# We need to stop this "Strikeforce is gonna do big things" train right now!



## Zuke (Sep 22, 2006)

Strikeforce sealed their fate when they decided to go heads up with the UFC. It really makes no sense. Strikeforce had a great business model. They were just basically in California and they were selling out good size arenas, with a small payroll, and marketing expenses (compared to UFC).

What do they really have other than some fighters who are being overpaid and do not draw crowds. I AM NOT SAYING FEDOR SUCKS. HE AND HENDERSON ARE GREAT. They have some great up and comers such as King Mo, Jacare, Lashley, . Those are the main ones.

Now let's run them down based on how they appeal to the GENERAL MMA FANS (UFC FANS THE STRIKEFORCE FANS ARE TRYING TO DRAW AWAY). Let's face it, Strikeforce is not going to CREATE any new fans.

What you need to do is ask a few questions for each main fighter.

1. Does he appeal to GENERAL MMA FANS?

2. Can I build a company around him?

3. Is he going to be loyal?

4. What does he need to improve?

5. Cost. IS it worth it?


Fedor:

1. No. He is Russian. He is being played as the Ivan Drago character. Americans were told for 40+ years to hate Russia and they were the enemy. I just see the legions of GENERAL FANS LEAVING UFC to watch a Russian who has no personality come in and beat some guy then have to spend 7 minutes translating the post fight.
HE IS THE BEST HEAVYWEIGHT IN THE WORLD BUT GENERAL FANS DON'T GIVE A SHIT. Nobody is paying for a PPV to see a great technical Russian fight.

COnclusion:

Waste of money that brought little attention to Strikforce.



HEndo:

He is another "Vanilla" kinda guy. No mic skills, he is a wrestler which other than his KO over Bisping hasnt done squat other than decison some guys and lose BOTH his PRIDE belts in first 2 UFC fights. He is going to retire in next few years and I dont know one person who ever bought a PPV to see Dan Henderson.

COnclusion:

Waste of money. He is gonna fight Fedor??? This alone validates my thread.

King Mo,

He is actually somebody that can pull if he builds his career up well and keeps improving. He is exciting in his fights and has a personality. Bright spot for Strikeforce. But who do they have to challenge him? Moussasi? Hendo? JAcare? Thats shitting where u eat.

Lashley:

He is STRIKEFORCE version of Lesnar. Let's be real here. There has to be a FOLLOWING IN BROCK SHADOW THING. Bobby is well spoken and very professional but lets be serious he wants the UFC as soon as he gets some tune up and does well.


This whole situation can be summed up in wrestling terms. Back in the day there was WWF, NWA, AWA, VCW, and several other state organizations. But eventually WWF started buying up all video libraries and got heads up with the WCW which was NWA. When another BILLIONAIRE WHO HAD HIS OWN TV STATIONS, NEWS STATIONS, AND AN UNLIMITED BUDGET. He failed. Why? He didn't have current, valid talent, with a mix fan favorites and was always considered "the other one" or looked as the "new guy".


One last thing. Strikeforce has NO PRODUCTION value. It looks cheap. Scott Coker has no idea what he is doing. Neither does Showtime. 

He whored the product quality for exposure. He lost control. Now CBS has idiot play by play men in there as well as a hand it the marketing. He really should talked to Ted Turner.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

Zuke said:


> COnclusion:
> 
> Waste of money. He is gonna fight Fedor??? This alone validates my thread.



Your post has a lot of misinformation and/or confused facts and there's a lot to be addressed here, I'll approach this part and leave the rest to other SF fans like Rival and Stokes.

Henderson has a ton of great matchups at SF, both at 185 and 205. 

*Hendo vs Mousasi* -top 5 LHW
*Hendo vs Misaki* -already beat Henderson once
*Hendo vs Shields* - #6 MW
*Hendo vs Jacare* -unreal BJJ, great striking
*Hendo vs Lombard* - vicious striker, great TDD
*Hendo vs King Mo* -near perfect wrestling, strong brawler
*Hendo vs Lawler* - top 10 MW
*Hendo vs Manhoef * more punching power than Henderson

There's almost no serious talk about Henderson fighting Fedor, if anything that would just be SF's retirement give to Dan and it wouldn't be at all relevant to the title scheme of Strikeforce. 

So since Dan isn't going to face Fedor I guess your thread is no longer validated huh.


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## Hammerlock2.0 (Jun 17, 2009)

Fedor vs Rogers was the most watched fight in history of MMA.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

Hammerlock2.0 said:


> Fedor vs Rogers was the most watched fight in history of MMA.


Is that really true? :eek01:


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

BobbyCooper said:


> Is that really true? :eek01:


25 Million international viewers IIRC.


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## Walker (May 27, 2007)

Crap like this still confuses the hell out of me when supposed fans want to hate on MMA orgs other than the UFC especially when going after the fighters because of it. 

