# ***OFFICIAL*** Jon Jones vs. Alexander Gustafsson Thread



## Budhisten

*Light Heavyweight bout: 205 pounds*
*Five round fight for the UFC Light Heavyweight Championship*
























​


----------



## Soojooko

Gustaf via viking funk.


----------



## Killz

Hilarious photo of Gus! :laugh:


Jones via late TKO or UD


----------



## oldfan

I can't get excited for this fight or the rest of this card.

I think Gus is going to be on the receiving end of a patient, methodical, beatdown. or a quick ground and poundyouout.

There is no one else on the main card that I care about seeing except Meathead and he can't carry it on his own even for me his biggest fan.

Gus is in for a world of hurt.


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## Soojooko

oldfan said:


> I can't get excited for this fight or the rest of this card.
> 
> I think Gus is going to be on the receiving end of a patient, methodical, beatdown. or a quick ground and poundyouout.
> 
> There is no one else on the main card that I care about seeing except Meathead and he can't carry it on his own even for me his biggest fan.
> 
> Gus is in for a world of hurt.


Sounds like a sensible prediction... are you feeling all right brother?


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## oldfan

Soojooko said:


> Sounds like a sensible prediction... are you feeling all right brother?


Keep in mind that when I make a statement like that there's a good chance we'll see fight of the year on the card of the decade.


----------



## cdtcpl

Why that pic of Gustaf? :laugh:

Jones by however he wants.


----------



## BrianRClover

LOL!! Seriously, that pic makes it impossible to see any chance for Alex... but fo real tho...

Jon Jones will vacate his title for greener heavy weight pastures one day... no one is taking it from him, in this guys opinion anyway.


----------



## GDPofDRB

50-45 Jones.


----------



## Gustafsson Fan

I change my mind every week. THIS week I think Gus will win 
I want to believe Gus will stand up the 1st round like Machida did but that he will be calmer than Machida and not use up his energy.

I want to believe Gus will start to out strike Jones BEFORE Jones lands a takedown so that Jones have already spent a considerable amount of energy standing up.

I want to believe Gus will take over the fight in the later rounds since Jones has not been able to inflict too much damage on the ground.

I want to believe Gus will win by knockout.


----------



## dsmjrv

Never been impressed by Gus, not sure where all the hype comes from... i hope im just missing something and that he actually gives jones a good fight..


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## Joabbuac

His movement might cause Jones to get a little frustrated, but he should get over that and win an awkward decision.


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## cdtcpl

Joabbuac said:


> His movement might cause Jones to get a little frustrated, but he should get over that and win an awkward decision.


While I know it doesn't work this way, but you would think if he was able to handle Lyoto's movement he should not have a difficult time with Gustaf. Then again with Lyoto you are dealing with someone who is getting out of dodge while Gustaf uses his head and feet better to stay where he is and try not to get hit.

But as I have said before, Gustaf looks like the loser in half the fights he wins because he gets hit way too much.


----------



## Joabbuac

cdtcpl said:


> While I know it doesn't work this way, but you would think if he was able to handle Lyoto's movement he should not have a difficult time with Gustaf. Then again with Lyoto you are dealing with someone who is getting out of dodge while Gustaf uses his head and feet better to stay where he is and try not to get hit.
> 
> But as I have said before, Gustaf looks like the loser in half the fights he wins because he gets hit way too much.


Lyoto with his Karate teachings tends to go straight back when under threat, Jones's pressure basically halved his running track which made it so he would just back straight into the the cage..., Gus is better at moving laterally.


----------



## cdtcpl

Joabbuac said:


> Lyoto with his Karate teachings tends to go straight back when under threat, Jones's pressure basically halved his running track which made it so he would just back straight into the the cage..., Gus is better at moving laterally.


True, but he gets hit a lot. I'm hoping Jack Slack puts out an article soon that explains why Gustaf gets hit so often. For a guy with as good as stand up as he has and someone who shows good defensive skills, his face is a wreck after every fight. Maybe he just marks up easily and I am just exaggerating the problem?


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## jonnyg4508

I think if Jones stands and tries to be patient it won't work as well for him. Gustaf doesn't have the reach of Jones. But he isn't Middleweight Rashad or Machida. He isn't slow, brawling Rampage. I still don't think Bones is a great striker. But he knows how to use his reach and keep fighters guessing. 

I think Bones takes Gustaf down early and beats on him. Probably finishing in round 2 or 3 with elbows or a sub.


----------



## mmaswe82

I'm Swedish myself & don't really care for Jones much so I'm obviously rooting for Alex but hell I think Jones is gonna swat him like a fly. Alex has decent wrestling but no more, Jones has atleast top 3 MMA wrestling in the world IMO. Hes gonna take Alex down and GnP him for a stoppage, maybe even in round 1.


----------



## 420atalon

If Jones keeps things standing or Gus somehow is able to stuff Jones' takedowns and keep it standing this fight is going to be a lot more competitive then some people think. 

Unfortunately I think Jones will at some point take Gus down and get a submission victory or win based on takedowns and ground and pound.


----------



## osmium

I don't see any real strategy for victory with Gus in this fight that wouldn't just be gambling with poor odds. The reach and wrestling skill are such daunting hurdles for anyone fighting Bones. You can't fight him on the inside because he will take you down, you can't fight him on the outside because he'll have like a foot of range on you, and you can't take him down because he is a great and versatile wrestler. 

I'm still waiting for someone to really brutalize those bird legs with kicks but I haven't seen anything from Gus that would suggest he is that guy.


----------



## Stapler

Jones is gonna maul the mauler.

Seriously though, I wanna see some elbows.

Osmium summed it up well. You can't stay on the outside against Jones and you can't close the distance without being in trouble. I don't see Gus as the guy to test his legs either.


----------



## LL

Jones takes him down and cuts him open then chokes him out.


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## BOOM

Jones will finish Gus in my opinion but it would be something if Gus manages to pull off the upset.


----------



## T.Bone

I think this could be Jones' toughest fight yet, Gustaf is taller than anyone he's faced to date (I think) and is pretty solid all round.

That said: Jones by submission rnd 3 or 4.


----------



## Gustafsson Fan

I think Gustafsson should not play a game of avoiding takedowns at all cost.

Instead Gus gameplan in general should be to try and land as much as possible before being taken down. He should not dance too much like he did against Shogun and Silva, instead he should try to be in Jones face and force Jones to open up and take risks. I want to see volumes of strikes because Jones does not have the hand speed to keep up with Gus in that game.

If the fight looks similar to when 2 heavyweight boxers brawling and trading blows then I think Gus has a big chance of winning.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0

Very interested in this fight. Finally a young lion with nice record and frame to face Jones. Jones is extremely strong in his torso, but I wonder if Gus can explore Jones "comically thin" legs(asb Joe Rogan). They don't look like they can take much damage.

If Gus gets easily taken to the ground, painful night for him.


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## Gustafsson Fan

MMA-Sportsman said:


> Very interested in this fight. Finally a young lion with nice record and frame to face Jones. Jones is extremely strong in his torso, but I wonder if Gus can explore Jones "comically thin" legs(asb Joe Rogan). They don't look like they can take much damage.
> 
> If Gus gets easily taken to the ground, painful night for him.


Well Gus has shown great balance in his earlier fights. He stopped a lot of takedowns from Phil Davis and he kind of pushed Shougn and Thiago Silva off balance and to the ground a few times using mostly his arms.


----------



## SM33

I don't know... No matter who faces Jones, he's build a good enough record to be favorite.

Personally I think Gus tops Jon in striking technique, speed and power. At least matches him in pacing, conditioning, size, youth and toughness.

Of course these are all just attributes, how the styles gel is the determining factor. Jon is coming off quick turnaround from dislocated toe. I'm not convinced Jones can get in clinch range without being clocked, I said the same about Rampage but at this point in time Gus is ten times the striker Rampage was, is fast and has pop in his strikes. And Jons tactics in that fight weren't really admirable.

I think Gus can hurt/dishearten Jon enough on the feet to weaken his ground game, which when he gets hit hard is his very successful plan B, his bread and butter. Not my prediction, for me this a close fight, fantastic match up. I just think Gus matches Jon's range and can make him go to war... Where Gus is good at dropping people.


----------



## Life B Ez

Gustafsson Fan said:


> Well Gus has shown great balance in his earlier fights. He stopped a lot of takedowns from Phil Davis and he kind of pushed Shougn and Thiago Silva off balance and to the ground a few times using mostly his arms.


Everyone seems to forget Gus stuffed all of Phil's takedowns. He got choked out because he tried to take Phil down and got sprawled on.

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## FatFreeMilk

Life B Ez said:


> Everyone seems to forget Gus stuffed all of Phil's takedowns. He got choked out because he tried to take Phil down and got sprawled on.
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App



That was the one thing stuck in my memory from that fight, don't know why it's not bought up more often. Speaking of past fights, just rewatched Gus Vs Shogun, and it must be said Gus took big bombs from Rua and didn't flinch at all. Maybe that why he gets hit so often, employing boxing defence straight from the school of Diaz.


----------



## osmium

Phil is a defensive wrestler his shot is terrible. Lil Nog was stuffing his takedowns left and right.


----------



## Soojooko

osmium said:


> Phil is a defensive wrestler his shot is terrible. Lil Nog was stuffing his takedowns left and right.


True. But Jones doesn't exactly have a great shot either. It's from the clinch that his takedowns are deadly. Having said that, Im sure Jones knows this and works his shot tirelessly.


----------



## UFC_OWNS

Jones is a greco roman clinch guy, I don't think I have ever even seen him shoot of a double leg that wasn't against the fence.


----------



## Rauno

UFC_OWNS said:


> Jones is a greco roman clinch guy, I don't think I have ever even seen him shoot of a double leg that wasn't against the fence, in the center of the cage.


He took Bader down with a double-leg.

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## cdtcpl

Rauno said:


> He took Bader down with a double-leg.
> 
> Sent from my GT-S5660 using VerticalSports.Com App


Bader also walked into it so he made it easy. The same way Tito cracked Bader, Bader starts every fight the same way.

Jones has moved to almost solely using clinch takedowns, so Gus should not worry about the shot and should focus on JBJ's legs. He may have to trade kicks, but honestly I feel that is a fight he would win.


----------



## Hexabob69

I picked Jones for this fight and really do hope that I am wrong. Gus does have a chance but for all the reasons mentioned I cannot see him just tsking this. I would however love to see a flash knock out or a Hail Mary type submission with JBJ as the victim; and I am positive I am not the only one with that sentiment.


----------



## slapshot

What is it, a four inch reach advantage for Jones? I dont get the logic when guys act like Gus has a style that's going to be hard for Jones to beat or that Gus's size is going to mess with Jon's striking. 

Its going to be Jon's length, size and striking ability that make this a hard fight for Gus to win not the other way around IMO.


----------



## HitOrGetHit

I don't see this going anyway other than a clear victory for Jones. I don't see Gus stopping the fight and I don't think any fighter is taking this belt without stopping Jones.


----------



## Gustafsson Fan

slapshot said:


> What is it, a four inch reach advantage for Jones? I dont get the logic when guys act like Gus has a style that's going to be hard for Jones to beat or that Gus's size is going to mess with Jon's striking.
> 
> Its going to be Jon's length, size and striking ability that make this a hard fight for Gus to win not the other way around IMO.


Gus is taller than Jones and has great standup skills including reach, power and footwork. So yes he has the style to beat Jones. Jones cannot stay on safety distance firing single shots or back one step backwards to make opponent swing wild into air. That is what will make this different.

Jones will have trouble doing eye pokes, knee cap kicks and oblique kicks because he will be close to Gus striking range all the time. Furthermore his spinning elbow is probably harder as well since Gus is tall and can hit Jones from above angle i.e overhand.


----------



## Killz

Gustafsson Fan said:


> Gus is taller than Jones and has great standup skills including reach, power and footwork. So yes he has the style to beat Jones. Jones cannot stay on safety distance firing single shots or back one step backwards to make opponent swing wild into air. That is what will make this different.
> 
> Jones will have trouble doing eye pokes, knee cap kicks and oblique kicks because he will be close to Gus striking range all the time. Furthermore his spinning elbow is probably harder as well since Gus is tall and can hit Jones from above angle i.e overhand.


Not biased at all though right? :thumbsup:


----------



## LizaG

Jones via being quicker to the punch and having a more varied attack. The dude is so quick that Gustafsson will only be left wondering what hit him.


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## UFC_OWNS

CupCake said:


> Jones via being quicker to the punch and having a more varied attack. The dude is so quick that Gustafsson will only be left wondering what hit him.


huh? jones isn't quick, he catches people by surprise sure but only because he has a varied attack. He's good at range and good with the clinch and top game and Gustafsson i can't see how he wins this at all especially since he said he would win this fight on the outside which is retarded.


----------



## BrutalKO

...Quite simply, Gus has earned his title shot but JBJ will make him look a bit silly fighting for it. Gus really is outmatched by Jon in every aspect. Yes- Gus has good hands, good wrestling, good submissions, good footwork and uses his reach well----with that said Jon Jones does ALL of those things and them some on a whole other level. Gus will be a little test for Jones but that's it. Jones with a finish if it goes to the ground a or UD...it won't be that close. 

_...Since Gus has those long legs, I'm real curious to see if Gus slams some hard legkicks right into the meat of JBJ's comically thin legs. If successful, it could make things become very interesting..._


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## Joabbuac

UFC_OWNS said:


> huh? jones isn't quick, he catches people by surprise sure but only because he has a varied attack. He's good at range and good with the clinch and top game and Gustafsson i can't see how he wins this at all especially since he said he would win this fight on the outside which is retarded.


If he can use his kicks and bait Jones in with his footwork, he could beat Jones on the outside. 

He won't though.


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## Gustafsson Fan

BrutalKO said:


> ...Quite simply, Gus has earned his title shot but JBJ will make him look a bit silly fighting for it. Gus really is outmatched by Jon in every aspect. Yes- Gus has good hands, good wrestling, good submissions, good footwork and uses his reach well----with that said Jon Jones does ALL of those things and them some on a whole other level. Gus will be a little test for Jones but that's it. Jones with a finish if it goes to the ground a or UD...it won't be that close.
> 
> _...Since Gus has those long legs, I'm real curious to see if Gus slams some hard legkicks right into the meat of JBJ's comically thin legs. If successful, it could make things become very interesting..._


If you think Jones is better in every aspect than Gus then you believe the hypes. Same could be said of Roy Jones, Mike Tyson and others who were said to be unbeatable. Suddenly they have the best everything.

Jon Jones has better hand speed than Gus? No
Can Jon Jones take a punch better than Gus ? I do not think so
Footwork, Jon Jones is faster on his feet than Gus ? Nope
Punching power, you sure Jon Jones punch harder than Gus ? I am not sure about it


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## js1316

Gustafsson Fan said:


> If you think Jones is better in every aspect than Gus then you believe the hypes. Same could be said of Roy Jones, Mike Tyson and others who were said to be unbeatable. Suddenly they have the best everything.
> 
> Jon Jones has better hand speed than Gus? No
> Can Jon Jones take a punch better than Gus ? I do not think so
> Footwork, Jon Jones is faster on his feet than Gus ? Nope
> Punching power, you sure Jon Jones punch harder than Gus ? I am not sure about it


No offense but I think you may be slightly biased. You weren't quoting BrutalKO correctly, you were putting words in his mouth persay. He said JBJ is better at practically everything, which is true. If you think Gus is better at something, what is it? And prove it?


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## Gustafsson Fan

I have to proof that Gus has better footwork or hand speed than Jones otherwise Jones is better ?

Is not that biased as well ?


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## Joabbuac

Outlaw117 said:


> If you think Gus is better at something, what is it? And prove it?


:confused02:

Why does someone have to prove it? How would you even go about proving something like speed, chin or foorwork?


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## Rauno

Gustafsson Fan said:


> If you think Jones is better in every aspect than Gus then you believe the hypes. Same could be said of Roy Jones, Mike Tyson and others who were said to be unbeatable. Suddenly they have the best everything.
> 
> Jon Jones has better hand speed than Gus? No
> Can Jon Jones take a punch better than Gus ? I do not think so
> Footwork, Jon Jones is faster on his feet than Gus ? Nope
> Punching power, you sure Jon Jones punch harder than Gus ? I am not sure about it


Just curious, based on what, why do you feel so confident in those arguments?


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## rabakill

UFC_OWNS said:


> huh? jones isn't quick, he catches people by surprise sure but only because he has a varied attack. He's good at range and good with the clinch and top game and Gustafsson i can't see how he wins this at all especially since he said he would win this fight on the outside which is retarded.


it's how you hit that's more important than how fast you do it which is why Jones is so good, he rarely telegraphs his attacks and he's very unpredictable and that greatly outmatches speed alone


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## js1316

Gustafsson Fan said:


> I have to proof that Gus has better footwork or hand speed than Jones otherwise Jones is better ?
> 
> Is not that biased as well ?


I'd like to see your reasoning, yes. And no, it would only be biased if I were a Jon Jones fan. I'm not, therefore my opinion can't be biased. You however, with a username like Gustafsson Fan, could definitely be interpreted as being "biased."



Joabbuac said:


> :confused02:
> 
> Why does someone have to prove it? How would you even go about proving something like speed, chin or foorwork?


He/She doesn't have to, I just asked if he/she could. And you could probably start by looking at both fighters previous fights, and looking at there speed, chin, and footwork. :thumbsup:


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## Gustafsson Fan

What I have seen in recent fights that show a difference is.

Hand speed:
Gus is throwing combinations and has been in exchanges. Jones damage his opponents using his physical advantages first before he starts to let his hands go to finish them. Gus has landed many more solid punches due to his hand speed standing up on fresh opponents than Jones. Against Machida Jones standup was good he landed solid blow before his takedown. This was partly because Machida used up his energy moving in and out of Jones range. When Machida had to reduce his tempo to conserve energy Jones caught him.

Footwork:
Gus is throwing punches while moving in all directions. Jones likes to get set and have his opponet standing in front of him. Gus has better footwork.

Punching power:
Might be equal.

Chin:
I have seen Gus take some heavy hits without flinching. I have not seen Jones take many hits yet. So I judge from what I see.

Standup:
I see a lot of Jones spectacular strikes are against opponents that have less range than Gus. He can do a random technique outside of opponents range and if opponent makes the wrong move he gets caught. The range means Jones can do it without risking much. Gus has a better solid boxing "one-two" than Jones and this will matter in this fight where both are of equal size.

Note:
if it was not because I have quit gambling years ago (for good reasons) the two fights I would strongly consider placing a big bet (1000 USD at leist) on is Gustafsson beating Jones and Chris Weidman beating Anderson Silva in the rematch.


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## Soojooko

Gustafsson Fan said:


> What I have seen in recent fights that show a difference is.
> 
> Hand speed:
> Gus is throwing combinations and has been in exchanges. Jones damage his opponents using his physical advantages first before he starts to let his hands go to finish them. Gus has landed many more solid punches due to his hand speed standing up on fresh opponents than Jones. Against Machida Jones standup was good he landed solid blow before his takedown. This was partly because Machida used up his energy moving in and out of Jones range. When Machida had to reduce his tempo to conserve energy Jones caught him.
> 
> Footwork:
> Gus is throwing punches while moving in all directions. Jones likes to get set and have his opponet standing in front of him. Gus has better footwork.
> 
> Punching power:
> Might be equal.
> 
> Chin:
> I have seen Gus take some heavy hits without flinching. I have not seen Jones take many hits yet. So I judge from what I see.
> 
> Standup:
> I see a lot of Jones spectacular strikes are against opponents that have less range than Gus. He can do a random technique outside of opponents range and if opponent makes the wrong move he gets caught. The range means Jones can do it without risking much. Gus has a better solid boxing "one-two" than Jones and this will matter in this fight where both are of equal size.
> 
> Note:
> if it was not because I have quit gambling years ago (for good reasons) the two fights I would strongly consider placing a big bet (1000 USD at leist) on is Gustafsson beating Jones and Chris Weidman beating Anderson Silva in the rematch.


