# Arianny Celeste: UFC champion Ronda Rousey is not a good role model for women



## onip69 (Oct 14, 2012)

> "I don't really like the way she carries herself. I don't think she's a good role model for women. I think that women should empower each other and give each other a little pat on the back. I've personally been talked about by her, and I don't even know her. I've met her twice. She said a couple things in her Maxim interview. A lot of people pointed it out to me, but I didn't really acknowledge it. She's paving the way for women's MMA, and I've made being a UFC Octagon Girl into a career. She should definitely recognize that and be nice."



http://www.mmamania.com/2014/2/24/5...mens-champion-ronda-rousey-bad-role-model-mma


----------



## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

Hmmmm.... that is one thing I don't think anyone has ever said about Rousey. I am pretty sure I have never read anyone ever calling her a role model. Some people are role models, some people try to be role models, and some people have no interest in it at all. I put Ronda in the last category.


----------



## OU (Sep 26, 2012)

Wasn't Arianny in Playboy? If I had the choice of my daughter being a World Champion that happens to be a d-bag or the eye candy ring card girl that was in Playboy. I'd take the Rousey route 100 times out of 100.


----------



## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

OU said:


> Wasn't Arianny in Playboy? If I had the choice of my daughter being a World Champion and Olympic medalist that happens to be a d-bag or the eye candy ring card girl that was in Playboy. I'd take the Rousey route 100 times out of 100.


:laugh: Might as well lock this thread now.


----------



## amoosenamedhank (Sep 2, 2009)

OU said:


> Wasn't Arianny in Playboy? If I had the choice of my daughter being a World Champion and Olympic medalist that happens to be a d-bag or the eye candy ring card girl that was in Playboy. I'd take the Rousey route 100 times out of 100.


I do have a daughter and I'll tell you 100 times again I completely agree with you.

I'm sure Arianny is a very nice girl... but I'm also confused where she has the moral high ground here. Lady, you take your clothes off for money and you prance around in a swim suit selling sex appeal for a living.


----------



## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

Book this fight immediately.


----------



## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

Here's waiting for Honda to give a mean look at Arianny somewhere.


----------



## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

Neither one of them is exactly Eleanor Roosevelt. 

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

OU said:


> Wasn't Arianny in Playboy? If I had the choice of my daughter being a World Champion and Olympic medalist that happens to be a d-bag or the eye candy ring card girl that was in Playboy. I'd take the Rousey route 100 times out of 100.


Agree, not to mention she gets paid by rich men from the middle east to come to be their sex slave. Not sure what the hell she is blabbing about. 

Not everyone has to be a role model. Charles Barkley said it best.


----------



## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

Neither are role models and it's not Ronda's job to "empower" anyone.


----------



## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

OU said:


> Wasn't Arianny in Playboy? If I had the choice of my daughter being a World Champion and Olympic medalist that happens to be a d-bag or the eye candy ring card girl that was in Playboy. I'd take the Rousey route 100 times out of 100.


The same Rousey that trash talked ring girls for modeling with no clothes on, then as soon as she was famous enough to be asked do it, modeled with no clothes on?


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

If i had a daughter i would rather she chose Rouseys career path then Ariannys but i would rather she have Ariannys personality then Rouseys.


----------



## OU (Sep 26, 2012)

HexRei said:


> The same Rousey that trash talked ring girls for modeling with no clothes on, then as soon as she was famous enough to be asked do it, modeled with no clothes on?


Rousey posed in a nude but covered edition for ESPN the magazine. Arianny put her goodies on display for the most popular porn magazine in the world. There is a difference.
Let's not get it confused, I'm a pretty big Ronda hater. But Arianny isn't in position to make these kind of comments IMO.
Ronda took her clothes off for a photo shoot 1 time that didn't display anything that couldn't be advertised on the front page of ESPN.com and she did it to promote her career.
Arianny's career consist of wearing as little clothing as possible so guys can stare at her. Maybe you would prefer this for your daughter or sister. I would not.


----------



## towwffc (Jan 1, 2008)

Maybe the girl is just upset that Ronda said something unflattering about her in that article she is referring to. Good for her to speak up, that probably took some guts knowing how Rousey is lol. I'm not gonna jump on the "shut up ring card girl who gets paid to prance around in a bikini" bandwagon. Of course I'd rather have a daughter like Ronda than Arianny. But if Ronda threw the first stone, the girl has a right to say something back. But maybe she could have responded without making the "role model" comment. Thats like Jon Jones calling somebody a D-bag :b


----------



## buddyface (Oct 9, 2008)

OU said:


> Rousey posed in a nude but covered edition for ESPN the magazine. Arianny put her goodies on display for the most popular porn magazine in the world. There is a difference.


There is no difference.


----------



## Killz (Oct 5, 2009)

OUs first post in this thread is bang on. There's no arguing with that 
Logic.


----------



## OU (Sep 26, 2012)

buddyface said:


> There is no difference.


I have never heard of a young boy getting a hold of his daddy's ESPN the body to do his...private work. 
Playboy is a porn magazine that is not censored. ESPN the body doesn't show anything that can't be displayed at a general store.


----------



## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

OU said:


> Rousey posed in a nude but covered edition for ESPN the magazine. Arianny put her goodies on display for the most popular porn magazine in the world. There is a difference.
> Let's not get it confused, I'm a pretty big Ronda hater. But Arianny isn't in position to make these kind of comments IMO.
> Ronda took her clothes off for a photo shoot 1 time that didn't display anything that couldn't be advertised on the front page of ESPN.com and she did it to promote her career.
> Arianny's career consist of wearing as little clothing as possible so guys can stare at her. Maybe you would prefer this for your daughter or sister. I would not.


People pose nude and get nude on camera all the time. You've probably seen the "goodies" of every female actress in the business if you've watched enough movies. Kathy Bates is nude in at least one of her movies for crying out loud.

What's the difference between what Ronda did and what Arianny did, exactly? They both posed nude on magazines to get male attention. Ronda did what she did because she's competing in in a male dominated sport, what better way to get men interested in you than posing nude on a magazine? Some of her "goodies" were covered up, but the idea and impact is the same - she posed without clothes for male attention.


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

Arianny is a great role model. In terms of money earned vs effort required, shes pretty much getting paid for doing sweet f*uck all... which is exactly what all aspiring females should be aiming for.


----------



## DonRifle (Jan 18, 2009)

Typical chick stuff, Arianni is just jealous rhonda is now the main bitch in the ufc. The green eyed monster is coming out. Wouldn't be surprised if we see Arianni shown the door by uncle Dana ifs she's openly slating the new golden girl!


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

I had to google Arianny nude photos and Palmers nude photos. 

I swear i wish i could retake those pictures. The whole "gym tough girl" atmosphere isnt sexy nude.


----------



## OU (Sep 26, 2012)

M.C said:


> People pose nude and get nude on camera all the time. You've probably seen the "goodies" of every female actress in the business if you've watched enough movies. Kathy Bates is nude in at least one of her movies for crying out loud. What exactly is wrong with nudity?
> 
> What's the difference between what Ronda did and what Arianny did, exactly? They both posed nude on magazines to get male attention. Ronda did what she did because she's competing in in a male dominated sport, what better way to get men interested in you than posing nude on a magazine? Some of her "goodies" were covered up, but the idea and impact is the same - she posed without clothes for male attention.


Apparently you aren't alone in thinking it's the same. I personally don't agree. It's not just what they did it's who they did it for. Playboy and ESPN are two very different companies and the magazines are made for two very different purposes. To Arianny's credit she probably got a lot more money for her display then Ronda did for her. Whether we agree or not the appearance of nipples is not acceptable on TV. What Ronda did is allowed. That right there should tell you there is some difference. If in your opinion there is no real significant difference there then that is fine, I just don't agree.


----------



## Swp (Jan 2, 2010)

compare a ring girl to a fighter...


----------



## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

OU said:


> Apparently you aren't alone in thinking it's the same. I personally don't agree. It's not just what they did it's who they did it for. Playboy and ESPN are two very different companies and the magazines are made for two very different purposes. To Arianny's she probably got a lot more money for her display then Ronda did for her. Whether we agree or not the appearance of nipples is not acceptable on TV. What Ronda did is allowed. That right there should tell you there is some difference. If in your opinion there is no real significant difference there then that is fine, I just don't agree.


Nipples are acceptable on TV, full breasts with fake sex is acceptable on TV, just not on movies made for a younger audience and they generally have a "rated R/M" clip for a few seconds before it starts. Nudity is a part of art these days, from professional modeling to being an actress, to just posing in a photo like Ronda/Arianny did.

As you say, we see it differently and will have to just agree to disagree. :thumbsup:


----------



## buddyface (Oct 9, 2008)

Posing as an object of desire, whether clothed or not clothed, whether male or female is objectifying. 
At this point I’m putting aside whether one thinks this objectification is part of oppression, freewill, internalized subjugation, or claiming back power is irrelevant. I’ll focus on Rousey calls out Celeste for posing and then turns around and willing poses. 