To me if you are a real fan of MMA you get excited about certain match-ups, follow your favorite fighters regardless of which organization they are, realize that not every fighter will *ever* be employed by one, and one only, MMA organization and finally watch and enjoy seeing MMA and quality fights regardless of the org.'s banner that is on the canvas. 

Seems pretty simple to me.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> 25 Million international viewers IIRC.


Cheers khov 

I just read an article about it, 16 million alone from Russia^^ now I know why! But the US numbers weren't the largest in History.


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## ZENKI1 (Apr 19, 2009)

This thread is ridiculous.. I post some off the wall against the grain back to africa type shit some times but this is jus ******* retarded.. Do some damn home work on your subject .. YOU DESERVE LIL RED CUBES:bye02:

I didnt even bother to stupify any more after reading the Fedor and Hendo shit.


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## CornbreadBB (Jul 31, 2008)

There is this thing called Pride....why don't you do a little bit more research than you have already done....Dan is/was an incredibly exciting fighter. You should try actually watching some old Pride besides for looking for information about it online....Hendo's left hook was/is devastating and he has a been a bunch of crowd drawing fights.


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## The_Senator (Jun 5, 2008)

> I just read an article about it, 16 million alone from Russia


It was free on the channel with the widest reception area. But it was shown next day on Sunday, so most people probably had watched the fight on Internet by then. The fight was really short, so it looked more like a long commercial - no promo, no entrances, just the fight, some replays of the KO with short interview afterwards


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## fightpragmatist (Dec 3, 2009)

I mostly just skimmed through the OP, because it was pretty redonk. I did read something about trying to directly compete with the UFC. Well, if you haven't noticed the UFC is the largest and most popular MMA organization in the United States. Strikeforce being a smaller organization decided they wanted to expand on a national level. It's kind of hard to do that without having to compete with the UFC. In other words it was inevitable, what do you want them to do man, just roll over and not try to expand their business?


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## Zuke (Sep 22, 2006)

Those opinions about the fighter are not my opinion. They are what the newer MMA fans that have made MMA skyrocket will think.

Mousassi is ******* great! ******* amazing actually. However, he still wants to fight in DREAM, K1, and STRIKEFORCE. His time will be split and long layoffs are not good. When you are trying to get brand recognition and get your FRANCHISE MEMBERS on Top-Of-Mind-Awareness with the new fan base you dont want to have a guy gone to Japan for 6 months of year or maybe more. What if he gets hurt?

Hendo is ******* amazing. Have any of the new breed seen his Pride fights? Prolly not. Since Hendo has been in UFC from his PRIDE what has he done other than knockout Bisping THAT WOULD MAKE A NEW FAN WANNA PAY TO SEE HIM.


I AM NOT TALKING ABOUT QUALITY OF FIGHTERS GUYS. I AM TALKING ABOUT THE MARKETING POTENTIAL. FROM A BUSINESS STANDPOINT.

I don't care if you had the BEST 5 guys in every weight class. If they have had no real exposure to a potential new fan base you are fucked. In this case Dana owns pretty much all the video Libraries.


The UFC has building blocks like GSP, Penn, Silva, Mir, Lesnar, JOn Jones, and I could go ON FOR EVER. They also have their fan favs (not that those I mentioned are not favs). They Wandy, Franklin, Alves. Guys who leave it in the ring. These guys also all have decent personalities good or bad that create talk. 

Who does STRIKEFORCE HAVE that is someone who is at the top of the sport and can connect with crowd?

Fedor is the best P4P in the world. Too bad his personality combined with his great choice of translators (if it wasn't his decision he should have made it his). Makes him impossible to care about unless you are a purist (like most here). But the guys wearing $75 Affliction shirts, the silver fist chain and their slut girl beside them are their TO BE ENTERTAINED. To the casual fans it takes more than in ring performance. **** look at Okami, and when Machida started.


Competition with UFC inevitable? Why was that? IF I had a promotion that sold out 10,000-15,000 seat arenas in a state with 30,000,000 people AND TURNED A NICE PROFIT WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO step up? 

Your advertising budget just went from basically just California to all 50 States, Canada, UK. How many more time is that gonna cost? You are now involved with the ******* Russian Mob assholes at M1 who are gonna have things to ask for and cause some problems for you using Fedor as a bargaining chip. Not to mention you went out of your way to get this CBS live show which means shit really (as the product was horrible).


Before the decision to compete with UFC, STRIKEFORCE was making money, had control of their business and small operating costs.

Now they share with M1, CBS, Showtime. HUGE operating costs. They gained Fedor, Hendo. Thats a ******* terrible deal.


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## Zuke (Sep 22, 2006)

Who cares if it was the most watched fight in history? It looked and sounded like crap. So STRIKEFORCE had a bigger stage than UFC has ever had and they shit the bed. They are not going to be able to fix it either.

