# Jon Jones' Boxing is Terrible



## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

1. The guy has a 84.5" reach, but has NO JAB... see miguel torres as someone who uses his length. LebronJones doesn't.

Against anyone that can strike worth a lick, like brandon vera, he reverts back to the wrestling as his crutch.

2. He drops his hands numerous times and leaves TONS OF OPENINGS.... 

His ability to take a punch, his chin , is not proven.

3. Lacks punching power , fact, has never hurt anyone on his feet FACT



4. flashy techniques masquerade huge deficiencies.... this guy needs a boxing trainer like freddy roach bad


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

roach is a good trainer but he sure didnt help arlovski much. im not convinced he's a good trainer for mma boxing.


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## SmokyEye (Feb 6, 2011)

RightCross said:


> 1. The guy has a 84.5" reach, but has NO JAB... see miguel torres as someone who uses his length. LebronJones doesn't.
> 
> Against anyone that can strike worth a lick, like brandon vera, he reverts back to the wrestling as his crutch.
> 
> ...


i belive he has alot of holes in his stand up game.. and people be comparing him to anderson silva lols......


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## PheelGoodInc (Jul 23, 2009)

RightCross said:


> 1. The guy has a 84.5" reach, but has NO JAB... see miguel torres as someone who uses his length. LebronJones doesn't.
> 
> Against anyone that can strike worth a lick, like brandon vera, he reverts back to the wrestling as his crutch.
> 
> ...


It was illegal, but yeah it was standing and it hurt.


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## Terror Kovenant (Nov 16, 2008)

Well dude, hes not a boxer, hes an mma fighter and that seems to be going great for him. Nice try though, thanks for stopping by


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

Terror Kovenant said:


> Well dude, hes not a boxer, hes an mma fighter and that seems to be going great for him. Nice try though, thanks for stopping by





not so fast... he also has deficiencies on the ground... lanky arms he left open for brandon vera... won't work against shogun... Shogun > Jones Standing Shogun > Jones on the ground.... Jones has the ability to dictate where the fight takes place with his wrestling....

and either place he takes the fight he loses.... TERRIBLE matchup for Jones.


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

He is 23 and only been training MMA for 3 years or so, you cant expect him to be amazing at any one thing except wrestling since that is what he did in college. Even if he loses against Shogun, it is a learning fight for him, he will learn a whole lot regardless of the outcome facing Shogun.


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

PheelGoodInc said:


> It was illegal, but yeah it was standing and it hurt.







people talk about CHUCK LIDDELL being fed grapplers lol\



Jones road to the title shot ...... Matashenko, Hamill, Bader.......all wrestlers.... he is a wrestler.... bad matchup for them...... he beat them all..where? on the ground....


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## f4rtknock3r (Nov 22, 2010)

Shogun is going to prove everyone wrong and will be ending another hype train.


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## SmokyEye (Feb 6, 2011)

RightCross said:


> people talk about CHUCK LIDDELL being fed grapplers lol\
> 
> 
> 
> Jones road to the title shot ...... Matashenko, Hamill, Bader.......all wrestlers.... he is a wrestler.... bad matchup for them...... he beat them all..where? on the ground....


he didnt fight any elite yet, yet people make a god out of him, rediculous.


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

SmokyEye said:


> he didnt fight any elite yet, yet people make a god out of him, rediculous.






This is the weakest modern day title-shot to an unproven fighter in the history of ufc's undeserved title shots... Forrest Griffen could have just as easily been given the title shot for a grudge match in shogun...

incredible.


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## Brydon (Jan 13, 2007)

RightCross said:


> 1. The guy has a 84.5" reach, but has NO JAB... see miguel torres as someone who uses his length. LebronJones doesn't.
> 
> Against anyone that can strike worth a lick, like brandon vera, he reverts back to the wrestling as his crutch.
> 
> ...


What qualifies you to rip on Jon Jones stand up ability? The guy is a destroyer in MMA and has been amazing his entire career.

Irratates me sometimes when people are so negative and try and discredit fighters no matter how they perform.


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

RightCross said:


> This is the weakest modern day title-shot to an unproven fighter in the history of ufc's undeserved title shots... Forrest Griffen could have just as easily been given the title shot for a grudge match in shogun...
> 
> incredible.


griffin is only 2 fights out from two losses, i dont think beating a guy who belongs at 185 by decision (basically, being able to hold him down) qualifies him for a title shot and neither does beating a washed up tito by SPLIT decision.


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

Brydon said:


> What qualifies you to rip on Jon Jones stand up ability? The guy is a destroyer in MMA and has been amazing his entire career.
> 
> Irratates me sometimes when people are so negative and try and discredit fighters no matter how they perform.







Did u read the OP?

Does he drop his hands yes/no?

Does he use a jab yes/no

kicks? powerful striking ? 



use your brain, i understand you don't train....and sip the lebron jones koolaid...

PLENTY of fighters look great against fighters who aren't elite...... what would Rampage do to Jones?


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## SmokyEye (Feb 6, 2011)

HexRei said:


> griffin is only 2 fights out from two losses, i dont think beating a guy who belongs at 185 by decision (basically, being able to hold him down) qualifies him for a title shot and neither does beating a washed up tito by SPLIT decision.


idk if forest should get it, but forest would be better than jon, since jon hasnt fought any elite yet, only mid- skill fighters..


