# Who would you pick in a Fedor-Werdum rematch?



## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

Now, I'm not advocating a one of those instant rematches that promoters seem so fond of these days. I believe they're very, very unfair to the fighter who won the first bout. 

But seeing as a Fedor-Werdum rematch seems a possibility, I'd like to know who this forum would favor in such a contest.

I've got Fedor here, as I still seem him as the more complete fighter, but someone who was overconfident and paid for it with a submission loss. With a slightly more conservative approach, I see him beating Werdum.

Who you got?


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## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

Instant rematches can be unfair, true, but in this instance, Werdrum actually seems to be calling for it. I'd have to go with Fedor myself. I know the hip thing to do right now is write him off and dismiss his legacy, but the simple fact of the matter is he was caught by a submission that he could easily avoid in a second bout. It would be as simple as pulling a page out of Anderson's book and saying, 'No, I'm not chasing you to the ground'. And I don't think it any mystery who would win the stand-up war.


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

I'd take Fedor easily.

He thought he had Werdum hurt and was over aggressive and just about jumped right into that triangle. 

In the rematch I dont think he would engage Werdum with the same over aggressiveness he did in last nights fight. 

If Fedor keeps the fight on the feet he would win easily IMO.........


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

Fedor....


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## themmadude (May 28, 2010)

Fedor


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## LiteGladiator (Jun 22, 2010)

Fedor, no doubt.


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

I see Fedor losing against Werdum similar to GSP losing to Serra. He's a much better fighter than Werdum, but he got careless and paid for it.

Fedor gave Werdum the win, all Werdum had to do was routine BJJ to catch him. Fedor had his warning when Werdum almost had his arm, then he just continued going wild until he was in a triangle. He had no composure, did not anticipate the triangle and probably didn't respect Werdum's ground game. It's like Fedor didn't give a crap about potential subs, he just wanted to finish him.

I guarantee that Fedor would crush Werdum in a rematch. That fight just shows Fedor is human, and that he can make mistakes. I think most would agree too. Look at the positions Fedor got out of against Arona, he can deal with high level BJJ but just not when he's going crazy, trying to finish the fight when Werdum wasn't even badly hurt. 

Only problem for Fedor is his age and time spent fighting. How will this loss affect him and his work ethic? We will see, he'll probably fight the winner of Overeem and Werdum.


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## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

Fedor isn't an intelligent fighter he would get subbed again. He tries to fight guys where their strength is instead of avoiding it like the true P4P kings GSP and Andy. That shit doesn't work when you aren't beating up cans.


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

osmium said:


> *Fedor isn't an intelligent fighter *he would get subbed again. He tries to fight guys where their strength is instead of avoiding it like the true P4P kings GSP and Andy. That shit doesn't work when you aren't beating up cans.


:confused03:

You cant have his record and not be an intelligent fighter. Post fail.


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## BD3 (Jun 8, 2010)

Why should Fedor get an IMMEDIATE rematch? Nonsense. Fabricio won fair and square. It wasn't controversial. It was a clean finish. Why don't we give everyone immediate rematchs every time they lose while we're at it? 

It's gonna be easier for Fedor in the rematch because he'll now avoid the ground like the plague. He shouldn't have the opportunity to go back and correct his mistakes. It's just lame. What would be the point of the first fight then?


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## themmadude (May 28, 2010)

BD3 said:


> Why should Fedor get an IMMEDIATE rematch? Nonsense. Fabricio won fair and square. It wasn't controversial. It was a clean finish. Why don't we give everyone immediate rematchs every time they lose while we're at it?
> 
> It's gonna be easier for Fedor in the rematch because he'll now avoid the ground like the plague. He shouldn't have the opportunity to go back and correct his mistakes. It's just lame. What would be the point of the first fight then?


come on now


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

BD3 said:


> Why should Fedor get an IMMEDIATE rematch? Nonsense. Fabricio won fair and square. It wasn't controversial. It was a clean finish. Why don't we give everyone immediate rematchs every time they lose while we're at it?
> 
> It's gonna be easier for Fedor in the rematch because he'll now avoid the ground like the plague. He shouldn't have the opportunity to go back and correct his mistakes. It's just lame. What would be the point of the first fight then?


 
FTR...Fedor was asked and he said if Fabricio would be willing to rematch he would like the opportunity to avenge the loss, if not that was okay too....Fedor is not a dick and does not act as if he is deserving of anything IMO....


