# Oh no, rampage isnt in shape for the rashad fight



## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

I kid, i kid:










Sorry to all rashad fans out there, but my god, he really is entering a world of pain. Gone are my doubts of rampage not turning up in shape and un-motivated.

Good luck in that octagon next week suga, boy, your going to need it.

http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2010/5/24/1485777/snapshot-of-the-day-2-rampage


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## Mx2 (May 4, 2010)

I approve of this thread.


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## The505Butcher (Jul 30, 2009)

Is this just me or does he not look as ripped as he normally does? Maybe this is just me not liking him.


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## H-Deep (Feb 3, 2009)

When i watched 24/7 i couldnt help but thinking how badly rampage wants to beat rashad. usually i see fighters hyping fights etc but with rampage it looked like a dofferent type of emotion. I personally cannot wait for this fight and i think if Rashad stands with him then it wont last more than 2 rounds


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## xeberus (Apr 23, 2007)

i look better than that without my shirt on and I had a cheeseburger for lunch


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

And the WINNER ISSSSS

QUINTON "RAMPAGEEEEEEE" JAAACKKSOOONN


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

xeberus said:


> i look better than that without my shirt on and I had a cheeseburger for lunch


Cool story ese.


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## SpoKen (Apr 28, 2007)

So I don't want to hear any excuses about Rampage being out of shape.

Deal?


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

Spoken812 said:


> So I don't want to hear any excuses about Rampage being out of shape.
> 
> Deal?


I dont make up excuses for fighters losing any ways. Its quite clear hes in shape though.

How do you see rashad winning this fight btw?


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## H-Deep (Feb 3, 2009)

Spoken812 said:


> So I don't want to hear any excuses about Rampage being out of shape.
> 
> Deal?


No deal, we as mma fight fans will always find an excuse :thumb02:


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## hommage1985 (Apr 22, 2007)

He isn't in shape. Look how tired he was from a little running in Primetime.


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## Crester (Apr 5, 2009)

He sure looks better than before...

I think Rashad is in for a hurting. He couldn't take punches from Silva... how's the gonna take punches from Rampage?

RIP Rashad


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## endersshadow (Mar 10, 2010)

H-Deep said:


> No deal, we as mma fight fans will always find an excuse :thumb02:


This.

If Evans gets knocked out this weekend, it's because of an illegal knee, a finger to the eye, or SOMETHING!


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## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

Looks to be in decent shape, but I think we've seen him in better (a little more shredded, etc.). Though, how can one really tell on the basis of a single image? I think Jackson is hungry for a win in this one... it's personal, and you can tell he absolutely does not want to lose to Rashad. I don't think he'd short change himself by showing up out of shape or not training his arse off... not for this fight. He's talked too mean a game to not bring the noise come fight night. Really looking forward to it, to be honest. This is once instance where the trash talking has proven uber effective in peaking my interest in a showdown.


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## beaux (May 20, 2010)

Well if he was haunted by Silva and shogun kicking his ass. Dana might want to put his silly ass on suicide watch after Saturday night.


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## SpoKen (Apr 28, 2007)

Mckeever said:


> I dont make up excuses for fighters losing any ways. Its quite clear hes in shape though.
> 
> How do you see rashad winning this fight btw?


Stoppage by Rashad in the late 2nd, early 3rd. I think Rashad will stay away from Rampage's power by staying out of the pocket to strike, than drive him against the cage and take him down repeatedly.

If I'm wrong and Rashad can't take Rampage down, then I may rethink Rashad winning. But Rashad has some of the best takedowns in MMA, so we'll just have to see.


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## Crester (Apr 5, 2009)

Is there really anything for Rashad to be proud of if he just lays down on Rampage for 3 rounds?


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## EastonAssassin (Nov 5, 2009)

the excuse everyone will use is the 'lay and pray' or ' he was too scared to exchange strikes'


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## SpoKen (Apr 28, 2007)

Crester said:


> Is there really anything for Rashad to be proud of if he just lays down on Rampage for 3 rounds?


You call it laying and praying, I'm a fan so I call it dominating Rampage's will.

Is it Rashad's fault that his wrestling is better than anything Rampage can throw at him?


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Crester said:


> Is there really anything for Rashad to be proud of if he just lays down on Rampage for 3 rounds?


In the eyes of Greg Jackson it is.


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## Rusty (Apr 13, 2010)

Physique means next to nothing in how well someone is in shape. Examples Roy Nelson, Marius Putz, Kongo, Baroni, Velasquez, Fedor, Randleman, Sokoudjou, etc... We'll see if Rampage is in shape the night of the fight and not a second sooner.


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## Crester (Apr 5, 2009)

Spoken812 said:


> You call it laying and praying, I'm a fan so I call it dominating Rampage's will.
> 
> Is it Rashad's fault that his wrestling is better than anything Rampage can throw at him?


I understand what you're saying... if you can take somebody down at will you are controlling the fight.

But really... if you just take somebody down and don't really cause damage... are you really a good "fighter"?


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## punchbag (Mar 1, 2010)

H-Deep said:


> No deal, we as mma fight fans will always find an excuse :thumb02:


Mine is with superior head movement and slicker boxing skills, but wouldn't be suprised if Rashad has been training solidly on his ground game as he feels it could be a great advantage being better than Page on the floor, although Rampage has great anti grappling.
I think if Rashad sticks to his game plan and doesn't get into a brwal, he wins the fight.
But as we all know if Page clips you once, your going to sleep.


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## Kado (Apr 18, 2010)

Crester said:


> Is there really anything for Rashad to be proud of if he just lays down on Rampage for 3 rounds?