I don't really disagree with too much of this. On paper, Gus is better then Jones in many areas. However, Jones use of length may well trump all of Gus above features. Gus doesnt rely on his length. He seems happy enough to dart inside and throw all kinds of hooks and uppercuts. Jones *never* does this. He stays strictly on the outside. As you pointed out, he breaks down his opponent from out there and then moves in once they have been sufficiently softened up. Thing is, Jones is used to stopping fighters getting inside. Its his bread and butter. But im not sure ive seen Gus get inside a fighter with Jones length. So he may well be forced to fight long = something I think Jones is more comfortable doing.

Also, Jones has eaten an overhand right from both Bader and Rashad. Im pretty sure his chin is solid.

Having said all that, I give Gus a fair chance. He has by far, more diverse striking then all of Jones previous opponents. Hes also a viking. Gotta love vikings. War Gustaf!


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## Gustafsson Fan

I agree with the styles but I do not agree with the conclusion. Jones is used to using his range and staying on the exact range. Gus is used to mixing jab and move with stay in opponents face. I think Gus then is more flexible and Jones is more of a specialist. I think the footwork, chin and hand speed means that Gus can set the pace and force Jones into trading punches. Either this or Jones immediately realises this and go for clinch against the cage plus takedowns. I do not think Gus can avoid takedowns the whole fight but I believe he can deliver the first big strike that changes the fight. We have not seen anything from Jones how he defends if he gets hit by a big one. He might just be like a Big George Foreman who starts to slug and gets hit even more. Of course Jones is just one clinch from getting the takedown in these situations so he is always dangerous.

I think Gus wins but.I see many scenarios where Jones win as well. I would absolutely not be surprised if Jones wins as well.


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## BrutalKO

Outlaw117 said:


> No offense but I think you may be slightly biased. You weren't quoting BrutalKO correctly, you were putting words in his mouth persay. He said JBJ is better at practically everything, which is true. If you think Gus is better at something, what is it? And prove it?


...Thx for the props man. I'm a Gus fan too but JBJ is not only more well rounded but is more athletic and elusive as well. Each time we've seen JBJ in a bit of trouble (i.e.- Vitor's armbar or when Lyoto was landing some hard strikes), Bones shows he can fight through adversity, turn the tables, and finish his opponent quickly...


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## oldfan

dude lives on his boat. he just rose a couple spots on my favorites list.


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## Sportsman 2.0

Soojooko said:


> Also, Jones has eaten an overhand right from both Bader and Rashad. Im pretty sure his chin is *solid*.


We know his toes aren't, though.


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## ProdigyPenn

To me, Jon Jones hasn't shown any weakness so far while facing all top tier fighters. The only time I remember seeing him in anything close to losing a round is against Machida's elusive striking style. 

But even so, Jones has more tools as he eventually took down Machida and choke him out in the 2nd.

Gustafsson on the other hand had shown weaknesses against wrestler. Although it's a long time ago and he has since trained with Phil, he hasn't face any good wrestler to prove that he can stop elite wrestler TD. 

With that, I just don't see how Gustafsson can win this. If jones can't outstrike Gustafsson, he can easily take him down. Even IF Gustafasson have a improved TDD, Jone will still take him down. If even Olympic alternate Chael Sonnen can't stop the TD, I don't see how Gustafsson can.


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## Soojooko

oldfan said:


> dude lives on his boat. he just rose a couple spots on my favorites list.


I was hoping his boat looked something like:


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## K R Y

Give him war give him war give him waaar.

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## Toxic

MMA-Sportsman said:


> We know his toes aren't, though.


Hendo has the h-bomb, Cro cop had the LHK and Sonnen has the foot stomps


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## slapshot

How can Gus have a reach advantage when he doesn't have a reach advantage...:dunno:

He may be quicker than Jones, although I dont agree that he is we shall see. He"ll have to knock Jones out because if he starts winning the stand up any other way, Jones is going to make the Trojan Man commercial of the year. 

First of all Gus is 15-1 with his one loss to Davis who has some serious BJJ chops. Its still a loss and Jones is undefeated also Gus really hasn't been swimming in the deep end for all that long. I dont think he can do to Jones what he can do to other fighters he's faced. 

Jones has 9 ko's of his own but more importantly he has the best wrestling in the division. If Jones gets top position I have no reason to believe gus can survive Jon's G&P. 

Gus cant stuff Jones and Jones can take him down at will. That complements his reach advantage and opens up striking opportunity's for Jones. 

Hell if im being honest Sonnen could beat all four of gus's last opponents. Still Gus is a solid fighter and good enough that if hes able to capitalize on a opportunity if one comes his way he could win but I dont think one will.


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## M.C

slapshot said:


> Hell if im being honest Sonnen could beat all four of gus's last opponents.


Indeed.

Gustafsson's best win *by far* is Shogun, in fact he got his title shot FOR beating Shogun, and Sonnen beat him very easily in the first round. Gus isn't anymore tested or unbeatable than Sonnen is, it's just the fact that Sonnen has faced competition 10x tougher than Gus has ever fought that he has more losses on his record. Honestly Sonnen could defeat Gus, I'd be 60/50 on that fight in Sonnen's favor. 

Point being, although this fight is interesting as Gus is bigger than the other guys and the size is more comparable, Jones will maul him and send him down the ladder without too much effort much like he did Sonnen. Sonnen/gus/Glover etc are all top guys in that division, but Jones is just a step beyond that, much like Cain is at HW.


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## slapshot

Found some hugger fodder in an junkie article. 

IN-FIGHT STATISTICS

Has never been taken down in his 19-fight MMA career, including 16 of 16 takedown attempts successfully defended in the UFC.

Finishing rate of 82 percent is second only to women's bantamweight champion Ronda Rousey for highest finishing percentage of the nine current undisputed UFC champions.

Has never been knocked down or submitted in MMA competition.

Is one of only two fighters in UFC history (Patrick Smith) to win two fights via a standing submission.

Nine knockout or submission wins in modern UFC competition are tied with former champion Chuck Liddell for the most stoppage victories in divisional history.

Takedown accuracy of 63.9 percent is second in UFC light heavyweight history to Lyoto Machida, who completes 65 percent of his takedown attempts.

Total of 552 significant strikes landed in UFC competition is the most among active light heavyweight fighters.

Has the fifth most total strikes landed in light heavyweight history with 741. Matt Hamill is fourth with 857, Stephan Bonnar third at 1,005, Forrest Griffin second at 1,096 and Tito Ortiz leads the category with 1,241 total strikes landed.

His 26 takedowns landed are the fourth most in UFC light heavyweight history.

http://www.mmajunkie.com/news/2013/09/ufc-165-preview-a-closer-look-at-jon-jones-career-statistics


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## Gustafsson Fan

M.C said:


> Indeed.
> 
> Gustafsson's best win *by far* is Shogun, in fact he got his title shot FOR beating Shogun, and Sonnen beat him very easily in the first round. Gus isn't anymore tested or unbeatable than Sonnen is, it's just the fact that Sonnen has faced competition 10x tougher than Gus has ever fought that he has more losses on his record. Honestly Sonnen could defeat Gus, I'd be 60/50 on that fight in Sonnen's favor.
> 
> Point being, although this fight is interesting as Gus is bigger than the other guys and the size is more comparable, Jones will maul him and send him down the ladder without too much effort much like he did Sonnen. Sonnen/gus/Glover etc are all top guys in that division, but Jones is just a step beyond that, much like Cain is at HW.


Styles makes a fight you know. Gustafsson beat Shogun who beat Machida. Machida is the only guy who won a round vs Jones.

Gus let both Thiago Silva and Shogun up a few times from the ground because he did not want to risk a submission. Gus probably felt he had control in the stand up already. IMO I think he should have gone for some ground and pound as well. It would evolve him as a fighter long term.


----------



## Killz

Love a bit of MMA Math! :laugh:


----------



## M.C

Gustafsson Fan said:


> Styles makes a fight you know. Gustafsson beat Shogun who beat Machida. Machida is the only guy who won a round vs Jones.
> 
> Gus let both Thiago Silva and Shogun up a few times because he did not want to risk a submission and he felt he had control in thr stand up already.


Obviously. However, that doesn't take away the fact that Sonnen has beaten and fought tougher competition than Gus ever has, and the only fight they share (Shogun), Sonnen not only finished it, but did it in the first round and made it look easy. He won in a far more impressive fashion. 

Point is, Gus is not on some other level. He's a top LHW along with guys like Sonnen, Glover, Machida, etc, which is good... but not good enough. Guys like Jones are a step above "the top guys". They make great fighters look second rate. 

Anything can happen during a fight, but Alex's chances of winning against Jones are not that good. I'm the first to want an upset, I love it when divisions are changed up, but reality is there to face.


----------



## Gustafsson Fan

I hope you are not right. If Gus and Texeira are just "another guy" then the light heavyweight division will become cleaned out and boring for years


----------



## slapshot

Gustafsson Fan said:


> Styles makes a fight you know. Gustafsson beat Shogun who beat Machida. Machida is the only guy who won a round vs Jones.
> 
> Gus let both Thiago Silva and Shogun up a few times from the ground because he did not want to risk a submission. Gus probably felt he had control in the stand up already. IMO I think he should have gone for some ground and pound as well. It would evolve him as a fighter long term.


If you want to say Gus has good footwork that's ok but Machida has some of the best footwork in MMA and Jones beat Machida striking, thats what allowed for him to get that choke.

I think Gus relies on his physical advantages, size strength and reach much more than Jon does. Jones uses his reach like a precision tool and Gus is still doing way too much brawling IMO. Rua was able to land flush shots and make that fight a war, a losing one but he didn't lay down and accept defeat. He ate shot after shot by Gus and just kept coming so as far as who has more power I cant help but think thats a misleading statement because its not necessarily who hits harder, its who dose more damage IDK. 

Barring a mental laps in judgment that allows for something crushing to land id think Gus is boned. 

Jones has been hit with solid shot from Machida, Evens and Rampage even Vitor got a few licks in, so you boggle my mind thinking that Gus has a more tested chin. I just totally disagree. 

Win or lose its quite possible Gus will be in another title fight soon if Jones vacates and goes to HW. I think he's going to move up soon, might even announce it after this fight.


----------



## rebonecrusher

I see Jon Jones in this fight standing up with Gustaffson briefly before taking the easier road and taking Gustaffson to the mat. Once Jones has Gustaffson down I think he'll devastate Gustaffson with elbows and and ground and pound. I'm expecting Jones to win by either TKO/KO or softening up Gustaffson with his ground and pound to the point where he locks on an easy submission. Either way I'm thinking another dominating performance for Jon Jones. I look forward to seeing it live and in person :thumb03:


----------



## oldfan

This deserves it's own thread but that thread would be full of sonnen whiners






note to self they have the History channel in Albuquerque :laugh:


----------



## No_Mercy

No predictions from me. I'm just going to enjoy the fight. I will say that if the LHW title holder dispatches Gustaf with ease that would be a statement. Those elbows man are fight finishers. If I were Gustaf stuck in the clinch, I'd recommend foot stomping the dislocated toe...roflz! I still crack up when I think about his facial reaction. He looked liked he was about to faint...haha. 

Wonder what the odds are...


----------



## cdtcpl

Per this article:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...-main-card-betting-odds-and-prediction/page/2

Currently JBJ - 800, Gus +550


----------



## Sportsman 2.0

cdtcpl said:


> Per this article:
> 
> http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...-main-card-betting-odds-and-prediction/page/2
> 
> Currently JBJ - 800, Gus +550


The bold part of this quote from the article in this link is the one I can't agree or understand, Mr. Jeremmy Botter:


> In my mind, Jones is easily the greatest fighter in the world today, and it's only a matter of a few more supreme wins over top divisional contenders before he's considered the best of all time. *Because there hasn't been a single fighter, ever, who has faced the kind of top-ranked competition on a continual basis as Jones. Not even Anderson Silva.*


Last 5 Jones defenses against: Sonnen, Vitor, Rashad, Lyoto and Rampage.
Last 5 Anderson successful defenses against: Sonnen, Okami, Vitor, Sonnen and Maia.

These two streaks aren't even comparable? Really?

Edit: And how Sonnen and Vitor were *top-ranked LHW* when they fought Jones?


----------



## BrutalKO

...Gus finds his range fast but he's never been in a 5 rd. fight. Jones has not fought anyone with a reach close to his. Gus has sweet angles and has the hands to crack Jones a few times. If he does...it's going to the ground where Jon will begin his devastation. Long-ass, cutting elbows from all angles. Total top control. I think Jones will soften him up and choke his eyeballs out.
That seems most likely to happen---or...Jones stands and catches Gus on the feet, dropping him then getting a TKO finish. That can happen too. Either way, Jones takes it...


----------



## K-R Blitz

I see this playing out similar to the Machida fight. I think Gus might surprise Jones in the first round but once he gets back his corner and Jackson changes the game plan Jones will win.

BTW am I the only one who really hates how Jones is called a "look, see, do fighter"?


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## cdtcpl

K-R Blitz said:


> BTW am I the only one who really hates how Jones is called a "look, see, do fighter"?


Not really. He got his striking start in MMA by watching video highlights of PRIDE and UFC, which is why early on that was pretty much all he threw. In reality, for him, it makes sense.


----------



## Toxic

I hate when people say Jones is better because he beat better guys than Gsp or Anderson did. really because the lhw belt changed hands more often than Matt Lindland changes underwear? The reason there are no former champions on then other two guys resumes is because they held the belt for such a long time as did there predecessors. If Gsp had come along 5 years later maybe Hughes, BJ, Alvez, Fitch and koschek would have made a super competitive division where they could have passed that belt around. if Anderson had came around 4 years later is there much doubt the division would have been more competitive with Hendo, Vitor, Sonnen etc Challenging Franklin or trading the belt around. The lack of note worthy fighters in the mw and we divisions is a nod to the long lasting dominance of there champions and does not retract from them. 


Sent from Verticalsports.com App


----------



## HitOrGetHit

Toxic said:


> I hate when people say Jones is better because he beat better guys than Gsp or Anderson did. really because the lhw belt changed hands more often than Matt Lindland changes underwear? The reason there are no former champions on then other two guys resumes is because they held the belt for such a long time as did there predecessors. If Gsp had come along 5 years later maybe Hughes, BJ, Alvez, Fitch and koschek would have made a super competitive division where they could have passed that belt around. if Anderson had came around 4 years later is there much doubt the division would have been more competitive with Hendo, Vitor, Sonnen etc Challenging Franklin or trading the belt around. The lack of note worthy fighters in the mw and we divisions is a nod to the long lasting dominance of there champions and does not retract from them.
> 
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com App


That's the same problem we are facing in the LHW division. Gus and Tex are contenders because of Jones dominating everyone else.


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----------



## slapshot

Toxic said:


> I hate when people say Jones is better because he beat better guys than Gsp or Anderson did. really because the lhw belt changed hands more often than Matt Lindland changes underwear? The reason there are no former champions on then other two guys resumes is because they held the belt for such a long time as did there predecessors. If Gsp had come along 5 years later maybe Hughes, BJ, Alvez, Fitch and koschek would have made a super competitive division where they could have passed that belt around. if Anderson had came around 4 years later is there much doubt the division would have been more competitive with Hendo, Vitor, Sonnen etc Challenging Franklin or trading the belt around. The lack of note worthy fighters in the mw and we divisions is a nod to the long lasting dominance of there champions and does not retract from them.
> 
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com App


Jons record outshines GSP's in finishes and therefore the outcome of his fights are more definitive IMO. 

To me P4P is much too subjective to have much merit to begin with. Anyway its not that the quality of the fighters they have faced has a huge disparity, its the means. Who you beat and how you beat them matters.

What if GSP finished Diaz, Condit and Hendrix by KO, how much stronger is his bid for GOAT with finishes than without? Besides this is MMA not boxing, the initiative was never to see who could out point who or win rounds, its always been damage first.

I was ripped when I wrote this, I kinda see my line of thought at least its linear lol.


----------



## Ape City

Toxic said:


> I hate when people say Jones is better because he beat better guys than Gsp or Anderson did. really because the lhw belt changed hands more often than Matt Lindland changes underwear? The reason there are no former champions on then other two guys resumes is because they held the belt for such a long time as did there predecessors. If Gsp had come along 5 years later maybe Hughes, BJ, Alvez, Fitch and koschek would have made a super competitive division where they could have passed that belt around. if Anderson had came around 4 years later is there much doubt the division would have been more competitive with Hendo, Vitor, Sonnen etc Challenging Franklin or trading the belt around. The lack of note worthy fighters in the mw and we divisions is a nod to the long lasting dominance of there champions and does not retract from them.
> 
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com App


Exactly. The longer Jones remains dominant the weaker the division, supposedly, will become. People that are not a fan of current champ x often seem to use the weak division excuse when in fact it is just a dominant champion making the division seem weak. Remember right before Jones became champ? When LHW was up there with LW as the deepest division? Divisions are simply viewed as deep when the skill level of the top 5-10 is similar. A truly deep division is about the quantity of quality fighters at the top level, not just at a similar level.


----------



## No_Mercy

I'm pretty sure the LHW title holder is going to win, but what if he and GSP lose in succession. How crazy would that be...

Those are juicy odds though. Thanks for digging that up and posting it! :thumbsup:

$10 nets you $55.

Juss sayin...


----------



## mastodon2222

This fight won't be close. Jones via ground and pound 2nd or 3rd round- lots of elbows and blood.


----------



## slapshot

No_Mercy said:


> I'm pretty sure the LHW title holder is going to win, but what if he and GSP lose in succession. How crazy would that be...
> 
> Those are juicy odds though. Thanks for digging that up and posting it! :thumbsup:
> 
> $10 nets you $55.
> 
> Juss sayin...


If 10 nets 500 maybe but its still just throwing it away.


----------



## BrutalKO

oldfan said:


> I can't get excited for this fight or the rest of this card.
> 
> I think Gus is going to be on the receiving end of a patient, methodical, beatdown. or a quick ground and poundyouout.
> 
> There is no one else on the main card that I care about seeing except Meathead and he can't carry it on his own even for me his biggest fan.
> 
> Gus is in for a world of hurt.


...Great post. I think the card is weak but Jones is pretty much gonna wreck Gus. Meisha Tate had a good call with a Jones 2nd rd. TKO. There is no way Gus has an answer for the wrestling of Jon Jones...plain & simple. I think Gus will get dumped on his ass and finished on the ground either by a nasty- perhaps bloody ground n' pound or submission...


----------



## slapshot

BrutalKO said:


> ...Great post. I think the card is weak but Jones is pretty much gonna wreck Gus. Meisha Tate had a good call with a Jones 2nd rd. TKO. There is no way Gus has an answer for the wrestling of Jon Jones...plain & simple. I think Gus will get dumped on his ass and finished on the ground either by a nasty- perhaps bloody ground n' pound or submission...