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## tlilly (Nov 13, 2009)

its either a rematch with werdum or he fights big foot or rogers... 

strikeforce matchmaking at its finest :thumbsup:


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## BD3 (Jun 8, 2010)

coldcall420 said:


> FTR...Fedor was asked and he said if Fabricio would be willing to rematch he would like the opportunity to avenge the loss, if not that was okay too....Fedor is not a ick and does not act as if he is deserving of anything IMO....


I'm aware of this. And I never implied any of that. I'm just referring to the fans thinking Fedor should get a rematch. I've been reading this a lot lately and I just think it's utter BS. It's coming from a place of, "We need to see Fedor winnn!" IMO It's not coming from a love of the sport and what can happen in competition. 
You don't get to re-do the World Series or the Super Bowl. 

If Fedor-Werdum decide to rematch, so be it. I'll watch it. I don't think he *deserves* one immediately, in the same way anyone who loses doesn't deserve one immediately. But if Werdum grants it, awesome!


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## themmadude (May 28, 2010)

BD3 said:


> I'm aware of this. And I never implied any of that. I'm just referring to the fans thinking Fedor should get a rematch. I've been reading this a lot lately and I just think it's utter BS. It's coming from a place of, "We need to see Fedor winnn!" IMO It's not coming from a love of the sport and what can happen in competition.
> You don't get to re-do the World Series or the Super Bowl.
> 
> If Fedor-Werdum decide to rematch, so be it. I'll watch it. I don't think he *deserves* one immediately, in the same way anyone who loses doesn't deserve one immediately. But if Werdum grants it, awesome!


remember you are talking about FEDOR. its his first loss.......he deserves a rematch............


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## BD3 (Jun 8, 2010)

themmadude said:


> remember you are talking about FEDOR. its his first loss.......he deserves a rematch............


Yes, he's Fedor. I'm well aware.


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

themmadude said:


> remember you are talking about FEDOR. its his first loss.......he deserves a rematch............


That was his second loss. 

He now has 2X more losses than Brock!!!


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## luckbox (Feb 12, 2010)

I don't know what Fedor was thinking before the fight, but he seemed alot more amped up then I have ever seen him. He got careless and jumped into the lethal guard of Fabricio Werdum without protecting himself, and paid the ultimate price. Brilliant job by Werdum, but I don't see Fedor doing the same mistake again. Great fighters learn from their losses and improve, GSP being the best example. Fedor could do that aswell.

So yeah, I like Fedor in a rematch.


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## limba (Jul 21, 2009)

Fedor. TKO


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## Budhisten (Apr 11, 2010)

Gotta go with Fedor here, he's just more well rounded and as somebody else in here mentioned, he made an error of judgement last night... So, he's human, who would've thunk it? 

Would love to see Fedor - BigFoot though ;P


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## The Lone Wolf (Sep 23, 2008)

Based on what we've seen its ridiculous to say Fedor. They've fought once, Werdum won, so the only logical answer is Werdum until we see otherwise.

Give Fedors nuts some room to breathe guys.

The guy lost a fight, ITS NOT A BIG DEAL so quit making it into a day of phucking mourning!

Seriously, the Fedor bum phucking has been taken too far. Look at yourselves for phucks sake!

:sarcastic12:


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## Toxic (Mar 1, 2007)

I would pick Werdum again unless Fedor brings in somebody with some serious grappling credentials like a Roger Gracie to help him prepare but the problem is that Brazillians have a real strangle brotherhood and I am not sure any of them would be willing to help Fedor.


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## Dream-On-101 (Jun 4, 2009)

I am one of Fedors biggest fans. I have seen alot of people claim that Fedor was 'not himself in this fight' or that he acted differently too how he normally does. Untrue - Fedor dove as recklessly into Nog's guard as he did into Werdum's, the difference was that Werdum was capable of making him pay dearly for it .

I am upset, but it is not the end of the world. In a rematch, i would pick Fedor 99/100, this just happened to be that time in my opinion. He underestimated his opponent and paid for it. 

I hope he has a chance to avenge this loss, but i fear thar Fedors fighting days may be over. Not just because of this fight, it is just a feeling i get 

Anyway in answer to the question - FEDOR. Any day.


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Toxic said:


> I would pick Werdum again unless Fedor brings in somebody with some serious grappling credentials like a Roger Gracie to help him prepare but the problem is that Brazillians have a real strangle brotherhood and I am not sure any of them would be willing to help Fedor.


