# ***OFFICIAL*** Jon Jones vs. Lyoto Machida Pre/Post Fight Discussion



## K R Y

*Please conduct all discussion regarding this fight in this topic. All other threads will be merged.*​


----------



## ProdigyPenn

Stylistically, Lyoto has the best chance to beat Jones. 

If he cant do it, than perhaps we will be seeing a Anderson Silva like regin in the Light Heavyweight division.


----------



## G_Land

Hmmmm the gambler in me wants to go with Lyoto.....


----------



## Soojooko

Come on Lyoto, you gorgeous bastard! Take Bones out... pleeeeeease.


I really cant handle watching Machida getting grinded to a pulp. If it goes that way, I will be sobbing.


----------



## rebonecrusher

Lyoto is tricky so he poses a threat to anyone in the division but I think Jones will be ready for him. I think its likely that Jones will out point Machida in the stand up and keep him in the clinch against the fence a lot of the fight getting a few take downs throughout a landing some ground and pound as well as strikes from the clinch. I'm picking Jones to get a decision.


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## K R Y

4 to 2 in Machida's favour! That's what I'm talking about!

I just hope Machida is confident and doesn't let Bones beat him before he even gets in the cage. If anyone at LHW can dethrone Jones right now, it's Lyoto.


----------



## cdtcpl

Any fight involving Lyoto is an interesting match up based on his fight style alone. I see JBJ's reach being the one thing that negates his style. Still this should be a good fight, I voted for it in the FOTN poll.


----------



## VikingKing

"The Dragon" will get the beating of his lifetime on Saturday.Jones will tool around with him and finish him in whatever way he wants


----------



## Ddog0587

Bones. 3rd Rd Guillotine choke.


----------



## cookiefritas

I hope Machida makes it a fight, but I don't see how the Dragon can win this fight. Machida can prolong the fight if he keeps a distance, and is elusive all fight long but I don't see how a challenger can win a title fighting like that. Any close fight should always go to the aggressor. Machida is the challenger, he needs to go and try to take the belt away from Jones and I see him getting wrecked when he tries to get within striking range.


----------



## VikingKing

The only way to beat Jon Jones is to get inside and close the distance and hit him.He doesnt have any experience with getting hit or being in the fire.

If Matchida plans to use his "normal" gameplan to stay on outside and counter.Thats a huge mistake and thats the last thing he should do.To let Jones pick his shots and use his reach is to ask for getting KOed.


----------



## HitOrGetHit

Machida needs to use the parts of his style that work and ditch the one's that will fail him in this fight. He can't sit back and try and counter Jones. He needs to be the one moving in but after he strikes, he needs to get out of dodge before Jones clinches with him.


----------



## SM33

I would like Machida to win mainly to keep the division interesting, but also because I do not like some of Jones' tactics and think he needs humbling.

With the right strategy and mindset, Machida can sting Jones with combos and good movement all night I don't care how long Jon's arms are, and Machida is under no pressure in this fight.


----------



## Sicilian_Esq

So long as Jones keeps his composure and sticks to the gameplan, he should pepper Machida from afar. I'm expecting a KO finish in the 3rd or 4th round when Machida tries to get aggressive.


----------



## El Bresko

I don't really like either fighter but i think Bones has more tools to win, his reach is his greatest asset and he knows how to use it. 

Although Lyoto is technically a better striker than Bones i am not sure that he will be able to close the distance as he's at a 10 inch reach disadvantage. Lyoto has great TDD and is a very underrated grappler but i don't think Bones will get subbed.

I say Bones TKO Round 4


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## Atras

G_Land said:


> Hmmmm the gambler in me wants to go with Lyoto.....


The gambler in me wants to go with Bones - I've already lost twice betting against him. But I dislike him so much I'm going to break the curse by betting on Lyoto.


----------



## Dtwizzy2k5

I don't know why people are saying that Machida is the best challenger for Jones stylistically. Machida's style is keeping the distance and fighting elusively from the outside, which is a terrible way to fight against someone who has a HUGE reach advantage over you. 

Machida is going to get killed, point blank period.


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## jonnyg4508

Dtwizzy2k5 said:


> I don't know why people are saying that Machida is the best challenger for Jones stylistically. Machida's style is keeping the distance and fighting elusively from the outside, which is a terrible way to fight against someone who has a HUGE reach advantage over you.
> 
> Machida is going to get killed, point blank period.


I agree with this. 

Not sure why so many people chose Machida, maybe it is fans or something. But keeping a distance won't work vs. a guy who has the reach by around a foot. 

I think Machida might have the best style to beat him just based on being unorthodox and getting in and out quicker than anyone. 

But I see things having to align nicely for Machida to win. He doesn't have much chance other than landing thunder on a quick counter or something. He can't sit there and try to outpoint him...which is annoying. He better go for it. Jones is a pretty patient guy, I doubt Machida will frustrate him like he likes to do, as seen with Tito. 

Jones has more ways to win, and his reach is just unfair.


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## BrianRClover

ProdigyPenn said:


> Stylistically, Lyoto has the best chance to beat Jones.
> 
> If he cant do it, than perhaps we will be seeing a Anderson Silva like regin in the Light Heavyweight division.


Yep, and within a year or so the LHW division will be considered "weak" because of it.


----------



## sNuFf_rEaLiTy

Machida can win this fight, but so can jones.

As a Lyoto Machida fan I have to go with him. But I'm interested in seeing how this all plays out.

I think the key is to not get pounded on or put in disadvantageous spots with Jones for the first 3 rounds. Let him naturally tire out. Machida just may have the best cardio, technique and speed Jones has ever faced.

I mention Speed because Jones is not that fast with his punches and kicks, they come off a little labored and that could be a prime opportunity for Machida to strike. I also think Machida will need to mix things up, put Jones on his back for a change. 

My biggest worry for Machida is the clinch.

I was thinking the other day, I don't know if this has been discussed here on the forums but Machida Karate was desinged for smaller men fighting larger men which could prove interesting.


----------



## PheelGoodInc

It's all going to come down to how Machida's distance covering matches Jones' reach. Right now he's the only guy who has a style which could counter Jones.

If Jones wins this, he's the next AS / GSP of the UFC. Rashad or anyone else doesn't stand a chance in the division.


----------



## No_Mercy

G_Land said:


> Hmmmm the gambler in me wants to go with Lyoto.....


Best time to take Machida. 



Atras said:


> The gambler in me wants to go with Bones - I've already lost twice betting against him. But I dislike him so much I'm going to break the curse by betting on Lyoto.


Got Machida with a 2:1 offer although I bet on JBJ against Rampage. 

To everyone else lets not get all twisted here. We all know JBJ is a beast at the moment against anyone and everyone in the LHW + HW. I truly think JBJ could beat most of the HWs. You know it's not so much his skill sets as it's his physical attributes. He's like one of those customized characters in a video game where he has all the attributes from speed, agility, power, endurance, athleticism, length, reach, height, etc. Basically like a cheat character...haha. 

I don't know if Machida can beat him, but he can surely put up a fight...I HOPE. With the odds I'm already putting money down on em. We'll see what happens this Saturday. 

Will Machida Karate make a comeback...


----------



## Atras

No_Mercy said:


> Will Machida Karate make a comeback...


And will Joe Rogan declare "the Machida era is back"? Man that was an embarrassing declaration after Machida won the belt. Declare the era when Lyoto has defended three or four times, not when he gets the belt.


----------



## sNuFf_rEaLiTy

Atras said:


> And will Joe Rogan declare "the Machida era is back"? Man that was an embarrassing declaration after Machida won the belt. Declare the era when Lyoto has defended three or four times, not when he gets the belt.


there's a lot of better things to reminisce about from that fight for any fan of MMA.


----------



## Hawndo

I'm amazed at the support Machida is getting here. I honestly think Machida is great but cannot comprehend how he wins this.


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## oldfan

Hahaha look at the size difference. it reminds me of when Overeem kicked the little girl.


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## HitOrGetHit

Dtwizzy2k5 said:


> I don't know why people are saying that Machida is the best challenger for Jones stylistically. Machida's style is keeping the distance and fighting elusively from the outside, which is a terrible way to fight against someone who has a HUGE reach advantage over you.
> 
> Machida is going to get killed, point blank period.


I don't think Machida's style is 100% tailor made to defeat Jones, but parts of it definitely work into his favor. His elusiveness, speed and ability to cover distance quickly are things he needs to utilize.

I completely agree with you though about the rest. If he expects to stand back and counter while letting Jones come to him, I don't expect him to go home with the belt.


----------



## Freakshow

Machida is probably the best at closing distance/retreating, but DAMN that's a lot of distance to close. His counter striking is only going to work if he catches JBJ coming in with a flashy spinning elbow or something like that. I'd like to see Lyoto win, and if any LHW can do it, it's him. I just think Bones is too much for any LHW right now. (and a lot of HW's)


----------



## maximusmus

*Jon Jones and Lyoto Machida Breake Down*

Jones vs. Machida headlines UFC 140 on Dec. 10

There truly is no rest for the weary when it comes to Jon Jones.

Seventy-seven days after facing Quinton “Rampage” Jackson in the first defense of his UFC light heavyweight championship, Jones will return to action to face one of the toughest puzzles in all of mixed martial arts, Lyoto Machida. Eleven weeks is a short turnaround time for any elite fighter facing top competition, not to mention a champion defending his belt. 

It is common for prospects building their competitive resumes to fight monthly or even bi-weekly when building their resumes against grossly overmatched foes. But most UFC champions compete two, maybe three times a year, if the fans are lucky. This will be Jones’ fourth fight in just over 10 months.

That is a ridiculous pace. Conventional wisdom suggests that he cannot keep it up. Not if he wants to hold onto that shiny gold belt that currently sits around his waist. 

The question, of course, is whether it will impact Saturday’s main event. Will Jones be a bit overtrained? Is he getting mentally burned out? Only time will tell. I’m not sure if Team Jones even knows the answer to those questions just yet.


The fear over overtraining and burnout isn’t the only things working against Jones. History also favors the challenger.

Eleven men have reigned as the UFC’s 205-pound champion. Only three have successfully defended the title more than once. Chuck Liddell was the last man to accomplish that feat, and his reign ended nearly five years ago.

Of the six champions since Liddell, only Rampage, Jones and Machida successfully defended even once. Those are startling statistics. The numbers clearly demonstrate the incredible parity in the UFC’s glamour division.

They also suggest that Saturday might be Machida’s night to finally make Jones seem human.

The problem with all of that is the fact that numbers are nothing more than numbers. People fight. Numbers don’t. And I’m quite certain that Jones couldn’t care less about the fact that his level of activity is far beyond the norm or that nobody since Liddell has successfully defended the title more than twice.

How am I so sure of that? Well, nobody in history had ever won a UFC title at the ripe young age of 23 until Jones did it back in March. No fighter had ever won UFC gold with less than eight weeks to recover and prepare since his previous bout in the Octagon. Jones snatched the title from Shogun a mere six weeks after bludgeoning Ryan Bader.

Only one man in the last decade has scored a submission win over Rampage. Yep, you guessed it. Jon Jones.

This guy breaks the mold in so many ways it is tough to keep up at times. He is anything but ordinary in terms of his fighting style and career accomplishments, so I’m going to go out on a rather short limb and suggest that neither his competitive frequency nor history will play any role in this fight. Jones will show up at his best—properly trained, physically strong and mentally ready to go.

I also fully expect Machida to show up at his absolute best. No other fighter in the sport lives mixed martial arts more than “The Dragon.” This guy personifies bushido in every aspect of his life. He would never disrespect himself, the sport or his opponent by taking a haphazard approach to preparing for a fight. No chance whatsoever.

This will be a fight decided by styles and skills, not extraneous factors, which raises the question of how these guys matchup against each other. Readers who regularly peruse my big fight breakdowns probably expect me to write that Jones, who has some of the best takedowns in the division, needs to put Machida on his back. While I’m confident the champion will do just that at some point in the fight, I don’t think he should hesitate to stand with Machida.

Jones is an extremely effective standup fighter, despite the fact that he has only been training that part of his game for a couple of years. One thing that makes him so unique is his record-setting 84.5-inch reach. No other fighter in the UFC, not even guys in the heavyweight division, can match that wingspan. As a result, he can land strikes from distances that are virtually impossible to prepare for. His crazy reach gave Rampage and Shogun, two standup experts, tremendous problems. It will do the same to Machida.

Read what the experts think http://mmadogs.com/index.php/mma-news/145-jon-jones-and-lyoto-machida-breake-down


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## dlxrevolution

Allthough Jones toughest fight would be Evans imo, I think Machida is the best stylistic match-up. I see Jones getting a (T)KO or decision. 

But if Machida did knock Jones out, I wouldn't be suprised.


----------



## Terror Kovenant

Wanting Machida to win due to my hatred of Jones. Wanting Machida to lose badly due to my hatred of some of his fans...

Overall going with Machida on this one, hopefully by KO early. Then looking forward to a new champ in Henderson.


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## oldfan

Terror Kovenant said:


> Wanting Machida to win due to my hatred of Jones. Wanting Machida to lose badly due to my hatred of some of his fans...
> 
> Overall going with Machida on this one, hopefully by KO early. Then looking forward to a new champ in Henderson.


I feel a similar dilemma. I like both fighters so, it comes down to which set of fanatics I enjoy watching wiggle away from a plate of crow more. (they never eat it)

I haven't decided yet.


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## Terror Kovenant

oldfan said:


> I feel a similar dilemma. I like both fighters so, it comes down to which set of fanatics I enjoy watching wiggle away from a plate of crow more. (they never eat it)
> 
> I haven't decided yet.