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

HexRei said:


> griffin is only 2 fights out from two losses, i dont think beating a guy who belongs at 185 by decision (basically, being able to hold him down) qualifies him for a title shot and neither does beating a washed up tito by SPLIT decision.







but he is a former champ...... and actually, i agree with you..... he doesn't deserve it either.... that is my point, Forrest = Jones when discussing deservedness for title shot.... my pick is Rampage....


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

RightCross said:


> Did u read the OP?
> 
> Does he drop his hands yes/no?
> 
> ...







Hows that for striking power?!

In Before "that guys a no body, jones still has no power".....


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

Mckeever said:


> Hows that for striking power?!
> 
> In Before "that guys a no body, jones still has no power".....






OK i change my mind... jon jones' knockout power = Kimbo Slice in those back yard bar-b-que fights...... no myth there, the video proves it.


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## AlphaDawg (Nov 16, 2009)

Mckeever said:


> Hows that for striking power?!
> 
> In Before "that guys a no body, jones still has no power".....



That guy is a nobody.

Jones still has no power.


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

Jon jones' titleshot, with the suprise rashad just got hurt and do u accept it, is the biggest VINCE MCMAHON WWF moment in ufc what a soap opera


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

Some one ban this troll.


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

Mckeever said:


> Some one ban this troll.







ban, for stating a well-informed opinion of fighting that others seem to believe the total opposite of due to hype... maybe YOU SHOULD BE BANNED ... YOU are the TROLL


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## MrObjective (May 22, 2010)

RightCross said:


> This is the weakest modern day title-shot to an unproven fighter in the history of ufc's undeserved title shots... Forrest Griffen could have just as easily been given the title shot for a grudge match in shogun...
> 
> incredible.


Why cause he won a close decision to Tito Ortiz? 


Jones finishes/dominates/destroys quality opponents, one after the other. 

As raw as he may be, he's more deserving than any other LHW. And if he's just a big hype train - i'm sure Shogun will put an end to it, right?

Also Rampage, coming off a loss. And then like basically a no clear winner against Machida, which was basically a tie as neither fighter really did $hit.


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## Black_S15 (Jul 14, 2010)

RightCross said:


> but he is a former champ...... and actually, i agree with you..... he doesn't deserve it either.... that is my point, Forrest = Jones when discussing deservedness for title shot.... my pick is Rampage....


wtf?

a guy who gets his ass handed to him against rashads and then loses against machida... i mean wins a close close split decision,,, and you give him a title shot over jones or forrest.

total nonsense & rubbish.


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## Kreed (Feb 5, 2007)

RightCross said:


> *This is the weakest modern day title-shot to an unproven fighter in the history of ufc's undeserved title shots...* Forrest Griffen could have just as easily been given the title shot for a grudge match in shogun...
> ffin?
> incredible.


weaker than forrest griffin? for the longest time dana had panned mma rankings.Then the moment their TUF poster child beats a rusty shogun who looked just as shitty against coleman (which was after the forrest fight mind u)then they start sayin forrest beat the no 1 ranked LHW in the world.And ufc fans so eager for a 'white' hero, ate that sh!t up..The guy had lost to keith fukin jardine 2 or so fights before the the shogun fight yet he was gift wrapped a titleshot, but I suppose that was fine by u right?

Weaker than dan hardy? who the hell did he beat to face that gutless champion? marcus davis? some asian bum? yet they found a way to get him that shot..

These things happen all the time........btw who would u have jones face


RightCross said:


> Jon jones' titleshot, with the suprise rashad just got hurt and do u accept it, is the biggest VINCE MCMAHON WWF moment in ufc what a soap opera


rofl so tru


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## KillingRoad89 (Jul 28, 2009)

He may not be the best technical stiker but he is one of the best light heavyweights in the world and gives a lot of people problems and will give alot of problems to shogun. That being said I still think shogun takes it.


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## Iuanes (Feb 17, 2009)

RightCross said:


> ban, for stating a well-informed opinion of fighting that others seem to believe the total opposite of due to hype... maybe YOU SHOULD BE BANNED ... YOU are the TROLL


Well informed opinions like Vitor's boxing being too much for Silva? http://www.mmaforum.com/ufc/87127-vitors-boxing-will-destroy-anderson-silva.html

Buddy, I don't think anybody here has said Jones hits like Tyson or is as fluid as Anderson Silva. The exact ability of Jones' standup right now is unquantifiable. All you can say for sure is that it has been enough for him to go 'undefeated' in his very short MMA career.

A fighter doesn't need to be a dominant boxer to be considered a legitimate title threat. They generally have to be elite in one area and competent in another. Jones is dominant in one and AT LEAST competent in two. The one he is dominant in (wrestling), gives him a leg up in BJJ aspect, because he can usually get better positions. It also augments his standup that he can mix in a takedown or make his opponent wary of getting in too close.

Again, no one saying Jones is perfect, or has optimized his style. But I think his performances speak for themselves.

Why don't you make a thread about Rua having deficient wrestling?

Or better yet, go join a boxing forum because you clearly don't enjoy considering MMA.