If Fedor keeps the fight on the feet he would win easily IMO........

He lost last night because he was overaggressive when he thought he had Werdum hurt.......... I dont see him making that mistake again.


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

Toxic said:


> I would pick Werdum again unless Fedor brings in somebody with some serious grappling credentials like a Roger Gracie to help him prepare but the problem is that Brazillians have a real strangle brotherhood and I am not sure any of them would be willing to help Fedor.


Why would he bother when he could just KO Werdum on the feet? Can Werdum take Fedor down? I doubt it. And even if it hit the ground, I think it would go different. Fedor was blatantly overexcited which left himself vulnerable. It's there for anyone to see and would be easily avoided in a rematch.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Overexcited*

Yeah I agree that was Fedor's downfall this match. He wouldn't make the same mistake twice!


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

Honestly, SF kind of needs to come up with a reason to put the rematch together or at least a way to bump Fedor over Werdum for a shot at Overeem. 

I don't think anyone is really interested in seeing Fedor fight anyone else in SF, so it's either a Werdum rematch or a fight with Overeem.


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## Toxic (Mar 1, 2007)

JimmyJames said:


> If Fedor keeps the fight on the feet he would win easily IMO........
> 
> He lost last night because he was overaggressive when he thought he had Werdum hurt.......... I dont see him making that mistake again.


 Perhaps you should examine Fedor's record and tell me one good grappler Fedor has beat easily. Fedor has won a decision against every good grappler he has ever fought Nog, Babalu and Arona. Problem was this time he was fighting a top level grappler and unlike when he fought Arona Werdum actually had some MMA experiance.



Hiro said:


> Why would he bother when he could just KO Werdum on the feet? Can Werdum take Fedor down? I doubt it. And even if it hit the ground, I think it would go different. Fedor was blatantly overexcited which left himself vulnerable. It's there for anyone to see and would be easily avoided in a rematch.


Can Werdum take Fedor down, yes. Easily? No but he is gonna use his length to keep distance till he wants to close it to take him down. An aggressive striker like Brett Rogers leaves openings when he strikes the same way Arlovski did with the knee. Werdum won't want to strike anymore than he has to and that makes him much more difficult to put away standing. No Fedor left himself open, you need to realize nobody is perfect and Werdum doesn't need you to leave yourself open, Fedor gave Werdum the arm but he took the choke that allowed him to go for both the choke and the arm at the same time and that is why he got him. Werdum can create a big opening from a slight one because that is the thing with a guy who grapples at that level, the guys at ADCC don't leave there arms out trying to throw punches, Werdum subs great grappler's who know what he is trying to do.


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## Calibretto9 (Oct 15, 2006)

In the other thread before their first fight, I picked Werdum. I thought once Fedor finally faced a high-level guy (not a once-was-a-top guy) he'd get caught. 

That being said, in the rematch I'd have to pick Fedor. I think Fedor is good enough to keep it on the feet, and obviously has the power to finish it there. I also think his speed for a HW combine with his Judo will make him extremely hard to take down. And yes, I think after their first fight Fedor will avoid the ground.

And, even if it does go to the ground, I think he'll be much, much more cautious. It's hard to submit a guy who's not giving you anything on the ground (hence we see so many ground stalemates in MMA). 

This time around the element of surprise is gone, as is the sloppiness. I give it to the more well-rounded fighter.


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## themmadude (May 28, 2010)

Fedor is more dangerous in his mind than his physicalness. Fedor is the king of the martial arts world mentally. Dude pisses for no one.


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## UrbanBounca (Sep 13, 2009)

Fedor would win 99/100 times, and that one time was Werdum's. I'd easily take Fedor over him.


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

Toxic said:


> I would pick Werdum again unless Fedor brings in somebody with some serious grappling credentials like a Roger Gracie to help him prepare but the problem is that Brazillians have a real strangle brotherhood and I am not sure any of them would be willing to help Fedor.


 
Thats assuming that the fight even hits the ground again, clearly knowing this an area of possible weakness that connot be improved then Fedor would look to keep it standing were Fabricio looked like shit, Im just sayin he can pull guard all he wants if he lays there and Fedor wait's to let him up you could be looking at a way different fight....I dont see him jumping into Fabricio's guard that quickly again, obviously he looked to finish it way too quick and Fabricio capitalized on that error...:thumbsup:


FTR.....I dont want to see a rematch, I would rather see him fight another Strikeforce HW and then leavefor the UFC, if that does not happen I want him to resign and fight Werdum again...