Do you think CBS and STRIKEFORCE have similar goal?

DO you think STRIKEFORCE and M1 do?

What about showtime?


This is why they should be avoiding these cancer like the plague.


The only way anybody is gonna challenge the UFC is if they have a deep, talented pool of loyal fighters. Like half of the top 10 in each division. They can't be wallflowers either. Hendo, SHields, and Ficth like guys are not gonna draw huge legions of fans to this new company with all these greatt fighters that need to challenged.

STRIKEFORCE NEEDS DEVLOPMENT and RETENTION and STAY small. Slowly build a huge pool of great figthers VERY POLULAR in the biggest state in the USA. Use that reputation to slowly spread into more Nevada, and Southern USA. YOU ARE NOT GONNA SHARE THE SPOTLIGHT USING OR OUT BIDDING UFC FIGHTERS. They need a totally seperate feeder system, along with developental contracts. CRACK DEALERS HAVE NO PROBLEM SELLING CRACK. BUT IT HAS TO BE DIFFERENT OR PEOPLE AINT CHANGIN.

As of now all the competition has been just buying fighters that grew and became popular through hard work of OTHER ORGANIZATIONS. Which are all now Zuffa. Good luck with the promo cutting with no footage. They needed to spend 10 years like UFC/PRIDE did and build their own success.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Its about $$$ and one man's music is another man's noise...I think Fedor is super marketable, he is stoic and destructive. 

Mousasi, King Mo, Nick Diaz are all young and marketable as well IMO. The last few UFC PPVs have been bleh and one of their bigger stars is the 47 year old Couture. Not saying UFC is not better...it is...but Strikeforce is following the Microsoft model...use our stars as you please but share yours as well. UFC goes for exclusivity (Apple did that)...who was more successful at the end?


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## Walker (May 27, 2007)

So basically you are saying that any other organization should just not try anything since the UFC is the end all be all? 

Strikeforce has some great fighters and a contract with CBS so casual and not so casual fans can check some events for free on network TV- that's a bad thing? :confused03:

This isn't EliteXC with Gary "I love to eat 10 hot dogs while making bad business decisions" Shaw running it.

Why get butt-hurt over seeing Strikeforce try to expand using a national network like CBS? To build stars you need exposure and that's what they doing. Relax dude and let them build before hating on it.

Pretty stupid to go after them over the "_points" _you bring up.


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## fightpragmatist (Dec 3, 2009)

Zuke said:


> Your advertising budget just went from basically just California to all 50 States, Canada, UK. How many more time is that gonna cost? You are now involved with the ******* Russian Mob assholes at M1 who are gonna have things to ask for and cause some problems for you using Fedor as a bargaining chip. Not to mention you went out of your way to get this CBS live show which means shit really (as the product was horrible).
> 
> 
> Before the decision to compete with UFC, STRIKEFORCE was making money, had control of their business and small operating costs.
> ...


This seems like a lot of speculation and your own personal opinions on strikeforce. Do you have actual figures for their business in regards to general spending, marketing, and profit etc.?

As far as retarded MMA fans go, I can't really help that man, maybe I could teach a class at a local university or something.


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## Zuke (Sep 22, 2006)

SHould other organization just sit back and accept UFC is King? **** NO!

They needed to keep their spending small and just keep making new fighters. Thats it. Just keep making monsters. Treat them well, pay them competitively. SHow them how you are gonna make them famous. SHow them how you are in it to make $$ and make new stars. You want these guys to be your stars.

They coulda just spent the next 5 years with no competition making great fighters. Then what marketing budget would they have to compete with UFC? ******* NOTHING! The UFC FANS WOULD BE TELLING DANA TO PROVE HIS FIGTHERS ARE STILL THE BEST.

You can not be a major competitor in any pro sport without having a solid, feeder system that is SOLELY FOR YOUR PURPOSE.

STRIKEFORCE should be jumping on talent when they are 16-20 years old. Get these guys in developmental deals. Lock them up in STRIKEFORCE THINKING. You have been the only serious organization that has been with these guys at this point.


Have your young up and coming superstars have to stay fit and on their game not because of some UFC fighter. No you have 5-10 younger, more dedicated guys wanting to be in their place.

BY THE TIME THE UFC FANS REALIZE WHO THEY ARE AND HOW GOOD THEY ARE....They have been with you for a long time.

See how long King Mo, MOusassi etc stick around with the STRIKEFORCE shelling out the big bucks for older guys like Hendo, Shamrock, FEdor. King mo and mousassi are still in it for the love of it. If you dont show them u are gonna make them famous or dedicated to their careers they are gone.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Zuke said:


> SHould other organization just sit back and accept UFC is King? **** NO!
> 
> They needed to keep their spending small and just keep making new fighters. Thats it. Just keep making monsters. Treat them well, pay them competitively. SHow them how you are gonna make them famous. SHow them how you are in it to make $$ and make new stars. You want these guys to be your stars.
> 
> ...



