# Frank Mir believes Fedor is too small to fight the bigger heavyweights



## vaj3000 (Dec 28, 2008)

Wow mr Mir Dont you remember the horeshoe incident? You'd think mir would have learnt his lesson ...aLL this shows is that Lesnar had incredible insight in hating thes douche



> Former UFC heavyweight champion, Frank Mir has once again been giving his opinion on WAMMA champion, Fedor Emelianenko, telling a packed Q & A session that he believes the Russian is simply too small to compete with the bigger men at the top of the tree.
> 
> On Saturday at the WEC 46 open Q & A session Mir said Brett Rogers was not a top ten fighter but gave Fedor all sorts of problems during their fight late last year. Mir also described Fedor as “5-11, 235 with a belly” and thought he could drop down to light heavyweight. He did however rank Fedor among the divisions elite alongside Brock Lesnar, Rodrigo Nogueira, Junior dos Santos, Cain Velasquez, Shane Carwin and of course, himself.
> 
> ...


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## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

How can he still call himself as the best heavyweight out there, whn UFC 100 wasnt that long time ago.


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## TheGrizzlyBear (Sep 15, 2009)

I think him saying he's the best is more of a moral thing for him, its driving him to be the best, which is why i think he is so determined to get to lesnars size so he can put the next fight on an even playing field...

he did make a point though, rogers definitly gave fedor trouble in that fight and he isn't a top ranked HWY at all...


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## MarcV (May 26, 2009)

That's exactly what I love about Fedor: he is only 5'11" and has a belly! Imagine what he'd be like if he had abs and was roided up? Guys would then only last seconds with him. 

I keep wanting to like Mir, especially against Lesnar, but I just can't. It is stupid comments like that; he's such a narcissist!

And what kind of trouble did Fedor have with Rogers? Oh, I guess if you make it into the 2nd round, you've practically beaten Fedor, right? Just like Mir gave Lesnar all kinds of problems, I guess.

Fedor is the baddest dude in the world and is an undersized heavyweight (and he has a belly). How can you not love that!?


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## TheGrizzlyBear (Sep 15, 2009)

how bout the fact that rogers was basically winning that fight until fedor caught him with the overhand right, he had a hard time getting off the ground when rogers started punching his face in too..


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

I think he has a point, as the MMA sport continues to raise its level its getting harder to compete without cutting to the maximum weight in your division, UFC 100 confirmed this for Mir, its hard to say that Brock is a more all round skilful fighter that Mir, but he used his size advantage efficiently to neutralise Franks superior fighting skills.

On an ever par I think it would be a much more interesting fight and I think Frank is right that in the future to raise to the top of the Heavy Weight division you are going to need both the skills and the size as more top fighters with the skills start to cut in at 265.


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

he didnt say Fedor is a bum, he put him right up there with guys he considers the best in division and he would likely (T)KO Minotauro again but he wont have to worry about that, he better start practicing TDD 

Grizzley, you will get nowhere with that arguement, around here even if Fedor doesnt look good or is in trouble, he never looked bad and was never in trouble. Around here Rogers is a true proven top HW and Big Timmy is a top 5 win. Around here Werdum is a great next opponent for the worlds number 1 ranked HW and Overeem is his biggest threat.... around here FEDOR IS GOD!!


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## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

Former UFC heavyweight champion, Frank Mir has once again been giving his opinion on WAMMA champion, Fedor Emelianenko, telling a packed Q & A session that he believes the Russian is simply too small to compete with the bigger men at the top of the tree.

On Saturday at the WEC 46 open Q & A session Mir said Brett Rogers was not a top ten fighter but gave Fedor all sorts of problems during their fight late last year. Mir also described Fedor as “5-11, 235 with a belly” and thought he could drop down to light heavyweight. He did however rank Fedor among the divisions elite alongside Brock Lesnar, Rodrigo Nogueira, Junior dos Santos, Cain Velasquez, Shane Carwin and of course, himself.

Mir also commented on a potential rematch with Brazilian legend, Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira, saying if the pair were to meet again the fight would go along the same lines as their first meeting. Mir ended by stating he felt he was the best fighter in the weight class and that if you didn’t believe in yourself as a fighter you had no place inside the octagon.


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## Thelegend (Nov 2, 2009)

wow frank...just wow, sure fedor has a belly but i think he has proven he can fight against larger opponents. i dont know how many "problems" brett gave him but its not like he is a can.

He probably wants him to drop down so that he never *ever* has to back up all that trash talking hes been doing of fedor. I do agree however that a belief in yourself is nescessary especially in a sport that is focused primarily on individual success.

edit: would also appreciate link to article


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## kc1983 (May 27, 2007)

Interesting. Got a link to post to see the whole thing? 

Mir is right - Fedor IS a small HW. I could see Fedor having some problems off his back against a guy like Lesnar. Brett Rogers did put him in a little bit of trouble and he's not exactly the cream of the crop. Regardless, Fedor was only in trouble for a little while before he got out of the position and ended up knocking Rogers' block off. I think we've seen Fedor in worse situations before too - when he fought Hong Man Choi and the dude fell on him like a ******* oak tree I thought Fedor was going to be screwed but he came back. I don't even care if Hong Man Choi is not a top 10 fighter, he is a giant and the topic of discussion is Fedor having problems with bigger HW's. 

EDIT - I take back what I said about Rogers, the guy KO'd Arlovski and and hung in there with Fedor.


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## Hammerlock2.0 (Jun 17, 2009)

kc1983 said:


> Interesting. Got a link to post to see the whole thing?
> 
> Mir is right - Fedor IS a small HW. I could see Fedor having some problems off his back against a guy like Lesnar. Brett Rogers did put him in a little bit of trouble and he's not exactly the cream of the crop.


Didn't this 'Fedor being in trouble' result in two sub attempts and then Fedor getting back to his feet?

And right back at topic...

After having watched WEC 46 and not being annoyed by Frank for a change, I find it kind of sad that he just can't stop running his mouth. Especially sad since the new 265lbs Mir looked very promising in his last fight. He makes it really hard for me to like him.


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## JackAbraham34 (Jun 30, 2009)

Every single time Mir opens his mouth and talks his shit, I love him just a little bit more haha. However, I agree with what 'Thelegend' said, in that Fedor can hold his own against larger opponents.


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## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

I agree with Mir.

If Fedor were to come to the UFC and fight Lesnar, Mir, Carwin, Velasquez and Dos Santos I think he would lose at least one of the fights. All these fighters are tougher fights then Fedor has seen in years.

He may win most of them as he is a great fighter but he would struggle at times. Especially with Lesnar(who I think Mir is talking about specifically with this comment), as much as Fedor fans hate to admit it Fedor has never fought a fighter like Lesnar and he would have a very tough time with his strength and size. Mir is a much larger fighter with pretty darn good wrestling and BJJ and Lesnar pinned him down and bullied him. I actually think Fedor's only real chance of beating Lesnar would be to knock him out in the first minute of each round, I think he would just be trying to survive the rest of the fight.


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

I love how you guys hate him when he talks, yet he's obviously one of the top 5 heavyweights in the world. If you expect him not to run his mouth, you must be crazy. It's a division filled with really tough guys who put their wellbeing on the line, I say they should be free to talk all the trash they want, it hypes fights and they deserve to be allowed to say what they want.


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

I think he has a point, as the MMA sport continues to raise its level its getting harder to compete without cutting to the maximum weight in your division, UFC 100 confirmed this for Mir, its hard to say that Brock is a more all round skilful fighter that Mir, but he used his size advantage efficiently to neutralise Franks superior fighting skills.

On an ever par I think it would be a much more interesting fight and I think Frank is right that in the future to raise to the top of the Heavy Weight division you are going to need both the skills and the size as more top fighters with the skills start to cut in at 265.


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## steveo412 (Sep 27, 2006)

Yah cause Frank Mir has no troubles at all with Brock Lesnar on top of him smashing his face. Of course Fedor would have trouble with big guys like Lesnar who the f-ck wouldnt. But he has always prevailed and showed us why he is the best HW fighter of all time. Mir can talk all the sh-t he wants it really means nothing until we see Fedor in there with them. I agree he would have trouble with Lesnar but as for Mir and the rest of them I dont really give them a chance.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

Frank is like the wimpy kid who puts on 10lbs and all of a sudden thinks he can call out the top dogs.


And I'd bet my house that Mir would lose to Rogers.


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## JWP (Jun 4, 2007)

Mir is a good fighter. top 5 IMO. JDS will smash him tho i reckon

I have never seen anything to suggest Fedor would lose to anyone, though i guess it could happen

makes me laugh when ppl say he will lose, and it makes me laugh when ppl try to explain why he will lose


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## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

khoveraki said:


> Frank is like the wimpy kid who puts on 10lbs and all of a sudden thinks he can call out the top dogs.
> 
> 
> And I'd bet my house that Mir would lose to Rogers.


You would be homeless then. Rogers is not that great of a fighter...

He is Strikeforce's version of Carwin.


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> Frank is like the wimpy kid who puts on 10lbs and all of a sudden thinks he can call out the top dogs.
> 
> 
> And I'd bet my house that Mir would lose to Rogers.


 at least kongo had muay thai world championship creditials when you claimed he would easily outstrike Frank Mir.... now your saying some sloppy amateur boxer is going to.... because he is big?? He has no real boxing creditentials and isnt world class at anything, he is just big with alot of power, Mir would own him and it wouldnt even be close, ill take a bet for w/e amount of $ you have if this fight ever comes up. Even $?? sucker bet. Frank Mir was breaking limps, winning grappling and MMA titles and knocking fools out while this clown was still changing tires and prob had no idea what MMA was.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

alizio said:


> at least kongo had muay thai world championship creditials when you claimed he would easily outstrike Frank Mir.... now your saying some sloppy amateur boxer is going to.... because he is big?? He has no real boxing creditentials and isnt world class at anything, he is just big with alot of power, Mir would own him and it wouldnt even be close, ill take a bet for w/e amount of $ you have if this fight ever comes up. Even $?? sucker bet. Frank Mir was breaking limps, winning grappling and MMA titles and knocking fools out while this clown was still changing tires and prob had no idea what MMA was.



