# OFFICIAL*** - UFC 94 Georges St Pierre Vs BJ Penn DISCUSSION THREAD(pre/post)



## Judoka (Feb 23, 2007)

vs.







Conduct all your discussion pre & post-fight on this fight, between Lightweight champion *BJ "the Prodigy" Penn* facing off against Welterweight champion *Georges "Rush" St Pierre* in *HERE*. *ALL *other threads concerning anything during this fight, or its outcome *WILL BE MERGED INTO THIS ONE.*

Thanks.


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## geoff0011 (May 27, 2007)

I hope GSP knocks BJ back down to his own division. WAR GSP!


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## Xerxes (Aug 14, 2008)

BJ winning this fight is not good for the sport and GSP is awesome.

WAR GSP!!!!


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

I'm saving my pick till I do my write up but I'm really pumped for this match up. Because I find it so complex unlike a lot of other match ups recently.


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## Suizida (Feb 29, 2008)

Gonna give it to GSP, his cardio and wrestling i feel will just be to much


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## Emericanaddict (Dec 31, 2006)

GSP is a monster of the likes BJ has never faced and he will feel the pain. GSP BY WHATEVER HE LIKES WAR!!!!!!


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## somethingclever (Apr 8, 2007)

BJ by strikes! This fight will finally set the record straight, BJ is the p4p greatest fighter ever.


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## Rockstar189 (Dec 14, 2006)

somethingclever said:


> BJ by strikes! This fight will finally set the record straight, BJ is the p4p greatest fighter ever.


I agree. I think BJ will pull it out...

whenever the vBookie comes on il go all in lol


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## The Legend (Jun 13, 2006)

I got GSP by DEC or BJ by T/KO or SUB due to strikes I am not sure yet though


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## georgie17891 (Dec 21, 2008)

I want bj to in but dont thik he can


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## Xerxes (Aug 14, 2008)

/\ finally a reasonable BJ fan that can face the truth. :thumb02:


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## pliff (Oct 5, 2006)

This is so great. UFC 58 was the first live event ive seen (Hvent missed one since though ) and Ive wanted a rematch since then.


Im hoping my boy GSP will take this one, and leave no doubt in peoples mind.

Let the debate end, GSP is the better 170 pound fighter.


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## e-thug (Jan 18, 2007)

Hope to god GSP wins for the sake of both the LW and WW divisions.


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## evilappendix (Jan 4, 2007)

So St.Pierre has Canada's flag draped over him while B.J. has Hawaii's? I'm rooting for my North American brethren all the way then. War Rush.


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## Jord -Jitsu (Nov 3, 2008)

All BJ fans cast your vote. Lets get behind him.

According to freddy roach he has "the best striking by far in MMA". Gotta respect that so im goin for BJ by KO/TKO


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## TeddyP (Jan 24, 2009)

I don't think Freddie Roach is capable of giving an analysis of who the best striker in MMA is. He might be able to tell us who the best boxer in MMA is, but I don't know how much he knows about striiking as a whole (knees, elbows and kicks) 

I'm rolling with GSP - going to be a hard fight though and I wouldn't put money on either man.


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## Jundon! (Sep 10, 2008)

The Prodigy by KO.

Rush has a weak chin IMO. He can't handle BJ's riddum.


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## The Lone Wolf (Sep 23, 2008)

Crazy match up. Cannot wait!

BJ needs to be careful of Georges' top game, and his head kicks.

GSP needs to be careful of BJ's top game and his powerful, accurate punches.

Jury's still out on this one, though i'm leaning more toward BJ


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## Jord -Jitsu (Nov 3, 2008)

TeddyP said:


> I don't think Freddie Roach is capable of giving an analysis of who the best striker in MMA is. He might be able to tell us who the best boxer in MMA is, but I don't know how much he knows about striiking as a whole (knees, elbows and kicks)
> 
> 
> > thats a very good point my friend i agree. But at the same time he is capable of judging key striking/stand-up skills (timing, accuracy, distancing, power, speed, ability to slip punches and evade strikes) so you still have to respect that.
> ...


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## The Lone Wolf (Sep 23, 2008)

Jord -Jitsu said:


> thats a very good point my friend i agree. But at the same time he is capable of judging key striking/stand-up skills (timing, accuracy, distancing, power, speed, ability to slip punches and evade strikes) so you still have to respect that.
> 
> Also I kinda believe that traditional boxing is more effective than muay thai and karate and all of that. *Besides from leg kicks i dont think kicking is all that effectie in mma*. Kicks are easier to counter and they leave the kicker vulnerable alot of the time. I know this is controversial and there are some great proponents of kicks and knees so dont crucify me, its just my opinion


It depends what you define as "effective". Even though a kick might not land, or might not cause damage, it still gives your opponent something to think about. Mixing up the level of your kicks can work to devastating effect. If your opponent is feeling the effects of your kicks to the body, enough to try and cushion the blow with his hands/arms, a quick flick and you're taking his head off.