Wow ~ do you know anything about finance and promotion? Fedor is the same age as Brock/Carwin, right? These partnerships help them create favorable and entertaining matches and if they were so low level why would Showtime and CBS sign on? Give them a chance, Dana. UFC does not have a Monopoly and the latest PPV has a main event of Evans vs. T. Silva for $50...really? Come on!


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## Zuke (Sep 22, 2006)

You think MIcrosoft business model is a good one to use for someone who is not the DOMINATING MARKET LEADER? Hey everybody share what you have been doing so I can see your model and then adjust accordingly.

Microsoft are the biggest scumbags in the world. You work hard for what you made, lock that shit up.


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## Walker (May 27, 2007)

This thread is just making me giggle now. :thumb02:


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## Zuke (Sep 22, 2006)

Do I know anything about Finace and Promtion? I have degree in Marketing.

I hear what you are saying and it makes sense.

Who does STRIKEFORCE have ready to fight Fedor that can be attributed to STRIKEFORRCE only and not someone else. Until they are seen as being able to create fights and not just picking off whatever Dana doesnt want is gonna do ALOT FOR their product.


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## UrbanBounca (Sep 13, 2009)

While Fedor is arguably the best fighter in the world, he has the worst personality to follow. Personalities make fighters in America, and unfortunately, unless Fedor learns English, I don't expect much of an American following.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Zuke said:


> You think MIcrosoft business model is a good one to use for someone who is not the DOMINATING MARKET LEADER? Hey everybody share what you have been doing so I can see your model and then adjust accordingly.
> 
> Microsoft are the biggest scumbags in the world. You work hard for what you made, lock that shit up.


No, the pt. was they wanted the software to be used in all PCs...its the razor/razor blade model. Razors are fairly cheap but the blades is where they get you. Share the hardware but patent the software. Strikeforce is sharing the fighters but also getting a shot of booking top competitors from other organizations. Imagine this PPV

Fedor vs. Overeem
Barnett vs. Grim Rogers
Hector Lombard vs. Jake Shields
Gilbert Melendez vs. Aoki
Jacare Souza vs. Nick Diaz
Bobby Lashley vs. Andre Arlovski
Dan Henderson vs. Gegard Mousasi
King Mo vs. Soko

I'd pay $50 for this before paying $50 for Evans vs. Silva.

OK!


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## Zuke (Sep 22, 2006)

If I were Dana I would be even more of a Nazi. I would buy every ******* video library known to man. Sharing is for losers. Nobody makes it to the top of their world by "playing nice and sharing".

Playing nice and sharing is exactly what I would expect someone to ask for who doesnt want to do the leg work themselves.

COme on Dana, you have too much. You should simply give away the marketshare you earned and paid for and just give it to us, your direct competitor. 

"Here at ++++++ we care about just great fights and putting the best fights on regardless of promotion. We want the fans to see what they deserve."

The above is EXACTLY how someone who is getting their asses fed to them would talk. Take a cheap poke to get a rouse. The we care for the fans nonsense. Its the same when Tito mentions the Troops for a cheap Hooray.


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## UrbanBounca (Sep 13, 2009)

Samborules said:


> No, the pt. was they wanted the software to be used in all PCs...its the razor/razor blade model. Razors are fairly cheap but the blades is where they get you. Share the hardware but patent the software. Strikeforce is sharing the fighters but also getting a shot of booking top competitors from other organizations. Imagine this PPV
> 
> Fedor vs. Overeem
> Barnett vs. Grim Rogers
> ...


That's *you*! The average MMA fan doesn't even know Overeem, Lombard, Aoki, Souza, Mousasi, or Soko, much less, spending $50 on the PPV.


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## Zuke (Sep 22, 2006)

That PPV would be ******* great. If I grab 10 random guys at the next UFC PPV and say the following....

" Who is Soko"?

" Who is Aoki?"

" Who is Hector Lombard?"

" Who is Overeem?"

" Who is Jacare?"

" Who is Barnett?"

" Who is Grim?" Oh isnt he the guy that got the shit kicked outta him on CBS.


They have talent. But all is from overseas or UFC. Thus there is little known about them to the average Joe and No footage available on others.


THEY CAN NOT SURVIVE WITHOUT SLICK PROMOS. THEY ARE ESENTIAL FOR HYPE. Any time they talk about the fights its UFC this or that.


Think about it. Until you have several fights with your new fighters you are going to have NO HIGHLIGHTS. How the **** can you get any cred or start some interest without footage. You need at least 5 fights minimum to get enough stuff its not the same shit over and over. By then your broke.