So I'm guessing you think Mir is somehow going to sub Rogers when Fedor couldn't? Or I guess you think Mir is going to knock him out. 

I remember you being borderline racist before with your opinions of Rogers, that guy is intensely legit and if you can't see it then there's no need discussing it.


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## Ashurum (Sep 23, 2009)

JWP said:


> Mir is a good fighter. top 5 IMO. JDS will smash him tho i reckon
> 
> I have never seen anything to suggest Fedor would lose to anyone, though i guess it could happen
> 
> makes me laugh when ppl say he will lose, and it makes me laugh when ppl try to explain why he will lose


I agree with you on Fedor. The guy is really good. He can be beat but it is going to take some luck. 

In my opinion though I can't rank JDS higher than Frank yet because I have seen more of Frank skill set and all I have seen from JDS is good striking. 

I enjoy Frank's stupid rambling on about how great he is. I think he is a very good fighter and Lesnar seems to have motivated him like GSP did to BJ and we know what that did. 

I still like Carwin the best out of the heavyweights. He has solid wrestling and great knockout power. JDS is probably my second favorite in HW. If you can't tell I like fighters who finish their fights.


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> So I'm guessing you think Mir is somehow going to sub Rogers when Fedor couldn't? Or I guess you think Mir is going to knock him out.
> 
> I remember you being borderline racist before with your opinions of Rogers, that guy is intensely legit and if you can't see it then there's no need discussing it.


 where the hell do you get borderline racist from?? seriously...????? your the one that always says some silly "if he wasnt black with a mohawk ppl would respect him" bs.... Rampage is my fav fighter outside of Cain.... but w/e, i guess i dont like him cuz he is big and black :sarcastic12:

Mir could/would sub him. I dont know what the hell saying "when Fedor couldnt" means. They were on the ground for like 15 seconds and the second Fedor went for an armbar Rogers gave up dominant position just to slip it. Mir will eat him all day on the ground and now he is as big and likely as strong (stronger in grappling strength for sure).

Or.... Frank Mir would knock him out, like he rocked Minotauro, like he rocked Kongo... both of whom have better standup creditientals and more proof of high calibre striking then one flash KO and a string of cans even most hardcore fans dont even know.

Seriously i was the guy cheering the loudest when Brock made Frank look stupid on the biggest MMA stage ever. But something has changed about him. It's pretty clear imo he is working harder then almost every HW and is more dedicated and he is coming to rip off your neck or arm. I think that loss will do for Frank what Serra did for GSP or what GSP did for BJ. Frank is on another level now in terms of training and dedication. He always had the skills. His stand up has evovled and those that cant see that by now are missing the bus, the bus that is likely to land on your favorite fighters head sometime soon.


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## The_Senator (Jun 5, 2008)

I've tired of Mir's muleheadedness and his foolish ideas. But why hasn't been the link posted?


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## Iuanes (Feb 17, 2009)

The ONLY person that could beat Fedor in the UFC almost just had his career ended by an intestinal bug. Cain? Carwin? Garbage standup even though Carwin has power, but neither have a ground game. 

Mir is apparently a world class boxer now. Not saying he doesn't have good hands for a UFC HW but I give him similar odds to what Barnett was given. He's well rounded but doesn't have it all put together into that fighting force we call Fedor.

The only guy in the UFC who has the size and has shown the speed and ability to use it devastatingly is Brock Lesnar. If he got on top of Fedor the fight could very well be over.

Still love it every time Mir opens his mouth though. And I think he takes Rogers pretty convincingly.


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## Blitzz (Apr 13, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> So I'm guessing you think Mir is somehow going to sub Rogers when Fedor couldn't? Or I guess you think Mir is going to knock him out.
> 
> I remember you being borderline racist before with your opinions of Rogers, that guy is intensely legit and if you can't see it then there's no need discussing it.


He pokes holes in your argument, so you retreat and take shots at him personally...


Mir is right. Rogers, albeit a average boxer who has average mma skills, who is just big had Fedor up against the fence and got some good GnP. Just think of the big wrestlers in the HW division of the UFC. They get Fedor up against the cage, it is going to be Mir/Lesnar II all over.

And, Big Mir would sub Rogers in the 1st or KO him in the 1st. Mir is a better striker and grappler than Rogers will ever be.


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## GMK13 (Apr 20, 2009)

i really wish fedor didnt have handlers, and he could come to the ufc, and could show everyone , once and for all who is the best. by the time he will, he'll lose and we'll here the he's past his prime argument.


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## The_Senator (Jun 5, 2008)

A year ago Mir was saying that Fedor "is so well-rounded and he's the best", now he's trying to hype himself more and more by convincing everyone that Fedor is somewhere behind him. "I'm the best fighter in my weight class", what is this? Fedor is not in the UFC, so why does he feel like he has to comment on him all the time? But it won't last long because Carwin will beat Mir soon and then Frank will be saying that Carwin is #1 HW only because he beat him...

"He did however rank Fedor among the divisions elite alongside Brock Lesnar, Rodrigo Nogueira, Junior dos Santos, Cain Velasquez,"
What a relief


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## +Shogun+ (Aug 3, 2007)

Hammerlock2.0 said:


> Didn't this 'Fedor being in trouble' result in two sub attempts and then Fedor getting back to his feet?
> 
> And right back at topic...
> 
> After having watched WEC 46 and not being annoyed by Frank for a change, I find it kind of sad that he just can't stop running his mouth. Especially sad since the new 265lbs Mir looked very promising in his last fight. He makes it really hard for me to like him.


It was a Q&A. He simply answered questions that were asked to him, and was spot on for the most part too. Also, like he said, if you aren't that confident in yourself then you shouldn't be in the octagon. What's he gonna say? "Yeah, Fedor would whoop my ass, hard!"?? 

Not sure where the Mir hate comes from. The guy is truthful and speaks his mind, I like that.


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## The_Senator (Jun 5, 2008)

> Not sure where the Mir hate comes from. The guy is truthful and speaks his mind, I like that.


Yeah, but his opinion changes all the time. It's like he has no position and says only what Dana White says in the best interests of UFC. If prior to the fight with Lesnar he'd said that Fedor was the best, after the UFC 100 he publicly stated that Lesnar would crush him. Why? Because he just lost? He thinks that Fedor would lose because he did...


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

It was not long ago that Mir was calling Fedor the greatest HW fighter in the world, without question. Ever since Brock beat him, he's been saying that Fedor isn't the best. Mir's ego is amazingly huge, the fact is, now that he was beaten by Brock, Brock HAS to be better than Fedor, and HAS to be the top HW other than himself, as, you know, only the best can beat big bad Frank Mir. :sarcastic12:

Fedor would destroy Mir, he'd tool him standing all day long and Mir could not take Fedor down. 

Oh, and, Rogers is definitely top 10, don't kid yourself.


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## Inkdot (Jun 15, 2009)

I swear, ever since that rematch with Lesnar, Mir has been more obsessed with weight then your average high school cheerleader.



The_Senator said:


> A year ago Mir was saying that Fedor "is so well-rounded and he's the best", now he's trying to hype himself more and more by convincing everyone that Fedor is somewhere behind him. "I'm the best fighter in my weight class", what is this? Fedor is not in the UFC, so why does he feel like he has to comment on him all the time? But it won't last long because Carwin will beat Mir soon and then Frank will be saying that Carwin is #1 HW only because he beat him...
> 
> "He did however rank Fedor among the divisions elite alongside Brock Lesnar, Rodrigo Nogueira, Junior dos Santos, Cain Velasquez,"
> What a relief


I think he already hyped Carwin by saying 'He is a better version of Brock Lesnar'. You can't blame him for selling fights but Mir sure changes opinions fast these days.


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## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

Michael Carson said:


> Oh, and, Rogers is definitely top 10, don't kid yourself.


Fedor, Lesnar, Mir, Nog, Velasquez, Dos Santos, Carwin, Werdum, Overeem, Barnett

I wouldn't say definitely top 10. He definitely isn't top 5 anyways.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

420atalon said:


> Fedor, Lesnar, Mir, Nog, Velasquez, Dos Santos, Carwin, Werdum, Overeem, Barnett
> 
> I wouldn't say definitely top 10. He definitely isn't top 5 anyways.


Overeem probably isn't top 10 at the very moment. Rogers is top 10, he was roughly placed #6-7 before he lost to Fedor, and he's around the 8-10 range right now. He's not top 5, though.

Saying Rogers isn't a top fighter is just ridiculous, he was undefeated, knocked out Arlovski extremely quick, and didn't completely suck against the #1 heavyweight in the world. That's better than many can say.

Top 10, definitely, but not top 5.


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

replace werdum with Rogers, maybe.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

420atalon said:


> Fedor, Lesnar, Mir, Nog, Velasquez, Dos Santos, Carwin, Werdum, Overeem, Barnett
> 
> I wouldn't say definitely top 10. He definitely isn't top 5 anyways.


Rogers has fought a top 3 and a #1 HW... Carwin and Velasquez haven't faced a single top 10 yet. Overeem hasn't faced a top 10 guy at HW yet.