Alot of fighters dont utilise kicks, the best examples are BJ and Randy. Although they are successful without the kicks, its still one less weapon in your arsenal, and one less thing for your opponent to worry about. I think thats what makes GSP so dangerous, he can and will do anything in the cage. His opponents wont ever be sure what he is going to do. Kick? Punch? Takedown?

A basic breakdown of this fight could look a little something like this:

BJ will have to concentrate on every aspect of GSP's game, whereas GSP will be confident that BJ wont take him down, or throw head kicks.

I rewatched the second meeting of Penn vs Pulver yesterday, and BJ looked a little uncomfortable out-wrestling Pulver. And GSP is a superb wrestler. I find it hard to see how BJ can take this to the mat on his terms, and if he ends up with GSP ontop of him, he could be in alot of trouble.

Having said that, i'm not sure if GSP would want to take BJ down with BJ being outstanding at BJJ. But also i think maybe GSP will be scared of BJ's boxing.

In short, i dont have any idea at all about what will happen in this fight, theres just so many variables. i just hope to god we get a classic :thumb02:


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

GSP by brutal TKO. I'm sure he's prepared for and quite able to surpass BJ's boxing and everything else.

This does not constitute a formal prediction and is merely my opinion.


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## SimplyNate (May 27, 2007)

GSP by TKO in round 3 or 4. Depends what round BJ gasses in, but GSP will still be winning the fight up to that point anyways.


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## Seanzky (Jan 22, 2009)

I like both fighters and the kind of performance they always bring to their fights --this one won't be any different.

I'm pulling for BJ to win just because he's the underdog.


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## Darkgecko (Apr 21, 2008)

I've got GSP in the 4th by TKO. By that time BJ should be worn out from GSP's pace.


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## The Legacy (Aug 14, 2008)

BJ is playing the bad guy for this fight. Makes it interesting.

The closer it gets to the time, the more I'm thinking that GSP will be able to get the win again. Both fighters have changed since their fight three years ago, but I still see the same guy getting his hand raised afterwards.

But I know that BJ is excellent as well, to be honest it's just going to be an awesome fight.


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## Mr. X (Nov 7, 2008)

gotta go with BJ on this one


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## TeamPunishment0 (Aug 6, 2007)

gsp is gonna tko bj because bj is gonna gas at the end of the 2nd round. gsp is going to set a pace that bj can match but not withstand over the entire fight


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## steveo412 (Sep 27, 2006)

I really think Bj is going to win this fight. I see a rear naked choke in the second round. I think if it makes it to a decision GSP is going to take it, but if anyone is finishing this fight it is BJ. Either way its going to be an awesome fight.


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## JWP (Jun 4, 2007)

I thought I was goin to be a bit different by saying GSP by TKO and not a decision, but i see many agree.

I think GSP will have his sharpest striking yet, as he continues to evolve. 

Im guna say Round 2


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## ZZtigerZZ81 (Jul 8, 2006)

http://www.mmaforum.com/ufc/50624-gsp-vs-bj-write-up-prediction.html


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## RapidDk (Dec 1, 2008)

i see bj submitting to strikes in the third round,so penn could eat his words from what he said in the "prime time"ufc special!gsp knows he has to make an example out of him!imo!


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## dudeabides (Sep 30, 2008)

I'm just looking forward to seeing the fight. I have no idea how it will go, BJ's ground game or GSP's stamina. I like football but the card is so good, it totally overshadows that game the next day. Super what? I want to see Guida vs Diaz, and Machida vs Silva but this fight tops them all.


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

Amped for this fight. No opinion on how it's going to go. I just want it to be a good three - five round match! Both look to be in great shape for the weigh ins and dead serious during the staredown. Let's get it on!!!


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2009/1/31/743055/georges-st-pierre-to-beat

Interesting stuff, thinking outside the box anyways. I wouldn't be surprised to see St. Pierre go for a heel hook. 

Ultimately I think GSP will try to press Penn against the cage


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## ZZtigerZZ81 (Jul 8, 2006)

Terry77 said:


> http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2009/1/31/743055/georges-st-pierre-to-beat
> 
> Interesting stuff, thinking outside the box anyways. I wouldn't be surprised to see St. Pierre go for a heel hook.
> 
> Ultimately I think GSP will try to press Penn against the cage


I don't think you can sub BJ by any lock targeting any part of his legs and losing top position and giving it to BJ is a death wish. Which is what a failed heel hook would eventually be.


