# ***OFFICIAL*** Frank Mir vs. Shane Carwin Pre/Post Fight



## Xerxes (Aug 14, 2008)

*Please conduct ALL of your discussion in regards to Frank Mir facing Shane Carwin in this thread. All threads made in regards to this fight will be merged into this one.*​


----------



## UFC on VHS (Dec 16, 2008)

Frank Mir will once again be the Interim Champion.


----------



## Tyson2011 (Jan 12, 2009)

i really dont see carwin winning this...

mir by tko, 2nd round


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

As a huge Mir fan this fight really scares me, only because Carwin only needs to land 1 punch to end this fight.........

I can't wait to see this fight!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Indestructibl3 (Apr 2, 2009)

It's definitely gonna be a tough fight, but I'm still backing Carwin


----------



## luckbox (Feb 12, 2010)

I'll have to think about this before voting, cause this could really go both ways. Perhaps Mir is the slim favorite, but this is anyones ballgame. Really important fight for both guys and for the heavyweight picture. The loser of this one might be lost in the shuffle for a while.


----------



## Syxx Paq (Feb 19, 2010)

this is a pick em. 

when its a pick em ya have to go with the experience, and thats mir, hes bigger, badder, and stronger than ever, not to mention hes been to the top several times.


----------



## dudeabides (Sep 30, 2008)

Going to be a very interesting fight, and can't wait to see if Shane's punching power and wrestling can help him survive Mir's ground game long enough to pull it off.


----------



## Rastaman (Feb 25, 2010)

I guess I'll be the first to say that I think Carwin is going to pull the upset. Mir's a great fighter, and he could easily win without stunning me or anything, but in Carwin's perfect career he's ended all 11 opponents in the first round...the longest someone lasted was 2:11. Granted at least half of the people he fought were essentially no-names, but still, 11-0 and never going past the first round has to mean something. I'm going with Carwin for the major upset by lucky Guillotine Choke submission early in the first round. I want Mir to win though for sure, because Lesnar vs. Mir 3 would be insane.


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

Carwin has a punchers chance, nothing else. Frank is better at everything. GG was schooling Carwin and about to end his hype train but he got that no look bomb..... he better look for another one cuz thats about all he has got going for him here IMO


----------



## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

I am taking Mir on this one. His standup is more technically sound and his ground game is above and beyond better than Carwin's. Mir just needs to watch out for Carwin's power.


----------



## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

alizio said:


> Carwin has a punchers chance, nothing else. Frank is better at everything. GG was schooling Carwin and about to end his hype train but he got that no look bomb..... he better look for another one cuz thats about all he has got going for him here IMO


The thing we learned from this fight is, that Carwin can take some shots, that Carwin can get on his feet pretty easily against a BJJ Back belt *(remember Gonzaga is a World Champion)* and that Carwin only needs one punch to end this fight. 

I'm really not impressed by Carwins striking, but Mir's neither! But Carwin only needs one jab to end this fight. And he will get at least one hand across Franks shitty Striking defense.

I pick Shane via KO first round!


----------



## Danm2501 (Jun 22, 2009)

BobbyCooper said:


> The thing we learned from this fight is, that Carwin can take some shots


No, I disagree that we learnt that; what we've learned I believe is that Carwin has a suspect chin. Carwin's been rocked by Gabriel Gonzaga and Neil Wain, but was lucky that neither have killer instinct and both failed to jump on him and finish the fight. Frank Mir will not make the same mistake, and he's a much better striker than either of them, with very impressive technical boxing. Carwin's stand-up often looks very robotic and slow early in fights, and due to his lack of head movement and average defence he takes shots. For Carwin's sake I'm hoping he's improved that come the Mir fight, or he'll be out cold in the 1st round.


----------



## The Horticulturist (Feb 16, 2009)

I want to see one of them get hurt!!!! I don't care which one!!!! I'm bloodthirsty with this fight, both guys have always rubbed me the wrong way. I'm starting to like Mir, but I'll always be annoyed by his idioms.


----------



## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

Danm2501 said:


> No, I disagree that we learnt that; what we've learned I believe is that Carwin has a suspect chin. Carwin's been rocked by Gabriel Gonzaga and Neil Wain, but was lucky that neither have killer instinct and both failed to jump on him and finish the fight. Frank Mir will not make the same mistake, and he's a much better striker than either of them, with very impressive technical boxing. Carwin's stand-up often looks very robotic and slow early in fights, and due to his lack of head movement and average defence he takes shots. For Carwin's sake I'm hoping he's improved that come the Mir fight, or he'll be out cold in the 1st round.


No come on Danm. If you are still able to stand after a punch from such a beast like Gonzaga, than well you have a good if not great chin. He was a little bit rocked thats true, but now tell me who wouldn't be?? Many others would have seen only black after that..

Both guys aren't great on there feet! Mir's striking is very overrated after the Kongo fight and Shanes striking only lives from his immense Power. It'll be a lot of fun to see these guys strike it out^^^^

Again first round KO from Shane


----------



## the ultimate (Mar 5, 2007)

I'm taking Carwin. Mir has improved boxing and has dangerous submissions but he doesn't have the chin to take a right hand from Shane and I can see him getting knocked out. 

The fight is win-win for the UFC though. If Mir wins, they get the rubber match which will get huge numbers and a great build-up  If Carwin wins, they get the fight originally planned for UFC 106 but Carwin has a bit more credibilty, has defeated Brock's 'enemy' and it will be the battle of two monsters. So easy to market from the UFC's perspective.


----------



## Indestructibl3 (Apr 2, 2009)

BobbyCooper said:


> The thing we learned from this fight is, that Carwin can take some shots, that Carwin can get on his feet pretty easily against a BJJ Back belt *(remember Gonzaga is a World Champion)* and that Carwin only needs one punch to end this fight.
> 
> I'm really not impressed by Carwins striking, but Mir's neither! But Carwin only needs one jab to end this fight. And he will get at least one hand across Franks shitty Striking defense.
> 
> I pick Shane via KO first round!


Dude, how can you not be impressed with Mir's striking? He showed great standup against Nog (staph infection or not), and then really smashed Kongo (a world-class striker). Personally, I think he's really improved and is VERY dangerous on the feet.

Either way, I'm on board the Shane-Carwin-War-Wagon and I agree with your outcome


----------



## hellholming (Jun 13, 2009)

Rastaman said:


> I'm going with Carwin for the major upset by lucky Guillotine Choke submission early in the first round.


That is never going to happen. Carwin is a purple belt under Nate Marquardt, Mir is a world class black belt.


----------



## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

Indestructibl3 said:


> Dude, how can you not be impressed with Mir's striking? He showed great standup against Nog (staph infection or not), and then really smashed Kongo (a world-class striker). Personally, I think he's really improved and is VERY dangerous on the feet.
> 
> Either way, I'm on board the Shane-Carwin-War-Wagon and I agree with your outcome


Frist: You can't just ignore a staph infection!!!

He landed a beautiful left hand, right on the chin from Kongo. That was a great hit with immense power. Everybody in the HW devision, can land a hand like that and KO an opponent. The even bigger accomplishment however is, that Kongo wasn't even out! He still tried to defend himself and he knew very well where he was at. Just because of Mir's BJJ skills was he able to finsih him.

Don't ask me why Kongo had his hands on his hips..I can't answer you that..

Put both guys into a K-1 match and Kongo will beat him 9 out of 10 times. His stand up is very very overrated! And Carwin will show us why.


----------



## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

I really think this newly revamped Frank Mir is someone who's on a mission. That's not fat he put on. His strength conditioning has vastly improved yet alone his striking which is probably pretty underated. Thing is you can't count out Carwin. He's proven he's got heavy...heavy hands. This is tough. Anybody who says this is an easy match is mistaken, it might end in the first minute, but it can certainly go either way. I want Carwin simply cuz he was slated to fight Brock and we've already seen Frank vs Brock. 

Psychologically I know Frank wants it more. Anybody who trains and puts on 20lbs of muscle is working out like a mad man. I'll give the edge to Carwin though cuz I think Frank is overlooking him. 

Hopefully we see three rounds of war, but unlikely. Both of these fighters are notorious for finishing people within a round.


----------



## NikosCC (May 16, 2007)

I want Carwin to win this but i don't see it.. I hate mir soo much but he will win this fight..


----------



## T.Bone (Oct 15, 2008)

Carwin's got power but he's also sluggish, Frank's gonna be too much for him standing. 

The only way I see Carwin winning is if he gets Frank to the ground which is possible but I think Mir will do enough to keep it standing. 

Eventually I see Shane getting rocked and Frank getting the TKO.


----------



## joe davola (Feb 10, 2010)

UFCFAN18 said:


> Frank Mir will once again be the Interim Champion.















you are making fun of mir right?




props to tramal for the pic


----------



## The Legacy (Aug 14, 2008)

Very tough to call...

I am a fan of Frank Mir, he knows how to sell a fight and I honestly believe him when he says things like wanting to break Lesnar's arm or whatever. I loved it that after being tossed around the cage at UFC 100, Mir got together with Mark Philippi and gained that 20 pound of muscle. 

I think his mind is so focused on earning another fight with Brock that he won't let anything else get in his way. 

For that reason I have to pick Mir here.

However, Mir struggles when he takes any damage and Shane Carwin is one of the hardest hitting men in MMA. Whether he can land that big punch or not is questionable, but if he does then I wouldn't be surprised to see a stunned Mir being knocked down and finished on the ground. 

I'm thinking that Mir's stand up technique will be too good for Carwin but it only takes one punch. 

Mir to take this, I'm not going to predict how or what round though, this is a great fight and very close to call.


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

Mir is the frontrunner of all frontrunners. i cant even recall a time he was in serious trouble and we've seen that "world class bjj" save him.... he just crumbles when ppl are beating on him, from Ian Freeman to Marcio Cruz to Vera and Lesnar x2.... everytime ive seen this guy in trouble he crumbles.

he has the mindframe and atttitude of a champion but in the ring it doesnt seem he is that strong mentally which is why i say Frank Mir will never the top guy for very long, he has the skills and the dedication but some guys.... no matter what they know.... you get em in a tough spot and they crumble. Thats Frank Mir.

That being said, i dont think Shane will even get Mir in trouble. Carwin really isnt as talented as anybody at the top of the division, he is just very big with alot of power.

He is butterbean with a better body. i feel bad for his fans. he is a sucka and will be exposed soon but if he lands that big right on Frank and follows up, he can make Frank quit, no doubt.


----------



## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

I really want Carwin to win this fight, simply because I want him to have the title shot he should of rightfully had last year.

If Mir is next in line for a title shot after this fight then there is a lot of mis-justice in the UFC HW division, even though I believe there is a string possibility that Mir is using his extra size effectively and has become a better fighter since his loss to Brock, that does not chance the fact that he was beaten up easily by Brock last time round an therefore should not be allowed to fight again for the title until at least another contender has there shot, its not like the Shogun/Machida rematch where it was a close arguable decision that decided there last match thus justifying a next title fight rematch.


----------



## Hammerlock2.0 (Jun 17, 2009)

Since I don't really feel the need to see Brock beat up Mir for a third time I'm going with Carwin here. Lesnar has basically shown everyone how to beat Frank Mir on the ground, now it's up to Carwin to do the same. Unless Carwin pulls another Gonzaga and hits Mir square in his face while he's getting outstruck by Frank, I don't see Carwin win this fight on his feet.


----------



## Syxx Paq (Feb 19, 2010)

KillerShark1985 said:


> I really want Carwin to win this fight, simply because I want him to have the title shot he should of rightfully had last year.
> 
> If Mir is next in line for a title shot after this fight then there is a lot of mis-justice in the UFC HW division, even though I believe there is a string possibility that Mir is using his extra size effectively and has become a better fighter since his loss to Brock, that does not chance the fact that he was beaten up easily by Brock last time round an therefore should not be allowed to fight again for the title until at least another contender has there shot, its not like the Shogun/Machida rematch where it was a close arguable decision that decided there last match thus justifying a next title fight rematch.



correction, its not a shogun/machida where the guy who just contended is the only contender, besides this IS for the interim title, which means whoever faces brock will be facing him in a unification bout.


----------



## Danm2501 (Jun 22, 2009)

BobbyCooper said:


> Put both guys into a K-1 match and Kongo will beat him 9 out of 10 times. His stand up is very very overrated! And Carwin will show us why.


Sorry, but Carwin is not going to be the one that's going to show us how over-rated Frank Mir's striking is. Carwin is powerful but that's about it. If he lands a big punch he could win the fight, but he won't out-box Frank Mir and pick holes in Frank's technique. Mir's stand-up will be tested when he fights Junior Dos Santos or Cain Velasquez, they'll be the true tests of the technicality of his stand-up and whether it's been over-rated or not. Carwin could test Mir's chin, but he will not out-strike Mir and prove anything as far as Mir having over-rated stand up goes.


----------



## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

Danm2501 said:


> Sorry, but Carwin is not going to be the one that's going to show us how over-rated Frank Mir's striking is. Carwin is powerful but that's about it. If he lands a big punch he could win the fight, but he won't out-box Frank Mir and pick holes in Frank's technique. Mir's stand-up will be tested when he fights Junior Dos Santos or Cain Velasquez, they'll be the true tests of the technicality of his stand-up and whether it's been over-rated or not. Carwin could test Mir's chin, but he will not out-strike Mir and prove anything as far as Mir having over-rated stand up goes.


Thats true! I misspelled that a little bit. I agree with you, that Mir is the more techincal striker from the two. However Mir has to many holes in his standup and Carwin is a guy who only needs one punch to end the fight. And I guarantee you, that he will get one through Mir's shitty striking defense. It won't show us that Carwin is the better striker, same as Mir didn't showed us, that he is a better striker than Kongo.


----------



## Danm2501 (Jun 22, 2009)

Oh I agree. Mir does have holes in his game, but it'll be a matter of whether Carwin's good enough to exploit them. Carwin's stand-up has looked quite robotic and slow in every one of his UFC fights, and if he starts the same against Mir then we could see an early finish. Really looking forward to the fight, should be a good test as to whether the Carwin hypewagon was justified or not. Question is though, will the long lay off hamper or help Shane Carwin? It'll be over 12 months since his last fight come UFC 111.


