# Lyoto Machida wants the light heavyweight title back within the next ten months



## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

At UFC 113, Lyoto Machida saw his light heavyweight title and unbeaten record disappear when Mauricio “Shogun” Rua knocked him out. And now he has made regaining the belt is new dream.

Back in Belém, the city of his birth, the Karate fighter spoke to for the first time after his loss to Tatame Magazine:

“My plans are to dispute this belt in a year or less, like 10 months. To regain the belt is my dream. I don’t matter who has it, I want to have the opportunity to fight for the belt, if it’s Shogun I’m ok, I’ll enjoy the win”.

The loss is a devastating blow to Machida who for a while seemed unbeatable, but he still found time to praise his opponent.

“It’s a complicated moment for me, I’m trying to understand what I did wrong, but on the other side it’s great having the support of my fans”.

“I was well trained, focused, even because our last fight was really controversial. I wanted to end this fight, I was feeling fast, but a fight is a fight, you can’t say much before it happens. Sometimes you are winning it, but the guy hits you and you lose. I think I was winning this fight, despite his aggressiveness”.

“I give Shogun all credits for his win, he deserved it and is the new champion, but that not the end of the story, life goes on”.

And on that punch that knocked him out cold:

“That punch really got me and, on this division, is really hard to get a punch like that. When it gets you, it’s really hard”

Machida will have to wait some time until that dream becomes a reality and is likely to be taking some time off anyway. He’ll be back eventually with the possibility of taking on the loser of “Rampage” Jackson and Rashad Evans.


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## morninglightmt (Sep 7, 2008)

or maybe Machida vs Bader. he has a thing for beating guys who are previously unbeaten


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## vilify (Mar 23, 2010)

Machida sounds like a good guy but im still glad he got KO'd.

I look forward to seeing him fight in the future and hopefully his fans have been humbled enough by the merciless beatdown he received.

thanks for posting.


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## ptw (Aug 13, 2009)

All truth from Machida, and yes, he was winning that fight til he got clipped. 

Shogun won the fight, all that really matters, but he didn't blow Machida out of the water like dumbass people on this forum are acting like. Same reason I'd like to see velasquez v nog II, Mir v Carwin II...and many other matches.


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## vilify (Mar 23, 2010)

he wont be getting the belt back in 10 months. i know that much


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

He wont have the title back within the next 10 months, Rashad/Rampage havent even fought and they are the next in line, and by the time one of thos faces shogun... it'll be a year and a half before Machida gets his next title shot.


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## vilify (Mar 23, 2010)

thats if machida even wins his next fight.


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## 6toes (Sep 9, 2007)

Good to finally hear from him after the loss. 10 months sounds really unrealistic to me simply because of the scheduling the UFC and fighters would have to go through to make that a reality. Honestly, if Shogun is still holding the belt when Machida get's his next shot I think he's going home empty handed.

Not really a bad thing though, Shogun taking the belt has really opened up a lot of interesting matches at LHW for both Shogun and Machida. I'd love to see Machida take on Rampage after Rashad puts him down at 114 :thumb02:. And should Rampage actually defeat Rashad that leaves us with Rampage-Shogun II and Evans-Machida II. Mmmm...


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## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

His time line is realistic, by the time shogun fights rampage he would be ready for his return. Say they fight in November. Depending who he beats he could be next in line after his return fight. So by March 2011 the Dragon should be champion again. However defeating shogun will be a difficult task.


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## chilo (May 27, 2007)

ptw said:


> All truth from Machida, and yes, he was winning that fight til he got clipped.
> 
> Shogun won the fight, all that really matters, but he didn't blow Machida out of the water like dumbass people on this forum are acting like. Same reason I'd like to see velasquez v nog II, Mir v Carwin II...and many other matches.


 It doesn't matter if he was "winning the fight," it didn't even go past the 1st round. So its kinda hard to say he was "winning the fight", more like he was winning the round. And considering how he was starting to breath after those first two take downs, i don't think he would of gotten out of the second if it went that far.


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## leifdawg (Jan 1, 2008)

Have you ever watched a Machida fight, he is always breathing out of his mouth.


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## Couchwarrior (Jul 13, 2007)

Good, he seems to have the right attitude after his loss so there's a good chance he'll come back even better than before. 

But if Evans loses to Jackson, he should fight somebody else next, because after the way Machida tooled Evans the first time I'm not excited at all about a rematch.

Jon Jones could be a possible next opponent if he gets out of his next fight without any suspensions. Or they could scrap the Matyushenko fight all together, it doesn't make much sense anyway.


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## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

> His time line is realistic, by the time shogun fights rampage he would be ready for his return. Say they fight in November. Depending who he beats he could be next in line after his return fight. So by March 2011 the Dragon should be champion again. However defeating shogun will be a difficult task.


His timeline is very unrealistic, 

- he's got 60 days (2 months) medical suspension
- Rampage and Evans need to fight
- then the winner needs to fight Shogun
- then the titleholder from that fight will probably fight the loser of Rampage vs Rashad if that person won their fight proceeding the loss to Page/Rashad

That is at least 1 year, all the while Jon Jones will probably be blasting his way to title contention, and Machida won't get another title shot after just 1 fight. Shouldn't do anyway.

Considering who the current Champ is, and the current pool of many tough contenders waiting their turn, I can't see Machida in a title fight for at least 18 months. UFC fighters tend to fight once every 4 months minimum.

Yes glad to see Machida has come out of this positively, still can't help but worry that too many guys in his division maybe hit too hard for him.


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

ptw said:


> All truth from Machida, and yes, he was winning that fight til he got clipped.
> 
> Shogun won the fight, all that really matters, but he didn't blow Machida out of the water like dumbass people on this forum are acting like. Same reason I'd like to see velasquez v nog II, Mir v Carwin II...and many other matches.


Yeah because Velasquez just got lucky, he didn't look too much for Nog in the standup at all. If he didn't KO Nog with a beautiful combo, Nog would have outboxed him...

No. Valesquez went in, outstruck Nog and finished him early as a result.


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## Poland (Dec 31, 2006)

Couchwarrior said:


> Good, he seems to have the right attitude after his loss so there's a good chance he'll come back even better than before.
> 
> But if Evans loses to Jackson, he should fight somebody else next, because after the way Machida tooled Evans the first time I'm not excited at all about a rematch.
> 
> Jon Jones could be a possible next opponent if he gets out of his next fight without any suspensions. Or they could scrap the Matyushenko fight all together, it doesn't make much sense anyway.


I pretty much agree with all this. I don't know how much Machida will change, but I did have him ahead in the round (takedowns and one good connect - I think it was the first exchange when he slipped Shogun's strike and hit Rua with the counter) till he got knocked out.. I'm also not wild about a rematch with Rashad right now. Rampage, or Jon Jones, I'd love to see either fight Machida.


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## Woodenhead (Jan 5, 2010)

ptw said:


> All truth from Machida, and yes, he was winning that fight til he got clipped.
> 
> Shogun won the fight, all that really matters, but he didn't blow Machida out of the water like dumbass people on this forum are acting like. Same reason I'd like to see velasquez v nog II, Mir v Carwin II...and many other matches.


I don't normally make posts like this, but... it's crap like this that gets me annoyed at fanboys. Your guy lost, period. Quit trying to play it down yadda yadda yadda - man up, admit it, & get over it. Machida has.


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

If he's mentally tough still he can literally take out the entire LHW division. I see Shogun and Lyoto as one and two respectively unless Spidey comes into the picture.

Contenders
Rampage
Jon Jones
Lil Nog


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## Diokhan (Jul 8, 2008)

Highly unlikely. Shogun will fight winner of Rashad/Rampage next and after that its most likely Randy or rematch with Forrest.
I suppose around year - 15 months is realistic though IF Machida fights for example Li'l Nog next and Forrest/Randy lose or get injured. Either Way Machida needs 1-2 wins before his next shot and I don't see that happening within 10 months unless Dana allows him to skip couple more deserving contenders on the line.


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## Guy Incognito (Apr 3, 2010)

he will not get that belt back, shogun will kill him again or lil nog will, he's boxing will be too good for machida as he doesn't hit hard enough and lil nog will counter and destroy him


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## Guy Incognito (Apr 3, 2010)

Hiro said:


> Yeah because Velasquez just got lucky, he didn't look too much for Nog in the standup at all. If he didn't KO Nog with a beautiful combo, Nog would have outboxed him...
> 
> No. Valesquez went in, outstruck Nog and finished him early as a result.


cains win was great no excuse but he didn't prove anything as they never grappelled.


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## ptw (Aug 13, 2009)

Woodenhead said:


> I don't normally make posts like this, but... it's crap like this that gets me annoyed at fanboys. Your guy lost, period. Quit trying to play it down yadda yadda yadda - man up, admit it, & get over it. Machida has.


I'm not a Machida fan, bighead. I was rooting for Shogun that fight, but morons like yourself keep saying stuff like, "Machida was exposed that fight, he got destroyed, he totally got wrecked." Machida said it himself, he got clipped, simple as that, it happens, especially with high caliber fighters in the ring. 

Shogun got a nice hit on Machida and it ended the fight, no one was winning til then...I want to see a rematch after Rua defends the belt. Can you at least agree with that? That a rubber match needs to happen?


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## Xerxes (Aug 14, 2008)

Machida wont get it back until Shogun has it. Just an awful match up for him.


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## rushStPierre (Nov 22, 2009)

wow machida, congrats to you and all your fans. you were winning the fight with more than a minute left in the first round and if he didnt "clip" you , you woulda surely won the fight on the scorecards.

:confused02:

whatever helps you guys sleep at night i guess. shogun and his trainers have said many times since that he was baiting machida into thinking he was sticking with the leg kicks then pouncing. your boy got ANNIALATED(sp) , deal with it.


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

ptw said:


> All truth from Machida, and yes, he was winning that fight til he got clipped.
> 
> Shogun won the fight, all that really matters, but he didn't blow Machida out of the water like dumbass people on this forum are acting like. Same reason I'd like to see velasquez v nog II, Mir v Carwin II...and many other matches.


Getting KO'ed in 1 round is getting blown out the water. 

What part of KTFO dont you get???


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## FrodoFraggins (Oct 25, 2009)

I think he's getting way ahead of himself. His sole focus should be to analyze the fight and the previous one, determine his biggest weaknesses and address them.

Then he should simply worry about his next opponent. The title shot will come eventually but he has to earn it over several other LHW fighters.


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

Hate to pop the bubble, but its not gonne be ten months Machida...sorry. He was doing really surprisingly well for how awkward and unusually aggressive he appeared to be performing. I guess 18-24 months before machida gets another shot at the title. 

As for fighting the loser of Rampage vs Evans. We've all seen how it plays out wen he fights Evans. I'm curious to see how he would perform against Rampage, or rather, how long Rampage fights before he gets sung a lullaby or gets frustrated and has a fit like Tito Ortiz.


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

ptw said:


> All truth from Machida, and yes, he was winning that fight til he got clipped.
> 
> Shogun won the fight, all that really matters, but he didn't blow Machida out of the water like dumbass people on this forum are acting like. Same reason I'd like to see velasquez v nog II, Mir v Carwin II...and many other matches.


lol, dumbass people. There are two kinds of fight fans

a: nuthuggers who cling to any word their boy says and hate anyone that has one bad thing to say about them, as if they are a perfect human being

b: fight fans who see fights objectively purely because they enjoy watching fights and not personalities

anyone in camp b knows Machida got his ass handed to him, I am a through and through Machida fan and I will watch every fight of his until he retires, but he got his ass handed to him and arguing against is pure 100% nuthuggery, watch the fight more closely. You don't get hammered by punches and kicks that give you a bloody nose then get knocked out and not call that an ass kicking.


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## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

I'm a machida fan i know he got Knock the f out but question did Matt Serra kO gsp or did he get cliped? Coming into this fight I wanted machida to win 100% but people who are on his nuts fail to realize as great as he is so is shogun. Shogun is just as great as him and can beat him. What I think most Machida fans underestimate shogun's performance. 