Barnett was denied a license and is generally considered off the top 10 list till further notice.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

khoveraki said:


> Rogers has fought a top 3 and a #1 HW... Carwin and Velasquez haven't faced a single top 10 yet. Overeem hasn't faced a top 10 guy at HW yet.
> 
> 
> Barnett was denied a license and is generally considered off the top 10 list till further notice.


I thought he said brett at the end of his list, didn't notice it was Barnett.

Yeah, Barnett goes off, Overeem is off, that leaves two open spots, and Rogers is definitely in one of them.


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## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

khoveraki said:


> Rogers has fought a top 3 and a #1 HW... Carwin and Velasquez haven't faced a single top 10 yet. Overeem hasn't faced a top 10 guy at HW yet.
> 
> 
> Barnett was denied a license and is generally considered off the top 10 list till further notice.


Arlovski wasn't a top 3 at the time. Heck he wasn't even top 5. 

Rogers definitely deserves to be considered around the 7-10 place but he is nothing special. Carwin and Velasquez would both beat him more often then not.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

420atalon said:


> Arlovski wasn't a top 3 at the time. Heck he wasn't even top 5.
> 
> Rogers definitely deserves to be considered around the 7-10 place but he is nothing special. Carwin and Velasquez would both beat him more often then not.


Arlovski was even considered #2 by many people. He was between 2-4. Pretty much every single MMA outlet had him ranked as so, as well as many many fans.

EDIT - Just realized we were discussing when he fought Rogers. Arlovski was still top 5 when he fought Rogers, he only moved down 1-2 spots because many saw him doing well against Fedor for the first round, and were actually impressed by him.


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## steveo412 (Sep 27, 2006)

Michael Carson said:


> I thought he said brett at the end of his list, didn't notice it was Barnett.
> 
> Yeah, Barnett goes off, Overeem is off, that leaves two open spots, and Rogers is definitely in one of them.


Save that spot for Todd Duffey after 2 more fights.


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## limba (Jul 21, 2009)

WOW.
I normally don't agree with Mir, but he is right in a way.
Half right, let's put it this way.
Fedor realy is a small heavyweight. That's no secret. He has a belly, ok. We know. This i have to agree with Mir.
But Fedor has proven on numerous occasions that he can fight the big boys. Rogers is pretty big.
But to say, Fedor is to small to fight big guys?? It's to much.
The essence of MMA is that not all the time the bigger fighter wins. I believe Fedor could cause serious damage to the HW division in the UFC.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

420atalon said:


> Arlovski wasn't a top 3 at the time. Heck he wasn't even top 5.
> 
> Rogers definitely deserves to be considered around the 7-10 place but he is nothing special. Carwin and Velasquez would both beat him more often then not.


He had just fought for the UFC HW title, beaten Werdum, Marcio Cruz, Rothwell, Nelson, and had a tough fight with the #1 HW. He was ranked from #3-5 on most rankings list, I'm having trouble finding the rankings though since it was more than a year ago.


And Velasquez is probably the most stylistically horrible matchup for Rogers of everyone in MMA... Carwin isn't too great of a matchup either.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

steveo412 said:


> Save that spot for Todd Duffey after 2 more fights.


Nah, I'd rather let the guy who is undefeated except for the fight with the #1 HW, and general pound for pound contender, who also has a very impressive knockout win over a top 5 fighter, take the spot. You know, a guy who actually has a more impressive record/competition than both Carwin and Cain.


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## steveo412 (Sep 27, 2006)

Michael Carson said:


> Nah, I'd rather let the guy who is undefeated except for the fight with the #1 HW, and general pound for pound contender, who also has a very impressive knockout win over a top 5 fighter, take the spot. You know, a guy who actually has a more impressive record/competition than both Carwin and Cain.


Ya im just throwing out that I think he is going to be in the top ten mix soon. Not anti Rogers being in the top ten at all.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

steveo412 said:


> Ya im just throwing out that I think he is going to be in the top ten mix soon. Not anti Rogers being in the top ten at all.


Oops, I thought you were being sarcastic with me. My apologies. :thumbsup:


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## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

Lol Frank. Just cause you cant handle it when someone is bigger then you doesn't mean Fedor cant. Dont put your bullsh!t on others Frank... plz.


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

Michael Carson said:


> Nah, I'd rather let the guy who is undefeated except for the fight with the #1 HW, and general pound for pound contender, who also has a very impressive knockout win over a top 5 fighter, take the spot. You know, a guy who actually has a more impressive record/competition than both Carwin and Cain.


 what a difference a fight makes huh?? Nobody was backing this bum in eliteXC but suddenly get a fluke KO over Mr. Glass Chin, no heart himself and he is undoubtedly top 10 and maybe top 5?? I know why you guys arent mentioning any of his other fights..... because you didnt watch them and would have to actually look up the names of the guys he fought before AA. Suddenly he flashes AA and he is worthy of Fedor?? wow

Get one punch in on Fedor, have complete control against the cage and give it up instantly and get KO'd in the next round and your considered impressive??

I'd take Big Country over Rogers.... there, i said it.

I'd take Carwins or Cains resume over Rogers any day.... you know.... the resume with an actual base, wrestling. Ppl say Brock is just big... that's all.... but Brock was considered an elite athlete since high school and had elite training. Carwin and Cain?? Both extensive wrestling backgrounds. Rogers??? Changing tires messing around with boxing... gl!!

btw plz mention once again, since Khov didnt know, Cain is a BJJ wiz and world champion. Prob one of the fastest up and coming HW grapplers in the BJJ world. He isnt just a one trick pony by any means.

Anyways, i guess this will all be settled pretty quick. Rogers will have to fight another top guy soon i assume. I think Big Foot is a favorable matchup for him but one im not sure he will win either but Big Foot might just stand and bang with him.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

alizio said:


> what a difference a fight makes huh?? Nobody was backing this bum in eliteXC but suddenly get a fluke KO over Mr. Glass Chin, no heart himself and he is undoubtedly top 10 and maybe top 5??
> 
> Get one punch in on Fedor, have complete control against the cage and give it up instantly and get KO'd in the next round and your considered impressive??
> 
> I'd take Big Country over Rogers.... there, i said it.


Except that Rogers wrecked Arlovski in seconds and Nelson lost to Arlovski... :confused05:

And a lot of people knew Rogers was legit when he was in EliteXC, that's why they kept Kimbo and any other "prospects" miles away from him.


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## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

khoveraki said:


> Except that Rogers wrecked Arlovski in seconds and Nelson lost to Arlovski... :confused05:
> 
> And a lot of people knew Rogers was legit when he was in EliteXC, that's why they kept Kimbo and any other "prospects" miles away from him.


MMAMATH FOR THE WIN!!!!!!!!!!!

Cmon dude u seriously think Brett is Legit??? I cant wait till he starts fighting avereage fighters and gets demolished. (Mark my words it will happen) He got by a pathetic Andre.. Props to him but thats as far as his career is going to go.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

alizio said:


> what a difference a fight makes huh?? Nobody was backing this bum in eliteXC but suddenly get a fluke KO over Mr. Glass Chin, no heart himself and he is undoubtedly top 10 and maybe top 5??
> 
> Get one punch in on Fedor, have complete control against the cage and give it up instantly and get KO'd in the next round and your considered impressive??
> 
> ...


Your bias against anything not UFC related is quite amusing.

Your view on Rogers is different than the views of MMA sites, most MMA fans, and the general population. Rogers has a better resume than Carwin and Cain, he has a more impressive win on his resume, and he has faced tougher competition (the #1 HW in the world, for one). Oh, and, knockout over Arlovski >>>>>>> being rocked, taken down, and controlled by Gonzaga until you land 1 punch/decisioning Kongo. Rogers has been more impressive than both Carwin and Cain.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

SideWays222 said:


> MMAMATH FOR THE WIN!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> Cmon dude u seriously think Brett is Legit??? I cant wait till he starts fighting avereage fighters and gets demolished. (Mark my words it will happen) He got by a pathetic Andre.. Props to him but thats as far as his career is going to go.


How is that MMA Math? Andrei fought Nelson, then Fedor, then Rogers, it wasn't even two fights apart when Nelson lost and Rogers destroyed him.


That's how you figure out rankings, not MMA Math. :confused03:


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## Danm2501 (Jun 22, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> Except that Rogers wrecked Arlovski in seconds and Nelson lost to Arlovski... :confused05


Nelson was winning that fight though tbf. Had Arlovski on the ground, and in Side Control, so would have inevitably moved to his favoured crucifix position and could have had the fight won if he wasn't unfairly stood up. Not saying I think Nelson would beat Rogers, as I'm not sure he would, but Nelson certainly didn't lose to Arlovski in convincing fashion, and if it wasn't for the shady Elite XC rules, Nelson could very well have won that fight.

Interested to read that you think Rogers would beat Mir as well. You think he'd beat Mir on the feet? I don't think Rogers is better than Mir on the feet or on the ground, and personally think Mir would take the fight.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

http://www.mmaweekly.com/absolutenm/templates/topten.asp?articleid=16&zoneid=15

http://www.sherdog.com/news/articles/2/Sherdog-Official-Mixed-Martial-Arts-Rankings-22040

http://www.fightmatrix.com/mma-ranks/heavyweight-265-lbs/

MMAweekly has Rogers ranked #7, Fightmatrix has him ranked at #7, Sherdog has Rogers ranked #5. Oh, yes, #5 (that's top 5, for those that don't know).

I figured I'd go ahead and throw that information in there.


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## steveo412 (Sep 27, 2006)

I do give rogers credit as being a fight in the top ten. But to be honest if Rogers fought Big Country I think Roy would win it gut and all.


