# ***OFFICIAL*** Tim Boetsch vs. Hector Lombard Thread



## Budhisten (Apr 11, 2010)

*Middleweight bout: 185 pounds*


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## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

Hoping Lombard to take a violent KO just so the build-up to a Silva fight would be cooler.


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## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

Hope Boestch wins but think Lombard will.

My head will explode if we see another Barbarian bitch toss or more Barbarian uppercuts.


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## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

Albino Gorilla via gorilla press slam.


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## Sports_Nerd (Apr 23, 2012)

If Tim Boetsch slaps Lombard (Could happen, though I favor Lombard) It's really gonna make Bellator look bad.


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## hellholming (Jun 13, 2009)

TheLyotoLegion said:


> Hope Boestch wins but think Lombard will.
> 
> My head will explode if we see another Barbarian bitch toss or more Barbarian uppercuts.


agreed.

Those uppercuts against Okami were great.


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## GriffinFanKY (Oct 22, 2007)

Would love to see Boestch take it but if I have to pick it would be Lombard but the one thing I do know is that this fight will end violently.


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## Big_Charm (Jan 7, 2011)

My head says Hector all day long but my gut tells me Boetsch could come in and make a hail marry come back via gorilla strength.

One thing for sure, this fight is going to be very nasty and end in brutal fashion!


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## GrappleRetarded (Jun 22, 2012)

Lombard via absolute destruction.


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## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

Lombard makes a statement and finishes this fight, rightfully earning himself a shot at Anderson Silva.


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## rul3z (Jun 27, 2010)

I hope Tim wins


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## dlxrevolution (Jul 16, 2009)

One of the reasons why Tim Boetsch is so successful in the Middle Weight division is because he's much stronger than everybody he fights. He won't have that advantage is Hector. The dude is a hulk.


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## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

I love Boetsch at MW. But he will never be a top guy. He can win many vs. solid fighters of the division. Everyone gets to giddy over his comeback win. But he was getting worked before that. Bad.

I think Lombard wins, but a win over Boetsch won't really change my opinion that he is overrated. 

The UFC loves this matchup and know it is a good matchup for Lombard.


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## Dtwizzy2k5 (Jul 7, 2008)

I'm rooting for Lombard, I want to see a unification match between him and Silva. Boetsch isn't that good of a fighter, and people should remember that he was clearly getting beat by Okami before his comeback KO. Lombard will take this easily I think.


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## rebonecrusher (Nov 21, 2011)

I expect Lombard to put a beating on Boetsch but Boetsch to hang tough. I think Lombard will get him out of there likely in the second round if not he'll just get a dominate decision. 

I think Lombard is a top ten middleweight but by no means has he proved to me even if this fight goes as I expect that hes a top five middleweight more deserving of a shot at Anderson Silva, then other contenders in the division. Though I don't mind the fight being put together because it will be entertaining and I don't think Weidman should be rushed into a shot at Silva though I consider him to be easily in the top five in the division.

The middleweight division is looking real good lots of contenders floating around at the moment.


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

I'll pick Boetsch because he know how to go a HARD three rounds and survive some really bad situations. I think after the initial Lombard blitz it will be Boetsch all night.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Lombard is going to BRUTALLY stop Tim in his tracks. TKO or KO.


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## Sterl (Jul 26, 2009)

I see Lombard winning this one brutally, the hype getting massive,then see him losing to the first contender he faces or gets brutally KOd by Anderson if they do indeed fight sooner rather then later.Just my take.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Let's see that gold medal go to work Shango!!


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## Stapler (Nov 18, 2006)

jonnyg4508 said:


> I love Boetsch at MW. But he will never be a top guy. He can win many vs. solid fighters of the division. Everyone gets to giddy over his comeback win. But he was getting worked before that. Bad.
> 
> I think Lombard wins, but a win over Boetsch won't really change my opinion that he is overrated.
> 
> The UFC loves this matchup and know it is a good matchup for Lombard.


I agree with this post. I don't understand why a lot of people are saying "Lombard's fight against Boetsch will tell us everything we need to know." How so? People are putting in a lot of stock on Boetsch's win over Okami. He got the finish which was nice, but like you said, he was getting worked before that. It wasn't that impressive of a win. I wouldn't be surprised if he was kicked out of the top 10 soon. He's still a solid fighter, but I won't consider him a huge win for Lombard if he loses. He will only be a nice win exposure wise.

That being said, I'm picking Lombard to win this one. He should be able to out grapple Boetsch convincingly like most competent grapplers can. He should also be good enough standing to not be caught by anything mid fight, we will see though.


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## Rusty (Apr 13, 2010)

Just a quick look at the list of garbage that Lombard has been facing tells me all I need to know about this fight. TBH he could very well beat the Barbarian but if he wins easily it'll be a big surprise. 

Sure, Tim was losing against Okami but he still knocked him the **** out and that's much more impressive than anything Hector has done in his career.

Trevor Prangley, Jesse Taylor, Joe Doerksen, and Jay Silva are his highlight wins ffs

Boetsch has at least beat some decent fighters at 185.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

RustyRenegade said:


> Just a quick look at the list of garbage that Lombard has been facing tells me all I need to know about this fight. TBH he could very well beat the Barbarian but if he wins easily it'll be a big surprise.
> 
> Sure, Tim was losing against Okami but he still knocked him the **** out and that's much more impressive than anything Hector has done in his career.
> 
> ...


His wins over James Tehuna, Brian Ebersole and Alexander Schmlenko are more impressive than the ones u named.. 

Nobody is calling him Top 5 but IMO with his win streak and incredible propensity to knock his opponents out cold he is definatly a legitimate and exciting prospect.


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## Rusty (Apr 13, 2010)

The Te Huna and Ebersole wins were many moons ago and Shlemko or however it's spelled was two years ago. Lombard could have a worse resume I guess but I don't rank him as high as some apparently.

He's also 34, not exactly an up and coming prospect. My money will be on Boetsch


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## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

I think they are equivalent overall as fighters. If Lombard can't put him away early he is basically screwed because Boetsch has a lot better cardio than he does.


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## SpoKen (Apr 28, 2007)

If Lombard gets wrecked I'm going to laugh so hard. But if he wrecks... I'll look like


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## Drogo (Nov 19, 2006)

RustyRenegade said:


> Just a quick look at the list of garbage that Lombard has been facing tells me all I need to know about this fight. TBH he could very well beat the Barbarian but if he wins easily it'll be a big surprise.
> 
> Sure, Tim was losing against Okami but he still knocked him the **** out and that's much more impressive than anything Hector has done in his career.
> 
> Boetsch has at least beat some decent fighters at 185.


Kendall Grove? Nick Ring? A bunch of other guys you've never heard of. That is Boetsch's resume. Lombard hasn't beaten anyone really impressive but Okami is Boetsch's only win that means anything and he was getting schooled for the first two rounds of that fight. I think Okami beats him 9 times out of 10. 

This fight is a pick em for me. Even if you think Lombard is over rated I don't see how beating Tim could really surprise anyone.


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## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

I just can't believe that Lombard is so unproven for many people, and that if he loses this fight he'll be irrelevant for those people.

UFC is undoubtedly the premier MMA organization, it has the biggest shows and the deepest roster. But you do not make a 25 fight win streak if you're not a special fighter, and it's not like Lombard has been in one place, he's fought in many shows.

Fights outside the UFC DO matter, and Lombards record is fantastic. Watch his fights, don't judge him just on one UFC fight.


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## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

_RIVAL_ said:


> His wins over James Tehuna, Brian Ebersole and Alexander Schmlenko are more impressive than the ones u named..
> 
> Nobody is calling him Top 5 but IMO with his win streak and incredible propensity to knock his opponents out cold he is definatly a legitimate and exciting prospect.


You mean a win over Te Huna before Te Huna really found his game? Not the Te Huna that is fighting in the UFC right now?

You mean a win that took him 4 rounds over Ebersole. A man with minimal skills. A man who said he was going to 155lbs?

You mean a win over Shlemenko. That went to a 5 round decision.

Point is he hasn't DESTROYED anyone that was even decent. When he has fought even decent competition he has went 3 or 4 rounds or went to decisions. 

He was getting fights with guys who were coming off losses. Went he fought a guy like Mousasi....he lost.

His best win ever is Shlemenko and it went all 5 rounds.


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## GrappleRetarded (Jun 22, 2012)

jonnyg4508 said:


> You mean a win over Te Huna before Te Huna really found his game? Not the Te Huna that is fighting in the UFC right now?
> 
> You mean a win that took him 4 rounds over Ebersole. A man with minimal skills. A man who said he was going to 155lbs?
> 
> ...


Brian Ebersole does not have "minimal skills". He's quite clearly proved himself to be a solid UFC fighter, clocking up a four fight winning streak in the organisation and dominating B level talent like Chris Lytle.

Lombard dominated Ebersole for four rounds.

Schlemenko is a savage and one of the toughest guys to finish in the sport and Lombard had his way with him for 5 rounds.


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## RearNaked (Jul 20, 2012)

I expect Lombard to win this by decision. 

But I'd freaking love for Boetch to beast him in the second or third round.

Lombard is a very good fighter, but his attitude leaves a lot to be desired imo.


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## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

GrappleRetarded said:


> Brian Ebersole does not have "minimal skills". He's quite clearly proved himself to be a solid UFC fighter, clocking up a four fight winning streak in the organisation and dominating B level talent like Chris Lytle.
> 
> Lombard dominated Ebersole for four rounds.
> 
> Schlemenko is a savage and one of the toughest guys to finish in the sport and Lombard had his way with him for 5 rounds.


