# ***Official Saturday Night Fights: Jake Shields vs Paul Daley Discussion Thread***



## MLS (Jul 18, 2007)

Conduct all of your pre & post-fight discussion on this Welterweight matchup as *Jake Shields *defends his title against *Paul "Semtex" Daley *in *HERE*, ALL other threads concerning this fight *WILL BE MERGED INTO THIS ONE. *

Thanks guys.

*MLS*


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## Steph05050 (Jun 4, 2008)

im pulling for shields on this one


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Shields will win this IMO. Daley is a really good WW though. He's got quick and heavy hands.

Maybe he'll at least be able to make it out of the 1st round.

Shield's last five opponents haven't.


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Shields is a top 3 WW. Daley is really good but he's not gonna be able to keep this on his feet.

1st or 2nd round submission for Shields.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Meh, Shields will finish him in round one. I was just tryin to give Daley the benifit of the doubt.

Jake takes it in a round one anaconda choke.


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## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

Pulling for Daley. Dude has a chance, but Shields should sub him.


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## Meshuggeth (May 26, 2008)

Shields is very talented and on a roll. The guy needs to step uo competition though. I believe he could be (or is) a top 5 WW.


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## MLS (Jul 18, 2007)

Bump for tonight


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## plazzman (Mar 29, 2007)

My goodness am I ever excited.

I want Semtex to win so bad.


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Semtex is the man but he's in trouble. Hopefully he can keep it on his feet but I doubt it.


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## Tripod87 (Dec 30, 2007)

Lol the ref looked annoyed that both fighters kept hopping up and down during the staredown


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

Sheilds' isn't moving enough, but it won't atter once he gets on top of Daley


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

It's over for Daley he put up a good effort but he isn't ready for a top 3 WW.


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## JuggNuttz (Oct 5, 2006)

this is a ******* clinic!


oops look like i spoke too soon...... still rd 1 definatly goes to Jake.


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

Sheilds mount was Paulo Filho esque


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Nice first round good job for Daley to survive.


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

Shields was barely doing anything out there. Those were some NASTY elbows by Daley at the end of the round.


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

I'm impressed with Daley he's doing a lot better then a thought.


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

Who wants to see Sheilds vs Filho? The ten to fifteen mount to armbar contest. Overall Sheilds got the job done, but he's not taking St. Pierre, Fitch, Sanchez, Koscheck etc. down anytime soon.


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## MLS (Jul 18, 2007)

Shields a top 3 WW, lol.


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Damn Daley is tough stayed in that armbar for awhile.

He's such a good fighter he's just no match for Shields on the ground.


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## Stapler (Nov 18, 2006)

Daley really does have a horrible ground game.


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## Entity (Aug 18, 2008)

Shields didn't look impressive. He'd get ******* spanked in the UFC.


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## JuggNuttz (Oct 5, 2006)

nice armbar, but i dunno... i love a good sub and all but that was just kinda.. meh... didnt get me excited.. dunno...


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Shields has a better ground game thn almost anyone at WW in the UFC.

Him getting outstruck by Daley has a lot more to do with Daley having some of the best stand up at 170.


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## MLS (Jul 18, 2007)

But the guys with better wrestling then Shields in the UFC also have better standup. Shields looked like a scared little bitch on the feet.


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

MLS said:


> Shields a top 3 WW, lol.


I don't see him going through the top of the ufc's 170 pound division. 

As your above post says, there are much better wrestlers with better striking there. He wouldn't be taking down guys with such a long shot and no striking.


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## plazzman (Mar 29, 2007)

Shields would have died if that fight didn't go on the ground.

Top 3 WW is an absolute stretch, his striking sucks way too much to hang with UFC's top 5


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

MLS said:


> But the guys with better wrestling then Shields in the UFC also have better standup. Shields looked like a scared little bitch on the feet.


Against Daley who's stand up is better then anyone in the UFC.

I mean GSP would beat him but I think Shields would be fine against Fitch or Koscheck.

Diego would be tough for him.

Honestly this guy beat Yushin Okami.


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## MLS (Jul 18, 2007)

Terry77 said:


> Maybe so, but I don't see him going through the top of the ufc's 170 pound division.


I was laughing at the notion of Shields being a top 3 WW.


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

Shields wouldn't be able to hang in the UFC. He may have a good ground game but his wrestling didn't look that good and guys like Fitch and GSP would destroy him in the wrestling and have much much better striking then he does.


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## MLS (Jul 18, 2007)

bbjd7 said:


> Against Daley who's stand up is better then anyone in the UFC.
> 
> I mean GSP would beat him but I think Shields would be fine against Fitch or Koscheck.
> 
> ...


Fitch or Kos could beat him on the feat and Shields cound't get them down. Did you see those ***** little strikes he threw, that wasn't because of Daley that was because he is a bad striker and he seems scared to get hit.