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## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

Rogers is only that high on those rankings because he looked ok against Fedor. There are also rankings that don't even have him in the top 10

http://www.mmasurvival.com/2008/01/mma-heavyweight-rankings.html

Those rankings could change a lot depending on how Nog vs Velasquez and Mir vs Carwin go.


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## steveo412 (Sep 27, 2006)

420atalon said:


> Rogers is only that high on those rankings because he looked ok against Fedor. There are also rankings that don't even have him in the top 10
> 
> http://www.mmasurvival.com/2008/01/mma-heavyweight-rankings.html
> 
> Those rankings could change a lot depending on how Nog vs Velasquez and Mir vs Carwin go.


I actuallly like the rankings on this mmasurvival pretty accurate to me, would obviously move a few around a bit but still good. I like how it shows that many fighters.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

steveo412 said:


> I actuallly like the rankings on this mmasurvival pretty accurate to me, would obviously move a few around a bit but still good. I like how it shows that many fighters.


Beating the #16 and #17 ranked fighters unconvincingly will get you a #6 spot on this rankings, that's cute.


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## Diokhan (Jul 8, 2008)

I still don't get this "Arlovski has glass chin" -joke, what is it actually based on? The nasty uppercut from Fedor which would have dropped pretty much anyone else too? Those 5 or whatever hits Rogers landed on his face in a row? The TKO by Sylvia (Arlovski was up congratulating Tim instantly after ref stopped the fight)? Seriously help me out here... 

I just find it weird that before Sylvia beat Arlovski everyone and their cousin was like "Arlovski is indestructable", yet after 2 KOs pretty much no-one else had survived from either he is suddenly called glass chin. No I don't think his chin is particularly great either, but if you call Arlovski a "glass chin" I seriously wonder what you would call Kimbo "I Got knocked out by a jab" Slice. No denying the facts that he ****ed it up on his own against all those 3 guys, but I would blame his technique and the mistakes he did more than his chin.


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## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

khoveraki said:


> Beating the #16 and #17 ranked fighters unconvincingly will get you a #6 spot on this rankings, that's cute.


Your dislike for Alizio has blinded you from the truth behind Velasquez. Maybe he will gain a little of your respect when he fights Nogeuira.

Edit: ^ Arlovski's glass chin comes from his inability to box and leaving his chin wide open to get rocked or knocked out. He has done it far too often in his career. If he could actually protect himself decently he would be a consistent top fighter in the division.


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

Duh! Everyone is too small now because of Lesnar!

On a serious note, Fedor is beating HW's all the time, therefor he can very obviously fight at HW...


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

420atalon said:


> Your dislike for Alizio has blinded you from the truth behind Velasquez. Maybe he will gain a little of your respect when he fights Nogeuira.



My dislike for Alizio has nothing to do with my dislike of Velasquez. Velasquez got a clearly wrong stoppage against unranked Ben Rothwell, got a decision of a stylistically perfect matchup in Kongo, and all of a sudden he's top 10 material?


The dude has no punching power, no proven submissions in the ring, gets hit a lot, and only has seven fights total. Sure he's an up and comer and has a good wrestling background, but the likes of King Mo have looked way better and have a much more impressive wrestling background.

There's no way he even does any damage to Nog, the dude will lose convincingly then his bandwagon will be gone.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

This is an instance wherein size doesn't matter.

Fedor beat Hong Man Choi, FFS.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

swpthleg said:


> This is an instance wherein size doesn't matter.
> 
> Fedor beat Hong Man Choi, FFS.



Fedor actually crushed the world's heaviest fighter in seconds so I don't understand. 


He's literally beat the biggest fighter to ever fight, past and present, so clearly he can compete. haha


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## Xerxes (Aug 14, 2008)

TheGrizzlyBear said:


> I think him saying he's the best is more of a moral thing for him, its driving him to be the best, which is why i think he is so determined to get to lesnars size so he can put the next fight on an even playing field...
> 
> he did make a point though, rogers definitly gave fedor trouble in that fight and *he isn't a top ranked HWY at all*...


No?

http://www.sherdog.com/news/articles/2/Sherdog-Official-Mixed-Martial-Arts-Rankings-22040

http://mmaweekly.com/absolutenm/templates/topten.asp?articleid=16&zoneid=15



TheGrizzlyBear said:


> *how bout the fact that* rogers was basically winning that fight until fedor caught him with the overhand right, he had a hard time getting off the ground when rogers started punching his face in too..


Really man? a fact??

MMAjunkie's pbp:



> Round 1 - "Big" John McCarthy gets us started. Emelianenko misses with a big lopping right. Neither fighter is willing engage until Emelianenko closes in and throws Rogers to the mat. Rogers, though, quickly gets back up, and Emelianenko clinches with him against the cage. Rogers reverses the position and puts Emelianenko against the cage and delivers a quick strike to the face. The ref warns Rogers not to hold the cage. Emelianenko tries a trip takedown, and though it doesn't work, he creates distance to get the restart. Emelianenko unloads a combo and then drags Rogers to the mat. From half guard, he delivers a few more punches until Rogers ties him up. Emelianenko works for position and grabs an arm, but Rogers reverses and puts Emelianenko on his back and unloads a flurry that connects. Emelianenko is bloodied in the exchange but wrestles for position and gets out of harm's way and into half guard. Emelianenko locks in a choke but lets it go and is pulled into full guard by Rogers. Emelianenko stands over his opponent and then misses wide when he dashes in with a big right. Rogers pulls him close to wait out an exciting first round. MMAjunkie.com scores it *10-9 for Emelianenko*.


MMAweekly's pbp:



> R1- Fedor gets a hold of Rogers early and tosses him to the ground, but Rogers is quick to his feet. Rogers presses Fedor against the cage, but they soon separate. Fedor connects with a big right hand hurting Rogers. Fedor swarms and gets the fight to the ground where he works from Rogers' half guard. Fedor goes for a kimura and Rogers reverses, landing and top reigning down huge bombs. Fedor goes for an armbar, but Rogers slips out. Fedor goes for a head and arm choke, but Rogers is able to slip out and pull full guard. Fedor moves out and swoops back in for a big punch but misses. The round ends with Fedor on top of Rogers.
> MMAWeekly scores R1 *10-9 Fedor Emelianenko*


Sherdog's pbp:


> Round 1
> Fedor is cut right on the noise right of the bat from a jab by Rodgers. Fedor swings wildly with both hands and misses short. Fedor cracks Rogers with a right hand and throws him effortlessly to the mat. Rogers is game as he quickly gets to his feet and clinches with icon against the fence. Fedor’s nose is a mess. He’s breathing from his mouth and wiping his nose. Rogers gets off the fence and gets mauled by a Fedor right hand. Fedor unloads with haymakers are pushes the off-balanced Rogers down. Rogers tees off with punches from the top and Fedor is busted wide open. Blood is pouring from the face of Fedor. Emelianenko goes for an armbar and Rogers has none of it. Fedor takes the top position and looks for an arm triangle. Rogers escapes. Great opening round, but Fedor’s face is jacked.
> *
> Jordan Breen scores the round 10-9 Fedor
> ...


----------



## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

Fedor is actually an optical illusion, he is bigger than he looks. He KO's people because they don't see the punches due to the fact that his arms are longer than they look. So Frank Mir must not be aware of this! He will know if they fight when he see's Fedor's hand a few inches in front of his face, but it still hits him!


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## Xerxes (Aug 14, 2008)

HitOrGetHit said:


> Fedor is actually an optical illusion, he is bigger than he looks. He KO's people because they don't see the punches due to the fact that his arms are longer than they look. So Frank Mir must not be aware of this! He will know if they fight when he see's Fedor's hand a few inches in front of his face, but it still hits him!


He also may very well be the HW with the quickest hands (along with AA)



420atalon said:


> Your dislike for Alizio has blinded you from the truth behind Velasquez.


I LOL'd :thumb02:


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## Stan Darsh (May 31, 2009)

I find this hilarious. Now that Frank Mir has put on a little wieght he thinks its gunna make all the difference in the world. The facts are Fedor, unlike Frank has never let size become an issue in his fights. He uses his technique and explosiveness to nullify his opponents wieght advantage.

Also, fedor has fought plenty of heavy, big guys, i don't know what Mir is on about. It seems to me he is using Brock Lesnars wieght advantage as a excuse for losing, and thinks that everyone else will be as cocky and disespectful as him and get dominated, Instead of fighting more tactically.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Future*

After this statement, if Fedor joins the UFC I would love to see Mir get submitted by him in the first minute of the first round!


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

kantowrestler said:


> After this statement, if Fedor joins the UFC I would love to see Mir get submitted by him in the first minute of the first round!


Actually I want to see Fedor/Mir more than any other Fedor fight right now! :thumb02:


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Fedor VS Mir*

Even more than Fedor versus Lesnar?


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

kantowrestler said:


> Even more than Fedor versus Lesnar?




I actually do! I think that it would be more interesting! Frank Mir is constantly improving and is a very well rounded fighter. I would love to see this fight.


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## Diokhan (Jul 8, 2008)

kantowrestler said:


> After this statement, if Fedor joins the UFC I would love to see Mir get submitted by him in the first minute of the first round!


Agreed, Mir has never seen a submission specialist like Fedor before, its not like he trains with Robert Drysdale or something. Oh wait....


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

Diokhan said:


> Agreed, Mir has never seen a submission specialist like Fedor before, its not like he trains with Robert Drysdale or something. Oh wait....


Roy Nelson beat Mir in a grappling match, just saying. :confused05:


I won't argue with you about Fedor being a better grappler than Mir (he is). But I'll tell you I'd rather see Barnett vs Fedor than Mir vs Fedor. Barnett has the grappling edge and the striking edge over Mir.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

He'll have to pee clean first.