Oh he doesn't? Than what area does he really excel at? Cartwheel kicks? Sub defense? Listen....I love Ebersole, but he gets by on heart and toughness and experience. He is a 170lber who said he was going to 155. And you are saying that is a real good win for a "beast" middle weight?

Who cares if Ebersole is winning. He hasn't beat anyone worth a damn in the UFC yet. And he is serious about going to 155lbs. Wow amazing, Lombard beat a decent UFC Light Weight.

I conceded that Shlemenko was a good win and his best win. But if Lomabard is just a devistating guy why doesn't he run through better fighters? He runs through cans and has long fights with anyone decent he faces.

Ebersole will never be top 10 at any weight class. Shlemenko won't either. And they are both smaller than Lombard.

Lombard's best wins were vs. guys not even in his weight class...


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## RearNaked (Jul 20, 2012)

jonnyg4508 said:


> Than what area does he really excel at... Sub defense?


That and ground and pound.


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## GrappleRetarded (Jun 22, 2012)

jonnyg4508 said:


> Oh he doesn't? Than what area does he really excel at? Cartwheel kicks? Sub defense? Listen....I love Ebersole, but he gets by on heart and toughness and experience. He is a 170lber who said he was going to 155. And you are saying that is a real good win for a "beast" middle weight?
> 
> Who cares if Ebersole is winning. He hasn't beat anyone worth a damn in the UFC yet. And he is serious about going to 155lbs. Wow amazing, Lombard beat a decent UFC Light Weight.
> 
> ...


He excels on the ground with his ground and pound and savvy submission defense.

He beat Chris lytle back when he was riding a 4 fight win streak and climbing the WW ladder,people were hyping him up to having a shot at the title. He dominated Lytle. That's a solid win against a solid UFC competitor.

What does it matter if the fights are long? He dominated both Ebersole and Schlemenko for the entire period. If they were close, competitive fights, I could reason with you, but they weren't.


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

What happens if Lombard does win, but by like a very boring decision? Do people still want him to fight for the title or should he have to have another fight?


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## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

GrappleRetarded said:


> He excels on the ground with his ground and pound and savvy submission defense.
> 
> He beat Chris lytle back when he was riding a 4 fight win streak and climbing the WW ladder,people were hyping him up to having a shot at the title. He dominated Lytle. That's a solid win against a solid UFC competitor.
> 
> What does it matter if the fights are long? He dominated both Ebersole and Schlemenko for the entire period. If they were close, competitive fights, I could reason with you, but they weren't.


We are comparing Chris Lytle....a non-top 10 WW to UFC Middleweights?

And what in the world is your definition of DOMINATE???

Ebersole has fought a bunch of tight fights with non-contenders in the UFC. 

Because if he is going to beat top 5 UFC MIDDLEWEIGHT fighters he should of at least stopped non-top 10 WELTERWEIGHTS? Wouldn't you think if Lombard was so beastly at middleweight that he would be able to stop natural welterweights a little sooner?

Fact is Lombard has ZERO top 10 wins. And has countless cans on his record. There is disputing that. He beat a couple UFC caliber fighters. Many welterweights that aren't even in his division. And none that will ever be top 10 at any weight in the UFC.


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## RearNaked (Jul 20, 2012)

jonnyg4508 said:


> none that will ever be top 10 at any weight in the UFC.


Just being IN the UFC makes you a top fighter.

Watch some minor league MMA. I saw Sean Salmon absolutely dominate a guy at a smaller show in Calgary. 

It's like saying a basketball player sucks because LeBron James dunked on him in the NBA...


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## TanyaJade (Aug 31, 2010)

I don't think Lombard will have any problems with Tim Boetsch.

I do think he'll have problems with other fighters down the road who will use his size and T-Rex arms against him. I can see someone like Belcher or Weidman, or even Michael Bisping staying on the outside and picking him apart with shots.


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## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

RearNaked said:


> Just being IN the UFC makes you a top fighter.
> 
> Watch some minor league MMA. I saw Sean Salmon absolutely dominate a guy at a smaller show in Calgary.
> 
> It's like saying a basketball player sucks because LeBron James dunked on him in the NBA...


Yea. And Lombard has fought how many guys who ha ve made it to the UFC? A few out of his 1000 fight win streak? Not even relevant UFC fighters...

Pretty much all decent pros have fought guys who have been in the UFC before.

Bellator isn't a local circuit. So not sure what you are comparing.


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## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

Ari said:


> I don't think Lombard will have any problems with Tim Boetsch.
> 
> I do think he'll have problems with other fighters down the road who will use his size and T-Rex arms against him. I can see someone like Belcher or Weidman, or even Michael Bisping staying on the outside and picking him apart with shots.


Personally, I think Bisping is tailor made for Lombard, Lombard doesn't stop going forward and throws with nothing but bad intentions, and Bisping always seems to get cracked at least once in his fights.


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

If Lombard doesn't blow his load he should take it. They're both strong, but Lombard has fast twitch muscles which makes him extremely explosive in all situations. He's simply quicker, stronger, and more agile especially when it comes to scrambles. I think this is going to be one of those fights where it's done in the first minute or it's somehow going to be a grueling three round decision where both sides take a round a piece. 

Lombard is most likely going for a impressive win (quick stoppage), but Boetsch's camp is going to drain him so they'll try to drag em out for three rounds. Boetsch won't be able to take him down not in the first, he's gonna have to clinch if he can. So yah the more I look at it the more I see it ending early in favor of the newcomer.


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## TanyaJade (Aug 31, 2010)

TheLyotoLegion said:


> Personally, I think Bisping is tailor made for Lombard, Lombard doesn't stop going forward and throws with nothing but bad intentions, and Bisping always seems to get cracked at least once in his fights.


That's a good point actually, but I still think that Bisping's significant reach advantage will keep Lombard from landing anything significant. Admittedly, I've only seen a handful of Lombard's fights (vs. The Storm, Prangley, Silva, and a few others), so you could be correct. I hope to see Lombard vs. Bisping soon later sometime, a very interesting matchup.


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## rallyman (Mar 15, 2010)

chris lytle might dissagree about Ebersole

for me really looking forward to this fight.

ive seen lombard 3 times live in aus and he has been a beast. i agree the competition hasnt been to the highest standard but that will change tomorrow and everything will be answered. 

personally i hope he does prove the doubters wrong and wins both quickly and easily so we have a few more guys in the mw division that may challenge silva in the future.

on paper i think he he has the game to beat silva. he has very good judo which he uses for GnP and his take down defence is very good, he also hits like a train.

so either way looking forward to a good fight filled with fireworks!


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## RearNaked (Jul 20, 2012)

lol I just realized this is a pay-per-view. I assumed it was on TV. 

Tim Boetsch and Hector Lombard for $50? 

Yeah... no. 

I like Boetsch and Ebersole a lot. But not that much.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

It's almost time for Tims corner man to get that rope around Tims neck and walk that sacraficial sheep out to the slaughter..


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## Sports_Nerd (Apr 23, 2012)

RearNaked said:


> lol I just realized this is a pay-per-view. I assumed it was on TV.
> 
> Tim Boetsch and Hector Lombard for $50?
> 
> ...


Remember it's a card that was pretty much gutted by injuries.


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## RearNaked (Jul 20, 2012)

Sports_Nerd said:


> Remember it's a card that was pretty much gutted by injuries.


Then it should have been put on free TV.


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## limba (Jul 21, 2009)

Lombard can end this brutally. I do believe some of his hype...wich isn't really hype = the fact that he hits hard as a truck.

ANd i also think Boetsch is the kind of guy who could take more punishement thatn the average fighter. Proof is the Okami fight.

i Could see this going 2 ways: Lombard tags Boetsch and ends it fast.

Or, he doesn't manage to put Boetsch away and gasses himself out and Boetsch comes back like a zombie and takes him out in the third...or at least dominates the 3rd rd.


Going with Lombard by KO though.


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## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

RearNaked said:


> Then it should have been put on free TV.


It has a title fight and a fight that could be a number one contender fight that isn't what you get on a free card.


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## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

RearNaked said:


> Then it should have been put on free TV.


I'm sure things don't work like this. They already had booked a venue and arranged everything. How were they supposed to know about this injuy plague.


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## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

RearNaked said:


> Then it should have been put on free TV.


Yeah, that's not how it works, they've signed deals with the satellite and cable providers. They can't help it Kongo and Boestch are all that are left from the original card.

That said, Faber/Barao and Lombard/Boestch are gonna be insane.


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## Stapler (Nov 18, 2006)

osmium said:


> It has a title fight and a fight that could be a number one contender fight that isn't what you get on a free card.


You make a solid point, but to be fair, An expensive PPV card shouldn't have Chris Clements vs. Matt Riddle on the main card. No disrespect intended, but that fight looks like it could be a prelim on a UFC on Fuel tv or Fox card.


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

limba said:


> Lombard can end this brutally. I do believe some of his hype...wich isn't really hype = the fact that he hits hard as a truck.
> 
> ANd i also think Boetsch is the kind of guy who could take more punishement thatn the average fighter. Proof is the Okami fight.
> 
> ...


Sounds about right. I think Lombard takes care of the job to cement his hype because this is the fight I want vs Anderson Silva. Lombard talked a lot...now it's time for him to DO OR DIE.


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## kalretrous (Jul 22, 2012)

lombard against a young vitor belfort... sounds interesting


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## Rygu (Jul 21, 2008)

This is a tough fight to call. As good as Lombard has looked, it had been primarily against weaker competition than someone like Boetsch. Lombard's power and ability to keep a fight on the feet, even against a big strong MW should be to his advantage. 