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## PheelGoodInc (Jul 23, 2009)

Kreed said:


> weaker than forrest griffin? for the longest time dana had panned mma rankings.Then the moment their TUF poster child beats a rusty shogun who looked just as shitty against coleman (which was after the forrest fight mind u)then they start sayin forrest beat the no 1 ranked LHW in the world.And ufc fans so eager for a 'white' hero, ate that sh!t up..The guy had lost to keith fukin jardine 2 or so fights before the the shogun fight yet he was gift wrapped a titleshot, but I suppose that was fine by u right?
> 
> Weaker than dan hardy? who the hell did he beat to face that gutless champion? marcus davis? some asian bum? yet they found a way to get him that shot..
> 
> These things happen all the time........btw who would u have jones face rofl so tru


^Good point. You forgot to add Brock Lesnar to that list. 1-1 in the UFC and was given a title shot. With his only win over Heath Herring. Hilarious.

The fact is the UFC will set up the fights that make them the most money. Flashy 23 year old Jones vs Shogun will sell a lot of fights.

Nothing against Jones. The guy is skilled as hell and may even take the title. Things are blatantly obvious how the UFC works though.


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## mastodon2222 (Feb 4, 2010)

All true but the guys got "it" for MMA...he dominates people, period.


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## Steroid Steve (Oct 1, 2010)

I find it funny that the guy that dominates in the fight is the one getting criticized. Shouldn't it be the other way around? We should be talking more about what Bader can't do if we are going to criticize. I'm not saying that Bones doesn't have any room for improving, but stuff like this is nitpicking especially when the guy has only been in the sport for about 3-4 years, and he's only 23. He's winning off his god-given ability and wrestling base he has in dominating fashion. That is impressive in itself. Fighters don't get in their prime until their late 20s, early 30s. I'd say he has A LOT of time to improve.


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## sg160187 (Apr 11, 2010)

RightCross said:


> This is the weakest modern day title-shot to an unproven fighter in the history of ufc's undeserved title shots... Forrest Griffen could have just as easily been given the title shot for a grudge match in shogun...
> 
> incredible.


Mauricio Rua - Champion 

Lyota Machida Fighting Couture also on a 2 fight losing streak

Rashad Evans - Injured

Quinton Jackson - 1 fight win streak, also fighting Silva

Forrest Griffin - 1 fight in the last year

Ryan Bader - Just lost to Jones

Jon Jones - In most peoples eyes undefeated

Rich Franklin - Just lost to a guy who hasn't fought in a year

Matt Hamill - Bones beat him (then got DQ)

Thiago Silva - I wouldn't complain but fighting Rampage

Any others?

Seriously take your hater shades off, Dana picked the guy who based on win streak, performances and PPV potential is best!


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

context buddy.... rampage lost an extremely contested decision to forrest griffin..... in today's ufc that is cause for an immediate rematch. He lost to rashad by decision after long layoff. he then beats machida. he has fought a who's who of elite fighters in their prime..... he deserves it for his body of work


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

Iuanes said:


> Well informed opinions like Vitor's boxing being too much for Silva? http://www.mmaforum.com/ufc/87127-vitors-boxing-will-destroy-anderson-silva.html
> 
> Buddy, I don't think anybody here has said Jones hits like Tyson or is as fluid as Anderson Silva. The exact ability of Jones' standup right now is unquantifiable. All you can say for sure is that it has been enough for him to go 'undefeated' in his very short MMA career.
> 
> ...








rewatch the belfort-silva fight... im pretty sure vitor out-boxed silva lol


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## NotDylan (Jul 13, 2009)

Nogueira's stiking sucks, Lesnar's stricking sucks, Griffin's striking sucks, Anderson's wrestling sucks and they're all champions.


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## JoshKnows46 (Jun 18, 2007)

RightCross said:


> 1. The guy has a 84.5" reach, but has NO JAB... see miguel torres as someone who uses his length. LebronJones doesn't.
> 
> Against anyone that can strike worth a lick, like brandon vera, he reverts back to the wrestling as his crutch.
> 
> ...


 one, this is mma not boxing. 2, he has only trained striking 3 year. 3, he still out struck bader. 4, he can take down anyone in the division. 5, he's longer, stronger, and bigger than anyone in the division, and very explosive with his gnp so he will be tough to submit. 6, give the kid a break, he's only 23, he's gonna get better, and no one has found a way to stop what he has yet. again this isnt boxing.


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## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

I don't think jones striknig/boxing is terrible, it does need some work but with a 84 inch reach he should be doing more than what he has. 12 fights so far and i can't really tell if jones has ko power or will he just be an effective striker like gsp.


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## AlphaDawg (Nov 16, 2009)

sg160187 said:


> *Jon Jones - In most peoples eyes undefeated
> *


I hate how people actually think this way, as if it's ok for fighters to just break the rules and throw illegal strikes, as long as their winning. 

Jones threw about 3 illegal elbows at Hamill because he couldn't finish him fairly. He got DQ'ed. He's not undefeated. Just accept it already.


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## Rygu (Jul 21, 2008)

I can agree Jones isn't a good technical striker, but he's only 23 and comes from a wrestling background. He'll become more fluid on the feet i'm sure.

Shogun is the best LHW on Earth however, and Bones' striking needs to improve for that fight as Shogun is pretty strong in all areas. The way Bones handled Bader though... just damn impressive.