Remember how Dana would say MMA will never be like boxing, that the only fighters you know are the headliners? heh..


----------



## No_Mercy

You know I've seen many types of takedowns.

Old school Royce would body lock and trip you.
GSP lunges at you and shoots in. 
Brock bulldozes his way in.
Cain is relentless and keeps going forever til he gets it. Single, double, ankle pick, doesn't matter.
Machida clinches then manipulates your body and trips you.
Maia, Big Nog, Werdum, Mir pull guard or feign injury. Not necessarily a takedown, but still get it to the ground.

Then you have the LHW title holder who powers his way. There doesn't seem like there's any resistance whatsoever. Even for Chael he got up once then that was it. Game over. He is what GSP does expect with much more dramatic effect. That's his finishing move. The fact that he has long arms and torso give him and incredible amount of torque unlike the average fighter.


----------



## oldfan

I never thought Gus had a chance in this fight until I watched the weigh in and listened to that intro monologue by Jones. *"It's bigger than just this one fight. It's about being the greatest combatant of all time."* That's the kind of stupid shit people say before they get their ass kicked.
ask bendo


----------



## cdtcpl

oldfan said:


> I never thought Gus had a chance in this fight until I watched the weigh in and listened to that intro monologue by Jones. *"It's bigger than just this one fight. It's about being the greatest combatant of all time."* That's the kind of stupid shit people say before they get their ass kicked.
> ask bendo


Bendo hadn't won every fight by destroying guys and making them quit. Bendo was talking about being the best while eeking by on Decisions, questionable decisions, and split decisions. Jones has wrecked everyone that was put in front of him. He is violence to a level most can only dream of achieving. He won't be LHW champ or dominant forever, but for right now I am not seeing anyone in the pack who gives him a solid run for his money.

This is apples and TNT comparisons, there are none.


----------



## Guy Incognito

Hopefully Gus makes it a fight. honestly think he will early on.


----------



## cdtcpl

Guy Incognito said:


> Hopefully Gus makes it a fight. honestly think he will early on.


Kenny Florian I think put it best:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1776281-dropping-knowledge-kenny-florian-breaks-down-ufc-165



> First and foremost, I think he needs to have a good first round. I think it's very important that he take away any momentum from Jon Jones early. If Jon Jones has momentum, he's going to run away with it. Gustafsson isn't going to have a prayer. Gustafsson has to find a way to hurt Jones or make him respect his striking early.


Literally if Gus doesn't come out and make JBJ respect him then the fight will get away from him very quickly.


----------



## Calminian

No_Mercy said:


> You know I've seen many types of takedowns.
> 
> Old school Royce would body lock and trip you.
> GSP lunges at you and shoots in.
> Brock bulldozes his way in.
> Cain is relentless and keeps going forever til he gets it. Single, double, ankle pick, doesn't matter.
> Machida clinches then manipulates your body and trips you.
> Maia, Big Nog, Werdum, Mir pull guard or feign injury. Not necessarily a takedown, but still get it to the ground.
> 
> Then you have the LHW title holder who powers his way. There doesn't seem like there's any resistance whatsoever. Even for Chael he got up once then that was it. Game over. He is what GSP does expect with much more dramatic effect. That's his finishing move. The fact that he has long arms and torso give him and incredible amount of torque unlike the average fighter.


Well apparently Alexander's wrestling has greatly improved according to his camp, and he's apparently been sparing with the klitschkos. That's the rumor anyway. Be classic if he was able to connect and rock Bones. Some guys really need humble pie.


----------



## marcthegame

I would love to see nothing more than Gus get his hand raise after this fight. However I think Jones will lay an ass whooping on him. Too creative and smart in there, my guess would be he takes Gus down and finishes him brutal GNP.


----------



## hellholming

**** you. Jon Jones!


----------



## Pillowhands

I hope for Gus to win. Gus need to take chances in the stand-up in first round just to make a clear message to Jon Jones that he is up for a real fighter with a nasty attack. 
I wonder what Gus has planned to stay away from those fight ending elbows both on the ground and standing. They are coming from all crazy angles. I remember how Rashad was punished by the elbows standing in 2nd round against Jones...


----------



## MagiK11

I want Gustafsson to win as well, but for some reason, I would like to see Jones break the record. So even though I'm not a Jones fan, I think he will win, and a part of me wants him to win, for the records sake. So I will try to be indifferent during the fight, and the better man will get his hand raised.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0

oldfan said:


> I never thought Gus had a chance in this fight until I watched the weigh in and listened to that intro monologue by Jones. *"It's bigger than just this one fight. It's about being the greatest combatant of all time."* That's the kind of stupid shit people say before they get their ass kicked.
> ask bendo


Excelent observation. I saw determined eyes in Gus, while I heard a loud mouth in Jones. How pathetic was he throwing litter to the public like they would be placed over someone fireplace for eternity? :dunno: 
Guy is desperate for approval, heading the wrong way.



cdtcpl said:


> Jones has wrecked every *"grandpa, washed out, weak cardio, unidimensional, MW, short notice, hurt, undeserving LHW title shots fighter"* that was put in front of him. He is violence to a level most can only dream of achieving, * "sure not to compare to Wanderlei Silva's violence level in his prime days, for those who were lucky enough to watch"*.


Fixed for you in bold.

Lets see if he'll walk right through Gus, then I can lend him a little more credit.


----------



## No_Mercy

I hope Gus puts up a good fight tonight and is prepared for the inevitable takedowns. He has the reach, speed and firepower.

Think I'm getting a bit more excited now about the card tonight!


----------



## hellholming

normally I don't cheer for swedes as I'm a finn (), but this time I'd be ecstatic if Gus won.


----------



## Toxic

I would love to be wrong but I fail to see how Gus can be a threat unless he has been working exclusively on fighting off his back and can take advantage of what Vitor showed us since it's the closest thing to a dent in the armor we have seen. 


Sent from Verticalsports.com App


----------



## lights out 24

Jon Jones by tko in the first. Not sure why anyone thinks this will even be remotely competitive. The light heavyweight division is horrible. Jon Jones only decent match up was Machida & Rashad. He's fought shogun who hasn't been consistent since losing to Jones, rampage (really?), they brought up 2 middleweight fighters & the competition has been WAY overrated. This won't even be a fight tonight. 

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## jonnyg4508

lights out 24 said:


> Jon Jones by tko in the first. Not sure why anyone thinks this will even be remotely competitive. The light heavyweight division is horrible. Jon Jones only decent match up was Machida & Rashad. He's fought shogun who hasn't been consistent since losing to Jones, rampage (really?), they brought up 2 middleweight fighters & the competition has been WAY overrated. This won't even be a fight tonight.
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


Bones rarely goes in a dominates the first. He did to little Chaelly boy. But other than that fight vs. a middleweight, he rarely goes in and dominates off the bat. And I think Gustaf is tough enough to last more than 1 round. 

I think Bones would be wise to look to go to the ground. I don't think Gustaf has much in the wrestling department (he could try to stay on the outside and try to be quicker to the punch, but not in close wrestling scenarios) and I don't think he has nearly a good enough ground/off back game, although it is hard to know that as he hasn't been there much as of late. But if Bones decides to stand for long periods, I think the fight becomes much closer.

I have Bones winning with elbows or a sub in teh 3rd round.


----------



## lights out 24

I just think Greg Jackson will implement a safer approach with Guss. Phil Davis had his way with him taking him down & I just don't see why this would be any different.. I like the match up if it would be just a stand up fight but I don't think Jon Jones will risk it. I can agree about a 2nd or 3rd rd stoppage because they will prob feel each other out. I really hope I'm wrong.


----------



## jonnyg4508

lights out 24 said:


> I just think Greg Jackson will implement a safer approach with Guss. Phil Davis had his way with him taking him down & I just don't see why this would be any different.. I like the match up if it would be just a stand up fight but I don't think Jon Jones will risk it. I can agree about a 2nd or 3rd rd stoppage because they will prob feel each other out. I really hope I'm wrong.


Phil Davis didn't really dominate Gustaf with wrestling. At the time Gustaf was basically a kickboxer. And Gustaf avoided TDs in that fight. He was caught in an anaconda during a scramble where he avoided a TD. 

You can't just look at a fight years ago and apply it now anyway. You don't think Gustaf has got any better??? Gustaf was new to the UFC and sort of new to MMA. 

That said, Phil Davis isn't Bones. Bones has way better MMA TDs. So I agree, I imagine he can take Gustaf down at will if he gets his hands on him, especially in the clinch. But the Phil Davis fight from more than 3 years ago has no influence on that opinion. Gustaf actually did very well in that fight until he was caught.


----------



## lights out 24

But it does. Phil Davis was as raw as Gus was back then he just had a better base. Do I think he's gotten better since that fight? Yes. Do I think that matters? No. I think Jones mma wrestling is way better then gus defense & if they clinch which is a Gus strength he's taken down, Jones shoots he's taken down. Gus standing & throwing on the outside don't mean much when the opponent has the same reach. Jones isn't a brawler so it won't be a scenario where it gets crazy & Jones gets clipped from a brawl, he won't showboat like Anderson so he won't get clipped that way either. Best case for Gus would prob rush the pace & keep throwing right down the pipe & try to transition back to his feet quickly like Chuck Liddell. That's my opinion & we'll see but bones will dictate the tempo. The only fighter able to dictate the tempo was Lyoto & he eventually got caught. I would like Gus to win but if I was to bet I would put all money on bones by stoppage before the championship rounds.


----------



## jonnyg4508

Phil was raw, but Phil was also coming off a great collegiate wrestling career. His wrestling was in full gear. To stay away from TDs from a guy like that says something when your take down defense was at its earliest stages. Like I said Bones is way better than Phil Davis ever will be. But the Phil fight says close to nothing...since it wasn't as if Phil took Gustaf down with ease all fight. You said Phil had his way. And that is just false.

Brock was more raw than Phil when he came into the UFC. But stopping a Brock TD even then is still a big deal. 

Of course if we are betting we are all taking Bones on a straight bet. The dude is a 9 to 1 favorite.


----------



## No_Mercy

How many rounds you think this will last...


----------



## Toxic

I will be surprised if this doesn't make the Barao/Wineland fight look competitive, I think unless Gus has secretly been building a bad ass guard then Jones runs through him. Gus has a good build for BJJ and he should have come prepared to use it.


----------



## Rygu

No_Mercy said:


> How many rounds you think this will last...


Gus is lucky to make it to the 3rd.


----------



## cdtcpl

2nd round, but not as fast as Barao.


----------



## Shoegazer

Wait a sec...

In the preview, did Jones just say "It's not about this fight, it's about being the greatest man ever"?

Did I hear that wrong?


----------



## cdtcpl

Shoegazer said:


> Wait a sec...
> 
> In the preview, did Jones just say "It's not about this fight, it's about being the greatest man ever"?
> 
> Did I hear that wrong?


Nobody tell Chuck Norris....


----------



## Rygu

Just clear the damn division Bones, so you can goto HW and get the shit knocked out of you by even mid-tier HWs.


----------



## No_Mercy

Please don't do the cartwheel and shuffle...

K...we got 3rd round and a 2nd round.


----------



## Rusty

Why would you wear headphones to the ring if you aren't listening to them?


----------



## Fieos

sponsorships


----------



## cdtcpl

I wonder if he will start off with the crawl? Last time with Vitor it nearly got him KO'ed and Big John told JBJ not to play the game (I agree with that call).

Edit: Per the UFC's measurements Gus's arms grew!


----------



## Toxic

Rusty said:


> Why would you wear headphones to the ring if you aren't listening to them?


cause somebody pays you to:confused02:


----------



## Roflcopter

The crawl doesn't save you anymore. You can get kicked.


----------



## No_Mercy

Here we go. For some reason I'm imagining a Vitor vs Wand I type of fight...but once again no predictions. Just gonna enjoy this fight and see it live as it goes.


----------



## Beeg

First time Jones doesn't looked ripped.


----------



## Stardog

Prediction: Tiny bit of standup, then Jones gets him against the cage, and punches, elbows and knees will finish it in round 1.


----------



## Terror Kovenant

Fight will end wildly, suddenly, and with a lot of people angry


----------



## Toxic

Beeg said:


> First time Jones doesn't looked ripped.


he does look a little soft, don't see it lasting long enough for it to be an issue though.


----------



## BOOM

Gus holding his own.


----------



## Toxic

what the f*** is Jones doing, take this down don't let ego ruin you.


----------



## Rygu

Gus is owning this guy, oh and an eye poke. Great.


----------



## cdtcpl

TD by Gus, didn't see that coming. I think the round was close up until that.


----------



## Terror Kovenant

Jones is a dirty fighter, points need to be taken


----------



## UFC_OWNS

10-9 gus


----------



## Roflcopter

Jones 10-9


Also Jones got cut, what a cornball brother.


----------



## Shoegazer

10-9 Gustafsson


----------



## Stun Gun

Come on Gus put his ego in place. Jones taunting pfft


----------



## rallyman

man closer fight than I thought so far.


----------



## cdtcpl

Is Gus cut on his cheek?


----------



## Roflcopter

Jones has such stupid, unnatural striking defense, he leans back and tries to parry everything.


----------



## 420atalon

Going as predicted. As long as Gus can avoid being taken down he has a chance of winning this.


----------



## Ape City

Damn Gus took that for sure! Nice round! amazing fight! Jon was so nervous and hesitant when johnsaid touch gloves haha.


----------



## jaycalgary

Jons bag of tricks doesnt work so well with a guy his own size


----------



## Toxic

Jones looked like he was going full retard running after Gus like that, I think Bones slept on Gus.


----------



## cdtcpl

I got them at a round a piece. Those 2 headkicks were the main damage of the round.


----------



## hixxy

20/18 Gus!


----------



## Rygu

20-18 Gus.


----------



## Shoegazer

Rd 2 for Jones


----------



## Roflcopter

Jones looks very comfortable right now. Slipping mostly everything. Landing tons of kicks.

20-18

Easy round for Jones


----------



## Ape City

Jones took that one. even fight.


----------



## AJClark

I'm biased but 20-18 Gus


----------



## Jumanji

1-1 imo


----------



## rabakill

definitely tied up now


----------



## Stun Gun

2-0 for Gus. I think a lot of you overlooked Gustas TDD and striking. Cardio might be the factor here


----------



## Roflcopter

Gustaffson is changing this fight by going to the body. Groundbreaking stuff in MMA.


----------



## Terror Kovenant

Gus has to watch those head kicks. hes eaten 3 flush, its a good thing Jones doesnt hit hard


----------



## Toxic

god Jones looks horrible tonight and Gus is just owning him. This is the worst we have ever seen Bones look and I don't think its a matter of Gus being that good or though he looks great.


----------



## cdtcpl

Gus is starting to slow down and look tired. Also a little wobbly on the lead leg a couple of times, I think the kicks are starting to add up. Lets see how the next 2 rounds go, but I think it is 2-1 Gus.


----------



## BOOM

Round 3 Gus


----------



## Roflcopter

That was the closest round of the fight. 

2-1 Jones.


----------



## Shoegazer

Gus squeaks rd 3 for me, up 2-1


----------



## UFC_OWNS

2-1 Gus


----------



## rallyman

have to agree jones looks flat and outside of his kicks seems to very flat and hesitant to pull the trigger

good fight though so far 2-1 gus for me


----------



## Ape City

Holy crap...what a fight.....I think i give round 3 to gus....so close!!!!


----------



## jaycalgary

Rogan is a dummy saying that was a thumb to the eye it was under


----------



## Stun Gun

I think Gus is up 2-1 or 3-0


----------



## XxDEATHSHEADxX

Real Fight


----------



## 420atalon

Toxic said:


> god Jones looks horrible tonight and Gus is just owning him. This is the worst we have ever seen Bones look and I don't think its a matter of Gus being that good or though he looks great.


Jones' striking has never looked very good. It just is flashy with his funky kicks and spinning elbows etc.

Gus keeping the fight standing has been able to show Jones' striking weakness.


----------



## suniis

I have it at 2-1 for Gus, with him winning round 4 so far...

It's impressive that he has been able to keep the fight standing...

I hope Jones goes down tonight!


----------



## BOOM

Wow Gus


----------



## cdtcpl

Jones looks really tired, he is running on heart. I think Jones stole the round at the end. 2-2, this round matters!!!


----------



## UFC_OWNS

2-2 due to late jones flurry


----------



## rallyman

wow how did he survive that last minutes

holy shit!!!


----------



## HorsepoweR

Rogan is such a ***got. Oh his toe injury. Lmao what a idiot


----------



## Stun Gun

Holy shit. Jones isnt a good striker but his spinning strikes hurt


----------



## suniis

Ooooh!! Gus might be hurt!


----------



## Ape City

all gus...the npwnage by Jon in the last minute!!!!! hgow the **** do u score that?????! What a fight. fight of the year so far imo.


----------



## Rygu

Could very well be tied going into the 5th. Great fight so far.


----------



## Jumanji

i got it 2-2 Jones stole that last round.


----------



## Roflcopter

I don't even know how to score that round.


----------



## 420atalon

What a fight. Just when it looks like Gus is going to start running away Jones lands one of his spinning elbows. 

Very close fight, if it goes to the judges who knows which way this is going to go.


----------



## Shoegazer

Wow Gus was winning 4 easy, but then Jones...

2-2 even fight. rd 5 wins it.


----------



## Terror Kovenant

3 - 1. Jones took the 4th round. Gus's TD defense and octagon control is amazing


----------



## Rusty

2-2 at best for Gus. I have Jones 3-1 so far.

Edit: Jon's lips are swollen. Ya don't say lol


----------



## suniis

It became pretty even with Jones stealing round 4...
This is a good fight!


----------



## Toxic

I think Glover is gonna lose his title shot in 3 minutes.


----------



## rallyman

gus looks gone


----------



## rabakill

Jones wins, split


----------



## cdtcpl

What a f*cking war!!!


----------



## Beeg

I wish Goldie was just reading from a phone book. I don't mind hearing the second voice, I just don't need to hear anything he has to say.


----------



## suniis

I think going to a decision, both fighters are pretty nervous...


----------



## Roflcopter

Amazing fight.

49-46 Jones


----------



## Ape City

Aaaaand New Lhw Champioooon!

fight of the year. amazing.


----------



## M.C

It can go to either guy IMO.


----------



## UFC_OWNS

i got gus 3-2


----------



## OHKO

Stream sucks. Gotta rewatch this fight somehow.


----------



## cdtcpl

The only way this is a robbery is if someone gets a 50-45.


----------



## Terror Kovenant

3 - 2 Gus. Close fight, but a clear victory for Gus


----------



## Rygu

Wow that was ridiculously close. I have a feeling the judges will see it 48-47 Bones though.


----------



## NoYards

FOTY candidate.


----------



## Stun Gun

I think 49-48 for Gus


----------



## Roflcopter

Rusty said:


> 2-2 at best for Gus. I have Jones 3-1 so far.
> 
> Edit: Jon's lips are swollen. Ya don't say lol


1 and 3 at best for Gustaffson.


----------



## Spec0688

I got round 2,4,5 for JBJ. We'll see what the judges score...could go either way.


----------



## Toxic

Sorry Glover no title shot for you


----------



## rallyman

man have no idea

think jones stole it in the last 2 but man the first 3 rounds could go either way.

not the greatest technical fight but pretty dam good entertainment either way


----------



## TheAuger

Ii think we are going to have a split decision with Jones getting the nod.