However I don't see anyone at LW beating Machida with the exception of shogun.


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## Nikkolai (Jan 7, 2008)

rabakill said:


> lol, dumbass people. There are two kinds of fight fans
> 
> a: nuthuggers who cling to any word their boy says and hate anyone that has one bad thing to say about them, as if they are a perfect human being
> 
> ...


Well said. Camp A keeps bringing up the two take downs (which resulted into nothing) and forget to neglect that his nose was busted.


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## TraMaI (Dec 10, 2007)

vilify said:


> Machida sounds like a good guy but im still glad he got KO'd.
> 
> I look forward to seeing him fight in the future and hopefully his fans have been humbled enough by the merciless beatdown he received.
> 
> thanks for posting.


Sounds to me like the other fans need a bit of humbling, too. I'd hardly call that a beatdown. That fight was Machida winning until he got caught and Shogun jumped on him. 3 punches does not a beatdown make, sir.

Anderson Silva/Griffin, not THAT is a damn beat down.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

TraMaI said:


> Sounds to me like the other fans need a bit of humbling, too. I'd hardly call that a beatdown. That fight was Machida winning until he got caught and Shogun jumped on him. 3 punches does not a beatdown make, sir.
> 
> Anderson Silva/Griffin, not THAT is a damn beat down.


Thanks for reminding me


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## streetpunk08 (Jul 15, 2006)

The Forrest-Anderson fight was the worst loss I've ever seen. As far as Machida winning the round, on the scorecards he probably was since North American judges love takedowns but it wasn't a dominating or one sided round for either guy it was close, the thing that stands out is that little tiny knock out, it wasnt like the fight went 3-4 rounds and Machida was winning all of them. Lyoto seems to be taking this the right way and he is saying all the right things. Due to UFC scheduling I dont think it will be as short as 10 months for him to get a title shot.


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## Bknmax (Mar 16, 2008)

http://www.grapheine.com/bombaytv/movie-uk-26df3b81a6443ba670ce8ef2e3f067a1.html


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

SM33 said:


> His timeline is very unrealistic,
> 
> - he's got 60 days (2 months) medical suspension
> - Rampage and Evans need to fight
> ...


Well if were basing this off your logic, then Machida should fight for the belt after three fights, which is how many Quinton will have had if he faces Shogun after Rashad(assuming he beats Rashad) my question is why after a yr off does he just get a title shot, hell Machida could win 2 fights and people are gonna talk rematch....especially if he does it in convincing fashion....which guys hit too hard for Machida, most of them cant land until Shogun entered the building!!! LOL, its hard not to defend a guy that has 1 loss and prior to meeting Shogun ran through the division in the UFC and was averaging getting hit 1 time every 2.5 rd's....these were three rd fights he also never had lost a round but now too many people hit hard....c'mon!!!





Woodenhead said:


> I don't normally make posts like this, but... it's crap like this that gets me annoyed at fanboys. Your guy lost, period. Quit trying to play it down yadda yadda yadda - man up, admit it, & get over it. Machida has.


 
I have given Shogun all the respect and his fans their respect and if you read the above post that might answer your question, things still need to be kept in perspective, I fully know he lost but many people have posted he was winning the rd till then, NO one is disputing he got KTFO....


ptw said:


> I'm not a Machida fan, bighead. I was rooting for Shogun that fight, but morons like yourself keep saying stuff like, "Machida was exposed that fight, he got destroyed, he totally got wrecked." Machida said it himself, he got clipped, simple as that, it happens, especially with high caliber fighters in the ring.
> 
> Shogun got a nice hit on Machida and it ended the fight, no one was winning til then...I want to see a rematch after Rua defends the belt. Can you at least agree with that? That a rubber match needs to happen?


 
^^^THIS^^^



rushStPierre said:


> wow machida, congrats to you and all your fans. you were winning the fight with more than a minute left in the first round and if he didnt "clip" you , you woulda surely won the fight on the scorecards.
> 
> :confused02:
> 
> whatever helps you guys sleep at night i guess. shogun and his trainers have said many times since that he was baiting machida into thinking he was sticking with the leg kicks then pouncing. your boy got ANNIALATED(sp) , deal with it.


 
No one that I can see is denying he got beat dude they are breaking down the fine details of the fight and also talking about possible match ups in the future....see above...



rabakill said:


> lol, dumbass people. There are two kinds of fight fans
> 
> a: nuthuggers who cling to any word their boy says and hate anyone that has one bad thing to say about them, as if they are a perfect human being
> 
> ...


I think we all have established he got his ass kicked the question at this pint seems better to ask, what is he going to do about it and who is he going to face next???



TraMaI said:


> Sounds to me like the other fans need a bit of humbling, too. I'd hardly call that a beatdown. That fight was Machida winning until he got caught and Shogun jumped on him. 3 punches does not a beatdown make, sir.
> 
> Anderson Silva/Griffin, not THAT is a damn beat down.


 
This is an accurate statement if were getting all particular on the details of the first rd and i agree with this, i also seem to need to once again give props to those that picked Shogun in the fight you were correct and Shogun def straight up took that belt, with class i might add cuz he could have mashed Lyoto's faced prob three or four more times, I just think people need to keep the skills that Machida has in mind and remember what got him where he is and how fast he got there....:thumb02:


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## Icculus (Oct 4, 2009)

rabakill said:


> lol, dumbass people. There are two kinds of fight fans
> 
> a: nuthuggers who cling to any word their boy says and hate anyone that has one bad thing to say about them, as if they are a perfect human being
> 
> ...


What fighter who has been constantly fighting top competition hasnt been KTFO or otherwise badly beaten in their career? Like Machida says in the interbiew, all those guys hit so hard and anyone can get caught on the temple.

Its not like he was outclassed. He would have to continue to improve his style but its not like it was Penn vs Sanchez, where Penn would win 100/100 times.

Go Team B!


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

Icculus said:


> What fighter who has been constantly fighting top competition hasnt been KTFO or otherwise badly beaten in their career? Like Machida says in the interbiew, all those guys hit so hard and anyone can get caught on the temple.
> 
> Its not like he was outclassed. He would have to continue to improve his style but its not like it was Penn vs Sanchez, where Penn would win 100/100 times.
> 
> Go Team B!



Honestly I can only really answer sort of Anderson Silva. I don't know who else has faced top competition consistently and never been beaten badly. But you bring up a good point, something that does not get mentioned here very much, Machida the LHW champ who was undefeated got knocked out. That's a pretty significant event in mma history, Machida could have been the guy to fight the best consistently and remain undefeated, no one has done it yet. Really, the only guy who has a chance now is Shane Carwin. And I don't mention Fedor because he is not fighting nor has he really ever at all fought guys consistently in the top 5 HW rankings consistently, he fights a lot of guys who really never stand a chance at beating anyone in the top 5 HW so how that could possibly rank his as #1 is beyond me.


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## ptw (Aug 13, 2009)

rabakill said:


> Honestly I can only really answer sort of Fedor and sort of Anderson Silva. I don't know who else has faced top competition consistently and never been beaten badly. But you bring up a good point, something that does not get mentioned here very much, Machida the LHW champ who was undefeated got knocked out. That's a pretty significant event in mma history, Machida could have been the guy to fight the best consistently and remain undefeated, no one has done it yet. Really, the only guy who has a chance now is Shane Carwin. And I don't mention Fedor because he is not fighting nor has he really ever at all fought guys consistently in the top 5 HW rankings consistently, he fights a lot of guys who really never stand a chance at beating anyone in the top 5 HW so how that could possibly rank his as #1 is beyond me.


Nah, **** that, Shane carwin to get KO'ed by Brock via F5!


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## Guy Incognito (Apr 3, 2010)

machida never got clipped or caught he got countered and KTFO, getting clipped or caught is when someone is just swinging wildly and one lands


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## astrallite (Mar 14, 2010)

Machida's style is puzzling to everyone, but there's no way he was going to go undefeated given his physical tools. Eventually he was going to face John Jones and lose.

The biggest weakness I see in Machida is his wingspan. He has a 74 inch reach. As Rogan calls it, Machida fights like a fencer. Unfortunately, he doesn't have great length, and fencing requires a long sword. Jon Jones has an 85 inch reach. 

Shogun's strategy would have basically been impossible if Machida had the physical tools to go along with his style. Because Machida has such a limited reach, he will get out-pointed by kicks if he keeps running away. So he *has* to counter (by landing simultaneously with Shogun's kicks) which leaves him exposed to an overhand right. If he was built like Jon Jones, he'd land the counter and Shogun wouldn't even be able to connect that overhand right.

If anything, I've always been _baffled_ that Machida had been undefeated for so long. A striker who is not known for his power, and also has short arms. If Jon Jones ever becomes a good striker, he could foreseeably go "undefeated" given his incredible wrestling, athleticism, and length. 

Jon Jones is basically the Lebron James of MMA. If he ever puts it together, he's gonna be steamrolling his way through the division.


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

guy incognito said:


> machida never got clipped or caught he got countered and KTFO, getting clipped or caught is when someone is just swinging wildly and one lands


That isn't true, you can get caught if you make a mistake. It doesn't only happen when the other fighter randomly lands a blind punch. Lyoto made a mistake and Shogun caught him. The counter punch did not KO him either, Lyoto was aware of what was happening and that is why he attempted to prevent Shogun from posturing up.



streetpunk08 said:


> The Forrest-Anderson fight was the worst loss I've ever seen. As far as Machida winning the round, on the scorecards he probably was since North American judges love takedowns but it wasn't a dominating or one sided round for either guy it was close, the thing that stands out is that little tiny knock out, it wasnt like the fight went 3-4 rounds and Machida was winning all of them. Lyoto seems to be taking this the right way and he is saying all the right things. Due to UFC scheduling I dont think it will be as short as 10 months for him to get a title shot.


I am interested to see if Lyoto reacts negatively if he gets a fight against someone else instead of Shogun seeing that Shogun got an immediate rematch. I know the circumstances were entirely different, but I think an argument can be made for Lyoto.


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## Machida Karate (Nov 30, 2009)

Good to hear from Lyoto, and i was proud of how badly he kicked Shoguns ass until the KO. Good night for the Shogun! That was a freaky night! When i saw how aggressive Machida was i knew that it was going to be a short night for someone.... It sucks to see him with a scar on his record, but at least this will take some pressure off of Machida....

And looking forward to seeing who he will Destroy next! I just hope Shogun is even able to keep the belt long enough for Machida to take it back from him...


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## DrunkInsomniac (May 6, 2010)

And its very possible. No matter what, Machida is a top fighter, and can fight just about anyone and win. 

I would like to see him face either Rampage or Lil Nog in the future.


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## DrunkInsomniac (May 6, 2010)

Machida Karate said:


> Good to hear from Lyoto, and i was proud of how badly he kicked Shoguns ass until the KO.


I don't think he was really beating him bad at any point in the fight...

Though, I haven't watched the fight since the night of.


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## Woodenhead (Jan 5, 2010)

ptw said:


> All truth from *Machida*, and yes, *he was winning that fight til he got clipped.*





ptw said:


> Shogun got a nice hit on Machida and it ended the fight, *no one was winning til then*...


???

I swear, if Fedor ever loses I won't be nearly this defensive.

(coldcall: I never had you in mind when I made my initial post; i don't know why you felt you had to attempt to counterpoint me earlier. i respect u & Machida)


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## ptw (Aug 13, 2009)

Machida was likely winning the round by points, but no one was winning the fight since they were even in terms of damage and whatnot...til the ko obviously. Dunno why I even have to clarify that for you, you're missing the point if all your looking for is irrelevant contradictions, grow up please.