The implied sexuality of the Rousey image – I’m naked behind my gloves and the photos is cropped just above my hips’ is way more sexually implicitly then a natural naked body where everything is shown and nothing left to the imagination. 

This is subjective and we might as well debate the super bowl nipple gate again. A women showing her nipples is no different than a man showing his nipples, and Rousey covering her breasts when she clearly has nothing else on is the epitome of sexualizing herself as an object and not presenting herself as an elite athlete but as an object of sexual desire. This is what Rousey initially is complaining about regarding Celeste.

Rousey complains that Celeste posing in playboy leaving nothing to the imagination makes Celeste somehow below Rousey, and yet Rousey is sexualizing her own image in a much more explicit manner.


----------



## OU (Sep 26, 2012)

M.C said:


> Nipples are acceptable on TV, full breasts with fake sex is acceptable on TV, just not on movies made for a younger audience and they generally have a "rated R/M" clip for a few seconds before it starts. Nudity is a part of art these days, from professional modeling to being an actress, to just posing in a photo like Ronda/Arianny did.
> 
> As you say, we see it differently and will have to just agree to disagree. :thumbsup:


Ok maybe I should say basic cable. You have to have Showtime or HBO to see nipples. I'm talking about basic cable which I thought was implied. Maybe I should also specify female nipples, since you can see a males nipples on basic cable.

But yes, we see it differently. I think there is a difference where as you see no difference at all.


----------



## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

OU said:


> Rousey posed in a nude but covered edition for ESPN the magazine. Arianny put her goodies on display for the most popular porn magazine in the world. There is a difference.
> Let's not get it confused, I'm a pretty big Ronda hater. But Arianny isn't in position to make these kind of comments IMO.
> Ronda took her clothes off for a photo shoot 1 time that didn't display anything that couldn't be advertised on the front page of ESPN.com and she did it to promote her career.
> Arianny's career consist of wearing as little clothing as possible so guys can stare at her. Maybe you would prefer this for your daughter or sister. I would not.


Yeah there is a difference, we didn't get to see Ronda's nipples. Period. I have no idea why so many people think that's some kind of important distinction.

edit: Oh, I see this is already brought up. Well, it's an arbitrary distinction and if you think Ronda has more integrity because she shows everything Arianny's showed EXCEPT her nipples... um, great.



OU said:


> Apparently you aren't alone in thinking it's the same. I personally don't agree. It's not just what they did it's who they did it for. Playboy and ESPN are two very different companies and the magazines are made for two very different purposes.


So it's not the content of the picture, its the intent of the periodical that matters? Hrmm...


----------



## ReptilianSlayer (Sep 2, 2013)

Rousey is a loud mouth hypocrite. Let's get this straight. She called out Arianney publicly as basically being a talentless whore (not her actual words, but that was clearly the message she was sending) for no reason what so ever, completely unprovoked. Then, AFTER she calls out Arianney, she poses nude for a magazine to gain more publicity and exposure. Arianney responds rightfully (and much more gracefully than I would have expected).

I've never really been fond of Celeste, but good for her for sticking up for herself from this hypocritical pig and standing her ground in a respectable way.

Bugger off Rousey, you're not a Diaz brother, no matter how hard you pretend to be.










Real classy darling.


----------



## OU (Sep 26, 2012)

HexRei said:


> Yeah there is a difference, we didn't get to see Ronda's nipples. Period. I have no idea why so many people think that's some kind of important distinction.
> 
> edit: Oh, I see this is already brought up. Well, it's an arbitrary distinction and if you think Ronda has more integrity because she shows everything Arianny's showed EXCEPT her nipples... um, great.


I personally don't think there should be much made of the inch or so in the middle of a breast that is taboo. However the distinction in there. One is acceptable to be on a magazine rack you might see by a register at a general store, the other will be plastic wrap behind the counter. One spread can be shown on ESPN the other can't. IMO the key difference lies in they type of magazine they are displayed in and the intention and perception of those magazines.


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

ReptilianSlayer said:


> Rousey is a loud mouth hypocrite. Let's get this straight. She called out Arianney publicly as basically being a talentless whore (not her actual words, but that was clearly the message she was sending) for no reason what so ever, completely unprovoked. Then, AFTER she calls out Arianney, she poses nude for a magazine to gain more publicity and exposure. Arianney responds rightfully (and much more gracefully than I would have expected).
> 
> I've never really been fond of Celeste, but good for her for sticking up for herself from this hypocritical pig and standing her ground in a respectable way.
> 
> ...


But... Arianni *is* a talentless whore. All she does is take her clothes off, period. Whereas, for Ronda, posing nude was merely a distraction from her day job.


----------



## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

Soojooko said:


> But... Arianni *is* a talentless whore. All she does is take her clothes off, period. Whereas, for Ronda, posing nude was merely a distraction from her day job.


Oh, so that makes Ronda a talented whore then I guess? (your words, not mine, I don't know factually that either woman has had sex for money)


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

I dont think AriannY is a talentless whore.

There is plenty of hot sexy women out there who are far less as accomplished then Arianny. If they could just take off their clothes to get to where Arianny is in life im sure they would have. But it takes a bit of talent...


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

HexRei said:


> Oh, so that makes Ronda a talented whore then I guess? (your words, not mine, I don't know factually that either woman has had sex for money)


Exactly. Except her talents dont lie in whoring. That's the difference.

A skilled girl who takes her clothes of as a novelty is one million miles away from a girl who takes her clothes off and nothing else.


----------



## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

Soojooko said:


> Exactly. Except her talents dont lie in whoring. That's the difference.
> 
> A skilled girl who takes her clothes of as a novelty is one million miles away from a girl who takes her clothes off and nothing else.


Arianny also sings (however unsuccessfully) and carries a card (lol). Her job isn't *all* about being naturally attractive. She probably spends a lot of time working on looking good, in the gym, and in front of the mirror with a makeup kit, etc. I'm not saying it's as much work as Ronda puts in by far, but she doesn't just lay in bed all day then roll out and comb her hair or something and then carry the card. By this standard, btw, I guess all models must be considered talentless whores. I think that's really stretching the definition of whore.


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

HexRei said:


> Arianny also sings (however unsuccessfully) and carries a card (lol). Her job isn't *all* about being naturally attractive. She probably spends a lot of time working on looking good, in the gym, and in front of the mirror with a makeup kit, etc. I'm not saying it's as much work as Ronda puts in by far, but she doesn't just lay in bed all day then roll out and comb her hair or something and then carry the card. By this standard, btw, I guess all models must be considered talentless whores. I think that's really stretching the definition of whore.


I heard her sing some stuff on youtube and she isnt bad. I liked it better then the way alot of successful people sing. Her singing sounded... human,honest,normal is the best way i could describe it. I wouldnt mind listening to it if i was living with her. She didnt need technology to make it sound good.


----------



## TheNinja (Dec 10, 2008)

Arianny coming off a bit salty. I think she's a little jelly (in my Eric Cartman voice).


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

TheNinja said:


> Arianny coming off a bit salty. I think she's a little jelly (in my Eric Cartman voice).







Lets send Arianny to the jelly school.


----------



## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

accomplishments aside I'd rather spend time around Arianny than Ronda. I wouldn't want Ronda as a role model for any one, everything about her is a bad attitude, crass and self-centered. Who would want their kid to grow up acting superior to everyone, what an awful personality. Before you say oh she earned it or whatever, screw that, there are plenty of world champions in many different sports that are millionaires many times over that are humble and act like decent human beings. Ronda's only a bronze medalist, I've met Olympic Gold medalists and world champions that can remember their fans first names and never say a bad thing about anyone even if they want to. To name one: Jarome Iginla, the dude was verbally abused (racially) as an up and comer and he's the most humble guy in the world.

What a hypocrit, she's on her high horse criticizing Arianny for being in playboy showing nearly everything when Ronda was in Sports illustrated showing nearly as much. Damnit I hate Ronda Rousey so much, I thought I disliked Jon Jones but holy hell Ronda is one phony hypocritical bitch, good for you not showing your nipples, that makes you so much more superior only showing your ass. You might say I'm crazy but intuition leads me to believe Karma will catch up to her one day.


----------



## ReptilianSlayer (Sep 2, 2013)

Soojooko said:


> Exactly. Except her talents dont lie in whoring. That's the difference.
> 
> A skilled girl who takes her clothes of as a novelty is one million miles away from a girl who takes her clothes off and nothing else.


So what exactly are you trying to say? Arianny didn't disrespect Ronda, Ronda disrespected her by calling her out on being "talentless". Would you like it if Honda Housey called your daughter a talentless whore? Would she get away with that statement because she tosses women around for a living and has athletic talents?