Oh never. Its always excuse after excuse. Machida clearly won the first Shogun fight, regardless of what anyone says and clearly beat Rampage if you have more than one brain cell and clearly was blinded by a reflection from a UFO hovering over the stadium which caused him to step into a puddle of oil accidentally spilled by BP at the same moment Shogun was getting ready to punch him in the face. Still undefeated!!!

But I'd rather deal with that then someone being touted as the greatest of all time who cant even sign a fan's belt. Would much rather see this guy get KO'd


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## khoveraki

If Jones wins, he will have finally beat someone that Forrest Griffin didn't also beat.


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## Terror Kovenant

khoveraki said:


> If Jones wins, he will have finally beat someone that Forrest Griffin didn't also beat.


Bader


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## HitOrGetHit

Terror Kovenant said:


> Bader


Bader was demolished by Tito Ortiz... 

But on topic, I picked Machida to win, and am now waiting for Jones to prove me wrong again...


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## Dream-On-101

Jones via destruction, probably at the end of the 3rd. Machida has always been very popular on these boards, for whatever reason, which is why i think so many of you are blinding yourselves to the clear and undeniable truth - Jones is going to smash Lyoto and there is nothing he can do to stop it. He is actually the worst matchup stylistically for Jones out of the LHW elites. He is a counter striker who fights on the outside and relies on his footwork to get in and out quickly - how the hell is he going to get through a ten inch reach advantage and back out without being clinched and tossed like a child or punched in the face. Jones has absolutely rag dolled superior wrestlers than Machida, who also will be at a strength and size disadvantage. I also see no reason to suggest that Machida is a superior grappler or submission artist than Shogun, who could barely move underneath Jones.

I actually prefer Machida as a fighter and definitely prefer him as a person (from what i've seen) but Machida is easily Jones easiest title defence - Rashad has a good chance as does a fit and healthy Shogun.


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## OwnOrBeOwned

I can't see Machida winning, Jones via 2nd round TKO/KO. Rashad will be the man to stop Jones :thumbsup:


----------



## cookiefritas

Machida put on some muscle for this fight, this tells me that he is willing to give up some of his mobility for added power. He probably knows that he won't have the oxygen to dart in and out the way he likes to do. I think that Machida is coming to bang in this fight and will try to do what BJ Penn did to Fitch. I don't know if it will work, but you gotta take risks sometimes.:confused02:


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## osmium

I've never liked the matchup standing for Machida's style. The reach advantage is going to screw up his ability to leap in with strikes. Page showed that Bones might actually be very vulnerable to leg kicks however and I think making this a grinding fight where he wears down Bones with leg kicks is Machida's best shot at winning. He should fight Bones the way Shogun fought him the first time around.


----------



## Drogo

Rampage managed to cut off space against Machida and pin him against the cage now and then. Bones is faster, less predictable and has a massive reach compared to Jackson so if Rampage can do it then it is hard for me to imagine Bones not being able to do the same thing only more so.

Is Machida a better striker? Yeah but Bones reach helps negate that. Bones is also going to be a very solid 20 pounds bigger than Machida, who is a small LHW. I think this is a nightmare match up for Machida, I expect Bones to win pretty easily.


----------



## Rauno

JBJ by domination.


----------



## Risto

This is an easy one. Jones will win. 100%.


----------



## DragonStriker

Jon Jones by whatever Jon Jones wants which is scary.


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## XxDEATHSHEADxX

I dislike Jones for admittedly irrational reasons. It honestly isn't even his fault. I just hate that he was allowed to win the world title against a Shogun who clearly shouldn't have been fighting him at that time coming off injuries.

So I want to see Jones get destroyed.

And Machida just isn't the man to do it.

I honestly just see Machida getting destroyed in a way that's so brutal and one sided that it leaves Machida fans tearing up in a fetal position for days.

This fight is going to be ugly...

I know Shogun haters will point to the first fight to disagree but I honestly think the only hope against Jones is a Shogun at 110% that can get in on him with a flurry of power punches.

I wouldn't be surprised if Machida goes down ugly like in the first round but it'll probably be a 2nd or 3rd round TKO.


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## Roflcopter

Machida is sick Im hearing. Flu like symptoms.

Jones via stoppage if true.


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## VikingKing

Roflcopter said:


> Machida is sick Im hearing. Flu like symptoms.
> 
> Jones via stoppage if true.


They are already looking for excuses huh:thumb02:


----------



## tap nap or snap

Roflcopter said:


> *Machida is sick Im hearing. Flu like symptoms.
> *
> Jones via stoppage if true.


damn i hope not


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## LL

Machida by submission or Jones by decision, it'll be a competitive fight though.


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## limba

War Bones!


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## Budhisten

War Cones!


----------



## oldfan

war phones?


----------



## Budhisten

War drones?


----------



## oldfan

war stones!


----------



## Budhisten

War scones!










How long can we keep this going?


----------



## Roflcopter

War Lyoto!


----------



## TheBadGuy

War Gnomes!!!











Had to...


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## Budhisten

War clones!


----------



## G_Land

War Loans?


----------



## Budhisten

War tones?






**** yeah


----------



## oldfan

War Joans!


----------



## Budhisten

War trombones!


----------



## G_Land

War Flintstones!!!


----------



## Budhisten

War cyclones!


----------



## TheBadGuy

War probes?


----------



## Budhisten

Dude that doesn't rhyme  Or does it?


----------



## _JB_




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## mastodon2222

K R Y said:


> *Please conduct all discussion regarding this fight in this topic. All other threads will be merged.*​


I'm a Machida fan, but this fight won't be close,,,Jones will make him look like all the others before him, short and slow. Hope I'm wrong tho :thumbsup:


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## oldfan




----------



## Hellboy

Machida didn't know what to do when the camera was on him just before. :laugh:


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## BIRDMANUK

Machida to stop Jones in 3rd


----------



## Hellboy

Machida didn't know what to do when the camera was on him just before. :laugh:


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## AmdM

Breed him, breed out...


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## Shoegazer

Tonight has a weird feel...expect the unexpected


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## cdtcpl

Shoegazer said:


> Tonight has a weird feel...expect the unexpected


JBJ via flying triangle?


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## TheReturn

My body is so ready for this


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## Shoegazer

cdtcpl said:


> JBJ via flying triangle?


Something crazy and spectacular, either way


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## Budhisten

I agree - tonight has been a weird night, something feels different tonight...

Still see Jones winning though :/


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## chosenFEW

if lyoto wins it will be by a palhares type leg lock.


besides that, i see jones by UD


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## XxDEATHSHEADxX

Part of me is saying COME ON, MACHIDA!

Part of me is saying RUN, MACHIDA! RUN FOR YOUR LIFE!


----------



## AJClark

I just don't know anymore...

I'm keeping my mouth shut.

(JBJ by steel chair to the back of the head)


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## AmdM

Shaite, i'm a pile of nerves right now...


----------



## Budhisten

I love it when your mind tells you "Holy hell, you're about to watch Jon Jones fight Lyoto Machida!"

I happens with every damn main-event!


----------



## Atilak

My brain says JBJ takes this.

But I have feeling that Lyoto will pull something crazy and win this. He has that hunger in his movement like before Randy fight. I never saw that in Lyoto before. He looks ready to go for kill.

Edit: I think that even if JBJ propably will win. Lyoto will make him look beatable/human/mortal.


----------



## xxpillowxxjp

Anyone else notice Jones came out to the same song Floyd mayweather Jr did in his last fight? Ironic?


----------



## cdtcpl

AJClark said:


> (JBJ by steel chair to the back of the head)


Rogan: WHERE DID SHOGUN COME FROM?

Goldie: I don't know Joe but he just entered the cage with a chair.

Rogan: CAN HE DO THAT? DOES IT MATTER? 

Goldie: Here we GO!


----------



## chosenFEW

jbj has been coming out to that song for a while now


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## TheReturn

Budhisten said:


> I love it when your mind tells you "Holy hell, you're about to watch Jon Jones fight Lyoto Machida!"
> 
> I happens with every damn main-event!


HAha right? This fights going to be so great. Start already lol .


----------



## box

Here we go ladies. Should be a great cap to the night.


----------



## Ape City

Here We Goooo! Machida looked pumped coming out! WAR Machida!!


----------



## vilify

I'm pulling for Jones but got a feeling he's going to get wrecked. I've seen this movie before.


----------



## Budhisten

Jones looks like he's on his way to a party? Haha, don't get too cocky now son


----------



## Canadian Psycho

It won't be the same without Rashad entering the cage afterwards.


----------



## Soakked

Apollo Creed entrance lol


----------



## Walker

WAR JONES!!! :thumb02:

Both fighters looked super relaxed- totally stoked for this fight!​


----------



## Redline7

War Jones!.. I'm a bit worried though.


----------



## Sousa

I still think JBJ is a little big for the LHW division


----------



## OHKO

So many fights ending in the 1st round tonight. Could this one be the same?


----------



## Budhisten

This ain't going five rounds - that's for sure


----------



## cdtcpl

Lyoto looks tight/tense.


----------



## OHKO

Lyoto pretty successful so far. I might even give the 1st round to Lyoto.


----------



## Atilak

Wow.. Lyoto getting comfortable there.. Lets see how Jones answer to it.. Suprised that he didnt shot yet..


----------



## cdtcpl

Interesting round. Lyoto landed the harder shots but JBJ landed more.


----------



## arkanoydz

damn.. not bad at all from lyoto... he basically did what he's always done in the past..


----------



## IcemanJacques

Im saying 10-9 Machida.


----------



## chosenFEW

jones need to clinch


----------



## XxDEATHSHEADxX

War Dragon!
Jones Is Scared!


----------



## Roflcopter

Lyoto 10-9.


I have no idea why people were overlooking that Lyoto is the best fighter Jones has fought. You can't crown his ass before he even fights anyone ffs.


----------



## Ape City

10-9 Machida.


----------



## Shoegazer

10-10

Jones looks a little concerned to me, personally.


----------



## AJClark

Holy shit Jon's getting hit!!!!

My heart won't calm down!!!


----------



## SerJ

Why is this fight making me so nervous? I like it. 
Anyway, I gave the first to Lyoto.


----------



## BWoods

Think Lyoto won the first round. Jon didn't land anything incredible and Machida flurried on him a few times.


----------



## Walker

Oh man bad corner advice for Jones- "Your're owning the guy!" -really not yet.​


----------



## NoYards

Picked Jones, but gave this one to Lyoto.

The dragon is looking very god so far.


----------



## Budhisten

Love it when you get a little shaky and adrenaline is pumping over a fight I'm not involved in myself!


----------



## Walker

HUGE takedown but this is the first time Jon has been in trouble in any fight. Great stuff so far.​


----------



## cdtcpl

Omg Omg Omg Omg Omg

EDIT: Lyoto is very flat footed now!


----------



## Walker

HOly fukk JON JONES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!​


----------



## OHKO

What a monster...


----------



## Budhisten

Oooooh shit


----------



## Canadian Psycho

Jesus Christ!!


----------



## chosenFEW

wow jones did that without none of that wrestling lay n pray shit either


----------



## Vale_Tudo

Thats the f'in future right there guys!


----------



## XxDEATHSHEADxX

So much for that.
So much for the light heavyweight division.


----------



## TheReturn

No F***ING WAY!!!!!!!!


----------



## RHYNO2K

what a crazy night!!!!!!!


----------



## UKMMAGURU

keyword motherfuckers:

*OVERMATCHED*


----------



## Shoegazer

JBJ is a beast, folks. Unbeatable in my book.


----------



## cdtcpl

Who matches against JBJ? WHO?


----------



## IcemanJacques

Wow, what a vicious night.


----------



## AJClark

Oh my... Disposed


----------



## SerJ

Blown away!


----------



## Cerroney!

This guy is insane. Really.

Who can beat this guy in the LH Division?

Awesome second round for the champ.


----------



## box

Like I said some time ago, Jones by whatever he wants. He hung striking easily, rocked Machida, then subs him standing.. Jones is the man.


----------



## xxpillowxxjp

Damn...


----------



## LL

Damn, that was hard to watch but props to Jones, dude's a beast.


----------



## cdtcpl

Can we stop saying his chin isn't tested now?


----------



## RedRocket44

murdered.

So much for that. Outmatched and outclassed.


----------



## dsmjrv

amazing... and we got to see his chin tested


----------



## chosenFEW

4 fights in 10 months!!!!!!!!


----------



## Sousa

Needs to move up, its obvious


----------



## Atilak

Im speechless....

That looked nasty... Lyoto falling on the ground sleeping with bloody face... Good reminder that we are looking at ultimate fighting...


----------



## hadoq

ok, who's next? I don't see who can beat that guy, who's left in the division? Hendo?


----------



## Walker

Quick fight but utterly fantastic! Wow great stuff. :thumb02:​


----------



## chosenFEW

jesus has one bad ass soldier


----------



## ptw

Jon jones keeps beating up my favorite fighters man, I hate this guy!


----------



## Ape City

That was brutal. What fantastic night of violence.


----------



## Budhisten

Somewhere BC is having a quiet weep


----------



## XxDEATHSHEADxX

It's going to take a Shogun at peak performance or a Hendo who just leaves it all in the 1st round, IMO.

Anyone in the division now that hangs in the Octagon with that guy for too long is just going to get over powered.


----------



## RHYNO2K

I reckon they should give 2 SOTN bonuses tonight


----------



## TraMaI

Atilak said:


> Im speechless....
> 
> That looked nasty... Lyoto falling on the ground sleeping with bloody face... Good reminder that we are looking at ultimate fighting...