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

MLS said:


> I was laughing at the notion of Shields being a top 3 WW.


Yeah I botched that post.


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

MJB23 said:


> Shields wouldn't be able to hang in the UFC. He may have a good ground game but his wrestling didn't look that good and guys like Fitch and GSP would destroy him in the wrestling and have much much better striking then he does.


Agreed! I can't see Sheilds getting past Fitch, Koscheck, or GSP! Those guys have better striking, better wrestling, and better cardio then Sheilds!


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## r00kie (Jul 8, 2008)

*Jake Shields*

Do you really think he's top 5 WW in the world ? Seriously, i understand they want to promote EliteXC but he would get murdered by ALOT of welterweights..


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## jongurley (Jun 28, 2008)

Jake shields would not even asked to fight on a undercard for the UFC,, he is a sub par fighter, he had the dude mounted for a total of 5 minutes, and he managed that lame ass slow set up arm bar,,, let him get in the ring with someone like BJ Penn,, or Alves,, or anyone of that caliber,, he would get killed,, all of those lame as Gracie fighters from stockton, Diaz boys, shields,, all of them have ZERO stand up,, and they are fighting crap fighters,, wait till Nate Diaz fights someone like Kenny Florian or such,, he would get killed,,


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## stitch1z (Dec 9, 2007)

You guys are crazy. Jake Shields is a stud.

Not sure if he's quite top 5, but he may be... Easily top 10!!!

Paul Daley was a really tough opponent.


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## Aaronyman (Mar 1, 2007)

shields is probably top 10...but not top 5 at all....

gsp, kos, fitch, alves, diego, karo would all beat him .....gsp and alves would probably stop him


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## Drogo (Nov 19, 2006)

stitch1z said:


> You guys are crazy. Jake Shields is a stud.
> 
> Not sure if he's quite top 5, but he may be... Easily top 10!!!
> 
> Paul Daley was a really tough opponent.


Shields is good but after watching that I'm 100% confident he isn't top 5 and he might not be top 10. That was not impressive. Daley didn't look that tough, he was good on his feet but he was laughably bad on the ground. When Shields took him down he fell into the mount, he didn't have to do anything to get mount. It shouldn't be that easy. 

The armbar set up was agonizingly slow, considering how helpless Daley was on the ground it shouldn't have taken him nearly that long to finish him.


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## 69nites (Jul 28, 2008)

thiago alves, hughs, Fitch (would dominate him IMO), diego sanchez, Karo Parisyan, carlos conduit, and koscheck are all better fighters than Sheilds. just having jujitsu isn't enough. 

not to mention his cardio didn't look good at all so he better hope that he can sub anyone he fights cause if it goes any kind of distance and stays standing he's done. 

In all honestly I see him losing to Marcus Davis as well, tho I would still rank sheilds higher.


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## rockybalboa25 (May 27, 2007)

I have to say I was thinking before tonight that Shields was a top WW. He has amazing BJJ, but I was disappointed in how terrible his striking looked. I didn't expect him to look good against Daley, but he looked completely outclassed. I know think that he would have some problem against some of the more well-rounded welter weights. I think tonight just showed how much Shields needs to improve.


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## morninglightmt (Sep 7, 2008)

After this fight, just try and picture Sheilds up against GSP, Fitch, Koscheck or Alves. It would be brutal.


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## B-Real (Oct 1, 2006)

I love the way Jake fights (on the ground). For me it's really enjoyable to watch.


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## rockybalboa25 (May 27, 2007)

B-Real said:


> I love the way Jake fights (on the ground). For me it's really enjoyable to watch.


Enjoyable yes.
Good enough to beat the UFC elite no.


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Aaronyman said:


> shields is probably top 10...but not top 5 at all....
> 
> gsp, kos, fitch, alves, diego, karo would all beat him .....gsp and alves would probably stop him


Just a question and I'm honestly wondering since when did who we think will beat who is the basis of rankings.

Shields has beaten Condit, Okami, Verissimo, Pyle, Thompson, and Daley. Since 06

Karo only has wins over Thompson, Fickett, Burkman, and Chonan since 06 and losses to Diego and Thiago

Thiago Alves has wins over Karo, Hughes(When he missed weight), Alessio and Lytle and a loss to Fitch.

Diego has wins over Alessio, Karo,Riggs, and Luigi. He lost to Fitch and Kos

Kos has a win over Diego and Lytle and a loss to GSP.

Fitch beat Burkman, Alves, Luigi, and Diego and lost to GSP.

I would put him ahead of Karo no doubt, Thiago can't make weight so until he does I can't put him in the top 3, Diego hasn't had a big win since he lost although I think he is very good I can't rank him to high, Koscheck hasn't proven himself that much. Now Fitch and Shields IMO are 2A and 2B.

IDK why you guys can't see why Shields is so good his ground game is really good and while his striking isn't good it's honestly not dreadful.