----------



## 420atalon

Dang it, Jones probably should get the nod. All because of his stupid spinning elbow...


----------



## Terror Kovenant

There is absolutely no way Jones should win this fight. Gus was better all night. Anything else is a robbery


----------



## Rusty

Shit storm incoming no matter the result.


----------



## Shoegazer

Jones 48-47


----------



## Ape City

I see it 3 rounds to 2 for Gus.


----------



## Rygu

Rusty said:


> Shit storm incoming no matter the result.


True words spoken.


----------



## Beeg

Rusty said:


> Shit storm incoming no matter the result.


Word.


----------



## 420atalon

Judges for karma sake please award Gus the fight.


----------



## Ape City

then again I am drunk now and emotional....but ya...I think gus ...


----------



## suniis

Noooooooooo!


----------



## cdtcpl

I think the judges got it right.


----------



## Rygu

Ugh I knew it.


----------



## UFC_OWNS

******* predictable bullshit


----------



## Terror Kovenant

One of the worst robberies in ufc history.


----------



## Roflcopter

Yep.

Wasn't worried about the decision.

Judges haven't been that bad in title fights actually recently.


----------



## 420atalon

, I can't wait for the rematch after Gus wins a couple more fights.


----------



## AJClark

bullshit bullshit bullshit.

They just wanted to gift him a record... Jones absolutely lost that fight


----------



## BOOM

Unanimous?


----------



## rallyman

wouldn't have disagreed either way but 49-46, must have watched a different fight


----------



## Guy Incognito

Jones won a close fight? well that is a straight up ROBBERY!!!!!


----------



## M.C

As I said, could go either way, good stuff.


----------



## Roflcopter

That was the best judged fight since the Aldo-Edgar fight that people deluded themselves into thinking was close.


----------



## UFC_OWNS

no way jones outstruck gus


----------



## Terror Kovenant

Judging is ruining MMA. Gus is the true champion. Cant let Jones lose before the gatorade sponsorship kicks in


----------



## XxDEATHSHEADxX

Rigged


----------



## Roflcopter

rallyman said:


> wouldn't have disagreed either way but 49-46, must have watched a different fight



I had Gustaffson only winning round 3.


Round 1 could've went to Gus despite being outstruck for most of the round I guess.


----------



## rabakill

Roflcopter said:


> That was the best judged fight since the Aldo-Edgar fight that people deluded themselves into thinking was close.


dude, go away


----------



## 420atalon

Terror Kovenant said:


> One of the worst robberies in ufc history.


I wanted Gus to win and this was far from a robbery. Jones should have got the 2nd round and then stole back the 4th round with his spinning elbow. 5th round Gus was just trying to survive.

If Jones hadn't of landed that spinning elbow we most certainly would have been looking at a new LHW champion.


----------



## cdtcpl

Wow, the fighter you wanted to win didn't so any decision must be rigged, or bad judging, etc? While I don't agree with a 49-46, I think the judges got it right. Jones really put it to Gus in the last 2 rounds and I think he won the second round.


----------



## Stapler

How can any of you call this a robbery considering how nearly everyone on this forum scored it differently? Most of you have a different score card, even if you agree with the overall winner. It was a close fight, hardly a robbery.


----------



## anderton46

Roflcopter said:


> That was the best judged fight since the Aldo-Edgar fight that people deluded themselves into thinking was close.


Kick to knee > Jab to body/face left hook combo clearly. IMO was an obvious 48-47 with Guf taking first 3, and Jones taking the last 2. You could argue jones gets a 10-8 round in the 4th. so a draw at best for Jones.


----------



## Roflcopter

UFC_OWNS said:


> no way jones outstruck gus


He did in rounds 1, 2 and 5.

Go the shit kicked out of him and round 4 honestly but Jones won it on damage.


----------



## cdtcpl

Roflcopter said:


> He did in rounds 1, 2 and 5.
> 
> Go the shit kicked out of him and round 4 honestly but Jones won it on damage.


Round 5? You mean the round where Gus was holding his sides just trying anything to stay standing up?


----------



## Roki977

Great fight. But 3:0 not even close.Very close fight and great performance by Gustafsson. Rematch I hope soon. Gustafsson deserves it.


----------



## Terror Kovenant

Roflcopter said:


> He did in rounds 1, 2 and 5.
> 
> Go the shit kicked out of him and round 4 honestly but Jones won it on damage.


Jones was outstruck in the first 3 rounds easily. Those little kicks to the thigh did no damage while Gus was destroying him in the boxing department. 


Also, a close fight can still have a clear absolute winner, which should have been Gus


----------



## UFC_OWNS

Roflcopter said:


> He did in rounds 1, 2 and 5.
> 
> Go the shit kicked out of him and round 4 honestly but Jones won it on damage.


None of those kick strikes were cleanly and effectively landed. And round 1 was pretty even but gus also took him down. Gus outboxed him easy


----------



## PheelGoodInc

I had 1-3 for Gustaf. 4 and 5 pretty obvious for Jones. Far from a robbery... but I thought it was pretty clear Gustaf won it.


----------



## Roflcopter

anderton46 said:


> Kick to knee > Jab to body/face left hook combo clearly. IMO was an obvious 48-47 with Guf taking first 3, and Jones taking the last 2. You could argue jones gets a 10-8 round in the 4th. so a draw at best for Jones.



Gus didn't start jabbing the body until the third round....

In the 2nd Jones slipped almost every punch.

In the first only the takedown really could've swayed the round.


Jones landed a shit ton of body kicks, spinning back kick and elbows in tight...and clean head kicks. He landed at least 3 in round 2.

However I don't take this board seriously in terms of scoring fights. Most are laughably uneducated and half-blind.

I'd take Cecil Peoples over most of the people on this board when it comes to striking exchanges.


----------



## No_Mercy

I got the fight I wanted to see. But I must say Gustaf's heart gave out on em in the 4th and 5th. I don't think he wanted it bad enough. It looked like he turned into survival mode. His trainers should have drilled it in his head that the last five minutes would define the rest of his career. 

LHW title holder showed determination even while getting busted up and taken down. 

Easily FOTN!


----------



## Ddog0587

Jones is def injured. Hope its not serious.


----------



## 420atalon

Roflcopter said:


> He did in rounds 1, 2 and 5.
> 
> Go the shit kicked out of him and round 4 honestly but Jones won it on damage.


Not round 1. Round 2 he got it just based on a few flashy kicks, other then those kicks he had nothing for Gus but Gus just couldn't capitalize enough.

I was so sad when Jones landed that spinning elbow in the 4th round. Gus was just starting to turn it up and take over the fight then boom momentum change.

As I said earlier I can't wait to see a rematch between these guys. Hopefully Gus can string together a couple quick wins and get himself lined up for another shot right away.


----------



## HorsepoweR

Gus won that fight. Disgraceful. 49-46? Really? **** the judging man, I'm so ****in pissed right now. Gus beat that ass.


----------



## anderton46

Roflcopter said:


> Gus didn't start jabbing the body until the third round....
> 
> In the 2nd Jones slipped almost every punch.
> 
> In the first only the takedown really could've swayed the round.
> 
> 
> Jones landed a shit ton of body kicks, spinning back kick and elbows in tight...and clean head kicks. He landed at least 3 in round 2.
> 
> However I don't take this board seriously in terms of scoring fights. Most are laughably uneducated and half-blind.
> 
> I'd take Cecil Peoples over most of the people on this board when it comes to striking exchanges.



If he does a spin, it counts as double!


----------



## khoveraki

Really bad decision by any judging criteria. Gus kept it standing(octagon control), constantly attacked (aggression). imposed his will and gameplan (effectiveness), outstruck Jones, and did more physical damage.


----------



## Roflcopter

Unsuprisingly pretty much everyone on a boxing forum Im posting at agrees Jones won the fight.

I guess actually watching a sport where you need an attention span and have to actually see which punches are landing or not gives you better eyes for these sort of things.


Not to mention the amazing hatewagon for Jones doesn't exist there..so there's that.


----------



## cdtcpl

Ddog0587 said:


> Jones is def injured. Hope its not serious.


I think it is probably his legs hurting from all the kicks. I think it was after the rampage fight he was in a wheelchair with bags of ice on his legs.


----------



## Roflcopter

420atalon said:


> Not round 1. Round 2 he got it just based on a few flashy kicks, other then those kicks he had nothing for Gus but Gus just couldn't capitalize enough.
> 
> I was so sad when Jones landed that spinning elbow in the 4th round. Gus was just starting to turn it up and take over the fight then boom momentum change.
> 
> As I said earlier I can't wait to see a rematch between these guys. Hopefully Gus can string together a couple quick wins and get himself lined up for another shot right away.


Flashy kicks?

You mean hard kicks that clearly landed?

As opposed to what, grazing right hands over the top? Gus didn't start to land cleanly until rounds 3 and 4...Jones looked very comfortable in round 2.


----------



## Dtwizzy2k5

I gave it to Bones 48-47 by winning rounds 2, 4, and 5. It was very close though and I could understand having Gus win the fight, but I won't argue with the judges scoring.


----------



## AlphaDawg

That's some bullshit right there. Gus won the first three rounds and should be champ right now. I'd love to hear the judge defend his 49-46 score. Ridiculous.


----------



## Iuanes

One of the best fights I've ever seen, probably the highest level fight at light heavyweight.

Impressed with both fighhters. Gus came prepared. Jones showed he had the will to pull through.

I think Jone hurt Gustafsson more, had him in more trouble.

**** scoring. Jones deserves the belt, just barely. And trust me, I don't like saying that.


----------



## Prolific

I had it 3 rounds to 2 for gus. I would really like to see an immediate rematch and i think it proves that jones reach advantage(and how he employs it) is one of his defining traits. His error of invincibility to me dimmed a little tonight but he works hard and is the Champ for a reason but i dont believe he won that fight. And im a huge Bones fan. How Gus preformed i have to eat some crow i never really thought he was that good, probably because of his akward style doesnt really translate as a dominant fighter but how he preformed and acted so gracious in a defeat was amazing. But i think going forward your gonna see a Jon Jones more focused on wrestling. Like a GSP after he lost to Matt Sera.


----------



## Shoegazer

Dtwizzy2k5 said:


> I gave it to Bones 48-47 by winning rounds 2, 4, and 5. It was very close though and I could understand having Gus win the fight, but I won't argue with the judges scoring.


Exactly the way I saw it.


----------



## UFC_OWNS

Roflcopter said:


> Unsuprisingly pretty much everyone on a boxing forum Im posting at agrees Jones won the fight.
> 
> I guess actually watching a sport where you need an attention span and have to actually see which punches are landing or not gives you better eyes for these sort of things.
> 
> 
> Not to mention the amazing hatewagon for Jones doesn't exist there..so there's that.


Yeah bullshit, boxing fans are retards, they still think pacman is gonna whoop floyd. Boxing fans know even less about MMA. Ironic what you say lands and doesnt when most of jone's stuff didnt land decent until the 4th round


----------



## 420atalon

No_Mercy said:


> I got the fight I wanted to see. But I must say Gustaf's heart gave out on em in the 4th and 5th. I don't think he wanted it bad enough. It looked like he turned into survival mode. His trainers should have drilled it in his head that the last five minutes would define the rest of his career.
> 
> LHW title holder showed determination even while getting busted up and taken down.
> 
> Easily FOTN!


Had nothing to do with heart. That elbow swayed the fight plain and simple. Gus was already tired and that elbow rocked him hard. That tired and hurt it is hard to make a full recovery.


----------



## St.Paul Guy

Gus hit Bones in the face about 100 times more than Bones hit him in the face and defended 11/12 takedowns while landing two of his own. None of that is even debatable. 

I'm going to have to rewatch rounds 1-3, but I had Gus winning all of them by a fair margin.


----------



## PheelGoodInc

Roflcopter said:


> Unsuprisingly pretty much everyone on a boxing forum Im posting at agrees Jones won the fight.
> 
> I guess actually watching a sport where you need an attention span and have to actually see which punches are landing or not gives you better eyes for these sort of things.
> 
> 
> Not to mention the amazing hatewagon for Jones doesn't exist there..so there's that.


I'm guessing you never get sick of looking at yourself in the mirror either. The amount of self righteous bullshit you spew on this board hits a new high every fight.

I consider myself more of a Jones fan than Gustaf... but I had Gustaf winning.

Also, you think because boxing fans scored an MMA fight it must be accurate? :laugh: That's gold man... pure gold.

Oh yeah, and one of the best scored fights since Aldo Edgar with one judge scoring it 49/46 :laugh: Oh man


----------



## Roki977

I dont mind that Jones won. He looked stronger and more dangerous in last two rounds but it is far from 3:0 and mind that or 49:46, wtf..


----------



## Terror Kovenant

Roflcopter said:


> Unsuprisingly pretty much everyone on a boxing forum Im posting at agrees Jones won the fight.
> 
> I guess actually watching a sport where you need an attention span and have to actually see which punches are landing or not gives you better eyes for these sort of things.
> 
> 
> Not to mention the amazing hatewagon for Jones doesn't exist there..so there's that.


Cool, maybe you and your high horse will fit in better over there, where as people who care more about MMA and less about trolling can remain here.


----------



## BOOM

Roflcopter said:


> Unsuprisingly pretty much everyone on a boxing forum Im posting at agrees Jones won the fight.
> 
> I guess actually watching a sport where you need an attention span and have to actually see which punches are landing or not gives you better eyes for these sort of things.
> 
> 
> Not to mention the amazing hatewagon for Jones doesn't exist there..so there's that.


I'm actually a big Jones fan and I can admit he should have lost tonight.


----------



## M.C

I had Jones winning 4 and 5, and then there was a round either 2 or 3 (can't remember which) that was extremely close and I thought that they would prob give it to Jones.

So overall I thought Jones edged it, but it was so close that I could have seen it going to either guy.

Impressive fight, wish all fights were like that.


----------



## King Daisuke

I thought Gus clearly won the first 3 rounds. Anyway, Jones wasn't that dominant fighting someone his own size, was he?


----------



## Roflcopter

khoveraki said:


> Really bad decision by any judging criteria. Gus kept it standing(octagon control), constantly attacked (aggression). imposed his will and gameplan (effectiveness), outstruck Jones, and did more physical damage.



This is pretty much exhibit A on why MMA forum goers have laughable opinions on judging.


Gus literally went for more failed takedowns than Jones in the first 3 rounds of the fight...Jones didn't start shooting a lot until getting lit up in the 4th before the elbow.

Secondly, it's a garbage criteria all around and not heavily weighed by the rules, but giving up the center of the cage like Gus did all night is considered losing in octagon control.

Not even going to address the rest of the garbage.


----------



## marcthegame

Really close fight, I thought Gus won, however it's interesting to see Jones vs someone with the same physical gifts. Brings up the question how would phil davis do in there.


----------



## taz1458

I'm OK with the decision even though I personally thought Gus won, but 49-46 Jones? How the hell? 

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Life B Ez

No hail mary spinning elbow and Gus is the new champ.

Gus should get a rematch after Glover. He boxed Jones up the whole fight. Gave Gus 1,3 and maybe 2 need to watch it again. Either way Jon looked uncomfortable and slow the whole fight. I'd take Gus in a rematch.

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Calminian

One things for sure. GSP is the best p4p fighter in mma today.


----------



## cdtcpl

St.Paul Guy said:


> Gus hit Bones in the face about 100 times more than Bones hit him in the face and defended 11/12 takedowns while landing two of his own. None of that is even debatable.
> 
> I'm going to have to rewatch rounds 1-3, but I had Gus winning all of them by a fair margin.


Rewatch the second round. While Gus threw a lot, very little landed. So you have Bones who is landing his kicks and those two head kicks. It was a close round, but I think it was pretty easy to see why Jones won it. Round 1 & 3 were clearly Gus though.


----------



## Roflcopter

UFC_OWNS said:


> Yeah bullshit, boxing fans are retards, they still think pacman is gonna whoop floyd. Boxing fans know even less about MMA. Ironic what you say lands and doesnt when most of jone's stuff didnt land decent until the 4th round



No. Casual boxing fans think that. You don't know the difference because of the sort of people you surround yourself with in discussion.


----------



## UFC_OWNS

marcthegame said:


> Really close fight, I thought Gus won, however it's interesting to see Jones vs someone with the same physical gifts. Brings up the question how would phil davis do in there.


davis can't strike so he owuld be massacred.


----------



## 420atalon

UFC_OWNS said:


> Yeah bullshit, boxing fans are retards, they still think pacman is gonna whoop floyd. Boxing fans know even less about MMA. Ironic what you say lands and doesnt when most of jone's stuff didnt land decent until the 4th round


Not sure why he resorted to a boxing forum...

Sherdog, mmajunkie, mmafighting, bloody elbow all scored the fight for Jones. He obviously took the 4th and 5th rounds and did just enough in the 2nd.


----------



## King Daisuke

khoveraki said:


> Really bad decision by any judging criteria. Gus kept it standing(octagon control), constantly attacked (aggression). imposed his will and gameplan (effectiveness), outstruck Jones, and did more physical damage.


This.


----------



## No_Mercy

420atalon said:


> Had nothing to do with heart. That elbow swayed the fight plain and simple. Gus was already tired and that elbow rocked him hard. That tired and hurt it is hard to make a full recovery.


True, but I'm willing to bet if he had a strong finish he could have won it. Huerta got hurt against Guida and finished, Edgar vs Maynard II, hell even Browne vs Overeem.

Gus was winning the exchanges when he pushed forward. The moment he went backwards and allowed spacing the LHW title holder was able to land his kicks at will. Alex came inches away from winning. The look on his face showed it all. He didn't want it...BAD ENOUGH. 

The LHW title holder kept pressing forward so ya gotta give em props and he tried to finish. Gus never tried to finish once. 

Great fight nonetheless.


----------



## Rusty

Rusty said:


> Shit storm incoming no matter the result.


I had it scored 3-1 after the 4th rd for Jones. The first three were close and it was a great fight altogether but I still had Jon ahead. My buddy who is new to the game thought it was a robbery. He's a cracker though.

Edit: ROFL is an asshole but he knows his shit. Imo some of the most knowledgeable people on this site happen to be dickheads but they shouldn't get the hate they do. Good call copter.


----------



## UFC_OWNS

Roflcopter said:


> No. Casual boxing fans think that. You don't know the difference because of the sort of people you surround yourself with in discussion.


yeah ok, should I call you emanuel steward since you think you know everything about striking and what does and doesn't land. Did you score machida vs shogun for machida too? probably


----------



## marcthegame

UFC_OWNS said:


> davis can't strike so he owuld be massacred.


But he can wrestle,can take jones down and stop his td?


----------



## 420atalon

Calminian said:


> One things for sure. GSP is the best p4p fighter in mma today.


True, he is about to face what may be his toughest test to date as well though.


----------



## HorsepoweR

Roflcopter said:


> This is pretty much exhibit A on why MMA forum goers have laughable opinions on judging.
> 
> 
> Gus literally went for more failed takedowns than Jones in the first 3 rounds of the fight...Jones didn't start shooting a lot until getting lit up in the 4th before the elbow.
> 
> Secondly, it's a garbage criteria all around and not heavily weighed by the rules, but giving up the center of the cage like Gus did all night is considered losing in octagon control.
> 
> Not even going to address the rest of the garbage.



That's because Jones realized he wasn't taking Gus down. Then he realized he's getting his ass beat and getting tired as **** and needs to go to the ground.