Yea its called a win.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

Crester said:


> I understand what you're saying... if you can take somebody down at will you are controlling the fight.
> 
> But really... if you just take somebody down and don't really cause damage... are you really a good "fighter"?


Yeah, you are. GSP sat on Hardy for 5 rounds and tried what, 2 sub attempts during the whole fight, and he's considered a P4P great.

Control is control, and whether you agree with it/like it or not, if you control the fight and win it, you're the better all around fighter.


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## Calibretto9 (Oct 15, 2006)

I think if Rashad gets Rampage down early and can control him there, that's extremely bad. Not because of the physical damage, but the mental damage that will cause. 'Page seems like the kind of guy who could come in, having a ton of "He's dead!" energy, get taken down, and get frustrated and burnt out. 

On the other hand, if he's able to lean on the fence and fend Rashad off and let Rashad burn himself out, Rashad is in trouble in my opinion. 

*Thinks back to how bad Rashad looked against Tito.*


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## SigFig (Sep 22, 2009)

EastonAssassin said:


> the excuse everyone will use is the 'lay and pray' or ' he was too scared to exchange strikes'


Ding ding ding. Correct answer.

Although, I've yet to cap this fight and don't have an official play. My gut is telling me Rampage is gonna knock Rashad's head off. Not sure I'll be able to wager on this fight though -- the layoff for Rampage is of some concern to me.


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

Rampage has had a full camp to get in shape, it would be ridiculous if he didn't leave enough time to do it properly. He might have a bit of cage rust, but he'll be in shape.

















Looks about right to me. A shredded Rampage usually has a gas tank, so we're good to go.

I'ts going to be frustrating for Rampage though because Rashad wont be there to trade for too long, because he knows his chin can't take a Rampage bomb. Run, takedown, run, takedown... zzzzzzzzz

Hopefully it goes something like this...










Boom, goodnight.


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## Zenhalo (Sep 9, 2006)

Ripped in no way equals MMA talent.


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## G_Land (Aug 11, 2009)

Zenhalo said:


> Ripped in no way equals MMA talent.


 
An everyday person your right but this is Rampage and a Ripped Rampage = mma talent


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## Mx2 (May 4, 2010)

Zenhalo said:


> Ripped in no way equals MMA talent.


Except we already know Rampage has MMA talent, so him being in good shape just adds to it.


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

RustyRenegade said:


> Physique means next to nothing in how well someone is in shape. Examples Roy Nelson, Marius Putz, Kongo, Baroni, Velasquez, Fedor, Randleman, Sokoudjou, etc... We'll see if Rampage is in shape the night of the fight and not a second sooner.


Rampage isn't like any of those guys. When he turns up shredded, he's ready to go 5 rounds, let alone 3. His UFC career to date shows us that, so nevermind those other names.

Look at the examples you gave for people who gas... Pudz, Randleman, Sokky, Baroni... all these guys are stacked with muscle they can't fuel. Rampage doesn't have any more muscle than he needs to power bomb fools and knock their heads off

WAR RAMPAGE


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## NATAS (Jun 30, 2008)

After reading this entire thread. If we see the Rampage we know and love, he is going to take it in my opinion. Rampage can hold his own against Hendo, and take Hendo's right hand grenade then im not worried about Rashad. He has great head movement but that isnt going to win you a fight.

Id be impressed with Rashad if he tore Page apart with vicious low leg kicks, frusterating him and then going in for the kill but I just don't see it. Great fight all in all.


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## Machida Karate (Nov 30, 2009)

War Rampage!


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

Spoken812 said:


> Stoppage by Rashad in the late 2nd, early 3rd. I think Rashad will stay away from Rampage's power by staying out of the pocket to strike, than drive him against the cage and take him down repeatedly.
> 
> If I'm wrong and Rashad can't take Rampage down, then I may rethink Rashad winning. But Rashad has some of the best takedowns in MMA, so we'll just have to see.


Thats fair enough. Im glad to see your not some blind fan boy and are realistic about the match up. Heres the thing though. I dont think rashads wrestling will be this big problem everyone thinks it will. Rampage has very under rated wrestling and has proved in the past he can deal with elite level wrestlers. Its almost as if people are implying rampage is a one dimensional striker with no wrestling. Not at all true. 

Id love it if rampage came at us with a few surprises and slammed rashad silly onto the mat. Rampage has brutal take downs.



Michael Carson said:


> Yeah, you are. GSP sat on Hardy for 5 rounds and tried what, 2 sub attempts during the whole fight, and he's considered a P4P great.
> 
> Control is control, and whether you agree with it/like it or not, if you control the fight and win it, you're the better all around fighter.


In my opinion that doesn't equal fighting, that equals pure wrestling. What i seen in the dan hardy fight was purely a wrestling exhibition match. That isnt what i would call "fighting".


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## BrianRClover (Jan 4, 2008)

Spoken812 said:


> So I don't want to hear any excuses about Rampage being out of shape.
> 
> Deal?


No doubt man! You seem to be forgetting though that Rampage never loses... he beats himself. If he doesn't make up the excuses I gurantee his fan base will.


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

Mckeever said:


> In my opinion that doesn't equal fighting, that equals pure wrestling. What i seen in the dan hardy fight was purely a wrestling exhibition match. That isnt what i would call "fighting".


That's strange, because it was more BJJ than wrestling.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Rampage is going to punch Rashad so hard his soul will fly out....


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## Dan0 (Aug 22, 2008)

I only hope Rampage's KO over Rashad will be even more devastating and ridiculous than Machida's KO over Rashad.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

This thread is getting me pumped. Rampage looks chunky and mean. He'll easily make 205 at the weigh-in.