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## Zuke (Sep 22, 2006)

Bottom line:

MORE:::

Tyrone Woodley, King Mo, Chris Cormier, Cung Le, Antonio Silva, Josh Thompson, Melendez, Jacare, Manheof, anybody else that is a FRESH BREATH.


LESS:::

Anything Zuffa has touched. Unless a amazing once of a life time deal. Not guys Dana has no need for. INCLUDING WOMENS MMA. Its a joke anyway. Not that they are not very talented. Just there is about 7 of them.



PS. AND FOR GODS SAKE ALLOW ELBOWS. IF NOT, then bring back knees on ground, stomps, and soccer kicks. It doesnt help that they are advertising a less exciting version.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Zuke said:


> That PPV would be ******* great. If I grab 10 random guys at the next UFC PPV and say the following....
> 
> " Who is Soko"?
> 
> ...


Your definition of avg MMA fan = UFC fan..I disagree


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## fightpragmatist (Dec 3, 2009)

Zuke, honestly at this point I can appreciate your conviction. 

However, I don't think building MMA fighters is really that viable. I mean look at the TUF graduates when they go up against the best of the best, i.e. Forrest vs Anderson Silva, Diego vs BJ Penn, and Rashad vs Machida. 

The best in MMA are physically gifted athletes with the training to match they weren't necessarily built, and your not going to attract the one of a kind athletes to your promotion if your a minor league club.

I'm American and I don't see why other American MMA fans can't appreciate great fighters no matter what country they are from, if that was the point you're trying to make. After all, we are a country of immigrants, I can find tons of things to identify with foreign fighters. Why can't they be marketable as well? Why can't the foreign fighters be introduced to non-hardcore MMA fans through strikeforce?

BTW, is this a troll or is this serious?

EDIT: Oh, and elbows normally lead to cuts, which lead to a fight being stopped for a s****y reason.


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## joshua7789 (Apr 25, 2009)

Samborules said:


> Your definition of avg MMA fan = UFC fan..I disagree


Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but that is pretty much a dead on analysis of what an average mma fan is. There is a reason that Strikeforce cannot afford to do pay per views right now, its because the average mma fan only watches the UFC and is only familiar with fighters from the UFC and is not going to pay fifty bucks to watch a bunch of dudes they have never seen or heard of fight. Strikeforce may get there at some point, but I think its gonna be another year or so of free shows with some big cards on CBS before they can even begin to think about having people pay for there fights, that is of course assuming they want to be able to keep doing business.


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## UrbanBounca (Sep 13, 2009)

fightpragmatist said:


> Zuke, honestly at this point I can appreciate your conviction.
> 
> However, I don't think building MMA fighters is really that viable. I mean look at the TUF graduates when they go up against the best of the best, i.e. Forrest vs Anderson Silva, Diego vs BJ Penn, and Rashad vs Machida.
> 
> ...


We're not debating their skill. We're debating their marketability, and unfortunately for Strikeforce, they don't have much to market right now.


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## fightpragmatist (Dec 3, 2009)

So what numbers are we using to compare fighter marketability just so I know?

Edit: Or are we just assuming that since they aren't well known in the states right now, that nobody is going to like them even if they get to see them fight on the Strikeforce cards?


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## Mjr (Apr 22, 2007)

Zuke said:


> Strikeforce sealed their fate when they decided to go heads up with the UFC. It really makes no sense. Strikeforce had a great business model. They were just basically in California and they were selling out good size arenas, with a small payroll, and marketing expenses (compared to UFC).
> 
> What do they really have other than some fighters who are being overpaid and do not draw crowds. I AM NOT SAYING FEDOR SUCKS. HE AND HENDERSON ARE GREAT. They have some great up and comers such as King Mo, Jacare, Lashley, . Those are the main ones.
> 
> ...


Incredibly stupid post, I was going to break it down but I just re-read it and I won't even bother.

Get your facts right before you post.


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## Zuke (Sep 22, 2006)

** Honestly, some of you guys do not know what good qualities are in marketability, brand awareness, and possible long term employees. You automatically think I am saying they all suck. I KNOW WHY ELBOWS ARE NOT ALLOWED AND THAT THEY STOP WAY MORE FIGHTS DUE TO CUTS. Most idiot MMA fans will look down on that.**


1. What are the most important factors for management in running a successful business? Especially, one that sport and entertainment based? As your employees will be doing lots of extra functions for promotion and growing your business and getting exposure to your market.

- Employees, employee retention 

- Customer service, satisfaction

- Strong reputable brand with value

- Tonnes of promotion 


fightprgmatist:

I agree man. STRIKEFORCE should be a longer time frame. Just like you said the guys that are best of best they mostly TUF grads from years ago. 

Im not talking minor league clubs. I like being the #2 guy in USA. Stick with what they were doing.