I don't give a phuck what your talents are in life. Stay humble, and stay true to yourself. She provoked Arianney for no reason (possible envy of her looks?), then posed nude for a magazine, and then Arianney responded to defend herself. I couldn't give a damn who has more "talent", I don't know much about Celeste, but she seems to be the nicer, more humble human being of the two, and that's really all that matters to me. You can have all the talent and ability in the world, if you're a disrespectful loud mouth bitch, then I don't want nothing to do with you.


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

rabakill said:


> accomplishments aside I'd rather spend time around Arianny than Ronda. I wouldn't want Ronda as a role model for any one, everything about her is a bad attitude, crass and self-centered. Who would want their kid to grow up acting superior to everyone, what an awful personality. Before you say oh she earned it or whatever, screw that, there are plenty of world champions in many different sports that are millionaires many times over that are humble and act like decent human beings. Ronda's only a bronze medalist, I've met Olympic Gold medalists and world champions that can remember their fans first names and never say a bad thing about anyone even if they want to. To name one: Jarome Iginla, the dude was verbally abused (racially) as an up and comer and he's the most humble guy in the world.
> 
> What a hypocrit, she's on her high horse criticizing Arianny for being in playboy showing nearly everything when Ronda was in Sports illustrated showing nearly as much. Damnit I hate Ronda Rousey so much, I thought I disliked Jon Jones but holy hell Ronda is one phony hypocritical bitch, good for you not showing your nipples, that makes you so much more superior only showing your ass.


This...

Neither is a good role model and neither is someone id want my daughter to imitate. But i would be heck of alot happier if my daughter had Ariannys personality then Rondas. Now i know that we dont know either of the women so we dont know what they are really like off camera but strictly speaking from what we do see i think Arianny is much nicer then Ronda. 

A kid once made a video on youtube singing asking Arianny to go to prom with him. Arianny responded and went with him to prom and made the kids dream come true. She didnt need to do that and someone like Ronda never would have. She could have just ignored the kid but she decided to do something nice for someone. So everything i have seen or heard from/about Arianny is that she is a good person. And that triumphs doing a naked photoshoot for Playboy. Minus the photoshoot i actually wouldnt mind having a daughter that turned out to be like Arianny i would be proud.


----------



## Woodenhead (Jan 5, 2010)

SideWays222 said:


> A kid once made a video on youtube singing asking Arianny to go to prom with him. Arianny responded and went with him to prom and made the kids dream come true. She didnt need to do that and someone like Ronda never would have. She could have just ignored the kid but she decided to do something nice for someone. So everything i have seen or heard from/about Arianny is that she is a good person. And that triumphs doing a naked photoshoot for Playboy. Minus the photoshoot i actually wouldnt mind having a daughter that turned out to be like Arianny i would be proud.


I'm in that camp as well. I'd rather have my daughter be friendly & well-grounded, regardless of posing nude & whatever she decides to do on that front, as opposed to a successful douchebag.

It's much easier to learn to become "successful" than it is to grow out of douchebaggery.


----------



## Ryan1522 (Oct 31, 2006)

Tons of assumptions here, but this is likely not far from the truth.


Here's what's going on... Arianny is absolutely gorgeous, Ronda most likely is intimated or jealous of Arianny's looks. As Ronda likely fancies herself as an Alpha female or matriarch she felt inclined to downplay Arianny's job as to tame her own insecurities. 

Although i do believe that Arianny's job requires zero skill or talent and the objectification of women is at it's peak during the 1 minute between rounds, i happen to agree with Arianny that Ronda is not the best role model due to the way she conducted herself on TUF.

It's unbelievably hypocritical of Arianny to say that Ronda is not a role model when she is far from a role model herself.

As far as the hypocrisy posters are referring to regarding Ronda's ESPN nude cover shoot, I say Arianny's shoot is borderline smut ( not that i minded looking at it) and Ronda's is more tasteful as OU eluded to.

If i had to pick a role model out of Arianny or Ronda it would 100 percent be Ronda. Hard work, dedication, sacrifice, blood, sweat, and tears to earn an Olympic medal and UFC brass or hitting the genetic aesthetic lottery and walking in circles with a cardboard sign? Do u think she can only turn left?


----------



## buddyface (Oct 9, 2008)

Ryan1522 said:


> As far as the hypocrisy posters are referring to regarding Ronda's ESPN nude cover shoot, I say Arianny's shoot is borderline smut ( not that i minded looking at it) and Ronda's is more tasteful as OU eluded to.


The intention of the Rousey images was to sell sex implicitly, whereas the Celesete images was to sell sex explicitly. There are both doing the same thing but Playboy as oppose to ESPN mag is being honest about it.

Rousey spent all of TUF talking about being upfront with people and what you see is what you get. That is far from the case with her though. For Rousey to blast Celesete for willingly being a sex object when she appears in a magazine that is about women as sex objects and then to turn around and do a much more proactive sexualized image and claim because it s a sports magazine it is somehow not selling sex is ridiculous.


----------



## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

Ryan1522 said:


> If i had to pick a role model out of Arianny or Ronda it would 100 percent be Ronda. Hard work, dedication, sacrifice, blood, sweat, and tears to earn an Olympic medal and UFC brass or hitting the genetic aesthetic lottery and walking in circles with a cardboard sign? Do u think she can only turn left?


Ronda is a horrible role model, anyone can work hard and sacrifice. That's easy. Accomplishing goals and staying humble, now that's something to be proud of.


----------



## Hammerlock2.0 (Jun 17, 2009)

That's one of the most sexist things I've heard in a while and it's coming from a woman who's making a living by being pretty.


----------



## amoosenamedhank (Sep 2, 2009)

rabakill said:


> anyone can work hard and sacrifice. That's easy.


:jaw:

You've got to be kidding me, right? The insane focus,drive and sacrifice necessary to become a top caliber Olympic athlete is easy? You seriously have no idea what you're talking about. 

Easily one of the craziest statements I've ever read on here.


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

ReptilianSlayer said:


> So what exactly are you trying to say? Arianny didn't disrespect Ronda, Ronda disrespected her by calling her out on being "talentless". Would you like it if Honda Housey called your daughter a talentless whore? Would she get away with that statement because she tosses women around for a living and has athletic talents?
> 
> I don't give a phuck what your talents are in life. Stay humble, and stay true to yourself. She provoked Arianney for no reason (possible envy of her looks?), then posed nude for a magazine, and then Arianney responded to defend herself. I couldn't give a damn who has more "talent", I don't know much about Celeste, but she seems to be the nicer, more humble human being of the two, and that's really all that matters to me. You can have all the talent and ability in the world, if you're a disrespectful loud mouth bitch, then I don't want nothing to do with you.


Humble? Arianny?! :laugh:

Anybody who claims anybody else is "not a good role model" is in essence saying they are a better role model themselves = humble, my arse.


----------



## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

amoosenamedhank said:


> :jaw:
> 
> You've got to be kidding me, right? The insane focus,drive and sacrifice necessary to become a top caliber Olympic athlete is anything other than 'easy'.
> 
> Easily one of the craziest statements I've ever read on here.


I think he's talking about in general. Everyone has to work hard, put in effort and sacrifice in their life. There's nothing to praise about it, everyone has to do it. It's like praising someone for feeding their child, that's what you're supposed to do, you don't get praise or get patted on the back for it.

Congratulations, you did the same thing billions of others have to do, HIGH FIVE! It's a bit silly.


----------



## amoosenamedhank (Sep 2, 2009)

M.C said:


> I think he's talking about in general. Everyone has to work hard, put in effort and sacrifice in their life. There's nothing to praise about it, everyone has to do it. It's like praising someone for feeding their child, that's what you're supposed to do, you don't get praise or get patted on the back for it.


Ronda doesn't deserve praise because she fed her dog this morning.. she deserves praise because she has dedicated a very large portion of her life (starting from a very young age)to be great at something.

I don't think people realize how much sacrifice truly comes with that. Most people either can't or won't make that sacrifice. 

She has remand focus and driven and that ability brought her to being the 3rd best at something in the entire world.

To be able to literally say, I am the 3rd best person in the entire world at something is no small feat... and I think that deserves recognition.


----------



## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

amoosenamedhank said:


> Ronda doesn't deserve praise because she fed her dog this morning.. she deserves praise because she has dedicated a very large portion of her life, starting from a very young age to something.
> 
> She has remand focus and driven and that ability brought her to being the 3rd best at something in the entire world.
> 
> To be able to literally say, I am the 3rd best person in the entire world at something is no small feat... and I think that deserves recognition.


She deserves a "good job" for reaching her goal, as does everyone else on this planet who has. Let me rephrase - she deserves no more praise than any other person who has worked hard and dedicated themselves. If someone is judging "role model" based on hard work, sacrifice, dedication, you're looking at most people on this planet - including Arianny. 