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## Diokhan (Jul 8, 2008)

khoveraki said:


> Roy Nelson beat Mir in a grappling match, just saying. :confused05:
> 
> 
> I won't argue with you about Fedor being a better grappler than Mir (he is). But I'll tell you I'd rather see Barnett vs Fedor than Mir vs Fedor. Barnett has the grappling edge and the striking edge over Mir.


To be fair that match was a while ago and we saw classic old school Mir with small gas tank losing it after controlling most of the match. Not saying Mir would 100% surely beat Roy now because Roy is hell of a grappler even though he doesn't look like one, but just saying I wouldn't really use that grappling match as reference for anything.
And I wont go to Fedor vs. Mir on grappling argument either, just saying that its silly to say that either has a huge edge vs. the other as both of them have faced top level grapplers before and even train with them constantly.

I don't think that you are the only person who wanted to see Barnett vs. Fedor, personally Im so pissed at Barnett still that I don't really even aknowledge his existence in any rankings anymore even though he would easily be top 5 still. Sadly you can't be top 5 if your pee isn't clean, so any skills you possess at that point are irrelevant. 
As a huge Mir fan though I can't say I would rather see Barnett vs. Fedor more than Mir vs. Fedor, but I would say both of them would be the biggest challenges for Fedor since Mirko if not the biggest ones so far.


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## fightpragmatist (Dec 3, 2009)

420atalon said:


> Fedor, Lesnar, Mir, Nog, Velasquez, Dos Santos, Carwin, Werdum, Overeem, Barnett
> 
> I wouldn't say definitely top 10. He definitely isn't top 5 anyways.


Carwin and Velasquez are not top 10 HW.

Ok maybe Carwin and even then I still don't know why he would be.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

Agreed about Barnett, he frustrates me just thinking about it. He threw himself out of the mix while he was nearly ontop of a stacked HW division.




fightpragmatist said:


> Carwin and Velasquez are not top 10 HW.
> 
> Ok maybe Carwin and even then I still don't know why he would be.



Agreed, to be top 10 you have to beat a top 10. And what happens to the rankings next month when JDS beats Gonzaga? Even though Gonzaga has more, and bigger wins than Carwin, Carwin is still ranked higher on average. So if JDS beats Gonzaga... how far back does that bump Carwin?

And when Nog beats Velasquez, does that bump Velasquez off the list?


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

Michael Carson said:


> Your bias against anything not UFC related is quite amusing.
> 
> Your view on Rogers is different than the views of MMA sites, most MMA fans, and the general population. Rogers has a better resume than Carwin and Cain, he has a more impressive win on his resume, and he has faced tougher competition (the #1 HW in the world, for one). Oh, and, knockout over Arlovski >>>>>>> being rocked, taken down, and controlled by Gonzaga until you land 1 punch/decisioning Kongo. Rogers has been more impressive than both Carwin and Cain.


 in one breath you claim to be on the side of the majority of MMA fans, MMA sites and the general population.... must be nice.

Then literally sentences later, you say Rogers is more impressive then Cain and Carwin. Yet on every MMA site they are ranked higher and to MMA fans they get more respect. So what is it?? You on the side of the majority when it's what you think but against the majority when it isnt?? Pretty crappy point to bring up tbh

what "general population" are you speaking for?? Even Brett himself sings the praises of Cain cuz he knows 1st hand what it is like to be tossed around by him. When Cain was asked if he thought Rogers had a chance vs Fedor he said a punchers chance only.... and they sparred together. Really lets you know what he thinks imo

It's funny, all these dudes Khov respects that have trained with Cain all say he is the real deal but Khov talks about him like he is some joke. The joke will be on you real soon bud  Win or lose in Australia, Brown Pride is gonna prove he belongs in the ring with top 5s and legends and no, if he lands only one signifigant punch and it is a jab and only has top control for seconds before being reversed and then gets KO'd in the 2nd round.... i wont run around claiming it was some great performance.


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## Ruckus (Oct 2, 2009)

420atalon said:


> Fedor, Lesnar, Mir, Nog, Velasquez, Dos Santos, Carwin, Werdum, Overeem, Barnett
> 
> I wouldn't say definitely top 10. He definitely isn't top 5 anyways.


Until Overeem decides to defend his belt (and be tested) he is cancelled out of the top rankings. This holds true for Barnett as well. 

At this point I would also put Rogers ahead of in between Cain and Carwin. Neither of those two have truly impressed me as of yet, more will be revealed after Mir/Carwin and Cain/Nog. IMO they both lose those matches. Rogers on the other hand did KO Arlovski who was probably #5 at the time and than had the #1 HW in trouble, if only briefly, before he got caught with the overhand right. 

As far as the OP, I like Mir. He's an intelligent fight with a high MMA IQ IMO. He obviously sees himself, or would like to be, fighting Fedor sometime in the near future and is just talking smack in case that happens. Do you really expect him to say anything differently. That being said, I don't know if he honestly believes what he is saying. Fedor has met and beat HW's either the same size as him or much bigger. Not sure what Coleman weighed when they fought, but he is a big, strong fighter/wrestler, and he subbed him, twice. Anytime in his career where he appeared to be in trouble, found a way to win. That is just how skilled he truly is.

If Mir and Fedor would ever meet, there is no way Mir is KOing Fedor and IMO it would more likely be Mir getting KTFO. This is also going on unknown tangibles, Mir's new fighting weight for one and how that is going to translate into his game. If it goes to the ground, as much as Frank likes to believe he is the best HW jitz gut out there, Fedor has subbed a better group of HW's than Mir. Frank looked real good his last fight, albeit only brief. IMO Fedor has overcome all challenges and seeming advantages or tangibles his opponents might have had, and would prove to do so once again.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

alizio said:


> in one breath you claim to be on the side of the majority of MMA fans, MMA sites and the general population.... must be nice.
> 
> Then literally sentences later, you say Rogers is more impressive then Cain and Carwin. Yet on every MMA site they are ranked higher and to MMA fans they get more respect. So what is it?? You on the side of the majority when it's what you think but against the majority when it isnt?? Pretty crappy point to bring up tbh
> 
> ...


My points:

1. Rogers is top 10:

http://www.sherdog.com/news/articles/2/Sherdog-Official-Mixed-Martial-Arts-Rankings-22040 - http://www.mmaweekly.com/absolutenm/templates/topten.asp?articleid=16&zoneid=15 - http://www.fightmatrix.com/mma-ranks/heavyweight-265-lbs/

You'll notice that in both Sherdog and fightmatrix's rankings, that Rogers is ranked higher than both Carwin and Cain, and ranked top 5 on Sherdog. MMAweekly have him ranked at #7 (that means top 10, by the way).

2. Rogers is Legit: 

He has roughly the same record as both Cain and Carwin, with all 3 guys having 1 solid win on their resume. Roger's win, Arlovski, is not only more impressive than Cain and Carwin's win because of how he won, but the name is also more impressive. After his big win, he went on and lasted a round and a half against the #1 HW, and pound for pound contender. He is very, VERY much legit.

Those are the 2 points I made in this thread, and they are highlighted very clearly. If you still cannot understand them, then I don't know what to tell you.


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

I can see all the top HW's in the near future all cutting in at 265, I think Mir is making a smart move by upping his weight to allow him to do this, I think its the natural progression for this weight class as it improves and more talent arrives.

If always been the case before where you had the situation where you had the guys at the low end of the weight class who would possibly have the edge on the bigger guys with Speed and possibility be a little more skilful, where as the Bigger guys in the class would have there size and possibility power.

Its a natural progression for the weight class that fighters with the will to succeed and be the best as the division and sport progresses to have all the attributes (Speed, Power, Size, Skills), and that's what Frank is striving for because thats what it will take to raise to the top from now on in the HW division.

As more and more skilful fighters start cutting in at 265 it's going to become harder and harder for smaller fighters who rely on there skills to compete.

Frank is very smart for been the first too see this coming and do something about it.


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

Michael Carson said:


> My points:
> 
> 1. Rogers is top 10:
> 
> ...


 im not denying that Rogers is ranked atm in the top 10. Im saying he wont stay there, as most HWs dont stay there.

Lasting a round and a half is hardly proof of anything, Fedor isnt even known to KO ppl early anyways. He never had any real advanatage in that fight except for a jab and being in top control for about 15 seconds, the rest of the entire fight was all Fedor, hardly proof he belongs.

He flash KO'd AA in mere seconds. What can you really take away from that fight?? He obv has tremendous power. I take more stock in wins like Cain has where he goes a few rounds with guys, dominating the whole way. Cain tossed around a man who gave AA a war (rothwell). 

Either way one win is hardly proof you are "legit". Lasting 1 round and 2 min vs Fedor doesnt mean you are anywhere close imo. Fedor messed around the 1st round, tried some things out, once he got Bretts telegraphed timing on his big punches he put one right on his chin. Something im confident any top HW could do or take him down.

Brett has no real wrestling base, no bjj, no sumo, no real ground base to speak of and his standup is simply sloppy boxing.

You bring up 2 fights?? Seriously. Did you ever watch him fight before?? Khov says ppl were avoiding him in EliteEC but really most ppl never heard of him and he was very, very raw. You are basing your entire opinion of this guy on one flash KO and a jab (the 1st punch he threw in the fight) vs Fedor. I think it's very premature and Cain is much more proven in the MMA world whether it means grappling championships, training with a top camp and top fioghters worldwide or dominating every fight he has been in.