I think Tim goes out in round 2.


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## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

Yea, a man who has massive trouble with James Head is a real tough opponent and a quality win....


not in this world...

He is a decent, awkward fighter who is almost a 155er compared to Lombard as a middle weight...


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## ACTAFOOL (Dec 10, 2008)

im hopping on the hype train and going with black vitor!


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

Finally, legit hype or can crusher? Lets find out!


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## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

Awww shit.


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## Soakked (Feb 5, 2007)

His Australian/Cuban accent is pretty cool. This is the fight I am most excited to watch.

What's up with Tim's music? I never liked rap/metal hybrids


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## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

Now muting the show and playing Apathy - Albino Gorillas.


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## Soakked (Feb 5, 2007)

Just bad music all around on both parts


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## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

Lombard wins the walk out music battle.


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## dudeabides (Sep 30, 2008)

Here we go the fight of the night is on!


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## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

+1000000000 to Hector Lombard for Roy Jones - Cant Be Touched


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## ACTAFOOL (Dec 10, 2008)

i like devil without a cause, they have metallicas sad but true:thumb02:


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## AJClark (Sep 19, 2010)

Sad But True is awesome! That was Kid Rock wasn't it? Yeah... that's not awesome.


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## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

You will not win cuz I will not lose! 

Behold the incredible rapping ability of Roy Jones.


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## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

Roflcopter said:


> +1000000000 to Hector Lombard for Roy Jones - Cant Be Touched


-100000000000000 for looking like an idiot wearing a bandana wrong.


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

Lombard seems shorter for some reason. He is thick, but like in bellator it just didn't seem like everyone was taller than him.


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## ACTAFOOL (Dec 10, 2008)

AJClark said:


> Sad But True is awesome! That was Kid Rock wasn't it? Yeah... that's not awesome.


yeah kid rock used sad but trues riff


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## TheGreg (Apr 29, 2007)

keep getting distracted at the fight preps by sam stout. Looks like he's havin a blast!


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## ACTAFOOL (Dec 10, 2008)

IM PUMPED, go black vitooor


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

Lombard looks comfortable, like he has nothing to worry about.


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## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

10-9 Boestch.


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## ACTAFOOL (Dec 10, 2008)

lombard is afraid of gassing, didnt expect this...he has great hips though, i would love to see that chael fight


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

well, that was anticlimactic


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## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

10-9 Lombard.

Not sure why they were making Lombard to be some kind of psycho rush artist.


He always fights like this.


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## rallyman (Mar 15, 2010)

pretty average first round.


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## Rygu (Jul 21, 2008)

Tim looks more than 2 inches taller than Lombard to me.


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## OHKO (Jul 11, 2010)

Lombard is probably gonna gas and Boetsch would steal a victory by being the more active fighter.


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## Mr. Sparkle (Nov 3, 2009)

I keep hearing the fighters being described as, "tremendous athletes" tonight. Not a good sign


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## luckbox (Feb 12, 2010)

This is like a sparring session. Both guys half assing it.


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## ACTAFOOL (Dec 10, 2008)

you can forget that title shot, buddy lol


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

So far the only thing really landing are Boetsch's leg kicks.


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

Lombard might lose this if he continues this strategy. He's landing the harder shots but Boestch is out landing him with those kicks. Never know how the judges view these type of fights.


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

well, the UFC definitely isn't winning any fans over tonight. I am falling asleep here


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## Rygu (Jul 21, 2008)

Anderson need not be scared.


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

And now we know why Bellator is a joke. This is their best fighter, a guy no one came close to beating.

Boestch is matrixing Hector's punches, Anderson wouldn't even need to move


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

Boetsch 2-0 so far. It's not an impressive win so far, but so far nothing in this fight is.


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## ACTAFOOL (Dec 10, 2008)

i think its rd 1 was tim and rd 2 was lombard just because he had a pretty sig. strike there with that kick


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## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

20-18 Lombard.


Vitale fight part 2 basically.


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## rallyman (Mar 15, 2010)

well i hope the 3rd is better

1 round each in my books


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## luckbox (Feb 12, 2010)

Piece of shit card.


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

1-1 I think


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

rygu said:


> Anderson need not be scared.


This is what I am thinking.


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## BigPont (Nov 19, 2007)

So this guy is supposed to be a contender to Anderson? Pfft.


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## OHKO (Jul 11, 2010)

Worst card I have seen in a while. Faber vs Barao better be darn good.

I admit this is the first time I have seen Lombard fight. But if Lombard fights this way against Silva, he is gonna get knocked the f out within 3 minutes.


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

Lombard is loading up and just throwing that overhand right. I don't get it? Does he think he is winning?

Sorry, left, not right.


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## ACTAFOOL (Dec 10, 2008)

i wonder what dana is thinking...


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## MikeHawk (Sep 11, 2009)

There goes any chance of Lombard getting a title shot soon.


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## luckbox (Feb 12, 2010)

Has there been any combinations thrown yet?


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

ACTAFOOL said:


> i wonder what dana is thinking...


Thank god I put him against Boestch first instead of giving him a title shot right away.


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## RHYNO2K (Feb 4, 2007)

I feel so bad for the people that actually paid the full PPV price for this.


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

Gotta say, I'm disappointed my Lombard in his UFC debut.


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## luckbox (Feb 12, 2010)

This is pretty dire.


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## BWoods (Apr 8, 2007)

Looks like Boetsch is on his way to a decision victory. Lombard did nothing in this fight.


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## MikeHawk (Sep 11, 2009)

cdtcpl said:


> Thank god I put him against Boestch first instead of giving him a title shot right away.


A fight with Silva would've been better. Lombard would've stood in front of him and got KO'd in minutes.


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## Mr. Sparkle (Nov 3, 2009)

Can we hear to boos, Joe? It's all we can hear for the past two fights.


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

so...... yeah. BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

Mr. Sparkle said:


> Can we hear to boos, Joe? It's all we can hear for the past two fights.


:laugh: The fights on FX were better than the ones you have to pay for!


----------



## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

30-27 Lombard.

Anderson Silva is shaking in his boots.


----------



## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

Winner: Chris Weidman.


----------



## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

That was horriawful. feed that can crushing clown to paul harris so he can get his knee torn out and be gone


----------



## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

What an electrifying fight! Another can crusher exposed.


----------



## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

I think its 2-1 Lombard, although I'm not happy with either performance. There is no winner here.


----------



## rallyman (Mar 15, 2010)

wow that was a crap fight
as a lombard fan im really disapointed inthat performance.
almost like he never got out of bed


----------



## Sterl (Jul 26, 2009)

Definitely the next MW champ. Watch out Anderson.


----------



## AJClark (Sep 19, 2010)

Looks like Bisping v Stann will be a No.1 contenders match then :thumbsup:

I got so excited for that, too.


----------



## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

BWoods said:


> Looks like Boetsch is on his way to a decision victory. Lombard did nothing in this fight.


Boetsch did even less.


----------



## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

So this is how Hector does against non cans?


----------



## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

Hmm...UFC jitters...


----------



## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

Neither man deserves the win.


----------



## ACTAFOOL (Dec 10, 2008)

yeah...i have no idea who won...i thought it was 1-1...i guess tim took the 3rd also since lombard didnt do shit in the 3rd except that TD

im going 2-1 tim....that was a sad fight...i feel stupid, at least lombard proved that he can stand for 3 rds and barley do anything and not get tired...if that proves anything:confused03:


----------



## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

TheLyotoLegion said:


> Winner: Chris Weidman.


Probably the most true statement about this fight.


----------



## El Bresko (Mar 12, 2010)

Soakked said:


> I never liked rap/metal hybrids


Rage Against the Machine are awesome!

I think Lombard won 30-27

I wonder if he was tentative so Dana would let him fight Munoz first?

It's a stretch but it's possible!



EDIT:

WHAT THE FUUUUUUUK. THAT IS A ROBBERY. I HOPE THE JUDGES ARE FANS OF RENAN BARAO OR HE CAN FINISH IT.. JESUS


----------



## Soakked (Feb 5, 2007)

I give the fight to Tim, but am disappointed because he used point attack no real damage intended after talking about knocking him out. Hector didn't do any better, just didn't have the necessity he needed.




MRBRESK said:


> Rage Against the Machine are awesome!


Yeah they have a few good songs and I like their radicalism, but for the most part that genre died a long time ago and good riddence.


----------



## Rygu (Jul 21, 2008)

29-28 Boetsch but wouldn't be surprised if it went the other way. 

Either way, not good in any aspect.


----------



## AJClark (Sep 19, 2010)

Bye bye win streak.


----------



## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

Well then....


----------



## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

So is the hype done? Can we refer to Lombard as a can crusher?


----------



## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

MRBRESK said:


> Rage Against the Machine are awesome!
> 
> I think Lombard won 30-27
> 
> ...


Yeah.

He pretty much got robbed.


----------



## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

How come there is no post fight interview?


----------



## Purgetheweak (Apr 23, 2012)

Caaaaaaannnnn crusher. Glad I put my imaginary internet moneys on Tim.

Sent from my HTC-X710a using VerticalSports.Com App


----------



## PheelGoodInc (Jul 23, 2009)

No robbery there. Neither of them should have expected to win after that performance. Terrible.


----------



## Rygu (Jul 21, 2008)

cdtcpl said:


> So is the hype done? Can we refer to Lombard as a can crusher?


Not sure I would go that far yet, not until after his second fight. 

Give him Palhares or Munoz or something.