Personally I don't think either of them are role models except maybe to their younger family that might look up to them the same way most children look up to adults in their life. Neither is anything special and both should probably mind their own business about each other.


----------



## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

OU said:


> Wasn't Arianny in Playboy? If I had the choice of my daughter being a World Champion that happens to be a d-bag or the eye candy ring card girl that was in Playboy. I'd take the Rousey route 100 times out of 100.


I'd rather have my child be seen naked when she is an adult than suffer the unavoidable massive amount of brain damage associated with being a professional fighter. That is just me though.


----------



## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

amoosenamedhank said:


> :jaw:
> 
> You've got to be kidding me, right? The insane focus,drive and sacrifice necessary to become a top caliber Olympic athlete is easy? You seriously have no idea what you're talking about.
> 
> Easily one of the craziest statements I've ever read on here.


Well I disagree, I know many people that work just as many hours as she does and work just as hard, many of them just as rich or more. There are lazy people yes, but there are also a lot of people that work 14 hour days. 

I've been on the side of working that hard and know quite a few people much wealthier than her so hard work and dedication isn't that impressive. Many of them say if they could go back and work less and spend more time being with family and friends they would, at the Christmas party I was at Brett Wilson was telling me all about this lamenting lost years while he became a billionaire. Not saying that's what she should do, but it's not that impressive. 7 first round armbars is much more credulous if you are looking for something to laud about. Also, not sustaining serious injury is impressive, she doesn't seem to have sustained any serious damage as of yet which not many can say.


----------



## ReptilianSlayer (Sep 2, 2013)

Soojooko said:


> Humble? Arianny?! :laugh:
> 
> Anybody who claims anybody else is "not a good role model" is in essence saying they are a better role model themselves = humble, my arse.


That just isn't true. I can come out and state that I think Miley Cyrus is a terrible role model for teenage girls without thinking that I'd ever make a good role model for society. 

Maybe Arianny isn't humble, I don't know her, I'm just judging from this particular feud. Ronda called her out and provoked her for no reason, Arianney responded and defended herself. Good on her I say.


----------



## Ryan1522 (Oct 31, 2006)

buddyface said:


> The intention of the Rousey images was to sell sex implicitly, whereas the Celesete images was to sell sex explicitly. There are both doing the same thing but Playboy as oppose to ESPN mag is being honest about it.
> 
> Rousey spent all of TUF talking about being upfront with people and what you see is what you get. That is far from the case with her though. For Rousey to blast Celesete for willingly being a sex object when she appears in a magazine that is about women as sex objects and then to turn around and do a much more proactive sexualized image and claim because it s a sports magazine it is somehow not selling sex is ridiculous.


Never did I contest the hypocrisy of what Ronda did. You're right, both Arianny and Ronda were selling sex. 

My point is simply that Ronda's photo shoot is less revealing, more conservative, classier if you will. You can see more nudity walking down the street on a hot day than you do in Ronda's 'nude' shoot. Ronda's photo is featured on a sports magazine cover to help promote her already well-established mixed martial arts career.

Arianny's photo shoot is more revealing for a men's magazine well known for it's nude, objectifying images of women. She's trying to promote herself and quite honestly, use her two biggest assets to make some quick money. 

There is a difference in the images... just look em up.




rabakill said:


> Ronda is a horrible role model, anyone can work hard and sacrifice. That's easy. Accomplishing goals and staying humble, now that's something to be proud of.


I said if I had to pick out of the two...

Hard work and sacrifice to attain an Olympic medal and the UFC belt is not easy. Furthermore, both of those were likely goals that Ronda set out to do and accomplish. How many people work hard enough and sacrifice enough to accomplish that?

Bizarre statement.



M.C said:


> I think he's talking about in general. Everyone has to work hard, put in effort and sacrifice in their life. There's nothing to praise about it, everyone has to do it. It's like praising someone for feeding their child, that's what you're supposed to do, you don't get praise or get patted on the back for it.
> 
> Congratulations, you did the same thing billions of others have to do, HIGH FIVE! It's a bit silly.


This is such a blanket statement. 

There are varying levels of degrees of work ethic and sacrifice. Olympic medal and UFC-gold work ethic/sacrifice is not comparable to cardboard carrying and stellar make-up work ethic/sacrifice or fill a hole with asphalt and have a coffee work ethic/sacrifice or... (enter mundane task that isn't very difficult, that people pretend is to make themselves feel better, here)


----------



## Rygu (Jul 21, 2008)

Arianny is just pointing out the obvious. I've actually never once heard or read one person stating that they thought she was a good role model.


----------



## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

A handshake at the end of a fight says: it was only business, nothing personal.

Things got personal between Ronda and Miesha.

A handshake to pretend it was only business and nothing personal, for PR and image purposes, wouldn't have amounted to more than an empty and fake gesture anyway.

Why criticize Ronda for not piling more fake PR on tv, when we already have so much of it?


----------



## PheelGoodInc (Jul 23, 2009)

rabakill said:


> Ronda is a horrible role model, *anyone can work hard and sacrifice. That's easy.* Accomplishing goals and staying humble, now that's something to be proud of.


Say what?

No, anyone can't. Working hard and accomplishing goals is one of lifes most difficult challenges. If it was easy, 3/4 of this forum would be in the UFC.


----------



## oldfan (Mar 14, 2010)

Only someone who knows nothing of either would belittle Ronda's work ethic, and achievement. I started reading this thread while I sat at my youngest daughter's second ever karate class. Both of my girls watch mma with me. They both admire Ronda and they both think ring girls are stupid.


I have very smart girls.


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

oldfan said:


> Only someone who knows nothing of either would belittle Ronda's work ethic, and achievement. I started reading this thread while I sat at my youngest daughter's second ever karate class. Both of my girls watch mma with me. They both admire Ronda and they both think ring girls are stupid.
> 
> 
> I have very smart girls.


:laugh:

:hug:


----------



## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

I can't believe a thread about two prima-donnas on their respective periods actually managed 6 pages of discussion. 

What a bunch of queens. Don't let me stand in the way of you getting in touch with your sensitive sides, nancy boys.


----------



## amoosenamedhank (Sep 2, 2009)

Canadian Psycho said:


> I can't believe a thread about two prima-donnas on their respective periods actually managed 6 pages of discussion.
> 
> What a bunch of queens. Don't let me stand in the way of you getting in touch with your sensitive sides, nancy boys.


We're just talking about boobs in here....:dunno:


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

amoosenamedhank said:


> Ronda doesn't deserve praise because she fed her dog this morning.. she deserves praise because she has dedicated a very large portion of her life (starting from a very young age)to be great at something.
> 
> I don't think people realize how much sacrifice truly comes with that. Most people either can't or won't make that sacrifice.
> 
> ...


I don't really get this... What exactly did Ronda sacrifice?? Did she leave her life behind and go fight in a war to protect the country?? Did she give up her dreams so she can help her parents out?? Did she work 3 jobs just so she can feed and clothe her children??

Ronda dedicated herself to a craft that she really enjoyed. A craft a lot off people do as a hobby. She went to the Olympics because that is something she wanted to do. She then became a MMA fighter because again that is what she wanted. She currently has a job most people would love to have... She makes tons of money.. she has fame.. does movies. I don't see a whole lot of sacrificing here. Throughout her life she has done everything she wanted to do. That isn't sacrificing... She works hard sure but that isn't sacrifice. 

And I always thought sacrificing for ones own benefit is a bit redundant to me. Seeing as how you are getting something you want more for something you care about less.. that does not really sound like sacrifice to me. 
Giving something up you want for someone else's benefit.. that to me is sacrifice.

And I don't want people to misunderstand me. I know Ronda worked her ass off.

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Scarecrow (Mar 20, 2008)

Rousey and Arianny are both tools. I feel sorry for anyone wanting to look up to either one of them. Rousey has a true and rare talent at least, that I will give her, but her personality is so atrocious that I can't but help but to root against her in all her endeavors. Arianny is nothing but a life support system for a vagina and proves it by how she pays the bills.


----------



## Iuanes (Feb 17, 2009)

I think role models are a cheap and flawed way to educate anyone on how to live life anyways.


----------



## Ryan1522 (Oct 31, 2006)

SideWays222 said:


> I don't really get this... What exactly did Ronda sacrifice?? Did she leave her life behind and go fight in a war to protect the country?? Did she give up her dreams so she can help her parents out?? Did she work 3 jobs just so she can feed and clothe her children??
> 
> Ronda dedicated herself to a craft that she really enjoyed. A craft a lot off people do as a hobby. She went to the Olympics because that is something she wanted to do. She then became a MMA fighter because again that is what she wanted. She currently has a job most people would love to have... She makes tons of money.. she has fame.. does movies. I don't see a whole lot of sacrificing here. Throughout her life she has done everything she wanted to do. That isn't sacrificing... She works hard sure but that isn't sacrifice.
> 
> ...