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

alizio said:


> Mir is the frontrunner of all frontrunners. i cant even recall a time he was in serious trouble and we've seen that "world class bjj" save him.... he just crumbles when ppl are beating on him, from Ian Freeman to Marcio Cruz to Vera and Lesnar x2.... everytime ive seen this guy in trouble he crumbles.
> 
> he has the mindframe and atttitude of a champion but in the ring it doesnt seem he is that strong mentally which is why i say Frank Mir will never the top guy for very long, he has the skills and the dedication but some guys.... no matter what they know.... you get em in a tough spot and they crumble. Thats Frank Mir.
> 
> ...


Frank Mir hasnt "crumbled" in a fight in years and he is clearly a different, better fighter. Why bring up loses that happened almost 5 years ago???


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

JimmyJames said:


> Frank Mir hasnt "crumbled" in a fight in years and he is clearly a different, better fighter. Why bring up loses that happened almost 5 years ago???


 some of those losses are years apart aswell, everytime he is in trouble he has crumbled, its hard to ignore the mountain of evidence isnt it??

arent BJJ guys supposed to be great at buying time and recovering on the ground?? it just seems weird everytime we see Frank in trouble on the ground by a decent fighter.... he gets finished rather easily. 

Isnt that worrysome to Mir fans??


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

alizio said:


> some of those losses are years apart aswell, everytime he is in trouble he has crumbled, its hard to ignore the mountain of evidence isnt it??
> 
> arent BJJ guys supposed to be great at buying time and recovering on the ground?? it just seems weird everytime we see Frank in trouble on the ground by a decent fighter.... he gets finished rather easily.
> 
> Isnt that worrysome to Mir fans??


Crumbled??? Lets see against Brock the second time Brock had Mir in a position where he couldnt move, gained wrist control and repeatedly punched him in the face till the fight was stopped. How is that crumbling???

I wont even bring up the other loses they were years ago.........

Frank has been in trouble by lots of fighters and has come out the winner in almost all of his fights except 4 fights. He has the most submission wins off his back in UFC history, I wouldnt call that "crumbling."


----------



## UFC on VHS (Dec 16, 2008)

Mir was still going for subs the whole time Brock was punching him in the face the first time. You may get better as a martial artist but the power stays the same, Mir was taking some huge shot and managed to take the win.

I would argue that most of Mir's losses were due to the accident but I think Frank lost to Brandon Vera far in square.


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

JimmyJames said:


> Crumbled??? Lets see against Brock the second time Brock had Mir in a position where he couldnt move, gained wrist control and repeatedly punched him in the face till the fight was stopped. How is that crumbling???
> 
> I wont even bring up the other loses they were years ago.........
> 
> Frank has been in trouble by lots of fighters and has come out the winner in almost all of his fights except 4 fights. He has the most submission wins off his back in UFC history, I wouldnt call that "crumbling."


 .... thats all fine and dandy in the day of scrubs and ppl that had no idea what BJJ was....

again.... nice fact... how many of those "most subs off his back in UFC history" were against ppl with any remote idea of sub defense or BJJ??? he doesnt sub great grapplers. he has subs big cans and guys with no ground game like Timmy and Kongo.

As for "going for subs vs Brock". Thats a nice story. im sure he was attempting many things. The 1st time they met he was overwhelmed aswell by an MMA rookie with little BJJ experience.

BJJ is supposed to be built for the smaller man to beat a bigger man. but now ppl are using the size as an excuse....

yea a smaller man can tap a bigger man... when that bigger man doesnt have a working funcitional knowledge of BJJ himself..... you will be hard pressed to find top level guys like that anymore.

Its funny... nobody believes in Gonzaga or his BJJ and its worlds above Franks.... i would say his standup is about as good if better too.


----------



## Rusko (Feb 4, 2010)

i want carwin to beat mir

then carwin to beat lesnar

and than someone else beat lesnar and mir again so they can stop puttin up a show how they wanna kill each other and how they are number 1 HW

Carwin maybe not well rounded, but i rather having him or Cain representing number 1 HW with needed respect and ethics.


----------



## Scorch (Apr 2, 2007)

I would really like to see Carwin win this. I think he has the ability to pull it off. Mir is going to be tough, but as long as Carwin keeps his cool and stays focused, I think he can do it.


----------



## Atilak (Nov 24, 2009)

I think that Mir could outstrike Carwin with skill and Carwin seems to be rocked easily - Im not saying he has weak chin, but he is just dizzy *everytime* he got hit. Just watch the fights. Mir propably could capitalize on that. 

On the ground. With brutal strenght of Carwin and some BJJ knowledge. He is hard dude to sub. Even for Mir.

If I was Carwin coach I will apply Brocks strategy.. Hit the ground as fastest possible. Get dominant position, no rush(sub prevence) and GNP(again no crazy 10hammers per second - slowly pick him apart). When Mir use BJJ to get on his feet - same like with GG try fast heavy hand. Then get Mir to ground again. Repeat until referee end it or UD win but seriously I dont believe this will be 5 round fight 

This is only way I see Carwin win. Yes he risks a submission but atm from what we know from fights(not hype, training, words etc) Carwin will be in trouble when he tries to stand up with Mir.


----------



## Grotty (Jul 21, 2006)

No dead cert in this fight but i do favour Mir.
Mirs going to box then take Carwin down and go for sub after vicious elbows imo, but i wouldnt bet any money against either fighter.


----------



## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

On the ground. With brutal strenght of Carwin and some BJJ knowledge. He is hard dude to sub. Even for Mir.

If I was Carwin coach I will apply Brocks strategy.. Hit the ground as fastest possible. Get dominant position, no rush(sub prevence) and GNP(again *no crazy 10hammers per second* - slowly pick him apart). 

Lolz...going with Carwin, but it's gonna be a great fight regardless. Don't know if people realize this but these guys are the two quickest finishers in the HW division right now. It be a miracle if it went passed two rounds.


----------



## Stapler (Nov 18, 2006)

This should be an interesting battle. this could potentially show Mir if he is ready for Lesnar. Carwin is sort of similar to Lesnar, a large heavyweight with good wrestling and heavy hands. I'd say Lesnar is slightly bigger though, and has better wrestling. Although I would say Carwin has more knock out power. This should show Mir how far he has come since his loss to Lesnar and if he wins this decisively, he should feel more confident when going up against Lesnar for a third time. Not that Mir is ever at a loss for confidence. I'd still pick Lesnar to beat him regardless of the outcome of this fight. I'm hoping Carwin does win just because I really don't want to see Mir vs. Lesnar again so soon. It's time for some new challenges for Lesnar. It's much more interesting to see how he matches up against another large wrestler like himself.

This should be a fairly exciting bout in my opinion, although I don't see it going passed the first round.


----------



## Baron (Mar 6, 2010)

I disagree with the last guy there. It's too early in Carwin's career and neither have we seen enough of Shane Carwin to say he is only a puncher. This guy Carwin is new and training, young and learning. He can only improve. Mir is as good as he is ever going to get. Even though Mir has put on some weight (note the roid gut in last fight) I don't think he brings anything to the fight that Carwin cannot prepare for. Carwin is ready to wrestle, his Jui Jitsu (sic) defense will be ready. Besides, Frank's addicted to knock outs now that he got such a world-watching taste of knock out rush in his recent fights against Norega (sic) and Kongo. Mark my words. Frank is gonna make a big mistake by ignoring his own strengths, and playing right into Carwin's. Mir is gonna try to go toe to toe with Carwin. Mir is through with fighting from bottom position since the humiliating ass-kicking he got from Lesner. I pick Carwin to knock Mir out, first round, with a left jab straight right combo fired right down the middle.


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

BobbyCooper said:


> Frist: You can't just ignore a staph infection!!!
> 
> He landed a beautiful left hand, right on the chin from Kongo. That was a great hit with immense power. Everybody in the HW devision, can land a hand like that and KO an opponent. The even bigger accomplishment however is, that Kongo wasn't even out! He still tried to defend himself and he knew very well where he was at. Just because of Mir's BJJ skills was he able to finsih him.
> 
> ...


 
Mir's stand up isn't really over rated, he has always had a Karate background so there will naturally be stand up from that, but his head and foot movement are what drew Kongo in.....thats skill on Mir's part to fake Kongo and clean his clock......I remember the talk all the way up to the fight, hell I avy bet Stokes that not only Mir would win via sub, but also he would look better on his feet...he did. 

Also if you look at the combination's he was throwing against NOG I'm not sure how you can say his striking is over rated....it s vastly improved and maybe he isn't getting credit, but dont be surprised if he beats Carwin on his feet....he wont, but it wouldn't shock me....I know NOG was sick, but the 6-8 punk/kick combinations were great. Watch that fight again and look at the 1st series of strikes Mir throws, it keeps getting better as the fight goes on....



NikosCC said:


> I want Carwin to win this but i don't see it.. I hate mir soo much but he will win this fight..


I love it when the hater even admit it.....


----------



## Syxx Paq (Feb 19, 2010)

Now that i have a horse in the Race. GO CARWIN! take the title, take what you've earned, and take with your own hands, rather then let things get out of them, IE. your Heavyweight Title match against Brock.


----------



## Grotty (Jul 21, 2006)

BobbyCooper said:


> Frist: You can't just ignore a staph infection!!!
> 
> 
> Put both guys into a K-1 match and Kongo will beat him 9 out of 10 times. His stand up is very very overrated! And Carwin will show us why.


I believe the strikes were made while they were both standing- very similar to K1 rules mmm, Kongo was stunned by the strikes and no doubt if hed been given a standing count as boxing rules etc Mir would have finished him.


----------



## Scorch (Apr 2, 2007)

I really really want to see Carwin take it! I wonder what Mir will say then? Maybe he'll start having nightmares about Carwin too?


----------



## Syxx Paq (Feb 19, 2010)

Scorch said:


> I really really want to see Carwin take it! I wonder what Mir will say then? Maybe he'll start having nightmares about Carwin too?


then everything hes ever said about brock will mean nothing, and he'll be scandalous for his "kill brock" comments, and an idiot for looking past a man every bit as deadly.


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

Syxx Paq said:


> then everything hes ever said about brock will mean nothing, and he'll be scandalous for his "kill brock" comments, and an idiot for looking past a man every bit as deadly.


 
He isn't looking past Carwin there is a thread on here with Frank being interviewed and he addresses not looking past Carwin to LesNAR....Frank will beat Carwin.....you heard it here 1st....


----------



## jongurley (Jun 28, 2008)

alizio said:


> .... thats all fine and dandy in the day of scrubs and ppl that had no idea what BJJ was....
> 
> again.... nice fact... how many of those "most subs off his back in UFC history" were against ppl with any remote idea of sub defense or BJJ??? he doesnt sub great grapplers. he has subs big cans and guys with no ground game like Timmy and Kongo.
> 
> ...



You are crazy if you think Gonzaga's MMA BJJ is better than Franks,, I am not even going to start arguing,, as far as a "actual" MMA fight Mirs is superior,, only 2nd to Damian Maia,,


----------



## Indestructibl3 (Apr 2, 2009)

Scorch said:


> I really really want to see Carwin take it! I wonder what Mir will say then? Maybe he'll start having nightmares about Carwin too?


Honestly man, if (when) Carwin takes out Mir - I swear Mir is going to go through a major depression.


----------



## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

jongurley said:


> You are crazy if you think Gonzaga's MMA BJJ is better than Franks,, I am not even going to start arguing,, as far as a "actual" MMA fight Mirs is superior,, only 2nd to Damian Maia,,


For real. People downplay Frank's BJJ all the time around here. He's made tons of UFC fighters look stupid with his BJJ. Yes I know haters, everyone he submitted sucked (except the HW champ, but that one doesn't count) and it will never happen again, unless it happens in his next fight, but then definitely never again after that :sarcastic12:.


----------



## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

All Carwin has going for him in this fight is he's heavy handed, but he's also slow and has mediocre footwork. If he takes Frank down he'll get subbed, if he tries to circle and throw bombs Frank will take him apart standing. Frank is a great fighter, he catches a lot of garbage because of the things he says, but that doesn't make him a bad fighter. 

I just can't come up with a way for Carwin to win this fight. I've got Frank by third round sub.


----------



## morninglightmt (Sep 7, 2008)

gwabblesore said:


> For real. People downplay Frank's BJJ all the time around here. He's made tons of UFC fighters look stupid with his BJJ. Yes I know haters, everyone he submitted sucked (except the HW champ, but that one doesn't count) and it will never happen again, unless it happens in his next fight, but then definitely never again after that :sarcastic12:.


lol, im sorry but what are you talking about?

lets look at the list of people he's subbed in mma
Dan Quinn - who?
Roberto Traven
Pete Williams
Tank Abbott - lulz
Tim Sylvia
Antoni Hardonk
Brock Lesnar
Cheick Kongo

Ok, now this is a big list right? But who the hell are these guys? Sylvia was the champ at the time but the guy has nothing in terms of jitz. Tank Abbott...please! When Mir subbed Lesnar it was Lesnar's SECOND mma fight. And Konga also has absolutely laughable jitz. The impressive part of that sub was that he did it after rocking Kongo on the feet. Aside from that the only name on that list is Raberto Traven, who would be EXTREMELY impressive if it were on the list of a middleweight lol. Traven weighs 185 lbs.

Am I saying Mir has bad jitz? Of course not, it's top notch! That's why he subs these people with so much ease! But going by his track record in the UFC, lets get real here. saying he makes UFC guys look terrible...yea it would be awesome to see him actually grapple in the octagon one day with someone who actually practices bjj. Can't wait for the Carwin fight!


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

morninglightmt said:


> lol, im sorry but what are you talking about?
> 
> lets look at the list of people he's subbed in mma
> Dan Quinn - who?
> ...


 
You fail to note any grappling tournaments and competitions Frank has been in. Or any accolades from these competitions......just sayin...


----------



## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

morninglightmt said:


> lol, im sorry but what are you talking about?
> 
> lets look at the list of people he's subbed in mma
> Dan Quinn - who?
> ...


Yes yes I know none of his subs count, I made that disclaimer in my post.


----------



## UFC on VHS (Dec 16, 2008)

BJJ aside Mir is stilla huge threat to Carwin. Alot of people seem to forget that Carwin was catching a beating before he KTFOd Gonazaga. He has tons of power but he doesn't have the most technical striking you have ever seen, that combined with him hesitation because of the BJJ factor might throw him off bigtime.