----------



## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

marcthegame said:


> How come there is no post fight interview?


Cause neither fighter deserved one.


----------



## ACTAFOOL (Dec 10, 2008)

wow i guess dana can give us some tips on how to throw away your money? that was terrible...wth was lombard thinking?


----------



## usernamewoman (Sep 24, 2007)

horrible decision for a horrible fight to go with a night of horrible fights


----------



## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

Roflcopter said:


> Boetsch did even less.


Landing strikes > punching air and standing around.


----------



## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

It's hard to say he's a can crusher when he didn't actually do anything. 

I still think he destroys Boetsch... you know, assuming he actually comes to ******* fight.


----------



## TheGreg (Apr 29, 2007)

this card started off so well....


----------



## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

Hope the main event is pure fire works...


----------



## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

You cant win sitting back the entire fight.
Tim Boetsch didnt win, Lombard LOST.


----------



## El Bresko (Mar 12, 2010)

PheelGoodInc said:


> No robbery there. Neither of them should have expected to win after that performance. Terrible.


Regardless, Hector outgrappled Tim and landed the better strikes.. I don't see how he lost. Dana's facebook (twitter feed) is blowing up at the moment, he's been complaining all night.


----------



## rallyman (Mar 15, 2010)

although both were terrible out side of a few leg kicks what did boetsch doin that fight?

dont agree with that descision


----------



## Drogo (Nov 19, 2006)

Roflcopter said:


> Yeah.
> 
> He pretty much got robbed.


Robbed for standing there and doing nothing? Boetsch didn't do much either but he was more active than Lombard. How is that even a split decision? I can't imagine how anyone could score that for Lombard.


----------



## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

The beast lost to Tim Boetsch as they were boo'd out of the cage.

Earlier in the night this beasts best opponent he has ever beat was beaten by James funky Head.

bahahahahahahahahahahaha

hype


----------



## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

Lombard only lost because he was highly favoured and basically got screwed over by his reputation.


Boestch did absolutely nothing and I find it extremely difficult to believe two people gave him two rounds.

They literally landed around the same amount of strikes, only Boetsch did nothing but inneffective body kicks...I dont think he touched Lombard's head once..while Lombard was hitting him with actual decent punches to the head. He also outgrappled him and got on top of him all three rounds and got two takedowns.


Complete highway robbery.


----------



## AJClark (Sep 19, 2010)

Looks like the bonuses are going to the prelims haha.

Though, I have faith in Faber and Barao.

Oh and Riddle for SOTN... Nevermind then.


----------



## Parky-RFC (Jul 6, 2010)

No surprises there tbh. Lombard is awful and has been found out by an average UFC fighter. I'd hang up the gloves from the sheer embarrassment.


----------



## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

PheelGoodInc said:


> No robbery there. Neither of them should have expected to win after that performance. Terrible.


Just because the fight sucked and was inactive doesn't mean their wasn't a clear winner.

I'd love to see the Fightmetric or Computstrike for this fight.

Completely shambolic decision.

Another classic example of being giving every benefit of the doubt to the underdog.


----------



## MikeHawk (Sep 11, 2009)

I thought Lombard won but I'm glad Boestch got the robbery.

Lombard didn't deserve that fight. Boestch didn't either but he's not the one with a shit ton of hype behind him.


----------



## Jumanji (Mar 30, 2011)

If Dana announces a number one contender fight with Tim Boetsch in it im gonna be pissed. Both of them don't deserve shit


----------



## Mirage445 (Dec 20, 2006)

I had Lombard winning rounds 2 and 3...he got robbed...and I'm kind of glad.


----------



## jaycalgary (Jun 19, 2008)

Probably will be a good fighter but I am so happy he lost on that performance.


----------



## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

Jumanji said:


> If Dana announces a number one contender fight with Tim Boetsch in it im gonna be pissed. Both of them don't deserve shit


As someone else said, the winner of this fight is Weidman.


----------



## TraMaI (Dec 10, 2007)

AJClark said:


> Looks like the bonuses are going to the prelims haha.
> 
> Though, I have faith in Faber and Barao.
> 
> Oh and Riddle for SOTN... Nevermind then.


I wouldn't say that until Barao is done fighting. I have a feeling he's taking part of Faber home with him


----------



## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

Roflcopter said:


> Just because the fight sucked and was inactive doesn't mean their wasn't a clear winner.
> 
> I'd love to see the Fightmetric or Computstrike for this fight.
> 
> ...


I don't know what you were watching but Lombard landed maybe 2 clean punches the entire fight. He grazed him a decent amount of times but did next to no damage. If you don't clearly out damage your opponent you need to win the strike total and he lost those badly.


----------



## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

Drogo said:


> Robbed for standing there and doing nothing? Boetsch didn't do much either but he was more active than Lombard. How is that even a split decision? I can't imagine how anyone could score that for Lombard.


No he wasn't. 

They literally threw about the same rate, except Boetsch threw close to zero punches and did nothing but land glancing, weak ass Forrest Griffin style kicks.


This fight reminds me of that Rampage-Forrest robbery. Except Rampage-Forrest was much worse because Forrest was getting rocked with almost every punch.

Boetsch hung in there but he clearly lost the fight in every facet of MMA.


----------



## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

The thing that seemed the most odd to me, Lombard was CLEARLY in Boestch's head. I thought a minute or two in that eventually Lombard would pour it on and win just because Boetsch seemed to expect to lose.

Oh well, Boetsch did win because he was more active. Lombard did just seem to stand there winging the occasional strike, and when he had Boetsch down he struggled to land anything significant.


----------



## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

osmium said:


> I don't know what you were watching but Lombard landed maybe 2 clean punches the entire fight. He grazed him a decent amount of times but did next to no damage. If you don't clearly out damage your opponent you need to win the strike total and he lost those badly.


Those few clean punches were clearly worth more than whatever ineffective offense Boestch had to offer.


He also had takedowns and octagon control in his favour.


----------



## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

People can't realistically say Lombard was 'exposed' or 'found out'. Boetsch didn't put a beating on him. In fact, Tim didn't do squat. Lombard just so happened to do very little himself. Lombard lost this fight for himself, not vice versa. 

I don't know if it was nerves or what, but he's going to regret it.


----------



## El Bresko (Mar 12, 2010)

I don't think Boetsch even thought he was gonna get the W


----------



## GrappleRetarded (Jun 22, 2012)

Apparently you can win MMA contests by treating them as fencing competitions.


----------



## Drogo (Nov 19, 2006)

Roflcopter said:


> No he wasn't.
> 
> They literally threw about the same rate, except Boetsch threw close to zero punches and did nothing but land glancing, weak ass Forrest Griffin style kicks.
> 
> ...


I don't think they landed or threw at the same rate, I thought Boetsch threw more and landed more. He was also the aggressor. I agree it was close and there wasn't a huge difference but the guy who landed more and initiated the action is the clear winner and that was Boetsch. I'd like to see the compustrike numbers too but I'd be stunned if Boetsch wasn't ahead in strikes thrown and landed.


----------



## Soakked (Feb 5, 2007)

Canadian Psycho said:


> People can't realistically say Lombard was 'exposed' or 'found out'. Boetsch didn't put a beating on him. In fact, Tim didn't do squat. Lombard just so happened to do very little himself. Lombard lost this fight for himself, not vice versa.
> 
> I don't know if it was nerves or what, but he's going to regret it.



Yeah I agree. I think the pressure to perform and not mess up got in his head along with UFC jitters. People saying he was exposed are the same ones that said Shogun was exposed in his fight against Forrest.

That being said he deserved to lose with that awful performance.


----------



## slapstick (Oct 15, 2010)

MRBRESK said:


> I don't think Boetsch even thought he was gonna get the W


He clearly thought he was gonna get his head kicked in the whole time and it just never happened.


----------



## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

The ridiculous thing is Joe Rogan literally said something to the effect of 

"Boestch is doing well, he's taken some hard shots from Lombard this round and hasn't gone away".

This shit reminds me of the Chonan-Silva fight that some absolute retards had for Chonan before the sub just becuase Mauro kept sucking him for eating several straights to the face in between in effective leg kicks.



Seriously, Im starting to think Cecil Peoples was on to something.

Surely not in the asinine, retarded way that he justified a clearly bad decision. But my God are little petty leg and body kicks being overrated greatly recently.


----------



## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

Roflcopter said:


> Those few clean punches were clearly worth more than whatever ineffective offense Boestch had to offer.
> 
> 
> He also had takedowns and octagon control in his favour.


He won the second for his takedown and top control and a decent body kick. I don't see how taking someone down for 1 second in the third and then getting kneed 4-5 times in the clinch is winning.



Roflcopter said:


> The ridiculous thing is Joe Rogan literally said something to the effect of
> 
> "Boestch is doing well, he's taken some hard shots from Lombard this round and hasn't gone away".
> 
> ...


I favor damage over total strikes generally but lombard just didn't do any real damage outside of the second.


----------



## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

Boetsch landed more, they weren't exactly hard kicks or punches, but he mostly landed kicks. How is this any different than Diaz/Condit?

Condit backed up and won by leg kicks, same thing Boetsch did. Lombard is really inactive and landed a few power bombs, but thats it. The one time he had him on the ground, he didn't make any significant punches or anything. 

Lombard lost the fight, simple.


----------



## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

Roflcopter said:


> Lombard only lost because he was highly favoured and basically got screwed over by his reputation.
> 
> 
> Boestch did absolutely nothing and I find it extremely difficult to believe two people gave him two rounds.
> ...