I consider Rashad the better overall fighter. More skilled. More athletic. The problem is, this is a proper old-skool grudge match. The emotions are different to anything Rashad has ever experienced before. For him, staying calm is the best thing to do. Sticking to gameplans and all that.. but in fights like this? O, man... He has no idea.

Whereas Rampage knows all about fighting with rage and full of emotion. Hate and anger make Rampage better. These things make Rashad crumble in my opinion. I dont think he has the fibre to rise above the raw energy of the night and be calm. IF he can, then he'll win... but I dont think it will go like that.

I think Rashad will be overwhelmed by it all and make too many mistakes. On the other side will be Jackson... well and truly in Rampage mode, making him pay.


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## Danm2501 (Jun 22, 2009)

Mckeever said:


> In my opinion that doesn't equal fighting, that equals pure wrestling. What i seen in the dan hardy fight was purely a wrestling exhibition match. That isnt what i would call "fighting".


The sport isn't called "fighting". It's called Mixed Martial Arts. Wrestling is as much of a Martial Art as Karate. As already mentioned too, it was more of a Jiu-Jitsu exhibition than a wrestling one from GSP. If you don't want to watch World-Class Grappling, then I'm not too sure MMA is the sport for you. I love a good stand-up war as much as the next guy, but the intricacies of Jiu Jitsu and the technique behind Wrestling fascinates me. I found GSP dominating Hardy with such ease brilliant to watch.


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## Neolistic (Apr 22, 2007)

Why does rampage's abbs look as if someone punched them over to his side.? Is this normal?


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## Thelegend (Nov 2, 2009)

lol ts i was coming with a mind full of flame but thanks for the lulz plus rep indeed.:bye02::thumb02:




Soojooko said:


> This thread is getting me pumped. Rampage looks chunky and mean. He'll easily make 205 at the weigh-in.
> 
> I consider Rashad the better overall fighter. More skilled. More athletic. The problem is, this is a proper old-skool grudge match. The emotions are different to anything Rashad has ever experienced before. For him, staying calm is the best thing to do. Sticking to gameplans and all that.. but in fights like this? O, man... He has no idea.
> 
> ...


yessssssssss........let the hate flow through you and become one with the dark side of the force.............


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## G_Land (Aug 11, 2009)

Thelegend said:


> lol ts i was coming with a mind full of flame but thanks for the lulz plus rep indeed.:bye02::thumb02:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
GGGOOOODDDDDD hate makes you STRROOONNNGGGGG makes you FOCUSSSS


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

Danm2501 said:


> The sport isn't called "fighting". It's called Mixed Martial Arts. Wrestling is as much of a Martial Art as Karate. As already mentioned too, it was more of a Jiu-Jitsu exhibition than a wrestling one from GSP. If you don't want to watch World-Class Grappling, then I'm not too sure MMA is the sport for you. I love a good stand-up war as much as the next guy, but the intricacies of Jiu Jitsu and the technique behind Wrestling fascinates me. I found GSP dominating Hardy with such ease brilliant to watch.


Please dont feed me the; mma isnt the sport for you man. Ive been watching mma for around 5 years now.

If you want to watch a good grappling mma fight then go and watch shogun rua vs eric wanderlei. Please do.

I dont consider GSP taking a guy down for 5 rounds whilst attemtping a staggering 2 submission attempts (which he made basic ju jitsu errors) and just smothering his opponent. Without inflicting damage, dan hardy didnt have a bruise on his face, hardly the expected face of some one whos just come out of a 5 round championship fight.

MMA is fighting which ever way you look at it. You dont see fights where guys just lie on top of each other not looking to beat each other up whilst down there.

If i wanted to watch pure wrestling with no damage, i would go watch some wrestling tournaments, not an mma bout. If i want to watch a pure kick boxing fight, i'll watch some K-1. 

UFC need to enforce rules in the octagon to make the fighters work and press the action like pride. A yellow card system, any thing. I dont want to watch kos vs daley, gsp vs hardy boring fights as main and co main events. I want excitement.


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## Rusty (Apr 13, 2010)

I agree on the yellow card idea. Start docking some pay and see what happens:thumb02:

To Rampage: If you got hate in your heart, let it out!!! Boogy Woogy!!!


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## limba (Jul 21, 2009)

He looks OK. It'd nothing spectacular.
But looking great and fighting great are two different things.
I can't think enough of the fact that Rampage hasn't fought since march 2009. And he had a hard time against Jardine.
And to be honest, everyone who fought Jardine lately, has put him to sleep, so that's interesting also.
I think Evans won't engage in hard exchanges with Rampage and will try to use his speed advantage to score points and also try and use the wrestling advantage against Page.
If he can avoid those big punches from Rampage, i think he will be ok.


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## SpoKen (Apr 28, 2007)

Mckeever said:


> Please dont feed me the; mma isnt the sport for you man. Ive been watching mma for around 5 years now.
> 
> If you want to watch a good grappling mma fight then go and watch shogun rua vs eric wanderlei. Please do.
> 
> ...


I wish the yellow card system came to the UFC, but I don't think it'll happen. No way you can take money away from someone now a days. They make fighters stand up when it's just no action, but fighters can "look" busy and just lay on top of you (My favorite fighter) and stay on the ground for a full 5 minutes.

What I'm suggesting is, if the fighter isn't looking to pass or posture up for effective strikes for 10 seconds, warn them. Another 10 seconds, stand them up.