Nothing wrong with foreign fighters being introduced in SF. They just can not be the bulk of your employees.


BOTTOM LINE:

The UFC has taken 17 years to get where it is today. They have built many fighters and bought many. But they have put the time in. NOBODY, AND I MEAN NOBODY CAN COMPETE WITH THEM OUT OF THE BLUE. UFC is considered MMA. Like Pampers, KY Jelly, Band Aids, and Tylenol.

If you think they can just buy fighters that have been deemed not wanted by UFC and succeed. You are nuts. I dont care what kind of cross promotion they decide to do with M1 and DREAM. Are these new fans gonna stay up and watch the fights in Tokyo or Moscow? Not to mention they partners with companies in countries that have been labelled as enemies of the USA for the last 45 years.

This is just 3 organizations grasping at straws.

THEY HAVE NO BRAND. BRAND RECOGNITION. TOP-OF-MIND-AWARENESS. They are just doing what the UFC and taking the deals UFC didnt want.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Um...Strikeforce/EXC made Kimbo Slice a household name to where even my wife knows who he is? I am pretty sure they can promote Fedor, Gegard, King Mo, etc... as well they have had one show on CBS...can we give them more than six months prior to judging them to be a colossal failure. If Strikeforce garners a contract with the USA Network lets say...would you consider them a failure then?


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## ZENKI1 (Apr 19, 2009)

Samborules said:


> Um...Strikeforce made Kimbo Slice a household name to where even my wife knows who he is? I am pretty sure they can promote Fedor, Gegard, King Mo, etc... as well they have had one show on CBS...can we give them more than six months prior to judging them to be a colossal failure. If Strikeforce garners a contract with the USA Network lets say...would you consider them a failure then?


You have the orgs mixed up.. Kimbo never fought in SF he fought in ELite. The kicker is Kimbo built himself up on his own through the net with the help of a wonderful porn site.. While ELite jus cashed in on it and brought it to tv for the masses . But yes SF has been around for a while Coker isnt a fool and he will do alright with his fighters. Shit doenst happen over night and as long as it doesnt go to his head and he tries to grow to fast he will be alright.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Keep his Head*

Yeah as long as Coker doesn't do anything overly aggressive like having a head to head show against a UFC event than Strikeforce should do fine!


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

Lol @ the misconception that Fedor is not popular in the states. Everyone at Buffalo Wild Wings knows he is on UFC fightnights and everyone who watches UFC in WNY knows who he is. His NYC workout and signings had lines that wrapped around multiple city blocks and his book is selling great in the states.


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## ZENKI1 (Apr 19, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> Lol @ the misconception that Fedor is not popular in the states. Everyone at Buffalo Wild Wings knows he is on UFC fightnights and everyone who watches UFC in WNY knows who he is. His NYC workout and signings had lines that wrapped around multiple city blocks and his book is selling great in the states.


LOL am I missing something here or did u type error is this some kind of sarcasm? :confused02:


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

ZENKI1 said:


> LOL am I missing something here or did u type error is this some kind of sarcasm? :confused02:


Fedor's popularity is SOOOO underrated here. I think you'd be surprised... maybe we should poll every new member here if they've heard Fedor's name or can recognize his face?


I remember when I was new to MMA, it was about 3 hours of liking it that I first heard of The Last Emperor.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> I remember when I was new to MMA, it was about 3 hours of liking it that I first heard of The Last Emperor.


Yup I experienced the same thing, nearly everybody was talking about this weird guy named Fedor^^ you get to know him very very quickly as a new MMA fan.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

BobbyCooper said:


> Yup I experienced the same thing, nearly everybody was talking about this weird guy named Fedor^^ you get to know him very very quickly as a new MMA fan.




I remember first reading the name and thought it sounded Latino...those were more innocent times.


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## ZENKI1 (Apr 19, 2009)

Ah more memories of Pride FC.


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

BobbyCooper said:


> Yup I experienced the same thing, nearly everybody was talking about this weird guy named Fedor^^ you get to know him very very quickly as a new MMA fan.


Same, I learned about Fedor very soon after watching MMA. It wasn't through tv, it was through more hardcoe fans. Fedor is starting to get his name out there in the US.

NOT TO MENTION that Dana White has done a pretty solid job hyping Fedor for SF anyways. He talked about him so much. Dana White got Fedor's name out there to the US fans whether he knows it or not.


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## G_Land (Aug 11, 2009)

HitOrGetHit said:


> Same, I learned about Fedor very soon after watching MMA. It wasn't through tv, it was through more hardcoe fans. Fedor is starting to get his name out there in the US.
> 
> NOT TO MENTION that Dana White has done a pretty solid job hyping Fedor for SF anyways. He talked about him so much. Dana White got Fedor's name out there to the US fans whether he knows it or not.