Pursuing an occupation you want to, which most people tend to gravitate towards doing, does not imply that no sacrifice was involved. 

Surely you can infer that one's social life, romantic life, family life etc. become comprised and sacrificed to some extent in order to make it to the top, no matter what you do for a living in life.

The time with loved ones is truly sacrificed in order to dedicate the time needed to be the best in the world at something.

The job everyone loves, the fortune, the fame, the opportunities that she has earned are all by-products of sacrificing relationships in the short term for the benefit of one's family in the long run by putting in the thousands of hours of hard work instead of having that free time for the relationships.


All 3 examples of 'true' sacrifice you gave above can be disputed because true sacrifice known as altruism doesn't actually exist. The benevolence of a person is always subject for debate.


----------



## sucrets (Jul 8, 2007)

While ronda is an abomination of humanity as a person she is an accomplished athlete, so as a collocation of protein she is certainly good at something. Arianne, while cute (sort of) is not in a position to claim honors for making "ring girl a career". It's gig (not a career) and it requires hardly anything special. Some above average good looks a good plastic surgeon and voila.

To be clear, there is nothing wrong with plastic surgery. In fact, I am all for it if it's made to improve. Walking around a ring in a bikini requires zero skill and hardly any effort. I bet you can get a bunch of fat ugly dudes tat can do it pissed drunk out of their mind. Big whoop.


----------



## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

SideWays222 said:


> If i had a daughter i would rather she chose Rouseys career path then Ariannys but i would rather she have Ariannys personality then Rouseys.


2¢ 
I suppose this is what I would want for my daughters as well (I have 4). Rousey unfortunately has convinced herself that being "real mean" as opposed to "fake nice" is a virtue. I think what she means is, it's better to openly hate people rather than just doing it quietly. 

The truth is though, keeping your mean feelings to yourself is simply a part of growing up. Most grown-ups do this. The world actually needs more "fake nice" people—people who don't feel the need to act out their bad feelings towards those they don't like. I would much rather my kids grow up in a world that is fake nice, rather than real mean. 

Now unfortunately for Rousey, she's on top of the world right now and will likely do whatever she pleases. So long as she keeps winning, she'll be put up on a pedestal regardless of how real or fake she acts. 

Props to Arianny for speaking up. Not that I endorse everything she's ever done, but she seems classy. 
/2¢


----------



## SmackyBear (Feb 14, 2008)

I'm always somewhat loathe to defend Rousey, but alas.

What did she say that was so hypocritical? She didn't say posing in magazines was bad, she didn't say sexy pictures are bad, she didn't even say Celeste was a whore. She specifically said that photos were permanent and that showing her vagina and ass (from context it appears she means "complete ass" rather than partial check that could be visible on the beach) would be embarrassing later in life:



> “With all these ring girls and their vaginas, – all of this goes back to advice my mom gave me. She gave me this one piece of advice, which I still hold dear. She said, ‘Look, whatever pictures you put out there are gonna be out there forever, so just think that one day your 12 or 13-year-old son or daughter is going to see those pictures. Whatever you want your son or daughter, or even your 13-year-old little sister to see, keep that in mind.’ So, whatever I’m not gonna show on a beach, I’m not gonna show in a magazine. These girls are going to have to explain to their kids one day why mommy’s ass and vagina are all over the place.”


Source

Can't say I don't understand. Nobody wants to see their mother's vagina.

Later:



> [Q] Congrats on making Maxim’s Hot 100! As someone who’s so competitive, do you feel there are any women who outranked you who don’t deserve it?
> 
> [A] It would have been really funny if I’d beaten [UFC Octagon Girl] Arianny Celeste, because that would be like a triathlete coming along and beating the runners in a marathon. Like, “Ha-ha, it’s your job to show your titties—I do that better than you!” Maybe next year. She’s only getting older, and I’m reaching my prime.


Source

Being a douche? Sure. Hypocritical? No.



buddyface said:


> Posing as an object of desire, whether clothed or not clothed, whether male or female is objectifying.
> At this point I’m putting aside whether one thinks this objectification is part of oppression, freewill, internalized subjugation, or claiming back power is irrelevant. I’ll focus on Rousey calls out Celeste for posing and then turns around and willing poses.
> 
> The implied sexuality of the Rousey image – I’m naked behind my gloves and the photos is cropped just above my hips’ is way more sexually implicitly then a natural naked body where everything is shown and nothing left to the imagination.
> ...


First, even if you were correct that Rousey is against sexy pictures, and she's not, ESPN's Body Issue pics aren't sexy. I can't believe this is even an argument.

Why was Rousey "posing as an object of desire" in ESPN magazine? Were Jon Jones, Apollo Anton Ono, Colin Kaepernick, Vernon Davis, Tyson Chandler, Adrian Peterson, Rob Gronkowski, etc. objects of desire and not elite athletes?

Many of them are smiling and obscuring their junk with a ball, or the photo is cropped, or taken from an angle where a leg or an arm obscures it. Are they objects of desire too? What about the Olympian who poses with a discus, like Myron's Diskobolus? Is everything so sexual that people can only appreciate the human form as sexual?



Calminian said:


> 2¢
> I suppose this is what I would want for my daughters as well (I have 4). Rousey unfortunately has convinced herself that being "real mean" as opposed to "fake nice" is a virtue. I think what she means is, it's better to openly hate people rather than just doing it quietly.
> 
> The truth is though, keeping your mean feelings to yourself is simply a part of growing up. Most grown-ups do this. The world actually needs more "fake nice" people—people who don't feel the need to act out their bad feelings towards those they don't like. I would much rather my kids grow up in a world that is fake nice, rather than real mean.
> ...


raise01:


----------



## Woodenhead (Jan 5, 2010)

This thread is about 21 posts longer than it should be.


----------



## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

I don't get people dissing a girl because she shows her tits. What's the big problem? She gets paid millions for it, and if she has absolutely no ethical or moral issues with it, I don't see the problem.

I do agree with Ronda's mum though. Imagine your mum was spread eagle in Playboy. What? You actually imagined it? You suck incestuous fuks!


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> I don't get people dissing a girl because she shows her tits. What's the big problem? She gets paid millions for it, and if she has absolutely no ethical or moral issues with it, I don't see the problem.
> 
> I do agree with Ronda's mum though. Imagine your mum was spread eagle in Playboy. What? You actually imagined it? You suck incestuous fuks!


Getting your tits out has nothing to do with it. Hell, my missus got her tits out in her late teens. Got paid very well to do it too. Doesn't bother me in the slightest. She also happens to have a degree in biochemistry.

Point is, *anybody* dictating to us who is a good role model or not, is a bit of a twat. Its right up there with people calling themselves "humble", like Bones. I cant be dealing with arseholes like that.


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

Ryan1522 said:


> Pursuing an occupation you want to, which most people tend to gravitate towards doing, does not imply that no sacrifice was involved.
> 
> Surely you can infer that one's social life, romantic life, family life etc. become comprised and sacrificed to some extent in order to make it to the top, no matter what you do for a living in life.
> 
> ...


Just like i thought she didnt sacrifice anything worth talking about.

She lived at home while she was training for the Olympics. So she probably got to spend more time with her mom then il ever get to spend with mine. Hell i doubt she was even spending 8 hours in the gym like most people do at a job and then dont bitch about "sacrifice". When i was 15 and a half years old i started working 6 hour days at a mom and pop restaurant. I guess we can add going to school then to the gym in there and then wrestling practice and homework and i got to spend little time with my parents and i dont pretend i sacrificed something. Thats just some nonsense people spit when they want people to feel sorry for them or something. 
I have tons of friends and acquaintance who have moved states so they can "pursue" they goals and their not crying about sacrifice away from their loved ones. So give me a break with that "she sacrificed time away from her family" nonsense. Its not anything that just about any human on earth has to do eventually. And the earth is a small place these days anyway with phones and webcams. So she could have talked to them literally whenever she wanted.
Same for her "relationship sacrifice". How exactly did she sacrifice that?? Again people work a heck of alot longer then Rousey and they have relationships. So Rousey could have had one too. When i see what alot of people have sacrificed "time away from your loved ones because you are in the gym" is nothing more then a joke. 



> All 3 examples of 'true' sacrifice you gave above can be disputed because true sacrifice known as altruism doesn't actually exist. The benevolence of a person is always subject for debate.


Yeah im not even going to bother responding to this. If thats what you think then great... im happy for you.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

So, *hard* work is *easy*? That made my day.

Lets put this way:

Both can be role models in their respective professions. As human beings, that's another story.
It is more than clear, with the right production, Arianny and Ronda can be considered beutiful fit girls, respecting personal taste.
As far as work goes, you CAN'T compare the amount of work and specific knowledge Ronda had to gather to reach the top of her career to the amount Arianny had to gather to hold a numbered card in the air, please.