Plus his takedowns are pretty good Shields was able to get Okami to the ground.


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## MLS (Jul 18, 2007)

bbjd7 said:


> Just a question and I'm honestly wondering since when did who we think will beat who is the basis of rankings.


They don't but lets look at something.



> Shields has beaten Condit, Okami, Verissimo, Pyle, Thompson, and Daley. Since 06


The win over Condit only looks good because of what Condit has become _after_ he fought Shields. Okami wasn't a top 10 guy either at the time. Verissimo and Pyle while good, imo on'y second tier guys. Thompson is a good win and not to sure Daley is a good win since Shields was such a huge favorite (our odds did not reflect vegas odds).



> Karo only has wins over Thompson, Fickett, Burkman, and Chonan since 06 and losses to *Diego and Thiago*


Two guys being picked to beat Shields Karo has lost to.



> Thiago Alves has wins over *Karo, Hughes*(When he missed weight), Alessio and Lytle and *a loss to Fitch*.


Beat two guys that some have picked to beat Shields and lost to one who people have picked to beat Shields.



> Diego has wins over Alessio, *Karo*,Riggs, and Luigi. He lost to *Fitch and Kos*



one win over a guy and two losses



> Kos has a win over *Diego* and Lytle and a loss to *GSP*.


One win one loss



> Fitch beat Burkman, *Alves*, Luigi, and *Diego* and lost to *GSP*.


2 wins one loss

The WW's in the UFC have a harder time maintaining their ranking because they are fighting each other. Where as Shields is fighting lesser competition and is able to rack up wins and move up the rankings based on this.

I'm not saying he isn't a top 10 WW but based on skill he is at the lower end of the top 10. But based soley on record then he is near the top.


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Well that's fine MLS honestly by skill I think the WW rankings would change a lot because I think Diego is a lot better then some of the guys ahead of him but because of some of the stuff that went on before his Koscheck fight and his Split decison with Fitch he is lower in the rankings.

Then if Alves could actually make 170 he would be a lot higher In my rankings 2.

But since I have always thought rankings are done on performance not assumed skill I think Shields be performance is top 5 guranteed. And I have him performance wise at 2 or 3.


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## 69nites (Jul 28, 2008)

bbjd7 said:


> Well that's fine MLS honestly by skill I think the WW rankings would change a lot because I think Diego is a lot better then some of the guys ahead of him but because of some of the stuff that went on before his Koscheck fight and his Split decison with Fitch he is lower in the rankings.
> 
> Then if Alves could actually make 170 he would be a lot higher In my rankings 2.
> 
> But since I have always thought rankings are done on performance not assumed skill I think Shields be performance is top 5 guranteed. And I have him performance wise at 2 or 3.


Alves solidifies his spot as #2 if he beats diego.


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

If he makes 170 and beats Diego I agree but those are not gurantees.


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## 69nites (Jul 28, 2008)

bbjd7 said:


> If he makes 170 and beats Diego I agree but those are not gurantees.


if he makes weight I don't see Diego having much of a chance.

I highly doubt he'll miss weight.


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Well I don't know why you have so muh confidence in him he has had trouble in 2 of his last 4 fights.

Also Diego could be very tough for Alves. The guy is one of the best ground fighters at 170.


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## Aaronyman (Mar 1, 2007)

thiago has fought at ww many times, he misses weight b/c of a spranged ankle and all of a sudden he's not a ww anymore?

c'mon now, that's being a lil ridiculous....the last 10 days before the fight is very important for a fighter coming down from such a high weight....and if you are completely sidelined from training (like he said he was), it's going to mess up things


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## rockybalboa25 (May 27, 2007)

I think if Shields wants to be considered a top five welter weight he needs to beat a top 5 welter weight. It's a weird concept, I know.


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## MLS (Jul 18, 2007)

bbjd7 said:


> But since I have always thought rankings are done on performance not assumed skill I think Shields be performance is top 5 guranteed. And I have him performance wise at 2 or 3.


Thought I covered that when I said this.



MLS said:


> I'm not saying he isn't a top 10 WW but based on skill he is at the lower end of the top 10. *But based soley on record then he is near the top.*


And again Shields being ranked in the top three because of his record is a little spotty since he doesn't have to fight top 10 guys. Where as the UFC WW's for the most part are fighting guys that are. So they are going to have losses that Shields won't because of the difference in competition. So pretty much by default Shields gets ranked higher. How many fights against guys who were in the top 10 when he fought them does he have?

To put it another way look at the SEC and Big 12, they beat each other during the season so they drop each other in the rankings where as a team from say the Big 10, ACC, or Big East beat the easier competition in their conference and move up the rankings. They don't really move up because they are better but because the SEC and Big 12 teams that are better then them are having to play each other.


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

I agree MLS I wasn't trying to disagree with you with that comment.

And yea I would agree with that comment.


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