In all fairness though this fight could end in one so it doesn't really matter how it looks on paper. IMO Mir is the better fighter and deserves to win and I think all will fall through.


----------



## Thelegend (Nov 2, 2009)

UFCFAN18 said:


> BJJ aside Mir is stilla huge threat to Carwin. Alot of *people seem to forget that Carwin was catching a beating before he KTFOd Gonazaga.* He has tons of power but he doesn't have the most technical striking you have ever seen, that combined with him hesitation because of the BJJ factor might throw him off bigtime.
> 
> In all fairness though this fight could end in one so it doesn't really matter how it looks on paper. IMO Mir is the better fighter and deserves to win and I think all will fall through.


a beating that only included 3-4 punches that carwin shrugged off, including the one that broke his nose......gonzaga held his leg for a takedown and carwin fought his way back up *then* he KTFO him.


----------



## The Horticulturist (Feb 16, 2009)

coldcall420 said:


> You fail to note any grappling tournaments and competitions Frank has been in. Or any accolades from these competitions......just sayin...


He makes very good points though. Those grappling competitions are not MMA, and until he subs someone like Nog, people are going to be skeptical. (especially with the very lackluster sub resume) But *I* totally get what you mean.

Personally, I think Mir is going to run through a few guys if he is as slick as he seems to be now. I don't see how you could even escape a choke from a HW like that.


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

SJ said:


> He makes very good points though. Those grappling competitions are not MMA, and until he subs someone like Nog, people are going to be skeptical. (especially with the very lackluster sub resume) But *I* totally get what you mean.
> 
> Personally, I think Mir is going to run through a few guys if he is as slick as he seems to be now. I don't see how you could even escape a choke from a HW like that.


 
Agreed....:thumb02:


----------



## morninglightmt (Sep 7, 2008)

coldcall420 said:


> You fail to note any grappling tournaments and competitions Frank has been in. Or any accolades from these competitions......just sayin...


Not trying to be an arse but I fail to mention them because I can't really find any info on them. Other than wikipedia saying he won some blue belt tourny back in 2001. Do you have the specifics?

Just to be clear, I already voted Mir, just sayin :thumb02:


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

morninglightmt said:


> Not trying to be an arse but I fail to mention them because I can't really find any info on them. Other than wikipedia saying he won some blue belt tourny back in 2001. Do you have the specifics?
> 
> Just to be clear, I already voted Mir, just sayin :thumb02:


 
In the 2 secs I feel like devoting I found these at wiki but there are a lot of vids out there.....:thumbsup:


Grappling credentials
Black belt in Jiu Jitsu under Ricardo Pires.
*Pan-American Championships:*

2001 Blue Belt Pesadissimo: 1st place
*Misc:*

1998 Nevada State Wrestling Champion
2007 NAGA Absolute Division Champion


----------



## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

Little interview with Frank.. 12.03.10


----------



## UFC on VHS (Dec 16, 2008)

^^ Thanks man that's new to me here is part 2 for anyone else wanting to watch it.

http://www.youtube.com/user/ShowMeYourJits#p/a/u/0/dEJWG6rtN_0

That was pretty funny when he made the "Die" comment and quickly backed up and said pass away lmao.


----------



## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

thanks for part 2, I could not find it!

I like Frank's wife, she seems to have a great sense of humour too^^


----------



## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

UFCFAN18 said:


> ^^ Thanks man that's new to me here is part 2 for anyone else wanting to watch it.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/user/ShowMeYourJits#p/a/u/0/dEJWG6rtN_0
> 
> That was pretty funny when he made the "Die" comment and quickly backed up and said pass away lmao.


Embedded for ya..

He Talks about Torres!!!! I love what ever reporter actually asked him about Miguel Torres, that guy is amazing for doing that.






Carwin panics on the ground, Mir will sub him quickly if he ends up on top and Mir can stand with him.


----------



## BrutalKO (Oct 5, 2006)

...Dang. What a wide margin of a poll. If Mir survives the 1st rd. unlike 11 others who challenged Carwin, he may have a chance to win it. I think it all comes down to 1 simple punch for Carwin. Shane is the more hungry fighter. Mir needs a good combination to finish Carwin. Shane only needs one clean punch and Mir will be out cold. I bet Greg Jackson will have the right plan for Carwin to crush Mir. 
...Mir's punches are wide and looping. Shane's are straight and compact with *HUGE* power. A straight punch always beats a looping one. Better chin? Carwin. Bigger KO power? Carwin. Mir can only hope to survive the 1st rd., drag this fight out making Shane gas and possibly submit him. I think Carwin will find his range quickly in the 1st. and shut Mir off like a light switch...:thumbsup:


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

BrutalKO said:


> ...Dang. What a wide margin of a poll. If Mir survives the 1st rd. unlike 11 others who challenged Carwin, he may have a chance to win it. I think it all comes down to 1 simple punch for Carwin. Shane is the more hungry fighter. Mir needs a good combination to finish Carwin. Shane only needs one clean punch and Mir will be out cold. I bet Greg Jackson will have the right plan for Carwin to crush Mir.
> ...Mir's punches are wide and looping. Shane's are straight and compact with *HUGE* power. A straight punch always beats a looping one. Better chin? Carwin. Bigger KO power? Carwin. Mir can only hope to survive the 1st rd., drag this fight out making Shane gas and possibly submit him. I think Carwin will find his range quickly in the 1st. and shut Mir off like a light switch...:thumbsup:


 
Mir has good stand up nd i believe wont fear standing with Carwin at all, nor is he at a disadvantage standing with him....


----------



## BrutalKO (Oct 5, 2006)

Life B Ez said:


> Embedded for ya..
> 
> He Talks about Torres!!!! I love what ever reporter actually asked him about Miguel Torres, that guy is amazing for doing that.
> 
> ...


...Did Shane panic with a large, world-class Jiu Jitsu guy in his half guard? Nope. Did Gabe submit Shane? Nope. Carwin powered back to his feet and shut Gonzo off with a punch that was probably 30% of his full power. Shane was flat footed, had very little space and did that.

* "When a guy can knock a big guy out like Gonzaga with a punch like that, that says a lot"....Rogan.*


----------



## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

BrutalKO said:


> ...Did Shane panic with a large, world-class Jiu Jitsu guy in his half guard? Nope. Did Gabe submit Shane? Nope. Carwin powered back to his feet and shut Gonzo off with a punch that was probably 30% of his full power. Shane was flat footed, had very little space and did that.
> 
> * "When a guy can knock a big guy out like Gonzaga with a punch like that, that says a lot"....Rogan.*


I'm sorry Carwin didn't panic when Gab was on top of him? We watched different fights apparently. Just because you got back up doesn't mean you didn't panic, and that was 30% power? Is Carwin the real life terminator? 30%? Really, it may not have been full power, but if that's 30 what is 100? Will it looks like this?


----------



## BrutalKO (Oct 5, 2006)

coldcall420 said:


> Mir has good stand up nd i believe wont fear standing with Carwin at all, nor is he at a disadvantage standing with him....


...What's up coldcall. Nice to hear your good insight. Really man, like I said in my post, Mir's punches are wide and looping. Carwin's are straight and compact with much more power. Straight punches beat looping ones.


----------



## BrutalKO (Oct 5, 2006)

Life B Ez said:


> I'm sorry Carwin didn't panic when Gab was on top of him? We watched different fights apparently. Just because you got back up doesn't mean you didn't panic, and that was 30% power? Is Carwin the real life terminator? 30%? Really, it may not have been full power, but if that's 30 what is 100? Will it looks like this?


...OK...OK... whatever man. Let's see what happens on the 27th. Enough with this tit for tat stuff...


----------



## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

BrutalKO said:


> ...What's up coldcall. Nice to hear your good insight. Really man, like I said in my post, Mir's punches are wide and looping. Carwin's are straight and compact with much more power. Straight punches beat looping ones.


In fairness everyone said that before Mir fought Kongo. 

Carwin always looks sluggish in the ring too me. I don't think Carwin can take a Mir punch on the chin like he did against Gab and make it back, Mir will finish the fight if he catches him. Having said that, Carwin has a just about equal chance of dropping Mir and it being over. 

Carwin needs to stand with Mir though, I don't think he has a chance on the ground.


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

BrutalKO said:


> ...What's up coldcall. Nice to hear your good insight. Really man, like I said in my post, Mir's punches are wide and looping. Carwin's are straight and compact with much more power. Straight punches beat looping ones.


 
WHATS UP BRUTAL, SHOW ME A LOOPING UPPERCUT AND I'll KISS YOUR ASS!!!! Mir's stand up is easily on par with Carwins and I can rely on my own eyes to tell me that, if anything Carwin has the beefier arms which lead to looping punches....

I'm not saying at times that Mir doesn't throw looping crosses but his striking has alot of kicking mixed into it as well Carwins doesnt....

There have some insight....:thumbsup:


----------



## BrutalKO (Oct 5, 2006)

coldcall420 said:


> WHATS UP BRUTAL, SHOW ME A LOOPING UPPERCUT AND I'll KISS YOUR ASS!!!! Mir's stand up is easily on par with Carwins and I can rely on my own eyes to tell me that, if anything Carwin has the beefier arms which lead to looping punches....
> 
> I'm not saying at times that Mir doesn't throw looping crosses but his striking has alot of kicking mixed into it as well Carwins doesnt....
> 
> There have some insight....:thumbsup:


...Are you ready to kiss it?..lol! just kidding but hey, didn't Mir hit Kongo with a looping overhand left? If not I stand corrected.


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

BrutalKO said:


> ...Are you ready to kiss it?..lol! just kidding but hey, didn't Mir hit Kongo with a looping overhand left? If not I stand corrected.


 
It was actually an over hand left, but even when Mir throws his crosses they ere not looping, his striking is more crisp than Carwins...

But this will all come out in the near future....:thumbsup:


----------



## Johnni G (Dec 2, 2009)

Mir by submission in round 2


----------



## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

how can you guys be so certain, this isn't GSP vs. Hardy, it's too close to call.


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

It's not too close to call for me, I already threw 5 mill on Mir and will be getting a nice return from that....:thumbsup:


----------



## Freiermuth (Nov 19, 2006)

I'm pulling for Carwin. Stand-up is pretty close but Carwin is likely going to be much stronger, even at similar weight.

I'd like for Mir to fight GG after this, if he loses....that would be the closest match-up for me to call I think in the HW division.


----------



## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

I hate Mir, but I believe Mir is the superior fighter; can't doubt his talent. I voted Mir :shame01:


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

Freiermuth said:


> I'm pulling for Carwin. Stand-up is pretty close but Carwin is likely going to be much stronger, even at similar weight.
> 
> I'd like for Mir to fight GG after this, if he loses....that would be the closest match-up for me to call I think in the HW division.


 Carwin will be signifigantly smaller and weaker then Mir on fight night


----------



## Freiermuth (Nov 19, 2006)

alizio said:


> Carwin will be signifigantly smaller and weaker then Mir on fight night


Smaller, maybe, but not weaker and significantly weaker is just crazy-talk  We will see if the clinch up or someone goes for a TD I guess.


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

Freiermuth said:


> Smaller, maybe, but not weaker and significantly weaker is just crazy-talk  We will see if the clinch up or someone goes for a TD I guess.


 I think Carwin might have the grappling strength advantage if thats what you are referring to. But grappling strength and just raw strength are two different things.

Im not sure Carwin has the grappling advantage tho. He has decent wrestling credentials but Frank is a decent wrestler too and with his size and BJJ knowledge i just dont think Carwin can outgrapple him for an extended period even if he did have the strength advantage there.


----------



## Syxx Paq (Feb 19, 2010)

alizio said:


> I think Carwin might have the grappling strength advantage if thats what you are referring to. But grappling strength and just raw strength are two different things.
> 
> Im not sure Carwin has the grappling advantage tho. He has decent wrestling credentials but Frank is a decent wrestler too and with his size and BJJ knowledge i just dont think Carwin can outgrapple him for an extended period even if he did have the strength advantage there.


are you just straight Anti-Carwin? i have a theory as to why, you hate Shane Carwin, because hes a legit threat to both Cain's title hopes and Cain.

you say Carwin will be smaller? lolwat. significantly? LOLOLOLOLOL. weaker? huh, now im getting confused. SIGNIFICANTLY?!?!? just straight up WTF.


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

alizio said:


> I think Carwin might have the grappling strength advantage if thats what you are referring to. But grappling strength and just raw strength are two different things.
> 
> Im not sure Carwin has the grappling advantage tho. He has decent wrestling credentials but Frank is a decent wrestler too and with his size and BJJ knowledge i just dont think Carwin can outgrapple him for an extended period even if he did have the strength advantage there.


 
......:confused02:


----------



## joe davola (Feb 10, 2010)

alizio said:


> I think Carwin might have the grappling strength advantage if thats what you are referring to. But grappling strength and just raw strength are two different things.
> 
> Im not sure Carwin has the grappling advantage tho. He has decent wrestling credentials but Frank is a decent wrestler too and with his size and BJJ knowledge i just dont think Carwin can outgrapple him for an extended period even if he did have the strength advantage there.


frank isn't even close to being a decent wrestler while carwin is a pretty damn good one and if gonzaga couldn't hold him down than mir isn't gonna be able to do shit


----------



## joe davola (Feb 10, 2010)

coldcall420 said:


> In the 2 secs I feel like devoting I found these at wiki but there are a lot of vids out there.....:thumbsup:
> 
> 
> Grappling credentials
> ...


gonzagas credentials

Submission Wrestling Championships

Record of opponents:

Won: Mustapha al-Turk (pts), Ricco Rodriguez (pts), Marcio Cruz (pts), Eduardo Telles (pts) 
Lost: Jeff Monson (pts), Xande Ribeiro (sub) 
2006 Winner CBJJO Copa Do Mundo Black Belt Pesadissimo Winner CBJJ Mundials Black Belt Pesadissimo

2005 2nd CBJJO Copa Do Mundo Black Belt Pesadissimo 3rd CBJJO Copa Do Mundo Black Belt Absolute 2nd place ADCC +99 kg

2003 2nd CBJJO Copa Do Mundo Black Belt Pesadissimo 2nd CBJJO Copa Do Mundo Black Belt Absolute

2000 =3rd Mundials black belt Super-Pesado

i think frank mir is overated in BJJ but is still damn good


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Frank got beat by Roy Nelson waaaaaaaaaaaaaay back in *2003*.