When Ronda is done with fighting, she'll still be a black belt with tons of experience to pass ahead to young fighters. What about Arianny? I am sure she is set for life and can use her fame to promote products or whatever, but what can she pass along about holding a card in the air?

Nothing against her at all, but she have lost a good opportunity to stay quiet here.


----------



## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Soojooko said:


> Getting your tits out has nothing to do with it. Hell, my missus got her tits out in her late teens. Got paid very well to do it too. Doesn't bother me in the slightest. She also happens to have a degree in biochemistry.
> 
> Point is, *anybody* dictating to us who is a good role model or not, is a bit of a twat. Its right up there with people calling themselves "humble", like Bones. I cant be dealing with arseholes like that.


Yeah I see your point.

These guys like Jones need to watch a bit of WWE. Would help with a face turn.


----------



## Ryan1522 (Oct 31, 2006)

SideWays222 said:


> Just like i thought she didnt sacrifice anything worth talking about.
> 
> She lived at home while she was training for the Olympics. *So she probably got to spend more time with her mom then il ever get to spend with mine. *Hell i doubt she was even spending 8 hours in the gym like most people do at a job and then dont bitch about "sacrifice". *When i was 15 and a half years old i started working 6 hour days at a mom and pop restaurant. I guess we can add going to school then to the gym in there and then wrestling practice and homework and i got to spend little time with my parents and i dont pretend i sacrificed something.* Thats just some nonsense people spit when they want people to feel sorry for them or something.
> I have tons of friends and acquaintance who have moved states so they can "pursue" they goals and their not crying about sacrifice away from their loved ones. So give me a break with that "she sacrificed time away from her family" nonsense. Its not anything that just about any human on earth has to do eventually. And the earth is a small place these days anyway with phones and webcams. So she could have talked to them literally whenever she wanted.
> ...


The personal accounts really are cute.

Don't know how it was possible, but you somehow made the 'octagon girl's opinion' thread about yourself. Not surprising.

Why even write the last part? If you're not going to respond you don't have to tell us you're not going to respond as if we are missing out on some absolutely insightful post that is going to solve the ever lasting debate regarding the indirect benefits of a purely altruistic act. 

The topic of altruism is subjective so you can do away with the inherent omniscient sarcasm.


----------



## buddyface (Oct 9, 2008)

SmackyBear said:


> First, even if you were correct that Rousey is against sexy pictures, and she's not, ESPN's Body Issue pics aren't sexy. I can't believe this is even an argument.
> 
> Why was Rousey "posing as an object of desire" in ESPN magazine? Were Jon Jones, Apollo Anton Ono, Colin Kaepernick, Vernon Davis, Tyson Chandler, Adrian Peterson, Rob Gronkowski, etc. objects of desire and not elite athletes?
> 
> Many of them are smiling and obscuring their junk with a ball, or the photo is cropped, or taken from an angle where a leg or an arm obscures it. Are they objects of desire too? What about the Olympian who poses with a discus, like Myron's Diskobolus? Is everything so sexual that people can only appreciate the human form as sexual?


Where’s your second point?

First – I don’t know Rousey’s direct answer to ‘sexy photos’ but she makes it clear that based on her mother’s teachings that showing breasts or genitalia is a no no for women and it is implied that is a shame that will carry with the individual the rest of their lives. One can infer from this that Rousey takes a negative few of full nudity, but full skin and cheeky placement of hands and photo cropping is just fine. 

Second - I would say that the ESPN body image issue is entirely about selling sex and little to do with selling athletic ability. If they were truly going to celebrate the body image the publisher would run the gauntlet, wrap the mag and sell it behind the counter without having to, as you say “obscure it”. The issue I have is when someone like Rousey gets on her soap box about other people doing full nude poses and then claiming it will damage them the rest of their life. People generally don’t say “Hey that’s some wonderful damage you’ve done to yourself for the rest of your life” and mean it as a compliment. Rousey is clearly making a distinction that her posing in the ‘body’ issue is in not selling sex in a sports magazine when the issue in question is doing nothing but selling sex. Celeste posing in playboy is clearly selling sex, but at least they are honest about it. Where is Rousey and her shtick about what you see is what you get. She blasts Celesete for doing exactly what she here self has also done. But because the magazine title is playboy and shows the whole body Rousey figures on this issue she is above Celeste. 

Side note - I think it is great this discussion went 8 pages :happy01::happy01: Here's to 8 more


----------



## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

Can't believe the debate this has sparked.

From what I've seen Ronda is awesome, not much more to say on that.

For me, modelling nude or clothed really doesn't say much about the individual, sure it takes a certain type of person but you can't judge them because of it. If they're getting big coins thrown at them, good for them. Go girl!!! It's not always seedy.

Funniest thing, Arianny really isn't all that, I wouldn't pay money to see her in Playboy.


----------



## Nomale (Apr 22, 2007)

Ryan1522 said:


> Pursuing an occupation you want to, which most people tend to gravitate towards doing, does not imply that no sacrifice was involved.
> 
> Surely you can infer that one's social life, romantic life, family life etc. become comprised and sacrificed to some extent in order to make it to the top, no matter what you do for a living in life.
> 
> ...


Sideways makes a good point. We can assume Ronda worked to be the athlete that she is today for herself and not because someone else wanted it. It was her priority no. 1. Did she then _sacrifice_ her lower priorities? In some sense maybe but normally we mean that a sacrifice is something that is a net loss to you. Ronda herself was the gainer of her sacrifices. It's about making priorities instead. 

Altruism doesn't exist? Altruism is the opposite of egoism in the sense that an act which aim to benefit the interests of others rather than yourself is an altruistic act. Even if you have some benefit from it like a good feeling it's still altruistic. (To say that any action which gives you the slightest benefit is in essence egoistic is an out-dated view.)

This is not to say that all altruistic acts are very praiseworthy. A rich man who gives a penny to a starving beggar is being altruistic (at a very small degree) but most would say he is morally obliged to do more than that.


----------



## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

SM33 said:


> Can't believe the debate this has sparked.
> 
> From what I've seen Ronda is awesome, not much more to say on that.
> 
> ...


Both have posed nude. Rhonda chose to make money off her body, just like other women. 

I think what people don't like about Rhonda is she's constantly talking herself up. "Hey, I'm an athlete and people want to see me naked. I'm better than that Arianny girl over there. She's just good looking." 

Now I don't endorse women posing nude in any circumstance. But Arianny's rebuke was necessary and classy. She impressed me. She may not have been gifted with the physical strength Rhonda has, but she handles her fame much better. If Rhonda is smart, she'll listen and learn.


----------



## dave-stjohn (Nov 10, 2009)

OU said:


> Wasn't Arianny in Playboy? If I had the choice of my daughter being a World Champion that happens to be a d-bag or the eye candy ring card girl that was in Playboy. I'd take the Rousey route 100 times out of 100.


I think you missed Arianny's point, she wasn't trying to make a moral point she was saying Ronda should be more supportive of her fellow female fighters and I totally agree with her. For whatever reason women have a tendency to attack each other when things would be much better and easier if they, like Arianny said "pat each other on the back and say good job". Ronda has on more than one occasion shown tremendously poor sportsmanship and that sets a poor example for younger fighters looking to emulate their favorite fighter. Whether she likes it or not she's a role model to some young female fighters.


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

dave-stjohn said:


> I think you missed Arianny's point, she wasn't trying to make a moral point she was saying Ronda should be more supportive of her fellow female fighters


No. Shes saying Ronda should be more supportive of her, in recognition of all the good work she's done carrying a plaque with her IQ printed on it.


----------



## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

Soojooko said:


> No. Shes saying Ronda should be more supportive of her, in recognition of all the good work she's done carrying a plaque with her IQ printed on it.


I think she was asking her to be more supportive of all women. Such as not smugly taking a shit on an entire industry. That's a decent point all by itself, but when you add in that she turned around and did the exact same thing once the offer and money were there, that really drives the point home. Ronda is an extremely conceited person though, so its different when *she's* the one doing it. To her, at least.


----------



## Woodenhead (Jan 5, 2010)

Becoming successful can be learned.

Being a douchebag is genetic.


----------



## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

HexRei said:


> I think she was asking her to be more supportive of all women. Such as not smugly taking a shit on an entire industry. That's a decent point all by itself, but when you add in that she turned around and did the exact same thing once the offer and money were there, that really drives the point home. Ronda is an extremely conceited person though, so its different when *she's* the one doing it. To her, at least.


See I have no clue what people are even talking about here. Who has Ronda no been supportive of? Tate? Who else?

She was nothing but class to McMann and Liz. Very VERY supportive of Cat. 