Dude the way he just dropped him like he was a dead body horrified me on some deep level. Like legit scared me for some reason. Jon Jones is a ******* monster.


----------



## Shoegazer

I suppose Hendo has the right hand hail mary...but other than that, I see no legitimate, realistic threat to JBJ.


----------



## arkanoydz

...damn...
i've always rooted against jones but gotta give credit where credit is due....
and to think this guy is on his way to heavyweight .


----------



## OHKO

Dana was asking Jones if he wanted some guy in the cage with him. Could it be Rashad again?


----------



## G_Land

Bobby needs to get un banned STAT!!!


----------



## UKMMAGURU

Budhisten said:


> Somewhere BC is having a quiet weep


raise01:

lol


----------



## XxDEATHSHEADxX

Jones won't look nearly as good at Heavyweight as he does not.


----------



## oldfan

Budhisten said:


> Somewhere BC is having a quiet weep


Keep an eye on the news for someone going postal in Germany.

Do Europeans know that term?


----------



## Alessia

TraMaI said:


> Dude the way he just dropped him like he was a dead body horrified me on some deep level. Like legit scared me for some reason. Jon Jones is a ******* monster.


I'm glad I'm not he only one. The way he dropped him combined with the fact that Lyoto is one of my favorite fighters scared me a bit.

With that said. I'm finally giving credit to Jon where it should be. I don't see anyone beating him at LHW. Maybe a Hendo H-Bomb, but I don't see that landing at all.


----------



## Squirrelfighter

There is no one at LHW who will beat Jones. I'm sold, he's unbeatable at 205.


----------



## AJClark

Man, for a minute there I was thinking 'shit! Lyoto could actually do this!'

How foolish of me.

So very foolish.


----------



## John8204

RHYNO2K said:


> I reckon they should give 2 SOTN bonuses tonight


They really should just give bonuses left and right to half the card.


----------



## aerius

cdtcpl said:


> Can we stop saying his chin isn't tested now?


He's got a pretty good chin, but even worse for his opponents, his recovery is also quite fast. You can knock him back and wobble him a bit, but it's a bitch to close the range on him for the followup kill shots.


----------



## Budhisten

If anyone cares 2/3 judges gave the first round to Jones


----------



## IcemanJacques

TraMaI said:


> Dude the way he just dropped him like he was a dead body horrified me on some deep level. Like legit scared me for some reason. Jon Jones is a ******* monster.


Haha same here man. And I used the exact same word to describe him. He's a monster. Almost felt like he just killed a guy.


----------



## FatFreeMilk

No one can beat this guy ATM. Life's hard being a Bones hater


----------



## AmdM

Feck this.


----------



## 6toes

I was seeing a Machida upset after that first round. But once Jones got that big hop-slam I got the feeling that was just the beginning of the end...didn't see that coming at all though, guess we know what happens now when Bones takes a hit...he chokes you out standing and drops you dead on your face :confused05:


----------



## PheelGoodInc

Jones vs Silva has officially passed Silva vs GSP in my books. What a ******* fight. Jones is not human. He was sent back in time to show the future of MMA.


----------



## Atilak

TraMaI said:


> Dude the way he just dropped him like he was a dead body horrified me on some deep level. Like legit scared me for some reason. Jon Jones is a ******* monster.


Same here man.. Being MMA fighter myself.. This shaked me.. Even though I been in the cage already.. 
We are really watching/doing crazy sport man..


----------



## NoYards

Best PPV in a long time ... and the main event, for a two round fight that wasn't a toe-to-toe slug fest, that was one amazing fight.

Personally I much prefer this kind of fight ... two people playing chess, both skilled, looking for a chance to exploit a weakness ... whoever was going to win it wasn't going to be by a lucky punch.

I think Jones proved a lot tonight ... to the fans and himself.

And props to Machida .. he's still tops in my book for a fighter I love to watch.


----------



## oldfan

Some one please explain to me why Buffer announced that Mir won by TKO when NOG TAPPED.

And announced that Jones won by submission when MACHIDA DID NOT TAP.

it ****ing drives me crazy.


----------



## Budhisten

Scary looking finish as you guys mentioned... Dead-drop + "Cool guys don't look at explosions" attitude = Bad bad man


----------



## John8204

At the end of the fight, somewhere in Chicago, Rashad Evans just broke his other thumb. :thumbsup:


----------



## RHYNO2K

What an amazing PPV... it left me speechless


----------



## Thunder1

unreal. my ppv of the fight frose at 3:10 of the second round. whats going on? Or what happened?


----------



## marcthegame

I'm gonna say it now, anderson silva is the greatest talent i have ever seen. But damn jone jones is the closest thing i have seen to be unbeatable. 

These two needs to fight before it gets to late.


----------



## oldfan

Budhisten said:


> Scary looking finish as you guys mentioned... Dead-drop + "Cool guys don't look at explosions" attitude = Bad bad man


He said he knew he was asleep.

If you were looking for a reason to think he's an ass. there it is.


----------



## bogey_j

*Most Arrogant Choke Ever?*

is it just me or was that the smuggiest choke ever? you're not even supposed to put guys to sleep on the feet with a choke like that. and the look on jones face walking away as machida flopped over like a bag of potatoes....so cocky. i gotta admit though, that was a grown man move right there :confused05:


----------



## NoYards

RHYNO2K said:


> I reckon they should give 2 SOTN bonuses tonight


Really ... one would have though that there was no way on earth anyone was going to beat Mir's tonight, but shit!!!! Hell, Give them both 2 SOTNs.


----------



## Acc1042

oldfan said:


> He said he knew he was asleep.
> 
> If you were looking for a reason to think he's an ass. there it is.


It's not over till the referee calls it.


----------



## marcthegame

What do you want from the man? I don't like him but its a fight shit happens. Mir was by far worst i don't even think he went near big nog.


----------



## TraMaI

IDK what it was but somethign about that whole exchange was seriously terrifying. He looked like a legitimate psychopath for a second. Like Dexter levels of psychopath.


----------



## DragonStriker

Jon Jones is a pure beast.


----------



## AmdM

Guess today is as good a day as any other to re-start smoking... So sad...


----------



## Notoriousxpinoy

Sorry I dont think Silva has a chance in hell to beat Jon Jones.. I'm officially sold on Jon Jones.. I doubted him and hated him but he's the real deal man...

I can't even describe what I saw..

Jon Jones is the best right now.


----------



## Walker

You are an idiot.​


----------



## Budhisten

oldfan said:


> He said he knew he was asleep.
> 
> If you were looking for a reason to think he's an ass. there it is.


Well he could have been a bit more gentle on the release that's for sure, but I'm not gonna hate him for it...

Just feel really bad for Lyoto, he actually did very well


----------



## LL

Machida didn't tap what was Jones supposed to do?


----------



## SideWays222

Yeah Jon Jones showed his true colors when he let Machidas face hit the floor. The ref called off the fight... Machida is limp... help the poor guy out and let him down gentle. Dont drop him like he is some object.

Maybe Jon Jones is going to start embracing the "evil" persona. Would be kind of cool to see that.


EDIT/

I guess i kind of miss understood. The choke itself was not arrogant in any way shape or form. Thats a very very absurd thing to say.


----------



## oldfan

Acc1042 said:


> It's not over till the referee calls it.


I'm talking about the way he threw him down with contempt.


----------



## Vale_Tudo

Wow.. Im still stunned! Who can beat this 24 year old kid? 
Hendo? Not a chance in hell
Anderson? Nope, he wont get back up until the ref pulls Jon off.
Junior? Honestly, I'd pick Jon.

This is absolutely insane


----------



## Budhisten

TraMaI said:


> IDK what it was but somethign about that whole exchange was seriously terrifying. He looked like a legitimate psychopath for a second. Like Dexter levels of psychopath.


It was scary yes, the whole Machida falling to the floor and Jones just walking away got to me as well 

Also when he adjusted his grip and just pushed his own arm further into Machida's neck, looked like murder


----------



## marcthegame

Notoriousxpinoy said:


> Sorry I dont think Silva has a chance in hell to beat Jon Jones.. I'm officially sold on Jon Jones.. I doubted him and hated him but he's the real deal man...
> 
> I can't even describe what I saw..
> 
> Jon Jones is the best right now.


I guess u did not see machida hitting the man...u got the best stiker...faster better than machida and has a chin for days. Anderson is 2x mentally stronger than machida. He is also a better fighter.


----------



## TraMaI

Atilak said:


> Same here man.. Being MMA fighter myself.. This shaked me.. Even though I been in the cage already..
> We are really watching/doing crazy sport man..


Maybe that's what it was. Being able to put myself in Lyoto's position (not exactly, but I've fought MMA in the past so I can kinda guess and then multiply it by a million) and thinking of someone just absolutely destroying me like that? Then walking away like "Clean up this mess, ref." ****. I've never, ever gotten that feeling from watching a fight before. I LOVE MMA!

What a fantastic fight that was.


----------



## John8204

TheLyotoLegion said:


> Machida didn't tap what was Jones supposed to do?


He should have pulled guard landed the triangle throw his middle fingers in the air and say 

"Rashad I've got something for ya"


----------



## madrappa

lmao @ arrogant choke. My call was Machida and for good reason, to me up until machida got taken down, jones seemed confused and unable to connect on machida.

but to then pull off a choke like that is spectacular. it wasnt his fault lyoto didnt tap and went out, i dont get all the hate for jones

and now after he beat machida (in my mind this was his most questionable matchup) im no longer betting against jones. yeh dude has confidence but he is undeniably phenomenal


----------



## SerJ

Who's next you might ask? Who the hell knows! This dude is legit scary! Can we just get silva in there please? All you guys that say he hasn't fought enough to warrant a fight with silva, please shut up. Jones is destroying everyone. Gotta make it happen before it's too late!


----------



## Walker

oldfan said:


> Some one please explain to me why Buffer announced that Mir won by TKO when NOG TAPPED.
> 
> And announced that Jones won by submission when MACHIDA DID NOT TAP.
> 
> it ****ing drives me crazy.


 
Dunno about the Mir fight announcement but Jones did win by submission- tap or not. There doesn't have to be a tap to win by that ya know.​


----------



## Ddog0587

Just been Boned :thumbsup:


----------



## Roflcopter

People are way too busy slurping Jones' semen ignoring how vulnerable he looked.

Conveniently forgetting that out there is a better wrestler that won't get so easily taken down in Rashad and a dude that hits way harder in Dan Henderson still out there.


----------



## PheelGoodInc

Agreed with both. It was the totality of the circumstances that got to me though. Seeing Lyoto, the former champ and a black belt in BJJ none the less; drop like a sack of potatoes sent a chill down my spine.

What an eerie moment.


----------



## NoYards

Thunder1 said:


> unreal. my ppv of the fight frose at 3:10 of the second round. whats going on? Or what happened?


I'd suggest you download a torrent and watch it , because there is no way to do it justice with words ... the "bad assyist" stand up choke I've ever seen ... think of some big dude grabbing a school girl by the throat and strangling her to unconsciousness while whispering a love poem in her ear. raise01:


----------



## Thunder1

WHAT HAPPENED? my pos cable company froze the fight at 3:10 in the second round. I'm still staring at a frozen screen.


----------



## vilify

SerJ said:


> Who's next you might ask? Who the hell knows! This dude is legit scary! Can we just get silva in there please? All you guys that say he hasn't fought enough to warrant a fight with silva, please shut up. Jones is destroying everyone. Gotta make it happen before it's too late!



I don't want to see that shit. Silva is my favorite fighter. :thumbsdown:


----------



## Notoriousxpinoy

marcthegame said:


> I guess u did not see machida hitting the man...u got the best stiker...faster better than machida and has a chin for days. Anderson is 2x mentally stronger than machida. He is also a better fighter.


I guess you didn't see how he disposed of Machida? Nor did you see how easy he took Machida down with his sumo wrestling base?

Now Jones on top Silva will be more damaging than Sonnen on top of Silva.


----------



## Hellboy

I love how Lyoto is now a devastating power puncher and tested Jones chin.


----------



## TraMaI

oldfan said:


> I'm talking about the way he threw him down with contempt.


He didn't throw him he dropped him. There really isn't much else to do in a situation like that either. Two options: Choke him longer to set him down or Drop him to relieve pressure. Tricky situation, standing guillotines.



Budhisten said:


> It was scary yes, the whole Machida falling to the floor and Jones just walking away got to me as well
> 
> Also when he adjusted his grip and just pushed his own arm further into Machida's neck, looked like murder


I know man. For some reason when I saw Machida's arm go limp I was like "**** HES DEAD!" That angle was horrid. Lyoto is not going to get that cramp out for a long while.


----------



## dsmjrv

NoYards said:


> I'd suggest you download a torrent and watch it , because there is no way to do it justice with words ... the "bad assyist" stand up choke I've ever seen ... think of some big dude grabbing a school girl by the throat and strangling her to unconsciousness while whispering a love poem in her ear. raise01:


wow lol + rep


----------



## No_Mercy

A formidable opponent vanquished. I knew Lyoto would be able to pose problems, but JBJ's strength was too much. 

Good win. Good luck to all the rest of the fighters in LHW. Well actually Hendo is ready to go. Man, if Hendo somehow pulls this off that would cap his career with a MAJOR EXCLAMATION POINT!!!


----------



## Acc1042

NoYards said:


> I'd suggest you download a torrent and watch it , because there is no way to do it justice with words ... the "bad assyist" stand up choke I've ever seen ... think of some big dude grabbing a school girl by the throat and strangling her to unconsciousness while whispering a love poem in her ear. raise01:


The school girl was also floored by the stunning poem.

Just a random thought not relevant to above post, if Jones gently placed Machida down would people call him fake again?