----------



## lights out 24

Boy was I ever wrong! Lol! Great fight! Bones pulled it off in the end.


----------



## americanfighter

what people need to remember is that this was an extremely close fight that could go either way and nobody really beat the other and when that happens the win always goes to the champ. To become the new champ you have to decisively beat champ and there has to be no question. The Judges will always favor the champs in close fights like this.

some don't like it but I guess its a good luxury that you earn for being champ and it makes sure that you have to truly without a doubt be the better fighter to dethrone the champ.


----------



## Ape City

Ya im cool with the decision overall. I always need to rewatch big fights because i get rly emotional during them. Was slammi g in my desk and yelling a lot during this one haha. I still think gus took it but i see how jones could have taken it too. Very close and extremely entertaining fight. Jones now looks way less invincible...

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Roflcopter

PheelGoodInc said:


> I'm guessing you never get sick of looking at yourself in the mirror either. The amount of self righteous bullshit you spew on this board hits a new high every fight.
> 
> I consider myself more of a Jones fan than Gustaf... but I had Gustaf winning.
> 
> Also, you think because boxing fans scored an MMA fight it must be accurate? :laugh: That's gold man... pure gold.
> 
> Oh yeah, and one of the best scored fights since Aldo Edgar with one judge scoring it 49/46 :laugh: Oh man




I had Aldo Edgar 49-46 as well.

Pretty accurate card considering Edgar got his ass handed to him.


Round 2 wasn't even close..I was literally laughing to myself that so many blind mice scored it for Gustaffson..it's like they have an utter inability to see Jones moves his head out of the way or block with his arms.


And people wonder why Leonard Garcia won so many fights.

Embarrassing.


----------



## Terror Kovenant

Jones had to be carried from the cage and limped his way backstage with a busted face. Gus walked out just fine. Its clear who the real winner is and who has the advantage in the rematch.


----------



## UFC_OWNS

marcthegame said:


> But he can wrestle,can take jones down and stop his td?


Well davis is one dimensional though so jones would expect the shot, gus is a striker so its unpredictable with him.


----------



## cdtcpl

marcthegame said:


> But he can wrestle,can take jones down and stop his td?


I think it was more to do with Jones making the same mistake Fitch made against BJ in thinking that they would never attempt a takedown. Against a wrestler, like against Rashad, he is a little lower and more prepared for the shot. I think he could stop PD just because he would expect it all fight long.


----------



## oldfan

PheelGoodInc said:


> I'm guessing you never get sick of looking at yourself in the mirror either. The amount of self righteous bullshit you spew on this board hits a new high every fight.
> 
> I consider myself more of a Jones fan than Gustaf... but I had Gustaf winning.
> 
> Also, you think because boxing fans scored an MMA fight it must be accurate? :laugh: That's gold man... pure gold.
> 
> Oh yeah, and one of the best scored fights since Aldo Edgar with one judge scoring it 49/46 :laugh: Oh man


He doesn't know shit about boxing either. what he knows is forums. he's an expert poster.:laugh:


----------



## TheGreg

I had 1 and 3 going to Gustafsson, 4 and 5 going to Jones and thought 2 could have gone either way. I wouldn't say this was an outrage, but I felt like if I were judging the fight as a whole I would have given it to Gustafsson. But That's not how this game works!

Unreal barn burner of a fight tho.


----------



## 420atalon

No_Mercy said:


> True, but I'm willing to bet if he had a strong finish he could have won it. Huerta got hurt against Guida and finished, Edgar vs Maynard II, hell even Browne vs Overeem.
> 
> Gus was winning the exchanges when he pushed forward. The moment he went backwards and allowed spacing the LHW title holder was able to land his kicks at will. Alex came inches away from winning. The look on his face showed it all. He didn't want it...BAD ENOUGH.
> 
> The LHW title holder kept pressing forward so ya gotta give em props and he tried to finish. Gus never tried to finish once.
> 
> Great fight nonetheless.


Getting hurt early when you are still fresh is a lot easier to come back from then getting hurt when you are already pretty much out of gas.

Gus started slowing down in the 3rd round and by the 4th round was obviously running out of gas. Gus being so tired is probably the only reason Jon was able to land the elbow. 

In the rematch Gus needs to conserve his energy a little better. I know it is kind of his style to be all bouncy but he was overly active in the first couple rounds due to jitters I believe.


----------



## Roflcopter

Remember when Condit whitewashed Rory and Rogan and the MMA plebs acted like Rory outstruck him with all of his murderous right hands to the shoulder? :laugh:


Remember when Rampage beat the shit out of Griffin for 4 rounds and Forrest won with an occasional slap to the leg? :laugh:



Terror Kovenant said:


> Jones had to be carried from the cage and limped his way backstage with a busted face. Gus walked out just fine. Its clear who the real winner is and who has the advantage in the rematch.


Yeah man, Gustaffson clearly didn't have a huge cut on his face.


----------



## cdtcpl

Terror Kovenant said:


> Jones had to be carried from the cage and limped his way backstage with a busted face. Gus walked out just fine. Its clear who the real winner is and who has the advantage in the rematch.


Yeah Jones won, clearly. He has the belt. As for why he is being carried, you kick someone in the head a dozen times and tell me your legs don't hurt.

In a rematch, I would still pick Jones, but I wouldn't be so naive to think he is going to just walk through Gus like I did this time.


----------



## Ape City

This fight was also a really good example of how far mma has come. The skillset here demonstrated how different stand up mma is to boxing, as jones u orthadox strikes triumphed. Also i was very impressed woth both of these athletes cardio. These are big guys, and for 20 minutes they kept up an intense pace. Neither gassed until round 5...which for a lhw must be a record.

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Terror Kovenant

Roflcopter said:


> Remember when Rampage beat the shit out of Griffin for 4 rounds and Forrest won with an occasional slap to the leg? :laugh:


No I remember Forrest landing more strikes, outworking, outfighting, pushing the pace, landing TDs, sub attempts, and some great knees to Rampage's face...while getting dropped once. Only Rampage thinks he can win a 5 round fight based around one punch.


----------



## SideWays222

In pride id give it to Jones but in the UFC i think Gus took 3 rounds to 2.

Stuffing takedowns needs to be scored a bit more. When someone gets a takedown it completely swayes the score cards even when alot of the time they dont do anything with the takedown. Shouldnt stopping a takedown count for dictating where the fight takes place atleast??


----------



## UFC_OWNS

Roflcopter said:


> Remember when Condit whitewashed Rory and Rogan and the MMA plebs acted like Rory outstruck him with all of his murderous right hands to the shoulder? :laugh:
> 
> 
> Remember when Rampage beat the shit out of Griffin for 4 rounds and Forrest won with an occasional slap to the leg? :laugh:


haha yeah remember when I was the first one on this forum to debunk the rory smashed condit until the finished theory? well I do. Oh rampage beat the shit out of griffin all right :laugh:


----------



## hixxy

I had Gus winning 3 rounds to 2. At WORST it was a draw.


----------



## Roflcopter

SHERDOG SCORES
TJ De Santis scores the round 10-9 Jones (48-47 Jones)
Chris Nelson scores the round 10-9 Jones (48-47 Jones)
Mike Whitman scores the round 10-9 Jones (49-46 Jones)


Pretty accurate...Whiteman's third to Jones was dubious though.


----------



## Roki977

King Daisuke said:


> I thought Gus clearly won the first 3 rounds. Anyway, Jones wasn't that dominant fighting someone his own size, was he?


 I agree. His face would be much more busted if he is smaller and big chunk off his dominance is because his size. We saw that now. And Gusaf is smller than him with shorter range. I hate Jones open fist and fingers in your face style. He wasnt using it this time as he couldnt but I hate that.


----------



## Roflcopter

SideWays222 said:


> In pride id give it to Jones but in the UFC i think Gus took 3 rounds to 2.
> 
> Stuffing takedowns needs to be scored a bit more. When someone gets a takedown it completely swayes the score cards even when alot of the time they dont do anything with the takedown. Shouldnt stopping a takedown count for dictating where the fight takes place atleast??


It's not scored at all as it does not constitute offense in any way.


----------



## cdtcpl

Ape City said:


> This fight was also a really good example of how far mma has come. The skillset here demonstrated how different stand up mma is to boxing, as jones u orthadox strikes triumphed. Also i was very impressed woth both of these athletes cardio. These are big guys, and for 20 minutes they kept up an intense pace. Neither gassed until round 5...which for a lhw must be a record.
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


Very true on both points.


----------



## Ape City

Roflcopter said:


> I had Aldo Edgar 49-46 as well.
> 
> Pretty accurate card considering Edgar got his ass handed to him.
> 
> 
> Round 2 wasn't even close..I was literally laughing to myself that so many blind mice scored it for Gustaffson..it's like they have an utter inability to see Jones moves his head out of the way or block with his arms.
> 
> 
> And people wonder why Leonard Garcia won so many fights.
> 
> Embarrassing.


For me round 4 was the quesrionable one. i had 2 and 5 def for jones and 1 and 3 def for gus.

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Roflcopter

Terror Kovenant said:


> No I remember Forrest landing more strikes, outworking, outfighting, pushing the pace, landing TDs, sub attempts, and some great knees to Rampage's face...while getting dropped once. Only Rampage thinks he can win a 5 round fight based around one punch.


Griffin is probably the first person in MMA history to win a fight while getting hurt with nearly every punch.

But clean effective strikes isn't a concept in MMA apparently....

If you throw and it somewhat landed apparently it's as valuable as a clean straight right hand to the face or a hard body kick unchecked to the ribs. 

MMA striking scoring. :laugh:


At least the people who matter haven't been ******* it up recently.


----------



## Guy Incognito

Terror Kovenant said:


> No I remember Forrest landing more strikes, outworking, outfighting, pushing the pace, landing TDs, sub attempts, and some great knees to Rampage's face...while getting dropped once. Only Rampage thinks he can win a 5 round fight based around one punch.


----------



## Terror Kovenant

cdtcpl said:


> Yeah Jones won, clearly. He has the belt. As for why he is being carried, you kick someone in the head a dozen times and tell me your legs don't hurt.
> 
> In a rematch, I would still pick Jones, but I wouldn't be so naive to think he is going to just walk through Gus like I did this time.


Yeah, Lenard Garcia clearly beat KZ the first time. 
He also clearly beat Phan
Same with Machida 
And Bradley over Pacman. 
Receiving a gift from the judges doesn't make you a winner. 

Only Jones could kick someone in the head a dozen times and never hurt them.


----------



## No_Mercy

420atalon said:


> Getting hurt early when you are still fresh is a lot easier to come back from then getting hurt when you are already pretty much out of gas.
> 
> Gus started slowing down in the 3rd round and by the 4th round was obviously running out of gas. Gus being so tired is probably the only reason Jon was able to land the elbow.
> 
> In the rematch Gus needs to conserve his energy a little better. I know it is kind of his style to be all bouncy but he was overly active in the first couple rounds due to jitters I believe.


He was doing so damn well. Busted both of his eyes and lips. He just didn't go for it and throw combinations which he's very capable of doing. It's obvious he trained, but being tired in a five round CHAMPIONSHIP FIGHT. This could have changed his entire career. Everytime he pressed forward Gustaf did well then he'd revert to running back and losing position. Why continue running, LHW title holder slowly pressed forward and obviously had more in his gas tank. 

Again I think it was a fallacy. It was within grasp. He'll look back and realize it.

Glover is next. I'm sure he saw something that he can utilize. Can he overcome the reach though.


----------



## SideWays222

Roflcopter said:


> It's not scored at all as it does not constitute offense in any way.


What are you talking about. Dictating where the fight takes place is part of the scoring. And it constitutes plenty of Offense. If you take me down i cant punch you in the face (not hard atleast) and il be on defense but if i stuff your takedown then i can continue punching you in the face standing and be on the offense.


----------



## rabakill

Roflcopter, I scored it for Jones but man you are driving me nuts. I've never seen a more indignant poor sport in my life, give it a rest dude.


----------



## PheelGoodInc

Roflcopter said:


> I had Aldo Edgar 49-46 as well.
> 
> Pretty accurate card considering Edgar got his ass handed to him.
> 
> 
> Round 2 wasn't even close..I was literally laughing to myself that so many blind mice scored it for Gustaffson..it's like they have an utter inability to see Jones moves his head out of the way or block with his arms.
> 
> 
> And people wonder why Leonard Garcia won so many fights.
> 
> Embarrassing.


I wasn't talking about the Aldo Edgar fight genius. I was talking about this one. Such a great scoring job with one of the judges scoring 49/46. I don't mind it went to Jones. I could easily see it. I had it for Gustaf. The issue here is you and your arrogance about how stupid you think people on this board are... yet you still post here regularly.


----------



## jonnyg4508

Was a very good fight.

Guss clearly won the fight. 

What a shame.


----------



## The Best Around

Excellent fight. I had Jones either 48-47 or 49-46, probably 48-47. Crazy he maybe wouldnt be champion if it wasnt for that late flurry in round four. Fight of the year.


----------



## Life B Ez

I hope this goes the way of Machida v Shogun.

Fight was way too close to call, could have gone either. Hence my above statement.

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Terror Kovenant

Guy Incognito said:


> Nicholas cage


Cute and intelligent response, thanks for participating. Laugh all you want, what I said was completely accurate.


----------



## 420atalon

SideWays222 said:


> In pride id give it to Jones but in the UFC i think Gus took 3 rounds to 2.
> 
> Stuffing takedowns needs to be scored a bit more. When someone gets a takedown it completely swayes the score cards even when alot of the time they dont do anything with the takedown. Shouldnt stopping a takedown count for dictating where the fight takes place atleast??


You can't really count stuffing a takedown as points. You aren't doing any damage, you are just avoiding damage.

It is like dodging a punch. You shouldn't get points for dodging a punch but it should negate the value of the punch.

Stopping a takedown could score towards octagon control but Gus wasn't doing enough after the takedown attempt. He was continuously backing up while Jones for the most part brought the fight to him.

I think the judges got it right unfortunately. Lots here including myself wanted to see Jones lose but you can't let that cloud your judgement.


----------



## cdtcpl

Terror Kovenant said:


> Yeah, Lenard Garcia clearly beat KZ the first time.
> He also clearly beat Phan
> Same with Machida
> And Bradley over Pacman.
> Receiving a gift from the judges doesn't make you a winner.
> 
> Only Jones could kick someone in the head a dozen times and never hurt them.


True, Jones does seem to lack KO power, but Gus didn't seem to enjoy them either, so there's that.

There have been some clear robberies in the MMA world, tonights fight was not one of them. I posted right before they read the decision that it would be a close one and could go either way. The only way it would be a robbery is if someone got a 50-45 (I don't agree with the 49-46).

I was surprised that it wasn't a SD, this is the sort of fight where we usually get one judge seeing it as a 48-47 the other way.


----------



## Notoriousxpinoy

Wow.. I actually bet money on Jones winning and I literally felt wrong taking the money from my friend. I had Gus winning the first 3 with the 5th round being close. I dont get MMA scoring sometimes.

Gus had octagon control(stuffed all the takedowns but 1) and he got up from that one takedown fairly fast. I'm at a lost why even a judge scored it 49-46.

Jon Jones striking looked exposed there. A bit sloppy and it showed.


----------



## Life B Ez

So Jones isn't as impressive not fighting middleweights and old men. I was shocked how easily Gus shrugged off Jones so many times.

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


----------



## Terror Kovenant

cdtcpl said:


> True, Jones does seem to lack KO power, but Gus didn't seem to enjoy them either, so there's that.
> 
> There have been some clear robberies in the MMA world, tonights fight was not one of them. I posted right before they read the decision that it would be a close one and could go either way. The only way it would be a robbery is if someone got a 50-45 (I don't agree with the 49-46).
> 
> I was surprised that it wasn't a SD, this is the sort of fight where we usually get one judge seeing it as a 48-47 the other way.


Well no one is going to like them, but headkicks can be devastating. Either Gus's chin puts Hendo to shame, or Jones has Jake Shield's hands for legs. 

50-45 for either fighter wouldn't have been a robbery, it would have been an atrocity. It was close, absolutely. However there is a clear victor in the damage and control department and should have been 3 rounds to 2 for Gus. Close can still be clear.


----------



## rabakill

Terror Kovenant said:


> Well no one is going to like them, but headkicks can be devastating. Either Gus's chin puts Hendo to shame, or Jones has Jake Shield's hands for legs.
> 
> 50-45 for either fighter wouldn't have been a robbery, it would have been an atrocity. It was close, absolutely. However there is a clear victor in the damage and control department and should have been 3 rounds to 2 for Gus. Close can still be clear.


the reason he took them so well is he always saw them coming and rolled with them, at the minimum turning his head like Anderson Silva does with people's punches.


----------



## jaycalgary

I can't remember the last time I saw a champ walk away that hurt. The part that makes me sick is to see the champ put on big goofy headphones and probably the Gatorade bottle when this guy really needs a doctor. Obviously just a UFC cash cow that might be circulating the drain with serious injury's.


----------



## cdtcpl

Terror Kovenant said:


> Well no one is going to like them, but headkicks can be devastating. Either Gus's chin puts Hendo to shame, or Jones has Jake Shield's hands for legs.
> 
> 50-45 for either fighter wouldn't have been a robbery, it would have been an atrocity. It was close, absolutely. However there is a clear victor in the damage and control department and should have been 3 rounds to 2 for Gus. Close can still be clear.


Well all 3 judges apparently thought close was clear, just not the way you believe it was. Go rewatch round 2, Gus didn't really land anything and Jones did. It wasn't impressive, but in the round Jones out landed and did more damage. Then round 4 & 5 are pretty easy to see how Jones got the nods for those rounds.


----------



## Terror Kovenant

rabakill said:


> the reason he took them so well is he always saw them coming and rolled with them, at the minimum turning his head like Anderson Silva does with people's punches.


Much harder to do with a shin to the dome than a gloved punch. Shows great skill on his part but damn


----------



## Roflcopter

SideWays222 said:


> What are you talking about. Dictating where the fight takes place is part of the scoring. And it constitutes plenty of Offense. If you take me down i cant punch you in the face (not hard atleast) and il be on defense but if i stuff your takedown then i can continue punching you in the face standing and be on the offense.


Octagon control is a very lowly rated scoring criteria, and rightfully so...it shouldn't even exist.

The only reason I can think of it's existence is to score rounds where one guy is holding the other against the cage the entire time and no actual effective striking and grappling is taking place.


----------



## SideWays222

420atalon said:


> You can't really count stuffing a takedown as points. You aren't doing any damage, you are just avoiding damage.
> 
> It is like dodging a punch. You shouldn't get points for dodging a punch but it should negate the value of the punch.
> 
> Stopping a takedown could score towards octagon control but Gus wasn't doing enough after the takedown attempt. He was continuously backing up while Jones for the most part brought the fight to him.
> 
> I think the judges got it right unfortunately. Lots here including myself wanted to see Jones lose but you can't let that cloud your judgement.


Shooting in for a takedown and holding someone down does not do any damage yet it scores more then just about anything else.

From when does UFC scoring system only go by damage?? Never is when.

And forcing the fight to stay standing is doing a much better job at controlling where the fight takes place and making someone walk back. Plenty of fighters especially counter fighters like walking backwards when standing and do everything they can to lure the other fighter to attack. Anderson Silva does this constantly.