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## prolyfic (Apr 22, 2007)

RightCross said:


> rewatch the belfort-silva fight... im pretty sure vitor out-boxed silva lol


First like everyone said this isn't boxing. Also it doesn't matter if Belfort out boxed Silva....where did that get him. Jones hasn't used boxing really in his fights and hasn't needed too. Honestly critizing him not utilizing his reach in the way "you" want him to...Really?
Thats like saying I know when you shot yout freethrows it goes in but I don't think you are using your elbows the way you should.....RESULTS are what matters and looking at what Jones has done its insane to think he doesn't deserve a shot.
Everyone loves to get on who someone has faced but beating someone and dominating are two different things. Your pick for the title is Rampage, but he only won that fight because Lyoto wouldn't exchange the first two rounds...not Rampages fault but lets not act like Rampage has been domintating lately. His last 4 wins 3 are by decision. Jones hasnt been to the third round in his last 5 fights. And the loss to Hamill is a technicality, that yess did show he still needs to grow in knowledge of the sport but really.....WHO BETTER THAN JONES for this title shot right now.


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## Hammerlock2.0 (Jun 17, 2009)

Yes, his standup is awful, nothing new here.


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

If Jones boxing is terrible then I guess its a good job that he is not a boxer.

His MMA is very good tho don't you think?


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## rul3z (Jun 27, 2010)

If JBJ is this "Terrible" as you said and has never lost a fight (only 1 disQ) + he ran through all opponents. Then what shall he do if he is this "PERFECT" ?

Guys give us a break, this guy is terrific + he only trained for 3 years + he's only 23y old !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!




SmokyEye said:


> he didnt fight any elite yet, yet people make a god out of him, rediculous.


Was BADR too no ELITE stuff ?


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## JoshKnows46 (Jun 18, 2007)

AlphaDawg said:


> I hate how people actually think this way, as if it's ok for fighters to just break the rules and throw illegal strikes, as long as their winning.
> 
> Jones threw about 3 illegal elbows at Hamill because he couldn't finish him fairly. He got DQ'ed. He's not undefeated. Just accept it already.


because he couldn't finish hammil fairly? oh, thats why he did it?¿ no way you honesty believe he couldnt finish, hammil was done before the illegal shots. and he couldn't continue because his shoulder was dislocated from the toss, not the illegal blows. when asked if he could continue, he grabbed his shoulder and said its dislocated. jon won that fight, ur a fool if you think otherwise, or you need to watch that fight again. just like people use to say fedor was undefeated when he had a lose because of a cut, any thinking person can see the man wasn't beat. he didnt strike to the balls repeatedly on purpose like kongo, and it wasnt a well known rule.


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## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

The jones dq was bs in my opinion yes it was illegal but hamil was done no matter what. There was no way in hell hamil was going to win that fight.


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## Killz (Oct 5, 2009)

KillerShark1985 said:


> If Jones boxing is terrible then I guess its a good job that he is not a boxer.
> 
> His MMA is very good tho don't you think?


This.


/END THREAD!


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## Danm2501 (Jun 22, 2009)

Jones undeserving of a title shot, are you lot mental? He just completely shut down Ryan Bader. You're not honestly going to dismiss that as an achievement are you? Bader hits incredibly hard, is a very good wrestler, was unbeaten and just coming off a win over Rogerio Nogueira. If that is not an impressive win, then I don't know what is. He has absolutely mauled every single one of his opponents. He dominated Bader, threw Matyushenko and Hamill around, smashed Vera and submitted O'Brien. What more does he need to do? Jones deserves his title shot, not only because of the competition he's been beating, but for the nature of his victories. Jones is legit, and is more than worthy of a title shot.


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## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

Danm2501 said:


> Jones undeserving of a title shot, are you lot mental? He just completely shut down Ryan Bader. You're not honestly going to dismiss that as an achievement are you? Bader hits incredibly hard, is a very good wrestler, was unbeaten and just coming off a win over Rogerio Nogueira. If that is not an impressive win, then I don't know what is. He has absolutely mauled every single one of his opponents. He dominated Bader, threw Matyushenko and Hamill around, smashed Vera and submitted O'Brien. What more does he need to do? Jones deserves his title shot, not only because of the competition he's been beating, but for the nature of his victories. Jones is legit, and is more than worthy of a title shot.


Jones deserved the title shot, but how do u figure bader hits hard? He ko keith but keith chin was gone by that fight. Plus how come if bader had won he had to fight someone for a title shot while jones got it? Bader is an average joe he will be fighting rich franklin and those type of lhw for a long time.


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## anderton46 (Apr 23, 2010)

JBJ has what alot of people call 'flashy' standup, but its his amazing wrestling/ground game that has won every single fight of his. So even though I don't believe he could stand and bang with almost any of the top LHW's he still has a great chance of beating them all due to his ground game.


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## Danm2501 (Jun 22, 2009)

marcthegame said:


> Jones deserved the title shot, but how do u figure bader hits hard? He ko keith but keith chin was gone by that fight. Plus how come if bader had won he had to fight someone for a title shot while jones got it? Bader is an average joe he will be fighting rich franklin and those type of lhw for a long time.


How do I figure Bader hits hard? Knocked out Jardine with a left hook, he's weaker hand; faceplanted Maghales with a right hand, the dude hits like a train, he has serious power. Where did you hear that if Bader won he'd not have got the title shot? As far as I could tell, the winner of that fight got the next title shot. Ryan Bader is not an average joe. He's a very athletic guy, an NCAA Div 1 wrestler that fights out of a good camp and has more than solid stand-up. I knew this would happen though, people like to discredit Jon Jones' victories. Bader was a legit challenger, and both were on the cusp of the Top 5 before that fight, now Jones is a definite top 5, an deserves his title shot.