----------



## oldfan

Walker said:


> Dunno about the Mir fight announcement but Jones did win by submission- tap or not. There doesn't have to be a tap to win by that ya know.​






> sub·mis·sion   [suhb-mish-uhn] Show IPA
> noun
> 1.
> an act or instance of submitting.
> 2.
> the condition of having submitted.
> 3.
> submissive conduct or attitude.


Please tell me which definition of submission applies here.

Lyoto did not submit. He lost consciousness.

Is a KO a submission to strikes?


----------



## marcthegame

Henderson has zero chance at landing that h bomb, he did not touch silva and he will not get jones.


----------



## Fieos

That was the most vulnerable Jones has ever looked and in fairness it wasn't 'that' vulnerable. Jones is a human wrecking machine. He played Machida's game against Machida better than any have done previously and when he found out how risky it was; he just decided to wrap up the fight. I would have appreciated Jones assisting Machida to the floor but I'm not going to hold it against Jones. 

Fantastic night of fights. I hope Nog heals well and I appreciate the kind things Mir had to say about Big Nog.


----------



## Roflcopter

I would like to see Anderson fight Jones at 205 now though.


----------



## TraMaI

oldfan said:


> Please tell me which definition of submission applies here.
> 
> Lyoto did not submit. He lost consciousness.
> 
> Is a KO a submission to strikes?


It's called a technical submission.

The technique its self is also called a submission. By logic:

Jon Jones uses technique > Jon Jones wins by said technique > Technique Jon Jones used was a submission > Jon Jones wins by submission.


----------



## John8204

Thunder1 said:


> WHAT HAPPENED? my pos cable company froze the fight at 3:10 in the second round. I'm still staring at a frozen screen.







that's what you missed


----------



## Budhisten

So:

KOTN - Zombie

SOTN - Mir (Perhaps Jones, both were horrifying - but you gotta spread the love)

FOTN - Jones vs Machida

Edit: Not official, just my guesses


----------



## Hellboy

The guy who would give Jones the most trouble at 205? 

I reckon Chael Sonnen would give the best account. He wouldn't win but the way he goes at TDs would never give Jones space.


----------



## 420atalon

vilify said:


> I don't want to see that shit. Silva is my favorite fighter. :thumbsdown:


Silva would destroy Jones. Jones was nervous as hell and once he got hit once was gunshy. Silva would pick him apart and knock him out before Jones could even get his hands on him.

Jones has great skills and is built perfectly for his style but he showed some mental weakness tonight and when he finally faces someone that he can't put away easily then he is going to be in trouble.


----------



## oldfan

TraMaI said:


> It's called a technical submission.



By who?

And why did Buffer announce that Mir won by TKO?:confused02:


----------



## 420atalon

Hellboy said:


> The guy who would give Jones the most trouble at 205?
> 
> I reckon Chael Sonnen would give the best account. He wouldn't win but the way he goes at TDs would never give Jones space.


1 word

Triangle.


----------



## marcthegame

Hellboy said:


> The guy who would give Jones the most trouble at 205?
> 
> I reckon Chael Sonnen would give the best account. He wouldn't win but the way he goes at TDs would never give Jones space.


I use to think that, but jones will take sonnen down and elbow his ass to death. I'm all game to see that, if maia took sonnen down Jones will do it to.


----------



## Soakked

That was a great fight, competitive until the takedown. Awesome finish. BJJ practitioners need to learn not to use wrist control with him. It allows him to slice down with elbows. Good win for JBJ he's the truth without a doubt.


----------



## Roflcopter

I just realized it was Superman punch that dropped Lyoto.

Lyoto literally never saw it.


----------



## Walker

Roflcopter said:


> People are way too busy slurping Jones' semen ignoring how vulnerable he looked.
> 
> Conveniently forgetting that out there is a better wrestler that won't get so easily taken down in Rashad and a dude that hits way harder in Dan Henderson still out there.


That's funny since neither Rashad nor Hendo can fight like Machida and pose the same difficulties he posed in the first round. Hendo cannot throw the H-bomb in the same zip code that Jones would fight him at and Rashad has the same problems with the reach advantage Jones has over him. They are both wrestlers and have that but Jones is no slouch there as well and can keep it at range when he wants to.

To compare what Machida did early in this fight to what those 2 could possibly do is laughable. Hendo can't move or attack like that and Rashad can move better but cannot attack the same way at all.​


----------



## aerius

Hellboy said:


> I love how Lyoto is now a devastating power puncher and tested Jones chin.


He isn't, but at the same time he's not a pillowfist like Forrest Griffin because that same straight left dropped Thiago Silva and Rashad on their asses. It's not 1-shot KO power like Hendo or Liddell's overhand right, but neither is it a punch that the average fighter can eat without getting knocked down.


----------



## TraMaI

oldfan said:


> By who?
> 
> And why did Buffer announce that Mir won by TKO?:confused02:


By the rules? Haven't you ever seen someone choked unconcious/get something broken in a fight before? It's ruled a technical submission.

EDIT: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submission_(combat_sports)


EDIT2: Whoa shit, according to that Wiki and depending on the rules of combat, Buffer could have been correct in calling it a TKO victory.



> A technical submission may occur when the referee or doctor stops the fight because a fighter has sustained an injury or becomes unconscious while in a submission hold. An example would be a fighter's arm breaking in an armbar, or a fighter passing out in a choke hold. In both cases the fighter refuses to tap and an official decides that the fighter can not safely continue to fight.* Such a match outcome may be called a technical submission or a technical knockout (TKO) depending on the rules of combat used for the match.*


----------



## Vale_Tudo

marcthegame said:


> I guess u did not see machida hitting the man...u got the best stiker...faster better than machida and has a chin for days. Anderson is 2x mentally stronger than machida. He is also a better fighter.


gtfo. 
If Chael Sonnen can keep you on your back for 23 minutes, Jon Jones wont have a problem keeping you there either, and Jon doesnt throw pillows, he throws vicious elbows.


----------



## vilify

Roflcopter said:


> People are way too busy slurping Jones' semen ignoring how vulnerable he looked.
> 
> Conveniently forgetting that out there is a better wrestler that won't get so easily taken down in Rashad and a dude that hits way harder in Dan Henderson still out there.


Machida is legit he gave all he could and still got wrecked. As for Rashad his striking isn't as fluid as Machida nor is he as quick. Jones wont have too much to worry about expect for his power which is easily avoidable. 

Hendo is even less of a threat. He has KO power in his hands but is quite slow and predictable. His cardio also sucks.

It'll take some kind of fluke for Jones to lose.


----------



## Hellboy

aerius said:


> He isn't, but at the same time he's not a pillowfist like Forrest Griffin because that same straight left dropped Thiago Silva and Rashad on their asses. It's not 1-shot KO power like Hendo or Liddell's overhand right, but neither is it a punch that the average fighter can eat without getting knocked down.


Exactly my point. Yes, his chin was tested. But there are harder hitting guys who are better wrestlers out there waiting for Jones.


----------



## NoYards

oldfan said:


> By who?
> 
> And why did Buffer announce that Mir won by TKO?:confused02:


My guess is that the ref didn't see Nog tap, but he did see Nog's arm "snap" .. and stopped the fight (Nog was tapping on Mir's back side which was looked like it may have been out of sight of the ref.)

That's just a guess though, and it could be Buffer was on drugs.


----------



## Roflcopter

marcthegame said:


> I use to think that, but jones will take sonnen down and elbow his ass to death. I'm all game to see that, if maia took sonnen down Jones will do it to.


Jones doesn't really like shooting though. He has a terrible frame for it. His best stuff is Greco-Roman stuff and takedowns from the clinch. However it's a catch 22 because to clinch he has to give up his style of being long and get inside, so typically as we saw tonight, he waits for his opponent to come in before he goes for any clinches and takedowns.

This is why it took so long for him to take down Lyoto, who is hard to catch and stays exclusively on the outside.


----------



## oldfan

TraMaI said:


> By the rules? Haven't you ever seen someone choked unconcious/get something broken in a fight before? It's ruled a technical submission.
> 
> EDIT: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submission_(combat_sports)


I'm saying it should be called something else. It should be noted that the man did not submit.

Nog did tap and they ca;ll it a TKO ??


----------



## marcthegame

Vale_Tudo said:


> gtfo.
> If Chael Sonnen can keep you on your back for 23 minutes, Jon Jones wont have a problem keeping you there either, and Jon doesnt throw pillows, he throws vicious elbows.


after the rematch get back to me. As far as im concern silva was laying there waiting to submit him. It was not like he was in any trouble at all on his back.


----------



## Fieos

I think the reason they called it a 'TKO' is because 'Amputation' wasn't an option.


----------



## Roflcopter

Walker said:


> That's funny since neither Rashad nor Hendo can fight like Machida and pose the same difficulties he posed in the first round. Hendo cannot throw the H-bomb in the same zip code that Jones would fight him at and Rashad has the same problems with the reach advantage Jones has over him. They are both wrestlers and have that but Jones is no slouch there as well and can keep it at range when he wants to.
> 
> To compare what Machida did early in this fight to what those 2 could possibly do is laughable. Hendo can't move or attack like that and Rashad can move better but cannot attack the same way at all.​


Too bad Hendo is the one that will dictate the range. Hendo has great clinch skills so not only is he not afraid of fully committed to getting on the inside, he embraces it.


----------



## oldfan

TraMaI said:


> By the rules? Haven't you ever seen someone choked unconcious/get something broken in a fight before? It's ruled a technical submission.
> 
> EDIT: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submission_(combat_sports)
> 
> 
> EDIT2: Whoa shit, according to that Wiki and depending on the rules of combat, Buffer could have been correct in calling it a TKO victory.


That link is to an empty page.

And Nog did tap.


----------



## Acc1042

Would you rather Jones sing him a lullaby as he puts him to sleep?

There isn't to many option you can do in that situation. Drop him or ease him down? 

And as for his face when walking away, he was hyped and felt like he just proved himself to the world and himself. Some people react by doing back flips off the cage wall, some climb the cage and smile and put their hand up. I don't think it has much to be with him being smug.


----------



## TraMaI

oldfan said:


> I'm saying it should be called something else. It should be noted that the man did not submit.
> 
> Nog did tap and they ca;ll it a TKO ??


1) I think it was more there was no time for him to submit. He went out in like 5 seconds. I get what you're saying, but they're ruled technical submissions all the same.

2) From the wiki I edited into the last post



> A technical submission may occur when the referee or doctor stops the fight because a fighter has sustained an injury or becomes unconscious while in a submission hold. An example would be a fighter's arm breaking in an armbar, or a fighter passing out in a choke hold. In both cases the fighter refuses to tap and an official decides that the fighter can not safely continue to fight. *Such a match outcome may be called a technical submission or a technical knockout (TKO) depending on the rules of combat used for the match.*


I'm pretty sure Buffer just goofed and called it a TKO because he hear the athletic commision say "technical" while the crowd was going ape shit and he couldn't hear anything else, but he could still be right. Not sure that the Toronto Athletic Commission has the exact same rules as we do in the states, so he could be right.

EDIT: my bad on the link, forgot the other parenthesis. Here


----------



## locnott

Boo Hoo,


----------



## IcemanJacques

Roflcopter said:


> Too bad Hendo is the one that will dictate the range. Hendo has great clinch skills so not only is he not afraid of fully committed to getting on the inside, he embraces it.


When was the last time Hendo fought well on the inside or in the clinch? Shogun has below average wrestling and he done better than Hendo in that aspect. Jones will throw him around just like he does to everybody else.


----------



## DragonStriker

I don't see anybody beating Jones for a while even Rashad I don't think he can do it after seeing what he did to Machida dude is scary good.


----------



## Cal2002

At this point, I don't see anybody in the division giving Jones any trouble.

Silva has refused to fight for the championship at LHW due to his friendship with Lyoto. Based on the outcome of this fight, and the possibility of Silva not fighting that much longer, I would not be very suprised to see Silva calling Dana to ask for a shot at Jones. I think this is a superfight everyone would love to see.


----------



## marcthegame

Man **** it we should train our asses off and try to beat jon jones. Its gonna be a while since someone beats him at 205.


----------



## Fieos

Henderson will always have a puncher's chance but after tonight are we 'really' going to quickly try to solve the Jones' puzzle by throwing a guy that can fight at 185lbs at him? I say give the fight to the most deserving guy, not based on theoretical match-making. 

Plus this is generally where Forrest steps up and is made to look like a goober again.


----------



## vilify

420atalon said:


> Silva would destroy Jones. Jones was nervous as hell and once he got hit once was gunshy. Silva would pick him apart and knock him out before Jones could even get his hands on him.
> 
> Jones has great skills and is built perfectly for his style but he showed some mental weakness tonight and when he finally faces someone that he can't put away easily then he is going to be in trouble.


I'm pretty sure Jones would employe a more aggressive wrestling tactic against Silva. He would be silly to try and strike with him. As we both know if Jones gets you down he will do serious damage and thats where I fear for Silva.


----------



## TraMaI

He did tap but it didn't seem to me the ref was looking at the tap. By the time he tapped his shit was broken, I think the ref was reacting to that more than the tap.


----------



## RedRocket44

Fieos said:


> I think the reason they called it a 'TKO' is because 'Amputation' wasn't an option.


lol

the medical suspension list shall be interesting.

Big nog with a broken arm, and lyoto was nearly choked to death.


----------



## Cal2002

marcthegame said:


> Man **** it we should train our asses off and try to beat jon jones. Its gonna be a while since someone beats him at 205.