Because I think Dana was/is still wanting Fedor to cross over so bad he could taste the money.....And i think he really thought they could come to terms and work it out..


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## h2so4 (Jun 24, 2008)

Zuke said:


> ** Honestly, some of you guys do not know what good qualities are in marketability, brand awareness, and possible long term employees. You automatically think I am saying they all suck. I KNOW WHY ELBOWS ARE NOT ALLOWED AND THAT THEY STOP WAY MORE FIGHTS DUE TO CUTS. Most idiot MMA fans will look down on that.**
> 
> 
> 1. What are the most important factors for management in running a successful business? Especially, one that sport and entertainment based? As your employees will be doing lots of extra functions for promotion and growing your business and getting exposure to your market.
> ...


Wow budd, you need to take your head out of your ass. Are you that afraid that UFC may go under or something. Both UFC and Strikeforce are MMA promotions that market them self around the sport of MMA. The fact that one company has been doing it longer then the other has nothing to with anything. 

Fighters come and go, some good, some bad, and some really great. There is nothing wrong with healthy competition, as it allows the sport and market to grow. The whole monopoly shit is bad for any industry.


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## G_Land (Aug 11, 2009)

I myself like the choice of the different companies...I just recently started paying real attetion to them..before I knew they were there but I kind of turned my nose up to them because I thought they were subpar..Looking back I wish I had a wider view..Better late than never


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## prolyfic (Apr 22, 2007)

1st off I am a big MMA fan but still in the early stages as I got into it around TUF and the whole hype around Chuck and Tito. It might seem like along time ago but Pride was never anything I had heard about or paid attention to, but as time went by and got more into MMA or rather the UFc, I expanded to seeing other fighters fights and watching it where ever and with who ever was showing it. IFL when it was on TV as well as some BODOG fights. 

I say that to say this, the UFC got me into MMA to the point I feel I will watch any MMA event that I can but I will only pay for UFC PPV's unless its a big card, but other than the occasional thing where there was the Affliction PPV and UFC PPV in 1 month I will not pay for another companys PPV, I will probably seek to see it else where or online. So basically I can relate to what Zuke is saying in that I feel I am a hardcore fan but without alot of hardcore knowledge. 

And with that being said I love that SF is building itself up but I too thought the acquiring of Hendo will legetimize them as a contender but does nothing long term to bring in new fans. I think business wise they are trying to capitalize on the whole MMA rise thing and that is why they are being so aggresive but at the same time it may not be the smartest thing in the long run. When you go head to head it is in sense saying there is no room for the both of us and is pretty much a declaration of war and the UFC can't lose that war and they won't. SF needs to play its role even after they get big. Cause as big as the grow the UFC will always be that much better.

Which is why, on a side not, TNA's days are numbered, cause you cant go head to head with a monster.


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## The_Senator (Jun 5, 2008)

I hope "Strikeforce+DREAM+M-1 Global" will overshadow UFC someday. Not because I like them more, but because I like their idea of co-promoting and alliance. UFC is good, but nothing ever changes there, the product is still the same as it's been for the last 5 years - no incredible openings, poor entrances, no tournaments. Besides, it's always better for the fans and fighters if there are at least 2 major MMA organizations.


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

The_Senator said:


> I hope "Strikeforce+DREAM+M-1 Global" will overshadow UFC someday. Not because I like them more, but because I like their idea of co-promoting and alliance. UFC is good, but nothing ever changes there, the product is still the same as it's been for the last 5 years - no incredible openings, poor entrances, no tournaments. Besides, it's always better for the fans and fighters if there are at least 2 major MMA organizations.


That isn't entirely true. The MLB, NHL, NHL, NBA and MLS are all run by thar one organization. Don't get me wrong, I love Strikeforce, I just think that looking back on other sports, one organization has made out just fine. Those sports are extremely popular as well.


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## The_Senator (Jun 5, 2008)

> That isn't entirely true. The MLB, NHL, NHL, NBA and MLS are all run by thar one organization. Don't get me wrong, I love Strikeforce, I just think that looking back on other sports, one organization has made out just fine. Those sports are extremely popular as well.


I'd more than happy if UFC improved those 3 "little flaws" in their product at some point. In that case, I guess, I wouldn't even think about other promotions that much. They can afford it. With PRIDE, for instance, I was more than satisfied, everything was great in every aspect including the best fighters and production.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Strikeforce*

Strikeforce is not the MMA equivalent to the USFL!


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## mattreis324 (Mar 24, 2009)

The flaw in the original post is the assumption that people will have to "leave" the UFC in order to enjoy Strikeforce. What does that even mean, exactly? I am a fan of MMA regardless of which org is promoting it. I'm going to watch the UFC Fight Night on Jan. 11th, and then try to find a friend who has Showtime for the Strikeforce: Miami card on Jan. 30th. I think it will be very rare that Strikeforce and the UFC actually have live cards going up against each other.