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## Hammerlock2.0 (Jun 17, 2009)

Sorry guys, but I'm sick and tired of this whole "Machida won the round until he got knocked out" stuff. Yes, Machida was arguably winning on points but a round goes 5 minutes. I understand that people want to defend Machida because some things that are said are just ridiculous (like Machida suddenly being obsolete after his first big loss), but it's really annoying to hear everyone (even reasonable members) say that Machida was winning until he got caught. If your favorite team is leading on points and there's only 5 seconds to go and the other team scores, it doesn't matter that your team was winning for 95% of the match. Fact is Machida got knocked out cold in the first round - no more, no less. Anyone who thinks he's done because he lost to one of the best LHWs on the planet as proclaimed 5 years ago before all the injuries and surgeries is ignorant and not worth a discussion in my opinion. If you haven't lost you just haven't faced good enough competition yet. In 99% of the cases this is true.


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## MikeHawk (Sep 11, 2009)

^Agreed. It's basically like saying. "Machida would've won that round if he didn't get punched so hard and went to sleep". There's absolutely no point in saying Machida was winning the round. It was pretty damn even anyway and if you can't acknowledge that, then you're just a delusional Machida fan.


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## Danm2501 (Jun 22, 2009)

Machida Karate said:


> Good to hear from Lyoto, and i was proud of how badly he kicked Shoguns ass until the KO. Good night for the Shogun! That was a freaky night! When i saw how aggressive Machida was i knew that it was going to be a short night for someone.... It sucks to see him with a scar on his record, but at least this will take some pressure off of Machida....


Were you watching the same fight as me? Machida basically landed nothing in the whole fight bar 1 decent left jab and the knee to the body just prior to getting KTFO. The takedowns were impressive, but he did sod all on the ground, and certainly wasn't kicking Shogun's ass. The takedowns appeared to come from necessity at getting beat on the feet AFAIC. If the round had lasted the full 5 it's likely that Machida would have won it, but it didn't. He got beat on the feet and then KTFO. People need to stop going on about it, Machida didn't win the round. He got beat on the feet bar 2 shots, and then KTFO. Arlovski was beating Fedor before getting knocked out, yet you don't see the Arlovski fans still harping on about it. It's getting quite dull tbh.

I think Machida's just banking on Rashad beating Rampage, and then beating Shogun before he gets a shot. I see no way for Lyoto to beat Shogun. Shogun no longer fears Machida on the feet, and swept Machida from the bottom with ease, meaning Machida couldn't win the fight on the ground either. Lyoto's only hope of getting the title back is if Rashad manages to somehow pull out back to back wins against Rampage and Shogun, which I personally think is unlikely.


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

No source?


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## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

> which guys hit too hard for Machida, most of them cant land until Shogun entered the building!!! LOL, its hard not to defend a guy that has 1 loss and prior to meeting Shogun ran through the division in the UFC and was averaging getting hit 1 time every 2.5 rd's....these were three rd fights he also never had lost a round but now too many people hit hard....c'mon!!!


Yes I know that, I think Machida will still be pretty dominant. 

You can't deny that there are several LHW's who probably hit a lot harder than Machida, and now they have a much better idea of how to get at him.

Machida will still be elusive, but now that Shogun has "entered the building" as you say, I think he's gonna have to get even better at being elusive. Rampage, for example, hasn't fought Machida yet, but he is very hard to knock out AND hits very hard, just like Shogun. So after seeing Shogun walk through Lyoto's strikes and KO him, Rampage will be quite confident he can do the same = not good for Machida.

As I said, Machida will still be dominant, but I really can't see him returning to his 'hit once every 2.5 rounds' type of dominance.


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## Mr. Sparkle (Nov 3, 2009)

Hammerlock2.0 said:


> Sorry guys, but I'm sick and tired of this whole "Machida won the round until he got knocked out" stuff.


I think the point a that some are trying to make is that it was not the purported beat-down being suggested. Yes, Machida lost. Yes, he got knocked out. But, up to that point he was not being beaten from pole to pole. The fight was very even and I had him ahead until that the knock out. I think the comments that Shogun will beat him every time are inane. As are the suggestions that Rua figured him out and destroyed him. The fight changed on one punch, which can and does happen. Rua was not negating everything that Machida was doing and stymieing him at every turn, say the way Machida handled Tito. I have no problem with Rua being champ, but man, some of the comments on here make me wonder if people only saw the knock out. I realize some people here don't like Machida fans, but damn, some of the Rua fans are not really coming off any better.


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## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

I reckon Shogun was 99% sure that he'd finish the fight within the first round, so in that sense it was a beatdown.

Shogun has 19 wins on his record, 15 of them ended in the first round.


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## Mr. Sparkle (Nov 3, 2009)

SM33 said:


> I reckon Shogun was 99% sure that he'd finish the fight within the first round, so in that sense it was a beatdown.
> 
> Shogun has 19 wins on his record, 15 of them ended in the first round.


Your post is complete conjecture.


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## Rusko (Feb 4, 2010)

Machida Karate said:


> Good to hear from Lyoto, and i was proud of how badly he kicked Shoguns ass until the KO.


Yeah right, right, right ! u r the man


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## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

> Your post is complete conjecture.


People bothering to talk about whether Lyoto was winning on points or not is complete conjecture, cus it never went past the first round.

I suppose what I meant was, people tend to forget about Shogun's tendancy for 1st round finishes.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

I don't know why you guys still debate this topic..:confused05:

Machida imo won the first fight and the second fight!!! And if you can't acknowledge that, then you're just a delusional Shogun fan. :sarcastic12:

War Machida! You are the greatest human on this planet!!!

won't reply to your respond for this post.


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

BobbyCooper said:


> I don't know why you guys still debate this topic..:confused05:
> 
> Machida imo won the first fight and the second fight!!! And if you can't acknowledge that, then you're just a delusional Shogun fan. :sarcastic12:
> 
> ...


It's so obvious too, I don't know why people are saying anything, Lyoto just slipped and there was a bad stoppage......Machida should get an instant rematch.


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## Machida Karate (Nov 30, 2009)

Hammerlock2.0 said:


> If your favorite team is leading on points and there's only 5 seconds to go and the other team scores, it doesn't matter that your team was winning for 95% of the match. Fact is Machida got knocked out cold in the first round - no more, no less.



Am i trying to say Machida won that round? Obviously not... I was obviously saying that i was proud of how he was winning by points until he got knocked out.... Does that matter?! Obviously not when your knocked the F out.... But can i be proud of the fact that he was winning until then... YES....

This is clearly my opinion and for you guys to get like offensive because i lay my opinion, is pretty sad.... :sarcastic12::sarcastic12:





Danm2501 said:


> People need to stop going on about it, Machida didn't win the round. He got beat on the feet bar 2 shots, and then KTFO.


Yeah im going to not state my opinion because Kids like u get whinny when i tell the facts, that im Proud of how Machida was winning by points until he got hit. LOL


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## TraMaI (Dec 10, 2007)

streetpunk08 said:


> The Forrest-Anderson fight was the worst loss I've ever seen. As far as Machida winning the round, on the scorecards he probably was since North American judges love takedowns but it wasn't a dominating or one sided round for either guy it was close, the thing that stands out is that little tiny knock out, it wasnt like the fight went 3-4 rounds and Machida was winning all of them. Lyoto seems to be taking this the right way and he is saying all the right things. Due to UFC scheduling I dont think it will be as short as 10 months for him to get a title shot.


The round being close only reinforces the fact that it wasn't a "beatdown" like he said. Like I said, when I think "Beatdown" I think of Forrest/Anderson, BJ/Diego, etc. A really one sided fight, that fight was anything but one sided (in either of their favor) and was going the way of Machida until he was caught.

Note to Guy Incognito: Getting caught is making a mistake and getting dropped, which happened to Lyoto. In no way was I trying to say the punch Shogun landed was a fluke but Lyoto made a mistake, too, that helped it KO him. Had Lyoto not been trying to throw a strike I don't believe that punch would've rocked him. Props to Shogun for the timing, though, for sure.



*EDIT: I want to say something here. The reason that "Lyoto was winning the round before he got KO'd" even came up is because some smart ass said the fight was a beatdown, which it very obviously was NOT. I was using the point to convey that it wasn't, not because I'm trying to take away from Shogun's win. I'm HAPPY we get to see Shogun as champ and I fully think he deserves that belt and he worked damn hard to get to it, plus, we get a rubber match! Anyways, me (and probably most of the other people saying it in here) saying that Machida was winning until he got KO'd is not an attampt to take away from Shogun's win but rather to combat the people who are saying "WOLOOL SHOGUN FOUND OUT LYOTO'S SECRETZ N DEZTROYED HIM!!!!!!" Because, while Shogun won that fight in very convincing fashion, the beginning of that fight clearly shows he didn't figure Lyoto out." And he may have KO'd him, but it was not a destruction by any means IMO. Had he come out, not been hit save for a couple times, stuffed lyoto's takedowns and put fist to face at will, then it would be a beatdown. As it stand, he did not do that, though.*


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## Thelegend (Nov 2, 2009)

*"WOLOOL SHOGUN FOUND OUT LYOTO'S SECRETZ N DEZTROYED HIM!!!!!!"*

that made me lol, i was gonna post that and leave it at that but someone might have thought i was serious.imo lyoto got the takedowns, shogun won the standup portions and got to his feet without taking a lot of damage on the ground. more important who does lyoto fight next? maybe forest since he pulled out? loser of page/shad fight (in other words rashad):bye02:. maybe little nog (that would be fun!). lhw is so much fun right now, anybody can beat anybody at the top on any given night it seems.raise01:


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## Woodenhead (Jan 5, 2010)

Hammerlock2.0 said:


> Sorry guys, but I'm sick and tired of this whole "Machida won the round until he got knocked out" stuff. Yes, Machida was arguably winning on points but a round goes 5 minutes. I understand that people want to defend Machida because some things that are said are just ridiculous (like Machida suddenly being obsolete after his first big loss), but it's really annoying to hear everyone (even reasonable members) say that Machida was winning until he got caught. If your favorite team is leading on points and there's only 5 seconds to go and the other team scores, it doesn't matter that your team was winning for 95% of the match. Fact is Machida got knocked out cold in the first round - no more, no less. Anyone who thinks he's done because he lost to one of the best LHWs on the planet as proclaimed 5 years ago before all the injuries and surgeries is ignorant and not worth a discussion in my opinion. If you haven't lost you just haven't faced good enough competition yet. In 99% of the cases this is true.


+1 & thank you.


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

Machida Karate said:


> =
> 
> Yeah im going to not state my opinion because Kids like u get whinny when i tell the facts, that im Proud of how Machida was winning by points until he got hit. LOL


Yeah we get what you are saying, but there is no way in hell Machida was winning the round on points, no chance, zero. He was getting battered and beaten, that's why he went for the takedowns, if you had any common sense you'd see Machida almost never attempts to take the fight to the ground because he feels he has an advantage when he's standing, the fact that he wanted to be on the ground is a giant signal that he knew he was losing the standup, he was bleeding before he got knocked out. I'm a Machida fan too, I know he'll bounce back, reality however dictates that he was not winning on points. What's happening is your idol looked a lot more human in the octagon so your brain is rationalizing whatever it can to make Machida look better, however this is not how a champion thinks. To bounce back you have to look at reality, learn from your mistakes and not cling to the past. This means Machida must realize he can not beat Shogun with his traditional karate stance, it makes him extremely vulnerable to an opponent who utilizes Mua Thai techniques to neutralize the counterstriking employed in the karate stance, Machida needs to incorporate a little more boxing/mua thai into his stance so that his head moves more during the fight and so his feet are more active because his style is exploitable right now, it opens him up to leg kicks and aggressive striking from a fighter who can time his strikes to the rhythm of Machida's counters and weight shifting. Shogun kicks, Machida punches, shogun is already blocking, Machida goes to set back to karate stance, Shogun is already firing a punch as Machida is getting set, the predictability of Machida's style is why he lost so badly. I remember posting after the first fight that I noticed the opening in Machida's style and apparently Shogun noticed it too, if you watch the first fight carefully there were moments when Machida would counter with a flurry and Shogun would block and then both would get back to a set stance, however Shogun was in a position where his weight was perfectly distributed to throw punches right after Machida stopped punching while Machida was left completely defenseless because his momentum had stopped and his weight had shifted forwards making it impossible to throw powerful punches, Shogun and his trainers saw this and exploited it. That's why Shogun came out and kicked him in the leg in the first 10 seconds, he wanted Machida to counter, he knew how to beat it.