Who where the F does this even come from? She is very supportive of most all MMA athletes. Gives nothing but praise to her current MMA instructors. 

I don't get it. So because she doesn't like 1 person we label her as non-supportive and doesn't handle herself well? OOOOOoook.,:sarcastic09:

Arianny is washed up no talent. She has sex with wealthy Saudi guys for money as they fly her out there all the time.


----------



## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

Ummm... well, women who model without clothes, for one. Also, did you watch that TUF season? Anyone who was on Team Tate was basically deserving of her contempt, including the coaches.


----------



## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

HexRei said:


> Ummm... well, women who model without clothes, for one. Also, did you watch that TUF season? Anyone who was on Team Tate was basically deserving of her contempt, including the coaches.


So she mentioned one thing about Arianny/Playboy when she was what? 23? 24? And that defines her? Ok.

Yea. Tate's BF who is a D-Bag and threatened to punch a girl. Yea, Tate's Team who's star fighter was Tate's best friend. So basically Tate. Who else? There is no other fighter in which she has disrespected. Not really a single one. Which can't be said for a majority of men fighting. Ronda has been ultra supportive of just about any other female fighter out there.

So funny how a reality TV show can be the end all with some fans/people. They watch an edited show and think they know her. ROusey didn't come off well in the show. But it is laughable that she is defined by a reality show in which she coached against the person she despises most. That sure is a clear indicator of her personality. So why don't we lock you up in a room with the person you despise most and then judge you on the outcome. Fair?


----------



## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

Ronda lost some credibility when she attempted to publicly slam GSP for no reason whatsoever. And no, saying "I don't like watching women get beaten up" is not the same as saying "Women should not be allowed to compete in MMA". 

I don't dislike Ronda. But she's clearly got an attitude problem.


----------



## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

Canadian Psycho said:


> Ronda lost some credibility when she attempted to publicly slam GSP for no reason whatsoever. And no, saying "I don't like watching women get beaten up" is not the same as saying "Women should not be allowed to compete in MMA".
> 
> I don't dislike Ronda. But she's clearly got an attitude problem.


I see your point that saying you don't care to watch women get beat up is not the same as saying they shouldn't be allowed to compete. But it comes off as he isn't for women in the UFC. How does it not? Coming from a UFC champ that sort of stings, when you are Ronda who is trying to break the doors down for the sport.

I am not some feminist goof. But in the eyes of a Olympic female athlete I can see how it would upset her. It basically sounded like he felt bad for them. When she doesn't want to be felt bad for, she doesn't see the difference in a man and a woman being punched in the face. GSP doesn't enjoy watching girls get "beat up" but he loves watch men get "beat up"? It came across like he didn't like the idea of women's fighting. And I can understand why that would upset a woman who is the first UFC WMMA champ. It is like saying "I don't care for women to be in the line of duty" (women police officers).


----------



## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

jonnyg4508 said:


> I see your point that saying you don't care to watch women get beat up is not the same as saying they shouldn't be allowed to compete. But it comes off as he isn't for women in the UFC. How does it not? Coming from a UFC champ that sort of stings, when you are Ronda who is trying to break the doors down for the sport.
> 
> I am not some feminist goof. But in the eyes of a Olympic female athlete I can see how it would upset her. It basically sounded like he felt bad for them. When she doesn't want to be felt bad for, she doesn't see the difference in a man and a woman being punched in the face. GSP doesn't enjoy watching girls get "beat up" but he loves watch men get "beat up"? It came across like he didn't like the idea of women's fighting. And I can understand why that would upset a woman who is the first UFC WMMA champ. It is like saying "I don't care for women to be in the line of duty" (women police officers).


I can see why she might take it the wrong way as well. But GSP explained himself, and Ronda still decided to take it that one interview/comment/twitter post too far, to the point where she was basically attacking Georges and his career (i.e. "No one would care about GSP if he wasn't attractive). 

But then she's young, and she's the first female face in the male dominated UFC, which I'm sure isn't easy. Gina Carano - the true first face of WMMA - approached the task much differently, and everyone loved her. Ronda's clearly just more emotionally fragile. I do think people pile the hate on a bit thick at times, but there's really no question that Rousey deserves a kick in the arse now and again.


----------



## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Canadian Psycho said:


> I can see why she might take it the wrong way as well. But GSP explained himself, and Ronda still decided to take it that one interview/comment/twitter post too far, to the point where she was basically attacking Georges and his career (i.e. "No one would care about GSP if he wasn't attractive).
> 
> But then she's young, and she's the first female face in the male dominated UFC, which I'm sure isn't easy. Gina Carano - the true first face of WMMA - approached the task much differently, and everyone loved her. Ronda's clearly just more emotionally fragile. I do think people pile the hate on a bit thick at times, but there's really no question that Rousey deserves a kick in the arse now and again.


Wow, now she's at it with GSP? 

Yeah, Rhonda really believes people are just after her because she's on top.


----------



## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

Calminian said:


> Both have posed nude. Rhonda chose to make money off her body, just like other women.
> 
> I think what people don't like about Rhonda is she's constantly talking herself up. "Hey, I'm an athlete and people want to see me naked. I'm better than that Arianny girl over there. She's just good looking."
> 
> Now I don't endorse women posing nude in any circumstance. But Arianny's rebuke was necessary and classy. She impressed me. She may not have been gifted with the physical strength Rhonda has, but she handles her fame much better. *If Rhonda is smart, she'll listen and learn.*


Ye that won't work on me because I'm not on the Ronda-hate wagon and I didn't try to tell everyone why they should like her, soooo....:confused02:

What I've bolded... please. Ronda does not need to learn from Arianny, they are in completely different careers and Ronda will probably make more money than any ring girl.

Also, what does handling fame have to do with physical strength?


----------



## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

Soojooko said:


> No. Shes saying Ronda should be more supportive of her, in recognition of all the good work she's done carrying a plaque with her IQ printed on it.


Ha, I've always known it - running in circles improves your intelligence!



jonnyg4508 said:


> I don't get it. So because she doesn't like 1 person we label her as non-supportive and doesn't handle herself well? OOOOOoook.,:sarcastic09:


Dude, you always seem to forget: *SHE DIDN'T SHAKE TATE'S HAND!*



jonnyg4508 said:


> *So funny how a reality TV show can be the end all with some fans/people.* They watch an edited show and think they know her. ROusey didn't come off well in the show. But it is laughable that she is defined by a reality show in which she coached against the person she despises most. That sure is a clear indicator of her personality. So why don't we lock you up in a room with the person you despise most and then judge you on the outcome. Fair?


That's actually what TV shows are for. Creating emotions to generate viewing ratings.


----------



## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

jonnyg4508 said:


> I see your point that saying you don't care to watch women get beat up is not the same as saying they shouldn't be allowed to compete. But it comes off as he isn't for women in the UFC. How does it not? Coming from a UFC champ that sort of stings, when you are Ronda who is trying to break the doors down for the sport.
> 
> I am not some feminist goof. But in the eyes of a Olympic female athlete I can see how it would upset her. It basically sounded like he felt bad for them. When she doesn't want to be felt bad for, she doesn't see the difference in a man and a woman being punched in the face. GSP doesn't enjoy watching girls get "beat up" but he loves watch men get "beat up"? It came across like he didn't like the idea of women's fighting. And I can understand why that would upset a woman who is the first UFC WMMA champ. It is like saying "I don't care for women to be in the line of duty" (women police officers).


I think there are many who don't like to see women get beat up. You can blame it on our current society and social structure (I might), but at the end of the day if you are being realistic, many men really don't like to watch women getting hit and beat on, even by other women. These same people (like GSP), probably don't mind if they compete or don't want to strip away their right to do it, they just feel uncomfortable seeing it as they've had it ingrained in them since birth that hitting women is bad and if someone hits a woman it can be cringe worthy.

As fans of the sport we all accept it a lot easier, but I suppose even fighters like GSP can't get that feeling to fade as much as he might want to? :dunno:


----------



## GDPofDRB (Apr 18, 2013)

I don't see what the big deal is, most people who have had some level of exposure to Rousey think she's lame. Celeste is potentially pretty lame in her own ways too but the type of exposure she offers doesn't easily give people an idea about that.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

LOL @ people minimizing others sacrifice, as they would have any clue how to measure up how things have impacted in their lives.
Yeah, Ronda became what she became by pure chance and thanks to internet she never ever, even for a second, felt lonely and cried hidden from the public she wants to convince she is all toughness, right? God bless internet and handhelds. 

So, you fight to have your dream job and when you get it, since your sacrifice did pay off, it automatically becomes irrelevant for the sole reason you were the one pursuing your own dream, not anybody else's dream. Jeez...


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

Ryan1522 said:


> The personal accounts really are cute.
> 
> Don't know how it was possible, but you somehow made the 'octagon girl's opinion' thread about yourself. Not surprising.
> 
> ...