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

Mckeever said:


> Please dont feed me the; mma isnt the sport for you man. Ive been watching mma for around 5 years now.
> 
> If you want to watch a good grappling mma fight then go and watch shogun rua vs eric wanderlei. Please do.
> 
> ...


It wasn't just wrestling though, it was BJJ mostly. Since when is the main aim of BJJ to cause cuts and bruises on someone's face? Yeh, punching happens at a much higher rate and causes obvious damage, but BJJ is just as legit, despite no damage being caused in between sub attempts. I don't like that logic where there has to be visible damage for it to have been a fight. It's an MMA fight, not a fight, so that's why I don't accept it.

It wasn't two sub attempts, what about all the times GSP took Hardy's back? He was continually trying to end the fight, but in a manner that didn't result in cuts and bruises. Why is a BJJ based gameplan unnaceptable but a striking gameplan is? One causes more damage, but both are part of martial arts, so why is GSP's approach so unnaceptable? He could have done more, but I see at as no different to a steady but one sides standup fight. Not as exciting to most, no cuts and bruises, but just as much a part of MMA.

GSP couldn't finish the fight, he made mistakes and could have punched Hardy in the face some more. But let's face it, you linking a good grappling fight just emphasises that the fight didn't involve 2 fighters who are able to grapple. Dan Hardy just rolled around being dominated, merely surviving and not actually doing anything to make it competitive. Throw someone who can grapple in there with GSP and you'll see a much better display... BJ and Fitch.


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## Danm2501 (Jun 22, 2009)

GSP landed 118 Ground strikes according to Compustrike, with 168 attempted. Then according to Fightmetric he landed 90 strikes to the head on the ground. GSP took Dan's back 5 times, moved to the mount twice and attempted 6 submissions. GSP was *far* more active in the Hardy fight than Josh Koscheck was in his fight against Paul Daley for example. Koscheck only landed 42 punches to the head on the ground; achieved the mount once, had Daley's back twice and only attempted 1 submission (none according to Compustrike). That's the definition of laying on an opponent, using GSP as an example simply isn't fair AFAIC. I enjoyed the GSP-Hardy fight a lot. The Koscheck-Daley fight wasn't entertaining until after the bell =p.


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## MILFHunter947 (Jan 30, 2010)

Hiro said:


> That's strange, because it was more BJJ than wrestling.


yea im pretty sure he meant a grappling match, dont be taking his words so literally, i think we all know what he meant


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

MILFHunter947 said:


> yea im pretty sure he meant a grappling match, dont be taking his words so literally, i think we all know what he meant


Ok, a grappling match... it doesn't matter. A kickboxing match is fine, but grappling isnt despite trying to snap body parts and choke the other unconcious?

There is actually no argument to back up the notion that BJJ that doesn't end in a sub isn't legit, apart from the lack of damage caused isn't as exciting. That's what it boils down to. It's a part of MMA, but people want the rules bent just because they don't like it as much as one dimensional standup fights.


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## Mx2 (May 4, 2010)

Hiro said:


> Ok, a grappling match... it doesn't matter. A kickboxing match is fine, but grappling isnt despite trying to snap body parts and choke the other unconcious?
> 
> There is actually no argument to back up the notion that BJJ that doesn't end in a sub isn't legit, apart from the lack of damage caused isn't as exciting. That's what it boils down to. It's a part of MMA, but people want the rules bent just because they don't like it as much as one dimensional standup fights.


Truth. I'd give you rep but I have to spread the love first. :thumbsdown:


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## edlavis88 (Jul 12, 2009)

Hiro said:


> Ok, a grappling match... it doesn't matter. A kickboxing match is fine, but grappling isnt despite trying to snap body parts and choke the other unconcious?
> 
> There is actually no argument to back up the notion that BJJ that doesn't end in a sub isn't legit, apart from the lack of damage caused isn't as exciting. That's what it boils down to. It's a part of MMA, but people want the rules bent just because they don't like it as much as one dimensional standup fights.


I think people just want fighters to try and finish the fight, and there can be no arguement that some fighters do not try all they can to finish fights.
I personally don't have a problem with GSP and Rashad's wrestling and BJJ cos they are always working for better position and subs or GnP. For example when GSP's fights with Alves and Fitch went to decisions, they both were still battered and bloody by the end. It's fights like the Koscheck/Daley one which piss people off, when Daley had not a single scratch on him, and once Koscheck knew Daley couldn't get a sweep he made little attempt to finish him on the ground.

People will always prefer fighters that finish fights. Hence why more people want Rampage to win than Rashad!


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## MILFHunter947 (Jan 30, 2010)

Hiro said:


> Ok, a grappling match... it doesn't matter. A kickboxing match is fine, but grappling isnt despite trying to snap body parts and choke the other unconcious?
> 
> There is actually no argument to back up the notion that BJJ that doesn't end in a sub isn't legit, apart from the lack of damage caused isn't as exciting. That's what it boils down to. It's a part of MMA, but people want the rules bent just because they don't like it as much as one dimensional standup fights.


naw i feel u man, i was just clearing up what he said, i wasnt defending what he said


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

edlavis88 said:


> I think people just want fighters to try and finish the fight, and there can be no arguement that some fighters do not try all they can to finish fights.
> I personally don't have a problem with GSP and Rashad's wrestling and BJJ cos they are always working for better position and subs or GnP. For example when GSP's fights with Alves and Fitch went to decisions, they both were still battered and bloody by the end. It's fights like the Koscheck/Daley one which piss people off, when Daley had not a single scratch on him, and once Koscheck knew Daley couldn't get a sweep he made little attempt to finish him on the ground.
> 
> People will always prefer fighters that finish fights. I don't see a problem with that!