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## OliverTwist (Oct 25, 2009)

loool I think Shogun was winning the round, had the better strikes, showed no fear hesitation or doubt this time....

Machida just kept going for desperation takedowns to keep the fight from standing up, but he couldn't do anything except for some sorry a$$ ground and pound. Standing up he was being out struck.....

I actually wonder what will happen in a rematch between rashad and machida.... rashad said after his loss that he was gunna try and go back to his roots of wrestling and I don't think hes going to be scared of taking it to the ground after the last fight with shogun....

Also, now that machidas chin is suspect (never really been tested because he gets hit so rarely), and he doesn't have much power, I could see fighters going berzerk and try to overwhelm him...... I don't think machida works well under pressure...... he needs everything to be ordered and technical....... but if someones running at him swinging he seems to be overwhelmed..... atleast thats how shogun made him look before he got KTFO looool


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## vilify (Mar 23, 2010)

rabakill said:


> Yeah we get what you are saying, but there is no way in hell Machida was winning the round on points, no chance, zero. He was getting battered and beaten, that's why he went for the takedowns, if you had any common sense you'd see Machida almost never attempts to take the fight to the ground because he feels he has an advantage when he's standing, the fact that he wanted to be on the ground is a giant signal that he knew he was losing the standup, he was bleeding before he got knocked out. I'm a Machida fan too, I know he'll bounce back, reality however dictates that he was not winning on points. What's happening is your idol looked a lot more human in the octagon so your brain is rationalizing whatever it can to make Machida look better, however this is not how a champion thinks. To bounce back you have to look at reality, learn from your mistakes and not cling to the past. This means Machida must realize he can not beat Shogun with his traditional karate stance, it makes him extremely vulnerable to an opponent who utilizes Mua Thai techniques to neutralize the counterstriking employed in the karate stance, Machida needs to incorporate a little more boxing/mua thai into his stance so that his head moves more during the fight and so his feet are more active because his style is exploitable right now, it opens him up to leg kicks and aggressive striking from a fighter who can time his strikes to the rhythm of Machida's counters and weight shifting. Shogun kicks, Machida punches, shogun is already blocking, Machida goes to set back to karate stance, Shogun is already firing a punch as Machida is getting set, the predictability of Machida's style is why he lost so badly. I remember posting after the first fight that I noticed the opening in Machida's style and apparently Shogun noticed it too, if you watch the first fight carefully there were moments when Machida would counter with a flurry and Shogun would block and then both would get back to a set stance, however Shogun was in a position where his weight was perfectly distributed to throw punches right after Machida stopped punching while Machida was left completely defenseless because his momentum had stopped and his weight had shifted forwards making it impossible to throw powerful punches, Shogun and his trainers saw this and exploited it. That's why Shogun came out and kicked him in the leg in the first 10 seconds, he wanted Machida to counter, he knew how to beat it.


great analysis, great post +rep coming your way :thumb02:


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## Maaz (Aug 20, 2007)

ptw said:


> All truth from Machida, and yes, he was winning that fight til he got clipped.
> 
> Shogun won the fight, all that really matters, but he didn't blow Machida out of the water like dumbass people on this forum are acting like. Same reason I'd like to see velasquez v nog II, Mir v Carwin II...and many other matches.


The funny thing is those matches will never happen. Cus when you get knocked the eff out , it's over you lost the most devastating way possible. Shogun blew machida out of the water.


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## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

Maaz said:


> The funny thing is those matches will never happen. Cus when you get knocked the eff out , it's over you lost the most devastating way possible. Shogun blew machida out of the water.


Just because you knock someone out does not mean that you will never be matched up with them again. I am pretty confident that we will see Machida/Shogun III. We will more than likely see Mir/Lesnar III and I wouldn't be surprised if we saw Mir/Carwin II.


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## Guy Incognito (Apr 3, 2010)

I could see fighters going berzerk and try to overwhelm him...... I don't think machida works well under pressure...... he needs everything to be ordered and technical....... but if someones running at him swinging he seems to be overwhelmed..... atleast thats how shogun made him look before he got KTFO looool[/QUOTE]


thats pretty much every counter striker if you go straight at them instead of standing in the pocket throwing punches than you have alot better chance because they don't work well under pressure, look at chuck he was having no problem with everyone else but had trouble with overeem, mezgher and rampage as they took the fight to him, they can't get into their rhyhm and be comfortable


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## vilify (Mar 23, 2010)

Machida got the shit beat out of him. But he'll back okay.


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## HeWillEnlarge (Aug 14, 2009)

vilify said:


> thats if machida even wins his next fight.


You're acting like he didn't dominate the division before shogun came along. honestly, Imo he's just gonna work his way back up to a title shot.


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## HeWillEnlarge (Aug 14, 2009)

Maaz said:


> The funny thing is those matches will never happen. Cus when you get knocked the eff out , it's over you lost the most devastating way possible. Shogun blew machida out of the water.


So what happened to GSP?


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

Regardless of who thinks Machida was winning the rd or the first fight I was thinking the other night when I saw an A-Team commercial, why wouldn't Dana want Rampage to be fighting for the belt right while he is in the theaters too, it will draw alot more casual viewers to the fight and Dana is always thinking how to get the best draw, it makes sense that if he beats Rashad he would fight Shogun.....


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## steveo412 (Sep 27, 2006)

All this Machida won the first round talk is so stupid. If the round ended right before the stoppage shogun woulda got the round. He knocked Machida down with really the only effective strike so far and finished the round with GnP and Machida never stood up lol. Definetly 10-9 Shogun



HitOrGetHit said:


> Just because you knock someone out does not mean that you will never be matched up with them again. I am pretty confident that we will see Machida/Shogun III. We will more than likely see Mir/Lesnar III and I wouldn't be surprised if we saw Mir/Carwin II.


lol thats a lot of nice fights where Mir gets KTFO to look forward to.


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Machida was winning the round???:sarcastic12:

Who gives a shit since he got KTFO!






Some people will do anything to make their favorite fighter look good after a crushing defeat. This is one of those cases. Take it like a man, he lost. 

Shogun won, Machida got KTFO. I look foward to a third fight since I still dont think anyone but Shogun can beat Machida. 

And being that both fighters are somewhat young a third fight will happen in the next couple of years depending on how this loss effects Machida.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

Ok guys just for you two one more time 

Lyoto and Shogun fought a very even fight that night. It's not a science to see that! Shogun won and as a result he of course also won the round and the whole fight! 

However after the current scoring system and not only because of that, many Fans had Lyoto in front until the Knock Down.. that's not a science either! That's all people are saying.. nothing more. Your boy won and deserves to be champion. :thumbsup:



But in my mind, Lyoto won the first fight and the second!


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## Joabbuac (Jan 31, 2009)

morninglightmt said:


> or maybe Machida vs Bader. he has a thing for beating guys who are previously unbeaten



Everyone ever was previously unbeaten :thumbsup:


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## steveo412 (Sep 27, 2006)

BobbyCooper said:


> But in my mind, Lyoto won the first fight and the second!


hahaha ya he won the second, thats like saying no sparky never got hit by a car he moved to a farm with all the best dogs in the world.


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

steveo412 said:


> hahaha ya he won the second, thats like saying no sparky never got hit by a car he moved to a farm with all the best dogs in the world.


HAHAH that's amazing +rep, that's such a great way of saying "and if I had wheels I'd be a wagon" hahaha

Edit: Damn I can't rep you, need to spread it around...


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

JimmyJames said:


> Machida was winning the round???:sarcastic12:
> 
> Who gives a shit since he got KTFO!
> 
> ...


 
I think that has been established....:thumbsup:


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

BobbyCooper said:


> Ok guys just for you two one more time
> 
> Lyoto and Shogun fought a very even fight that night. It's not a science to see that! Shogun won and as a result he of course also won the round and the whole fight!
> 
> ...


lol, this is a troll post right?


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

JimmyJames said:


> Machida was winning the round???:sarcastic12:
> 
> Who gives a shit since he got KTFO!
> 
> ...


Duh, he got KOed. I looked the round up until that point over and I think it was really close. Since the fight is over, and Rua has no obvious opponents yet. Its perfectly okay to postulate what might have been. 

And by the way dude, chill pills are free. What one?



BobbyCooper said:


> Ok guys just for you two one more time
> 
> Lyoto and Shogun fought a very even fight that night. It's not a science to see that! Shogun won and as a result he of course also won the round and the whole fight!
> 
> ...





rabakill said:


> lol, this is a troll post right?


Haha! Who cares, its funny!:thumb02:


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Squirrelfighter said:


> Duh, he got KOed. I looked the round up until that point over and I think it was really close. Since the fight is over, and Rua has no obvious opponents yet. Its perfectly okay to postulate what might have been.
> 
> And by the way dude, chill pills are free. What one?


WTF???

I think it's quite stupid to argue over something that doesnt matter. But feel free to waste your time.


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

So I hope he fights the loser of Rampage Rashad next, I think he should be healthy enough to fight soon. 

I really think Rashad could beat Rampage if he can weather the storm that will be Rampage in the 1st Rd.....

That said if Rampage comes out sharp which apparently he is working at then it could be a long night for Rashad, I mean I have basically bet against Rashad in everyone if his fights but 1 and the dude delivers every time, like 6 of those losses on my vBookie R from him.....

If not I would be fine with I'm fighting Lil Nog if needed but at this point all we can do is hurry up and wait....


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

JimmyJames said:


> WTF???
> 
> I think it's quite stupid to argue over something that doesnt matter. But feel free to waste your time.


How is it a waste of time to say what if? Like what if that overhand had missed, or what if Machida managed to find his senses and buck Rua. Its not in any way a waste of time at all. Actually, I think its a remarkably helpful mental exercise.




coldcall420 said:


> So I hope he fights the loser of Rampage Rashad next, I think he should be healthy enough to fight soon.
> 
> I really think Rashad could beat Rampage if he can weather the storm that will be Rampage in the 1st Rd.....
> 
> ...


I'm very interested in Machida vs Rampage. As I'm also interested in Evans vs Rua. Ideally, Evans beats Rampage quickly, but not resoundingly enough to mess up his head. That way he can get into camp and train to fight Machida. If Evans loses to Rampage I would prefer to see Machida fight someone else, seeing as we've all already seen Evans "do the stanky leg" as Rampage put it while coaching on TUF.


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

Squirrelfighter said:


> How is it a waste of time to say what if? Like what if that overhand had missed, or what if Machida managed to find his senses and buck Rua. Its not in any way a waste of time at all. Actually, I think its a remarkably helpful mental exercise.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Enters LiL NOG....:thumbsup:


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## machidaisgod (Aug 14, 2009)

Machida lost to the better man that night, this "was winning the round" is just bs, he lost and it crushed me more emotionally than financially. Now for the next fights if Machida beats a Lil Nog or other top contender and Rua loses to Rampage lets say then I can see Machida getting the shot. Rua-Evans would be a good fight and Evans-Machida was a massacre. But if Rua retains then I would hope the egghead would match Rua with AS, I mean who does not want to see that fight? If Rua can beat AS I will just give up handicapping this sport because it is kicking my ass. All I have is AS, Kos and Brock, not that rooting for them is tough. Brock, please just throw carwin out of the ring


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## vilify (Mar 23, 2010)

I find it a bit funny that the same people who call machida/evans a massacre and dont want to see it again are the same ones who want to see shogun/machida 3. 

whats the point machida got KO'd in the first rd?