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## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

Danm2501 said:


> How do I figure Bader hits hard? Knocked out Jardine with a left hook, he's weaker hand; faceplanted Maghales with a right hand, the dude hits like a train, he has serious power. Where did you hear that if Bader won he'd not have got the title shot? As far as I could tell, the winner of that fight got the next title shot. Ryan Bader is not an average joe. He's a very athletic guy, an NCAA Div 1 wrestler that fights out of a good camp and has more than solid stand-up. I knew this would happen though, people like to discredit Jon Jones' victories. Bader was a legit challenger, and both were on the cusp of the Top 5 before that fight, now Jones is a definite top 5, an deserves his title shot.


Dana said it somewhere, jones is sick, but i don;t see much from bader. I see jones as a future champ. As for bader i don't see him beating any top 5 guys. My top 5 before the fight was//shogun/machida/evans/page/thaigo silva/jones


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## Danm2501 (Jun 22, 2009)

Mine was Shogun, Rashad, Rampage, Machida and Jones. Jones' win over Bader just confirmed his Top 5 ranking for me. After that event my Top 5 might actually be Shogun, Rashad, Rampage, Jones and Griffin. Harsh on Machida, but Forrest is actually on a winning run, and looked impressive against Rich. Machida would be at #6, with Thiago Silva at #7. Seriously stacked division!


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## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

Danm2501 said:


> Mine was Shogun, Rashad, Rampage, Machida and Jones. Jones' win over Bader just confirmed his Top 5 ranking for me. After that event my Top 5 might actually be Shogun, Rashad, Rampage, Jones and Griffin. Harsh on Machida, but Forrest is actually on a winning run, and looked impressive against Rich. Machida would be at #6, with Thiago Silva at #7. Seriously stacked division!


i don't count forrest as he won against two guys irrelevant in contender ship. Whereas machida lost to the champ then lost a fight where i think he won with rampage. All i know is if u take away the stupid point system and declare a winner by who whooped ass more, machida wins hands down.


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## Danm2501 (Jun 22, 2009)

Yeah, but I had Machida losing to Rampage and Shogun the first time, so my rankings are influenced by that, having Machida on a 3 fight losing streak. Forrest is 4-2 in his last 6, with wins over Tito, Franklin, Shogun and Rampage. He won the first 2 rounds against Rashad too. Sure, he lost to Rashad eventually, and then got embarrassed by Anderson, but he has a legitimate win over the champ, and a win over 'Page. Forrest is Top 5 for me, but, as you can probably see from my sig, I'm a biased Forrest fan.


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## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

Danm2501 said:


> Yeah, but I had Machida losing to Rampage and Shogun the first time, so my rankings are influenced by that, having Machida on a 3 fight losing streak. Forrest is 4-2 in his last 6, with wins over Tito, Franklin, Shogun and Rampage. He won the first 2 rounds against Rashad too. Sure, he lost to Rashad eventually, and then got embarrassed by Anderson, but he has a legitimate win over the champ, and a win over 'Page. Forrest is Top 5 for me, but, as you can probably see from my sig, I'm a biased Forrest fan.


lol i'm a bias anderson silva fan, so machida is a package deal when ur a silva fan. So there no way i would accept forrest in the top 5 due to the silva factor.


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## sg160187 (Apr 11, 2010)

RightCross said:


> context buddy.... rampage lost an extremely contested decision to forrest griffin..... in today's ufc that is cause for an immediate rematch. He lost to rashad by decision after long layoff. he then beats machida. he has fought a who's who of elite fighters in their prime..... he deserves it for his body of work


Alright I'll put it this way...

You want Rampage vs Shogun? Thats cool but he is fighting another guy I believe to be damn close to a title shot himself in Silva. What's Dana meant to do? Go tell Silva that even though he is fighting a guy for a possible shot they are going to pull Rampage out of that and throw him in against Rua? That is straight up disrespectful.

Jones is the only legitimate match-up that isn't either injured or tied up in a match already.


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## Danm2501 (Jun 22, 2009)

There's no way Rampage would be ready in 6 weeks either, he tends to get fairly out of shape between fights. Would have been a serious struggle for him to get into fight shape, and ready for a title shot in such a short amount of time. Giving the shot to Bones makes perfect sense.


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## mmaswe82 (Feb 22, 2010)

Righcross is obviously a boxing-troll who like so many other comes to an MMA-board to troll and talk about boxing. I used to love boxing back in the day, but fans like this makes me absolutely hate that sport. Did the fans lose their mind together with James Toney?



> If Jones boxing is terrible then I guess its a good job that he is not a boxer.
> 
> His MMA is very good tho don't you think?


Oh, and this...all that needs to be said really!


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## smokelaw1 (Aug 3, 2007)

RightCross said:


> Jon jones' titleshot, with the suprise rashad just got hurt and do u accept it, is the biggest VINCE MCMAHON WWF moment in ufc what a soap opera


Yeah, we get it, you think the shot is undeserved. Dude, dod Jon Jones kill your puppy or something? 

I am a big fan of Bones, but I agree the shot is too early. Underserved? Perhaps, but definitely too early. I think he's going to be an absolute bear, and at or near the absolute top of the food chain for a long time. But he is still REALLY green. And already really impressive. 

WAR BONES!


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## limba (Jul 21, 2009)

RightCross said:


> 1. The guy has a 84.5" reach, but has NO JAB... see miguel torres as someone who uses his length. LebronJones doesn't.
> 
> Against anyone that can strike worth a lick, like brandon vera, he reverts back to the wrestling as his crutch.
> 
> ...