Good, I'm not the only one. Sure, it was a shit fight, but Hector won quite clearly IMO.

Landed ALL 'effective' strikes in the fight, controlled the Octagon, and won all the grappling exchanges.

Boestch got punched in the head, threw minor leg kicks, had his takedowns stuffed and got reversed the one time he got Hector down.

Wasn't a crazy slugfest like Rogan wanted, pure robbery though.


----------



## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

A takedown is certainly more valuable then 3 small knees in the clinch.

What is this RINGS in 2001? Get a clue.


----------



## TraMaI (Dec 10, 2007)

Via twitter



> Mike Bohn ‏@FightCoveMike
> Dana White has left the building, folks. Stormed off after the decision. Haven't seen him come back in yet.


LOOOOOOOOL


----------



## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

Roflcopter said:


> A takedown is certainly more valuable then 3 small knees in the clinch.
> 
> What is this RINGS in 2001? Get a clue.


Rather than being pissed at the decision be pissed that Lombard sat back and let it go to them. 

The fight actually reminded me of Melvin Guillards TUF fight. You knew he was talented, but he kind of froze and didn't do anything.


----------



## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

Wonder what Dana paid Lombard


----------



## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

200 thousand I think.


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

What are you guys talking about???

Boetsch won the fight because he was active atleast.

Lombard just stood there waiting for Boetsch. You CANNOT win a fight like that. No one should EVER get a decision victory if they just stand there and wait for the opponent to do everything. I had it 29-28 for Boetsch. 

But on a different note

Anyone wanna Sig bet that a few days from now we will hear 

"I was sick/injured/broken bone so i couldnt fight the way i wanted to BUT im making no excuses he won and thats that"


----------



## TraMaI (Dec 10, 2007)

Spec0688 said:


> Wonder what Dana paid Lombard


Too much.


----------



## Alessia (Sep 1, 2011)

Only person that robbed Lombard, was Lombard.


----------



## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

You obviously weren't watching the exchanges.


----------



## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

SM33 said:


> You obviously weren't watching the exchanges.


Was Boetsch moving so fast that he left an after image that Lombard was punching? Tim "Lightning" Boetsch.


----------



## Iuanes (Feb 17, 2009)

Lombard landed more significant anything, but I can see why the judges scored the way they did.

You know, despite the unremarkable showing, Lombard still looks impressive. His grappling is ridiculous, I don't know who would take him down.


----------



## RearNaked (Jul 20, 2012)

Everyone's ragging on Lombard for not fighting up to his potential... He didn't, but neither did Boetsch.

Both guys need to give their heads a shake. That was really awful.


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

Lombard would have won the fight had he decided to engage. Instead he stood there like a turd and just punched when Boetsch engaged. The only reason i gave him round 3 is because of the wicked takedown.


----------



## PheelGoodInc (Jul 23, 2009)

Roflcopter said:


> Just because the fight sucked and was inactive doesn't mean their wasn't a clear winner.
> 
> I'd love to see the Fightmetric or Computstrike for this fight.
> 
> ...


It was a completely shambolic fight. I don't know why you're so up in arms in defense of the decision in such a crappy fight.


----------



## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

I shouldn't be. But it's still relevant in terms of division rankings and the two fighters' standing in the division.

Boetsch clearly isn't the better fighter out of the two.


----------



## ACTAFOOL (Dec 10, 2008)

lombard didnt have octagon control, he just stood there, tim was more agressive and landed more strikes

usually i would say effective strikes are more important but lombard really didnt land anything significant either, he landed some good shots but they didnt hurt tim either. the only shot that actually hurt tim was in the 2nd round wich i gave to lombard because of it

but round 1 tim was more active and lombard didnt land anything that actually hurt tim.

i guess you could give the 3rd to lombard because of the TD but he didnt do anything with it, then again tim didnt do much either....personally i think this fight should have been the saddest draw in MMA history

at the end of the day it doesnt really matter who won, somehow both fighters stock dropped big time with this fight


----------



## Toxic (Mar 1, 2007)

Hector Lombard was gonna be the guy to overthrow Anderson Silva? BAHAHAHA, seriously though the nights biggest loser was clearly Hector Lombard, he was in a fight with little to nothing to gain against an opponent whose ranking was because of more right place right time than his own actual abilities and not only did Lombard lose but he looked like complete garbage. I would not be surprised to see him get cut and sent back to Bellator with his tail between his legs just to discredit Bellator.


----------



## Sterl (Jul 26, 2009)

Roflcopter said:


> I shouldn't be. But it's still relevant in terms of division rankings and the two fighters' standing in the division.
> 
> Boetsch clearly isn't the better fighter out of the two.


Not saying rankings don't have any meaning, but after that fight it won't really matter what rank Lombard is even if they would have gave him the decision. It was complete garbage and both shouldn't be anything but disappointed with themselves.


----------



## the ultimate (Mar 5, 2007)

Lombard won the fight imo, but he was pretty awful. Boetsch was very lackluster as well.


----------



## usernamewoman (Sep 24, 2007)

tonights biggest loser was the fans


----------



## dvonfunk (Oct 31, 2007)

There is no winner in this fight. Was that the most disappointing UFC debut (considering the hype) ever? It just might be... If Lombard loses his next fight- I don't care how, or who it's against- cut him. He is not relevant.


----------



## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

I think nerves got the better of em. This changes things a bit. Hector vs Vitor should be a good one or against Stann as originally planned. 

Belcher vs Weidman


----------



## PheelGoodInc (Jul 23, 2009)

Roflcopter said:


> I shouldn't be. But it's still relevant in terms of division rankings and the two fighters' standing in the division.
> 
> Boetsch clearly isn't the better fighter out of the two.


I can understand that. I thought he won too. But at the end of the day, the both looked like shit. Neither one of them are shooting up the ladder. If anything, that fight dropped them both further away from the title... regardless of who got the W.


----------



## dvonfunk (Oct 31, 2007)

Congratulations to Hector Lombard! Now a Munoz-Lombard fight seems destined to be. Two number one contenders in their own minds. AND they both looked despicable in their last respective fights. That's what Lombard wanted, after all. A fight with Munoz. Kudos to him...


----------



## Wookie (Jul 20, 2008)

That really was a dreadful fight, but I still had Lombard being the agressor most of the time and landing the better punches. It should have went Lombard's way in my opinion, but it was close. This is one case were I didn't buy the card, I wouldn't be the least bit dissappointed.

p.s. sorry for typos can't spell for shit, given current condition!


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

Anyone watch the post fight conference??

Any excuses dropped? Dana whites comments?


----------



## K R Y (Nov 19, 2007)

Close but abysmally awful rubbish fight. Such an anti climax. 

Sent from my GT-I9300 using VerticalSports.Com App


----------



## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

Here is the thing i don't get people are disappointed by Hector's performance, but got down right angry when Silva toyed with Maia. 

Which was more entertaining, this fight or Silva vs Maia?


----------



## boatoar (May 14, 2010)

It's one thing to show you're levels above an opponent (Silva vs. Maia) and then be a dipshit and stop engaging...but there was no doubt who the winner would be.

In this fight, we were all waiting for Lombard to start being aggressive and to start taking control. It never really happened. He had a few small moments, but that was unbearably frustrating to watch after the hype. I was really excited for him to tune up Boetsch emphatically and setup a Weidman Lombard eliminator. God damn is this disappointing. 

I have nothing against Tim Boetsch, but he's not someone who will threaten for the title. Now, obviously Lombard isn't either, and I am saddened by this. (I realize many people didn't think he was to begin with, but this performance was a 2/10)


----------



## Sports_Nerd (Apr 23, 2012)

Booooooo!

Hector Lombard? More like Paris Lombard. More like Priam frigging Lombard.


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

marcthegame said:


> Here is the thing i don't get people are disappointed by Hector's performance, but got down right angry when Silva toyed with Maia.
> 
> Which was more entertaining, this fight or Silva vs Maia?


Thats what you dont get?? Serious...


----------



## "El Guapo" (Jun 25, 2010)

I literally cannot ******* believe this decision. Just watched the fight this morning and it's an easy 30-27 Lombard, I don't even favor either of them.

These bad judges decisions are literally starting to turn me away from the sport, a retarded monkey could score the fight better than the current judges.

I am actually struggling to remember ANYTHING Boetsch did that was effective WHATSOEVER.

Another thing, SORT OUT YOUR COMMENTATORS. Listening to Rogan harp on you would have thought Tim dominated the fight. It's ridiculous. Just call the bloody fight as you see it and leave your opinions out of it.

Anyone notice at the end of the fight EVERY SINGLE ******* HIGHLIGHT was of Hector Lombard.

Why is that you ask.... Oh maybe because Tim Boetsch did jack shit the whole fight!


----------



## Sports_Nerd (Apr 23, 2012)

"El Guapo" said:


> I literally cannot ******* believe this decision. Just watched the fight this morning and it's an easy 30-27 Lombard, I don't even favor either of them.
> 
> These bad judges decisions are literally starting to turn me away from the sport, a retarded monkey could score the fight better than the current judges.
> 
> I am actually struggling to remember ANYTHING Boetsch did that was effective WHATSOEVER.


At least he engaged occasionally.



> *Another thing, SORT OUT YOUR COMMENTATORS. Listening to Rogan harp on you would have thought Tim dominated the fight. It's ridiculous. Just call the bloody fight as you see it and leave your opinions out of it.*
> 
> Anyone notice at the end of the fight EVERY SINGLE ******* HIGHLIGHT was of Hector Lombard.


Joe Rogan is a color commentator. Giving an opinion is his job, calling it is Goldie's job.