Mir was schooling Nelson till he gassed, Roy also had help as he had somebody on the side telling him what to do. 

Mir BJJ overrated????? GTFOutta here...... He has the most sub victories off his back in UFC history.


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

joe davola said:


> gonzagas credentials
> 
> Submission Wrestling Championships
> 
> ...


 

Im not saying that there arent a slew of GG stats out there, Franks are harder to find, they do exist...

Lets do this, if your so sure sig bet me??? Then I can just say i told you so.


----------



## Freiermuth (Nov 19, 2006)

alizio said:


> I think Carwin might have the grappling strength advantage if thats what you are referring to. But grappling strength and just raw strength are two different things.
> 
> Im not sure Carwin has the grappling advantage tho. He has decent wrestling credentials but Frank is a decent wrestler too and with his size and BJJ knowledge i just dont think Carwin can outgrapple him for an extended period even if he did have the strength advantage there.


Carwin hits harder, has a better shot of getting a TD, and getting back from from a TD, is the angle I'm coming at when I say he is stronger. Even if Mir is 20lbs heavier and can bench-press more, he doesn't seem to have the same muscle mass that Carwin does...that dude is a rock-solid 260-5. Mir's strength is going to help him no doubt, I just don't think he's at the same level as Carwin in that department.

Either way, I hope it's a somewhat close fight so one of them doesn't all of a sudden become a can or lucky.


----------



## xeberus (Apr 23, 2007)

I gotta say Mir, but carwin has so much goddamn power the guy could easily KO anyone in the world. Its his plethora of power, anyone can wind up and get that KO punch... Carwin get sneeze and throw a short punch and its better than ambien.


----------



## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

morninglightmt said:


> lol, im sorry but what are you talking about?
> 
> lets look at the list of people he's subbed in mma
> Dan Quinn - who?
> ...


^^here^^



JimmyJames said:


> Frank got beat by Roy Nelson waaaaaaaaaaaaaay back in *2003*.
> 
> Mir was schooling Nelson till he gassed, Roy also had help as he had somebody on the side telling him what to do.
> 
> Mir BJJ overrated????? GTFOutta here...... He has the most sub victories off his back in UFC history.


Take a look on who Frank subbed throughout his career! Is his BJJ overrated?:confused02: I think it is! For me a really great BJJ guy needs to be very flexible like the Anderson's, Maia's, Penn's. These guys can strain there body and legs to a limit.


----------



## joe davola (Feb 10, 2010)

coldcall420 said:


> Im not saying that there arent a slew of GG stats out there, Franks are harder to find, they do exist...
> 
> Lets do this, if your so sure sig bet me??? Then I can just say i told you so.


sure i'll sig bet may aswell it's a bit of fun


----------



## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

BobbyCooper said:


> Take a look on who Frank subbed throughout his career! Is his BJJ overrated?:confused02: I think it is! For me a really great BJJ guy needs to be very flexible like the Anderson's, Maia's, Penn's. These guys can strain there body and legs to a limit.


What?? Now Silva's BJJ is better than Mir's? Lol okay.

If Mir's striking is overrated, his BJJ is overrated, and his wrestling and everything else sucks you gotta wonder how he stays at the top of the division huh? Just luck I suppose. Expect to see more luck in his next fight.


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

joe davola said:


> sure i'll sig bet may aswell it's a bit of fun


 
I just realized.....can you have text in your sig???? Or can you even have a sig??? If not we could do avy....but i would prefer sig bet....let me know...:thumbsup: Or upgrade....


----------



## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

gwabblesore said:


> What?? Now Silva's BJJ is better than Mir's? Lol okay.
> 
> If Mir's striking is overrated, his BJJ is overrated, and his wrestling and everything else sucks you gotta wonder how he stays at the top of the division huh? Just luck I suppose. Expect to see more luck in his next fight.


Just because Frank won more fights via submission, doesn't make him superior then Anderson. 

Take a look on who Frank fought in the most valuable times in his career. 



> He fought..
> 
> Tank Abbott ( lol )
> 
> ...


can you see now why I think he is overrated?? We can say he had a very lucky draw throughout his career.


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

BobbyCooper said:


> Just because Frank won more fights via submission, doesn't make him superior then Anderson.
> 
> Take a look on who Frank fought in the most valuable times in his career.
> 
> ...


 hehe. frank is a frontrunner from hell.

his biggest win is also his biggest loss. he caught a straight beatdown by an MMA noob and got a heel hook, thats his claim to fame??

The Nog fight was the perfect storm for Frank.

Frank flat out just isnt the athlete like Brock, Cain and JDS are. Thats why he will flat out lose to them all.

Carwin...i dunno  i dont have much faith in him either. Why do you, bobby?? what has Carwin done??

he KO'd Gonzaga with that punch.... now everybody thinks he can land one jab and win a fight?? 

ppl forget that Neil Wain rocked Carwin???

who??

Gonzaga rocked him too. 

Carwin supporters arent worried about his very suspect standup because of some mythical power to KO ppl with any punch that lands??

The deeper it goes, the deeper in trouble Carwin will be. His stand up is horrible. Ppl need to open their eyes past a big right hand.

He is Hendo, with less standup and no clinch.


----------



## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

BobbyCooper said:


> Take a look on who Frank fought in the most valuable times in his career.
> 
> 
> can you see now why I think he is overrated?? We can say he had a very lucky draw throughout his career.


Yes we all know luck is Mir's main asset as a fighter 

You will see more of Mir's luck v. Carwin.


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

BobbyCooper said:


> Take a look on who Frank subbed throughout his career! Is his BJJ overrated?:confused02: I think it is! For me a really great BJJ guy needs to be very flexible like the Anderson's, Maia's, Penn's. These guys can strain there body and legs to a limit.


Ok lets take a look at who he subbed....... 8 of his 13 wins are by submission

Dan Quinn
Roberto Traven...... 1999 Abu Dhabi open class world Champion, 2x first place finish in the World Jiu-Jitsu Championship. Only submission loss of his 10 fight career.
Pete Williams...... First submission loss of 18 career fights
Tank Abbott
Tim Sylvia....... UFC HW Champion on a 16-0 win streak, first career loss.
Antoni Hardonk
Brock Lesnar........... Only loss of short career, Current UFC HW Champ
Ckeick Kongo............First submission loss in 21 career fights

Now I am willing to admit some of those guys arent BJJ world champs or anything near but Frank Mir has used 7 different submissions in his 8 submission victories. Also giving 5 different fighters their first and in some cases only career submission loss. 

Now explain to me how that is overrated BJJ??? :confused02:


----------



## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

alizio said:


> hehe. frank is a frontrunner from hell.
> 
> his biggest win is also his biggest loss. he caught a straight beatdown by an MMA noob and got a heel hook, thats his claim to fame??
> 
> ...


Don't get me wrong alizio I am nowhere near a supporter of somebody like Carwin. Frank is a much better MMA fighter with a bigger skillset then Carwin and I would even wish him luck for this fight, but becauce of the interim titel I just can't do that now. 

How can he be in line for a titel shot is beyond my grasp. Same goes for Carwin, a win over a guy like Gonzaga should not earn you a World Titel Shot!!! 

But we all know that titel shots aren't fair undelivered.. just take a look at my sig.

I hope that Carwin connects with a jab so that we don't need to see a third one sided beating, thats all.. his new muscle mass will only be a bigger disadvantage for Frank..


----------



## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

JimmyJames said:


> Ok lets take a look at who he subbed....... 8 of his 13 wins are by submission
> 
> Dan Quinn
> Roberto Traven...... 1999 Abu Dhabi open class world Champion, 2x first place finish in the World Jiu-Jitsu Championship. Only submission loss of his 10 fight career.
> ...


^^^ :thumbsup:


----------



## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

JimmyJames said:


> Ok lets take a look at who he subbed....... 8 of his 13 wins are by submission
> 
> Dan Quinn
> Roberto Traven...... 1999 Abu Dhabi open class world Champion, 2x first place finish in the World Jiu-Jitsu Championship. Only submission loss of his 10 fight career.
> ...


All the guys he supped throughout his MMA career could not even spell Jiu-Jitsu not to speak of defend it intelligently. 

The only really notable name I give you is Roberto Traven! This submission actually means something.


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

BobbyCooper said:


> All the guys he supped throughout his MMA career could not even spell Jiu-Jitsu not to speak of defend it intelligently.
> 
> The only really notable name I give you is Roberto Traven! This submission actually means something.


Ok I get it you are just being dismissive .............:thumbsdown:


----------



## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

JimmyJames said:


> Ok I get it you are just being dismissive .............:thumbsdown:


No not at all! I respect what Mir did throughout his very successful career, but his submission wins against white-blue belts just aren't as high as many think off.. sry!


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

JimmyJames said:


> Ok lets take a look at who he subbed....... 8 of his 13 wins are by submission
> 
> Dan Quinn
> Roberto Traven...... 1999 Abu Dhabi open class world Champion, 2x first place finish in the World Jiu-Jitsu Championship. Only submission loss of his 10 fight career.
> ...





BobbyCooper said:


> No not at all! I respect what Mir did throughout his very successful career, but his submission wins against white-blue belts just aren't as high as many think off.. sry!


 
You'll prob watch him do it to Carwin and if it ever presented there is no doubt in my mind he would sub GG, the fact that NOG expected a BJJ battle played well to Franks GP as he out pointed NOG easily while NOG had stated he wanted to beat Mir on the ground.....

Frank doesn't get the respect he deserves, but thats okay, cuz he is hell bent on taking it and the accident is a thing of the past he looks great....


----------



## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

If he subs Carwin, that would be another purple belt in his resume^^

But I will stop the criticism now!


----------



## joe davola (Feb 10, 2010)

coldcall420 said:


> You'll prob watch him do it to Carwin and if it ever presented there is no doubt in my mind he would sub GG, the fact that NOG expected a BJJ battle played well to Franks GP as he out pointed NOG easily while NOG had stated he wanted to beat Mir on the ground.....
> 
> Frank doesn't get the respect he deserves, but thats okay, cuz he is hell bent on taking it and the accident is a thing of the past he looks great....


frank mir subbing gonzaga you are talking some shit now


----------



## joe davola (Feb 10, 2010)

coldcall420 said:


> I just realized.....can you have text in your sig???? Or can you even have a sig??? If not we could do avy....but i would prefer sig bet....let me know...:thumbsup: Or upgrade....


actually i don't know my Av comes up sometimes but than everything disappears


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

BobbyCooper said:


> If he subs Carwin, that would be another purple belt in his resume^^
> 
> But I will stop the criticism now!


 
You can bring it all night, you underestimate his Jitz and thats fine, regardless of what Carwin is, thats not franks fault, he doesn't give a shit about who is what color belt he wants LesNAR....Period, i just find it funny that he is so easily tossed to the side as a non top tier BJJ practitioner and thats just not the case.....his subs come quick alot of the time as well.....



joe davola said:


> frank mir subbing gonzaga you are talking some shit now


 
I'm actually not.....you think Mir's belt isnt black?? Regardless tell me what GG is going to do to Mir that Mir cant do to him???:confused02:


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

joe davola said:


> actually i don't know my Av comes up sometimes but than everything disappears


 
Your avy is your BJ penn pic, and i would own it if we bet avy's, cuz, Carwin is gonna lose....it would be a pic of what i want or vice versa god forbid...

Anyway upgrade it's ten bucks you get a ton of cool shit and access to more rooms...


----------



## Emericanaddict (Dec 31, 2006)

Im a huge Carwin fan but im not dillusional. Frank has a ton of experience on his side aswell as his jiu jitsu skills and not to mention new found size and strength advantage. Add to that the fact that it's clear as day that the guy has never been more motivated in his life actualy. I just can't see him being careless and getting caught.

Frank is gonna expose Carwin for being reliant on his 1 punch ko power. That said I LOVE CARWIN dude is one of my idols nowadays but you know what im also sane enough to realise he is probably not going much further than he allready has in the division. It's just facts people, though i would love if he were to win and prove me wrong.


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

Emericanaddict said:


> Im a huge Carwin fan but im not dillusional. Frank has a ton of experience on his side aswell as his jiu jitsu skills and not to mention new found size and strength advantage. Add to that the fact that it's clear as day that the guy has never been more motivated in his life actualy. I just can't see him being careless and getting caught.
> 
> Frank is gonna expose Carwin for being reliant on his 1 punch ko power. That said I LOVE CARWIN dude is one of my idols nowadays but you know what im also sane enough to realise he is probably not going much further than he allready has in the division. It's just facts people, though i would love if he were to win and prove me wrong.


 
Repped for truth....


----------



## americanfighter (Sep 27, 2006)

i really dont know who to cheer for i would love to see mir get his revenge on brock for that last showing but Shane go screwed out of his title shot when brock got sick and think he deserves to fight him.


----------



## Machida Karate (Nov 30, 2009)

Emericanaddict said:


> Im a huge Carwin fan but im not dillusional. Frank has a ton of experience on his side aswell as his jiu jitsu skills and not to mention new found size and strength advantage. Add to that the fact that it's clear as day that the guy has never been more motivated in his life actualy. I just can't see him being careless and getting caught.
> 
> Frank is gonna expose Carwin for being reliant on his 1 punch ko power. That said I LOVE CARWIN dude is one of my idols nowadays but you know what im also sane enough to realise he is probably not going much further than he allready has in the division. It's just facts people, though i would love if he were to win and prove me wrong.



I agree, and i hope Carwin Knocks Mir the F out too


----------



## jdun11 (Apr 23, 2006)

Mir's striking looks better and better everytime out. His footwork and overall movement for a HW is amazing. He might not have the power in his hands that Carwin has, but he has more tools in his shed.

Mir can take out Carwin's legs with leg kicks, which will open up Mir's dangerous uppercut. I expect Carwin to show his lack of big fight experience. Mir will hurt him standing, and Carwin will resort to his wrestling and it will be his downfall. A rocked Carwin will fall victim to an air tight guillotine late in the 1st.

Carwin's chins is suspect. Mir has been there before and might even be the bigger man that night. Throw in Mir's DRASTICALLY improved striking, Carwin is outmatched everywhere.

Mir vs Brock

Cain vs JDS/GG winner

Good stuff! And if they put a Randy Couture/ James Toney fight, or Randy vs anyone as the co main event, it will break all UFC ppv numbers ever.