----------



## rabakill

Terror Kovenant said:


> Much harder to do with a shin to the dome than a gloved punch. Shows great skill on his part but damn


it makes a huge difference when you can take a shot right, even with minimal movement.


----------



## Guy Incognito

Only reason why Gus put up a good fight against Jones is because he was the bigger man, he should stop being a coward and man up and go to HW.


----------



## Roflcopter

Life B Ez said:


> So Jones isn't as impressive not fighting middleweights and old men. I was shocked how easily Gus shrugged off Jones so many times.
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


I'm totally with this though.


----------



## Stun Gun

Roflcopter said:


> I had Aldo Edgar 49-46 as well.
> 
> Pretty accurate card considering Edgar got his ass handed to him.
> 
> 
> Round 2 wasn't even close..I was literally laughing to myself that so many blind mice scored it for Gustaffson..it's like they have an utter inability to see Jones moves his head out of the way or block with his arms.
> 
> 
> And people wonder why Leonard Garcia won so many fights.
> 
> Embarrassing.


You seem smart


----------



## cdtcpl

Guy Incognito said:


> Only reason why Gus put up a good fight against Jones is because he was the bigger man, he should stop being a coward and man up and go to HW.


:laugh: Right before the fight started I was wondering why everyone makes that comment about Jones but never says it about Gus since he is bigger.


----------



## Terror Kovenant

cdtcpl said:


> Well all 3 judges apparently thought close was clear, just not the way you believe it was. Go rewatch round 2, Gus didn't really land anything and Jones did. It wasn't impressive, but in the round Jones out landed and did more damage. Then round 4 & 5 are pretty easy to see how Jones got the nods for those rounds.


And judges have made the wrong call on numerous occasion. My argument is that its a bogus leg to stand on with a simple "judges said so" based upon how clear victors have had their wins stolen from them. 

I agree with 4 and 5 for Jones. 1 and 3 for Gus. Does seem like 2 is the one being contested and is the fight decider. I though Gus won it upon first watching, but I'll try to find somewhere to rewatch it


----------



## Roflcopter

420atalon said:


> Not sure why he resorted to a boxing forum...
> 
> Sherdog, mmajunkie, mmafighting, bloody elbow all scored the fight for Jones. He obviously took the 4th and 5th rounds and did just enough in the 2nd.


Because Breen is the only one I trust to score striking exchanges other than boxing guys and he didn't have a score...


Oh and I don't think osmisium was rooting for either guy so he might have a good score here too.



Just checked Twitter Breen had 2, 4 and 5 for Jones. Unsurprisingly.


----------



## cdtcpl

Terror Kovenant said:


> Does seem like 2 is the one being contested and is the fight decider. I though Gus won it upon first watching, but I'll try to find somewhere to rewatch it


Until the first head kick I had the round even and couldn't make a call. After the head kick Jones then lands a couple of elbows while still slipping or catching most of Gus's punches. It wasn't a domination by Jones in that round, but he landed more. I wonder when the compustrike will be available on this fight?


----------



## jonnyg4508

Crowds don't usually boo that loud for nothing. Unless it is some real hometown stuff.


----------



## Stun Gun

I don't get the 49-46 scores people are throwing out there. 

I can understand 48-47 for Jones but not 49-46


----------



## Roflcopter

This is the first time in a while I'm going to rewatch a main event as soon as it's available.

Jon Jones is good for the sport.


----------



## Terror Kovenant

cdtcpl said:


> Until the first head kick I had the round even and couldn't make a call. After the head kick Jones then lands a couple of elbows while still slipping or catching most of Gus's punches. It wasn't a domination by Jones in that round, but he landed more. I wonder when the compustrike will be available on this fight?


I'll definitely rewatch it, I had Gus winning on pressing the action and landing more. 

Also thanks for engaging in polite oppositional discussion instead of some of the other lunacy and immaturity by a few select high and mighty users here.


----------



## 420atalon

SideWays222 said:


> Shooting in for a takedown and holding someone down does not do any damage yet it scores more then just about anything else.
> 
> From when does UFC scoring system only go by damage?? Never is when.


Shooting in for takedown doesn't score. Just like defending a takedown doesn't score.

What does score is what happens after the takedown or after the takedown defense.

After most of the takedown attempts by Jones Gus was backing away if not flat out running away from Jones. He wasn't doing anything to in any way hurt Jones. He was just fighting smart and avoiding being taken down and hurt.

This fight only had striking, 2 takedowns and octagon control/aggression to score on. 

The first round Gus got the better of the striking and landed a takedown winning him the round.

The second round Gus wasn't as effective with his striking. Jones was avoiding many of his strikes and was doing some damage with his kicks. Overall it was a pretty close and uneventful round but Jones did just enough to take it.

Third round Gus started landing a little better and figured out how to negate Jones' kicks winning him the round.

4th round Gus was turning it on and starting to take control. Jones clawed his way back into it and then landed a crushing elbow and nearly was able to get the stoppage.

5th round Gus was tired and still feeling effects of elbow. He did ok but Jones got a takedown which Gus used up all of his remaining effort to stand up from. Gus spent the rest of the round just trying to survive. 

This fight was very easy to score outside of the 2nd round. I think a lot of people after rewatching it closely will notice that Jones did just enough to win that round.

And all this is coming from a guy that wanted Gus to win and bet on Gus to win...


----------



## Stun Gun

Jones was take to the hospital on a stretcher Ariel just tweeted


----------



## Roflcopter

Stun Gun said:


> I don't get the 49-46 scores people are throwing out there.
> 
> I can understand 48-47 for Jones but not 49-46


Because I didn't care about that takedown in the first round and thought Jones was more effective in his striking.


Hell, the cut on Jones was caused by a grazing shot and was verified on replay to be grazing. You don't just score that as a general punch and act like that constitutes outstriking someone.

I'll take a clean body kick over a grazing right any day of the weak.


----------



## jaycalgary

cant wait to see the post fight


----------



## cdtcpl

Both Gus and Jones going to the hospital post fight.....damn what a war!

And DW teasing a rematch.....


----------



## jaycalgary

they both went to the hospital and didn't make it to the post fight


----------



## cdtcpl

cdtcpl said:


> And DW teasing a rematch.....


And he is already backing down from that comment :laugh:


----------



## Roflcopter

No post fight presser...darn


----------



## UFC_OWNS

Roflcopter said:


> No post fight presser...darn


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNqjBEnxnQc


----------



## cdtcpl

http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2013/9/2...-post-fight-press-conference-video/in/4521481


----------



## Terror Kovenant

> Jones was loaded into a stretcher and is presumably being taken to the hospital. Far worse shape than Alex, who conducted a few interviews.
> — Brett Okamoto (@bokamotoESPN) September 22, 2013



Rough fight


----------



## ProdigyPenn

I said Gustafsson hasn't prove himself against a top tier wrestler that he can negated being taken down (his only known weakness). Jon Jones is going to win this fight easy via ground game.

NOOOOOOOOPPPPPPPPPPPPPPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE.

Alexander Gustasson turn out stuffing every single TD Jon Jones attempted and gave Jon Jones one of the toughest match to date.


----------



## Roflcopter

The stretcher thing is because Jones' legs/feet are ****ed up.

Not because he was nearly killed in the cage or some other nonsense.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0

See, Jones? That's what is like to face a *TOP UFC LHW*.


----------



## Roflcopter

I'm rewatching...fight looks totally different in standard definition.

I'd give the first to Gustaffson.


Honestly it's a lot harder to tell what's landing and what isn't in SD....it's a little fuzzy around the striking points.


----------



## HorsepoweR

Roflcopter said:


> The stretcher thing is because Jones' legs/feet are ****ed up.
> 
> Not because he was nearly killed in the cage or some other nonsense.


I'm not surprised you like awful, horrible decision wins, you're a Benson fan. I don't post much but I still read on here, you are annoying as ****. :thumb01:


----------



## Roflcopter

I'm not a fan of Benson.



EDIT: On this replay it's really apparent how much harder it is to see whats landing cleanly in standard definition....especially accompanied with Rogan's usually blindness.



This is why you stream in HD.


----------



## evilappendix

Man what a fight! I feel Gus should have have had the nod, as he appeared to out-strike Jones for the majority of the fight. Foty candidate for sure. Nice to see the champ being classy and humble at the end of the fight, as was Bones.:hug:


----------



## dlxrevolution

Honestly, I had rds 2-3 Gus, and 4-5 Jones. First rd could've went to anyone IMO. It was just basically a feel out round.


----------



## PheelGoodInc

Was anyone else wondering why Jones wasn't trying to put the fight on the ground more? I know Alex was shoving off most of his takedowns, but I truly believe if Jones pushed TD and eventually got it, he could have had a much easier fight. I was pretty amazed when his corner wasn't pushing him to take the fight to the ground...


----------



## hadoq

robbery
I really don't see how jones got the nod, he got outstruck and taken down in 1, 2, outstruck in 3, 4 or 5 were jones rounds, but that's still only 2 out of 5, I had gus by UD, by a longshot. Gus takes the rematch anyday and finishes that kid


----------



## Gustafsson Fan

No_Mercy said:


> True, but I'm willing to bet if he had a strong finish he could have won it. Huerta got hurt against Guida and finished, Edgar vs Maynard II, hell even Browne vs Overeem.
> 
> Gus was winning the exchanges when he pushed forward. The moment he went backwards and allowed spacing the LHW title holder was able to land his kicks at will. Alex came inches away from winning. The look on his face showed it all. He didn't want it...BAD ENOUGH.
> 
> The LHW title holder kept pressing forward so ya gotta give em props and he tried to finish. Gus never tried to finish once.
> 
> Great fight nonetheless.


I do not think Gus should back off or circle too much when he has Jones hit. He gives up momementum.


----------



## Gustafsson Fan

No_Mercy said:


> He was doing so damn well. Busted both of his eyes and lips. He just didn't go for it and throw combinations which he's very capable of doing. It's obvious he trained, but being tired in a five round CHAMPIONSHIP FIGHT. This could have changed his entire career. Everytime he pressed forward Gustaf did well then he'd revert to running back and losing position. Why continue running, LHW title holder slowly pressed forward and obviously had more in his gas tank.
> 
> Again I think it was a fallacy. It was within grasp. He'll look back and realize it.
> 
> Glover is next. I'm sure he saw something that he can utilize. Can he overcome the reach though.


Exactly. And Gus was sometime running long circles around Jones that has to cost energy in a 5 round fight.

Oh by the way. My final predicitions some days ago was that Gus would win by dominating the stand up. I feel I was more right than the ones who picked Jones to win by massacre T.K.O or hellbows.


----------



## SmackyBear

What a great fight. I'm a big fan of both guys, and even more so now. It was real fun to watch Jones in a close fight. 

Watching live, I had it 48-47 Jones, but I wouldn't have called it a robbery either way.

I just checked MMA Decisions to see if they have the judges' round by round scoring, but not yet.

They do have thirteen media scores though. Twelve of the thirteen are for Jones.

http://mmadecisions.com/decision/4518/Jon-Jones-vs-Alexander-Gustafsson


----------



## Proud German

What is this? Another fight heist robbery? I have only seen highlights but it would seem that Gusftaffson almost broke Jones' bones. I wish I was there to see this.


----------



## Killz

WHAT A FIGHT!!

I gave Gus literally no chance in making this competitive but man did he prove me wrong. I was really surprised at firstly, how well he avoided the TD and 2ndly just how good of a chin he has. 

Bones didn't look himself. I'm not willing to say it wasn't because of just how good Gus was, or how the cut in the 1st affected him. I don't know. either way what a fight.

For the record I gave rounds 1 and 3 to Gus and rounds 2, 4. And 5 to bones. (I think). To be honest, neither fighter deserved to lose.

If they rematch, I see bones coming back much stronger and finishing Gus... Although that is also what I said this time


----------



## Vale_Tudo

Wow, very impressed by Gus.
I expected Jones to win by dominating fashion and I was dead wrong.

I see some people guys claim Gus' takesdown won him rounds, but honestly those takedowns were worthless. Nothing happend and should be counted as such.

Round 1 was a toss up, 2-3 I had Gus. 4-5 Jones. I have no problem with the decision though. Great fight, hope to see a rematch.


----------



## K R Y

Had it 3-2 to Gus but can see it going to either fighter. Amazing fight and cannot wait for the rematch. 

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----------



## RangerClydeTheBlue

You're going to hear A LOT of people being bitter about this fight for a while. I had the second round even, 1 and 3 to Gus, and 4 and 5 to Jones, so either fighter or a draw is alright with me.

I'm going to avoid flipping out on the stupid guys claiming it's a robbery for a while, cause that's gonna do my head in.


----------



## Rauno

Haven't seen the fight but i can only laugh at the robbery claims. Some say Jones won, so Gustaf. I'd imagine it was a close fight with both of them having their moments and judging is so wide that it's impossible to tell a clear cut winner.

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----------



## Gustafsson Fan

Killz said:


> WHAT A FIGHT!!
> 
> I gave Gus literally no chance in making this competitive but man did he prove me wrong. I was really surprised at firstly, how well he avoided the TD and 2ndly just how good of a chin he has.
> 
> Bones didn't look himself. I'm not willing to say it wasn't because of just how good Gus was, or how the cut in the 1st affected him. I don't know. either way what a fight.
> 
> For the record I gave rounds 1 and 3 to Gus and rounds 2, 4. And 5 to bones. (I think). To be honest, neither fighter deserved to lose.
> 
> If they rematch, I see bones coming back much stronger and finishing Gus... Although that is also what I said this time


Jones have had everything going his way so far for example when he landed one elbow that changed the Machida fight. So, Jones opponents have also been "unlucky" as well like Jones was with his cut tonight.


----------



## SM33

Sick fight. I had Gustaf winning the first three rounds, Jones the last two. 48-47 Gus. Could call round 2 a 10-10, which makes the fight a draw. We should all be used to this by now...

I think a rematch is in order. Hilarious how so many people didn't give Gustaf a chance before the fight, everyone just looks at records to pick a winner... Watch the fights, no one is untouchable, Gustafsson was always going to be a hard fight for Jon.


----------



## mo25

There really isn't anything to say except go back and watch the decision being announced. When the decision was being made and jones got his hand raised look into his eyes. He KNEW that his opponent had just been robbed. He knew he had lost that fight fair and square and that the belt should not be around his waist at the moment.

1,2,3 Gustafsson

4 either way but jones leaning

5 could have gone either way but more jones leaning because of the take down.

48-47 Gustafsson

Also, Jones was exposed. Reach/size is why he's been winning.

And because of that I predict he will NEVER move up to HW. Cain and JDS would seriously murder him. He was already walking out like a corpse at the end of the fight.


----------



## osmium

ClydebankBlitz said:


> You're going to hear A LOT of people being bitter about this fight for a while. I had the second round even, 1 and 3 to Gus, and 4 and 5 to Jones, so either fighter or a draw is alright with me.
> 
> I'm going to avoid flipping out on the stupid guys claiming it's a robbery for a while, cause that's gonna do my head in.


I scored it the exact same way. The second was really close. It was leaning a bit towards Bones so I thought he would get the decision since MMA judges almost never score draw rounds. The best LHW title fight ever in my opinion. 

Gus had less of a reach disadvantage than I thought heading into the fight. His reach definitely isn't 77 like they were saying in his previous fights. Bones has developed some really terrible range and boxing habits because of his reach which Gus took full advantage of. Just really lazy defensively when fighting from the outside. 

It was good to see Bones get back to what he really does best late in the fight with those elbows I felt like he hurt himself fighting from the outside too much in the earlier rounds. 

The best part about all of this is now we have a legit great rivalry between the two best young LHWs in the sport.


----------



## mo25

One last thing

GSP is the 1 p4p. He has been the most dominating out of everyone. And this is coming from someone who hopes that hendricks knocks GSP's lights out.


----------



## LL

I had it 49-46 Jones but the second and third could have gone either way. I wouldn't have complained with 48-47 Gus.

Jones will never move to Heavyweight after this.


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----------



## Toxic

The first 3 rounds were close with me giving the edge to Gus in 1,2 the 3rd could have gone either way and the last two I think bones took. Could not be seen as a rip off either way IMO but I will say that it was Gus's fight to lose his movement was what was winning for him early and his cardio let him down big time and once he was no longer the faster man he looked vulnerable. 


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----------



## AmdM

49-46 Jones
3rd going to Gus

Why isn't Jones moving up to HW after this?
He dwarfs both the n1 and n2 HW's at the moment. 

Can't find the picture of all guys standing right ot each others, but did manage to find one of Jones facing Cain.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0

I can't say I was impressed by Gus because I was always bringing the point he would be the first legit test to JJ. 

He is tough, disciplinated, skilled and BIG, beside having a good record to back this up. 
His aggressive game plan was great and he lost the nod by getting tired.

Time to people to realize Jones stand up is nothing special, aside his long reach. If Gus had a little more power in his punches, this fight would be stopped and this is a good moment to bring that "not ready Tex" would have murder Jones yesterday, not mentioning any HW and Roy Nelson comes to my mind.


----------



## osmium

Toxic said:


> The first 3 rounds were close with me giving the edge to Gus in 1,2 the 3rd could have gone either way and the last two I think bones took. Could not be seen as a rip off either way IMO but I will say that it was Gus's fight to lose his movement was what was winning for him early and his cardio let him down big time and once he was no longer the faster man he looked vulnerable.
> 
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com App


Eh I think he gassed so badly because of getting rocked and beaten on in the second half of the fourth. He was winning the first half of the fourth and really just had nothing left after being badly hurt and panicked trying to survive.


----------



## Toxic

osmium said:


> Eh I think he gassed so badly because of getting rocked and beaten on in the second half of the fourth. He was winning the first half of the fourth and really just had nothing left after being badly hurt and panicked trying to survive.


I think he was slowing down already in the 3rd his footwork was extremely active in those early rounds the early rounds he was moving like a Cruz/Condit hybrid and jones was having great difficulty with that. 


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----------



## EVERLOST

If that fight was 49-46 Jones then paint my ass green and call me Gumby because that is about as cartoon a score as I have ever seen.


----------



## Life B Ez

Toxic said:


> I think he was slowing down already in the 3rd his footwork was extremely active in those early rounds the early rounds he was moving like a Cruz/Condit hybrid and jones was having great difficulty with that.
> 
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com App


I only seen him noticeably slow down after the first. He was all over the place after that he seemed pretty steady until he got rocked. Jon looked exhausted as well, sitting on the stool between rounds he looked beaten.

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----------



## Toxic

Life B Ez said:


> I only seen him noticeably slow down after the first. He was all over the place after that he seemed pretty steady until he got rocked. Jon looked exhausted as well, sitting on the stool between rounds he looked beaten.
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


Jones slowed first but paced himself and never got full exhausted the way Gus did. I have little doubt that if Gus was in better shape he would be wearing that belt right now


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----------



## TanyaJade

I had it 48-47 Jones.

Rounds one and three I thought were pretty clear for Gustafsson.
Round two was really close but I thought Jones landed more. I think Gustafsson defended several takedowns impressively but still got outstruck.
Round four was Gustafsson's up until the end when Jones completely owned the latter two and a half minutes of the round.
Round five was all Jones, clearest round of the fight in my opinion.

I was black out drunk when the fight was live but managed to watch it this morning. I was VERY impressed with Gustaf and had he not gassed I think he would have won. Jones escaped by the hair on his chin. 

I think Glover deserves the next shot but a rematch for Gustaf shouldn't be far behind.


