# Do Some Of You Still Consider Jake Shields To Be Overrated?



## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

I've had alot of conversations with many members on this board about Jake Shields. I've been a long time fan of his, and one of the only on this board for a long time.

Alot of members here have constantly called him an overrated fighter for their own reasons.

Jake just moved up in weight and finished a top 5 consensus world ranked MW in Robbie Lawler. And he finished him in the first round.

So I was wondering your guys thoughts on this and his ranking. Do you guys think that he's worthy of his top five ranking yet?


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## joshua7789 (Apr 25, 2009)

Ive never been one of those people that thinks jake is overrated, if anything he has been pretty underrated for a guy with his resume. I would feel pretty confident in sayin that he is the number two welterweight in the world. There is only one other welterweight in the world that i would take in a bet over him and that is gsp. Wins over lawler, okami, condit, imada, and thompson are highpoints on his 12 fight win streak. Thats my take on the dude anyhow. I would love to see him fight in the ufc sometime soon so we can really see how he stacks up.


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## D.P. (Oct 8, 2008)

He isn't overrated, but I'm not a fan. And I tend to not like fighters who seem to have only one strength in their game. BJJ being Shield's.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

D.P. said:


> He isn't overrated, but I'm not a fan. And I tend to not like fighters who seem to have only one strength in their game. BJJ being Shield's.



Shields was a two time all american wrestler in college as well. That's why he's dangerous his BJJ is hybrid with great grappling.


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## D.P. (Oct 8, 2008)

J.P. said:


> Shields was a two time all american wrestler in college as well. That's why he's dangerous his BJJ is hybrid with great grappling.


Yeah that too, I mean in terms of striking. As in Maia's case.


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## Randomus (Apr 30, 2009)

J.P. said:


> Shields was a two time all american wrestler in college as well. That's why he's dangerous his BJJ is hybrid with great grappling.


 He loves showing people how effective his "American Jiu Jitsu" is.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Shields Underrated*

I have to agree that up to this point Shields has not been overrated, hes been underrated! Now he is not underrated cause rankings came out shortly after that same card. He's not number one yet but hes getting close!


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## joshua7789 (Apr 25, 2009)

I would love to see a shields/gsp match. Gsp would completely outstrike him standing but he likes to take all of his opponents down for the first two or three rounds lately. I dont see gsp being able to muscle shields around on the mat like he does everyone else. This would be a great fight if it hit the floor.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Shields VS GSP*

A Shields versus GSP match would be interesting. It's too bad that they are in different promotions. Shields might move at some point but not for now.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

He's not overrated. I never understood the Shields hate on this forum last year. It seemed to be for its own sake.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

I really think that alot of the Shields hate was pretty odd. Dude has more notable victories than almost any WW in the game with an awsome record and win streak.

Jake is the real deal.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*True*

That he does, but I really think he would do better at welterweight in the long run!


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

kantowrestler said:


> That he does, but I really think he would do better at welterweight in the long run!



Maybe, but he's already conquered the WW world outside of the UFC. He's really got nothing to gain by staying in that weight class but negative critisizm.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

He's underrated by a lot of people, but I think he would lose to guys like Kos and Fitch, and GSP would absolutely eat his children.
His striking is beyond awful, it amazes me that a guy at his level can be so bad at it.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

TheNegation said:


> He's underrated by a lot of people, but I think he would lose to guys like Kos and Fitch, and GSP would absolutely eat his children.
> His striking is beyond awful, it amazes me that a guy at his level can be so bad at it.



I'm actually interested in looking at the compustrike for the Strikeforce event. He landed about 4 body kicks in that round and I'd bet more strikes than Lawler did.

I'm not saying that his striking is all that awesome but I think he gets alot of flak behind the fact that he looks stiff in the standup and because of his performance in the Paul Daley fight.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

It's not just that he looks a bit stiff. He doesn't move at all. He doesn't keep his hands up or defend properly. He looks like he gets striking lessons from the gracies.

That being said, I just watched that fight and I liked the kicks he was throwing, especially the one he hit while Lawler was attempting to secure the thai clinch on him.

I am a fan, I just think his deficencies in the striking department are as bad as a guy like Kongos in the ground game. He really needs to work on at least his defense.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

i think he's gonna give alot of strikers fits in the standing game due to the fact that they'll be watching for that takedown they'll be afraid to let their hands go.

I need some Shields vs Aoki.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

Could it happen?


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

I know who he needs to fight next. He needs to fight Riggs for the welterweight title and then fight Hayato Sakurai from DREAM! That would be a good fight!

Yes, Shields versus Aoki could happen but did you see what Sakurai did to Aoki?


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

kantowrestler said:


> Yes, Shields versus Aoki could happen but did you see what Sakurai did to Aoki?