When you say this, I assume you mean we all train hardcore and as a group fight Jones somewhere. Because if you mean 1 by 1, count me out... :thumbsdown:

/shudder


----------



## Walker

Roflcopter said:


> Too bad Hendo is the one that will dictate the range. Hendo has great clinch skills so not only is he not afraid of fully committed to getting on the inside, he embraces it.


Hang on to that hope if you want to. :thumbsup:​


----------



## Thunder1

*What happened in Jones fight?*

Can someone just let me know how the fight played out. My POS cable company froze the fight at 3:10 of the second round. All was well until then. There still frozen on my screen now. Cox cable sucks ass.


----------



## marcthegame

LOL how the hell are some of yall giving hendo a chance...the man could not hit silva, lost to jake sheilds, has no cardio. Some say he would not beat chael sonnen, so how on earth will he beat jones. Its gonna be like rampage vs jones.


----------



## astrallite

Lyoto landed some big counterpunches in the first round and rocked Jones.

Second round Jones got a takedown, opened Lyoto's face with an elbow, then finished him with a standing guillotine.

And Lyoto didn't tap.


----------



## marcthegame

astrallite said:


> Lyoto landed some big counterpunches in the first round and rocked Jones.
> 
> Second round Jones got a takedown, opened Lyoto's face with an elbow, then finished him with a standing guillotine.
> 
> And Lyoto didn't tap.


before the finsh jon caught him with a punch that dropped machida for a few moments.


----------



## 420atalon

vilify said:


> I'm pretty sure Jones would employe a more aggressive wrestling tactic against Silva. He would be silly to try and strike with him. As we both know if Jones gets you down he will do serious damage and thats where I fear for Silva.


Jones looked scare to commit to getting in close in this fight. Didn't start getting somewhat comfortable until he rocked Lyoto a couple times(second and most important time almost knocking him out). Silva's cat like reflexes and superior striking(best striker in MMA without a doubt) would make things interesting as without a doubt he would catch Jones coming in for takedowns.


----------



## RedRocket44

oldfan said:


> Some one please explain to me why Buffer announced that Mir won by TKO when NOG TAPPED.
> 
> And announced that Jones won by submission when MACHIDA DID NOT TAP.
> 
> it ****ing drives me crazy.


Who cares - they are both on their way to the hospital.

They shouldn't have announced Mir and JBJ as winning by tko or submission. 

They should have announced Big Nog and Machida as losing by 'stupid' for not tapping.


----------



## astrallite

*What happened to "Takedown Machida?"*

Lyoto gained 20lbs of muscle and proclaimed he was going to take Jones down, but instead all he did was defend against takedowns and didn't even try for one himself. :confused02:


----------



## Budhisten

RedRocket44 said:


> Who cares - they are both on their way to the hospital.
> 
> They shouldn't have announced Mir and JBJ as winning by tko or submission.
> 
> They should have announced Big Nog and Machida as losing by 'stupid' for not tapping.


Machida's not, he'll be at the presser


----------



## aerius

Fieos said:


> Henderson will always have a puncher's chance but after tonight are we 'really' going to quickly try to solve the Jones' puzzle by throwing a guy that can fight at 185lbs at him? I say give the fight to the most deserving guy, not based on theoretical match-making.


The only way I can think of to solve the puzzle would be to combine Machida's speed and ability to get in and out with Hendo's iron chin & 1-shot KO power, then stir in a mixing of Liddell's takedown defence and ability to pop right back up to his feet. There's no one I can think of that has that.


----------



## marcthegame

astrallite said:


> Lyoto gained 20lbs of muscle and proclaimed he was going to take Jones down, but instead all he did was defend against takedowns and didn't even try for one himself. :confused02:


it does not matter how technical you are with tdd, when a man picks u up and slamming up he is just moving weight there is nothing u can do. U see it all the time in football when dudes get jacked up.


----------



## OneManArmy

Yeah i don't know. He didn't really look any bigger then he did before, at least from what i could see. He did alright in the first round standing up, but damn that elbow was pretty nasty, as well as the choke. Looks like Jones will be holding the belt for a little while.


----------



## dsmjrv

i feel like in the first round machida was out thinking jones, despite a huge reach disadvantage he was getting the better of the standup.. machida gained some confidence and thought he was "instinctualy" the better striker when in fact he is not naturally better, just smarter... so after a few slightly wild flurries (abandoning his striking strategy) he got clinched and taken down and cut and this gave jones the confidence in which he thrives on and it was soon all over...

i really felt like machida was stupid for going for a KO when he rushed in, he was throwing with bad intentions and looking to finish when his best bet was to stay in his comfort zone and out point the champ...

however he may have felt that he needed to take advantage of his striking advantage before jones figured out how to counter him, he may have thought that with jones confidence low that this was the best time to attack...

i really hope jones has 4 fights in 2012 so we can see this freak of nature work his magic... and i hope we get to see silva up in the mix too


----------



## TraMaI

> Hang on to that hope if you want to.


Completely agree with this. First, Dan has a 71in reach (With Lyoto clocking in at 74, Rampage at 73 and Shogun at 76, respectfully). Know how long Jones' is? 84.5. That's 13.5 inches. Jones also has 5in of height on him and who knows how much weight. Hendo is a natural 185er, Jones is probably better suited at HW. Henderson is a plodding fellow, comes in on straight lines and has one combo to set off that mythical "H-Bomb." (Left leg kick, right hand) He uses it over and over and over and is extremely predictable. 

Compare and contrast to both Machida and Shogun who both 1) have more reach and height and 2) Are WAY better strikers and 3) Are EXTREMELY GOOD IN THE CLINCH. Lyoto has some of the best takedowns in the game, hands down and some serious takedowns on top of that that are would have been very unorthodox to Jones. Shogun has an incredibly good (and active) guard as well as great TDD.

Take that, substitute Lyoto and Shogun's foreign feeling clinch games (to Jones) with Henderson's, which he's played his entire life, and what do you get?


Hendo would get slaughtered. It wouldn't even be fun to watch.


----------



## sove

Amazing event. I haven't logged on here in years, but couldn't resist considering that Jones was sponsored by Toes Up (owner posted here). We were privileged enough to hear the Jones hype before his first UFC fight.


----------



## No_Mercy

You must have been screaming at the TV...holy that sucks ballz.

JBJ came out aggressive, clinched and got the takedown. That was the key moment right there. He inflicted a couple of slashing elbow shots that cut Machida's forehead. Machida got back up and Big John paused it to check on the gash. After cleaning it up they went back to the same position. Let go and JBJ was stalking Machida then he landed a shot while Machida just like against Shogun missed his left counter and got dropped. Machida went for a single, got back up, then got tapped out with a standing guillotine reminiscent of Cody Mckenzie. 

After 10 seconds Machida collapsed to the ground. Man he fought valiantly. JBJ is like a cheat character.


----------



## BrutalKO

...Trippy night of fights! Hammond got jacked by right hand bombs. Brutal. Nice W for Costa. Hominick got countered perfectly in 7 seconds. His mind was elsewhere, it's understandable. Nice win for the Zombie. Tito's left side got squashed by Lil' Nog. Broken rib certainly. What an incredible match for Mir. Got rocked bad and went to the ground. What an amazing Kimura! POP! 15 seconds of amazing Jiu Jitsu. Big Nog's arm snapped like a twig. Mir overcame adversity and won big. Wicked! Mir for certain has Big Nog's number. Mindbender fight with Jones & Machida. What a striking chess match. Bones for the first time tasted real adversity. Machida's straight left again and some kicks caused some concern. Then Jones came out in the 2nd round and did his thing. That elbow was ewwwwww!. As soon as Lyoto saw his blood pour, the game changed. That standing Guillotine was unreal. Machida flopped to the ground like a rubber doll. Out ice cold. Hardest test for Jones so far and he passed. I believe it's all downhill for him now. Crazy night of fights!

*...A great highlight of UFC 140---BRITTNEY'S ASS! GOD! I WOULD EAT IT ALL DAY & NIGHT!...Put Brittney's ass on Arianny---You have the absolute perfect chick!...*


----------



## 420atalon

Jones vs Hendo would look like Jones vs Rampage. Jones using jabs and kicks to keep Hendo out of position/range and then finishing him when he tires(probably in the first or early 2nd round...)


----------



## TraMaI

sove said:


> Amazing event. I haven't logged on here in years, but couldn't resist considering that Jones was sponsored by Toes Up (owner posted here). We were privileged enough to hear the Jones hype before his first UFC fight.













See those shorts? I DESIGNED THOSE!!!! AHHHHHGHGL:JKHGJLSHDLKJHJLGH

Seriously thought, that makes me stupid in my brain thinking that this dude has some connection to me.


----------



## Steroid Steve

Brutal... I think the Dan Miller IFL one is even more gnarly, but I thought Machida was dead for a moment. It was scary...


----------



## Soakked

Hendo would be beat and tkoed. Anderson Silva would pose a major problem for him on the feet, but JBJ is big and fast and if he manages to bring Silva down I don't like Silva's chances. Plus Silva is a MW and JBJ is LHW (built almost like a HW). P4P Silva is better overall, but that's only at this point of JBJ's development. JBJ has the ability to one of the best, the skys the limit.


----------



## TheReturn

LMAO at all the people proclaiming Silva would get smashed by Jones. It was nothing short of an amazing awesome win but lets not go too far.


----------



## Hellboy

Jones wouldn't dare stand with Silva.


----------



## Soakked

TheReturn said:


> LMAO at all the people proclaiming Silva would get smashed by Jones. It was nothing short of an amazing awesome win but lets not go too far.


Silva would KO JBJ on the feet eventually, he's that good. But if JBJ grabs him and manages to take him down JBJ would give him serious problems. If Sonnen can take Silva down, JBJ might be able to. If they were the same weight class (true weightclass)I would pick Siva to win (That's why I said P4P). But size is a major factor. Plus JBJ has the talent and the ability to give anyone a run for their money. His GNP is top notch and is quickly learning how to apply explosive subs.


----------



## VikingKing

This result was very expected.But JBJ wasnt dominating Machida in the striking,this was a little hint to what the weakness of JBJ is.JBS did alot of his flashy striking but didnt work at all against Macida.

Im not Machida fan.I was actually rooting for Jones.But it wasnt before JBJ took it down where it got one sided.

So Machida..you think you deserve "Anderson Silva" money?:thumb02::confused05:


----------



## VikingKing

TheReturn said:


> LMAO at all the people proclaiming Silva would get smashed by Jones. It was nothing short of an amazing awesome win but lets not go too far.



Silva would destroy Jones standing.Without any doubts,i dont think his striking looked impressive at all to be honest.


----------



## BrutalKO

...I knew this would come up! Will Anderson step up and avenge his close friend's loss? 

*...IT'S GOTTA HAPPEN---JON JONES vs. ANDERSON SILVA 2012.
I said before--it would be the Mayweather/Pacquiao of MMA. The demand is about to be overwhelming from the fans and the $$$'s of course to the UFC would be the biggest ever. Only time will tell...*


----------



## Budhisten

Just look at him adjusting his grip and driving that forearm even deeper into the neck of Machida - Brutal!


----------



## cookiefritas

I didn't like Machida before this fight, but now he has a fan for life, it takes a real warrior to not tap when you know you are going out. War Machida.

With that said, Jones is a great fighter and proved that he can take a punch. It was a good fight and a great card overall.


----------



## TheReturn

Soakked said:


> Silva would KO JBJ on the feet eventually, he's that good. But if JBJ grabs him and manages to take him down JBJ would give him serious problems. If Sonnen can take Silva down, JBJ might be able to. If they were the same weight class (true weightclass)I would pick Siva to win (That's why I said P4P). But size is a major factor. Plus JBJ as the talent and the ability to give anyone a run for their money.


I have no doubt he would give him problems on the ground but who knows. And if Jbj kept it standing like he did with Machida in an attempt to prove his kickboxing is equal or better he'd get dominated.


----------



## Soakked

Yeah Machidas striking is top notch and was really getting the better in the in and out style. JBJ only success on the feet in the first round were leg kicks. Second round he caught Machida with that right and it was a done deal. 

Silva striking is better than Machida's He's versatile and has about 6 different striking stances and tactics. He also has excellent footwork, range-knowledge, ko power, accuracy and an iron chin to go along with it. JBJ at this point in the game would need to try and take Silva down without a doubt.


----------



## Budhisten

This ladies and gentlemen - is a bad, bad man










Great shot by Esther Lin


----------



## SideWays222

Budhisten said:


> This ladies and gentlemen - is a bad, bad man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Great shot by Esther Lin













That is a bad man.


Isnt there another picture VERY similar to that one??? I forgot who the picture if off though. Anyone know what im talking about?? I think someone has it as his sig.


----------



## TheReturn

Budhisten said:


> This ladies and gentlemen - is a bad, bad man
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Great shot by Esther Lin


will rep as soon as possible, badddd asssss:thumbsup:


----------



## kc1983

Is anybody out there STILL questioning Jones?? If you are you need to wake up. Like him or not he is the real deal. That finish was spectacular, Lyoto dropped like a sack of potatoes once Jones let the choke go. Very dramatic finish.


----------



## No_Mercy

cookiefritas said:


> I didn't like Machida before this fight, but now he has a fan for life, it takes a real warrior to not tap when you know you are going out. War Machida.
> 
> With that said, Jones is a great fighter and proved that he can take a punch. It was a good fight and a great card overall.


Actually you're right he didn't tap. Damn Jon Bones Jones. I'm still not convinced of his skill sets. It's his physical attributes that carries him. He whiffed a ton of shots. Machida had the perfect game plan in the first round. Fawk...I wanted to see five rounds of that chess match.