Kos vs Daley was nothing like GSP vs Hardy. Stats for both fights were posted on the previous page of this thread, GSP was active and it's still not acceptable to some. He didn't just lay on Hardy like Kos did on Daley. It's the difference between the two that people need to acknowledge. It winds me up when I hear fans, Dan Hardy and whoever, saying GSP is just a wrestler and doesn't fight, and talk about that sort of performance in the same light as real LnP like Kos vs Daley.



MILFHunter947 said:


> naw i feel u man, i was just clearing up what he said, i wasnt defending what he said


Ah ok, cool. If he meant wrestling then he's watching the wrong fight, and if he meant grappling then he's just plain wrong.

:thumb02:


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## 154rambo (Apr 2, 2010)

LOL! I love the shit talking threads. I wouldn't mind seeing either man win, but I think Rashad is gonna take it!


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## edlavis88 (Jul 12, 2009)

Hiro said:


> Kos vs Daley was nothing like GSP vs Hardy. Stats for both fights were posted on the previous page of this thread, GSP was active and it's still not acceptable to some. He didn't just lay on Hardy like Kos did on Daley. It's the difference between the two that people need to acknowledge. It winds me up when I hear fans, Dan Hardy and whoever, saying GSP is just a wrestler and doesn't fight, and talk about that sort of performance in the same light as real LnP like Kos vs Daley.


This! Sorry to go off topic but GSP was within inches of finishing all his fights against Fitch, Alves and Hardy. Rocked Fitch, busted open Alves and was abotu a second away from snapping Hardy's arm! That ain't "lay and pray!"

Back on topic, Rashad worries me. Against Thiago Silva he was really boring, hardly worked any elbows from guard and side position, i mean according to compustrike he threw 4 ground strikes... in 3 rounds compared to 41 in the griffin fight! If he does the same against Rampage, he might win but i'll probs be asleep by the end!


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

edlavis88 said:


> This! Sorry to go off topic but GSP was within inches of finishing all his fights against Fitch, Alves and Hardy. Rocked Fitch, busted open Alves and was abotu a second away from snapping Hardy's arm! That ain't "lay and pray!"
> 
> Back on topic, Rashad worries me. Against Thiago Silva he was really boring, hardly worked any elbows from guard and side position, i mean according to compustrike he threw 4 ground strikes... in 3 rounds compared to 41 in the griffin fight! If he does the same against Rampage, he might win but i'll probs be asleep by the end!


Yeah and Thiago was able to get up all the time. He was very ineffective in that fight. Problem he's up against is Rampage has good wrestling, is strong and is angry :thumb02:


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

Wonder if the layoffs has helped him mentally and physically. Obviously there's a bit of rust, but sometimes the body needs time off to rebuild. 

"THE FIGHT DRAWS NEAR. THE FOCUS SHARPENS. THE METAMORPHOSIS HAS BEGUN..." - UNKNOWN


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

Mckeever said:


> Please dont feed me the; mma isnt the sport for you man. Ive been watching mma for around 5 years now.
> 
> If you want to watch a good grappling mma fight then go and watch shogun rua vs eric wanderlei. Please do.
> 
> ...


And that's exactly the beauty of this Sport :thumbsup: That not everything is just fist to the head and again and again and again fist to the head..


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## Davisty69 (May 24, 2007)

I have $5 on Rampage with a friend. I hope he dominates


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## Icculus (Oct 4, 2009)

BobbyCooper said:


> And that's exactly the beauty of this Sport :thumbsup: That not everything is just fist to the head and again and again and again fist to the head..


What gets you a win is what you will see more and more of. The rules of the game definitely favor wrestling skill over all other skills (at least atm). The beauty of it is that the rest of the world should start catching up eventually, just like everyone had to catch up to the BJJ guys before.

That said, I definitely agree with the other guy, at least a little bit, dont we all?.


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## MrObjective (May 22, 2010)

Dan0 said:


> I only hope Rampage's KO over Rashad will be even more devastating and ridiculous than Machida's KO over Rashad.


Rampage KOed W Silva

Machida caught Rashad and unleashed a flurry with tons of precise shots on the button


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## SpoKen (Apr 28, 2007)

MrObjective said:


> Rampage KOed W Silva
> 
> Machida caught Rashad and unleashed a flurry with tons of precise shots on the button


This post is so... mindblowing.

Literally. My mind is blown away at this post.


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## MrObjective (May 22, 2010)

Spoken812 said:


> This post is so... mindblowing.
> 
> Literally. My mind is blown away at this post.


Why? I'm not saying Rashad has no one punch KO power (obviously he does) . Was pointing out the difference in the KOs.


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## G_Land (Aug 11, 2009)

MrObjective said:


> Why? I'm not saying Rashad has no one punch KO power (obviously he does) . Was pointing out the difference in the KOs.
> 
> The smart money's on Rashad, including mine.


So your saying that since Rampage KOd Silva ...and Rashad got knocked out but Machida ...the "smart money" is with Rashad ...Im not seeing the conection


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## MrObjective (May 22, 2010)

G_Land said:


> So your saying that since Rampage KOd Silva ...and Rashad got knocked out but Machida ...the "smart money" is with Rashad ...Im not seeing the conection


No connection, whatever $hitty post. I'll edit that my cash is on Rashad.


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## Ruckus (Oct 2, 2009)

Spoken812 said:


> So I don't want to hear any excuses about Rampage being out of shape.
> 
> Deal?


Deal. 



Zenhalo said:


> Ripped in no way equals MMA talent.