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## machidaisgod (Aug 14, 2009)

vilify said:


> I find it a bit funny that the same people who call machida/evans a massacre and dont want to see it again are the same ones who want to see shogun/machida 3.
> 
> whats the point machida got KO'd in the first rd?


1) They are 1-1 in their fights not absolute ko-0
2) Machida has done more in UFC than Rua ever did to get a title shot. Does Machida need to beat Lidell for a title shot, I do not think that would be a problem. 
3) Machida was undefeated until 1 loss, did GSP have to go through a gaunlet for a title shot? 
4) Let Rua fight Evans or Rampage, he might no longer be relevant. He has beat one damn good fighter in 2 tries, so maybe he should just pick whoever he wants to fight like before.


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## vilify (Mar 23, 2010)

I've got no problem whatsoever with him getting a shot after 1 or 2 more fights. hopefully not against shogun though.

my only beef is with machida fans and their sense of entitlement to a 3rd fight with shogun.


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## Guy Incognito (Apr 3, 2010)

machidaisgod said:


> 1) They are 1-1 in their fights not absolute ko-0
> 2) Machida has done more in UFC than Rua ever did to get a title shot. Does Machida need to beat Lidell for a title shot, I do not think that would be a problem.
> 3) Machida was undefeated until 1 loss, did GSP have to go through a gaunlet for a title shot?
> 4) Let Rua fight Evans or Rampage, he might no longer be relevant. He has beat one damn good fighter in 2 tries, so maybe he should just pick whoever he wants to fight like before.


shogun never picked any of his fights apart from asking for coleman, forrest asked for shogun and at ufc 86 shogun was supposed to fight liddel but got injured so the fight was cancelled and than they set up chuck vs rashad at 88.


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## limba (Jul 21, 2009)

I don't think he will get it.
I'm not even convinced he will get a shot at the title in the next 10 months.
If a remember he has a 6 months medical suspension after fighting Shogun!?:confused02:
And if he were to get back in the title picture he would have to fight a TOP 5 fighter: loser of Rashad/Rampage, Lil Nog..who knows. And i don't think he will get to fight a TOP 6 fighter.
Plus...in 10 moonths time, a lot could happen: by that time, Anderson could be a regular LHW, Jones could be a contender, Bader also...why not Phill Davis.
10 months is a lot of time.


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## Emericanaddict (Dec 31, 2006)

I definitly don't see Machida getting the belt back from Shogun dude just seems to be Kyrptonite for Machida but if anyone else is holding the title and he gets back into contention then yeah he could be our champ again relatively soon. Everyone loses eventually Lyoto is still an amazing fighter even if I don't like to watch him.


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

vilify said:


> I've got no problem whatsoever with him getting a shot after 1 or 2 more fights. hopefully not against shogun though.
> 
> my only beef is with machida fans and their sense of entitlement to a 3rd fight with shogun.


Its not a sense of entitlement, its a rubber match, why wouldnt Machida get a crack at his belt, historicvally the losing champ fights 2 maybe 3 times then fights for his belt back why would this not apply to Machida......it did to Rampage, and Rashad has his name in there.....

Its the way it is, not what Machida fans feel entitled to, or at least they feel entitled to the same as any other camp....


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

coldcall420 said:


> Its not a sense of entitlement, its a rubber match, why wouldnt Machida get a crack at his belt, historicvally the losing champ fights 2 maybe 3 times then fights for his belt back why would this not apply to Machida......it did to Rampage, and Rashad has his name in there.....
> 
> Its the way it is, not what Machida fans feel entitled to, or at least they feel entitled to the same as any other camp....


I think historically, these instant rubber matches are dictated by: 
1). The fashion in which the fight ended, usually controversy, an epic & close battle or perception of some kind of fluke. [That would be a no go in this second fight, as none of those criteria were met.]
2). The relative depth of that particular division. [I think Machida is still unquestionable top tier, so that's a debatable justification in his favor.]
3). Existing animosity between the fighters that the public drools over. [No animosity between the two fighters.]
4). Simple, overwhelming public interest in such a rematch, which traditionally ties in with reason number 1 [and Shogun/Lyoto 2 didn't meet that criteria.]

In my opinion, had the fight ended even in a KTFO situation in the late 4th or 5th round, there would have been a demand for a rematch from the public and Dana himself, but first round KO's are usually hard to defend a rubber match, "particularly" if none of the above mentioned criteria are not met. I think for the current time, public interest in such a rubber match doesn't exist, so Dana would have no reason to pull such strings if the strings don't come with a lot of money/mass public interest.


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

VolcomX311 said:


> I think historically, these instant rubber matches are dictated by:
> 1). The fashion in which the fight ended, usually controversy, an epic & close battle or perception of some kind of fluke. [That would be a no go in this second fight, as none of those criteria were met.]
> 2). The relative depth of that particular division. [I think Machida is still unquestionable top tier, so that's a debatable justification in his favor.]
> 3). Existing animosity between the fighters that the public drools over. [No animosity between the two fighters.]
> ...



Not to mention, I don't want to see three straight title fights between the same two guys.


----------



## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

Life B Ez said:


> Not to mention, I don't want to see three straight title fights between the same two guys.


haha and that would fall under criteria no. 4.


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

VolcomX311 said:


> haha and that would fall under criteria no. 4.


TBH, I don't care if the first two were all out barn burner wars, I don't want to see the same two guys fight three times in a row, I don't like seeing the same two fight back to back, but I understand that has to happen sometimes. But three in a row is just stupid.


----------



## ptw (Aug 13, 2009)

Having them fight so soon is bad. Let Lyoto get one or two more matches before another title shot, see how he handles his loss, and how it changes him. It'll be easier to determine whether he should get a title shot or not after his next fight. He will probably fight Forrest, or Jones.


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

ptw said:


> Having them fight so soon is bad. Let Lyoto get one or two more matches before another title shot, see how he handles his loss, and how it changes him. It'll be easier to determine whether he should get a title shot or not after his next fight. He will probably fight Forrest, or Jones.


They aren't going to feed Jones to Machida yet.....Bones is a good fighter, but he's not ready for Lyoto. Forrest or Lil Nog is more likely.


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## xRoxaz (May 6, 2010)

There's definitely going to be a trilogy to this match up, however I don't see it coming this year, and by earliest it would be the late of 2011, provided that no one is injured etc.


----------



## Calibretto9 (Oct 15, 2006)

Good guy but I'd bet money that he'd lose the re-rematch with Shogun.


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

coldcall420 said:


> Its not a sense of entitlement, its a rubber match, why wouldnt Machida get a crack at his belt, *historically the losing champ fights 2 maybe 3 times then fights for his belt back why would this not apply to Machida.*.....it did to Rampage, and Rashad has his name in there.....
> 
> Its the way it is, not what Machida fans feel entitled to, or at least they feel entitled to the same as any other camp....





VolcomX311 said:


> I think historically, these instant rubber matches are dictated by:
> 1). The fashion in which the fight ended, usually controversy, an epic & close battle or perception of some kind of fluke. [That would be a no go in this second fight, as none of those criteria were met.]
> 2). The relative depth of that particular division. [I think Machida is still unquestionable top tier, so that's a debatable justification in his favor.]
> 3). Existing animosity between the fighters that the public drools over. [No animosity between the two fighters.]
> ...


Good points....:thumb02:



Life B Ez said:


> Not to mention, I don't want to see three straight title fights between the same two guys.


 
Do you read???? Can you??? Who ever said three fights in a row, again some people just see what they want on here, I even quoted my own post to point out where I stated after 2-3 fights......READ then post, you will appear more intelligent....Good Lord!!! Nothing in the bold, which is what Volcom responded to about an instant rematch, or instant 3rd fight, or as you say a 3rd fight in a row......READ!!!!



Here is you again not getting it again:



> TBH, I don't care if the first two were all out barn burner wars, *I don't want to see the same two guys fight three times in a row*, I don't like seeing the same two fight back to back, but I understand that has to happen sometimes. But three in a row is just stupid.


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

I certainly think Machida would get a title shot in 2 maybe 3 fights, depending on the fashion in which he wins. I actually think if Machida wins a single fight, Joe Rogan will start talking about a Shogun/Machida III.


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

VolcomX311 said:


> I certainly think Machida would get a title shot in 2 maybe 3 fights, depending on the fashion in which he wins. I actually think if Machida wins a single fight, Joe Rogan will start talking about a Shogun/Machida III.


Oh of course that moron will. But he's only Joe Rogan and no one takes Joe Roagn seriously. I would like to see Machida fight prefereably two after thinking about it more. Rampage vs Evans loser, then (assuming he wins) Griffin vs Nog winner. Then Rua again. By then Rua would have likely fought the winner of Rampage vs Evans, and maybe another.

If there actually is another champion level fighter in the LHW division besides Machida, Rua, Rampage and Evans? This is a legitimate question if anyone wants to reach out and kill some ignorance!


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

I don't actually see, how you can't give Machida another shot after he defeats two prospects. The LHW devision in my mind, isn't really that stacked at all atm. (from the sight of real title contenders).

After Lyoto beats the loser of Rampage/Rashad or the winner of Franklin/Liddell.. then maybe Forrest.. there is nobody else for him or Rua to fight then each other. Jones won't be in title contention until 2012 maybe late 2011 cause Dana wants to built him up very slowely, wich he showed with his recent matchup for him. Same with Bader and Davis.

So LHW in sight of real contenders, isn't really stacked at all. Of course when Anderson would mix into it, everything would fall apart.. but that's why Dana and Silva will not consider this.

edit: If you are wondering what about Lil Nog^^ I counted him into Rua's second Title defense.


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

I'm sure if Machida wins his next two fights and especially wins it convincingly, then public interest will start calling for Shogun/Machida III. Hell, if some freak-fluke occurs and Shogun gets beat and doesn't get a rubber match, Machida/Rua III could be a number one contender fight. 

That's deep....


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

VolcomX311 said:


> I'm sure if Machida wins his next two fights and especially wins it convincingly, then public interest will start calling for Shogun/Machida III. Hell, if some freak-fluke occurs and Shogun gets beat and doesn't get a rubber match, Machida/Rua III could be a number one contender fight.
> 
> *That's deep*....


 
LMAO....:thumb02: Repped


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

coldcall420 said:


> Do you read???? Can you??? Who ever said three fights in a row, again some people just see what they want on here, I even quoted my own post to point out where I stated after 2-3 fights......READ then post, you will appear more intelligent....Good Lord!!! Nothing in the bold, which is what Volcom responded to about an instant rematch, or instant 3rd fight, or as you say a 3rd fight in a row......READ!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> Here is you again not getting it again:




I know I'll get warned for this, but go **** yourself CC, I just stated my opinion and you act like it was directed at you.........I didn't even quote you, I seen someone saying reasons for *an instant rubber match* and was responding to them. You've really been a condescending punk since Machida lost. You're trolling the shit out of this forum.....it's sad.


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## BrutalKO (Oct 5, 2006)

...I'm sure Lyoto is taking this hard. Your first loss after a dominating, undefeated run is a monster pill to swallow. Truth is- styles do make fights and Shogun started putting the Machida puzzle together at UFC 104. Shogun had the winning formula. Machida is still a top fighter without question, it was just Shogun's time. I'm a huge fan of both fighters. I just want to see Rampage & Shogun bang for a second time. Rua's 1st round destruction of Page over in Pride was sick. QJ got absolutely mauled! 
I wonder if Page or Evans really wants a piece of him? 

*P.S. Once again- I want the mega-fight like most others-- Shogun vs. The Spider!!*


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

Life B Ez said:


> I know I'll get warned for this, but go **** yourself CC, I just stated my opinion and you act like it was directed at you.........I didn't even quote you, I seen someone saying reasons for *an instant rubber match* and was responding to them. You've really been a condescending punk since Machida lost. You're trolling the shit out of this forum.....it's sad.