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

coldcall420 said:


> Thats assuming that the fight even hits the ground again, clearly knowing this an area of possible weakness that connot be improved then Fedor would look to keep it standing were Fabricio looked like shit, Im just sayin he can pull guard all he wants if he lays there and Fedor wait's to let him up you could be looking at a way different fight....I dont see him jumping into Fabricio's guard that quickly again, obviously he looked to finish it way too quick and Fabricio capitalized on that error...:thumbsup:[/FONT




I see your point, but at the same time I don't see Fedor turning into Anderson Silva anytime soon and just waiting for Werdum to stand back up. Obviously he wouldn't just fall into another triangle, but I can't see that if Werdum pulled guard Fedor would step back and stand him up over and over again. Imo this one fight showed us that Fedor actually has emotions. He looked like he was trying to send a message to Overeem and everyone else that Rogers just got lucky lasting more then a round. So while I would back Fedor in a rematch, I think it is possible he gets caught again, Werdum is a technician on the ground, Toxic is right when he says that Fedor has never fought a grappler like him. Yes, he fought Nog, but Nog's plan was pretty much take a beating until the other guy is gassed then throw on a sub when he's too tired to defend and that won't work against Fedor.




> FTR.....I dont want to see a rematch, I would rather see him fight another Strikeforce HW and then leavefor the UFC, if that does not happen I want him to resign and fight Werdum again...



Second this, I want to see Fedor fight Overeem before he retires or signs with the UFC for probably next to nothing now.


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## vilify (Mar 23, 2010)

the answer is pretty obvious. Fedor will TKO him standing in a rematch.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

Life B Ez said:


> I see your point, but at the same time I don't see Fedor turning into Anderson Silva anytime soon and just waiting for Werdum to stand back up. Obviously he wouldn't just fall into another triangle, but I can't see that if Werdum pulled guard Fedor would step back and stand him up over and over again. Imo this one fight showed us that Fedor actually has emotions. He looked like he was trying to send a message to Overeem and everyone else that Rogers just got lucky lasting more then a round. So while I would back Fedor in a rematch, I think it is possible he gets caught again, Werdum is a technician on the ground, *Toxic is right when he says that Fedor has never fought a grappler like him.* Yes, he fought Nog, but Nog's plan was pretty much take a beating until the other guy is gassed then throw on a sub when he's too tired to defend and that won't work against Fedor.


He fought Arona as well!

I doupt Fedor would do the same mistake again in a second fight.


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## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

I'd like to know where people are getting this "He won't go to the ground with him next time" idea from. Fedor has never fought that way and probably still thinks Werdum's BJJ is equivalent to Nog. That is seriously like saying if Scott Smith fights Cung Le again he is going to pull guard. Fedor has never shown any signs of evolving his style or gameplans to adjust to the skill sets of his opponents he just fights on instincts wherever the fight takes him.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

osmium said:


> I'd like to know where people are getting this "He won't go to the ground with him next time" idea from. Fedor has never fought that way and probably still thinks Werdum's BJJ is equivalent to Nog. That is seriously like saying if Scott Smith fights Cung Le again he is going to pull guard. Fedor has never shown any signs of evolving his style or gameplans to adjust to the skill sets of his opponents he just fights on instincts wherever the fight takes him.


Yea, but that's because he never lost before. He beat the guys at there own game and it always worked out. He got overconfident in his ability, like he did a couple of times before but this time he got caught. Now he knows that this kind of fighting doesn't work anymore today and that he needs to adjust his fighting style to the present.


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## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

BobbyCooper said:


> Yea, but that's because he never lost before. He beat the guys at there own game and it always worked out. He got overconfident in his ability, like he did a couple of times before but this time he got caught. Now he knows that this kind of fighting doesn't work anymore today and that he needs to adjust his fighting style to the present.


No, you think that and are assuming he does for no reason at all. It is more likely that he just thinks he made a mistake and got caught in a submission judging from his post fight comments about trying too hard to finish.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

I just believe Fedor is capable of adjusting to the Present. He knows that well enough, that this fight was and will be a easy victory for him in the future. I think everybody learns from his mistakes. 