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## R u s h (Aug 12, 2008)

Rush by TKO (strikes) in second round. GSP! GSP! GSP!


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## sisdavid (Dec 31, 2006)

*Weight Class*

What are the weight classes anyway? Also, What weight did they fight at the first time?


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## Vale_Tudo (Nov 18, 2007)

God damn I cant belive we're finally just hours away!!
I dont think I've been this hyped for a fight since Chuck & Randy fought for the third time.


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## Wombatsu (Jul 10, 2006)

i honestly think GSP's gameplan will be to take BJ to the ground early and GnP. He wont want too much of the standup boxing so i say a few minutes or less and Gsp will go for the takedowns and use his wrestling advantage.

Either way Bj is dangerous on the feet or on the ground but he is possibly a little less dangerous on the bottom at least on his back. Thats how i see GSP's gameplan to win this fight. 

However gameplans seem to go out the window very quick in MMA !!!

Just bring it on im pumped for this one


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

ZZtigerZZ81 said:


> I don't think you can sub BJ by any lock targeting any part of his legs and losing top position and giving it to BJ is a death wish. Which is what a failed heel hook would eventually be.


I thought it was interesting though.

Going into the fight I was in the firm belief GSP takes it, but I've switched to Penn today. I think he has the superior skill set everywhere besides size, power and wrestling. St. Pierre doesn't like being backed up and I think BJ has the ability to do it throughout the fight


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## ZZtigerZZ81 (Jul 8, 2006)

Terry77 said:


> I thought it was interesting though.
> 
> Going into the fight I was in the firm belief GSP takes it, but I've switched to Penn today. I think he has the superior skill set everywhere besides size, power and wrestling.


definitely interesting and I sure hope you are right about Penn taking it.


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## WarHERO (Dec 31, 2006)

BJ via SUB or TKO in the 2nd.


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## cpbama7to11 (Dec 29, 2008)

BJ via UD or TKO late.


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## Terror Kovenant (Nov 16, 2008)

Ahh so pumped. BJ has to (t)KO him in the first two, or else GSP wins this.


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## N1™ (Apr 8, 2007)

i give the first to GSP purely for trying. he needs to get that leg ( BJs)

plz let GSP win this


2nd clearly goes to GSP...


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## Terror Kovenant (Nov 16, 2008)

Penn is starting to look tired


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## k3232x (Sep 17, 2008)

Penn is gassed already.


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## Cheef_Reef (Jul 20, 2008)

GSP is working him


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## N1™ (Apr 8, 2007)

somebody seriously needs to go and kick goldberg in the face if he doesnt stop talking about those takedownstats


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## box (Oct 15, 2006)

Gsp, UD


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

This fight has sucked and is really boring. I'm dissapointed.


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## NameChange (Mar 4, 2007)

Thats just Wow.


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## the ultimate (Mar 5, 2007)

GSP is the WW king  

Great fight by him.


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## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

Rofl, corner retirement!!!


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## UKRampage (Jan 28, 2009)

Complete domination as I expected! GSP has to be considered for best P4P on planet! Incredible performance, congratulations George! Bring on Anderson Silva fight!


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## N1™ (Apr 8, 2007)

man.... Alves is HUGE


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## SimplyNate (May 27, 2007)

Can BJ shut up now? I remember him saying GSP was a quitter. Too bad so sad.


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## deanmzi (Oct 15, 2006)

SimplyNate said:


> Can BJ shut up now? I remember him saying GSP was a quitter. Too bad so sad.




:mistress01:


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## Cheef_Reef (Jul 20, 2008)

Didn't BJ say if you tap from strikes your a little bitch?

Oh the irony


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## All_In (Aug 23, 2007)

I love how people say how this fight sucked. It's the fans that demanded this fight take place, even though BJ hadn't earned it and GSP still had game competition at 170. And if I'm not mistaken this fight already occurred...and wasn't all that exciting then. This one was just pure domination. Like everyone said, if Penn didn't end it early he was gonna be in trouble.


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## Tepang (Sep 17, 2008)

haha the crybaby got owned :bye02:. i gotta admt he had balls to step up a weight class and fight the best, but he was no match at all. GSP just keeps getting better


ALL HAIL GSP raise01:


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## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

I'm convinced GSP would beat Anderson Silva.


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## the unknown (Jun 23, 2007)

WOW, GSP dominated start to finsih. wonder what BJ will say now about calling others out who has tapped?