----------



## hadoq

mo25 said:


> One last thing
> 
> GSP is the 1 p4p. He has been the most dominating out of everyone. And this is coming from someone who hopes that hendricks knocks GSP's lights out.


at first I thought "off topic", but thinking of it, it makes sense, people had jones #1 P4P but GSP never was dominated like that during his title run, now one can also argue that jones was never actually beaten in his MMA career.

logic would say GSP #1 P4P due to his utter dominance on his opponents, thing that Jones doesn't have anymore today.

I'll watch the fight again, to me it was obvious that Gus won.


----------



## 420atalon

Toxic said:


> Jones slowed first but paced himself and never got full exhausted the way Gus did. I have little doubt that if Gus was in better shape he would be wearing that belt right now
> 
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com App


I don't know that Gus could come in much better shape. Based on last night he is obviously one of the best shape fighters at LHW.

What he needs to do is pace himself a little more earlier on. He was bouncing around like Guida in the first round and even in the 2nd you could see him slow down a little bit and by the 4th he was pretty near flat footed.

His movement really helps him and is a big part of how he avoided being taken down but he could simplify it a little bit to use less energy.


----------



## Roflcopter

I rewatched and scored it 48-47 with only my opinion on the 1st round changing.


Gustaffson snuck in more punches than I caught live.


The 2nd round he got outworked...


----------



## hellholming

I wasn't a fan of Gus coming into the fight... I am now.


----------



## hellholming

Killz said:


> WHAT A FIGHT!!
> 
> I gave Gus literally no chance in making this competitive but man did he prove me wrong. I was really surprised at firstly, how well he avoided the TD and 2ndly just how good of a chin he has.
> 
> For the record I gave rounds 1 and 3 to Gus and rounds 2, 4. And 5 to bones. (I think).


agreed on these counts.


----------



## Vale_Tudo

Rewatched the fight, muted Rogan & Goldbergs often biased commentary.

Rd 1: Both did about the same amount of damage. Gus hit that gracing right that cut the eye of Jones, Gus also got a takedown, but delivered no damage and Jones got right back up. Overall Jon controlled the center and showed more agression. I think this is the round people are arguing about. I could see It go either way though, but personally I give it to Jones. Maybe a 10-10

Rd 2: Gus won this round. Jones had one nice kick to the head, other than that he didnt really land much.

Rd 3: Another round for Gus. Just outstriking Jones and controlling the center for most of the round.

Rd 4: Jones. Gus not keeping the same pace, Jones landing and doing more damage and being the agressor\controlling the center for the majority of the round. This is where he also started landing his elbows. Had Gus hurt bad at the end of the round.

Rd 5: Great round. Both tired and going on heart, Jones got a takedown but did absolutely nothing and Gus got right back up. Both doing damage but I think Jones showed more agression and had a couple nice kicks to the head and I think he finished the fight stronger and I gave him the round, but also an extremely close round.


Fantastic fight, up there with Hendo & Shogun.
Im amazed at Gus' takedown defense in this fight. Jones has manhandled bigger and better wrestler than Gustafsson.

I have to admit, i never gave Gustafsson a chance in hell, I didnt think this would make it out of the 2nd round. He proved me wrong.


----------



## Hammerlock2.0

Great fight. I thought Gus won but knew the judges would give it to the champ.

I think Gus finishes him in the rematch.


----------



## osmium

Toxic said:


> I think he was slowing down already in the 3rd his footwork was extremely active in those early rounds the early rounds he was moving like a Cruz/Condit hybrid and jones was having great difficulty with that.
> 
> 
> Sent from Verticalsports.com App


I'm pretty sure a lot of that was due to the beating his lead leg took. He was definitely fatigued going into the fourth but there was a huge difference between fourth and the fifth.


----------



## Iuanes

Gustafsson's boxing training really shown through. Bones, really doesn't have the greatest hands, but his diversity of kicks really makes up for it. 

He hurt Gustaffson a couple of times with body kicks and scored with head kicks. His oblique kicks weren't as effective both due to gustafssons height and the fact that he came prepared.

People are going to be saying it was Gustafssons height that gave Jone's trouble, which is true, but Gustafsson is a smart fighter and came prepared to fight Jones.

A normal tall guy would get aced by Jones, but the Swede used his movement, angles, wrestling training and mixed levels to great effect.

He also was able to make Jones tentative about throw those range sustaining oblique kicks by actually CATCHING a couple of them, which shows a high level of preparedness on his part.

For people saying its only height that keeps Jones on top, think about what a Struve vs Jones fight would look like.


----------



## Hammerlock2.0

Watching it again as I'm typing and Gus made Jon look like Tim Sylvia at times (talking about footwork).


----------



## Purgetheweak

Jones won that fight 3-2, close rounds go to the champ.

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----------



## SM33

Hammerlock2.0 said:


> Watching it again as I'm typing and Gus made Jon look like Tim Sylvia at times (talking about footwork).


Two reasons for this. One, the most obvious, is Alex has great footwork, knows what his feet are for and really knows his way around the octagon.

The other reason is, and dont get mad about this people... Jones does not have good footwork. He does not have good boxing. He's been hyped up to be amazing at everything when in reality, he's one scary wrestler and once his opponent lets that in their head, he is physically imposing enough to win on the feet as well.

Jon is a plodder, he likes the space and time to throw wild strikes, and his wrestling fear factor affords him that. Alex is/was criminally underrated and I had no doubt he'd outclass Jon in movement and boxing. I expected him to shrug most clinches off but even I was amazed at how well he defended the grappling.

Jones does good for someone lacking so much traditional striking technique... the possibilities in MMA are endless.


----------



## Andrus

Oh damn, Gus got robbed. Gus looked really good in this fight, after the first takedown i was like "oh, interesting"  Jones definitely took the last round but all the previous ones were Gustafsson's in my opinion.


----------



## Life B Ez

SM33 said:


> Two reasons for this. One, the most obvious, is Alex has great footwork, knows what his feet are for and really knows his way around the octagon.
> 
> The other reason is, and dont get mad about this people... Jones does not have good footwork. He does not have good boxing. He's been hyped up to be amazing at everything when in reality, he's one scary wrestler and once his opponent lets that in their head, he is physically imposing enough to win on the feet as well.
> 
> Jon is a plodder, he likes the space and time to throw wild strikes, and his wrestling fear factor affords him that. Alex is/was criminally underrated and I had no doubt he'd outclass Jon in movement and boxing. I expected him to shrug most clinches off but even I was amazed at how well he defended the grappling.
> 
> Jones does good for someone lacking so much traditional striking technique... the possibilities in MMA are endless.


I've been saying Jones' footwork would get him in trouble and would be the key to beating him literally since before the Ryan Bader fight.

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----------



## rabakill

Andrus said:


> Oh damn, Gus got robbed. Gus looked really good in this fight, after the first takedown i was like "oh, interesting"  Jones definitely took the last round but all the previous ones were Gustafsson's in my opinion.


even the 4th?


----------



## BrianRClover

DAMMIT!!! Why do these awesome fights keep happening when I have a show?!?

So seriously... I already know the outcome and I get back home tomorrow... is it worth getting the replay of the pay per view for the fight?


----------



## Gustafsson Fan

I think in a rematch Gus should let his hands go even more and not fear the Jones wrestling.

Maybe that is why he took so many elbows and kicks, he should focus on winning the kick boxing even more and just accept a little wrestling comes with it.

This fight reminded me of 

Apollo Creed vs Rocky Balboa I
where both ended up wrecked and went to the hospital.

In real MMA it was the championship version of Forrest Griffin vs Stephan Bonnnar I.

IMO one of the best MMA fights ever. The only thing missing in the fight was a round 5 stoppage to end the fight in a peak.


----------



## Life B Ez

Has any fight ever been so radically changed in one second and it not end in a stoppage? I mean no spinning elbow Gus isn't even in the hospital he's sitting at the press conference with the belt.

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----------



## Rygu

Jones looks like a guy who just lost an MMA bout.


----------



## BrutalKO

..Dang. We all wondered when we would see Jon Jones look like that! It's happened. Tex must be licking his chops right now. I was so far off with Weidman & Silva and even further off with Gus & Jon. MMA is getting crazy. Jones has barely had a dent put in him since he stepped into the Octagon and wiped out all the top dogs---then that one fighter comes along that everybody overlooks and exposes a completely dominate champion. All I can say is Gus really prepared. Hats off to him. Obviously- Gus isn't going anywhere soon and a little hot air has finally been let out of Jones...


----------



## Ape City

Totally agree BrutaKO! This fight changes the dynamic of the entire LHW division now that Jones is clearly beatable. Man can you imagine if Hendricks takes a legit run at GSP?

Things are getting shaken up in mma hardcore folks!


----------



## Joabbuac

I though the scoring was pretty spot on here, i had it 3-2 Jones. Gus nearly had it though, only if he hadnt got rocked late in the 4th, gotta give that round to jones based on damage though.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0

BrutalKO said:


> *I was so far off with Weidman & Silva and even further off with Gus & Jon.* MMA is getting crazy. Jones has barely had a dent put in him since he stepped into the Octagon and wiped out *all the top dogs*---then that one fighter comes along that *everybody overlooks* and exposes a completely dominate champion. All I can say is Gus really prepared. Hats off to him. Obviously- Gus isn't going anywhere soon and a little hot air has finally been let out of Jones...


Difference being:
Jones wasn't fooling around like Anderson.
The "Top dogs" Jones wiped out were, well, not Gus, or not LHW.
Not everybody overlooked Gus. :wink01:


----------



## SideWays222

420atalon said:


> Shooting in for takedown doesn't score. Just like defending a takedown doesn't score.
> 
> What does score is what happens after the takedown or after the takedown defense.
> 
> After most of the takedown attempts by Jones Gus was backing away if not flat out running away from Jones. He wasn't doing anything to in any way hurt Jones. He was just fighting smart and avoiding being taken down and hurt.
> 
> This fight only had striking, 2 takedowns and octagon control/aggression to score on.
> 
> The first round Gus got the better of the striking and landed a takedown winning him the round.
> 
> The second round Gus wasn't as effective with his striking. Jones was avoiding many of his strikes and was doing some damage with his kicks. Overall it was a pretty close and uneventful round but Jones did just enough to take it.
> 
> Third round Gus started landing a little better and figured out how to negate Jones' kicks winning him the round.
> 
> 4th round Gus was turning it on and starting to take control. Jones clawed his way back into it and then landed a crushing elbow and nearly was able to get the stoppage.
> 
> 5th round Gus was tired and still feeling effects of elbow. He did ok but Jones got a takedown which Gus used up all of his remaining effort to stand up from. Gus spent the rest of the round just trying to survive.
> 
> This fight was very easy to score outside of the 2nd round. I think a lot of people after rewatching it closely will notice that Jones did just enough to win that round.
> 
> And all this is coming from a guy that wanted Gus to win and bet on Gus to win...


I wonder how laying and praying wins so many fights then.

Iv seen plenty fights where im thinking the guy on the bottom is doing much more yet the points always go to the guy on top even if they are not throwing a damn punch.




> Effective grappling is judged by considering the amount of successful executions of a legal takedown and reversals. Examples of factors to consider are take downs from standing position to mount position, passing the guard to mount position, and bottom position fighters using an active threatening guard.





Roflcopter said:


> Octagon control is a very lowly rated scoring criteria, and rightfully so...it shouldn't even exist.
> 
> The only reason I can think of it's existence is to score rounds where one guy is holding the other against the cage the entire time and no actual effective striking and grappling is taking place.


Can you show me where you saw a graph on what is valued how much when it comes to scoring or any article on the subject??? Since you seem to have read something i havent.




> C.Judges shall evaluate mixed martial arts techniques, such as effective striking, effective grappling, control of the ring/fighting area, effective aggressiveness and defense.
> 
> D.Evaluations shall be made in the order in which the techniques appear in (c) above, giving the most weight in scoring to effective striking, effective grappling, control of the fighting area and effective aggressiveness and defense.


Seems to me its not scored that lowly


----------



## No_Mercy

You know his go to move is that elbow. It's a fight changer. 

Gus did not look too good in the end of the 4th. Sooo close. I really enjoyed that fight though and it answered quite a few questions.

- chin + durability
- conditioning
- heart
- striking
- nullifying the reach advantage
- takedown
- tdd
- everyone is mortal


----------



## UFC_OWNS

He really needs to work on his conditioning, he comes in with equal cardio to jones or better he wins the 5th easy and there is no doubt on the winner


----------



## Gustafsson Fan

Question is if it was conditioning or if it was about overusage of energy at times. Gus ran long circles around Jones at times to avoid having the cage too close behind his back. Maybe Gus could push forward a bit more often and have Jones back off.


----------



## SM33

Jones has not been 'exposed', no one else in the division can fight like Gustaf. This fight doesn't mean Jones is going to get beat up all the time now, it means we have a serious rivalry in its prime that will leave the rest of the division in the dust.

Glover can take it to Jones, but he cant dance like Alex and probably would have gassed within 3 rounds on saturday. Definately has the finishing ability, but I think he'll be waiting behind Gustaf for a while. Hell, when he gets a shot Gus might be champ.

Cain/JDS situation likely to unfold ar LHW.


----------



## Killz

Gustafsson Fan said:


> Question is if it was conditioning or if it was about overusage of energy at times. Gus ran long circles around Jones at times to avoid having the cage too close behind his back. Maybe Gus could push forward a bit more often and have Jones back off.


Or it might have been the damage Jones did to him. He didn't seem 'too' gassed up until Jones landed that elbow?

Who knows?


----------



## Gustafsson Fan

Killz said:


> Or it might have been the damage Jones did to him. He didn't seem 'too' gassed up until Jones landed that elbow?
> 
> Who knows?


Could be. Despite Gustafsson having great footwork I think in this 5 round fight he should use it more seldom.

He should have used those legs to move out of the way of strikes NOT using it to get away from the cage. 

Gustafsson also said in an interview (in Swedish) some day ago that he will try to put more pressure on Jones in a rematch. I like to see that and I think that fight will then probably end in stoppage.

IMO, Jones is the best striker in the division when standing still at long range. He developed that to beat the smaller guys. He uses it a lot in this fight as well with kicks.

IMO, if Jones tries to use spinning elbows jump at his legs and take him down. If Jones tries to use kicks throw your own kick close the distance to punching range and force Jones to exchange or back off or clinch. Do not stay at Jones favourite range.


----------



## Gustafsson Fan

*Dirty Strikes, who "won" it ?*

I would like us to analyze any dirty strikes and attempts to dirty strikes because it is disgusting and could very well change a fight luckily it didn't this time around.

These eye pokes. I can understand when someone tries to stop a jab with his hand or parry and accidently pokes opponent in eyes. What I cannot understand is how the hell someone does a long jab with fingers at long range.

Round 1:
3:34 left of round. Jones does an odd stretching out of his arm with open hand fingers miss Gus face luckily.
0:35 left of round, Jones land fingers in Gus face while Gus throws a right hand. Both gets a warning.


Round 4:
1:05 left of round. Jones stretching his arm fully towards Gus face WTF is that ? Did he really try to land a jab there or is the intent to do a poke ? A jab has a snap to it but this looks more lika a pawing motion.


There is plenty of more, takes time to analyze please help me out. The problem is this pays off. It has been discussed before but I think this debate can never be too seldom...


----------



## No_Mercy

Some good points. I think the main thing was the mind set. Gustaf can finish when the opportunity presents itself, but in this fight I think he was wary of the clinch/takedown thus he continued his usual game plan which served him very well early on. How long can you keep that up though. I get winded off doing 10 minute warms up before class...haha.

The LHW title holder was having a difficult time adjusting. Reach wise was nullified so he resorted to kicks, clinch, and takedowns. Even that didn't work according to plan, so if Alex put the pressure on he would have won the decision most likely. Initially I thought 1,2,3 went to Gustaf and the latter two for the LHW title holder, then before the ref announced it I figured with a match this close and how the latter two rounds turned out it most likely went to the champ. Think BJ vs Fitch. Heck even Machida vs Shogun I. I'm not complaining cuz I won money on the Machida fight, but I thought Machida lost. It was close.

I hope Gustaf learned from this and will tighten up his game plan. Also press the action a bit more to not allow his opponent to reset and get positioning.

Also grabbing his leg kicks is key to throw him off balance. That's like 50% of his strikes. 

I believe Glover should be next then Gustaf after beating an opponent or two can get his rematch. I don't want Glover to get stuck in purgatory then opt for another match only to lose. The landscape can change very shortly. 

Til then we'll all be waiting for this rematch!


----------



## UFC_OWNS

I'd like gus to use more standing elbows and cut jones more and frequently because it really does mess with him and helps for the rest of the fight. Also better conditioning and more body/head combos and leg kicks would be nice.


----------



## slapshot

SM33 said:


> Two reasons for this. One, the most obvious, is Alex has great footwork, knows what his feet are for and really knows his way around the octagon.
> 
> The other reason is, and dont get mad about this people... Jones does not have good footwork. He does not have good boxing. He's been hyped up to be amazing at everything when in reality, he's one scary wrestler and once his opponent lets that in their head, he is physically imposing enough to win on the feet as well.
> 
> Jon is a plodder, he likes the space and time to throw wild strikes, and his wrestling fear factor affords him that. Alex is/was criminally underrated and I had no doubt he'd outclass Jon in movement and boxing. I expected him to shrug most clinches off but even I was amazed at how well he defended the grappling.
> 
> Jones does good for someone lacking so much traditional striking technique... the possibilities in MMA are endless.


People keep saying this and Jones won this fight striking, his striking sucks but he beat Gus striking.. I understand the praise for being a great striker and giving Jones a run for his money. Gus is a tough fighter and fought the best fight Ive seen him give. 

Round one was Gus's and after that different people see rounds very differently. Some ppl are giving Jones the 3ed 4th and 5th and some are giving him the 2ed 4th and 5th. You could make a case for Jones winning the last four rounds, although I dont feel he did. 

I dont think its logical to give Gus the fourth in any scenario when he was saved by the bell and almost put away in that round.

I had Jones dropping the first two rounds and winning the last three rounds but round two and three are very close. Im down for a rematch after a Glover fight the one thing this does is create a buzz. I hope we can put away any questions about Jons chin.

I have some difference in opinion but I basically agree with this. http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1783033-jones-vs-gustaffson-breaking-down-the-fightmetric-numbers although I dont think fightmetric is the be all end all, its a decent tool.


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## Danm2501

I've not been shocked by a fight as much as I have by that one in a long time. Jon Jones has absolutely ripped through the 205lb division, and was looking like he was 3 years ahead of everyone else in terms of how advanced his MMA game was, but Gustafsson proved himself to be on Jon Jones' level. That is insane. Jones, who took Chael Sonnen down, widely regarded as one of the best wrestlers in all of MMA, with ease, was stuffed on 9 occasions by Gustafsson. For the first takedown of the fight to come from Alex was absolutely insane. Jones and Gus are going to run this division for years to come, much like Cain and JDS will run the HW division. No-one else is anywhere near them. Davis and Teixeira might be somewhere near, but no-one is as close to Jones' level as Alexander Gustafsson. He looked so impressive. What a fight.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue

Gus Vs Phil Davis 2 for number 1 contendership.
Jones Vs Glover

I'd be happy with that.