I would take Rothwell, Country, Kongo, Pat Barry, Hardonk, Duffee and Gonzaga over Rogers just to name a few unranked. Basically i would take anybody with a real ground game or anybody with legit high calibre standup. Unfortunately for Brett that's most of the division, he is hardly proven. Asmuch as i love Cain, Cain isnt proven yet either but he has the background and team behind him to stand a much better chance of making a longterm impact on the sport IMO


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

TheGrizzlyBear said:


> how bout the fact that rogers was basically winning that fight until fedor caught him with the overhand right, he had a hard time getting off the ground when rogers started punching his face in too..


Rogers was winning the fight? Watch the fight again, please. Fedor won the 1st round.


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## Jimdon (Aug 27, 2008)

There is no way i would rank Rogers above Cain, i don't care what Sherdog says, people have a way of putting Fedor on a pedestal, and lasting a round and a half when Fedor didn't even look very impressive should not move you UP the rankings either IMO.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Jimdon said:


> There is no way i would rank Rogers above Cain, i don't care what Sherdog says, people have a way of putting Fedor on a pedestal, and lasting a round and a half when Fedor didn't even look very impressive should not move you UP the rankings either IMO.


Why is Rogers less impressive than Cain + Carwin, I am 100%serious with this question. Why? The combined record of people Carwin beat is under .500

What is this contrarian schtick of disrespecting Fedor? Because he did not sign with the UFC and fight a 4-1 champion? Really? This is borderline laughable. 

As far as Mir goes, he sounds tough until he gets punched in the face. At the very least he should show respect to Fedor and to Brock, who are champions. Although honestly, I think JDS is the best HW in the UFC now.


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## Jimdon (Aug 27, 2008)

Samborules said:


> Why is Rogers less impressive than Cain + Carwin, I am 100%serious with this question. Why? The combined record of people Carwin beat is under .500
> 
> What is this contrarian schtick of disrespecting Fedor? Because he did not sign with the UFC and fight a 4-1 champion? Really? This is borderline laughable.


I didn't disrespect Fedor in the slightest, just said iv'e seen him look a lot better than he did in his last fight.

Never said one word about Carwin, and my opinion on Cain being higher ranked than Rogers comes from the level of competition they've beaten. 

The Arlovski Rogers beat was a broken, shell of a man compared to what he used to be and he's the only person besides Fedor that is worth mentioning unless you count James Thompson (i don't).

O`brian, Stojnic, Kongo, Rothwell > Thompson, Arlovski IMO.

Again, this is only my opinion, and has nothing to do with my liking of one organization over another.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

Uh......weren't Fedor's knockouts of Sylvia and AA both pretty f8cking quick?


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

I was not asking one particular person but in general why are people so quick to dismiss Fedor. The man is a house, he is not as toned as some of the muscle dudes but he packs quite a punch, he is a world champion ***** practitioner and is well respected by his peers. Just because he does not look the part? I don't get it at all? Everyone is entitled to their opinion but the only time I recall Fedor being in even a bit of trouble in terms of KO or submission was vs. Fujita. Thats pretty impressive.


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

swpthleg said:


> Uh......weren't Fedor's knockouts of Sylvia and AA both pretty f8cking quick?


He did dispose of them rather quickly. He was losing the standup with Arlovski before the KO. BUT he did still KO him.

The sylvia fight didn't end in a KO though. He was rocked and then subbed by Fedor. I believe the fight did end at 36seconds though! :thumb02:


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

HitOrGetHit said:


> He did dispose of them rather quickly. He was losing the standup with Arlovski before the KO. BUT he did still KO him.
> 
> The sylvia fight didn't end in a KO though. He was rocked and then subbed by Fedor. I believe the fight did end at 36seconds though! :thumb02:


I stand corrected. I guess the awesome rockage is what stuck in my mind.


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

swpthleg said:


> I stand corrected. I guess the awesome rockage is what stuck in my mind.


It doesn't make it any less spectacular though. A finish is a finish and Tim Sylvia was ranked high at that time and Fedor wiped his hands clean of him in the firstr 36 seconds.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

alizio said:


> im not denying that Rogers is ranked atm in the top 10. Im saying he wont stay there, as most HWs dont stay there.
> 
> Lasting a round and a half is hardly proof of anything, Fedor isnt even known to KO ppl early anyways. He never had any real advanatage in that fight except for a jab and being in top control for about 15 seconds, the rest of the entire fight was all Fedor, hardly proof he belongs.
> 
> ...


You are basing Cain and Carwin on 1 fight, no? Their competition has been as much garbage as Roger's has, except for their 1 big fight (Kongo, Gonzaga, Arlovski). The difference is after their big fight, Crawin didn't fight again, Cain beat Rothwell, and Rogers went almost two rounds with the greatest heavyweight of all time, and didn't completely suck. 

It's funny, you are saying I am basing him on two fights, when you are basing Cain and Carwin on.... what exactly? It must be their wrestling you're basing on, because their wins/competition sure in the hell isn't above Rogers. If you're basing it on their wrestling skills, do you realize GSP, a guy who has no record whatsoever of wrestling, is the best wrestler in MMA? Rogers showed he could keep Fedor against the cage for a little bit, and showed he could reverse Fedor on the ground, even get out of two submissions. Rogers trains in MMA, he trains in all aspects of MMA, and just because he doesn't have a wrestling background, doesn't mean he can't wrestle/have a solid grappling game.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

I think people are having a tough time coming to grips that a former tire worker can come out and compete with fighters who have years of martial arts and or wrestling pedigree? I give Grim credit, he did a good job. He is like that big American dude in Bloodsport, may not have much in terms of true martial arts skills but he packs a solid punch.


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

Michael Carson said:


> You are basing Cain and Carwin on 1 fight, no? Their competition has been as much garbage as Roger's has, except for their 1 big fight (Kongo, Gonzaga, Arlovski). The difference is after their big fight, Crawin didn't fight again, Cain beat Rothwell, and Rogers went almost two rounds with the greatest heavyweight of all time, and didn't completely suck.
> 
> It's funny, you are saying I am basing him on two fights, when you are basing Cain and Carwin on.... what exactly? It must be their wrestling you're basing on, because their wins/competition sure in the hell isn't above Rogers. If you're basing it on their wrestling skills, do you realize GSP, a guy who has no record whatsoever of wrestling, is the best wrestler in MMA? Rogers showed he could keep Fedor against the cage for a little bit, and showed he could reverse Fedor on the ground, even get out of two submissions. Rogers trains in MMA, he trains in all aspects of MMA, and just because he doesn't have a wrestling background, doesn't mean he can't wrestle/have a solid grappling game.


 guess we could argue til we are blue in the face. Time will prove who is right. Cains resume is more impressive, he went straight to the UFC because he couldnt find a local fight. Again, Cain was in the UFC.... not eliteXC or w/e. He went straight to the bigs. Jake O'Brian was once a hotshot prospect, Cain basically ended all hope of that (he had lost prior to Cain aswell tho). All the fighters Cain have fought minus on a whole are more talented then all Rogers except the fight he got KTFO and a flash KO of AA. Kongo is no joke, as i said, i would take Kongo over Rogers everyday of the week. Same with Rothwell.

Rogers did impress with his power vs AA, other then that, not much to point at and think there is alot of future success coming. He had control of Fedor for a couple seconds and didnt do much and Fedor is a smaller HW. He gave up dominant control against the cage to slip an armbar that was likely just a lure to get back up which Fedor did immediately. Fedor also threw him down once i dont see him stopping the bigger HWs TDs or a real wrestlers.

Last ill speak on it, time will tell and we can look back and see. I predict Rogers will not be ranked by years end if he fights more then twice. He may be able to beat Big Foot but i dont see him beating Werdum or Overeem.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

alizio said:


> guess we could argue til we are blue in the face. Time will prove who is right. Cains resume is more impressive, he went straight to the UFC because he couldnt find a local fight. Again, Cain was in the UFC.... not eliteXC or w/e. He went straight to the bigs. Jake O'Brian was once a hotshot prospect, Cain basically ended all hope of that (he had lost prior to Cain aswell tho). All the fighters Cain have fought minus on a whole are more talented then all Rogers except the fight he got KTFO and a flash KO of AA. Kongo is no joke, as i said, i would take Kongo over Rogers everyday of the week. Same with Rothwell.
> 
> Rogers did impress with his power vs AA, other then that, not much to point at and think there is alot of future success coming. He had control of Fedor for a couple seconds and didnt do much and Fedor is a smaller HW. He gave up dominant control against the cage to slip an armbar that was likely just a lure to get back up which Fedor did immediately. Fedor also threw him down once i dont see him stopping the bigger HWs TDs or a real wrestlers.
> 
> Last ill speak on it, time will tell and we can look back and see. I predict Rogers will not be ranked by years end if he fights more then twice. He may be able to beat Big Foot but i dont see him beating Werdum or Overeem.


Fedor is a world ***** champion many, many times over. There's not many people Fedor can't take down, he's one of the best, if not the best, HW grappler in MMA, that includes takedowns.

As you say, we will see what happens.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

alizio and M. Carson...can we agree that SF/Dream HWs are on par with UFC?

Mir ~ Fedor
Carwin ~ Grim
JDS ~ King Mo
Gonzaga ~ Lashley
Cain ~ Werdum
Big Nog ~ Arlovski
Nelson ~ A. Silva

I know the UFC is deeper but SF has some solid dudes.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

Did I just read that somebody thinks Kongo would beat Rogers? 


We know that Kongo lost to Heath freakin' Herring and Marrero right? 



Just wondering alizio... would you take Werdum over Rogers? Or Antonio Silva over Rogers? Who would you pick Rogers over?


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## fightpragmatist (Dec 3, 2009)

I am clearly winning this thread, no?