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## G_Land (Aug 11, 2009)

True true....but you do have to admit..Stikeforce chose a weird platform with Showtime....notice you said try to find a frind that has it lol i mean come on Strikeforce ....who do you know that will get showtime just for this???....Im with you with wanting to watch it all tho


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

G_Land said:


> True true....but you do have to admit..Stikeforce chose a weird platform with Showtime....notice you said try to find a frind that has it lol i mean come on Strikeforce ....who do you know that will get showtime just for this???....Im with you with wanting to watch it all tho


Yeah Showtime was not a good choice at all don't have it and they would have to have more fights than they do to make it worth buying Showtime.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Showtime*

Yeah I know a friend who has Showtime for other reasons and watches the fights because they are on!


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## G_Land (Aug 11, 2009)

HitOrGetHit said:


> Yeah Showtime was not a good choice at all don't have it and they would have to have more fights than they do to make it worth buying Showtime.



Yup yup I think it was both Showtime trying to jump on the Mma train and Stikeforce getting an offer from a company and got excited..Mix those two together and what do we get???? Poop lol


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

kantowrestler said:


> Yeah I know a friend who has Showtime for other reasons and watches the fights because they are on!


Other reasons huh? :sarcastic12:


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

G_Land said:


> True true....but you do have to admit..Stikeforce chose a weird platform with Showtime....notice you said try to find a frind that has it lol i mean come on Strikeforce ....who do you know that will get showtime just for this???....Im with you with wanting to watch it all tho


Seriously. That was just stupid. Who's going to get one pay channel when you have to get a bunch along with it that you don't want, just to see a fight now and then?


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## Cptmats (Dec 27, 2009)

swpthleg said:


> Seriously. That was just stupid. Who's going to get one pay channel when you have to get a bunch along with it that you don't want, just to see a fight now and then?


stupid ? There is usually one ufc per month somtimes two ! at $50 each, i pay a shit load of money for UFC's and my Showtime package cost me about $8 a month ! I Gladley added show time for Strikeforce. As far as one or the other, thats bullshit too! who cares who puts on the show, i watch any mma i can find And as far as UFC being the king Pride was a way better organisation with better fighters ! There is alot of room for new organisations. Mma fans are just hungry for Fights period, were like crack head that way.....we dont care whos got it we just want it!


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## joshua7789 (Apr 25, 2009)

Cptmats said:


> stupid ? There is usually one ufc per month somtimes two ! at $50 each, i pay a shit load of money for UFC's and my Showtime package cost me about $8 a month ! I Gladley added show time for Strikeforce. As far as one or the other, thats bullshit too! who cares who puts on the show, i watch any mma i can find And as far as UFC being the king Pride was a way better organisation with better fighters ! There is alot of room for new organisations. Mma fans are just hungry for Fights period, were like crack head that way.....we dont care whos got it we just want it!


Pride had some good fighters, but lets not pretend that they didnt also have a shit load of cans and put on a lot of freak show fights.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

If you have a decent cable company that lets you add ONE channel, I can see it, but our makes you buy packages of a bunch of channels.


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## G_Land (Aug 11, 2009)

Crappy deal Swp Ive tried and all they would say was "sorry sir we dont do that" But we can sign you up with our special package we have going on!!! Ummm no lol


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Special Package*

Let me guess, they want you to buy Showtime with HBO and a few other channels instead of Showtime by itself?


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## Cptmats (Dec 27, 2009)

G_Land said:


> Crappy deal Swp Ive tried and all they would say was "sorry sir we dont do that" But we can sign you up with our special package we have going on!!! Ummm no lol


so you would rather pay $50 dollars each for individual events than $8-$12 a month for a movie package ? I pay $50-$100 per month for UFC's, My showtime package is $8 per month !


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Strikeforce Events*

The pay-per-view Strikeforce events online are $25 bucks, not $45! Plus if you don't want to buy the UFC pay-per-views, go to a sports bar and watch them for $20 at most with food and drinks included!


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

Not everyone lives in an area where bars show the PPVs.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Bar Area*

Well you could have friends come over and pitch in!


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## Cptmats (Dec 27, 2009)

swpthleg said:


> Not everyone lives in an area where bars show the PPVs.


closest one is an hour from me, and im a single father as well so going to a bar to watch a fight isnt exactly an option for me. Im stuck with $50 ufc ppv's and strike force on my $8 showtime package !


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Single Father*

Well why didn't you mention that in the first place?


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## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

When I open my first bar, it will have every UFC main event and Fight Night on the tele - it just does not happen in the UK (that I'm aware of). It definately makes for better pub conversation than football and rugby.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*MMA Pub*

Great, go for it!


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