Irrelevant in this case. There has been enopugh response to the post in regards to a ripped Rampage.



Mckeever said:


> Please dont feed me the; mma isnt the sport for you man. Ive been watching mma for around 5 years now.
> 
> If you want to watch a good grappling mma fight then go and watch shogun rua vs eric wanderlei. Please do.
> 
> ...


Well thought and stated. Repped.

I can only hope that this fight backs up the year of frustratingly wading through all the hype. Smart fighters would stick to a game plan however will all of the animosity I could easily see all gameplan's thrown right out the window and good old fashioned brawl, however quick that would be. Three more days of hype. Woo Hoo !!!


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

Hiro said:


> It wasn't just wrestling though, it was BJJ mostly. Since when is the main aim of BJJ to cause cuts and bruises on someone's face? Yeh, punching happens at a much higher rate and causes obvious damage, but BJJ is just as legit, despite no damage being caused in between sub attempts. I don't like that logic where there has to be visible damage for it to have been a fight. It's an MMA fight, not a fight, so that's why I don't accept it.
> 
> It wasn't two sub attempts, what about all the times GSP took Hardy's back? He was continually trying to end the fight, but in a manner that didn't result in cuts and bruises. Why is a BJJ based gameplan unnaceptable but a striking gameplan is? One causes more damage, but both are part of martial arts, so why is GSP's approach so unnaceptable? He could have done more, but I see at as no different to a steady but one sides standup fight. Not as exciting to most, no cuts and bruises, but just as much a part of MMA.
> 
> GSP couldn't finish the fight, he made mistakes and could have punched Hardy in the face some more. But let's face it, you linking a good grappling fight just emphasises that the fight didn't involve 2 fighters who are able to grapple. Dan Hardy just rolled around being dominated, merely surviving and not actually doing anything to make it competitive. Throw someone who can grapple in there with GSP and you'll see a much better display... BJ and Fitch.


It was quite a poor display of BJJ, for both fighters. What about all the times GSP took Hardy's back? does this not prove my point even further? He simply controlled Hardy on the ground, smothered him. He wasnt putting in enough work to try and finish the fight. Its all well and good, transitioning and advancing your position, what matters is what you do with those positions. Why not punch Hardy in the side of the had when he head his back, knee him on the ribs from side control? This would of opened up much more opportunities for GSP to finish the fight. Taking some ones back doesnt mean very much if your not going to do any thing with it. He attempted two submissions out of all of those transitions, and hardly did any GNP. 

The kos/daley fight was even worse, an appalling mma fight. Some of you guys need to hop off your mma fanboyism waggon and recognise that there are faults with the rules and system in the UFC as it currently stands and it is seriously damaging the casual fanbase and at attracting new fans. I tell my mates to watch an event, they then see paul daley/kos as a co main event or gsp/hardy for a main, championship bout and they never want to watch it again. I can see their point. Now, either, fighters are going to have to adapt and evolve their skillset in order to develop their wrestling (harder for many european fighters, given that wrestling resources are so limited) or rules can be changed in order to make the fighters work more, instead of winning fights via points and octagon control.

Another flaw of the rules is the clinching. When a fighter has his opponent clinched up against the cage and some times even when busy with knees, elbows and what not, the referee will jump in and split them up. How ever, when on the ground, its perfectly acceptable to just control a fighter without working hard to finish the fight or advance position. kos vs daley for eg. For the majority of that fight, kos was slipping out of daleys half guard, but then daley would immediately slip back into half guard. Neither fighter landed any real damage during the process and were simply neutralising each others position. Should they not be split up? The UFC need to sort the rules and refereeing out.


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## A Random Person (Oct 15, 2009)

Rampage would want to stand, Rashad would want to go to the ground, I think that they would have a close first two rounds and then once Rashad starts getting tired and drops his fists, Rampage will throw a haymaker that would make Rashad off balenced, and Rampage will follow him to the ground for the GnP.

My prediction, Rampage by TKO (Strikes) late in the third round.


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## Nefilim777 (Jun 24, 2009)

Rampage is definitely in great shape, but I think Rashad's coming in with a serious game plan: wrestling. He knows not to stand with Rampage and I don't think he will. I say Rashad by UD


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

Mckeever said:


> It was quite a poor display of BJJ, for both fighters. What about all the times GSP took Hardy's back? does this not prove my point even further? He simply controlled Hardy on the ground, smothered him. He wasnt putting in enough work to try and finish the fight. Its all well and good, transitioning and advancing your position, what matters is what you do with those positions. Why not punch Hardy in the side of the had when he head his back, knee him on the ribs from side control? This would of opened up much more opportunities for GSP to finish the fight. Taking some ones back doesnt mean very much if your not going to do any thing with it. He attempted two submissions out of all of those transitions, and hardly did any GNP.


As far as I remember when GSP had Hardy's back he was continously looking for the choke. There was 2 near submissions, but like I said he was constantly looking for a sub. You saying he was just smothering him doesn't change what actually happened. He was grappling, trying to find a sub. So he didn't get 10 close subs, just like some strikers don't land any shots that rock their opponent. You see grappling as smothering and not fighting, I do. It's a big part of MMA and it is not just laying on a guy like you're trying to imply.

Why does there have to be GnP? He was trying to sumbit him, trying to win the fight using BJJ. Why does it have to involve punches to be acceptable to you? Your logic is off.