Edit button baby, edit button, so you don't double post, and what did Sakurai do to poor Aoki? I can deal with anything but disrespecting his pants.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Sakurai VS Aoki*

Thanks for the advise and Sakurai knocked out Aoki! And Aoki is supposed to be the top lightweight in the world!


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

kantowrestler said:


> I know who he needs to fight next. He needs to fight Riggs for the welterweight title and then fight Hayato Sakurai from DREAM! That would be a good fight!





kantowrestler said:


> Yes, Shields versus Aoki could happen but did you see what Sakurai did to Aoki?





swpthleg said:


> Edit button baby, edit button, so you don't double post, and what did Sakurai do to poor Aoki? I can deal with anything but disrespecting his pants.





kantowrestler said:


> Thanks for the advise and Sakurai knocked out Aoki! And Aoki is supposed to be the top lightweight in the world!



Jake Shields has already defeated Hayato Sakurai.


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

J.P. said:


> I've had alot of conversations with many members on this board about Jake Shields. I've been a long time fan of his, and one of the only on this board for a long time.
> 
> Alot of members here have constantly called him an overrated fighter for their own reasons.
> 
> ...


Not sure that Robbie Lawler ever should have been a "top 5 consensus world ranked MW," but yeah, Shields good stuff.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

This thread is missing some Shields highlight gifs. Make it happen, J.P.


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## mtt_c (Jun 15, 2008)

Shield's stand up game (punching) sucks and won't get any better...he's just not good at it. He takes good shots and is quick to recover (vs. Cemtex) and goes for what he is good at (takedowns).

A lot of people won't give him his due b/c he doesn't knock anyone down. Given that, he took on Lawler at a higher weight because he's a competitor. I think Kos, Fitch would be good competition as Shield's strength is his takedowns/bjj.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Shields in UFC*

Its unfortunate and I haven't wanted to say it myself, but most of the best fighters that Shields really need to test himself are in the UFC. But I don't want Shields to join the UFC cause then all the worlds top welterweights would be in the UFC. And Shields rematch against Sakurai would be great cause both of those fighters are not the fighters they were when they first fought!


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## hebaj (Jun 25, 2008)

The thing that Shields has over almost all of the UFC WW division is his submission ability.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

hebaj said:


> The thing that Shields has over almost all of the UFC WW division is his submission ability.



Mix that with his ability to control using his excellent wrestling.


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## joshua7789 (Apr 25, 2009)

If shields could get his stand up to a point where he didnt look like he just walked into his first sparring session everytime he fought then i dont think anyone could beat him at welterweight, not even gsp would be able to handle a him if he had some good stand up.


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

joshua7789 said:


> If shields could get his stand up to a point where he didnt look like he just walked into his first sparring session everytime he fought then i dont think anyone could beat him at welterweight, not even gsp would be able to handle a him if he had some good stand up.


GSP's just such such a beast on the ground, though. If Shields does start to tag him, all he has to do is drop for the takedown and he takes over the fight.
And as good as Shields' wrestling is, I don't think he can match GSP's power.


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## joshua7789 (Apr 25, 2009)

Gsp is probably more powerful on the ground, but shields jiu jitsu and sub game is a few notch's better then gsp's. Either way, this is a fight i hope happens someday regardless of shields possibly improving his striking.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Shields VS GSP*

Shields is the perfect hybrid of wrestling and submissions. GSP is an overall good fighter but has holes in his game. A match between the two would be interesting.


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

Thing about Shields is he hasn't beaten anyone on GSP's level.

And no, Robbie Lawler is not.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

vandalian said:


> Thing about Shields is he hasn't beaten anyone on GSP's level.
> 
> And no, Robbie Lawler is not.



Sakurai was Japans GSP when Shields defeated him. I don't think GSP has really faced a fighter who can challenge him the way Shields can.


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

J.P. said:


> I don't think GSP has really faced a fighter who can challenge him the way Shields can.


You may be right about that. But I believe GSP has consistently faced a higher calibre of opposition than Shields, or anyone in the history of the division. Not even Hughes, during his long reign, went up against such beasts on such a consistent basis.
Shields' ability to win this fight will depend on his ability to take GSP to the ground and control him. And I doubt he'll have any more success doing that than Koscheck, Fitch, Sherk or Hughes did.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

vandalian said:


> You may be right about that. But I believe GSP has consistently faced a higher calibre of opposition than Shields, or anyone in the history of the division. Not even Hughes, during his long reign, went up against such beasts on such a consistent basis.
> Shields' ability to win this fight will depend on his ability to take GSP to the ground and control him. And I doubt he'll have any more success doing that than Koscheck, Fitch, Sherk or Hughes did.



You make a good point. I think Hughes was a bit overrated. His victory over Newton was questionable as hell, over Royce it was obvious that Royce was out of practice and He barley was able to defeat Serra. And as far as the UFC I think GSP has been more dominant as a WW.