----------



## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

Tim landed more but in a fight with such limited action, you have to put more weight on effective strikes, which would favor Lombard undeniably.

And effective grappling? Hector all day, stuffed all takedowns, landed two of his own, hadttim turtled up at one point.

Poor decision IMO, it's like a mini version of Diaz vs Condit, I felt Diaz won that fight.


----------



## Sports_Nerd (Apr 23, 2012)

SM33 said:


> Tim landed more but in a fight with such limited action, you have to put more weight on effective strikes, which would favor Lombard undeniably.
> 
> And effective grappling? Hector all day, stuffed all takedowns, landed two of his own, hadttim turtled up at one point.
> 
> Poor decision IMO, it's like a mini version of Diaz vs Condit, I felt Diaz won that fight.


Lombard won rd 2 with the liver kick undeniably, the rest was all ineffective striking and grappling, I can see giving 1 & 3 to Boetsch based on aggression. Neither of them really deserve it though, IMO, I don't see any justification in complaining about the decision going either way.


----------



## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

Listen, I have bashed Lombard. But I thought he won that fight. But I also thought Diaz beat Condit....but things happen. Movement and little leg kicks get scored these days.

That said, it was TIM BOETSCH. A man who has beat no one really other than Okami in a fight where he got his ass kicked most of the time. If Lombard is so devistating he would have been more aggressive. Like I said, anytime he fights even a decent fighter he doesn't beast through them. He goes to decision or it takes him 3 or 4 rounds. His "devistating" rep is highly over-blown.

There are 8-12 guys in the UFC 185 division that are tougher fights than Boetsch who is basically a journeyman who was kicked out of the UFC and has a little streak going now.

Lombard has some skills. But for as much hype as he had he should have been more aggressive to show these "skills". Lombard is definatly UFC quality. But he isn't top 5 quality. And probably not top 10 quality. Okami lit Boetsch up way more than Lombard did.

If anyone is going to think about Lombard facing Silva, than he should be running through a guy like Boetsch.


----------



## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

Seriously when are people going to learn that a long winning streak against mostly cans doesn't mean anything. I'm really sick of people saying how difficult that shit is. Name me all of the times a fighter that is actually good lost to a can; it never happens. Top ten fighters rarely lose to borderline top 20 fighters unless it is some prospect who it turns out is actually a top 10 quality fighter.


----------



## oldfan (Mar 14, 2010)

from fight metric


----------



## Sports_Nerd (Apr 23, 2012)

jonnyg4508 said:


> Listen, I have bashed Lombard. But I thought he won that fight. But I also thought Diaz beat Condit....but things happen. Movement and little leg kicks get scored these days.
> 
> That said, it was TIM BOETSCH. A man who has beat no one really other than Okami in a fight where he got his ass kicked most of the time. If Lombard is so devistating he would have been more aggressive. Like I said, anytime he fights even a decent fighter he doesn't beast through them. He goes to decision or it takes him 3 or 4 rounds. His "devistating" rep is highly over-blown.
> 
> ...


The thing is that from what I saw I'm positive that Lil' Lombard _could_ have gone through Boetsch if he actually came to fight. He's faster, more accurate, and is by far the superior grappler. But he was completely passive the whole fight.


----------



## ACTAFOOL (Dec 10, 2008)

oldfan said:


> from fight metric


thanks, guess it was the right decision, just like i thought...i gave rds 1 & 3 to tim, and rd 2 to lombard for the liver kick

rd 3 might be lombards because of the TD but honestly...who cares? this really should have been a draw....but lombard needed to lose, if he had won he might want to fight like that again.


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## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

IMO Tim deserved the victory. He made this somewhat of a fight, constantly moving and throwing more strikes. Lombard was just hanging out in front of him looking for shots.


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

Right decision. Lombard fought like crap and his inexperience against anyone remotely notable was definitely shown.


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## tight (Aug 26, 2007)

Huge letdown of a fight. 

Was Hector injured? He fought like he couldn't move his legs. He looked like the more dangerous fighter but didn't prove it.

Tim fought like he was scared of getting hit, maybe it was smart movement but really who cares, I don't care that much to see him win or climb the ladder when the 'barbarian' fights like that. 

I don't like it when fans boo but they had every right to in this fight. Neither fighter went in for the kill to finish the fight and that sucks imo.


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## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

I thought Tim won by being more active, but I just don't understand what the hell Lombard was doing, you can't fault Boestch, staying away from a fire fight with Lombard was the best thing he could have done but Lombard just stood there and did nothing.

I don't know what this was, Octagon Jitters, throwing the fight to fight Munoz(people are actually suggesting that) or what but that wasn't the Hector Lombard I saw in Bellator, no aggression, no blitzkrieg from hell, no violent swarms, just a really odd performance from him.


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## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

TheLyotoLegion said:


> I thought Tim won by being more active, but I just don't understand what the hell Lombard was doing, you can't fault Boestch, staying away from a fire fight with Lombard was the best thing he could have done but Lombard just stood there and did nothing.
> 
> I don't know what this was, Octagon Jitters, throwing the fight to fight Munoz(people are actually suggesting that) or what but that wasn't the Hector Lombard I saw in Bellator, no aggression, no blitzkrieg from hell, no violent swarms, just a really odd performance from him.


Yeah very frustrating. And conservative as Hector was, he was still blatantly the better and more dangerous fighter... Still waiting for a statement or interview from him.


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## TanyaJade (Aug 31, 2010)

Awful. Lombard has Jorge Santiago written all over him.

I scored it originally 29-28 for Lombard, giving him the second and third. But after watching it again I could see why Boetsch was given the third round. Lombard controlled the grappling, Boetsch controlled the striking. It could have gone either way. 

At least now we get to see Munoz vs. Lombard.


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## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

I like how Boetsch's wimpy slap kicks are considered "significant"

That's hilarious.


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## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

Another thing I thought was interesting was the fact Boestch got off so many kicks, I remember watching him catch them regularly against Alexander Shlemenko.


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## ptw (Aug 13, 2009)

oldfan said:


> from fight metric


I'll have to watch the fight again, but I don't remember Tim landing any significant strikes other than wimpy leg kicks on Lombard. When Tim tried to let his hands go Lombard would dodge and counter, and he hit Tim with some really good shots throughout the fight. It was a bullshit call, just like the Diaz and Condit fight, just like the Fitch and BJ fight etc. Lombard was clearly playing a waiting game, and was picking his shots without risking himself, he really outclassed Tim in that fight. Tim looked about 20lbs heavier than Hector and was manhandled in the grappling, controlled, and countered every time he tried to engage. The only person who was ever in trouble in that fight was Tim, it's ridiculous to expect Lombard to fight like an idiot and throw wildly...

I definitely see Hector as a potential contender for the belt, but I think he just got ****ed by the system right now. I would love to Hector vs Vitor.


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## oldfan (Mar 14, 2010)

I did notice that they count almost everyone of Tim's strikes as "significant".

It seemed to me like what strikes Lombard did throw were hard and fast and significant.

Regardless, Lombard looked like sh*t. If he had stood in front of Brian Stann like that he would have been the KOTN.


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## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

ptw said:


> I'll have to watch the fight again, but I don't remember Tim landing any significant strikes other than wimpy leg kicks on Lombard. When Tim tried to let his hands go Lombard would dodge and counter, and he hit Tim with some really good shots throughout the fight. It was a bullshit call, just like the Diaz and Condit fight, just like the Fitch and BJ fight etc. Lombard was clearly playing a waiting game, and was picking his shots without risking himself, he really outclassed Tim in that fight. Tim looked about 20lbs heavier than Hector and was manhandled in the grappling, controlled, and countered every time he tried to engage. The only person who was ever in trouble in that fight was Tim, it's ridiculous to expect Lombard to fight like an idiot and throw wildly...
> 
> I definitely see Hector as a potential contender for the belt, but I think he just got ****ed by the system right now. I would love to Hector vs Vitor.


Worded it better than me. Lombard outclassed Boetsch, straight up. There was no KO, no submission, it wasn't 15 minutes of chaos. But Lombard was better at everything, he did more damage and people are supporting awful judging because it wasn't the fight they were expecting.


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## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

I cannot understand how people managed to 'rewatch' this fight :confused02:

Yeesh! just to make a point about how either person performed or didnt perform... the fact is, BOTH fighters contributed to one boring arse fight


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## PheelGoodInc (Jul 23, 2009)

SM33 said:


> Worded it better than me. Lombard outclassed Boetsch, straight up. There was no KO, no submission, it wasn't 15 minutes of chaos. But Lombard was better at everything, he did more damage and *people are supporting awful judging because it wasn't the fight they were expecting.*


That's not the case. The case is that no one should come in there and fight the way he did and then bitch about getting the wrong end of the decision.

Who won that decision is completely irrelevant to me (and probably Dana as well). Both fighters moved down the ladder. I would be just as disappointed if Lombard had won. It's not a matter of people supporting awful judging. It's a matter of people not giving a shit about the judging because the fight was crap.

Lombard should have got the decision. Boo hoo. Tell him to fight to his ability next time and he won't have to worry about getting robbed. Ultimately, it was the fans who got robbed after that fight. Not Lombard.


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## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

PheelGoodInc said:


> That's not the case. The case is that no one should come in there and fight the way he did and then bitch about getting the wrong end of the decision.
> 
> Who won that decision is completely irrelevant to me (and probably Dana as well). Both fighters moved down the ladder. I would be just as disappointed if Lombard had won. It's not a matter of people supporting awful judging. It's a matter of people not giving a shit about the judging because the fight was crap.
> 
> Lombard should have got the decision. Boo hoo. Tell him to fight to his ability next time and he won't have to worry about getting robbed. Ultimately, it was the fans who got robbed after that fight. Not Lombard.