> The kos/daley fight was even worse, an appalling mma fight. Some of you guys need to hop off your mma fanboyism waggon and recognise that there are faults with the rules and system in the UFC as it currently stands and it is seriously damaging the casual fanbase and at attracting new fans. I tell my mates to watch an event, they then see paul daley/kos as a co main event or gsp/hardy for a main, championship bout and they never want to watch it again. I can see their point. Now, either, fighters are going to have to adapt and evolve their skillset in order to develop their wrestling (harder for many european fighters, given that wrestling resources are so limited) or rules can be changed in order to make the fighters work more, instead of winning fights via points and octagon control.


Here's some of my other posts that address this:



Hiro said:


> Kos vs Daley was nothing like GSP vs Hardy. Stats for both fights were posted on the previous page of this thread, GSP was active and it's still not acceptable to some. He didn't just lay on Hardy like Kos did on Daley. *It's the difference between the two that people need to acknowledge*. It winds me up when I hear fans, Dan Hardy and whoever, saying GSP is just a wrestler and doesn't fight, and talk about that sort of performance in the same light as real LnP like Kos vs Daley.





Hiro said:


> Ok, a grappling match... it doesn't matter. A kickboxing match is fine, but grappling isnt despite trying to snap body parts and choke the other unconcious?
> 
> There is actually no argument to back up the notion that BJJ that doesn't end in a sub isn't legit, apart from the lack of damage caused isn't as exciting. That's what it boils down to. It's a part of MMA, but people want the rules bent just because they don't like it as much as one dimensional standup fights.


To be honest, I don't care what your friends or the casual fans think. Kos vs Daley, yes that was LnP and not what MMA should be about. GSP vs Hardy was not the same. It wasn't the most exciting, but nor are some standup fights. Just because someone's getting punched or kicked doesn't make it somehow more accaptable as mixed martial arts. BJJ doesn't work like that, but because you and your friends don't like it you want more punching (check the stats btw)? Striking doesn't need more BJJ does it? So why does BJJ need more striking? 

I think your argument is completely flawed. The GSP fight is not a reason why the rules need to be changed, especially considering how many shots were landed and how active GSP was. If you had referred to Kos vs Daley I would have agreed. The GSP fight is miles away from that.


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## Danm2501 (Jun 22, 2009)

GSP did land ground strikes too. GSP landed 118 strikes on the ground in 5 rounds. Hardy's face might not have been messed up like Jon Fitch's after facing GSP, but GSP did land strikes on the ground. It wasn't a pure Wrestling or BJJ exhibition.


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

Hiro said:


> As far as I remember when GSP had Hardy's back he was continously looking for the choke. There was 2 near submissions, but like I said he was constantly looking for a sub. You saying he was just smothering him doesn't change what actually happened. He was grappling, trying to find a sub. So he didn't get 10 close subs, just like some strikers don't land any shots that rock their opponent. You see grappling as smothering and not fighting, I do. It's a big part of MMA and it is not just laying on a guy like you're trying to imply.
> 
> Why does there have to be GnP? He was trying to sumbit him, trying to win the fight using BJJ. Why does it have to involve punches to be acceptable to you? Your logic is off.
> 
> ...


I may need to watch the fight again, but i dont remember seeing GSP coming any where near close to sinking in a choke. I dont think he was working hard enough to find a sub, thats how i seen the fight. The only diffrence between the GSP/Hardy and Kos/Daley fight is that GSP was transitioning time and time again on Hardy, where as Kos only managed a few transitions. They were not miles apart. kos tried for a RNC twice (or maybe have only been once) i believe, which equeals GSP sub attempts. 

Like i said, the way i percieved the fight was to be GSP simply controlling and smothering Dan Hardy. I dont think he was working hard enough to get a sub. You can say he was trying for a choke when he got Hardy's back, but he wasnt any where near close to sinkine one in. I counted two proper submission attempts from GSP. The rest of the fight was simply take down, transition, transition, rinse and repeat. Pure control. GSP himself said it was a lack luster performance. 

Why does there have to be GNP? shots on the ground can lead to submission oppurtunities. They can be used to put the other fighter off and expose him to a sub.

Where did i ever say i dont like BJJ? I like watching high level BJJ as much as i like to see high level striking. Watching two bums who can barley throw combiations in a striking battle is equally as boring as two guys on the ground boring me with their lackluster JJ. 

You saying you dont care what casuals have to think about the fights is being ignorant to MMA. Fights like GSP and kos ones are hindering the growth of the sport, do you not want to see mma grow and become more popular?


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

So now the sub attempt has to be arms around throat for it to bee deemed that GSP was being active and trying to get subs? Of course he was trying for subs, the whole fight. I don't know why you'd bother he wasn't trying hard enough, he abandoned brutal GnP as seen against BJ to try and submit the guy. It didn't work out, but he didn't just lay on him. Yes he transitioned loads which isn't what Kos was doing, and those transitions were to get into positions to set up subs. Hardy could only survive therefore it wasn't very eventful, but the rules definitely should not be changed because of it.



Danm2501 said:


> *GSP landed 118 Ground strikes according to Compustrike, with 168 attempted. Then according to Fightmetric he landed 90 strikes to the head on the ground. GSP took Dan's back 5 times, moved to the mount twice and attempted 6 submissions.* GSP was *far* more active in the Hardy fight than Josh Koscheck was in his fight against Paul Daley for example. *Koscheck only landed 42 punches to the head on the ground; achieved the mount once, had Daley's back twice and only attempted 1 submission (none according to Compustrike)*. That's the definition of laying on an opponent, using GSP as an example simply isn't fair AFAIC. I enjoyed the GSP-Hardy fight a lot. The Koscheck-Daley fight wasn't entertaining until after the bell =p.


Acknowledge the difference.



> Why does there have to be GNP? shots on the ground can lead to submission oppurtunities. They can be used to put the other fighter off and expose him to a sub.