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Nope, I am!


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Winning*

Is that what this thread has become, a competition?


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## fightpragmatist (Dec 3, 2009)

kantowrestler said:


> Is that what this thread has become, a competition?


Yes, Kanto, you are a close second with your awesome post titles.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

You three last posters are literally my favorite posters that I don't talk to personally. :thumb02:


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Don't Talk Personally*

Well you can talk to us now, or at least me!


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## fightpragmatist (Dec 3, 2009)

Yeah, I'm pretty awesome and most people do love me, I think it has to do with me being so modest, oh wait...


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Modest*

That is something I am not!


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## ZENKI1 (Apr 19, 2009)

alizio said:


> he didnt say Fedor is a bum, he put him right up there with guys he considers the best in division and he would likely (T)KO Minotauro again but he wont have to worry about that, he better start practicing TDD
> 
> Grizzley, you will get nowhere with that arguement, around here even if Fedor doesnt look good or is in trouble, he never looked bad and was never in trouble. Around here Rogers is a true proven top HW and Big Timmy is a top 5 win. Around here Werdum is a great next opponent for the worlds number 1 ranked HW and Overeem is his biggest threat.... around here FEDOR IS GOD!!


Here we go again.. Dont you ever stop? Why post shit like this ? The way you intentionally go about you know its not gonna bring a respectable discussion but only a pissy fit.. Grow up man you would have thought you learned something by now.


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

ZENKI1 said:


> Here we go again.. Dont you ever stop? Why post shit like this ? The way you intentionally go about you know its not gonna bring a respectable discussion but only a pissy fit.. Grow up man you would have thought you learned something by now.


 cool story, bro.

why are you the only one to make a big deal and an entire OT post about it, when it was clearly said in jest and nobody else cared?? Wait til page 11 to comment on stuff on page 1 just to blast me?? Stop having a hardon for me and stop making OT posts just to disrespect me, it doesnt make you look any more mature.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

Alright guys, let's play nice.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Tenacity*

Yeah, calm down people!


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

You want to Fight?!?!? Fight ME!!

LOL

Agreed, lets be civil


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Weight*

Well lets see, how heavy are you?


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

Jesus Christ.

This is a thread about Mir talking about Fedor.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Back on Subject*

Ok, if Mir and Fedor went at it I think Fedor would win by a submission or TKO like the one he pulled on Rogers.


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## Chileandude (Jan 17, 2008)

*Mir is right.*

Fedor is too small, when the big guys start developing elite skills he's going to be in trouble.


Fedor has been so sucessful because he's a great fighter, and there haven't been great fighters that are big. 

But when the big guys start catching up with him skill-wise, he won't be able to keep owning everyone.

And i think that Mir and Lesnar will defeat him by the time he manages to strike a contract with the UFC.

Off course nobody can take away what Fedor has done, because he has been/was the number 1 heavyweight and P4P for a long number of years.

But eventually size will catch-up with him, it's only natural.


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## JWP (Jun 4, 2007)

Chileandude said:


> Fedor is too small, when the big guys start developing elite skills he's going to be in trouble.
> 
> 
> Fedor has been so sucessful because he's a great fighter, and there haven't been great fighters that are big.
> ...


i dunno man i think any possible fedor demise will have more to do with him aging rather than any big guys catching up. they would have to be on the scene by now

i did post this theory in another thread when talking abour Mir, i think in the future big heavyweights with speed and k-1 level striking (and enough ground game to hang in) will overtake guys like lesnar and mir in the future imo


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*In Time*

Yeah in time someone will be ablt to defeat Lesnar that is his size with the right skills!


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

JWP said:


> i dunno man i think any possible fedor demise will have more to do with him aging rather than any big guys catching up. they would have to be on the scene by now
> 
> i did post this theory in another thread when talking abour Mir, i* think in the future big heavyweights with speed and k-1 level striking (and enough ground game to hang in) will overtake guys like lesnar and mir in the future *imo


So I guess you think Overeem can beat them both??????


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Overeem*

He needs to actually worry about defending his title before he can worry about actually fighting Fedor or Mir!


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

kantowrestler said:


> He needs to actually worry about defending his title before he can worry about actually fighting Fedor or Mir!


It goes to show how small of a promotion Strikeforce is when your HW champ hasnt defended his belt in a few years.

They need to strip him of that belt ASAP.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Stripping the Belt*

The more I'm on this forum the more I start to think that stripping him of the belt might not be such a bad idea. I still think an Interim belt wouldn't be a bad idea either.


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

kantowrestler said:


> The more I'm on this forum the more I start to think that stripping him of the belt might not be such a bad idea. I still think an Interim belt wouldn't be a bad idea either.


Just take the f#cking thing from him already. He has shown no interest in defending the belt. Which I think is very disrespectful to Strikeforce. Overeem seems to think fighting in Dream and K-1 is more important than being a champion for an up and coming org like Strikeforce.


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## Ruckus (Oct 2, 2009)

JimmyJames said:


> Just take the f#cking thing from him already. He has shown no interest in defending the belt. Which I think is very disrespectful to Strikeforce. Overeem seems to think fighting in Dream and K-1 is more important than being a champion for an up and coming org like Strikeforce.


^this^

It's like beating a dead horse. SF seems to making moves forward yet this just continues to hold their HW division back somewhat. Not to mention that he is a big HW and once Fedor would shut him down, the Frank Mir statement becomes null and void.


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## Blitzz (Apr 13, 2009)

Ruckus said:


> ^this^
> 
> It's like beating a dead horse. SF seems to making moves forward yet this just continues to hold their HW division back somewhat. Not to mention that he is a big HW and once Fedor would shut him down, the Frank Mir statement becomes null and void.


Because Overeem is a better grappler than Mir?


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## Ruckus (Oct 2, 2009)

Blitzz said:


> Because Overeem is a better grappler than Mir?


The statement was that Fedor is too small to fight the bigger HWs. Overeem is 6'5", 260 lbs...that's a big HW. Never said anything about grappling skills of Overeem vs. Mir, just the size comment. Hell, Rogers is the same size and he wanted no part on the ground with Fedor as well. I like Mir, but the statement has no validity IMO, just classic Mir.


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## JWP (Jun 4, 2007)

JimmyJames said:


> So I guess you think Overeem can beat them both??????



ok i will clarify. i mean even higher level him, the cream of the crop who choose mma earlier on like anderson, machida, mousasi 

i was referring to bigger guys aswell

but yeh i do think he could definately catch them on a given day


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## Jimdon (Aug 27, 2008)

> Originally Posted by *JimmyJames*
> So I guess you think Overeem can beat them both??????


If Overeem can KO Badr, he can KO Fedor or Lesnar, not saying it's likely, but def possible.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

Jimdon said:


> If Overeem can KO Badr, he can KO Fedor or Lesnar, not saying it's likely, but def possible.


Agreed, and Overeem has THE BEST guillotine in MMA. And Brock's main take-down is the double scoop...


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## Cptmats (Dec 27, 2009)

Jimdon said:


> If Overeem can KO Badr, he can KO Fedor or Lesnar, not saying it's likely, but def possible.


I dont know if a 210 lb. Overoid could knock out anyone in the US, drug testing is a little better :thumbsup:


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## Diokhan (Jul 8, 2008)

Cptmats said:


> I dont know if a 210 lb. Overoid could knock out anyone in the US, drug testing is a little better :thumbsup:


He could prolly knock out the guy who gives him the cup to pee in, other than that I doubt he'll stop hiding from tests in japan anytime soon.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

6'5", 260, that is a significant height/weight advantage over Mir, but not one that MIr's skill couldn't overcome, IMO.


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## Diokhan (Jul 8, 2008)

swpthleg said:


> 6'5", 260, that is a significant height/weight advantage over Mir, but not one that MIr's skill couldn't overcome, IMO.


Mir was 264.5 pounds in his last fight, dunno if he cut weight for that or not, but no 260 pounds isn't enough to outweight him anymore.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

Diokhan said:


> Mir was 264.5 pounds in his last fight, dunno if he cut weight for that or not, but no 260 pounds isn't enough to outweight him anymore.


Damn, I know he got bigger, I didn't realize he got quite that big. Mir's weight/shape fluctuations and morphing are messing with my head.


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## Woodenhead (Jan 5, 2010)

JWP said:


> i dunno man i think any possible fedor demise will have more to do with him aging rather than any big guys catching up.


Yup, my feelings exactly.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

Overeem is also an unreal amount stronger than Mir, he's an absolutely shredded 260 opposed to a little thicker 264.

Overeem's frame is also better designed for that weight.




As to the original statement... Rogers is the same height, reach, and weight as Lesnar and he got thrown around and KO'd by Fedor.


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## Xerxes (Aug 14, 2008)

khoveraki said:


> Overeem is also an unreal amount *stronger than Mir*, he's an absolutely shredded 260 opposed to a little thicker 264.
> 
> Overeem's frame is also better designed for that weight.


Agreed but Overeem is lighter than 260. He's much closer to 250. But as you said he's a shredded 250er. 



> As to the original statement... Rogers is the same height, reach, and weight as Lesnar and he got thrown around and KO'd by Fedor.


Rogers doesnt have Lesnar's wrestling background. They are very different fighters.


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## Cptmats (Dec 27, 2009)

swpthleg said:


> 6'5", 260, that is a significant height/weight advantage over Mir, but not one that MIr's skill couldn't overcome, IMO.


He would need some time to get clean before he could fight in the US, i dont think he would be able to mantain the massive frame, prolly wouldnt be weight dif.


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

Xerxes said:


> Rogers doesnt have Lesnar's wrestling background. They are very different fighters.