----------



## SideWays222

No_Mercy said:


> Actually you're right he didn't tap. Damn Jon Bones Jones. *I'm still not convinced of his skill sets.* It's his physical attributes that carries him. He whiffed a ton of shots. Machida had the perfect game plan in the first round. Fawk...I wanted to see five rounds of that chess match.


Okay buddy.


----------



## cdtcpl

No_Mercy said:


> It's his physical attributes that carries him. He whiffed a ton of shots. Machida had the perfect game plan in the first round. Fawk...I wanted to see five rounds of that chess match.


To try and discredit him by using this statement is poor. A lot of guys have a reach advantage but don't know how to use it other than to beat someone to the jab. JBJ is great because he has learned to use his body in a way that Lyoto seemed to have started to crack, but then he ended up on the ground (the TD, not the choke).


----------



## RedRocket44

No_Mercy said:


> Actually you're right he didn't tap. Damn Jon Bones Jones. I'm still not convinced of his skill sets. It's his physical attributes that carries him. He whiffed a ton of shots. Machida had the perfect game plan in the first round. Fawk...I wanted to see five rounds of that chess match.


At this point it's just silly to question Jones.

However the scary thing is you might be on to something -- his physical attributes vs his actual skill. He's 24, and only been training for 4 years. His striking & skills are only going to get better. There's not to many guys in the UFC that have only been training for 4 years, and he is a champion that has pretty much cleaned out his division.

If he is this dominant at 24 years with only 4 years under his belt, seeing him when hes 28-30 will be scary. He has the physical attributes, and his skills will only get better.


----------



## TheReturn

RedRocket44 said:


> At this point it's just silly to question Jones.
> 
> However the scary thing is you might be on to something -- his physical attributes vs his actual skill. He's 24, and only been training for 4 years. His striking & skills are only going to get better. There's not to many guys in the UFC that have only been training for 4 years, and he is a champion that has pretty much cleaned out his division.
> 
> If he is this dominant at 24 years with only 4 years under his belt, seeing him when hes 28-30 will be scary. He has the physical attributes, and his skills will only get better.


Wow, cant even imagine him 4-6 years from now.


----------



## RedRocket44

cookiefritas said:


> it takes a real warrior to not tap when you know you are going out.


Or stupidity. Just ask Big Nog.

Two devastating finishes tonight because of not tapping.


----------



## HorsepoweR

After tonite I am convinced Anderson would KO Jones. But I like Jones and don't like Silva anymore, so I don't want to see that fight.


----------



## TheReturn

RedRocket44 said:


> Or stupidity. Just ask Big Nog.
> 
> Two devastating finishes tonight because of not tapping.


Woah cmon man its not stupid to choose not to tap. If thats what they want to do then thats theyre choice theyre the ones who went through the brutal camps and mind games for 2 months.

More respect to them from me.


----------



## SideWays222

RedRocket44 said:


> Or stupidity. Just ask Big Nog.
> 
> Two devastating finishes tonight because of not tapping.


Big Nog not tapping that was dumb.

On the other hand the choke that Jones put Machida in. You lose consciousness extremely quickly. One second you think your fine the next someone is slapping your cheek to get a response. Machida very well may not have felt the need to tap but then before he knew it he was asleep.


----------



## RedRocket44

TheReturn said:


> Woah cmon man its not stupid to choose not to tap. If thats what they want to do then thats theyre choice theyre the ones who went through the brutal camps and mind games for 2 months.
> 
> More respect to them from me.


Never understood that mentality, but I'm guessing Big Nog is regretting his decision to not tap right now. Could be a career ending decision at his age.

Lyoto looked like he lost a few brain cells from that choke at the presser. Either that or he was depressed. Probably both.


----------



## cookiefritas

TheReturn said:


> Woah cmon man its not stupid to choose not to tap. If thats what they want to do then thats theyre choice theyre the ones who went through the brutal camps and mind games for 2 months.
> 
> More respect to them from me.


I concur. Machida is a true warrior, he has said many times he fights for honor. He proved it tonight, he fought a better fighter and lost, but he left it all in the cage. 

Jones is just a freak, he has skinny legs, but I am sure he squats and works his legs out just as much as everyone else, some guys just have parts of their body that can take massive trauma and don't break down. He has a great body for MMA, he is just massive and physically stronger than all his opponents in every way, but his body is capable of staying at the right weight class. 

Machida is a warrior but he has an average chin and average power. Against the elite fighters, he has to win by points because he does not have the punching power to finish the fight or the chin to make it go the distance. He was dominating the fight until Jones took his best shot right on the chin, right after that Jones figured out he could just walk through his punches. Shogun did the same thing.


----------



## TheReturn

RedRocket44 said:


> Never understood that mentality, but I'm guessing Big Nog is regretting his decision to not tap right now. Could be a career ending decision at his age.
> 
> Lyoto looked like he lost a few brain cells from that choke at the presser. Either that or he was depressed. Probably both.


Its more of a pride thing. Never giving up even when theres no hope. 
Might not be the smartest choice but in the end its still a choice.


----------



## RedRocket44

cookiefritas said:


> He was dominating the fight until Jones took his best shot right on the chin, right after that Jones figured out he could just walk through his punches. Shogun did the same thing.


I don't think dominating is the right word.

I don't even know if I would say he was in control. He had a good first round but it was hardly dominant.

Somebody already posted somewhere that 2/3 judges gave round 1 to JBJ.


----------



## SlowGraffiti




----------



## rabakill

who cares.... JBJ annihilated him. The only person that can beat Jones is a very strong wrestler that can run in with his head down and tackle Jones. King Mo is the only guy that comes to mind. 

-Hendo: way too slow
-Anderson Silva: would get taken down by Jones
-Mousassi: would get picked apart
-Evans: will get picked apart and gnp'ed with elbows, not strong enough to take Jones down
-Phil Davis: way way too slow and unskilled

King Mo is the only one with the strength to take Jones down and layn'pray him.


----------



## vilify

^^ I hate to see Machida like that embarrassing to say the least.


----------



## VB3

I am a Machida fan, and would have preferred that he defeat Jones.

However, Jones lost the first round, and made adjustments in the 2nd round that secured the win. That's smart fighting.

Machida did show that Jones does have holes that can be exploited though. 

Good fight. Too short. Another round would have been awesome.


----------



## Term

It looked to me like he was about to tap when his right hand hit Jones's leg. I think he just went unconscious before he could finish.

Scary stuff.


----------



## SlowGraffiti

^you're right


----------



## chosenFEW

i love how the kids in the audience about 15 feet/4 meters away notice that machidas out cold faster than the ref who is right next to them


----------



## box

I feel for Machida. Trained his ass off, showed tons of technique and speed, just wasn't enough for a guy like Jones. This Machida would give anyone not named Jones a hell of a night, he'll be contending once again.


----------



## TraMaI

rabakill said:


> who cares.... JBJ annihilated him. The only person that can beat Jones is a very strong wrestler that can run in with his head down and tackle Jones. King Mo is the only guy that comes to mind.
> 
> -Hendo: way too slow
> -Anderson Silva: would get taken down by Jones
> -Mousassi: would get picked apart
> -Evans: will get picked apart and gnp'ed with elbows, not strong enough to take Jones down
> -Phil Davis: way way too slow and unskilled
> 
> King Mo is the only one with the strength to take Jones down and layn'pray him.


You think Evans will get tooled by him and that Mo could beat him? You and I must be thinking of different King Mos. Jones is not easily taken down, he's massive and he's going to ragdoll 99% of his division. King Mo stands less of a chance at beating him than a snowball on the sun.


----------



## TraMaI

SideWays222 said:


> Big Nog not tapping that was dumb.
> 
> On the other hand the choke that Jones put Machida in. You lose consciousness extremely quickly. One second you think your fine the next someone is slapping your cheek to get a response. Machida very well may not have felt the need to tap but then before he knew it he was asleep.


This is more than likely exactly what happened. Machida was out before he even thought about tapping. A blood choke will put you out in about 3-5 seconds if applies right. Jones had perfect technique on that and he's strong as shit, not to mention the leverage from the cage. There was 0 oxygen getting to Lyoto's brain. That dude was out cold before he even knew what was happening.

Nog on the other hand was the instigator of his own demise. Frank did crank that shit really quick, but Nog should know better. He's been doing this how long? He doesn't know where that line is between pain and breakage? C'mon.


----------



## Soakked

Somewhere out there i know Bobby is pissed


----------



## rabakill

TraMaI said:


> You think Evans will get tooled by him and that Mo could beat him? You and I must be thinking of different King Mos. Jones is not easily taken down, he's massive and he's going to ragdoll 99% of his division. King Mo stands less of a chance at beating him than a snowball on the sun.


Yeah I do, Mo is much stronger than Evans. I don't think he would win because he'd have a crap gameplan, but Evans just doesn't have the strength. The only way to beat JBJ is to take him down unless you are Anderson Silva and then JBJ would just take him down. No fighter at LHW can stand with Jones and win, nobody. He will close the gap, take them down and gnp then submit. Evans stands a 0% chance of winning while King Mo would stand a .1% by LNP. I'd bet any amount of money on Rashad losing because he's just too short to beat Jones standing and too weak to get him down. You can say Rashad can land that one in a hundred punch but he really can't, there's no way for him to get inside JBJ's range to land it because Jones's reaction time is way too fast and for any current LHW's to get in range they must telegraph their move to the point that Jones can circle and block with ease unless you are Machida and your gameplan is to counterstrike. Machida really had the best chance, and we saw what happened.

That fight will happen too. Rashad will come out, stand with Jones for a while, throw a legkick and an overhand right, get caught once, go for a takedown, get thrown into the cage, kneed, taken down, elbowed, rnc'ed. Book it.


----------



## Wookie

Jones would rag-doll 90% of the division right now. It would be interesting to see how it goes down.


----------



## marcthegame

Evans would be interesting but i see that as another win, forget hendo. Phil davis is not ready for jones. 

Maybe in a few years someone outside the ufc can take him out. Keep your eye out for jimi manuwa, he is not battle tested or proved shit yet. But the man is a beast and if he keeps doing what he has been doing he will get in the ufc one day.


----------



## slapshot

Anderson Silva should move up and challenge jones, its always possible someone could beat him but if Silva wants to keep his p4p spot he could beat Jones and retire the best fighter in the world.

Jones win or lose could fight rashad then move to heavyweight and try to take that title. Jones is huge idk how long he can hang out at lhw.

I felt the first round was solidly 10-10.


----------



## Toroian

Im disappointed in lyoto! After failing into a grappling exchange!(should of pulled out) he seems really disheartened from the cut and became really slow and sluggish! if he took his time and kept his distant ..... 

Dam Jones is such a disrespectful fighter! Knowing your opponent is out and just throwing him on the floor! 

Also anyone else think jones was scared shitless after round 1! even after the fight his body language looked like a child!


----------



## No_Mercy

I think it's in the cards for Rashad to pull off the upset. He's the only one who knows how JBJ thinks and what goes on in the GJ camp.

That cut changed the entire momentum of the fight.


----------



## Hammerlock2.0

Man, this is just getting ridiculous. A standing guillotine? Nobody should be able to put anyone away with a standing guillotine in a title fight. It's like Jones suddenly turned God mode on. :confused05: 

Nobody in this division can survive a grappling battle with Jones at this point. And since he tapped a black belt with a standing guillotine I dare say it's at least 50% because of his size.

Now bring on Rashad so I can finally enjoy one of Jon's victories.


----------



## No_Mercy

Hammerlock2.0 said:


> Man, this is just getting ridiculous. A standing guillotine? Nobody should be able to put anyone away with a standing guillotine in a title fight. It's like Jones suddenly turned God mode on. :confused05:
> 
> Nobody in this division can survive a grappling battle with Jones at this point. And since he tapped a black belt with a standing guillotine *I dare say it's at least 50% because of his size.*
> 
> Now bring on Rashad so I can finally enjoy one of Jon's victories.


That's what I'm saying. People are in awe of him...for what...that he's bigger than all the LHWs and rangier. Take the range away and size and he's got nothing. He's got a big target on his forehead. I hate the way he fights. It's irritating to watch him. 

You can judge a man by his character. He let Machida who didn't talk shiet at all and fought honourably crumple to the mat. He had to hear from GJ to check on em. That's not really koo. Goes to show his mind state just like how he cuck blocked Rashad. He's young...it can only go downhill from here. Lets see him in 10 years.


----------



## PheelGoodInc

No_Mercy said:


> That's what I'm saying. *People are in awe of him...for what...that he's bigger than all the LHWs and rangier. Take the range away and size and he's got nothing.* He's got a big target on his forehead. I hate the way he fights. It's irritating to watch him.
> 
> You can judge a man by his character. He let Machida who didn't talk shiet at all and fought honourably crumple to the mat. He had to hear from GJ to check on em. That's not really koo. Goes to show his mind state just like how he cuck blocked Rashad. He's young...it can only go downhill from here. Lets see him in 10 years.


Do you honestly believe this? I can go find a bunch of rangy, lanky dudes and throw them in there. According to you they'll be just as successful as Jones :confused05:


----------



## K R Y

That's exactly why the HW champion is Stefan Str....Oh...nevermind.

He uses his size extremely well but to say it's the biggest factor to his success is ridiculous. His size does not make him the greatest Light Heavy Weight in the world right now.


----------



## Leed

K R Y said:


> That's exactly why the HW champion is Stefan Str....Oh...nevermind.
> 
> He uses his size extremely well but to say it's the biggest factor to his success is ridiculous. His size does not make him the greatest Light Heavy Weight in the world right now.


Well it kinda depends on how you look at that. Sure, the size itself didn't make him the LHW champ, but his skill-set which he adapted to his size is what made him successful. Not saying that Jones isn't incredibly talented and gifted, but the size is a part of his success.