----------



## Syxx Paq (Feb 19, 2010)

jdun11 said:


> Mir's striking looks better and better everytime out. His footwork and overall movement for a HW is amazing. *He might not have the power in his hands that Carwin has, but he has more tools in his shed.
> *
> Mir can take out Carwin's legs with leg kicks, which will open up Mir's dangerous uppercut. I expect Carwin to show his lack of big fight experience. Mir will hurt him standing, and Carwin will resort to his wrestling and it will be his downfall. A rocked Carwin will fall victim to an air tight guillotine late in the 1st.
> 
> ...


Shane Carwin has a bigger Hammer lol


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

jdun11 said:


> Mir's striking looks better and better everytime out. His footwork and overall movement for a HW is amazing. He might not have the power in his hands that Carwin has, but he has more tools in his shed.
> 
> Mir can take out Carwin's legs with leg kicks, which will open up Mir's dangerous uppercut. I expect Carwin to show his lack of big fight experience. Mir will hurt him standing, and Carwin will resort to his wrestling and it will be his downfall. A rocked Carwin will fall victim to an air tight guillotine late in the 1st.
> 
> ...


 
I think Cain should have to fight again....thats a big win over GG for JDS so if it happens what did Cain do to earn that match up???

I agree on Mir although I dont know if he will get the guillotine in the first as he said he wants the fight to go to the 2nd at least....

I also agree on how much Mir's striking has improved...


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

coldcall420 said:


> I think Cain should have to fight again....thats a big win over GG for JDS so if it happens what did Cain do to earn that match up???
> 
> I agree on Mir although I dont know if he will get the guillotine in the first as he said he wants the fight to go to the 2nd at least....
> 
> I also agree on how much Mir's striking has improved...


 Cain beat a top 5. JDS hasnt done that yet.

He also beat JDS' mentor, trainer and hero.

I dont want that matchup yet either tho. Cain is ahead on the food chain regardless if JDS wins this fight or not. He is next in line after the winner of Carwin/Mir or if the winner is hurt it is his shot.

Cain would be the highest ranked fighter JDS has ever fought.

JDS would be a step down in ranking compared to Nog, who Cain just fought.

I dont understand your thinking here tbh

your saying a win over Gabe Gonzaga is bigger then a win over Minotauro Nogueira?? if so, we disagree. so do the rankings.


----------



## The Horticulturist (Feb 16, 2009)

alizio said:


> Cain beat a top 5. JDS hasnt done that yet.
> 
> * He also beat JDS' mentor, trainer and hero.*
> 
> ...



Probably one of the most convenient reasons currently for the UFC to put this fight together. 

OH YEAH! Aside from the fact it makes 100% sense to see who the hungrier young fighter is.

JDS finishes people, and I want to see if he can finish Cain.


----------



## PheelGoodInc (Jul 23, 2009)

I'm really excited for this fight. I like both Mir and Carwin and will be happy regardless of who wins, or how they win (hopefully by KO).

With that being said, I think Mir has the slight edge. But if Carwin's showed us one thing, it's not to underestimate him. WAR MIR AND CARWIN!


----------



## arkanoydz (Mar 15, 2010)

Though I see Mir as the more experienced, well-rounded fighter, I hope Carwin takes this one for the simple fact that he'd already earned his title shot to face Lesnar in 2009 (was very excited about this one). A rubber match between Mir and Lesnar is far less interesting to me than the other possible HW title fights (JDS, Velasquez, Carwin, Lesnar, Gonzaga...)


----------



## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

You know what would be shocking is if this went the full five rounds...lolz.


----------



## Indestructibl3 (Apr 2, 2009)

arkanoydz said:


> Though I see Mir as the more experienced, well-rounded fighter, I hope Carwin takes this one for the simple fact that he'd already earned his title shot to face Lesnar in 2009 (was very excited about this one). A rubber match between Mir and Lesnar is far less interesting to me than the other possible HW title fights (JDS, Velasquez, Carwin, Lesnar, Gonzaga...)


Exactly, it was unfortunate (for Carwin) that Lesnar became ill because he lost his immediate title shot. Although I believe it was too early for Carwin at the time - it doesn't take away the fact that he had a shot at the title. Hopefully he gets through Mir, and I believe he will, so we can see a more intriguing HW match-up as you said.


----------



## PageFan (Mar 24, 2010)

i'm more excited for this fight than any other upcoming mma fight. maybe machida-rua 2


----------



## Johnni G (Dec 2, 2009)

starting to get excited about this one


----------



## michelangelo (Feb 1, 2009)

I reluctantly voted for Mur. 

Carwin has great power but his standup defense is terrible and we've seen little or nothing of his takedown or submission skills. 

Mur is clearly the more well rounded fighter.

Having said that, the prospect of seeing Brock Mur III is so unappealing, I am rooting for Carwin all the way.


----------



## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

Carwin via brutal KO/TKO 1st Rd. I'm not convinced on the Mir hype after beating an over the hill Nog, getting gifted a submission after a thorough ass kicking by Lesnar, and subbing a one-dimensional kickboxer in Hardonk who barely belongs in the UFC. His only legit win lately is Kongo, and that's because he let Mir get inside his head. 

Carwin isn't getting suckered into the mental shenanigans, and his wrestling and power will make this a repeat of Brock Vs Mir II.


----------



## joe davola (Feb 10, 2010)




----------



## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

wow that is an awesome photoshop, the head looks proportional and the reaction just right and everything.


----------



## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

Hahah...has there ever been a double submission. That would be somethin'... 

I was going to bet on Carwin, but man this is not a good fight to bet on. To me this is like a coin toss. Shane misses a punch, Frank wobbles him with a counter, then takes him down and submits him. OR Frank over commits gets sloppy and gets caught. As I said it would be SHOCKING if it went the full five rounds. 

One thing is for sure Frank has been eating his wheaties...


----------



## TriangleBoy (Feb 6, 2009)

ehh im kinda back and forth on this. 
if it stays standing, shance carwin has a chance since he has good KO power. 
but frank mir has been working on his standup, saying it has been "steamrolling."
if it goes to the ground, carwin's gona have to really utilize his wrestling to stop frank's submissions.

my opinion:Mir by armbar


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

This is great I'm nervous and not even fighting tonight!!!

WAR MIR!!!


They just said Lesnar is in attendance ......... If Mir wins we might have another Rampage Rashad moment......


----------



## Blitzz (Apr 13, 2009)

Lol. Carwin coming out to bodies.


----------



## thrshr01 (Dec 30, 2007)

*Let the Bodies Hit the Floor*

Love Shane's entrance! Almost 600lbs of combined monsters colliding in the cage. hopefully, they reinforced the cage for this one!


----------



## Gonzo (May 19, 2009)

Has this fight started? I just arrived home from work...


----------



## truebluefan (Oct 22, 2007)

I am leaning towards Mir, but ya know either guy can it.


----------



## Terror Kovenant (Nov 16, 2008)

I have no idea who is going to win this fight, but either way I want to see both of these dudes fight Brock. But I'd almost want to see Carwin vs Lesnar first since that would make 3/5s of Brock's UFC fights against Mir lol. But I do love Mir.


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Brock got slightly booooooooo'ed and Dana laughed... LOL


----------



## Guymay (Jul 6, 2009)

I'm so nervous


----------



## Terror Kovenant (Nov 16, 2008)

Brock in a suitcoat....weird


----------



## Gonzo (May 19, 2009)

he dresses like an idiot!


----------



## adobostreak (Apr 8, 2007)

why would you want to take mir down, carwin?


----------



## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

I thought Carwin always came out to Drowning Pool?

Brock's in a suit? A gorilla suit?

EDIT: Oh, holy shit!!


----------



## Gonzo (May 19, 2009)

any punches thrown???


----------



## adobostreak (Apr 8, 2007)

woohoo hit past the 3 minute mark


----------



## thrshr01 (Dec 30, 2007)

Carwin's a FREAKIN BEAST!!!

Edit: Oh, and there goes the idea that Carwin has slow hands.


----------



## Guymay (Jul 6, 2009)

dammit


----------



## adobostreak (Apr 8, 2007)

he's unconscious!! that's worse than what brock did!


----------



## Terror Kovenant (Nov 16, 2008)

my god.....


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

MOTHER F#CKER I AM PISSED.

WAR MIR even in the loss........


----------



## Gonzo (May 19, 2009)

Holy cow!! Carwin for president!!!!!!


----------



## LittleJoe (Oct 15, 2006)

Crap. What happened?


----------



## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

I was rooting for Mir, as well 

But damned if the HW title picture didn't just get HELLA interesting.


----------



## Terror Kovenant (Nov 16, 2008)

Was the ref trying to get Mir killed?

and secondly, Brock is going to lose his title via KO.


----------



## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

Damn, didn't think Carwin would win this. Glad that Mir isn't fighting Lesnar again though.


----------



## Gonzo (May 19, 2009)

Now it's GSP's turn to win by KO!!


----------



## chosenFEW (Oct 25, 2009)

yeah this ref sucks dan mirgliotta F out of here


----------



## Blitzz (Apr 13, 2009)

Man. Mir almost escaped. Oh well.


Cannot wait for July.


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Terror Kovenant said:


> Was the ref trying to get Mir killed?
> 
> and secondly, Brock is going to lose his title via KO.


I hope so, I like Carwin somewhat........ Hate the Brock......


----------



## Blitzz (Apr 13, 2009)

Lesnar makes Carwin look tiny. Holy shitt.


----------



## thrshr01 (Dec 30, 2007)

Damn, Brock dwarfs Carwin.


----------



## Iuanes (Feb 17, 2009)

Miragliotta... brutal reffing. Mir simply didn't respect the power, fatal mistake. Carwin has every chance at catching Brock with something.


----------



## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

Lesnar is huge compared to Carwin.


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

thrshr01 said:


> Damn, Brock dwarfs Carwin.


If Carwin is 6'5" Brock is ay least 6' 7" LOL.......


----------



## Terror Kovenant (Nov 16, 2008)

Iuanes said:


> Miragliotta... brutal reffing. Mir simply didn't respect the power, fatal mistake. Carwin has every chance at catching Brock with something.


Carwin needs to have 100% faith in his hands and use all of his wrestling skills to keep it standing and knock Lesnar's head off. It will happen, Carwin 13 - 0 UFC undisputed HW champ this summer


----------



## The Horticulturist (Feb 16, 2009)

I feel VERY happy that Mur lost for some reason.


----------



## Drogo (Nov 19, 2006)

Terror Kovenant said:


> Was the ref trying to get Mir killed?
> 
> and secondly, Brock is going to lose his title via KO.


Yeah, I thought that went on a little too long, Mir was clearly done. 

In any case, I'm surprised. Mir was so passive. He didn't even try to get anything going in the clinch, he just seemed to be waiting for....I don't know what and finally Carwin starts throwing and boom. I'd like to know what Mir was thinking there.


----------



## NameChange (Mar 4, 2007)

What a terrible job yet again my mirgo.:thumbsdown:


----------



## UFCFAN89 (Jan 20, 2010)

Just goes to show you how classy Carwin is...Brock was tryin to get some trash talk going and Shane wanted no part of it haha. Brock looks HUGE, great to see him back.

Can't wait for that fight!


----------



## LV 2 H8 U (Nov 7, 2006)

LOL @ MIRs height stat 6'2" and Carwins 6'5" and Carwin was visibly shorter.

Was it just me or did Carwin look alot smaller this fight.


----------



## michelangelo (Feb 1, 2009)

Thank you Shane! I am so sick of Mur!!!!! His relentless trash talking was all for naught, baby. In your face Mur!

ps: Miragliotta surpasses Azzagatti as the worst ref in all of MMA.


----------



## Walker (May 27, 2007)

Miragliotta was terrible- Shane was awesome. I picked Mir but Carwin was dominate and even after all the work Frank can't handle the bigger powerful fighters. Great win for Shane and now the King Kong vs. Godzilla hype will begin until Carwin and Brock face off. Good stuff in the HW division with Cain and Dos Santos waiting in the wings. This division is finally exciting again. :thumbsup:


----------



## Freiermuth (Nov 19, 2006)

Was hoping for a longer fight, but glad Carwin pulled through.


----------



## michelangelo (Feb 1, 2009)

Yeah, Brock's at 280 and counting...



UFCFAN89 said:


> Just goes to show you how classy Carwin is...Brock was tryin to get some trash talk going and Shane wanted no part of it haha. Brock looks HUGE, great to see him back.
> 
> Can't wait for that fight!


----------



## Terror Kovenant (Nov 16, 2008)

Drogo said:


> Yeah, I thought that went on a little too long, Mir was clearly done.
> 
> In any case, I'm surprised. Mir was so passive. He didn't even try to get anything going in the clinch, he just seemed to be waiting for....I don't know what and finally Carwin starts throwing and boom. I'd like to know what Mir was thinking there.


When you've got guys like Carwin that hit that hard, the refs need to do their best to stop unnecessary blows. Mir was flat on his belly with his hands spread out, sleeping. The ref still didnt stop it. 

Mir didn't seem himself, like he wasn't there mentally. I definitely expected better out of him tonight. He will come back even better though


----------



## Gonzo (May 19, 2009)

How happy do you think Kongo is right now? Lol


----------



## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

LV 2 H8 U said:


> LOL @ MIRs height stat 6'2" and Carwins 6'5" and Carwin was visibly shorter.
> 
> Was it just me or did Carwin look alot smaller this fight.


The UFC's height measurements are always terrible.
I remember when Anderson debut, him and Chris Leben were both listed at 5'11, then they step in the cage and Anderson is like 3, 4 inches taller. :laugh:


----------



## Hellboy (Mar 15, 2008)

SJ said:


> I feel VERY happy that Mur lost for some reason.


Because he is an arrogant douche ?


----------



## Dakota? (Dec 27, 2009)

Missed it, need GIF now pls


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

I am not a happy camper........

Horrible reffing but I cant even use that as an excuse.....

MIR what were you thinking????


----------



## Redline7 (Mar 28, 2010)

Carwin did very well, but I still disappointed Mir didn't get the win. I hope Carwin takes that belt from Lesnar though!


----------



## Iuanes (Feb 17, 2009)

It looked like Mir was hoping to outlast Carwin. Trying to pull him into the later rounds and outstrike him.