I disagree though on ground control in regards to Shields. I think Shields has proven time and time again that his ground control is second to none. Especially since in a few non MMA competitions he's defeated guys like Vinny Magalhaes, Fitch and Diego Sanchez on the ground.

I don't think Kos or Fitch are near the calibur of Jake Shields on the ground.


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

J.P. said:


> You make a good point. I think Hughes was a bit overrated. His victory over Newton was questionable as hell, over Royce it was obvious that Royce was out of practice and He barley was able to defeat Serra. And as far as the UFC I think GSP has been more dominant as a WW.
> 
> I disagree though on ground control in regards to Shields. I think Shields has proven time and time again that his ground control is second to none. Especially since in a few non MMA competitions he's defeated guys like Vinny Magalhaes, Fitch and Diego Sanchez on the ground.
> 
> I don't think Kos or Fitch are near the calibur of Jake Shields on the ground.


Do you think he can take Georges down, though? I'm not so sure he can.

I believe the only way to solve this one is to see the fight. Hopefully UFC gets cracking and signs Shields.


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## Fieos (Mar 26, 2007)

I'm confused. GSP takes world class wrestlers/grapplers and puts them on their back and makes them look like amateurs. 

I don't see Jake Shields wrestling at a higher level than Fitch or Koscheck. I don't see his submissions as more of a threat than BJ or Serra.

The person who beats GSP isn't a grappler; it is a 170lb version of a young Chuck Liddell.


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## Evil Ira (Feb 9, 2009)

swpthleg said:


> This thread is missing some Shields highlight gifs.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Shields record*

I didn't know Shields had that many championships under his belt! And now he will probably be the Strikeforce Welterweight Champion when they create the title!


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

kantowrestler said:


> I didn't know Shields had that many championships under his belt! And now he will probably be the Strikeforce Welterweight Champion when they create the title!


'Cept this one.










UFC has to get this guy signed eventually.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Fieos said:


> I'm confused. GSP takes world class wrestlers/grapplers and puts them on their back and makes them look like amateurs.
> 
> I don't see Jake Shields wrestling at a higher level than Fitch or Koscheck. I don't see his submissions as more of a threat than BJ or Serra.
> 
> The person who beats GSP isn't a grappler; it is a 170lb version of a young Chuck Liddell.


His submissions are more dangerous than Serras simply because he consistantly wins fights by sub. When was the last time Matt Serra subbed anybody?

Fitch's ground game is not better than Shields. In a BJJ torunament Shields defeated Fitch. 

A year prior he defeated Diego Sanchez in a grappling tournament. 

Shields ground game simply is that good.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Shields VS Sanchez and Fitch?*

Shields really out grappled Diego Sanchez and Jon Fitch? He is already ready for the UFC! Bring on GSP!


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

kantowrestler said:


> Shields really out grappled Diego Sanchez and Jon Fitch? He is already ready for the UFC! Bring on GSP!


He was also able to defeat Vinny Magalhaes in a BJJ match a few years ago. This is impressive because of Vinnys calibur of BJJ and the size difference between the two.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Ufc*

Why is he not in the UFC already?


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

*listens for J.P.'s knowledgeable reply*


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

kantowrestler said:


> Why is he not in the UFC already?


Coker gave him an offer that he couldn't refuse. He was on Danas list when EliteXC went under. And Jake was making it obvious in interviews that he fully intended to sign to the UFC.

Jake even went as far as to challenge Pro-Elite contract clause about being able to put shows on in a specific amount of time in order to get free from his contract.

Scott began to publically state that he wanted to work with Shields the minute the Pro-Elite acquisiton went through offering him huge fights and Jake stayed. His first fight was with Robbie who at the time was a top 5er.

I can see him fighting Cung or Aoki in the near future with the ability to fight elsewhere and still collect a payday in Strikeforce with mega fights I'd say he's got it made at this point.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Shields VS Aoki*

Well considering what Sakurai did to Aoki, I don't think a fight with Shields would be too much more spectacular. I can't wait for Shields match against a worthy opponent for the Strikeforce Welterweight title!


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## joshua7789 (Apr 25, 2009)

Aoki pulls off some cool subs, but i think Shields is a much better grappler. It would be hard to say who has the stand up advantage in this one. Id still pick shield by dominant decision.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Aoki's weight*

The fact is Aoki is just too light at welterweight! He's not like BJ Penn who has fought as high as 187, so fighting at welterweight he is naturally going to get dominated. Probably not from a guy like Serra who should go back to lightweight anyways, but guys like Kosh, Fitch and Shields, its not going to be a good match, if even a match!


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Shields won't be doing too much WW fighting at this point because of Nick Diaz.

We'll most lilkey see him at 185. 

However I can see an Aoki fight being an exception due to the bad blood between the two.


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## kantowrestler (Jun 6, 2009)

*Bad Blood*

Wait, there is bad blood between Aoki and Shields? How did that come about?


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