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## Sportsman 2.0

Jones don't have the stand up level of Gus and still (arguably) beat him for the same reason Cain does not have the same JDS stand up level and beat him out of strikes. Both Cain and Jones are feared for they TDs and mixing things up to get the TDs. When you are worried to get taken down and under ruthless GNP, you hold your horses on striking department and the striking of the one not worried about being taken down shines.


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## osmium

MMA-Sportsman said:


> Jones don't have the stand up level of Gus and still (arguably) beat him for the same reason Cain does not have the same JDS stand up level and beat him out of strikes. Both Cain and Jones are feared for they TDs and mixing things up to get the TDs. When you are worried to get taken down and under ruthless GNP, you hold your horses on striking department and the striking of the one not worried about being taken down shines.


Gus has far better boxing but Bones is better with MT techniques than Gus. I don't think the fights are really comparable Cain just caught JDS early and he took forever to recover. I didn't come out of that fight thinking Cain would have any advantages on the feet if they fought again. After this fight it was pretty clear Bones would still be more effective with kicks and elbows if they fight again.


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## H33LHooK

I think what Jones said to Joe in the octagon after the fight was very telling in terms of what we might expect from a follow up fight. 
He said something like, "I should have been more like water; should have adapted more".

I'm betting they had a pretty specific plan for Gus, and it's likely they stuck to it, if not for the whole fight, then at least for longer than Jones thinks they should have.

On another note, while Jones has historically been percieved as somewhat a pillow-hands while standing, he caught Gus with multiple solid, solid shots, and I'm not just referrring the elbow/s. Gus can take it, man.

.


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## cdtcpl

H33LHooK said:


> I think what Jones said to Joe in the octagon after the fight was very telling in terms of what we might expect from a follow up fight.
> He said something like, "I should have been more like water; should have adapted more".
> 
> I'm betting they had a pretty specific plan for Gus, and it's likely they stuck to it, if not for the whole fight, then at least for longer than Jones thinks they should have.


Greg Jackson was not at cage side, so your statement actually makes a lot of sense. I guess they have a rule in Canada only allowing 3 cornermen, so for some odd ass reason it sounds like Greg was the one they benched.


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## Soojooko

Only just seen it.

Jesus fecking Christ, what a great fight. :thumbsup:


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## Life B Ez

osmium said:


> Gus has far better boxing but Bones is better with MT techniques than Gus. I don't think the fights are really comparable Cain just caught JDS early and he took forever to recover. I didn't come out of that fight thinking Cain would have any advantages on the feet if they fought again. After this fight it was pretty clear Bones would still be more effective with kicks and elbows if they fight again.


I don't know, Jones may score points but kicking a guy in the head six or seven times while he's leaning into it and never even wobbling him doesn't really show much, other than the guy getting kicked can stop worrying about it. That's why Gus ended up getting hit with the elbow, he ducked for the jab to the body with no fear of the head kick and Jones finally got the placement of the spin correct and caught him.

Jones did well with kicks early like the first, but Gus never seemed bothered by them and imo next time will key on them and throw straight punch counters. 

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


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## Sportsman 2.0

osmium said:


> Gus has far better boxing but Bones is better with MT techniques than Gus. I don't think the fights are really comparable Cain just caught JDS early and he took forever to recover. I didn't come out of that fight thinking Cain would have any advantages on the feet if they fought again. After this fight it was pretty clear Bones would still be more effective with kicks and elbows if they fight again.


Fights not entirely comparable, of course, just the points I mentioned. I believe Jones kicks are not effective at all, or his punches. It's his elbows that are lethal and only when they started landing he was definitely effective on hurting Gus.


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## BrutalKO

Ape City said:


> Totally agree BrutaKO! This fight changes the dynamic of the entire LHW division now that Jones is clearly beatable. Man can you imagine if Hendricks takes a legit run at GSP?
> 
> Things are getting shaken up in mma hardcore folks!


Ty brother! Just the fact that you mentioned GSP & Hendricks gave me goosebumps! Johny is BY FAR GSP's biggest challenge ever! It would not surprise me to see Johny stuff a patented GSP takedown. An on the feet war between GSP & Hendricks is likely and fireworks galore. Dang!- and don't forget the Cain/JDS trilogy coming up. The Anderson & Chris rematch. 2013 has certainly been a changing of the guard and things are mixing up quickly and it's not over yet. I think we will have a few more surprises left...


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## deadmanshand

BrutalKO said:


> *It would not surprise me to see Johny stuff a patented GSP takedown.*


I'm always bewildered when I read or hear this comment from people. Hendricks has never shown the ability to stuff that kind of shot. He's been taken down before. By far worse mma wrestlers than GSP. Story and Koscheck both outwrestled him. I even believe Kos beat him. His striking style is wild and aggressive which stylistically leaves him off balance in the face of a double leg.

I don't think Hendricks has much a chance beyond a puncher's chance. In both of his fights against wrestlers he was much more hesitant in his striking. Add in that he has horrible cardio and starts to wilt after round 2 I don't see him as much of a threat to GSP.

Off topic, I know.


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## osmium

MMA-Sportsman said:


> Fights not entirely comparable, of course, just the points I mentioned. I believe Jones kicks are not effective at all, or his punches. It's his elbows that are lethal and only when they started landing he was definitely effective on hurting Gus.


Some of those leg kicks were brutal and he got him good once or twice early on with some kicks to the body. He doesn't follow through on the head kicks though. He could knock someone out with one of those if it caught them right but he really does need to slam the shin into the neck or head. Either way it does hurt and it bothered Gus especially the first one in the fifth. His elbows are absurdly vicious though probably the most devastating in MMA right now. He needs to utilize those more especially timing that step in elbow with a guy starting a hand combination.


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## Iuanes

Jones's kicks to the body visibly hurt Gustafsson. He didn't commit much to the headkicks no.


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## aerius

Iuanes said:


> Jones's kicks to the body visibly hurt Gustafsson.


Definitely noticed that one. I was hoping that Jones or his corner would notice that and adjust the gameplan to go heavy on the body kicks. Which would take away Gustafsson's cardio and movement along with helping to setup some freebie head kicks. I was surprised that they didn't do that and stuck to low kicks and head kicks.


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## No_Mercy

I wonder why Gus doesn't throw power shots. It seems like he's going at 50% - 75% at all times. I mean if JDS hit the LHW title holder it should be a different story or heck even Glover I suppose. Cuz Gus hit him a ton of times...uppercuts, hooks, and jabs. But it didn't damage em enough to the point where he would get TKOed. Then he runs into ONE elbow square in the forehead and it looked pretty bleak those last 30 secs. I was like..."uh oh!" 

The Mauler has to go Shogun style at some point. From the looks of it takedowns, clinch, and grappling does not seem to be an issue any longer. Only time he got taken down he wall walked with no problem. He just has to believe in his own ability to FINISH. Even though the LHW title holder got battered he was always focused in landing the fight ending blow and was on the offensive majority of the time.

I hope they put in Glover so Gus can refine his skills a tad bit more and be ready the next time around.


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## Gustafsson Fan

No_Mercy said:


> I wonder why Gus doesn't throw power shots. It seems like he's going at 50% - 75% at all times. I mean if JDS hit the LHW title holder it should be a different story or heck even Glover I suppose. Cuz Gus hit him a ton of times...uppercuts, hooks, and jabs. But it didn't damage em enough to the point where he would get TKOed. Then he runs into ONE elbow square in the forehead and it looked pretty bleak those last 30 secs. I was like..."uh oh!"
> 
> The Mauler has to go Shogun style at some point. From the looks of it takedowns, clinch, and grappling does not seem to be an issue any longer. Only time he got taken down he wall walked with no problem. He just has to believe in his own ability to FINISH. Even though the LHW title holder got battered he was always focused in landing the fight ending blow and was on the offensive majority of the time.
> 
> I hope they put in Glover so Gus can refine his skills a tad bit more and be ready the next time around.


Exactly, Gus has to stop the stick and move when he has Jones hit and instead sit down on his punches. He should not be happy just hitting Jones with 1-2 shots instead go forward and go for finish. This may get Jones to back off and Gus to get momentum.


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## SM33

Gustaf's strategy was fine, if he moves less and looks for the KO, he'll find himself having to defend more takedowns.

Gus knows what he's doing, he has plenty power and he knows that technique will bring the KO. It wont happen in every fight, but if he's outpointing then it doesnt matter.

Any good boxing coach will train you not to look for the knockout. Jones just has awkward defense, he doesnt tuck his chin, slip and trade, he sticks his gangly arms out and turns away. Frustratingly effective, I'm confident Alex will find a home for his power strikes more often in the rematch.


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## UFC_OWNS

The strategy was fine, but his cardio needed to be better if he was gonna be constantly moving around. Also he should have been a bit more wary of jon's biggest weapons the elbows and the kicks


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## RangerClydeTheBlue

Gustafsson Fan said:


> Exactly, Gus has to stop the stick and move


Literally the stick and move was the ENTIRE strategy.


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## No_Mercy

Gustafsson Fan said:


> Exactly, Gus has to stop the stick and move when he has Jones hit and instead sit down on his punches. He should not be happy just hitting Jones with 1-2 shots instead go forward and go for finish. This may get Jones to back off and Gus to get momentum.


Early on the strategy definitely worked and everybody knows that's what he does...for three rounds. So yes at some point I also agree that he should have planted his feet and put on the heat. The takedown wasn't coming after he defended all those...Gus was trained well by Phil Davis. He needed to believe in his technique and skills the way Weidman does and go forward. 



SM33 said:


> Gustaf's strategy was fine, if he moves less and looks for the KO, he'll find himself having to defend more takedowns.
> 
> Gus knows what he's doing, he has plenty power and he knows that technique will bring the KO. It wont happen in every fight, but if he's outpointing then it doesnt matter.
> 
> Any good boxing coach will train you not to look for the knockout. Jones just has awkward defense, he doesnt tuck his chin, slip and trade, he sticks his gangly arms out and turns away. Frustratingly effective, I'm confident Alex will find a home for his power strikes more often in the rematch.


Very true, but his conditioning started falter. Heres the flipside. It's because he didn't press the action especially towards the latter end that I felt he allowed the champ to get back into the game...in a very big way.

To attack is to shape the battle. I do not believe the LHW title holder is a counter attacker the way Anderson is. His main counter is his oblique kick. He's more of a one strike offensive fighter. He needs that range that's why the elbow is so effective because that's essentially a jab or a hook for any other fighter. A very powerful one. 
- spinning elbow
- forward slashing elbow
- left jab with open palm
- right overhand
- oblique kick
- leg kick, body, and high kick

I really equate this to Edgar style of fight and Shogun in his first fight vs Machida even. It looked like Gustaf may have outpointed him, but in the judges eyes it wasn't decisive enough. The LHW title holder was imo down three rounds and he went for it and almost got the finish if not certainly put Gus in a world of trouble in the end of the fourth. That swayed the judges scoring. Had to.

*Hence why I would say you know what...at some point Gus is gonna have to go for it. *


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## Terror Kovenant




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## cdtcpl

and most importantly


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## amoosenamedhank

Terror Kovenant said:


>


I'm a horrible person.... but I can't stop laughing at this picture. :happy02:


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## Life B Ez

Terror Kovenant said:


>


Maybe the best punch face ever!

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App


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## GDPofDRB

Yeah I saw this yesterday. Shady, the live stats are never perfect but the discrepancy here is significantly large, more so then typical of FM. When I saw them, the original stats looked more like what I expected the stats to look like, the stats from the second image, not even close.


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## Gustafsson Fan

How can Gus total strikes go from 191 to 114 that is a laughable difference?


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## SM33

The new stats are bollocks because in terms of volume, Alex obviously landed more.


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## 420atalon

SM33 said:


> The new stats are bollocks because in terms of volume, Alex obviously landed more.


Look at the details... I posted them somewhere else on here. Gus landed more head and body shots. Almost half of Jones' strikes were leg kicks which he did land lots of but many weren't what I call significant although fight metric still scores them as such.


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## slapshot

MMA-Sportsman said:


> Jones don't have the stand up level of Gus and still (arguably) beat him for the same reason Cain does not have the same JDS stand up level and beat him out of strikes. Both Cain and Jones are feared for they TDs and mixing things up to get the TDs. When you are worried to get taken down and under ruthless GNP, you hold your horses on striking department and the striking of the one not worried about being taken down shines.


Cain had to take JDS down to win, do you think if he had been skunked with solid TDD that that fight would have looked the same or even had the same outcome? Because if so, you didn't watch the fight. Jones was able to win striking with Gus who according to the common wealth is a far superior striker.


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## BrutalKO

deadmanshand said:


> I'm always bewildered when I read or hear this comment from people. Hendricks has never shown the ability to stuff that kind of shot. He's been taken down before. By far worse mma wrestlers than GSP. Story and Koscheck both outwrestled him. I even believe Kos beat him. His striking style is wild and aggressive which stylistically leaves him off balance in the face of a double leg.
> 
> I don't think Hendricks has much a chance beyond a puncher's chance. In both of his fights against wrestlers he was much more hesitant in his striking. Add in that he has horrible cardio and starts to wilt after round 2 I don't see him as much of a threat to GSP.
> 
> Off topic, I know.


...You have a good point but what's GSP's most effective base? Wrestling. Johny is no slouch and for CERTAIN he knows GSP's MO is takedowns. He's probably been working bigtime on his TDD to keep it on the feet. Everybody knows GSP is brilliant on his feet but Hendricks has that one punch KO power to end everything...

_Anderson lost the belt. Henderson lost the belt. Jones got exposed by Gus and Hendricks is very capable of stealing GSP's belt... _


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## Sportsman 2.0

slapshot said:


> Cain had to take JDS down to win, do you think if he had been skunked with solid TDD that that fight would have looked the same or even had the same outcome? Because if so, you didn't watch the fight. Jones was able to win striking with Gus who according to the common wealth is a far superior striker.


Mark this, again: Cain Velasquez is *UNABLE* to take an undamaged Junior dos Santos down, or keep him there. He absolutely just can't. If you think Cain didn't find JDS unprotected face first (in a very intelligent manner, btw, since all his TD attempts were being pathetically stuffed until that moment) and took JDS down out of pure wrestling from the first bell, it is clear who did not watch that fight.


----------



## slapshot

MMA-Sportsman said:


> Mark this, again: Cain Velasquez is *UNABLE* to take an undamaged Junior dos Santos down, or keep him there. He absolutely just can't. If you think Cain didn't find JDS unprotected face first (in a very intelligent manner, btw, since all his TD attempts were being pathetically stuffed until that moment) and took JDS down out of pure wrestling from the first bell, it is clear who did not watch that fight.


Bah, Carwin and Gonzaga can take him down but Cain is incapable? LOL.


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## Sportsman 2.0

slapshot said:


> Bah, Carwin and Gonzaga can take him down but Cain is incapable? LOL.


He never could before he got JDS hurt, fact, so LOL back to you. Hell, even badly hurt JDS just kept coming to his feet to the end of the fight. 
The exact point is Cain had to use his hands to soften JDS for take downs because before that, his shots were leaving him embarrassed crawling after JDS ankles. And I am the one who didn't see the fight...
Edit: Props to Cain for being versatile in his game plan.


----------



## SideWays222

MMA-Sportsman said:


> He never could before he got JDS hurt, fact, so LOL back to you. Hell, even badly hurt JDS just kept coming to his feet to the end of the fight.
> The exact point is Cain had to use his hands to soften JDS for take downs because before that, his shots were leaving him embarrassed crawling after JDS ankles. And I am the one who didn't see the fight...
> Edit: Props to Cain for being versatile in his game plan.


You do realize that taking someone down after setting it up with the striking is still taking someone down??


----------



## BOOM

GDPofDRB said:


> Yeah I saw this yesterday. Shady, the live stats are never perfect but the discrepancy here is significantly large, more so then typical of FM. When I saw them, the original stats looked more like what I expected the stats to look like, the stats from the second image, not even close.


Nothing to see here.




Terror Kovenant said:


>


The nod clearly has to be given to the champ however because he decided to show up during the fight with 30 seconds left in the 4th round even though Gus was boxing his face in like shown above all night long.


----------



## anders100

Just to open up an old discussion. I haven't read all the post, but i can see that many people was and surely still are butthurt by the decision. For me it is very easy. 

Gustafsson landed a takedown in the first round, which for me was pretty even otherwise. 10-9 Gus, no doubt.

But round 2. Wtf? How can anyone seriously say, that Gus won that round? Jones was the aggressor, and connected with kicks the entire round. Gus connected with a few jabs, but otherwise he just punched air most of the time that round. Kicks are significant strikes, and it counts more than a single jab - and it counts as much as a hook or a uppercut. Jon was the one landing the most strikes, most significant strikes, he was dictating the pace in the round and he was the aggressor. There is no possible way you can score that round for Gus. It's just nonsense. 

I gave third round for Gus. 29-28 for Gus after three rounds. Round four was even the first 2:30 of the round, i actually had Jones leading with more strikes landed and as the aggresor. But Gus took a slight lead in the round from the half way point until the spinning elbow by Jon. Those 37 seconds won him the round. Hands down. Gus was hurt badly, which counts alot as effective striking. Jon won that round. 38-38 after 4 rounds.

The fifth round was a easy call. Gus was tired and Jones dominated that round. 48-47 for JON JONES. Gustafsson didn't win that fight.

This is the official judging rules from the UFC: 
"Judges shall evaluate mixed martial arts techniques, such as effective striking, effective grappling, control of the ring/fighting area, effective aggressiveness and defense.".

Let's take round 2, 4 and 5. 

Round 2 - Jon landed the most strikes and the most significant strikes. He was controlling the pace in that round, and was the aggressor. Just like he had the better defence. Clear round for Jon.

Round 4 - Jon was by far the effective striker this round. He was controlling the pace allmost the entire round. He landed the most strikes, and had some clinch control after he hurted Gustafsson with the spinning elbow. Jon won this round aswell. No doubt.

Round 5 - Jon was the aggressor the whole round. He controlled the pace, he landed the more significant strikes, and he had a takedown. Gus running for the most of five rounds. You can't give that round for Gus. Jon won that round.

Jon won three rounds. You can't prove otherwise.


----------



## edlavis88




----------



## Sports_Nerd

I love how you resurrected an almost 3 year old thread and opened up by claiming that "people are still butthurt."

With the best will in the world, that shows a remarkable lack of self awareness.


----------



## Joabbuac

I like reading old threads... just to look back and see how much bollocks i wrote in the past, but... kinda proud of "2013 joabbuac" here, he did alright. 



Joabbuac said:


> His movement might cause Jones to get a little frustrated, but he should get over that and win an awkward decision.





cdtcpl said:


> While I know it doesn't work this way, but you would think if he was able to handle Lyoto's movement he should not have a difficult time with Gustaf.





Joabbuac said:


> Lyoto with his Karate tends to go straight back when under threat, Jones's pressure basically halved his running track which made it so he would just back straight into the the cage... Gus is better at moving laterally.


and i wasn't even butthurt.... I scored it for Jones. 



Joabbuac said:


> I though the scoring was pretty spot on here, i had it 3-2 Jones. Gus nearly had it though, if only if he hadnt got rocked late in the 4th,i gotta give that round to jones based on damage though.


But saying "Jon won three rounds. You can't prove otherwise." is fuking stupid, this was such a close fight, its not about "proving" anything it, its a very subjective fight... with very close rounds. 

and nobody is even buthurt about the scoring, i haven't heard anyone bar this resurrector even mention the scoring in years.... 

Lots of old members in this thread that i wish were still around


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## anders100

Okay .


----------