I would also have to say that Lesnar is probably quite a bit stronger than Rogers as well. I doubt that Fedor would come close to just tossing him around.


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> Overeem is also an unreal amount stronger than Mir, he's an absolutely shredded 260 opposed to a little thicker 264.
> 
> Overeem's frame is also better designed for that weight.
> 
> ...


Overeem looks shredded because he has a much bigger upper body than Mir who holds a lot of his weight in his legs and mid-section.

They just carry their weight in different places, and that doesnt necessarily make Overeem stronger than Mir.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Stronger*

It might mean that Mir and Overeem are stronger in different places. Some people just put on muscle in different places!


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## Cptmats (Dec 27, 2009)

JimmyJames said:


> Overeem looks shredded because he has a much bigger upper body than Mir who holds a lot of his weight in his legs and mid-section.
> 
> They just carry their weight in different places, and that doesnt necessarily make Overeem stronger than Mir.


Hahaha, yeh Overeem carries his in a vile in his pocket.


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## Xerxes (Aug 14, 2008)

HitOrGetHit said:


> I would also have to say that Lesnar is probably quite a bit stronger than Rogers as well. I doubt that Fedor would come close to just tossing him around.


Exactly. Wrestling develops your core strength tremendously.


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## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

khoveraki said:


> How is that MMA Math? Andrei fought Nelson, then Fedor, then Rogers, it wasn't even two fights apart when Nelson lost and Rogers destroyed him.
> 
> 
> That's how you figure out rankings, not MMA Math. :confused03:


Well to me it sounded like you think Rogers would beat Nelson because Nelson lost to Andrei and Rogers beat Andrei. That to me is MMA Math at its fullest. If thats not what you were implying then i respectfully take back my comment.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*MMA Math?*

Ok, and then after beating Arlovski, Rogers fought Fedor and got TKO'd in similar fashion to Arlovski!


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## vaj3000 (Dec 28, 2008)

Xerxes said:


> Exactly. Wrestling develops your core strength tremendously.


yup and the fact that lesnar is a lean 260lb and a world class wrestler makes it a difficult proposition indeed


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

vaj3000 said:


> yup and the fact that lesnar is a lean 260lb and a world class wrestler makes it a difficult proposition indeed



Lesnar is also 4-1 ~ the same record as Kimbo Slice...can we see him fight 10x before declaring his toughness?


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## Jimdon (Aug 27, 2008)

Anyone who compares Lesnar to Kimbo needs to give their head a shake.


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## Cptmats (Dec 27, 2009)

Jimdon said:


> Anyone who compares Lesnar to Kimbo needs to give their head a shake.


A little harsh ! Brock is over rated....chill im not hating, Hes only 4-1, he may be as good as hes made out to be but it will take time to know for sure. He hasnt been hit hard by a good striker, he hasnt felt a good hard leg kick, hes never been on his back or felt an elbow cutting into his flesh.....to call him the best heavey weight in the game (and alot do) is jumping the gun a little.....he may very well be one day soon, but for now theres just too many question marks.


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## Siikk (Jan 25, 2010)

Just watch UFC 100 countdown, he said all that shit about Brock and got pwned. They all say the same about Fedor but in the end he always wins.


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

Samborules said:


> Lesnar is also 4-1 ~ the same record as Kimbo Slice...can we see him fight 10x before declaring his toughness?


Brock Lesnar and Kimbo are not even close in talent. Brock is much stronger and faster than Kimbo, he is an excellent wrestler with vicious ground and pound. He has fought much betetr opponents than Kimbo as well.



Cptmats said:


> A little harsh ! Brock is over rated....chill im not hating, Hes only 4-1, he may be as good as hes made out to be but it will take time to know for sure. He hasnt been hit hard by a good striker, he hasnt felt a good hard leg kick, hes never been on his back or felt an elbow cutting into his flesh.....to call him the best heavey weight in the game (and alot do) is jumping the gun a little.....he may very well be one day soon, but for now theres just too many question marks.


Yes their are question marks, but he has shown signs that he will be a star. I would also like to point out that Fedor started out at 4-1 as well.



Siikk said:


> Just watch UFC 100 countdown, he said all that shit about Brock and got pwned. They all say the same about Fedor but in the end he always wins.


This is said about all of the champions. Everyone wants an upset. In almost evety championship bout, there is a good number of people that will convince themselves that the champion will lose this time.


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## Cptmats (Dec 27, 2009)

HitOrGetHit said:


> Yes their are question marks, but he has shown signs that he will be a star. I would also like to point out that Fedor started out at 4-1 as well.


Good point except Brocks 4-1 is legit and his one loss was in 90 secs. Fedor has 32 pro fights against top level compitition and no one has ever even come close to beating him.........oh and Fedor isnt 270lbs.


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

Cptmats said:


> Good point except Brocks 4-1 is legit and his one loss was in 90 secs. Fedor has 32 pro fights against top level compitition and no one has ever even come close to beating him.........oh and Fedor isnt 270lbs.


All I am saying is that Fedor started out at 4-1 and look at what he has become. Brock could become dominant like that as well with his own style.


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## Cptmats (Dec 27, 2009)

HitOrGetHit said:


> All I am saying is that Fedor started out at 4-1 and look at what he has become. Brock could become dominant like that as well with his own style.


Yup, i hear you. The point im trying to make though is that Lesner isnt the HW champ because he the best HW in the UFC, hes the champ because he sells tickets. He was 1-1 coming off a loss and gets a tittle shot ? Why did Nog not get a tittle shot ? he lost to Mir as well !.....with the right training and a few more fights he could very well be the fighter everyone allready thinks he is....just not yet.

But you make some good points and i repped u for that !


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Cptmats said:


> Yup, i hear you. The point im trying to make though is that Lesner isnt the HW champ because he the best HW in the UFC, hes the champ because he sells tickets. He was 1-1 coming off a loss and gets a tittle shot ? Why did Nog not get a tittle shot ? he lost to Mir as well !.....with the right training and a few more fights he could very well be the fighter everyone allready thinks he is....just not yet.
> 
> But you make some good points and i repped u for that !


I understand what you are saying but Brock isnt the champ because he sells tickets. He is the champ because he beat everybody since the first Mir fight. The reason he is the UFC champ is because of those wins......... and because of the huge amount of money he brings in being the second most popular behind Kimbo sadly:thumbsdown:


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## Cptmats (Dec 27, 2009)

JimmyJames said:


> I understand what you are saying but Brock isnt the champ because he sells tickets. He is the champ because he beat everybody since the first Mir fight. The reason he is the UFC champ is because of those wins......... and because of the huge amount of money he brings in being the second most popular behind Kimbo sadly:thumbsdown:


What wins ? he lost to Mir and his next fight was for a tittle !.......Cain V is 7-0 hasnt got a shot....cause people dont pay to see him like they do with Brock......Brock sells, only reason hes the champ......not saying he wouldnt be eventually.....but after 1 win and 1 loss....c'mon


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## TheAxeMurderer (Oct 27, 2009)

Cptmats said:


> What wins ? he lost to Mir and his next fight was for a tittle !.......Cain V is 7-0 hasnt got a shot....cause people dont pay to see him like they do with Brock......Brock sells, only reason hes the champ......not saying he wouldnt be eventually.....but after 1 win and 1 loss....c'mon


Actually his next fight was against herring


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## Hammerlock2.0 (Jun 17, 2009)

TheAxeMurderer said:


> Actually his next fight was against herring


And then he stopped Couture...


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## drey2k (Jul 9, 2009)

Man Fedor would seriously lay a big nasty hurting on Mir... please let this fight happen.



HitOrGetHit said:


> All I am saying is that Fedor started out at 4-1 and look at what he has become. Brock could become dominant like that as well with his own style.


Buddy he was only 4-1 because he lost due to a cut at the very beginning of the fight. It's hardly a real loss.


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

drey2k said:


> Buddy he was only 4-1 because he lost due to a cut at the very beginning of the fight. It's hardly a real loss.


I am not saying that Lesnar is better or that Fedor is better. I am just saying that it's kinda early for people to be talking bad about Lesnar's skills in the cage. Fedor was 4-1 and look how he turned out! I am not saying that Lesnar is the next Fedor either. I am simply showing that at this stage, Lesnar is on track and he has a good record and he could be dominant.


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## Johnni G (Dec 2, 2009)

Rauno™ said:


> How can he still call himself as the best heavyweight out there, whn UFC 100 wasnt that long time ago.


+1:thumbsup:


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

JimmyJames said:


> I understand what you are saying but Brock isnt the champ because he sells tickets. He is the champ because he beat everybody since the first Mir fight. The reason he is the UFC champ is because of those wins......... and because of the huge amount of money he brings in being the second most popular behind Kimbo sadly:thumbsdown:


Coture world of lost his title to any number of guys in the UFC, the title was an easy target in his hands, I for one believe

Carwin
JDS
Mir
Nog
Cain

too name a few could of all took that title from Couture, hell I would even of had my money on Chieck Kongo to beat couture.

The UFC knew this and gave the title shot to Brock because Brock sells tickets, I agree that maybe Brock is the beat HW in the UFC but he has not proven it yet in my eyes, and there where other who deserved that title shot before him.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

How about Mir fighting Carwin...there is a nice fight!


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

I just realized something.

*Frank Mir has lost to:*



A LHW in Vera

A 220lb HW in Cruz

ANOTHER LHW in Freeman


*While Fedor has beaten:*



Semmy Schilt (290lbs)

Zulu (400lbs+)

HMC (319lbs)

Sylvia (280lbs)

Brett Rogers (265lbs)


Plus loads of other fights who were 250lbs+.


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