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## the unknown (Jun 23, 2007)

Tepang said:


> haha the crybaby got owned :bye02:. i gotta admt he had balls to step up a weight class and fight the best, but he was no match at all. GSP just keeps getting better
> 
> 
> ALL HAIL GSP raise01:


dominated and outclassed!


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## Rabid (Oct 7, 2007)

His brother saved his ass from a pounding. How embarrassing...


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## EVERLOST (May 28, 2007)

I like both guys but I till like Penn more, GSP has no personality and is kinda robotic but he proved himself to be the better fighter. Penn winning wouldve been more interesting to me then GSP. In all actuality the UFC is getting kinda boring in its match making right now for me anyway. Dont know why, but nothing is getting me excited for the fights anymore. .......Bring back soccer kicks. =-)


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## Terror Kovenant (Nov 16, 2008)

Norway1 said:


> man.... Alves is HUGE


Yeah hes a middleweight who barely makes WW. Cheap tactic.

I wonder if BJ will calm down with his spouting off at the mouth. Also, I wonder how this is going to play into his title defense against Florian. Will his head be screwed on straight? His ego might be so defeated that he turns to shit. Or the exact opposite might happen and he comes back better. We'll see


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## The Dude Abides (Jul 8, 2008)

Roflcopter said:


> I'm convinced GSP would beat Anderson Silva.


Break it down then.


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## southpaw447 (Mar 21, 2007)

After all the shit talk after all the childish antics, all the "you tapped" "you're a little bitch"

He gets outclassed on the ground, standing up, his conditioning is still crap, and his corner throws in the towel.

Man this is very satisfying for me as a fan of GSP. I wonder how he feels.


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## wolfbot (Oct 5, 2008)

Let's get realistic. Anderson Spider Silva walks around and cuts from 230. GSP walks around at 185-190. Both are freaky athletes, but you can't give away 40-45 pounds and not expect to be at a serious disadvantage. Anderson Silva's future is in destroying UFC LHW competition. 



Roflcopter said:


> I'm convinced GSP would beat Anderson Silva.


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## 20lbbooster (Oct 15, 2006)

I hate that he won by lay and pray, but a win is a win I guess. 

...let GSP step up to 185 and see him try that lay and pray with Anderson. I wish he would have done more stand up.


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## Alex_DeLarge (Sep 5, 2006)

Seriously, shut up.


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## GMW (Nov 15, 2006)

20lbbooster said:


> I hate that he won by lay and pray, but a win is a win I guess.
> 
> ...let GSP step up to 185 and see him try that lay and pray with Anderson. I wish he would have done more stand up.


Hey. 
You're a troll?


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## Tepang (Sep 17, 2008)

He was dominating in standup as well

I agree though GSP is kind of robotic.


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## SimplyNate (May 27, 2007)

20lbbooster said:


> I hate that he won by lay and pray, but a win is a win I guess.
> 
> ...let GSP step up to 185 and see him try that lay and pray with Anderson. I wish he would have done more stand up.


lol Lay and Pray didn't make him give up after round 4.


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## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

GSP would ground and pound Silva like he did BJ. Silva's not that good on his back nor is he physically strong, just very technical and a big puncher.


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## All_In (Aug 23, 2007)

wolfbot said:


> Let's get realistic. Anderson Spider Silva walks around and cuts from 230. GSP walks around at 185-190. Both are freaky athletes, but you can't give away 40-45 pounds and not expect to be at a serious disadvantage. Anderson Silva's future is in destroying UFC LHW competition.


That's just ridiculous. 230? Where did you read that?


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## Alex_DeLarge (Sep 5, 2006)

Silva is actually pretty good off his back and doesn't need to be incredibly strong. He'd have the size advantage on GSP, and much better stand-up.

It'd be a tremendous fight, but don't spew on about how GSP would "just do this and that."


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## Tepang (Sep 17, 2008)

lets not talk about silva just yet...


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## southpaw447 (Mar 21, 2007)

UFC isn't (better not) going to cock block anymore titles. Thiago is next for GSP and Florian is next for BJ.


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

Good lord this is the worst the forum's ever been.


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## Alex_DeLarge (Sep 5, 2006)

southpaw447 said:


> UFC isn't (better not) going to cock block anymore titles. Thiago is next for GSP and Florian is next for BJ.


Amen.

We've wasted enough time with this damn fight.

It's funny though. Before this fight, all anyone ever talked about was fighters coming up or down in weight classes. I guarentee people after this fight will go on about how "the UFC shouldn't do that crap anymore and quit denying worthy contenders of title shots."

I always say this, it's amazing how people change within an hour.