 
LOL....I have actually been very level headed about his loss, so much so that I can post your PM to me telling me that at least I am a level headed Machida fan....sound trollish, how bout everywhere I post the next post is your's....that would be cool, i surely hurt cuz Machida lost, however that has nothing to do with clarifying something that now you realize your wrong results In you insulting me...if you werent talking to me who were you, and why respond right after my posts all the time......really I'd be happy to never hear you hate again but so long as you do and the statements you make are false I will be here to correct....


I will go F my self and you can call me a punk and condescending, but there are roughly 1500 posts of your own you may wanna go re read before you just throw that shit out there.....kinda the pot calling the kettle black....all you have to do is read the thread and the times posted and who your directing things at becomes pretty clear....


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## OliverTwist (Oct 25, 2009)

BrutalKO said:


> ...I'm sure Lyoto is taking this hard. Your first loss after a dominating, undefeated run is a monster pill to swallow. Truth is- styles do make fights and Shogun started putting the Machida puzzle together at UFC 104. Shogun had the winning formula. Machida is still a top fighter without question, it was just Shogun's time. I'm a huge fan of both fighters. I just want to see Rampage & Shogun bang for a second time. Rua's 1st round destruction of Page over in Pride was sick. QJ got absolutely mauled!
> I wonder if Page or Evans really wants a piece of him?
> 
> *P.S. Once again- I want the mega-fight like most others-- Shogun vs. The Spider!!*



Rampage Shogun II would be sick. Would be nice to see how it turns out if Rampage doesn't get his ribs broken in the first couple of minutes this time


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

coldcall420 said:


> LOL....I have actually been very level headed about his loss, so much so that I can post your PM to me telling me that at least I am a level headed Machida fan....sound trollish, how bout everywhere I post the next post is your's....that would be cool, i surely hurt cuz Machida lost, however that has nothing to do with clarifying something that now you realize your wrong results In you insulting me...if you werent talking to me who were you, and why respond right after my posts all the time......really I'd be happy to never hear you hate again but so long as you do and the statements you make are false I will be here to correct....
> 
> 
> I will go F my self and you can call me a punk and condescending, but there are roughly 1500 posts of your own you may wanna go re read before you just throw that shit out there.....kinda the pot calling the kettle black....all you have to do is read the thread and the times posted and who your directing things at becomes pretty clear....


Wow, all I can say is you changed more since Machida's loss than he did for the second fight.

There's some trolling...


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## Nomale (Apr 22, 2007)

OliverTwist said:


> Rampage Shogun II would be sick. Would be nice to see how it turns out if Rampage doesn't get his ribs broken in the first couple of minutes this time


I don't think Rampage would be able to deal with Shogun's leg kicks. His defence of low-kicks in the fight with Forrest was non-existent, and I doubt he has been improving it enough since then.


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## Icculus (Oct 4, 2009)

Nomale said:


> I don't think Rampage would be able to deal with Shogun's leg kicks. His defence of low-kicks in the fight with Forrest was non-existent, and I doubt he has been improving it enough since then.


The leg kicks are part of it, but I think that its the way Shogun, Silva, and even Forrest mixed up the attack that really does him in as a somewhat one-dimensional boxer. Shogun and Wandy were just coming at Rampage from all angles with crisp striking and it was too much for him. I hope he is really working on improving in all areas because I dont see him ever getting past elite strikers like Shogun and Machida the way he has fought in the past.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

Everybody play nice, and go to separate threads if you can't. :thumb02:


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## BrutalKO (Oct 5, 2006)

swpthleg said:


> Everybody play nice, and go to separate threads if you can't. :thumb02:


...LOL! cool swp...keeping the testosterone levels down...


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

Life B Ez said:


> Wow, all I can say is you changed more since Machida's loss than he did for the second fight.
> 
> There's some trolling...


 
Your a nag...you ever head of tits on a bull....they are useless like your posts...the only troll here is you and i will own you till you die cuz nags like you only serve one purpose....to nag...im going to enjoy making you my B****


You wanna keep calling me out enjoy ace it will end sorely for you......


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## Guy Incognito (Apr 3, 2010)

Icculus said:


> Shogun and Wandy were just coming at Rampage from all angles with crisp striking and it was too much for him. I



what? wandy isn't a crisp striker by any means, rampage was doing very well in the second fight standing and even dropped him, shogun also was not a crisp striker back than and just got him in the clinch and destroyed him.


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## deadmanshand (Apr 9, 2008)

coldcall420 said:


> Your a nag...you ever head of tits on a bull....they are useless like your posts...the only troll here is you and i will own you till you die cuz nags like you only serve one purpose....to nag...im going to enjoy making you my B****
> 
> 
> You wanna keep calling me out enjoy ace it will end sorely for you......


If only a moderator had warned people to be nice and civil in this thread....


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## Mirage445 (Dec 20, 2006)

deadmanshand said:


> If only a moderator had warned people to be nice and civil in this thread....


Didn't coldcall used to be an admin/mod here?


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## deadmanshand (Apr 9, 2008)

I believe so. Not sure. Don't particularly care. He has a habit of trying to throw his "weight" around and threaten people. And he will inevitably respond to these posts with a comment about obviously not reading his posts or not having enough posts for our opinion to matter. Like he always does.


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## Guy Incognito (Apr 3, 2010)

shogun stole machidas soul.


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## Mirage445 (Dec 20, 2006)

guy incognito said:


> shogun stole machidas soul.


Kinda like what Silva is gonna do to Sonnen's? :thumb02:


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## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

Mirage445 said:


> Kinda like what Silva is gonna do to Sonnen's? :thumb02:


Chael doesn't have a soul he will just turn to ash in the middle of the octagon.


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## AmdM (Apr 13, 2010)

Mirage445 said:


> Kinda like what Silva is gonna do to Sonnen's? :thumb02:


Im gonna enjoy so much seing Silva STFU Sonnen´s mouth.

Can´t wait for it! :thumb02:


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## Guy Incognito (Apr 3, 2010)

the only place you will see silva dancing after the sonnen fight is in the broadway musical cats because sonnen is gonna end him.





P.S he will be a pink one


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

swpthleg said:


> Everybody play nice, and go to separate threads if you can't. :thumb02:


Haha, you mean coldcall and Life play nice. Even though the banter has been hilarious!:thumb02:


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## Powers (May 10, 2010)

wow this site has a lot of Machida fans..but um let's be real he got whoop by Shogun 2 times.. 9 out of 10 times Machida will lose to Shogun. It's just like Chuck is to Randy, Rampage is to Chuck, Tito to Shamrock, Anderson to Franklin. ect ect... Shogun's style is bad news to Machida's in every which way.. The only thing we can all wait for is to see how well Machida responds to his first KO lost. Sometimes fighters mentally lose it after a bad KO like that. I'll say it now imo I don't think Machida will come back and make a another run with flying colors as his loyal fans are saying & thinking already before hand. Shogun's already put out a blueprint to beat him. Everyone's going to base their gameplan off Shogun's to at least try to negate Machida's once invincible style. Not all will succeed but they all at least have an ideal to beat him now...


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

deadmanshand said:


> If only a moderator had warned people to be nice and civil in this thread....


 
It takes 2 to tango so quote the troll....:thumbsup: @ Mirage yes,and now when I stunbmle into a troll I dont have to kiss his ass and ask him to conform to the rules and hope he does, now I can just call him out when he is being retarded, speaking of MODS how many times is this guy gonna use slurs against me before you paint him????

Just curious do we have rules on that anymore???? I already took it to Pm's and notified more than one....


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

deadmanshand said:


> If only a moderator had warned people to be nice and civil in this thread....


I see what you did there........so clever.


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## Adam365 (Jul 10, 2008)

marcthegame said:


> At UFC 113, Lyoto Machida saw his light heavyweight title and unbeaten record disappear when Mauricio “Shogun” Rua knocked him out. And now he has made regaining the belt is new dream.
> 
> Back in Belém, the city of his birth, the Karate fighter spoke to for the first time after his loss to Tatame Magazine:
> 
> ...


I can't really see him getting the belt back anytime soon, no offense to all the machida nut huggers but I never really thought he was that good. He really hasn't fought anyone good IMO except Rashad.


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## punchbag (Mar 1, 2010)

marcthegame said:


> At UFC 113, Lyoto Machida saw his light heavyweight title and unbeaten record disappear when Mauricio “Shogun” Rua knocked him out. And now he has made regaining the belt is new dream.
> 
> Back in Belém, the city of his birth, the Karate fighter spoke to for the first time after his loss to Tatame Magazine:
> 
> ...


I want Alicia keys butt naked in my house, but it aint gonna happen either Mr MACHIDA.
IMO, Shogun has beaten LYOTO twice and a third only gets worse.
I admire MACHIDA's heart, but just like Chuck will always have Randys number, I feel the same about these two guys, that's unless Shogun loses his next fight and Machida beats the guy for the title, but it is MMA and as we all know anything can happen.


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

Powers said:


> wow this site has a lot of Machida fans..but um let's be real he got whoop by Shogun 2 times.. 9 out of 10 times Machida will lose to Shogun. It's just like Chuck is to Randy, Rampage is to Chuck, Tito to Shamrock, Anderson to Franklin. ect ect... Shogun's style is bad news to Machida's in every which way.. The only thing we can all wait for is to see how well Machida responds to his first KO lost. Sometimes fighters mentally lose it after a bad KO like that. I'll say it now imo I don't think Machida will come back and make a another run with flying colors as his loyal fans are saying & thinking already before hand. Shogun's already put out a blueprint to beat him. Everyone's going to base their gameplan off Shogun's to at least try to negate Machida's once invincible style. Not all will succeed but they all at least have an ideal to beat him now...


Okay a couple things first off: 
What? You are comparing Machida and Rua going to war in the first fight and Machida getting slammed with a solid overhand and getting TKOed to Silva putting on a clinic against Franklin twice? Those fights are in no way alike. 

Secondly:
Yes, Rua found Machida's weaknesses, his reliance on his hopping style of striking, and his rather low guard when he comes in. But do you really think I guy like Rampage, who is in no way like Rua, or Evans, who is in no way like Rua, or Griffin, who throws the leg kicks, but does not have the accuracy and KO power of Rua by a long shot, could actually do what Rua did? 

Thirdly:
Damn dude, you gave me a headache with that grammer!


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## Powers (May 10, 2010)

Squirrelfighter said:


> Okay a couple things first off:
> What? You are comparing Machida and Rua going to war in the first fight and Machida getting slammed with a solid overhand and getting TKOed to Silva putting on a clinic against Franklin twice? Those fights are in no way alike.
> 
> Secondly:
> ...


I'll keep it simple for you. Shogun is Machida's kyptonite. Style-wise it's bad for Machida. As for making another title run? I'm not doubting Machida, He has all the skills to beat the top LHWs. But like I said a bad KO like the one Rua gave him could mentally mess up any fighter. So if he's thinking 10 months? that's like jumping right back into the mix. That's too little time to heal up(mentally imo). But we'll see, just my thoughts.


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

Powers said:


> I'll keep it simple for you. Shogun is Machida's kyptonite. Style-wise it's bad for Machida. As for making another title run? I'm not doubting Machida, He has all the skills to beat the top LHWs. But like I said a bad KO like the one Rua gave him could mentally mess up any fighter. So if he's thinking 10 months? that's like jumping right back into the mix. That's too little time to heal up(mentally imo). But we'll see, just my thoughts.


I agree 10 months is impossible. I think I said 18-24 earlier in the thread. But as for his kryptonite, maybe. I don't put too much backing on the idea of kryptonite. IMO anyone can beat anyone with proper training and a gameplan.

My solution for Machida, make sure that mind is right and stop training with Daddy!


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

lol, nameless neg reppers who can't handle their boy losing. The most cowardly form of mmaforum poster.


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

rabakill said:


> lol, nameless neg reppers who can't handle their boy losing. The most cowardly form of mmaforum poster.


Got the same, waiting for more of them.....


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

there really should be some form of name recognition or something for neg reppers like that, they are the kid who told on others in class for things they had nothing to do with. Teacher teacher, he said something about some guy I like that was mean.