Here you go dude:
Boxing forum

I think you are mistaking this forum with another one.

This is MMA.
Jon Jones is an MMA figher. Not a boxer!

PS: once you join Boxing Forum, look for Calu13 and tell him i said *HI*!
Thanks a lot!


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## AlphaDawg (Nov 16, 2009)

JoshKnows46 said:


> because he couldn't finish hammil fairly? oh, thats why he did it?¿ no way you honesty believe he couldnt finish, hammil was done before the illegal shots. and he couldn't continue because his shoulder was dislocated from the toss, not the illegal blows. when asked if he could continue, he grabbed his shoulder and said its dislocated. *jon won that fight, ur a fool if you think otherwise, or you need to watch that fight again.* just like people use to say fedor was undefeated when he had a lose because of a cut, any thinking person can see the man wasn't beat. he didnt strike to the balls repeatedly on purpose like kongo, and it wasnt a well known rule.


No he didn't, hence why he's 12-1.

You ******* idiot.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

Honestly his standup doesn't matter. There isn't a soul in the LHW division that can stop his shot when he takes down wrestling machines like Matyushenko and Bader like nothing. 

His standup will only be used when he chooses to, and that is against even weaker strikers. 

The question that matters more against Shogun is his sub-defense.



RightCross said:


> people talk about CHUCK LIDDELL being fed grapplers lol\
> 
> 
> 
> Jones road to the title shot ...... Matashenko, Hamill, Bader.......all wrestlers.... he is a wrestler.... bad matchup for them...... he beat them all..where? on the ground....


Wow talk about selective perception. He's also fought a technical standup MT fighter in Vera, a brawling standup fighter/BJJ black belt in Bonnar, and a BJJ/Capoeira figher in Gusmao. I could selectively pick out a bunch of wrestlers from any fighters resume and prove a fake point too.


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

Just reading though some random posts in this topic about the Jones vs Hamill match, kind of funny but maybe if Jones beats Shogun and becomes champ they should let Jones avenge his one and only loss by giving Hamill a title shot, not sure who you guys saying that Jones used illegal elbows because he couldn't finish Hamill any other way think would win that fight but I know who I would bet on.


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## Mike28 (Aug 11, 2010)

Jones boxing is not very good. But he is so long that he is able to keep people on the outside until he takes the fight to the ground. But he is only 23 and will only get better in the stand up department. Plus he is almost unstoppable on the ground at the moment.


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

this thread is made not to criticize jones, but to question the hype of jones' striking now that he is facing shogun rua....who out-struck machida twice.

different animal... and when jones takes it to the ground he will be at a severe disadvantage.


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

AlphaDawg said:


> No he didn't, hence why he's 12-1.
> 
> You ******* idiot.


So you use suborn black and white thought and its just fine, everyone else is a idiot but when he used it he's a idiot. I think I see a pattern here.

Can we just chill the - out. 

A loss on his record sure but its not a loss or it would say LOSS what its says is DQ if you dont understand the significance between the two thats on you.


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## AlphaDawg (Nov 16, 2009)

slapshot said:


> So you use suborn black and white thought and its just fine, everyone else is a idiot but when he used it he's a idiot. I think I see a pattern here.
> 
> Can we just chill the - out.
> 
> A loss on his record sure but its not a loss or it would say LOSS what its says is DQ if you dont understand the significance between the two thats on you.


Was this a joke post or are you being serious? I honestly can't tell.


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

JoshKnows46 said:


> because he couldn't finish hammil fairly? oh, thats why he did it?¿ no way you honesty believe he couldnt finish, hammil was done before the illegal shots. and he couldn't continue because his shoulder was dislocated from the toss, not the illegal blows. when asked if he could continue, he grabbed his shoulder and said its dislocated. jon won that fight, ur a fool if you think otherwise, or you need to watch that fight again. just like people use to say fedor was undefeated when he had a lose because of a cut, any thinking person can see the man wasn't beat. he didnt strike to the balls repeatedly on purpose like kongo, and it wasnt a well known rule.


As I already said in another thread, the Emelianeko case is different to the Jones case. Jones was undoubtly the dominant fighter and pretty sure would eventually have won the fight, but he undeniably did use an illegal technique multiple times. He is in the UFC for quite some time now and it's also part of his job to know the rules. So it's his own fault to get this unnecessary (as he was the dominant fighter), but still legitimate DQ loss on his record. Whereas in Emelianenko's case it was not he himself who used an illegal technique, but his opponent who consequently should have been disqualified.


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

Jon Jones is the Brock Lesnar of light heavyweight.

size/weight advantage = check
speed/wrestling advantage = check
reach advantage to cover up striking deficiencies = check
(remember Brock knocked Herring/Mir down w/punches
and TKO'D Randy Couture w/punches)
Jon Jones hasn't displayed the striking results
that Brock displayed



gameplan of takem down , avoid the sub and gnp = check
undeserved title shot = check

do not react well to punches = brock check/ jones unknown at this time.



Brock Lesnar = Jon Jones


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## Killz (Oct 5, 2009)

RightCross said:


> Jon Jones is the Brock Lesnar of light heavyweight.
> 
> size/weight advantage = check
> speed/wrestling advantage = check
> ...