Lombard hasn't bitched about it(yet). You're missing my point, yeah Hector lost I'm over it, but this is another case of poor scoring and that should not be overshadowed by the fact that it was a boring fight.

In total strikes, Tim had only 10 more than Lombard. Lombard landed blatantly more effective strikes and dominated the grappling, stuff all 9 takedown attempts and landing 2 of his own 4.

I'm not worried about Lombard, he'll bounce back quicker than most expect. Poor decisions are actually becoming more frequent and it's a serious issue. But of course, landing baby leg kicks almost exclusively, moving backward, and ending up with only 10 more strikes than your opponent makes all the difference... Like Dana said, it's going to ruin the sport.


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## TheNinja (Dec 10, 2008)

Yeah that fight was dreadful... But I actually had the fight scored 30-27 for Lombard. I was real surprised when it was a split, then shocked when he lost.

Hector just seemed to land the better punches, outwrestled him for sure, and had that body kick in the second which did more damagae then anything in the fight.

I'm not a fan of either fighter, but it just sucks that Tim actually gets closer to a title fight with a win like that...


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## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

At the end of the day, the only person Lombard has to blame is himself, when the fight was over I just thought "what a missed opportunity" he had Boestch hurt bad with that body kick and if he had just opened up he probably could have finished, but he didn't and it's really puzzling to me.


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## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

Roflcopter said:


> I like how Boetsch's wimpy slap kicks are considered "significant"
> 
> That's hilarious.



Everything is significant in those things including a bunch of punches Lombard didn't land or barely scraped Boetsch with his knuckle. Boetsch did land some power punches in the first he just stopped throwing them completely as the fight went on because he could dodge basically all of Lombard's offense if he didn't throw them.


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## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

Pic: Tim Boetsch broken foot, which "The Barbarian" thinks he cracked kicking the knee of Hector Lombard in the UFC 149 co main event, some time in the second round. 

http://www.mmamania.com/2012/7/22/3...en-foot-which-the-barbarian-thinks-he-cracked


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## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

Roflcopter said:


> I like how Boetsch's wimpy slap kicks are considered "significant"
> 
> That's hilarious.


Lets not act surprised.

Condit got the same treatment. 

Guida was awarded the fight by 1 judge who scored back peddling around the cage as points. 

It was a bad decision. But lets not act like it was any worse than we see on a normal basis. 

Lombard didn't blow Boetsch out of the water. He was content on keeping it a toss up and hoping the judges would give him the rounds. 

That is not how a devastating fighter fight. His fans are just pissed because they told everyone over and over how dangerous this guy is....how he is such a explosive guy. And he came in and looked like a hesitant fighter waiting on 1 power shot to end the fight. 

If he is just going to stand around trying to land 1 bomb he is going to lose in the UFC a lot.


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## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

I can understand fighters with heavily muscled frames need to pace themselves sometimes to avoid gasing.

What I don't get is why fighters afraid of gasing don't pour it on in the 3rd. 

When there's 30 - 60 seconds left in the last round, why not unleash teh Vitor blitz?


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## drey2k (Jul 9, 2009)

Horrible fight AND horrible decision.

Disgusting.


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## hellholming (Jun 13, 2009)

Chris Weidman would have murdered both fighters.... And Lombard was supposed to be a tough matchup for Silva? gimme a ******* break...


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

Actually I learned a lot from this fight. 

He has two thing he does well. That's clinching/judo throw and blitzing once he gets within his range. 

- nerves got the better of Hector which shows he's not the strongest mentally (quite obvious from his actions in the ring in the past) 
- not the most versatile
- unable to adapt
- he has trouble with range (didn't realize how small or short he was) 
- there was no dominant winner here although I scored it for Boetsch for peppering em with those kicks (points.) 

I think he wanted to pace himself and not look like an idiot and get knocked out in his debut. Too bad he didn't pour it on in the third or when Boetsch was hurt with the kick to the mid section. Had high hopes. The second and third fights will be a much better indication where he stands.


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## RearNaked (Jul 20, 2012)

He just got over-hyped. 

We're all mad at him for not performing up to his potential in his first UFC fight. 

If he went balls out, couldn't put Boetsch away, gassed out, and got TKO'd in the third, you'd all be laughing saying he was never UFC caliber and he sucks and he should be cut.

People saying you looked like crap is better than people saying you lost because you never deserved to be in there in the first place and you should be cut.


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## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

Scenario: you're standing in a cage with someone who trained diligently to punch you in the head hard enough to knock you unconscious.

Trainers say things like... if you circle to the left, you'll be safe. If you fight conservatively, you'll be safe. If you keep your hands up, you'll be safe.

But really, there is no safety in there. You're not necessarily any safer being conservative than you are bum rushing someone. There are plenty of fighters who are conservative who do all the right things & they still get knocked out.

Okami had Boetsch hurt & didn't try to finish. Boetsch ended up finishing him. 

I just think that someone who has that much of a speed and technique advantage over someone like Boetsch should turn it up once in awhile and try to get the finish. Not necessarily to fight sloppy or reckless. But, at least, fight with some urgency and show that you want it.


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

RearNaked said:


> People saying you looked like crap is better than people saying you lost because you never deserved to be in there in the first place and you should be cut.


I disagree with this because we can all say "Boetsch is very hard to finish, who else would actually survive that?". There would also be the argument for if he rushed and did a lot of damage as to whether he COULD do that to AS or not. What we know right now is that if he performed that way in front of AS we would have another front kick highlight reel from AS.

I think Dan Hardy proved that it is better to be an exciting loser than a boring winner.


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## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

cdtcpl said:


> I disagree with this because we can all say "Boetsch is very hard to finish, who else would actually survive that?". There would also be the argument for if he rushed and did a lot of damage as to whether he COULD do that to AS or not. What we know right now is that if he performed that way in front of AS we would have another front kick highlight reel from AS.
> 
> *I think Dan Hardy proved that it is better to be an exciting loser than a boring winner.*


No, it is better to be a exciting loser than a boring loser. It is always better to win no matter how you do it. Dana was pissed at Lombard after this fight not Boetsch.


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

osmium said:


> No, it is better to be a exciting loser than a boring loser. It is always better to win no matter how you do it. *Dana was pissed at Lombard after this fight not Boetsch.*


Yes, I think we all know that. My point was look at a guy like Dan Hardy who lost 4 in a row but was kept around because he was "exciting". He kept getting main event or co-main event fights, didn't fight on the undercard since his Swick victory, although he clearly deserved to.

Lets take the counter example, Fitch. Immediately after his fight with GSP his next fight was on the undercard. Add to that the fact that DW makes Fitch fight more unknowns or up-and-comers than anyone. All because Fitch is viewed as a boring winner.

So I feel that my statement stands, even if Lombard had won that decision it doesn't matter, his stock still goes down. I feel that his stock went down more than if he would have gassed because he blitzed Boetsch but Boetsch survived.


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## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

There is a bad relationship issue there it isn't just because of how he fights. Dan is also a well known british fighter so he can be used high up on european cards and he has been fighting on the main cards of free tv cards as well which lack the depth to push him to the prelims that many ppvs would have. The only card that doesn't fall into those categories that he fought on since losing to GSP he was in the prelims.


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## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

cdtcpl said:


> Yes, I think we all know that. My point was *look at a guy like Dan Hardy* who lost 4 in a row but was kept around because he was "exciting". He kept getting main event or co-main event fights, didn't fight on the undercard since his Swick victory, although he clearly deserved to.
> 
> Lets take the counter example, Fitch. Immediately after his fight with GSP his next fight was on the undercard. Add to that the fact that DW makes Fitch fight more unknowns or up-and-comers than anyone. All because Fitch is viewed as a boring winner.
> 
> So I feel that my statement stands, even if Lombard had won that decision it doesn't matter, his stock still goes down. I feel that his stock went down more than if he would have gassed because he blitzed Boetsch but Boetsch survived.


He is the only example of this. I dont recall any other fighter losing as many as Dan Hardy and getting to stick around. Exciting or not.

They do however get back into the UFC easier then none exciting fighters.


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## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

SideWays222 said:


> He is the only example of this. I dont recall any other fighter losing as many as Dan Hardy and getting to stick around. Exciting or not.
> 
> They do however get back into the UFC easier then none exciting fighters.


Steve 'Cantwin' Cantwell has lost his last five and to my knowledge he's still on the roster, for whatever reason, with Hardy he's a former title challenger and a big guy to market for the UK. Cantwell has nothing to offer.

Akiyama's also still there but of course, another big name guy they can use for international shows.


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## IcemanCometh (Mar 9, 2007)

Cantwell was cut. He was 0-5 but finally got cut.

Source


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

IcemanCometh said:


> Cantwell was cut. He was 0-5 but finally got cut.
> 
> Source



Efrain again..


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## RearNaked (Jul 20, 2012)

SideWays222 said:


> He is the only example of this. I dont recall any other fighter losing as many as Dan Hardy and getting to stick around. Exciting or not.
> 
> They do however get back into the UFC easier then none exciting fighters.


And really the Dan Hardy thing is a special case because he and Michael Bisping are the faces of the UFC in Britain and the UFC is aggressively expanding there.

I was in the UK about 5 years ago for holiday and no one watched MMA. They all called it 'brutal' and acted like it was a sideshow.

Now it's HUGE over there and a big part of that the fact that the UFC pushes UK fighters like crazy whether they deserve it or not.