----------



## Elitemajik (Dec 31, 2006)

Brock is in Mir's head and its effecting Mir even when he is fighting someone else


----------



## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

I don't know if I want Mir vs. Dos Santos after this... the thought of my boy Frank getting knocked out two fights in a row is more than my nut-hugging heart can bear


----------



## Jawni (Sep 27, 2009)

wow, this one shocked me. i mean, we all knew that if Carwin caught him well Mir would be done, but so soon? What was Mir thinking? Was there any gameplan?

Can't wait for July, man


----------



## Terror Kovenant (Nov 16, 2008)

Canadian Psycho said:


> I don't know if I want Mir vs. Dos Santos after this... the thought of my boy Frank getting knocked out two fights in a row is more than my nut-hugging heart can bear


Wont happen, Cain vs JDS will be more likely as long as Carwin and Lesnar stay healthy. Mir will probably rematch Nog


----------



## LittleJoe (Oct 15, 2006)

We need GIF's of the knock out and Brock and Carwin facing each other.


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Canadian Psycho said:


> I don't know if I want Mir vs. Dos Santos after this... the thought of my boy Frank getting knocked out two fights in a row is more than my nut-hugging heart can bear


I agree and feel the same way.........:thumbsdown:


----------



## Freiermuth (Nov 19, 2006)

So what's next for Mir? I'm hoping for him vs GG personally.


----------



## michelangelo (Feb 1, 2009)

Frank will have to work his way back up against tier 2 or tier 3 heavyweight contenders: fighters such as Roy Nelson, Rothwell, or Gonzaga come to mind.

The UFC loves Gonzaga though so he'll get someone like Struve or Buentello for another W before he gets another tough fight. That HK KO to Mirko, Joe Silva and Dana will never forget that, lol. 



Freiermuth said:


> So what's next for Mir? I'm hoping for him vs GG personally.


----------



## deadmanshand (Apr 9, 2008)

Lesnar looked a lot bigger than Carwin standing in the octagon with him. Height and shoulder breadth. Kinda surprised me. I knew he was bigger but not that much bigger.

And Carwin's td attempt was really slow and pathetic. Good god.


----------



## LV 2 H8 U (Nov 7, 2006)

Roflcopter said:


> The UFC's height measurements are always terrible.
> I remember when Anderson debut, him and Chris Leben were both listed at 5'11, then they step in the cage and Anderson is like 3, 4 inches taller. :laugh:


I know huh. :dunno:


----------



## chosenFEW (Oct 25, 2009)

everyone said nog was too old when cain took him out.


mir didn't look impressive at all.... AND he actually bulked up nicely too


----------



## Freiermuth (Nov 19, 2006)

michelangelo said:


> The UFC loves Gonzaga though so he'll get someone like Struve or Buentello for another W before he gets another tough fight. That HK KO to Mirko, Joe Silva and Dana will never forget that, lol.


Haha yeah, that image is burned into my memory.


----------



## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

Mir, its time to rethink your focus. Let Brock go and get on with your life. Clearly you were looking past Carwin with even talking about Brock and how you want to injure him.


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Carwin obviously has much more power in his hands than Lesnar.......

I just dont know what Frank was thinking standing with him like that........


Oh well..... bummed out for the night......


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

lost some credits but was worth it.

front runner frank with that world class bjj to save the day!!


----------



## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

I always back Frank and gave him support, but after this fight, it's become very clear to me that when things get tough Frank quits. He clearly wanted the ref to stop the fight, when it didn't happen he rolled and laid out flat. It pains me to say this but I don't think he's ever going to hold a title again. 

I put money on Frank, figuring the new and improve Frank Mir would withstand a punch and have some heart. But after this fight, I'm really questioning if Frank has the heart to go through a war. At this point I don't think he does.


----------



## Freiermuth (Nov 19, 2006)

JimmyJames said:


> Carwin obviously has much more power in his hands than Lesnar.......
> 
> I just dont know what Frank was thinking standing with him like that........
> 
> ...


Yeah I was thinking Mir should let Carwin take him down and pull him in guard because he just looked sorta zoned out when he was pressed against the cage...like he didn't care at all for some reason. I know he's good about staying calm, but he took it too the next level.


----------



## diablo5597 (Nov 12, 2008)

I think Frank is an amazing fighter, but HUGE strong wrestlers like Carwin and Brock I think are bad match ups for him. I don't know what Frank could have done really. Carwin forced the clinch and landed bombs from there.


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

anybody with good standup and good TDD is a bad matchup for Frank.

which is pretty much all the elite HWs.


----------



## michelangelo (Feb 1, 2009)

I picked Mur in this fight as well, but the top HW's in the UFC have unreal power: Brock, Shane, and Cain. JDS is up there as well. Gonzaga has one strike KO power as well, as we have seen. Kongo has heavy hands. This division at the top, is very dangerous. 

No shame in Frank losing tonight. The UFC is unpredictable, bro. Frank will be back. 




Life B Ez said:


> I always back Frank and gave him support, but after this fight, it's become very clear to me that when things get tough Frank quits. He clearly wanted the ref to stop the fight, when it didn't happen he rolled and laid out flat. It pains me to say this but I don't think he's ever going to hold a title again.
> 
> I put money on Frank, figuring the new and improve Frank Mir would withstand a punch and have some heart. But after this fight, I'm really questioning if Frank has the heart to go through a war. At this point I don't think he does.


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Life B Ez said:


> I always back Frank and gave him support, but after this fight, it's become very clear to me that when things get tough Frank quits. He clearly wanted the ref to stop the fight, when it didn't happen he rolled and laid out flat. It pains me to say this but I don't think he's ever going to hold a title again.
> 
> I put money on Frank, figuring the new and improve Frank Mir would withstand a punch and have some heart. But after this fight, I'm really questioning if Frank has the heart to go through a war. At this point I don't think he does.


It has nothing to do with his heart tonight.

How have others fared standing with Shane Carwin??? Not so good.

I think Frank may have underestimated his power, and Carwin never gave him a chance to recover. Good fight for Carwin, first huge win for him.


----------



## UrbanBounca (Sep 13, 2009)

michelangelo said:


> I picked Mur in this fight as well, but the top HW's in the UFC have unreal power: Brock, Shane, and Cain. JDS is up there as well. Gonzaga has one strike KO power as well, as we have seen. Kongo has heavy hands. This division at the top, is very dangerous.


It's the HW division, it's kind of expected. :thumb02:


----------



## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

Frank is done as a HW champ, He will NEVER beat Lesnar, and seeing him get destroyed like this by Carwin, I dont see a JDS fight going any differently.


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

UrbanBounca said:


> It's the HW division, it's kind of expected. :thumb02:


 frank never had that KO power, ppl just made it out like he did.

he had to work over a weakened Nog for 7 min to stop him and still didnt really KO him.

He staggered Kongo but didnt have him close to finished.

Frank prob has the least power of all the top HWs standing.

I thought he would have a better strategy for Shane. He didnt or couldnt implement it. Im not sure what he can do. he is grasping for answers by getting bigger, did the size serve him that well?? i rather get FASTER to combat the monsters, you cant just become one of them in 6 months.


----------



## michelangelo (Feb 1, 2009)

Finally!

Oh, don't forget about Roy trailer park trash buddha belly Nelson. And I say that with all due respect, lol. 



UrbanBounca said:


> It's the HW division, it's kind of expected. :thumb02:


----------



## footodors (Aug 26, 2007)

frank, ever heard of offense? 
Push him off you against the cage. 
don't just stand their both doing nothing until Carwin says, "I'm bored, think I'll start throwing haymakers and see what happens"
Friggin Mir!


----------



## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

JimmyJames said:


> It has nothing to do with his heart tonight.
> 
> How have others fared standing with Shane Carwin??? Not so good.
> 
> I think Frank may have underestimated his power, and Carwin never gave him a chance to recover. Good fight for Carwin, first huge win for him.


It just looked like he quit to me and was waiting for the ref to step in and stop it. He didn't look like he wanted to fight anymore, just like when Brock was beating him at 100.

I think he's got a little too much confidence in his stand-up now too. He should have pulled guard and put Carwin on the ground.


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

Life B Ez said:


> It just looked like he quit to me and was waiting for the ref to step in and stop it. He didn't look like he wanted to fight anymore, just like when Brock was beating him at 100.
> 
> I think he's got a little too much confidence in his stand-up now too. He should have pulled guard and put Carwin on the ground.


 lets look at Franks losses

Vera- GNP'd into hamburger 1:09
Carwin - GNP'd into hamburger at 3:48 
Cruz - GNP'd into hamburger 4:10
Freeman - GNP'd into hamburger at 4:35
Lesnar GNP'd into hamburger at 6:48

do we see a common theme here?? 

infact, Lesnar took the longest to do it. 

Front runner Frank will be the 1st to quit when the going gets tough, i said that for quite awhile.

dont worry, other HWs you can support with <3  maybe Carwin, he looked pretty beastly i may have underestimated him.


----------



## HitOrGetHit (Jun 29, 2009)

Frank definitely looked to have given up to me. He wasn't unconscious, he laid on his stomach and it looked like he was just waiting for the ref to step in.


----------



## box (Oct 15, 2006)

Congrats to Carwin, still works a fulltime job and trains to do this. I'm glad Carwin gets the shot, why rush another Mir/Lesnar bout when Frank still isn't ready for that.


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Life B Ez said:


> *It just looked like he quit to me and was waiting for the ref to step in and stop it. He didn't look like he wanted to fight anymore, just like when Brock was beating him at 100.*
> 
> I think he's got a little too much confidence in his stand-up now too. He should have pulled guard and put Carwin on the ground.


With this post you make it obvious to me you have never been punched in the head.

Ever heard of the term "rocked"?


----------



## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

alizio said:


> lets look at Franks losses
> 
> Vera- GNP'd into hamburger 1:09
> Carwin - GNP'd into hamburger at 3:48
> ...


I really want Frank to get some heart, he's a great fighter. I can't stand Lesnar and I think Carwin is too wild a striker to have any lasting power. It's a toss up between Cain and JDS at this point.



HitOrGetHit said:


> Frank definitely looked to have given up to me. He wasn't unconscious, he laid on his stomach and it looked like he was just waiting for the ref to step in.


Exactly, he wasn't out, everyone I was watching with was screaming about a late stoppage and I said it wasn't, that Frank was just laying out waiting for the ref, it was clear he wasn't out, a little rocked but not out.


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Frank was out on his feet and the ref should have stopped it sooner.


----------



## xbrokenshieldx (Mar 5, 2007)

I agree with the posts above. I don't think Mir is that strong psychologically. It seems like every time he faces adversity he collapses. He has all the tools, but I am not sure he has the psychological part down inside the cage.

Taking nothing away from Carwin. I still think he has the best shot at taking Lesnar out. Looking forward to that fight.


----------



## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

JimmyJames said:


> Frank was out on his feet and the ref should have stopped it sooner.


He gets rocked and his legs buckle and he goes down, but you see him recover when Carwin starts throwing wildly. Show me the punch that put him to sleep after that? You can see that's he's still conscious when Carwin is throwing bombs from his back. Frank was awake and sitting up almost immediately after ALL THOSE PUNCHES that's someone who just didn't want to fight anymore, not someone who just got KO'd.

And don't get me wrong, I love Frank Mir, I'm just a little disgusted by how he fought tonight.


----------



## box (Oct 15, 2006)

what are you guys talking about. Carwin hit him with a cinder block uppercut over and over until Frank finally dropped, then more full bore shots to the ear and behind the ear, yea....giving up under pressure.


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Life B Ez said:


> He gets rocked and his legs buckle and he goes down, but you see him recover when Carwin starts throwing wildly. Show me the punch that put him to sleep after that? You can see that's he's still conscious when Carwin is throwing bombs from his back. Frank was awake and sitting up almost immediately after ALL THOSE PUNCHES that's someone who just didn't want to fight anymore, not someone who just got KO'd.
> *
> And don't get me wrong, I love Frank Mir, I'm just a little disgusted by how he fought tonight.*


I am pissed also about his performance. I think he fought a very shitty gameplan.

That thing that is really pissing me off is seeing all the flip floppers in this thread that were giving Mir all the praise in the world about how he has changed as a fighter and when he gets TKO'ed they start with the it the same old Frank Mir talk....... N00b bullshit. 

And how anybody can questions another mans heart without knowing him is beyond me. Maybe he has a lot of personal friends here I guess. 

Yea I'm bitter cause Mir lost.


----------



## TraMaI (Dec 10, 2007)

Fight stoppage was possibly the worst I have EVER seen. Fight should've been called WAY, WAY before it was. Jesus Christ Dan >:[ On top of that he had one of the WORST stand ups I've ever seen with Fitch and Saunders. Terrible, terrible referee.

On to the point:

HUGE respect to Carwin for that fight. IMO he is FULLY deserving of his shot now. Really sad to see Mir beat but God dammit if I don't want to see if Carwin can wreck Lesnar's face off like that. Huge props to him.


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

TraMaI said:


> Fight stoppage was possibly the worst I have EVER seen. Fight should've been called WAY, WAY before it was. Jesus Christ Dan >:[ On top of that he had one of the WORST stand ups I've ever seen with Fitch and Saunders. Terrible, terrible referee.
> 
> On to the point:
> 
> HUGE respect to Carwin for that fight. IMO he is FULLY deserving of his shot now. Really sad to see Mir beat but God dammit if I don't want to see if Carwin can wreck Lesnar's face off like that. Huge props to him.


I approve of and agree with every single word in this post 100%.

Repped'


----------



## AK-Bronco (Feb 25, 2008)

To quote my wife after the fight "This some WWE shit, why doesn't he put on a cowboy hat and gab a folding chair?" I mean seriously, Shane just tooled Frank, how long has it been since Brock fought? Why bring Brock up to the octagon? That was lame.


----------



## dtreidjr (Oct 15, 2006)

What is wrong with you people?

He has no heart??? Are you serious??? He is getting pounded on by a 265lb man who trains to pound other men with his fists. You people are absolute retards. You think after all the endless hours of training he does, he has no heart? You seriously are a bunch of idiotic armchair quarterbacks. Freaking internet dorks.


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

AK-Bronco said:


> To quote my wife after the fight "This some WWE shit, why doesn't he put on a cowboy hat and gab a folding chair?" I mean seriously, Shane just tooled Frank, how long has it been since Brock fought? Why bring Brock up to the octagon? That was lame.