----------



## BodyHead

It's going to take one badass dude to beat Jon Jones. Some guy that we've probably never seen before.


----------



## Steroid Steve

Hammerlock2.0 said:


> Man, this is just getting ridiculous. A standing guillotine? Nobody should be able to put anyone away with a standing guillotine in a title fight. It's like Jones suddenly turned God mode on. :confused05:
> 
> Nobody in this division can survive a grappling battle with Jones at this point. And since he tapped a black belt with a standing guillotine I dare say it's at least 50% because of his size.
> 
> Now bring on Rashad so I can finally enjoy one of Jon's victories.


It's because of his leverage. His long arms are what allowed him to crank the guillotine like that. The best all have phyiscal advatanges...


----------



## Mckeever

Anderson Silva vs Jon Jones would be the biggest MMA fight in history.

It's incredible how young Jones is to the sport when looking at resume.

Rampage
Shogun
Machida
Bader
Bonnar

That is ridiculous. He's destroyed the very best fighters in the world.

**** Sonnen vs Silva. 

Jon Jones vs Anderson Silva, MAKE IT HAPPEN.


----------



## vilify

No_Mercy said:


> That's what I'm saying. People are in awe of him...for what...that he's bigger than all the LHWs and rangier. Take the range away and size and he's got nothing. He's got a big target on his forehead. I hate the way he fights. It's irritating to watch him.
> 
> You can judge a man by his character. He let Machida who didn't talk shiet at all and fought honourably crumple to the mat. He had to hear from GJ to check on em. That's not really koo. Goes to show his mind state just like how he cuck blocked Rashad. He's young...it can only go downhill from here. Lets see him in 10 years.


Sounds like Jones must have really hurt your feelings. You sound pathetic.


----------



## limba

LMAO at some people being so depressed and frustrated seeing Jones win (destroy another "toughest challenge")...so easily.


----------



## fightfan76

Roflcopter said:


> *People are way too busy slurping Jones' semen ignoring how vulnerable he looked.
> *
> Conveniently forgetting that out there is a better wrestler that won't get so easily taken down in Rashad and a dude that hits way harder in Dan Henderson still out there.


Thats a tool statement.....

He wont have to take Rashad down and he is a good enough (MMA) wrestler to keep Rashad from taking him down. He will knock Rashad googoo eyed just like Machida did, if not worse.....

Also, Machida had enough power to knock Rashad googoo eyed to the guy who said "since when did Machida become a power puncher". If I am not mistaken he has knocked a few guys silly in his last few fights that he won.....


----------



## oldfan

vilify said:


> Sounds like Jones must have really hurt your feelings. You sound pathetic.


 you have to admit, he's the biggest LHW ever. I wonder what he weighs fight night?



limba said:


> LMAO at some people being so depressed and frustrated seeing Jones win (destroy another "toughest challenge")...so easily.


yeah but,.... it's the arrogant way he did it.




Poor Rashad is cursed. I don't think he'll ever get to fight Jones. When davis wins their fight I think Dana is smart enough to hold him back.

That leaves Henderson.

God help him.


----------



## Terror Kovenant

fightfan76 said:


> Thats a tool statement.....
> 
> He wont have to take Rashad down and he is a good enough (MMA) wrestler to keep Rashad from taking him down. He will knock Rashad googoo eyed just like Machida did, if not worse.....
> 
> Also, Machida had enough power to knock Rashad googoo eyed to the guy who said "since when did Machida become a power puncher". If I am not mistaken he has knocked a few guys silly in his last few fights that he won.....


You don't know that actually, Jones' TDD hasn't been tested in the octagon and certainly not by a wrestler as well adapted as Rashad. Rashad has quick hands and does have powerful punches as well, if Machida can hit him, Rashad can too. 

Machida did knock Evan's googoo eyed, but it took multiple shots and a flurry to put him out. Machida doesn't really have solid one punch KO power. And even without that he still rocked Jones. Evans can KO him. 

Not as one sided as it seems.


As for the guy who said "lets see him in 10 years." In a few years time he'll be losing to HWs.


----------



## beezer

Did Big John call Machida "baby" when he was waking up from the choke? Not only once but twice... check it if you got the fight recorded or on download 

Regarding the actual fight, Jones does indeed look unstoppable at the moment. Here is to Davis getting past Rashad and getting a shot at the title...


----------



## Steroid Steve

oldfan said:


> you have to admit, he's the biggest LHW ever. I wonder what he weighs fight night?
> 
> 
> 
> yeah but,.... it's the arrogant way he did it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Poor Rashad is cursed. I don't think he'll ever get to fight Jones. When davis wins their fight I think Dana is smart enough to hold him back.
> 
> That leaves Henderson.
> 
> God help him.


Rashad himself has came out and said that Jones comes into camp as big as 217, and as little as 212, so he's not as big as you think he is, and note that I said he comes into camp at that weight, so that shows he keeps himself in shape in and out of training. It's his length, not his weight. Jones would have to be extremely out of shape to be at 235 or put on a lot of muscles mass, which isn't exactly the smartest thing to do for him at the moment. He should let his body naturally transform itself instead of piling on useless mass.


----------



## Atras

Goddammit.

The only good thing to come out of this fight was that JBJ sounded like a real human being in the post-fight interview with Joe Rogan. I guess he's better without a Zuffa script. Let's see how long that lasts.


----------



## AmdM

Steroid Steve said:


> Rashad himself has came out and said that Jones comes into camp as big as 217, and as little as 212, so he's not as big as you think he is, and note that I said he comes into camp at that weight, so that shows he keeps himself in shape in and out of training. It's his length, not his weight. Jones would have to be extremely out of shape to be at 235 or put on a lot of muscles mass, which isn't exactly the smartest thing to do for him at the moment. He should let his body naturally transform itself instead of piling on useless mass.


Yeap. He is all muscle with no fat mass, long limbs and very intelligent. He's the perfect machine at 205.

Don't know why people say he should go HW.
Just because were not used to see guys near the perfect shape for a human, it doesn't mean he's in the wrong here.
I just would like to know that if he's a vegan.
Probably he is. Does someone has a definitive answer to my doubt?


----------



## vilify

oldfan said:


> you have to admit, he's the biggest LHW ever. I wonder what he weighs fight night?


The size thing is getting overblown a little bit. Jones weighs about the same as guys like Forrest, Tito and Rampage. He just has better reach that's it...and is obviously more skilled.


----------



## Spec0688

Jon Jones the the equivalent of Anderson Silva, just for LHW. Anderson Silva possesses the same advantages, just for the MW division. 

He has reach, length, speed, the only difference might be strength.


----------



## SideWays222

Why are people saying that Jon jones isnt any bigger then Forrest or Rampage???

Did you guys see Jon Jones vs Rampage??? They looked to be in different weight classes.


----------



## oldfan

vilify said:


> The size thing is getting overblown a little bit. Jones weighs about the same as guys like Forrest, Tito and Rampage. He just has better reach that's it...and is obviously more skilled.


Rampage is a BIG LHW. I don't think it's over blown at all.


----------



## No_Mercy

Jon Jones reminds me of Xerxes from 300...lolz! He will get dethroned eventually.

To Vilify yes my feelings did get hurt...cuz I lost money...haha...but my consolation was that Machida won the first and hit em which SHOWS all along that JBJ's striking is quite over rated. How many times did he whiff. Anderson Silva does not miss. He strikes with a purpose.

It was only after he took Machida down that the momentum shifted. Then Machida got caught with the same scenario against Shogun rushing in with the left counter and getting dropped. Machida's game plan in the 1st was perfect. That's the way it goes. 

I believe the way to beat JBJ is to go berserker mode without a doubt in my mind or a perfect game from Machida. He has too much range and is too strong in the clinch. He rag dolled Rampage. When's the last time anybody did that...

My bet is Shogun or Hendo who go out guns blazing and go for broke in the first round. No point in going five rounds cuz it aint getting there.


----------



## oldfan

Randy Couture former HW champ.










Tito former biggest LHW ever










Andre Arlovski Former HW champ. List by Sherdog and Wikipedia as 6'-4" 250lb










Jon Jones is the biggest LHW ever.


----------



## limba

oldfan said:


> you have to admit, he's the biggest LHW ever. I wonder what he weighs fight night?
> 
> 
> 
> yeah but,.... it's the arrogant way he did it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Poor Rashad is cursed. I don't think he'll ever get to fight Jones. When davis wins their fight I think Dana is smart enough to hold him back.
> 
> That leaves Henderson.
> 
> God help him.


Bones isn't the biggest LHW. Not at all.
The biggest he's ever been was ahead of his fight against Matyushenko , around 232 lbs...and that was before he started his camp.

And in his last fights he entered his camps at under 225. There is no way he is bigger than 220 on fight night. He might look extremely big, but people are forgetting he has a pretty unique frame style, with those thin legs. 
But his upper body strength and size "steal" all the spotlight.
Plus...he has a low body fat level.

PS: Yup Oldie...that arrogance is so....."arrogant"


----------



## oldfan

limba said:


> Bones isn't the biggest LHW. Not at all.
> The biggest he's ever been was ahead of his fight against Matyushenko , around 232 lbs...and that was before he started his camp.
> 
> And in his last fights he entered his camps at under 225. There is no way he is bigger than 220 on fight night. He might look extremely big, but people are forgetting he has a pretty unique frame style, with those thin legs.
> But his upper body strength and size "steal" all the spotlight.
> Plus...he has a low body fat level.
> 
> PS: Yup Oldie...that arrogance is so....."arrogant"


Being lean doesn't make you smaller. 232lbs of lean muscle and no fat is pretty damn big for a 205er.

If he isn't the biggest who is?


----------



## limba

oldfan said:


> Being lean doesn't make you smaller. 232lbs of lean muscle and no fat is pretty damn big for a 205er.
> 
> If he isn't the biggest who is?


Bonnar and/or Griffin are bigger IMO, but they also carry more body fat on their frame.

Anyway...I believe it's useless talking about how big a certain fighter.

Point is, Bones doesn't win fights because he is bigger than his opponents. It's a mix of skills: physical, technical, tactical, psychological and emotional/motivational. All these combined with thousands of hrs of hard training, dedication, perseverance in studying the martial arts plus the desire to be the best and all the sacrifices that come along.


----------



## oldfan

limba said:


> Bonnar and/or Griffin are bigger IMO, but they also carry more body fat on their frame.
> 
> Anyway...I believe it's useless talking about how big a certain fighter.
> 
> Point is, Bones doesn't win fights because he is bigger than his opponents. It's a mix of skills: physical, technical, tactical, psychological and emotional/motivational. All these combined with thousands of hrs of hard training, dedication, perseverance in studying the martial arts plus the desire to be the best and all the sacrifices that come along.


all of those things are factors. plus the FACT that he is bigger, stronger and has a huge reach advantage.


----------



## vilify

Forrest is bigger


----------



## oldfan

vilify said:


> Forrest is bigger













not


----------



## vilify

Yuck LOL


----------



## drey2k

limba said:


> Bones isn't the biggest LHW. Not at all.
> The biggest he's ever been was ahead of his fight against Matyushenko , around 232 lbs...and that was before he started his camp.
> 
> And in his last fights he entered his camps at under 225. There is no way he is bigger than 220 on fight night. He might look extremely big, but people are forgetting he has a pretty unique frame style, with those thin legs.
> But his upper body strength and size "steal" all the spotlight.
> Plus...he has a low body fat level.
> 
> PS: Yup Oldie...that arrogance is so....."arrogant"


He is a huge LHW, and yes he is the biggest ever in the top 10 at least.

There is no way he is 6'4" he is more like 6'5" or 6'6".


----------



## Beeg

K R Y said:


> That's exactly why the HW champion is Stefan Str....Oh...nevermind.


Actually, I'd love to see Stefan Stuve cut weight (maybe amputate a limb) and come down to fight Jones. Purely for scientific reasons.


----------



## Steroid Steve

oldfan said:


> Randy Couture former HW champ.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tito former biggest LHW ever
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Andre Arlovski Former HW champ. List by Sherdog and Wikipedia as 6'-4" 250lb
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jon Jones is the biggest LHW ever.


You're just comparing their upper bodies. Jones is on stilts man. You're completely leaving that aspect out.


----------



## Risto

oldfan said:


> Rampage is a BIG LHW. I don't think it's over blown at all.


Rampage packs at least an extra 10 pounds in his head.


----------



## METALLICA_RULES

This was a good fight. Machida took it to Jones, but Jones ultimately won.


----------



## marcthegame

Ray Lewis is 250











THe man looks as big as cain


----------



## AJClark

marcthegame said:


>


Frankie Edgar just won this thread.raise01:

Someone mentioned in another thread what a Forrest Bones fight would be like. All destruction aside I would be intrigued to see how Bones would deal with a LHW of Forrests size, if he used it properly ala the Rampage fight.

Then again Bones suplexed Bonnar. It's like everytime you think of someone or anything who could beat JBJ there's an entirely logical reason why it's complete tosh.

It's all up to Rashad or Hendo now IMO


----------



## AmdM

Cheick kongo just shared the all event on FB lol

[dm]xmwsmr[/dm]


----------



## bcros

It was an incredible great fight. I just regret that the fighters have protections in the hands but they do not have on the elbows. Without gloves, Machida could have hit strongly Jones and get him KO. With protections on the elbows of Jones, Machida would probably not stuck in the guillotine when he had to get up.
I find it dangerous and stupid a guillotine against the cage can be afflicted, specially when fighter are standing up. The one who suffers the guillotine can not get rid of (it's absurd so far as to let the fighters hang the cage with hands), and moreover, the referee can not see when the fighter is no longer conscious ( dangerous in many ways ! for brain, and even if the competitor releases the lock suddenly as JBL did ). May be a point of revision of the rules, if we really want to protect the fighters against the worst.