If he can not adjust to that.. then I would say he should retire. But I believe he can, so he is very capable of winning at least the SF belt in his late career.


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## Johnni G (Dec 2, 2009)

Fedor


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

BobbyCooper said:


> He fought Arona as well!
> 
> I doupt Fedor would do the same mistake again in a second fight.


Sorry I forgot about Arona, but we all know the story behind that fight. It was also Arona's third MMA fight.


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## Toxic (Mar 1, 2007)

BobbyCooper said:


> He fought Arona as well!
> 
> I doupt Fedor would do the same mistake again in a second fight.


Arona was in his third mma fight and if you really want to get into it, Fedor lost that fight to, that decision was a highway robbery.


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

Toxic said:


> Arona was in his third mma fight and if you really want to get into it, Fedor lost that fight to, that decision was a highway robbery.


 
Why is it called highway robbery??? Ever wonder that?? Why not like interstate robbery or toll road robbery???

Serious question...:confused02:


I think Bobby was pointing out that the only other real grappler he faced was Arona....could be wrong but i think thats where he was going, and I think he thinks it was robbery too....:dunno:


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

coldcall420 said:


> Why is it called highway robbery??? Ever wonder that?? Why not like interstate robbery or toll road robbery???


Ummmmm, pretty sure it's obvious, highways are way better then interstates and toll roads sir.



> I think Bobby was pointing out that the only other real grappler he faced was Arona....could be wrong but i think thats where he was going, and I think he thinks it was robbery too....:dunno:


He was, I posted that Fedor had only really every fought one high level grappler in Nog and forgot about Arona.


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## Lusi (Apr 22, 2007)

osmium said:


> Fedor isn't an intelligent fighter he would get subbed again. He tries to fight guys where their strength is instead of avoiding it like the true P4P kings GSP and Andy. That shit doesn't work when you aren't beating up cans.


Errrmmmm....where have you been the last 10 years? Apparently not watching Fedor fights.


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## Toxic (Mar 1, 2007)

Life B Ez said:


> He was, I posted that Fedor had only really every fought one high level grappler in Nog and forgot about Arona.



eh, I feel like I bang my head against the door but Nog is far from a high level grappler. Nog is the the single most overrated grappler on earth. Nog has no real grappling credentials, he has a bunch of subs that he got because he was durable and his opponents usually were getting tired from pounding on him. Nog is a decent MMA grappler but he would never succeed at a high level grappling competition. Nog is in the same boat as guys like Frank Mir, hell personally I even question if he is any better than Mir. Nog is definetly not a great grappler though guys like, Maia, Jacare, Monson, Werdum and BJ Penn are great grappler's.


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

Toxic said:


> eh, I feel like I bang my head against the door but Nog is far from a high level grappler. Nog is the the single most overrated grappler on earth. Nog has no real grappling credentials, he has a bunch of subs that he got because he was durable and his opponents usually were getting tired from pounding on him. Nog is a decent MMA grappler but he would never succeed at a high level grappling competition. Nog is in the same boat as guys like Frank Mir, hell personally I even question if he is any better than Mir. Nog is definetly not a great grappler though guys like, Maia, Jacare, Monson, Werdum and BJ Penn are great grappler's.


Haha, that is about the exact same thing I said in my OP haha, that Nog was probably the highest level grappler he had faced and Nog pretty much had a strategy of getting pounded until the other guy was tired then slapping on a sub haha.

My first post that started that little discussion. Haha I even mentioned you Toxic.



> So while I would back Fedor in a rematch, I think it is possible he gets caught again, Werdum is a technician on the ground, Toxic is right when he says that Fedor has never fought a grappler like him. Yes, he fought Nog, but Nog's plan was pretty much take a beating until the other guy is gassed then throw on a sub when he's too tired to defend and that won't work against Fedor.


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## Toxic (Mar 1, 2007)

so we come full circle...


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Full Circle?*

In what way?


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

kantowrestler said:


> In what way?


Just follow the posts back and you'll understand.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Hasty*

Yeah that is a big example of what happens when things like that happens!


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

coldcall420 said:


> I think Bobby was pointing out that the only other real grappler he faced was Arona....could be wrong but i think thats where he was going, and I think he thinks it was robbery too....:dunno:


:thumbsup: CC, that's why I have you my friend!


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Cc*

Who is that?


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

kantowrestler said:


> Who is that?


ColdCall


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Cold Call*

Oh right my bad!


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