So can grappling, so there should be no problem, surely? This reason is not sufficient to back the argument that GSP should have punched Hardy more.



> You saying you dont care what casuals have to think about the fights is being ignorant to MMA. Fights like GSP and kos ones are hindering the growth of the sport, do you not want to see mma grow and become more popular?


No it's the other way around. Casual fans are ignorant and don't understand the sport. Based on what this quote says, you're implying the sport needs to change in order to appease casual fans who don't understand how grappling and BJJ is marital arts, and want to see damage being caused the whole fight.

If my view and understanding of MMA limits it's growth then good, I don't want it changing based on flawed logic and the desire to see cuts and bruises rather than grappling. In that sense, I'm doing my bit for true MMA, and I don't care if casual fans who are ignorant don't want to watch the sport.


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

Hiro said:


> So now the sub attempt has to be arms around throat for it to bee deemed that GSP was being active and trying to get subs? Of course he was trying for subs, the whole fight. I don't know why you'd bother he wasn't trying hard enough, he abandoned brutal GnP as seen against BJ to try and submit the guy. It didn't work out, but he didn't just lay on him. Yes he transitioned loads which isn't what Kos was doing, and those transitions were to get into positions to set up subs. Hardy could only survive therefore it wasn't very eventful, but the rules definitely should not be changed because of it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Well, im sorry im no BJJ expert, i have never practised the martial art, but i feel i have a basic understanding of it. I did not at all see GSP attempt 6 submissions in that fight. How else are you supposed to identify if GSP is attempting a choke if he isnt trying to wrap his arms around some ones neck? Am i missing some thing here? I didnt see him do this once. 

He transitioned into dangerous positions but i didnt see him working to set up submissions, i just seen him pinning hardy to the ground, bar the two sub attempts.

Like i said i understand and can appreciate a good BJJ display, but GSP vs Dan Hardy was a poor display. Its got nothing to do with myself not being able to understand grappling. GSP being the much superior fighter should of subbed hardy or found another way to finish him within 5 rounds, its as simple as that. Instead, i witnessed a snoozefest of lack luster BJJ and wrestling, not some thing i want to watch as a main event championship fight including one of the best pound for pound fighters in the world.


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

So what it boils down to is you found it boring. That's cool, so did many others. But that's not reason for rules to be changed. It's like you watching a standup fight, thinking it's boring and then saying the rules need to be changed.

Rewatch the fight, I'm sure you'll see GSP taking Hardy's back a number of times and even rolling onto his own back to try and set up a choke.

It wasn't a poor display. Two of the Gracies posted a video about how much they enjoyed the BJJ in the fight.


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

Hiro said:


> So what it boils down to is you found it boring. That's cool, so did many others. But that's not reason for rules to be changed. It's like you watching a standup fight, thinking it's boring and then saying the rules need to be changed.
> 
> Rewatch the fight, I'm sure you'll see GSP taking Hardy's back a number of times and even rolling onto his own back to try and set up a choke.
> 
> ...



When i mentioned the rules being changed, although not mentioned, i dont just mean for grappling situations, i mean stand up as well. If i saw two fighters on the feet in a stalemate, i wanted to see some thing done about it. Yellow cards, what ever, some thing to encourage the fighters to press the action and engage. I find a boring stand up war just as boring as a poor ground battle,its just that as of late, there seems to be much more stalemates on the ground than there are on the feet.

I will have to watch the fight again soon though, i cant remember these 4 other sub attempts that were recorded. 

The reason i say it was a poor display of BJJ was because Dan Hardy isnt known for his great submission defense or Ju Jitsu at all, where as GSP is supposed to be one of the most well rounded fighters in the sport today. Him not being able to submit Hardy (after that being his gameplan) is quite poor. No one expected hardy to last even 2 rounds.

This isnt some thing i have against grappling. If the majority of mma fights were boring stand up, kick-boxing wars, i would be arguing the exact same case.


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

I've said all that needs to be said. I seriously think your argument holds no weight whatsoever, so we'll have to agree to disagree on this one :thumbsup:


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

Hiro said:


> I've said all that needs to be said. I seriously think your argument holds no weight whatsoever, so we'll have to agree to disagree on this one :thumbsup:


Fair enough. I appreciate your viewpoint and understand where you are coming from, but i have to disagree. Good debating though.


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## MILFHunter947 (Jan 30, 2010)

Mckeever said:


> Fair enough. I appreciate your viewpoint and understand where you are coming from, but i have to disagree. Good debating though.


lol u say 'good debating' like u guys were playing something hahahaha wtf


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

MILFHunter947 said:


> lol u say 'good debating' like u guys were playing something hahahaha wtf


All fun and games at the end of the day son.


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## SpoKen (Apr 28, 2007)

MILFHunter947 said:


> lol u say 'good debating' like u guys were playing something hahahaha wtf


That's what seperates this forum from others. Debates can get heated everywhere, but it doesn't mean you can't be friendly about it.

Internet wars are kinda pointless so we try to avoid that here. Btw, that was a good debate  reps for you two!


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## Woodenhead (Jan 5, 2010)

I only skimmed thru some of this thread (gotta run off to work) but I'll just throw this out there: I'm curious to see how Rampage's cardio will be for this fight. He may "look" in great shape, but cardio is a different beast.


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## Mx2 (May 4, 2010)

MILFHunter947 said:


> lol u say 'good debating' like u guys were playing something hahahaha wtf


Children argue, adults debate. Which is why I'm so glad to have found a forum like this filled with adults. Hard to find such a thing on the internet.


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