I was pointing out that working hard is common and pretty much unless your an athlete you dont bitch and moan about "sacrifice" or have kids behind keyboards do that bitching and moaning for you. It wasnt as much about myself as it was the story behind it. People that miss some family time in order to achieve their goals is extremely common and they dont bitch and moan about sacrifice. And like i said Ronda actually lived at home while she was training for Judo... so she got PLENTY of quality Family time. More then most probably. 

Its cool that you have nothing intelligent to say back. I expected as much. 



> Why even write the last part?


Well cause you posted it towards me and i felt i owed you some sort of response. Even if it was just to tell you that i thought the comment was silly at best and i wont pretend to take it seriously. My bad though... next time il just ignore it.


----------



## Nomale (Apr 22, 2007)

MMA-Sportsman said:


> LOL @ people minimizing others sacrifice, as they would have any clue how to measure up how things have impacted in their lives.
> Yeah, Ronda became what she became by pure chance and thanks to internet she never ever, even for a second, felt lonely and cried hidden from the public she wants to convince she is all toughness, right? God bless internet and handhelds.
> 
> So, you fight to have your dream job and when you get it, since your sacrifice did pay off, it automatically becomes irrelevant for the sole reason you were the one pursuing your own dream, not anybody else's dream. Jeez...


Maybe it's just semantics we're doing here but I'm with those who thinks it's better to reserve the word for people who actually sacrifices themselves for others. It's all too common to see people playing the martyr card and cry about sacrifices to justify their self interest.

Not to diminish Ronda's or anyone's hard work.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

Nomale said:


> Maybe it's just semantics we're doing here but I'm with those who thinks it's better to reserve the word for people who actually sacrifices themselves for others. It's all too common to see people playing the martyr card and cry about sacrifices to justify their self interest.
> 
> Not to diminish Ronda's or anyone's hard work.


Oh, absolutely. I know what you mean and semantics will play a role for sure because we can't actually "reserve" the word for a single meaning. The word can and will be applied to many situations, so there will always be *sacrifices*(donate one of your kidneys to a stranger) and *sacrifices*(spend 2 hours on the treadmill to keep a good shape) and a lot of misuse of the term between these two.

I do know people who make a lot of fuss about something trivial just to promote themselves and it is indeed annoying, but as annoying as people trying to dismiss what others do. Gotta hate those two extremist ways.


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

I seem to have been sacrificing left and right and not even known it.

Can i start giving speeches to people "DO YOU KNOW HOW MUCH I SACRIFICED TO BE HERE!! DO YOU!! WELL DOOO YOUU!!!"

Cause that sounds like a fun drunk speech to give to people.

I guess seeing the sacrifices veterans made really isnt such a big deal anymore when i ran on a treadmill and sacrificed.... well im not sure what i sacrificed but thats just details right??


----------



## SmackyBear (Feb 14, 2008)

buddyface said:


> Where’s your second point?
> 
> First – I don’t know Rousey’s direct answer to ‘sexy photos’ but she makes it clear that based on her mother’s teachings that showing breasts or genitalia is a no no for women and it is implied that is a shame that will carry with the individual the rest of their lives. One can infer from this that Rousey takes a negative few of full nudity, but full skin and cheeky placement of hands and photo cropping is just fine.
> 
> Second - I would say that the ESPN body image issue is entirely about selling sex and little to do with selling athletic ability. If they were truly going to celebrate the body image the publisher would run the gauntlet, wrap the mag and sell it behind the counter without having to, as you say “obscure it”. The issue I have is when someone like Rousey gets on her soap box about other people doing full nude poses and then claiming it will damage them the rest of their life. People generally don’t say “Hey that’s some wonderful damage you’ve done to yourself for the rest of your life” and mean it as a compliment. Rousey is clearly making a distinction that her posing in the ‘body’ issue is in not selling sex in a sports magazine when the issue in question is doing nothing but selling sex. Celeste posing in playboy is clearly selling sex, but at least they are honest about it. Where is Rousey and her shtick about what you see is what you get. She blasts Celesete for doing exactly what she here self has also done. But because the magazine title is playboy and shows the whole body Rousey figures on this issue she is above Celeste.


My second point was that Ronda isn't against women posing in a sexual manner in magazines. I didn't think I had to restate it directly. My apologies.

To your first point - she didn't say anything about breasts. Considering she said, “Ha-ha, it’s your job to show your titties—I do that better than you!” I find it strange that you'd include breasts in your point. And we don't know if the motivator for not showing genitalia is shame or embarrassment. She's not necessarily saying it's morally wrong, but that it will be embarrassing when your kid sees that picture of your vagina.

To your second point - Why is it about sex? Because you say it is? Do people really pick these up because it's sexy? I don't. Nobody I know even treats it like SI's swimsuit issue. Genitalia isn't really as central to athletic ability as the major muscles, but they need to show genitalia and subject themselves to prudish regulations to prove they are celebrating the athletic form? That makes no sense at all. 

Has Rousey ever said that selling a sexual image is bad? Besides the quotes I posted, what else has she said? That Kim Kardashian is only famous for a sex tape and that's not an accomplishment? I'm not saying she hasn't, but I haven't seen any. Because there seems to be quite a few inferences being drawn from a paucity of quotes.


----------



## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

SmackyBear said:


> My second point was that Ronda isn't against women posing in a sexual manner in magazines. I didn't think I had to restate it directly. My apologies.
> 
> To your first point - she didn't say anything about breasts. Considering she said, “Ha-ha, it’s your job to show your titties—I do that better than you!” I find it strange that you'd include breasts in your point. And we don't know if the motivator for not showing genitalia is shame or embarrassment. She's not necessarily saying it's morally wrong, but that it will be embarrassing when your kid sees that picture of your vagina.
> 
> ...





> With all these ring girls and their vaginas, – all of this goes back to advice my mom gave me. She gave me this one piece of advice, which I still hold dear. She said, ‘Look, whatever pictures you put out there are gonna be out there forever, so just think that one day your 12 or 13-year-old son or daughter is going to see those pictures. Whatever you want your son or daughter, or even your 13-year-old little sister to see, keep that in mind.’ So, whatever I’m not gonna show on a beach, I’m not gonna show in a magazine. These girls are going to have to explain to their kids one day why mommy’s ass and vagina are all over the place.”


I thought it was obvious that her comment about "all these ring girls and their vaginas" was implicitly about nudity, not limited to only and literally vaginas. And if she did mean it literally, it makes no sense because no UFC ring girl has ever shown their vagina in a periodical of any kind. we've seen the vulva (and even then, usually just an angle shot revealing the crease above the clitoris which is like three more centimeters than Ronda showed for ESPN), but no UFC ring girl has laid back and spread it open to see the vagina which is the inner portion past the labia. So if you want to take her comment totally literally... well, then she would have had to be speaking about some hypothetical ring girl?

That aside, she also mentions ass. And we did see her ass, I guess her future child will be totally scarred when they find that on the internet. Also all the people arguing that ESPN body pictorials aren't about sex... well, I'd argue that they are, to some degree. Certainly many people look at them because the athletes have sexy bodies. But have we forgotten that she did a Maxim shoot? Are we going to pretend that Maxim doesn't sell sexiness?

And finally, yes, I do believe she is saying it's bad, or at least something to be shameful about.


----------



## buddyface (Oct 9, 2008)

HexRei said:


> And finally, yes, I do believe she is saying it's bad, or at least something to be shameful about.


This.


----------



## SideWays222 (Sep 9, 2008)

rabakill said:


> +Rep Response


Thanks

But it isnt just a story. You can look it up on google. Or here is a vid






I wanted to just message you this but you have reached your maximum capacity of messages allowed. Erase those brosky!


----------



## Lewdawg (Jan 18, 2021)

onip69 said:


> http://www.mmamania.com/2014/2/24/5442042/arianny-celeste-ufc-womens-champion-
> 
> 
> M.C said:
> ...


No she's no role


----------



## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

King Mo, back in the day, said the schedule of professional wrestlers is harder than the schedule of MMA fighters.

Guys like him and Josh Barnett showed respect to professional wrestling and what it took to do 200 shows per year in WWE.

Ronda came along and ruined all of that. Somehow. Whatever bridge people in MMA used to enter WWE is burned thanks to her.

MMA fighters who know nothing about professional wrestling think its easier than MMA.

Long days on the road and tough schedule of professional wrestling can actually be harder in ways. Even if Ronda can't admit it.


----------



## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

I think the thing is that people argue that pro wrestling is choreographed versus MMA which is 100% what is called in pro wrestling a "shoot". Then again in pro wrestling they go for these high profile, high stunt, impressive maneuvers versus in MMA which is all inside the cage or ring. In pro wrestling people have died form stunts like Owen Hart.


----------