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## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

20lbbooster said:


> I hate that he won by lay and pray, but a win is a win I guess.
> 
> ...let GSP step up to 185 and see him try that lay and pray with Anderson. I wish he would have done more stand up.


You are an idiot.

Usually I'm somewhat creative with my putdowns, but by God, you are an idiot.


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## joey__stalin (Dec 31, 2006)

That was surprising. 

It was interesting to see Alves standing next to GSP heh. Guy's got a big upper body.


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## Alex_DeLarge (Sep 5, 2006)

Alves was probably walking around at 396.


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

Impressive performance. Man Greg Jackson comes up with some serious off the chart game plans. I knew GSP was grinding him to wear him out the first two rounds, but didn't know the exact reason until he explained it. Very methodical. Lay n pray is way out of context. He was active at all times; guard, passing to side mount, pinning his arm with his knee, pinning his neck, then almost getting into a crucifex ala Matt Hughes pt 2, all the while throwing punches, and elbows. If you know anything about BJJ you can't over committ otherwise you'll make an error and get submitted. I really thought he was going to get the TKO if not a KO by the fifth round. BJ's head must have been ringing to withstand all that punishment. Lyoto and GSP are another level. 

Anyone else see him labelled as "the complete fighter" under the stats.


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## Darkgecko (Apr 21, 2008)

Darkgecko said:


> I've got GSP in the 4th by TKO. By that time BJ should be worn out from GSP's pace.


:happy04::winner01:


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## pho3nixxx (Feb 1, 2009)

GSP's rig was about to explode coming out for the 3rd and 4th rounds...BJP was seeing stars early and never came back, wasn't in the fight...at all. GSP, too dynamic and focused, looked fkn unstoppable, granted it wasn't that flashy but executed game plan perfectly. BJP won't be able to run his mouth no more, that kind of beat down will breed a hell of alot of self doubt, good luck in his next title fight


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## clywhite (May 25, 2008)

BJ said: "If you tap from strikes your just a BITCH".. But what if you QUIT and refuse to come back for the last round? I think that just makes you a ***** BJ!


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## e-thug (Jan 18, 2007)

clywhite said:


> BJ said: "If you tap from strikes your just a BITCH".. But what if you QUIT and refuse to come back for the last round? I think that just makes you a ***** BJ!


Man, ya shoulda heard me last night when he didnt come out for the 5th round!

I havent enjoyed a main event like that in quite some time.


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## dontazo (Feb 29, 2008)

haha gsp beat bj even worse than he beat fitch. thats just humiliating


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## SpikeMaul (Feb 1, 2009)

HAve to remember though.... BJ came up to Georges weight category.

I too think BJ talked too much smack ; GSP deserved the win and roasted him. :shame01:

But carrying around all that extra weight would be a hell of a feat on a body frame that is used to carrying only so much. I personally think BJ overdid it training or the stamina thing wasnt happening at that weight and he knew that going in. He never had any jump or real spark. It was 'defense is best' the whole match.

Sure BJ threw in the towel by jsut not really saying anything, but i think realistically he was dissapointed that the stamina wasnt there and that he knew that the whole time and why he looked like a sack of doorknobs out there.


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## Hellboy (Mar 15, 2008)

Terror Kovenant said:


> Yeah hes a middleweight who barely makes WW. Cheap tactic.


And GSP doesn't do the same thing ?


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

So it goes on record as a verbal tapout?


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## hvendlor (Jan 15, 2009)

It was great seeing BJ get owned so bad.

Of course he makes it all the better for talking so much BS, so he sets himself up for a big fall. 

GSP looked leagues above BJ in every way.


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## Flak (Jul 1, 2007)

Never have i seen someone pass BJ's guard at will like that. It really was strange seeing BJ dominated on the ground like that for so long, even before he gassed. 

Georges is just a machine, and refuses to plateau....better and better every time we see him. It wasn't even competitive. I wonder what this will do to BJ's confidence in the long run, and if it will affect his performances at 155? I don't think he entertains the idea of jumping up weight classes anymore and knows his place.


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

While BJ might have continued, I saw his cornerman wave it off as the doctor was walking away. Herb Dean agreed with it. It was to save face too...because I knew GSP would KO him in the fifth. He was hunting him and just picked him apart in every way possible. You gotta give props for BJ to withstand all that punishment for four rounds basically. He was in total survival mode. BJ is dope, but he was talking too much. He knew the pied piper came to collect...


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## RHYNO2K (Feb 4, 2007)

It never ocurred to me that it would be like that, what a fight, now I hope that BJ will only focus at 155, because he has absolutely everything to become a legend at 155.


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