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

rabakill said:


> there really should be some form of name recognition or something for neg reppers


If you pay for a lifetime membership you can see who it was.


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## Guy Incognito (Apr 3, 2010)

Squirrelfighter said:


> Okay a couple things first off:
> What? You are comparing Machida and Rua going to war in the first fight and Machida getting slammed with a solid overhand and getting TKOed to Silva putting on a clinic against Franklin twice? Those fights are in no way alike.



MACHIDA GOT KOed NOT TKOed


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## Adam365 (Jul 10, 2008)

rabakill said:


> lol, nameless neg reppers who can't handle their boy losing. The most cowardly form of mmaforum poster.


Yeah I got neg repped too but he left his name which was kinda shocking.


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## morninglightmt (Sep 7, 2008)

Guys, come on. Nobody want's an entire page of a thread to be about how you got neg repped. Get a premium account if it's that big a deal.

http://www.mmaforum.com/ufc/75935-reputation-system-everyone-read.html

"Complaining about Negative Reps in forum threads and/or posting asking who neg reped me ..ect is also looked down upon. If you want to know who Pos/Neg Repped you upgrade to a Premium/Lifetime Membership and seeing who left you reputation points is revealed for every rep is one of the many perks of upgrading"


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## leifdawg (Jan 1, 2008)

Fork over the $10 for a premium membership and you never have to deal with anonymous neg reppers again.

Edit: oops didn't see the post above.


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## N1™ (Apr 8, 2007)

i doubt they will give rampage a titleshot unless he extends his contract


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## rezin (May 28, 2007)

Squirrelfighter said:


> I agree 10 months is impossible. I think I said 18-24 earlier in the thread. But as for his kryptonite, maybe. *I don't put too much backing on the idea of kryptonite. IMO anyone can beat anyone with proper training and a gameplan.*
> 
> My solution for Machida, make sure that mind is right and stop training with Daddy!


I dont know some people a la GSP are kryptonite to other like jon fitch since there strengths are similar but GSP is just far better in every area.

Jon Fitch has not lost in god knows how long except for his massacre at the hands of GSP


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## TLC (Apr 5, 2010)

Too bad Shogun is a better fighter than him.


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## MrObjective (May 22, 2010)

Get real, beat Forrest THEN, Rashad/Rampage loser, Lil Nog, or even Bones (not likely IMO) then you get a shot. 

After Rampage/Rashad winner V Rua fight that title fight belongs to Anderson Silva after he runs through the next two #1 contenders.


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

guy incognito said:


> MACHIDA GOT KOed NOT TKOed


I slight error on my part, no need for mega caps!:thumb02:



rezin said:


> I dont know some people a la GSP are kryptonite to other like jon fitch since there strengths are similar but GSP is just far better in every area.
> 
> Jon Fitch has not lost in god knows how long except for his massacre at the hands of GSP


I think comparing GSP vs Fitch to Machida vs Rua is kind of a stretch. 

GSP beats just about everyone in the WW division because he's a superior Mixed Martial Artist to just about everyone else in the WW division. His ground techniques are unquestioningly unbeatable at that weight by any fighter currently in the division(though this is disputeable in some cases).

Rua is an extremely skilled striker who has not beaten everyone who's ever come up against him in the UFC LHW division, not by a long shot. He was subbed by Griffin, and lost the debateable UD to Machida. He came back in the rematch and defeated Machida, however my analysis of the Machida fight suggests that Machida was not trying to fight his fight, i.e. ellusive and waiting for a proper opening. He appeared to be fighting Rua's fight. A more "I'm gonna come get you with good technique and knock you the f*** out" style. But that's not Machida's style, and it was obvious in his poor performance. 

Overall in Machida vs Rua 2, Machida came in with a bad gameplan, or was unable to instill it because Rua's was better and he was able to execute his quicker. 

On the comparison between Machida vs Rua 2 and GSP vs Fitch, you're comparing two of the greatest LHWs in the world to one of the greatest WWs in the world and one "Eh," quality WW in comparision. Its not a fair comparison.


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## TLC (Apr 5, 2010)

Squirrelfighter said:


> I slight error on my part, no need for mega caps!:thumb02:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Bullshit.


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## MrObjective (May 22, 2010)

TLC said:


> Bullshit.


Neither has dominated LHW, no one has since prime Lidell without the Prime guys to challenge him.

Machida came attacking gameplan like he did against Thiago Silva, something you don't do against Shogun's caliber striking, it was playing right in to Shogun's hands. I give Macihda much respect though, he was confident, wanted to silence the critics and attacked - sadly you don't do that against Shogun and win. Machida's a strong guy, but his strikes aren't all that great, no real one strike KO power. 

Machida could have won that fight if he stuck to his successful takedowns and Machida 'punch-n-run' avoid all engagements when on their feet.


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## 154rambo (Apr 2, 2010)

Machida?...Title Shot?...10 months?... doubt it. Unfortunately, the light heavyweight division is stacked with skilled fighters who are also deserving of a title shot, and they didn't just get knocked out in the first round of their last fight. I could almost see if Machida lost a close decision, or if it were only Machida and Shogun who were clear top contenders in that division, but thats definately not the case here. Machida has to win a few big fights first. I'm ready to see the winner of Rashad, Rampage take on Shogun! eff Machida...for now anyway...


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## MikeHawk (Sep 11, 2009)

Squirrelfighter said:


> I slight error on my part, no need for mega caps!:thumb02:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


He already said he was doing what he wanted to do but Shogun caught him. No need to try and make excuses for him.


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

MikeHawk said:


> He already said he was doing what he wanted to do but Shogun caught him. No need to try and make excuses for him.


Yeah, and Machida never said he had a broken hand for the first one either. I doubt anyone would ever admit they were trying to fight their opponents game in an attempt to win. I know I wouldn't. 

The fact is Machida has never fought the way he did against Rua, and he looked sloppy. That isn't debateable. Anyone with eyes could tell he was trying to fight in a different way than he has his whole career.


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## Guy Incognito (Apr 3, 2010)

Squirrelfighter said:


> Yeah, and Machida never said he had a broken hand for the first one either. I doubt anyone would ever admit they were trying to fight their opponents game in an attempt to win. I know I wouldn't.
> 
> The fact is Machida has never fought the way he did against Rua, and he looked sloppy. That isn't debateable. Anyone with eyes could tell he was trying to fight in a different way than he has his whole career.


yeah machida was trying to finish shogun, which he can't because he doesn't hit hard enough. but at the end of the day shogun has machida's number, he couldn't hurt shogun in the first fight and he couldn't do anything in the second fight.

machida just isn't elusive. he has zero head movement he just runs backward, shogun wins 9 out of ten, machida does nothing better


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

guy incognito said:


> yeah machida was trying to finish shogun, which he can't because he doesn't hit hard enough. but at the end of the day shogun has machida's number, he couldn't hurt shogun in the first fight and he couldn't do anything in the second fight.
> 
> machida just isn't elusive. he has zero head movement he just runs backward, shogun wins 9 out of ten, machida does nothing better


*sniff* *sniff* I smell a trollism.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

you are just a troll dude! :confused05:

Please stop posting so much nonsense on here. Those type of posts are for Sherdog. I will send you the link if you wish. You would fit perfectely to there community! This forum on here however is trying to remain and bulit something special. So try to acclimatize yourself into this community or you won't last long.

Just a tip man.. it's your choice do you really wanna get banned or do you wanna start to be a good member?


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

guy incognito said:


> yeah machida was trying to finish shogun, which he can't because he doesn't hit hard enough. but at the end of the day shogun has machida's number, he couldn't hurt shogun in the first fight and he couldn't do anything in the second fight.
> 
> machida just isn't elusive.* he has zero head movement *he just runs backward, shogun wins 9 out of ten, machida does nothing better


The zero head movement was classic, could you possibly find a fighter who draws more people in with simple head fakes than Machida.....WoW.......


Squirrelfighter said:


> *sniff* *sniff* I smell a trollism.


It's crap you smell, and it's coming in the form of type...needs to be eradicated....


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## TLC (Apr 5, 2010)

Squirrelfighter said:


> Yeah, and Machida never said he had a broken hand for the first one either. I doubt anyone would ever admit they were trying to fight their opponents game in an attempt to win. I know I wouldn't.
> 
> The fact is Machida has never fought the way he did against Rua, and he looked sloppy. That isn't debateable. Anyone with eyes could tell he was trying to fight in a different way than he has his whole career.


I agree. He fought even more passive than normal. As soon as he got hit the chump starts shooting in for takedowns. But if you can list examples of this so called increased aggression, feel free.


The "aggressive" Lyoto Machida.










lol, he runs out of room to backpedal and gets caught..then shoots for a takedown soon after. I could tell he really was going for Shogun's head. -_-


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## TLC (Apr 5, 2010)

MrObjective said:


> Neither has dominated LHW, no one has since prime Lidell without the Prime guys to challenge him.
> 
> Machida came attacking gameplan like he did against Thiago Silva, something you don't do against Shogun's caliber striking, it was playing right in to Shogun's hands. I give Macihda much respect though, he was confident, wanted to silence the critics and attacked - sadly you don't do that against Shogun and win. Machida's a strong guy, but his strikes aren't all that great, no real one strike KO power.
> 
> Machida could have won that fight if he stuck to his successful takedowns and Machida 'punch-n-run' avoid all engagements when on their feet.


He attempted to, unfortunately he got timed during the "punch" part then went to pieces.


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

TLC said:


> I agree. He fought even more passive than normal. As soon as he got hit the chump starts shooting in for takedowns. But if you can list examples of this so called increased aggression, feel free.
> 
> 
> The "aggressive" Lyoto Machida.
> ...


This post rocks! Woo, worse troll than the other one! You're calling Machida a chump? You're the chump bud. 

Did you watch the fight? Or Machida's previous ones? He usually hops in to strike as his opponent moves in, countering and striking after he baits with head movements. In this fight, he just jumped in and started snapping off leg kicks and punches. He was being unusually aggressive. Not the normal behavior of Machida.


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## TLC (Apr 5, 2010)

Squirrelfighter said:


> This post rocks! Woo, worse troll than the other one! You're calling Machida a chump? You're the chump bud.
> 
> Did you watch the fight? Or Machida's previous ones? He usually hops in to strike as his opponent moves in, countering and striking after he baits with head movements. In this fight, he just jumped in and started snapping off leg kicks and punches. He was being unusually aggressive. Not the normal behavior of Machida.


I'm a troll...right. It's apparent you like to make things up to defend your favored fighter. No harm, we all do it I suppose. 

Machida didn't throw any combinations so that's a bit off base. And yes I did watch the fight, Machida was similarily passive and even unusually went for takedowns after being hit. Clearly he wasn't to comfortable on the feet.


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

TLC said:


> I'm a troll...right. It's apparent you like to make things up to defend your favored fighter. No harm, we all do it I suppose.
> 
> Machida didn't throw any combinations so that's a bit off base. And yes I did watch the fight, Machida was similarily passive and even unusually went for takedowns after being hit. Clearly he wasn't to comfortable on the feet.


You may not be a troll, but calling a world class fighter a chump is a trollish thing to do. I call it as I see it. 

Machida did throw combinations. Leg kick-cross-jab. That is what is commonly refered to as a combination. The fact that he hopped in threw that or a similar combination, then got backed off by Rua's striking shows two things. 

1. Machida wasn't paying it safe and waiting for an opoening like he did in Machida vs Rua 1. 

2. Rua was possibly in Machida's head and Machida was potentially having contact anxiety. So on the count you and everyone everywhere has made of Machida possibly not wanting to stand with Rua is obvious.


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## TLC (Apr 5, 2010)

I'll do a play by play of the fight and see if I see any of Machida's so called "aggression".