Ok, ive read a lot of your posts over the past few days, on various subjects and have come to the conclusion you are either one of two things.

A. A troll.

B. you have no understanding or knowledge of MMA at all.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

RightCross said:


> Jon Jones is the Brock Lesnar of light heavyweight.
> 
> size/weight advantage = check
> speed/wrestling advantage = check
> ...


Yeah, Brock fights in a division where he can have up to a 70 lb weight advantage on his opponents. Jones not so much. 

Any reach advantage he has can easily be negated by the fact that the other guy has more muscle mass. But it isn't, because the guy's wrestling technique is just so damn good.


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## PheelGoodInc (Jul 23, 2009)

RightCross said:


> Jon Jones is the Brock Lesnar of light heavyweight.
> 
> size/weight advantage = check
> speed/wrestling advantage = check
> ...


Excuse my language, but you are a ******* moron. Jones' standup may not be the best, but to say he's brock lesnar either means you're delusional our just a moron when it comes to mma.

Lesnar was very one dimensional. Jones' transitions and submissions are light years ahead of brock. And unlike brock, jones has won a significant amount of fights and has yet to be in danger.


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## MrObjective (May 22, 2010)

Anderson Silva's striking wasn't much better at Jon Jones' age, like his first fight. He has plennnnty of time to become a good, if not great striker.


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

PheelGoodInc said:


> Excuse my language, but you are a ******* moron. Jones' standup may not be the best, but to say he's brock lesnar either means you're delusional our just a moron when it comes to mma.
> 
> Lesnar was very one dimensional. Jones' transitions and submissions are light years ahead of brock. And unlike brock, jones has won a significant amount of fights and has yet to be in danger.




how was lesnar one dimensional when he dropped frank mir standing? Dropped herring standing? tko'd randy couture standing. stood with carwin the whole first round. 

jones submissions are better than brock? Brock subbed shane carwin, a lot tougher than a mentally broken ryan bader. ..... by the way, for your last point about jones not being in danger, he lost to hammill... in a fight he was well on his way to winning. Sound familiar?

Lesnar/Mir 1 Lesnar loses a fight he was well on his way to winning when Mazzigati interfered. The similarities are startling.

Both have 3 years mma training


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

Liddellianenko said:


> Yeah, Brock fights in a division where he can have up to a 70 lb weight advantage on his opponents. Jones not so much.
> 
> Any reach advantage he has can easily be negated by the fact that the other guy has more muscle mass. But it isn't, because the guy's wrestling technique is just so damn good.







Bones cuts massive amounts of weight for 205 and can't do it for much longer. His wrestling technique is good, but his size advantage is incredible for 205. 


Brock had 20 pounds on Cain Velasquez. Brock doesn't cut weight anymore. ... it isn't inconceivable that on fight night Jones had 20 pounds on Bader.... he is 6'4


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

MrObjective said:


> Anderson Silva's striking wasn't much better at Jon Jones' age, like his first fight. He has plennnnty of time to become a good, if not great striker.



WRONG. Anderson Silva honed his skills at Chute Boxe, pride, cage rage, and Vale Tudo.... he peaked when he entered the UFC. Jon Bones has great strengths, but great holes in his game that ensure he will get beaten by the elite fighters of 205. -- which he hasn't fought yet.

This reminds me of Rumble Johnson and him ragdolling a couple of mid-level fighters then getting a title shot... no he fought koscheck and found out he had small things he needed to work on. so does jones


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## Killz (Oct 5, 2009)

RightCross said:


> how was lesnar one dimensional when he dropped frank mir standing? Dropped herring standing? tko'd randy couture standing. *stood with carwin the whole first round.*
> 
> jones submissions are better than brock? Brock subbed shane carwin, a lot tougher than a mentally broken ryan bader. ..... by the way, for your last point about jones not being in danger, he lost to hammill... in a fight he was well on his way to winning. Sound familiar?
> 
> ...


You are an obvious Troll. i have never read anything as rediculous as that in all my life!

:sarcastic12:


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## MrObjective (May 22, 2010)

RightCross said:


> WRONG. Anderson Silva honed his skills at Chute Boxe, pride, cage rage, and Vale Tudo.... he peaked when he entered the UFC. Jon Bones has great strengths, but great holes in his game that ensure he will get beaten by the elite fighters of 205. -- which he hasn't fought yet.
> 
> This reminds me of Rumble Johnson and him ragdolling a couple of mid-level fighters then getting a title shot... no he fought koscheck and found out he had small things he needed to work on. so does jones





> Anderson Silva's striking wasn't much better *at Jon Jones' age*


 at 23 years old - which is actually before Silva even started fighting in official MMA events.

Again, he has plenty of time to improve. 


Though he did outstrike - Bonnar, Hammil, Vera, Vlad, Bader using 'flashy' slams, takedown throws, and brutal TKOs/beatdowns/submission/strikes.

Nonetheless, JBJ is the top contender like it or not, he has annihilated everyone he's faced. 

So, who makes up the UFC LHW elite... Shogun, Rampage (1 fight win streak, did nothing of relevance and fought to basically a tie), Machida (1 fight losing streak, did nothing of relevance and fought to basically a tie), Forrest (Fought to a tie against Tito and beat up Rich Franklin) Ryan Bader (Undefeated TUF winner, ohhh but JBJ just destroyed him as well), and Lil Nog (1 fight losing streak, and won the previous fight by curious judging against Jason Brillz)? All of whom would have no problem of disposing JBJ if they were to get the chance matched up with such an unproven arrogant non 'elite lhw' right?