Greetings to JBL that will certainly have a lot of victories in future, and a very few fighters who wants to get into the cage with him.


----------



## Budhisten

AmdM said:


> Cheick kongo just shared the all event on FB lol


He was also sharing streams for UFC 139 - he just doesn't give a s***  Someone twitter Dana this if you wanna get him in trouble  (Don't btw)




bcros said:


> It was an incredible great fight. I just regret that the fighters have protections in the hands but they do not have on the elbows. Without gloves, Machida could have hit strongly Jones and get him KO. With protections on the elbows of Jones, Machida would probably not stuck in the guillotine when he had to get up.
> I find it dangerous and stupid a guillotine against the cage can be afflicted, specially when fighter are standing up. The one who suffers the guillotine can not get rid of (it's absurd so far as to let the fighters hang the cage with hands), and moreover, the referee can not see when the fighter is no longer conscious ( dangerous in many ways ! for brain, and even if the competitor releases the lock suddenly as JBL did ). May be a point of revision of the rules, if we really want to protect the fighters against the worst.
> 
> Greetings to JBL that will certainly have a lot of victories in future, and a very few fighters who wants to get into the cage with him.


Welcome to the forum mate 

Gloves are meant to protect the hands, not the head they're punching...

The punch lands a little lighter, but the momentum is just the same... No gloves = more injuries (Cuts and broken hands/wrists) and less KOs

As for the standing front choke (Prayer choke if you wanna get wrassly) the whole point of it is that it's hard to get out off  Standing submissions should by no means be illegal, it's the fighter's own duty to tap before going out if you don't want to go out


----------



## bcros

I understand for gloves. I would just say that it's not fair to win on abandonment due to injuries done with elbows. Does a championship have to be played as this ?

For standing choke of Machida, we all have seen Machida 
in no move, trying to get out from JBL'arms because he was certainly without no air and no blood to brain, until the start of the choke. And when his arm felt down, referee was on the other side ! Public saw the right arm down, 5 seconds before referee stop the fight and JBL release the lock. What would happen if the 2 arms where locked by JBL ? 30 s without blood to brain ? more ? how long is it possible to do a blood choke without brain damage ? a doctor in the room to answer that ? :confused02:

:confused02:



Budhisten said:


> He was also sharing streams for UFC 139 - he just doesn't give a s***  Someone twitter Dana this if you wanna get him in trouble  (Don't btw)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Welcome to the forum mate
> 
> Gloves are meant to protect the hands, not the head they're punching...
> 
> The punch lands a little lighter, but the momentum is just the same... No gloves = more injuries (Cuts and broken hands/wrists) and less KOs
> 
> As for the standing front choke (Prayer choke if you wanna get wrassly) the whole point of it is that it's hard to get out off  Standing submissions should by no means be illegal, it's the fighter's own duty to tap before going out if you don't want to go out


----------



## Budhisten

bcros said:


> I understand for gloves. I would just say that it's not fair to win on abandonment due to injuries done with elbows. Does a championship have to be played as this ?
> 
> For standing choke of Machida, we all have seen Machida
> in no move, trying to get out from JBL'arms because he was certainly without no air and no blood to brain, until the start of the choke. And when his arm felt down, referee was on the other side ! Public saw the right arm down, 5 seconds before referee stop the fight and JBL release the lock. What would happen if the 2 arms where locked by JBL ? 30 s without blood to brain ? more ? how long is it possible to do a blood choke without brain damage ? a doctor in the room to answer that ? :confused02:
> 
> :confused02:


If Jones had locked both of Machida's arms up he couldn't have don a choke... No choke has both arms locked up, none


----------



## slapshot

Its fairly silly to say he's not the biggest lhw, he's not as muscled as a few guys but his height and reach also contribute to that. I can't wait to see if Silva walks the walk and challenges Jones, I think he'll pull a Fedor and avoid a superfight.


----------



## Squirrelfighter

marcthegame said:


> Ray Lewis is 250
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> THe man looks as big as cain


He's as tall as Cain, and when you compare their girth/muscle mass he's pretty undersized. Cain's core, neck, chest, legs, back are all more heavily built.


----------



## slapshot

Budhisten said:


> He was also sharing streams for UFC 139 - he just doesn't give a s***  Someone twitter Dana this if you wanna get him in trouble  (Don't btw)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Welcome to the forum mate
> 
> Gloves are meant to protect the hands, not the head they're punching...
> 
> The punch lands a little lighter, but the momentum is just the same... No gloves = more injuries (Cuts and broken hands/wrists) and less KOs
> 
> As for the standing front choke (Prayer choke if you wanna get wrassly) the whole point of it is that it's hard to get out off  Standing submissions should by no means be illegal, it's the fighter's own duty to tap before going out if you don't want to go out


Agreed and gloves or no gloves machida would have gotten trashed barring injury, that first round was a 10-10 round but the fashion in which Jones won was exciting and pure dominance.


----------



## Soakked

Don't see how the first round was a 10-10 round when all JBJ landed were leg kicks while Machida stunned him with punches. 2nd round was pure dominance for sure though.


----------



## Mr. Val A Tudo

SideWays222 said:


> Yeah Jon Jones showed his true colors when he let Machidas face hit the floor. The ref called off the fight... Machida is limp... help the poor guy out and let him down gentle. Dont drop him like he is some object.
> 
> Maybe Jon Jones is going to start embracing the "evil" persona. Would be kind of cool to see that.
> 
> 
> EDIT/
> 
> I guess i kind of miss understood. The choke itself was not arrogant in any way shape or form. Thats a very very absurd thing to say.





oldfan said:


> I'm talking about the way he threw him down with contempt.





Budhisten said:


> It was scary yes, the whole Machida falling to the floor and Jones just walking away got to me as well
> 
> Also when he adjusted his grip and just pushed his own arm further into Machida's neck, looked like murder


LOL!!!:confused03:


You guys *DO* realize that this was a championship FIGHT, right? Right? 

Machida was trying to kick Jones' head into the cheap seats, and vice versa. There simply is no room in the fight game for compassion for one's opponent. 

Killer instinct is a requirement in MMA, and you saw it on display in grand fashion. THAT is how one finishes a fight. To expect one to turn it on/off like a light switch is asking too much.

If you fault Bones for not carefully placing his beaten opponent on the mat within a second of choking him unconcious, then you should limit your sporting pleasures to badminton, synchronized swimming and the like.


----------



## RedRocket44

Mr. Val A Tudo said:


> If you fault Bones for not carefully placing his beaten opponent on the mat within a second of choking him unconcious, then you should limit your sporting pleasures to badminton, synchronized swimming and the like.


Agreed.










One of the most bad-ass images in some time.

Certainly sends a message to anyone challenging Jones for the belt, no? Jones isn't there to play. He's a nice guy on the camera, and some will whine and say it's an act - but you KNOW when he steps into the cage he's there for one thing.


----------



## Mr. Val A Tudo

bcros said:


> I understand for gloves. I would just say that it's not fair to win on abandonment due to injuries done with elbows. Does a championship have to be played as this ?
> 
> For standing choke of Machida, we all have seen Machida
> in no move, trying to get out from JBL'arms because he was certainly without no air and no blood to brain, until the start of the choke. And when his arm felt down, referee was on the other side ! Public saw the right arm down, 5 seconds before referee stop the fight and JBL release the lock. What would happen if the 2 arms where locked by JBL ? 30 s without blood to brain ? more ? how long is it possible to do a blood choke without brain damage ? a doctor in the room to answer that ? :confused02:
> 
> :confused02:


There was nothing unique about the stoppage or the choke. 
Many fights end in chokes where the choked individual is not in a position to tap-out or the ref can't see one hand or another. Often, the ref can only look at the fighter's eyes or at other musculature to determine if a fighter is out. Sometimes, the ref will lift a fighter's available arm to check if it has gone limp or not. You'll often see the choked fighter give a "thumbs-up", under these circumstances, to make sure the ref knows he is still game. 

In the absence of having two refs in the cage to monitor the action from multiple angles, there is no way to avoid what happenned w/ Machida.


----------



## No_Mercy

Don't people realize by now that everything ALWAYS comes full circle in MMA especially. I've watched for close to two decades now. All the fighters who viciously knocked out their opponents became victims of their own circumstances. Even Big Nog ironically tasted his own medicine although I was rooting for Mir. But guess what Mir got thrashed by Carwin, Brock and will so again by JDS or Cain. Royce getting submitted himself many years later with an artform he helped introduce. Chuck, Wand, Mirko
laying waste to everything in their path only to be brutalized in the same exact way. 

They all rise and fall eventually. It can be one year or can be 10 years. Only a matter of time. Fedor is the PERFECT example. Unbelievable how dramatic it has been this year for him. I don't hate on JBJ, but I have my own sentiments about him. If he continues to win good for him, but I'll always be rooting for his opponents much like how some people root against Anderson Silva who happens to be my favorite fighter. 

I'm going to end with this though. If JBJ truly wants to test his legacy then move up to HW. Beat Cain, JDS, Brock, Carwin, Mir and then you'll earn my props. Til then he's an oversized LHW IMO...haha.


----------



## Soakked

The thing about JBJ is that he uses all aspects of MMA like he's an expert in each one. He has submitted people that haven't been submitted before (Machida, Rampage), Koed people that's never been koed (Shogun), out wrestled wrestlers. He is top 2 or 3 GNP's active now and he has the athleticism to go along with his talent. He has also shown the ability to take a solid shot and become unfazed. He is truly the "new model" or new addition of the complete MMA. 

Does his size have a factor in it? Sure it does, but people will fool themselves to think that the only reason he is successful is because of his size. He has at this point in his career, the chance to break all the records and set the new bar on what it means to be excellent. That kid is the truth without a doubt and as long as he stays focused and determined, he will reign in for a long time.

Who else can say that they beat 3 former champions in one freaking year and done so in each fight dominantly?


----------



## limba

RedRocket44 said:


> Agreed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One of the most bad-ass images in some time.


Here's another one


----------



## oldfan

Mr. Val A Tudo said:


> LOL!!!:confused03:
> 
> 
> You guys *DO* realize that this was a championship FIGHT, right? Right?
> 
> Machida was trying to kick Jones' head into the cheap seats, and vice versa. There simply is no room in the fight game for compassion for one's opponent.
> 
> Killer instinct is a requirement in MMA, and you saw it on display in grand fashion. THAT is how one finishes a fight. To expect one to turn it on/off like a light switch is asking too much.
> 
> If you fault Bones for not carefully placing his beaten opponent on the mat within a second of choking him unconcious, then you should limit your sporting pleasures to badminton, synchronized swimming and the like.



well... my comments were only half serious. just kinda pointing out ammo for my hater friends.

Here's what tom lawlor, a guy who knows more than most people about getting choked out in the octogon said, " he knew he was unconscious. I thought it was a bit much." so, go lol at him.

and the badminton line is mine. quit using my line.


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## Soojooko

I dunno. the ref told him to let go so he did. The speed at which he let go left Lyoto to fall to the ground, but it could simply be that Bones didn't want to hold on to the choke any longer then he needed to. It was a standing sub at the end of the day. Letting go of a sub that quickly in any other senario would have been no problem.

I honestly dont see anything wrong with it. Its unfortunate for Lyoto at worse.


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## slapshot

Soakked said:


> Don't see how the first round was a 10-10 round when all JBJ landed were leg kicks while Machida stunned him with punches. 2nd round was pure dominance for sure though.


He did what? He never stunned Jones that's wishful thinking. He came forward and landed on Jones a few times but stunned him? Nah.

Jones was the aggressor and took octagon control, they landed about the same number of total strikes and significant strikes to boot so I don't see how you don't see it.

I look at 10-10 scoring like this, 
A close round still needs to be scored if possible however if all aspects of the judging criteria are so close its hard to tell then 10-10 the round otherwise you may give someone a fight they should have lost. All mma fights should be 5 rounds. The 10-9 system is not adapted and dose not work correctly in 3 round fights, bringing that up b/c for the system to be its most effective 10-10 needs to be used in a round with no clear winner and three round fights stunt the system. That's why 10-10 became taboo.


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## Soakked

Well I guess I'll have to watch the fight again. Maybe stunned is a strong word, perhaps knocked off his equilibrium is better? There were two cases where he knock JBJ off balance while attacking with straight punches. I also recall him throwing a kick and following up real fast with a straight punch that landed solidly. 

As far as octagon control and aggressiveness is concerned, yeah I can see that. But then again that would decribe pretty much all of Machida's opponents because that's his style. Tito had octagon control and aggressiveness in his fight with Machida too. For me the defining score comes to successful strikes, and besides a few leg kicks (of them one or two really good ones) I don't think JBJ landed anything solid in that first round, while Machida did. Don't get me wrong it was a close round but I would have given it to Machida.


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## slapshot

Yea I agree that machida is a counter striker but I believe when you score a fight you can't tailor your criteria to individuals. I get knocked off balance sparring, I don't give it much thought especially if I'm trying to lay a heavy mawashi geri although I'm not sure that was the case here.

I felt machida was running more than circling for counters like he usually dose but I can see your angle.

Good post btw.


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## Soakked

slapshot said:


> Yea I agree that machida is a counter striker but I believe when you score a fight you can't tailor your criteria to individuals.
> 
> I felt machida was running more than circling for counters but I can see your angle.
> 
> Good post btw.


Yeah true. Likewise, always a pleasure sir.


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