Round 1

Shogun starts with a leg kick that's checked. Shogun bull rush flurries, Machida evades. Shogun leads with another leg kick, Machida attempts to counter with a straight left but it's blocked. Machida switching stances, Shogun walking forward. Machida leaps in with what is supposed to be a left hook but he appeared to change his mind mid motion and just pops back out while a kick grazes him. Shogun misses an overhand right. Another bullrush flurry from Shogun and a left straight lands while Machida evades. 

Shogun leads with another leg kick. Checked. Machida attempts to counter with his own but misses. Shogun presses forward and lands a right straight and then stumbles as Lyoto evades, Lyoto grabs double underhooks and takes him down. Shogun looks to sweep and gets up and pushes Machida into the cage, landing knees to the legs. Machida attempts a left on the break but misses. Another bullrush flurry from Shogun, first punch misses and Machida tries to counter while backpedaling but gets hit with a left straight, he then circles to his right and gets wobbled by a hard right straight. They trade leg kicks, and Shogun misses an overhand right, Machida tries to leap in with a counter straight left but it's blocked. However Machida uses the opportunity to grab double underhooks and takes Shogun down again. A repeat of last time as Shogun stands up and presses him into the cage after eating a knee to the body from Lyoto. Knees to the leg, then a knee to the head on the break from Lyoto. Lyoto evades a body kick, then steps in for a solid knee to the body. He then attempts to follow up with a straight left and eats a right. He falls to the canvas as Shogun drops punches from above than moves to full mount, Shogun finishes the deal as Machida is left unconscious on the mat.

So was he more aggressive, Verdict, NO!
Was he forced out of his gameplan? YES.


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

TLC said:


> I'll do a play by play of the fight and see if I see any of Machida's so called "aggression".
> 
> Round 1
> 
> ...


You don't get the point. You proved Machida was being aggressive. Look at all of Machida's previous fights. He baits his opponents and as they come in and attack, he counters, scoring points, and in the cases of Thiago Silva and Rashad Evans, KOs. In the fight with Rua, he was attacking Rua, who countered with rediculous crispness and accuracy against an opponent leaping in at him.


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## TLC (Apr 5, 2010)

He leaped in maybe twice, and he does that in every fight. Your definition of the word aggressive must be ludicrously loose.

And don't compare Thiago or Rashad to Shogun. Thiago basically attempted Shogun's bullrushes except he's f'ing slow and chinny and doesn't bother to block.

Compared to his fights with the mid level fighters he was even more passive in terms of actually leading with strikes.


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

TLC said:


> He leaped in maybe twice, and he does that in every fight. Your definition of the word aggressive must be ludicrously loose.
> 
> And don't compare Thiago or Rashad to Shogun. Thiago basically attempted Shogun's bullrushes except he's f'ing slow and chinny and doesn't bother to block.
> 
> Compared to his fights with the mid level fighters he was even more passive in terms of actually leading with strikes.


Wah? Don't compare Rua's "bullrush" to Thiago Silva's attempt to do the same thing because Thiago failed? That's like saying don't compare rain to snow because snow falls slower. They did the same thing, Rua just did it effectively. 

And I don't call throwing combinations(oh no, I used the c-word again) and securing two takedowns being passive. I call that...what's that word...oh yeah, aggressive. 

Note: I am in no way saying he was more aggressive than Rua, he was just more aggressive than he was in previous fights.


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## TLC (Apr 5, 2010)

Don't compare Shogun to Thiago because Shogun is a world-class p4p fighter, and Thiago is a B fighter at best.

And again, he didn't throw combinations, he threw maybe two strikes at a time once in a fight. That's not being aggressive. Even bums do that.


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

TLC said:


> Don't compare Shogun to Thiago because Shogun is a world-class p4p fighter, and Thiago is a B fighter at best.
> 
> And again, he didn't throw combinations, he threw maybe two strikes at a time once in a fight. That's not being aggressive. Even bums do that.


Now Machida is a bum? Its over, done.

I guess we're just gonna disagree. You see things this way, me that way. You think Machida is a bum chump. I think he's a world class, top 10 p4p who ate a solid thrown by an equally high ranking top 10 p4p and got KOed. But whatever, you know, we all see things our own way.


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## TLC (Apr 5, 2010)

He is world class. That's not debateable, I didn't call him a bum, I simply stated that the level of combinations he throws can be matched by bum fighters. Because he fights passive with single strikes, and he did this month as well. I don't respect him as a fighter, but I don't say asinine things.


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

TLC said:


> He is world class. That's not debateable, I didn't call him a bum, I simply stated that the level of combinations he throws can be matched by bum fighters. Because he fights passive with single strikes, and he did this month as well. I don't respect him as a fighter, but I don't say asinine things.


Oh I see, I get it. Machida isn't a bum, he just fights like one. Yeah, that's totally different. 

So wait a minute...you say he's world class, but you don't respect him, and he's a passive single strike fighter. Rashad Evans would disagree with that I think. 

Seems to me you're the one saying asinine things. But hey whatever. You're a pot calling me a kettle. Whatever, stuff happens right?


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## TLC (Apr 5, 2010)

You don't seem to be an expert of reading comprehension. Try again.


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

Pointless arguing with squirell, TLC. He delluded himself with me when i was discussing rua/machida 1. He had convinced and fooled himself into believing machida won that fight and was the aggressor too, lol. I think the best way to describe a guy like squirell is the following summary:

"Your ego is so out of whack that it will do whatever it can to protect itself and people with a messed up ego can to these mental gymnastics to convince themselves they are awesome when really they are just douche bags."


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

TLC said:


> *He is world class. That's not debateable,*





TLC said:


> * I don't respect him as a fighter, but I don't say asinine things.*





TLC said:


> You don't seem to be an expert of reading comprehension. Try again.


What exactly am I missing?



Mckeever said:


> Pointless arguing with squirell, TLC. He delluded himself with me when i was discussing rua/machida 1. He had convinced and fooled himself into believing machida won that fight and was the aggressor too, lol. I think the best way to describe a guy like squirell is the following summary:
> 
> "Your ego is so out of whack that it will do whatever it can to protect itself and people with a messed up ego can to these mental gymnastics to convince themselves they are awesome when really they are just douche bags."


Uh, last time I checked the W was in Machida's column for 1. Regardless of your or my opinion. That discussion is dead. And neglected to mention you dragged out the fightmetric stats 7 months after the fight. 

Also, by calling me a douchebag, you have proven yourself to in fact be a douchebag.


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## TLC (Apr 5, 2010)

He's not a dumb guy, just overly combative. I'm not going to disagree with a guy 100% in a debate but he takes everything out of context.



Squirrelfighter said:


> What exactly am I missing?
> 
> It's pretty clear, I'm not daft enough to suggest Lyoto isn't an elite fighter but I don't respect him as a fighter because of his style.


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

Squirrelfighter said:


> What exactly am I missing?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


There yo go again, performing your mental gymnastics. If you actually genuinely believe Machida was being the aggressor in the rematch, then you are delluded my friend, simple as that. Its quite clear rua was the aggressive fighter and Machida was the passive, why argue against proven facts?

Rua has Machida's number. Machida cant threaten rua with striking or power, rua is also light years ahead of Machida on the ground. 9/10 times rua beats machida, deal with it man.

"Some people just can't accept who they are or what they have done and have to do these mental gymnastics to convince themselves they are not to blame or not as wrong as they really are."


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

TLC said:


> He's not a dumb guy, just overly combative. I'm not going to disagree with a guy 100% in a debate but he takes everything out of context.
> 
> 
> It's pretty clear, I'm not daft enough to suggest Lyoto isn't an elite fighter but I don't respect him as a fighter because of his style.


Typo then? I apologize for getting bent out of shape on that one. We'll just disagree on Machida being aggressive. The bum comment was harsh though! 



Mckeever said:


> There yo go again, performing your mental gymnastics. If you actually genuinely believe Machida was being the aggressor in the rematch, then you are delluded my friend, simple as that. Its quite clear rua was the aggressive fighter and Machida was the passive, why argue against proven facts?
> 
> Rua has Machida's number. Machida cant threaten rua with striking or power, rua is also light years ahead of Machida on the ground. 9/10 times rua beats machida, deal with it man.


You are an idiot! Every single time you post and quote me you jump down my throat without reading anything in advance. I never said Machida was the aggressor, just more aggressive than previously. There is a difference. Go back and check. To make sure the discussion with TLC wasn't about this very thing I said that I didn't think Machida was the aggressor. Pay the f*** attention if you want to argue like a bitch McKeever.


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

Dont waste your time Squirrel.....Machida will win his next two fights, and I think they may not be in a ten month window, he will fight for the belt again regardless of haters, and take into account a man that had never lost, if you start out 16-0, your probably gonna go on to be a great fighter for a long time, Squirrel, we both know Machida will fight Shogun again assuming Shogun can hold on to the belt long enough.....

Lyoto coming off a loss isnt someone I would want to have to face and if people think there is a lack of power there thats okay....

Dont waste your positive energy....this is such a troll thread now......


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

Squirrelfighter said:


> You don't get the point. You proved Machida was being aggressive. Look at all of Machida's previous fights. He baits his opponents and as they come in and attack, he counters, scoring points, and in the cases of Thiago Silva and Rashad Evans, KOs. In the fight with Rua, he was attacking Rua, who countered with rediculous crispness and accuracy against an opponent leaping in at him.





Squirrelfighter said:


> This post rocks! Woo, worse troll than the other one! You're calling Machida a chump? You're the chump bud.
> 
> Did you watch the fight? Or Machida's previous ones? He usually hops in to strike as his opponent moves in, countering and striking after he baits with head movements. In this fight, he just jumped in and started snapping off leg kicks and punches. He was being unusually aggressive. Not the normal behavior of Machida.


Two ocassions where you call Machida being aggressive. If any thing Machida was being more passive than usual and even more gunshy. He wasnt at all, agressive.

Im really begging the UFC make lil nog/machida happen for Machida's next fight. That way, we get to see Machida out classed in both striking and the ground game again. I have nothing against Machida at all, i just really dont dig the fans constantly thinking of excuses. Maybe two back to back losses will make you wake up to reality.


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

coldcall420 said:


> Dont waste your time Squirrel.....Machida will win his next two fights, and I think they may not be in a ten month window, he will fight for the belt again regardless of haters, and take into account a man that had never lost, if you start out 16-0, your probably gonna go on to be a great fighter for a long time, Squirrel, we both know Machida will fight Shogun again assuming Shogun can hold on to the belt long enough.....
> 
> Lyoto coming off a loss isnt someone I would want to have to face and if people think there is a lack of power there thats okay....
> 
> Dont waste your positive energy....this is such a troll thread now......


Ah, thank you my brudda. You are a continuous voice of reason. I appreciate it!


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## TLC (Apr 5, 2010)

Not exactly. It's pretty relevent. It's a measuring stick to his so-called aggressiveness. Not many mid level fighters are going to go Shogun-style bull rushing unless they want to get KO'd. However, Lyoto, in terms of putting together combinations, which he rarely does, doesn't do anything outside of what you'd see in any normal MMA fight. His trickery is evasion and single strike counters, like he caught Thiago and Rashad with. However Shogun has a chin and Lyoto is just not a good matchup for him at all. I thought Shogun won the first fight 4 to 1 pretty handily as well. I also don't get this theory that Machida was winning the round, sounds like too much bad American scoring to me. Machida didn't do shit with those takedowns and got cracked a good number of times.


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## Squirrelfighter (Oct 28, 2009)

Mckeever said:


> Two ocassions where you call Machida being aggressive. If any thing Machida was being more passive than usual and even more gunshy. He wasnt at all, agressive.


Before I unsubscribe from this one so I stop posting in it I wanna just say one thing to you, well its not so much a statement as a suggestion. 

Do research into the differing meanings between the suffixes "ive" and "or" it will make your life much easier.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

Please conduct a civil discussion, with no further insults.


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## zath the champ (Feb 13, 2008)

Not unrealistic at all. Rashad will have the belt back by then . Machida won't have much trouble taking it from him again.


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