 How long had it been since Shane fought?? 

they brought in Lesnar so they could hype the fight, why wouldnt they?? Brock was pretty funny and what he said was true. That belt is fake.


----------



## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

That was pretty much exactly the fight I expected. Frank Mir thinks just by gaining 30lbs he will instantly start winning. Sorry Frank, but these guys are also wrestlers who are used to pushing people their size around, you aren't. 

I think that win was impressive enough that Carwin deserves the shot at Lesnar now. It will be interesting to see if Lesnar can push and takedown Carwin, if not Carwin proved tonight that he is lethal from in the clinch. I still think Lesnar will prove how dominant he is, but I also think Carwin showed how legit he is and I think it will be an awesome fight!


----------



## Nomale (Apr 22, 2007)

Carvin has some serious power in those short range dirty strikes! 
I'm not so sure about Mir qutting though - he was clearly rocked on his feet and while not unconcious his brain might not had the time to recover properly during that onslaught. I also thought the ref was too late.


----------



## AK-Bronco (Feb 25, 2008)

alizio said:


> How long had it been since Shane fought??
> 
> they brought in Lesnar so they could hype the fight, why wouldnt they?? Brock was pretty funny and what he said was true. That belt is fake.


OH, you mean hype the fight scheduled for last year? That was a Busch League Fail move. Unless the "million dollar man" is involved, I don't need the "bring it on" moment.


----------



## Nomale (Apr 22, 2007)

dtreidjr said:


> What is wrong with you people?
> 
> He has no heart??? Are you serious??? He is getting pounded on by a 265lb man who trains to pound other men with his fists. You people are absolute retards. You think after all the endless hours of training he does, he has no heart? You seriously are a bunch of idiotic armchair quarterbacks. Freaking internet dorks.


Bring the wrath! :happy01:

Yeah, I don't think some people realise how disoriented etc. you can get when rocked.


----------



## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

Nomale said:


> Bring the wrath! :happy01:
> 
> Yeah, I don't think some people realise how disoriented etc. you can get when rocked.


I agree with you.....

As I have said earlier in this thread I think some people have never been punched in the head before and have no idea what it is like. 

And then they have the nerve to talk shit about a fighter????? Please......


----------



## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

Guess I was one of the few who gave Carwin the slight edge in taking this. Still think it's a coin toss, but I just knew from watching his fights that he has such HEAVY HEAVY hands and can pound out anyone into oblivion. That clinch shows how much strength Shane has. He completely bullied Frank and trapped him there like how Brock did. 

Too bad, was hoping for a more competitive fight. Well now we get to see the fight that should have happened a year ago. I went with Carwin then and I'm going with him again. He's the champion of the underdogs...a blue collar fighter that minds his own and handles his business in the cage when it counts.


----------



## Nomale (Apr 22, 2007)

AK-Bronco said:


> OH, you mean hype the fight scheduled for last year? That was a Busch League Fail move. Unless the "million dollar man" is involved, I don't need the "bring it on" moment.


What's so hard to get? This fight was for the *interim* belt, so they brought the "real" belt holder in to show/hype what's next for the two belt holders.


----------



## ESPADA9 (Oct 13, 2006)

Nomale said:


> Carvin has some serious power in those short range dirty strikes!
> I'm not so sure about Mir qutting though - he was clearly rocked on his feet and while not unconcious his brain might not had the time to recover properly during that onslaught. I also thought the ref was too late.


Yea I don't think Mir gave up I think he failed to consider how truly dangerous ONE shot can be from Carwin, he did seem somewhat lethargic against the cage though, almost like he lost focus.

It only proves what most people were already saying Carwin only has to land one accurate shot and the fight turns a corner.


----------



## AK-Bronco (Feb 25, 2008)

Nomale said:


> What's so hard to get? This fight was for the *interim* belt, so they brought the "real" belt holder in to show/hype what's next for the two belt holders.


Was Randy in the face of Mir when he won the interm? That was just staged theatrics, If you can't fight for your own title just STFU and sit down. If your tough enough to step up to Crawin, why aren't you fighting him?


----------



## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

haha show me the credits, called my 1st rd KO! It was obvious with Mir's burning rage trash talk mental game... that kinda thing only works on fools like Kongo that fall for it. Against calm guys like Carwin it gets in your own head and gets your head blown off. The fool deserved it.


----------



## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

AK-Bronco said:


> If your tough enough to step up to Crawin, why aren't you fighting him?


Ummmm... Brock _is_ fighting Carwin... :confused02:


----------



## AK-Bronco (Feb 25, 2008)

Canadian Psycho said:


> Ummmm... Brock _is_ fighting Carwin... :confused02:


Yes, I know Brock is now scheduled to fight Carwin, just like last year. 

My point is, why are you not fighting Carwin NOW? If you are Johnny Tough Guy?


----------



## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

Ah, you're one of those conspiracy theorists who believes Brock ducked Shane, and wasn't actually ill. Gotcha.


----------



## AK-Bronco (Feb 25, 2008)

Not my point, if your unable to fight and a interm fight has to be named, just sit down and let Carwin have his moment. If your such a tough guy, to call out the Interm, why is there an interm?


----------



## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

Liddellianenko said:


> haha show me the credits, called my 1st rd KO! It was obvious with Mir's burning rage trash talk mental game... that kinda thing only works on fools like Kongo that fall for it. Against calm guys like Carwin it gets in your own head and gets your head blown off. The fool deserved it.


I agree, the people I watched it with who know jack about mma kept saying that he looked way too relaxed and overconfident. Mir's only real chance was outboxing him technically and employing his handspeed, but he felt so invincible he decided a clinch game was a good idea, I hate to say it because even up until tonight I liked Mir, but what a dumbass. I mean after the first time Carwin had him against the fence he got dominated you'd think he'd learn to keep his distance.


----------



## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

It's called selling a fight, AKB. Just like they attempted to do with Evans and Jackson. The fighting is very real, but at the end of the day, it's a business, and it's entertainment. They have to sell it to the casual fans and 'in-the-know' fans alike. Frankly, I don't see a mini-confrontation as being all that big of a deal. We've seen it in boxing, and it's only meant to garner further interest. You're reading more into the matter than there is to be read.


----------



## AK-Bronco (Feb 25, 2008)

Canadian Psycho said:


> It's called selling a fight, AKB. Just like they attempted to do with Evans and Jackson. The fighting is very real, but at the end of the day, it's a business, and it's entertainment. They have to sell it to the casual fans and 'in-the-know' fans alike. Frankly, I don't see a mini-confrontation as being all that big of a deal. We've seen it in boxing, and it's only meant to garner further interest. You're reading more into the matter than there is to be read.


Maybe it's just Brock's WWE past. With that said could you see Anderson, GSP or Machita pulling that kind of stunt?


----------



## BrutalKO (Oct 5, 2006)

...I stated before that I had a strong feeling Mir was overlooking Carwin. He did. He stepped into the cage like it was just another day on the job and paid dearly for it. Mir got mashed to a pulp. A year ago I wanted the two superpowers Carwin & Lesnar to face each other. I got my wish. 12-0 and *still* Shane hasn't let anybody out of the first round alive. I can't wait for the monster & the gorilla to face each other, while the other two wreckingballs ( Cain & JDS) will now probably meet. The HW division is roaring back in leaps & bounds...:thumbsup:


----------



## Indestructibl3 (Apr 2, 2009)

WAR CARWIN! Bring on Lesnar, then Cain, then JDS ...


----------



## Crester (Apr 5, 2009)

AK-Bronco said:


> Maybe it's just Brock's WWE past. With that said could you see Anderson, GSP or Machita pulling that kind of stunt?


I think that "stunt" was set up by the UFC to build hype for the future fight... not Lesnar. I remember with the confrontation with Rampage and Rashad... Rashad was TOLD to go into the ring.

So don't blame Lesnar.


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

AK-Bronco said:


> Maybe it's just Brock's WWE past. With that said could you see Anderson, GSP or Machita pulling that kind of stunt?


 GSP came in the ring and told Matt Hughes "i was not impressed by your performance".

stfu with the ignorant double standard cuz of Brocks past. Dana WANTED him to do the stare down thing. The fact that Brock is funny and can sell a fight is just a bonus.


----------



## AK-Bronco (Feb 25, 2008)

Once again, not like GSP vs. Hughes or Rashad vs. Quentin this was an Interm fight. If you are tough enough to step up to Carwin, why can't fight him?


----------



## FrankMir20 (Dec 21, 2009)

AK-Bronco said:


> Once again, not like GSP vs. Hughes or Rashad vs. Quentin this was an Interm fight. If you are tough enough to step up to Carwin, why can't fight him?


he is going to fight him, in july..stop making a big fuckin deal about it? Dana most likely told him to do it..:confused03:


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

anyways....

Frontrunner Frank fans. how can u say he isnt a frontrunner?? the guy is so scared of getting hit.

he has the handspeed advantage in this fight?? i thought he would. he was way too scared to even get off and keep Carwin at bay.

Mir is the ultimate frontrunner. say w/e you want about it. when he is in trouble he will fold. when he is in the belly of the beast he wont get off 1st he will hesitate and crumble.

Frank needed to get off and get off 1st EVERYTIME, instead he just kinda stood around, threw a couple punches, felt the power and backed off and let himself get pinned against the cage and casually let himself get KOd.


----------



## AK-Bronco (Feb 25, 2008)

FrankMir20 said:


> he is going to fight him, in july..stop making a big fuckin deal about it? Dana most likely told him to do it..:confused03:


You are soooo right, this is a awesome bought, why didn't it happen sooner?


----------



## bedcommando (Oct 16, 2006)

Carwin surprised me I didn't think it'd be that quick.

Who had predicted Mir's game plan as blocking shots with your head?

All kidding aside I like Mir but he fights too cocky. It's good to be confident but so confident you think punches will feel like pillows. Than your in trouble.


----------



## Danm2501 (Jun 22, 2009)

Seems I'm going to have to eat some crow here. I didn't honestly see Carwin winning that fight, but he performed excellently. His stand-up didn't look great, got caught by a couple of shots, but against the cage Mir didn't have a hope in hell. Awesome power, and a very good performance. Looking forward to seeing how he goes against a much more explosive wrestler though.


----------



## limba (Jul 21, 2009)

One thing Mir was right about: Carwin is a better version of Brock (i think it's only half true), but still. Carwin needed half the amount of time Brock needed. 

Not much to say about the fight.
I give all the credit to Carwin. big congratulations. Came in, got the TKO...what else is there to say? Carwin just proved he has amazing power in his hands. Those are like atomic bombs...daaamn.

As for Mir...big mouth again. I would like to point out some things i consider to be worthy of pointing out, at least for me:
1. there were a lot of people who said Mir looked bigger than Carwin at the weigh-in, but as you can see, bigger isn't stronger. I think all this bulking-up Mir has done lately, isn't worth anything when you face someone who has done this his entire life, or at least, a lot more than you have. I don't know where all that strength and power Mir has received thanks to his new training is. I mean, Carwin tooled him the same way Brock did. When Mir had Carwin preseed on the cage, that lasted like 2 seconds. Carwin reversed the position eay to easy. He was bulking up exactly for this reason: to be able to hold these strong guys (Carwin, Brock) and not get tooled by them. Failed! I don't wanna sound mean, but I think all this power training wasn't all natural (if you know what i mean)
2.i thaught Mir was smarter than this. He got manhandled the same way by Brock. Got killed in the clinch. And still he didn't try to avoid it. I think he is a better boxer than Carwin, but that is worth ZERO if you don't use it in your advantage
3. i think the fight against Congo screwed him a bit. He came in that fight after a big loss and after that much talked about "new miracoulous power training...bla bla bla". He finnished that fight extremly fast and perhaps he got this strange idea, it was going to be the same case in this fight to. Perhaps he should have went at least one round with Congo to test himself...just a thought

It's gonna be interesting now, to watch Brock vs Carwin. Like King Kong vs Godzilla . I give Brock the advantage, but those big punches Carwin has...
As for Mir. I think he gets Cain. And he losses. TKO again.
Best regards


----------



## Woodenhead (Jan 5, 2010)

WAR CARWIN!

Is he legit yet?

Man... Carwin, JDS, Cain... loving it.


----------



## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

i hate to beat a dead horse but I do think carwin's hands play a role. When you punch someone you're basically swinging rocks attached to the end of your wrists, and the bigger those rocks are the more force they can deliver, and that is independent of the musclepower of the arms. And Carwin not only has the muscles, his hands are quite likely the biggest in the UFC.

I was wincing seeing those huge shots to the side of Mir's head against the cage.


----------



## Curly (Aug 20, 2007)

I don't understand Franks lack of head movement when he's being nailed to the head, I don't mean trying to dodge the punches, I mean sliding the punches with that little three inch head move good boxers have. I can't figure out if he's stiff necked or if it's a machismo thing-- it may be the latter.


----------



## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

before Mir crumpled I could see Mir's head whipping back. The most impressive thing is how Carwin completely disregards anything his opponents do or say, it looked like another day in the office for Carwin as Mir came out looking jacked and ready to go fight Lesnar. You gotta have that invincible mentallity where you don't look past your opponent, Mir's problem starts inbetween the ears


----------



## Curly (Aug 20, 2007)

rabakill said:


> Mir's problem starts inbetween the ears


I agree, Mirs hair is the problem. Curled on the top and straight on the sides, that is so 1990's. 








:thumb02:


----------



## limba (Jul 21, 2009)

rabakill said:


> before Mir crumpled I could see Mir's head whipping back. The most impressive thing is how Carwin completely disregards anything his opponents do or say, it looked like another day in the office for Carwin as Mir came out looking jacked and ready to go fight Lesnar. You gotta have that invincible mentallity where you don't look past your opponent, Mir's problem starts inbetween the ears


Agreed.
Maybe Mir was already looking to the fight vs Brock or he saw Brock in the cage..
Don't know what he was thinking, but this fight looked a lot like the Brock fight.


----------



## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

Curly said:


> I agree, Mirs hair is the problem. Curled on the top and straight on the sides, that is so 1990's.


ok dude, no need to be sarcastic, you know what he meant. excessive earwax buildup.


----------



## Uchaaa (Apr 22, 2007)

I think mir was surprised by the first punch that rocked him. He thought that carwin would continue throwing short punches and knees to the leg. He was thinking of a way out of the clinch.