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## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

TheLyotoLegion said:


> Steve 'Cantwin' Cantwell has lost his last five and to my knowledge he's still on the roster, for whatever reason, with Hardy he's a former title challenger and a big guy to market for the UK. Cantwell has nothing to offer.
> 
> Akiyama's also still there but of course, another big name guy they can use for international shows.


Yeah your right.

Cantwell should have been cut a while ago.


Akiyama i do not believe should be cut. 

His 3 more recent losses are to Bisping,Vitor,Shields. 

I just dont see how anyone can be cut or JUDGED by losing to those fighters when MANY fighters on the roster would lose to them. In order to be cut for losing fights you need to lose to mediocre fighters because that would mean you are not good enough to compete at the UFC level. On the other hand you lose to those 3 and im no closer to believing you cant hang with 50% of the other fighters on the roster. 

His only loss id say is cut worthy is Chris Leben BUT he needs to rack up 2-3 of those.


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## Risto (Oct 11, 2006)

Lombard should bring a chair to his next fight, so he can... you know... just hang out and kick back.

What an utterly shite fight.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Risto said:


> Lombard should bring a chair to his next fight, so he can... you know... just hang out and kick back.




you ain't lyin..


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## Sports_Nerd (Apr 23, 2012)

SideWays222 said:


> Yeah your right.
> 
> Cantwell should have been cut a while ago.
> 
> ...


Akiyama also has 3 FotN honors in 5 fights. When a guy brings it every fight the way he usually does he deserves some leeway, IMO.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

Only just now seen the fight.

I gave it to Barbarian.

Lombard was rubbish. But I'll put it down to nerves. It's not his fault he has a bloated hype train. Lets see how he goes in his second fight.

Chael Sonnen anyone?


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

Soojooko said:


> Only just now seen the fight.
> 
> I gave it to Barbarian.
> 
> ...


If Leben were around that would be an ideal fight. I was pumped for the Stann matchup. Maybe Palharis vs Lombard...that would be hilarous. Two fighters with the same build, low fight IQ, and T-rex arms going at it.


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## Sports_Nerd (Apr 23, 2012)

Watching the fight again.

Round 1 is really difficult to score. Lombard landed a couple of nice uppercuts after stuffing a takedown, and one overhand left that grazed Botsch's dome. Tim isn't really connecting with anything but leg kicks, but those leg kicks are pretty nasty. Lombard is a southpaw so Tim is throwing switch kicks right to his inner thigh. Lombard got a takedown but didn't do anything with it and Boetsch got up pretty easily.

And Boetsch is clearly controlling the distance. he's also being more aggressive, following strikes with more strikes, while Lombard is just swinging once and hanging back. Close round but I give it to Tim, 10:9.

Round 2 was obviously going to Lombard even before the liver kick, and Lombard could've finished the fight afterwards. But Boetsch got up and returned some knees. And obvious round for Lombard but not nearly enough for a 10:8. 10:9 Lombard.

Round 3 clearly goes to Boetsch. Several hard inside leg kicks, a nice straight right, a nice front kick to the face, and a bunch of big knees in the clinch compared to one clean lead right hook and one big takedown that just resulted in Tim Scrambling up. Boetsch was also checking Lombard's kicks, which is something UFC fighters rarely do.

29:28 Boetsch.


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## John8204 (May 13, 2010)

Sports_Nerd said:


> Watching the fight again.
> 
> Round 1 is really difficult to score. Lombard landed a couple of nice uppercuts after stuffing a takedown, and one overhand left that grazed Botsch's dome. Tim isn't really connecting with anything but leg kicks, but those leg kicks are pretty nasty. Lombard is a southpaw so Tim is throwing switch kicks right to his inner thigh. Lombard got a takedown but didn't do anything with it and Boetsch got up pretty easily.
> 
> And Boetsch is clearly controlling the distance. he's also being more aggressive, following strikes with more strikes, while Lombard is just swinging once and hanging back. Close round but I give it to Tim, 10:9.


Really Round 1 is hard to score?
Lombard landed a head kick, an overhand right to Boetsch temple, stuffed his takedown and unloaded on his head, took him down for 1/10 of the round, and stayed in the center of the octagon. Tim Boetsch kicked his inner thigh and bounced out of range. I guess he aggressively moved away when Lombard started to unload on him.

And just so we're clear



> Round 3 clearly goes to Boetsch. Several hard inside leg kicks, a nice straight right, a nice front kick to the face, and a bunch of big knees in the clinch compared to one clean lead right hook and *one big takedown that just resulted in Tim Scrambling up.* Boetsch was also checking Lombard's kicks, which is something UFC fighters rarely do.


Okay so just I'm clear with you, in your eyes take downs don't really count if it's a slam (round 3) or being held down (round 1). Should take downs only count if you engage in gnp? Is you hold a fighter down for lnp session?


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## Sports_Nerd (Apr 23, 2012)

John8204 said:


> Really Round 1 is hard to score?
> Lombard landed a head kick, an overhand right to Boetsch temple, stuffed his takedown and unloaded on his head, took him down for 1/10 of the round, and stayed in the center of the octagon. Tim Boetsch kicked his inner thigh and bounced out of range. I guess he aggressively moved away when Lombard started to unload on him.


The overhand left (Lombard's a southpaw, remember?) was a glancing blow, it seemed like a less effective blow than the straight right Tim landed, for example. The head kick didn't actually land. Staying in the center of the octagon is _not_ octagon control, dictating range is.



> And just so we're clear
> 
> 
> 
> Okay so just I'm clear with you, in your eyes take downs don't really count if it's a slam (round 3) or being held down (round 1). Should take downs only count if you engage in gnp? Is you hold a fighter down for lnp session?


Judges are expected to weigh effective striking vs effective grappling based on the effect each had on the tenor of the fight. So a long lnp session, even if ineffective in doing damage, does have a significant impact on the tenor of the fight. Lombard did show a significant grappling advantage, but couldn't use it to significantly affect the tenor of the fight. In round 3 in which Tim clearly won the striking battle, that one takedown wasn't enough to say "Well, this guy edged out the striking department, but the other guy had an overwhelming advantage in the grappling department, so the round should go to him."

In round 1 I can see it going either way.


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## John8204 (May 13, 2010)

Sports_Nerd said:


> The overhand left (Lombard's a southpaw, remember?) was a glancing blow, it seemed like a less effective blow than the straight right Tim landed, for example. The head kick didn't actually land.* Staying in the center of the octagon is not octagon control, dictating range is.*


These judging criteria were emailed to an inquisitive fan from Marc Ratner back when he was head honcho at the NSAC



> J. Octagon Control
> *1. The fighter who is dictating the pace, place and position of the fight.*
> *2. A striker who fends off a grappler's takedown attempt to remain standing and effectively strike is octagon control.*
> *3. A grappler who can takedown an effective standing striker to ground fight is octagon control.*
> 4. The fighter on the ground who creates submission, mount or clean striking opportunities


Of the three aspects of Octagon Control that are germane to this fight, Lombard clearly established himself in 2 of them, and 2/3rds of the first one. The only thing you can credit Boetsch with was the pace which is negated by Lombard in the middle of the Ocatagon(place) and position of the fight (standing).

Also



> G. The heavier striker who lands with efficiency, deserves more credit from the Judges than total number landed.
> 1. If the striking power between the fighters was equal, then the total number landed would be used as the criteria.
> 2. The total number of strikes landed, should be of sufficient quantity favoring a fighter, to earn a winning round.


Seeing as how Boetsch inflicted no noticeable damage to Lombard, and backed away or <ahem> weaving out of the exchanges Lombard won the striking battle.



> K. Effective Aggressiveness
> 1. This simply means who is *moving forward* and finding success.(scoring)
> 2._ Throwing a strike moving backwards is not as effective as a strike thrown moving forward._
> 3. Throwing strikes and not landing is not effective aggressiveness.
> ...


It says fairly explicitly that moving forward is more effective then moving backwards (or finding your range). This is the principle that allows for Deigo Sanchez to defeat Martin Kampmann because he was moving forward. 

:sarcastic10:


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## Sports_Nerd (Apr 23, 2012)

John8204 said:


> These judging criteria were emailed to an inquisitive fan from Marc Ratner back when he was head honcho at the NSAC
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Landing takedowns and letting the guy up isn't octagon control either. By dictating Range Boetsch established control for most of the fight according to criterion #1.

The argument regarding damage inflicted is bunk. You don't ignore strikes just because they The fact is Boetsch was moving in and out while Lombard spent most of the fight waiting for him, rather than moving forward. You don't win the striking exchanges by standing around waiting to counter.




> It says fairly explicitly that moving forward is more effective then moving backwards (or finding your range). This is the principle that allows for Deigo Sanchez to defeat Martin Kampmann because he was moving forward.
> 
> :sarcastic10:


What the hell are you talking about? You need to watch the fight again. Lombard wasn't "moving forward" he kept moving along the internal octagon mark and waiting for Boetsch.


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## RearNaked (Jul 20, 2012)

The way I see this fight is: 

If Carlos Condit won that fight with Diaz, then Boetsch won this fight.

But I think Diaz won that fight, and by extension, I kind of have to say Lombard won this fight. 

Originally I called it for Boetsch, but on second viewing I think that had a lot to do with the fact I like Boetsch.


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## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

John8204 said:


> These judging criteria were emailed to an inquisitive fan from Marc Ratner back when he was head honcho at the NSAC
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Judges who can't follow striking exchanges allowed for Diego to be given the win and nothing else.


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