Well among the elite, Forrest seems the most qualified, two wins in a row, let's see what he has to say about JBJ as a fighter:


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## limba (Jul 21, 2009)

RightCross said:


> Jon Jones is the Brock Lesnar of light heavyweight.
> 
> size/weight advantage = check
> speed/wrestling advantage = check
> ...


Are you ________?!



RightCross said:


> extremely easy road.... jon jones = brock lesnar
> 
> titleshot check big strong athletic powerful quick w/ longest reach in division check standup defeciencies check


This was your post from another thread about Jon Jones!!! It's exactly the same!
This one!!!

All of your posts are the same!

1. You are clearly trolling, like i already told you, yesdterday! 
2. Your knowledge of MMA is terrible

Brock Lesnar = Jon Jones?!?!!!?!?!?!?!

In wich parallel universe?!
That only happens in the world you built for yourself, where you are *the king of the world* and everyone else - all the people here telling you you have no idea what you're talking about - are humble servants!

You should snap out of it!

You have an opinion! I Respect that!
What it's delusional and it's better you realize that yourself before shit gets worse.



Killstarz said:


> Ok, ive read a lot of your posts over the past few days, on various subjects and have come to the conclusion you are either one of two things.
> 
> A. A troll.
> 
> B. you have no understanding or knowledge of MMA at all.



Bingo!


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

MrObjective said:


>


Thanks for that one. I've read the quotes from that interview, but they cannot replicate how funny the interview really is. It's hilarious.


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## G_Land (Aug 11, 2009)

RightCross said:


> how was lesnar one dimensional when he dropped frank mir standing? Dropped herring standing? tko'd randy couture standing. stood with carwin the whole first round.
> 
> jones submissions are better than brock? Brock subbed shane carwin, a lot tougher than a mentally broken ryan bader. ..... by the way, for your last point about jones not being in danger, he lost to hammill... in a fight he was well on his way to winning. Sound familiar?
> 
> ...





RightCross said:


> Bones cuts massive amounts of weight for 205 and can't do it for much longer. His wrestling technique is good, but his size advantage is incredible for 205.
> 
> 
> Brock had 20 pounds on Cain Velasquez. Brock doesn't cut weight anymore. ... it isn't inconceivable that on fight night Jones had 20 pounds on Bader.... he is 6'4





RightCross said:


> WRONG. Anderson Silva honed his skills at Chute Boxe, pride, cage rage, and Vale Tudo.... he peaked when he entered the UFC. Jon Bones has great strengths, but great holes in his game that ensure he will get beaten by the elite fighters of 205. -- which he hasn't fought yet.
> 
> This reminds me of Rumble Johnson and him ragdolling a couple of mid-level fighters then getting a title shot... no he fought koscheck and found out he had small things he needed to work on. so does jones


Triple post are you serious? Are you Packmantyson???? Wake up man. How about you go to the newbie section and learn forum rules before you dump this garbage on us. How in the world could you compare JBJ to Lesnar??? You said Lesnar TKOd Randy standing...wrong...Stood with Carwin the whole 1st round???? And that sub looked better than JBJ/Bader???? Have you ever watched a single fight in your life or have you just read about it on teh interwebz.


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## Sambo de Amigo (Sep 24, 2010)

Jones doesnt need good striking he is kicking everyones ass without it :confused03:


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## andersen85 (Oct 18, 2010)

I wish they would have had bones fight rampage or thiago silva first, someone who can really take it to him on his feet. I didn't think much of bader's so-called "knockout power" before that fight and thought even less of it after. Personnally i would have loved rampage vs bones, rampage has good TDD and some of the best boxing at 205


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## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

> Jones doesnt need good striking he is kicking everyones ass without it


Until he meets a great striker.


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## andersen85 (Oct 18, 2010)

SM33 said:


> Until he meets a great striker.


hes about to...i think shogun is the worst possible matchup for bones jones. his stiking is light years ahead of anything bones has ever seen and i think he will be the much physically stronger fighter. not that i think he will ragdoll jones, i just dont think jones will have his way with shogun like he has with everyone else.

bones is one of my favorite up and coming fighters but shogun is a warrior from pride and i believe he is going to put JBJ to sleep in devastating fashion


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## Sambo de Amigo (Sep 24, 2010)

SM33 said:


> Until he meets a great striker.


and then he will take them down too.


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## RightCross (Jan 5, 2011)

***** Amigo said:


> and then he will take them down too.






Shogun has the best guard out of all the ufc elite 205ers. 

Do u really want to take shogun down? The guy that trained bjj for 2 and a half years is gonna get tooled on the ground by Shogun Rua. Shogun has amazing defensive guard, the best sweeps, great subs that he uses, normally, to stand up, such as his kimura sweep. 

Standing? Lebron Jones isn't gonna develop a jab in 5 weeks. Shogun will present numerous problems for him. body kicks, leg kicks (Machida 1) leg-locks (liddell)
guard sweeps from open or half-guard (Arona) strong muythai clinch (rampage) and great butterfly guard to stand up, he did it twice against Lyoto a legit bjj blackbelt in the second fight.

Shogun's punches are slightly loopy compared to strict boxing technique, but his accuracy along with his power is extremely refined. Shogun's chin is iron and his defensive boxing using the high guard is incredibly effective.


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