----------



## limba (Jul 21, 2009)

Uchaaa said:


> I think mir was surprised by the first punch that rocked him. He thought that carwin would continue throwing short punches and knees to the leg. He was thinking of a way out of the clinch.


Suprised by the short punches. Maybe. But Brock did the same thing.
Getting out of the clinch?? I didn't see one attempt to do that. But i think he just wasn't able to get out.


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

Carwin managed to turn Mir around with ease the one time Frank pushed him into the cage. It looked weird. Like Frank wasn't even trying to fight it. Is Carwin really that much stronger?! Bloomin' hell. Maybe we all need to get out of the gyms and shovel cow shit around for a few years. Seems to work.


----------



## Leed (Jan 3, 2010)

Damn, sucks for Mir, I wonder what will be next for him..

But on the other hand, Carwin will get his ass handed by Brock, hooray. :thumb02:


----------



## creepjacker (Jul 19, 2009)

LOL, big mouth Mir got his butt kicked by Carwin almost the same way Lesnar beat him, except when Lesnar did it his face looked like hamburger when it was over.

Lesnar vs. Carwin is gonna be awesome.


----------



## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

lol, get trashed Frank Mir. I ******* hate the way he was sticking his head/face up through the entire entrance and even in the octagon when buffer was announcing. Just the song choice as well, says a lot about that guys character. Could you be any more full of yourself? I hope they feed him to cain or JDS next, JDS more so because i think we are guaranteed another KO for Mir.


----------



## Jebber (Oct 11, 2008)

How many punches did Mir throw? He looked bored out there.

I can't wait for the next bout with Brock.


----------



## vaj3000 (Dec 28, 2008)

Wow carwin is like an american muscle car, dude has some srs power in his hands


----------



## tripster (Jun 5, 2006)

I always said Mir was no good. Yes he's got great Jiu Jitsu mostly becasue he is a moutain of a man to be doing Jiu Jitsu. Bottom line is he got no balls and the mental capacity of a mouse. Like I said before the fight, a real betting man would never put money on a guy like Mir.


----------



## The Legacy (Aug 14, 2008)

Ok, now we can start talking about Carwin as the real deal. Before this fight I wasn't so sure, but now I am. He has the strength and the KO power to really trouble Brock Lesnar. 

I can't wait for that fight. 

Mir, well it's back to the drawing board for him. Maybe JDS or Cain next?


----------



## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

I am so glad the fight turned out the way it did. Shane really deserves it, he proved the haters wrong! And he really has a decent chance against Brock. 

I say it again, I was never sold at Frank..

and really terrible refereeing :thumbsdown: poor Frank had to take so many unnecessary blows. How can he not stop the fight?? I mean that was Carwin on top of him, a guy who is known for his brutal fists.


----------



## Fieos (Mar 26, 2007)

I like Mir and I think he came in very conditioned and very technical. I do think that he over-thinks fights however. You could see from his expression that when Carwin reversed him against the cage that Mir was thinking about where he wanted to go from that position, what he wanted to work on, etc. He was really looking at it like a match and not a fight. Mir needs to live a bit more in the moment in his fights. Everything can change with a 6" punch from a guy like Carwin, Mir should have been focusing on that.

Mir also thinks like a Jiu-Jitsu player and not like a wrestler. Mir is a big guy but you NEVER see him physically bully someone. He prefers to give way to his opponents strength and redirect their energy. From a martial philosophy standpoint that's nifty. In a cage that means you've given up a dominant position. (The way Mir didn't contest the cage reversal by Carwin) Mir loves to be the thinking fighter, but if you have the tools you should be a thinking fighter that also has the capacity to be the bully. Fighting is a competition of technique, speed, intelligence, spirit, AND strength. Mir is too prone to forgetting the last part. With the game advancing like it is I would give a fight advantage to a wrestler with good submission defense over a solid Jiu-Jitsu player.


----------



## Thelegend (Nov 2, 2009)

WAR CARWIN!!!!!
he came and finished the fight and shows just how mir shy's away when hit. lol he was rocked, he was laying down, either way he lost. i got ultimate lulz when he lost. he wasn't looking past carwin at all he just was not as good as the "engineer" that night. it does not surprise me mirs improved stand up did little. I'm sorry but all mirs talk about brock and then him not even getting out of the first round with carwin made me ROFL.......WAR CARWIN!!!!!!


----------



## The505Butcher (Jul 30, 2009)

Awesome! I am happy of the way this turned out. I would have wanted to have Carwin fight Lesnar when it was scheduled but now I think he has earned his title shot and not just advanced because he was big and intimidating and no one had made it out of the first minute and a half with him. Should be interesting to see Carwin's plan coming into a fight with Lesnar. Think he will try to keep it standing or try to take Lesnar to the ground?


----------



## Johnni G (Dec 2, 2009)

Tonight! :O

oh its already over, my bad

Now i've seen it.

Mir really got pwned in this one.


----------



## Thelegend (Nov 2, 2009)

^wow triple post lol, but i agree with the last one


----------



## bmo37 (Jun 1, 2008)

Frank has been one of my favorite fighters because he is a quick heavy weight with an excellent ground game. I think at times though he gets to wrapped up in the technical aspects of the fight game where he over looks things that are crucial, almost an arrogance when fighting that ends up killing him in the end. To me he did this in the Lesnar fight smerking at some quick shots that ultimately ko'd him. 

Last night I saw the same thing almost this mentallity that your shots can't hurt me and next thing you know his legs go limp and its good night. He needs to switch from this "Im better than every opponent in every way crap" to thinking where can I exploit their weakest area and defeat them.

On the flip side Carwin is a fun fighter to watch with his sheer ko power, he lacks alot of techincal ability but so does Brock which will make this fight in July a good old fashion brawl, which I'm psyced about. Reminds me of the early days of ufc.


----------



## luckbox (Feb 12, 2010)

Just got done watching the fight, all I gotta say is

Holy ******* shit Shane Carwin is a ******* animal! I did not think he would manhandle Mir to that extent. My jaw just dropped after he knocked him off his feet.

And Dan Mirgliotta, jesus christ man, what are you playing at? Stoppage should have happened way earlier, and he let him take 4-5 punches while he was clearly out. What a ******* tosser.


----------



## Hammerlock2.0 (Jun 17, 2009)

Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad stoppage. Should have been over the second Mir got flattened out or even earlier. Can't say I didn't like Carwin knocking Mir out, but these last shots just weren't neccessary. Now I'm really psyched for Carwin/Brock though. It seems Brock likes Carwin a lot more than he likes Mir (as a person, not as an opponent). I just hope Carwin doesn't play the babyface card again.


----------



## arkanoydz (Mar 15, 2010)

*finally*

Much credit to Carwin for his victory considering the mental ordeal of having to go through a guy like Mir in order to just get back to a title shot he'd already earned. I wanted Carwin to win all along, but thought Mir posed a huge threat considering he is the fighter that he his, so I really didn't know how this would turn out.

Looking forward to see how Mir returns in his next fights (especially considering the possibilities of his future opponents in such an interesting division). Gotta love the way this heavyweight division is unfolding.


----------



## evilstevie (Apr 19, 2009)

I suprised at how big Lesnar looked compared to Carwin. That should be a good fight....


----------



## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

I WAS ELATED!!!! I DID NOT see that coming. Personally, I hate Frank Mir, but I expected Mir to win almost 100% (I respect his talent whether I like him or not). I probably gave Carwin a 10-20% chance to win, so I was shocked. Wow...


----------



## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

Cuz this thread is moving like lightening...I just wanna give prop's to thosewho took Carwin in the fight, congrats.....:thumbsup:


----------



## Lastage (Mar 29, 2010)

*WoW*

I must say, like most I did not think it would turn out this way. Im glad with the results tho UFC 116 will be a great fight.

Grats to Carwin, kinda makes some of these guys look silly that a part-time fighter came in and destroyed Mir.


----------



## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

coldcall420 said:


> Cuz this thread is moving like lightening...I just wanna give prop's to thosewho took Carwin in the fight, congrats.....:thumbsup:


I second that. I certainly didn't give Carwin a chance, but I was thrilled to be wrong.


----------



## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

I am a Mur fan, but this was a freakin exciting upset and one of the reasons I love watching MMA.

I think I can safely say that Carwin throws atomic bombs now.


----------



## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

swpthleg said:


> I am a Mur fan, but this was a freakin exciting upset and one of the reasons I love watching MMA.
> 
> I think I can safely say that Carwin throws atomic bombs now.


Is GSP taking a temporary break from MMA to join the Canadian Olympic Wrestling team for 2012? I know he intends to try out for the team, but does that mean he's taking a hiatus from MMA (temporarily)?

Edit: Nevermind, I don't want to take away from the subject of this thread (Carwin/Mir), sorry.


----------



## Wookie (Jul 20, 2008)

I totally wasn't expecting that ending. All I can say now is war Carwin! I don't see Brock taking any of those shots either.


----------



## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

Wookie said:


> I totally wasn't expecting that ending. All I can say now is war Carwin! I don't see Brock taking any of those shots either.


Any of the elite HW can potentially lay each other out, which is why the HW division is currently the most exciting.


----------



## BrutalKO (Oct 5, 2006)

Leed said:


> Damn, sucks for Mir, I wonder what will be next for him..
> 
> But on the other hand, Carwin will get his ass handed by Brock, hooray. :thumb02:



...Carwin will get his ass handed to him?? That is so far out of context it's kinda funny. Have you forgotten about Brock being seriously ill? You don't know if Brock will still be same or the fighter he was at UFC 100. He's only had 5 fights and a long lay off. Ring rust will be a big factor. Carwin is fresh and ready for the kill. His punches are just as powerful as Lesnar's...maybe even more. *Flat out--- Carwin's boxing is miles ahead of Brock's * There is no lying in that statement.


----------



## LOJ (Mar 9, 2007)

It just goes to show the importance of a gameplan. GSP put forward a perfect gameplan and dominates Hardy, while Mir doesn't and gets crushed on the feet by someone who was known for the KO.


----------



## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

LOJ said:


> It just goes to show the importance of a gameplan. GSP put forward a perfect gameplan and dominates Hardy, while Mir doesn't and gets crushed on the feet by someone who was known for the KO.


Mir didn't even try to take it to the ground. Think he's got a little to much confidence in his chin, I mean he escaped the clinch the first time after taking some shots and he faces was welted up and he still was fine with just sitting in the clinch and waiting for Carwin to start throwing bombs. Carwin has power, but he is a little sloppy, after this fight it makes me wonder what JDS would do to Mir.


----------



## BrutalKO (Oct 5, 2006)

LOJ said:


> It just goes to show the importance of a gameplan. GSP put forward a perfect gameplan and dominates Hardy, while Mir doesn't and gets crushed on the feet by someone who was known for the KO.


...Well said man. Carwin known for the KO is on the money. You can't deny 12-0 all first round finishes under 3 minutes. That has to be some kind of record. That stat alone is just plain sick. I think Carwin opened a lot of peoples eyes to the freakish power he man possesses. The man is for real. Best of all he's a very cool, humble, class act. Nobody will ever look past this man and if Lesnar does, he might experience his first "What the hell just happened"? when he comes to...


----------



## Thunder1 (Aug 16, 2008)

I know I'm opening myself up to slaughter on this one. BUT Carwin has a better pro mma record at this point in his career than Fedor did at the same time.


----------



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

you know what isnt mentioned much??

this was the 1st fight in MMA HW history with both guys coming in at max weight.


----------



## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

Thunder1 said:


> I know I'm opening myself up to slaughter on this one. BUT Carwin has a better pro mma record at this point in his career than Fedor did at the same time.


How dare you speak of the Russian God and not say he is the greatest ever, how dare you.......:sarcastic12:

So f*cking sick of Fedor talk.


----------



## Thunder1 (Aug 16, 2008)

Exactly, the Fedor folks will be smashing me shortly. I like Fedor by the way.

"lol, get trashed Frank Mir. I ******* hate the way he was sticking his head/face up through the entire entrance and even in the octagon when buffer was announcing. Just the song choice as well, says a lot about that guys character"

So true. Then Carwin comes out to "Let The Bodies Hit The Floor" and does just that.


----------



## LOJ (Mar 9, 2007)

So I just watched this fight for a second time, and in all honesty and as far as my opinion goes; Dan Miragliotta was pretty bad for the time this fight lasted.

The first fury by Carwin dropped Mir and Carwin was all over him. Good call by Miragliotta not to call the fight and to at least give Mir a chance at defending himself. But than Mir roles over on his stomach and is getting crushed by like 5 clean shots that puts him out for good and than Carwin gives him 6 more shots after being out cold is retarded and injury worthy. What on earth was Dan Miragliotta thinking?

I understand the first fury and giving Mir a chance but holy blue hell. As soon as Mir roles over hes taking some serious shots and than goes out for good, and you can clearly see that hes out of the fight. Miragliotta had to of been on a bad angle or something because after Mir is cleanly out I count 6 more shots before he actually stops the fight.

There's giving a fighter a chance, and than there's saving him from being injured. Being out cold and taking 6 extra shots is beyond me.


----------



## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

Thunder1 said:


> I know I'm opening myself up to slaughter on this one. BUT Carwin has a better pro mma record at this point in his career than Fedor did at the same time.


No reason you'll get flamed for that it's a completely true statement, and I suppose I'm one of those "Fedor folks" here. 

Thing is, Fedor maintained that kind of record and actually improved it once he got to the top levels, which most others haven't done. 

Carwin's had like 1 elite fight as champ/champ contender. Fedor had over a dozen and won them all. Give Carwin time.

Others have flawless records all the way to the title too, like Rashad, but then they get destroyed or start putting mediocre performances against other elites... it's when you get to the top that your true worth is revealed. 

If Carwin destroys Lesnar, Velasquez and Dos Santos like he did Mir and Gonzaga, I'd say he's better than Fedor. Until that time though, I think Fedor has destroyed more than his fair share of "flavor of the month" hyped Ex UFC champs like Mir.


----------



## The505Butcher (Jul 30, 2009)

LOJ said:


> So I just watched this fight for a second time, and in all honesty and as far as my opinion goes; Dan Miragliotta was pretty bad for the time this fight lasted.
> 
> The first fury by Carwin dropped Mir and Carwin was all over him. Good call by Miragliotta not to call the fight and to at least give Mir a chance at defending himself. But than Mir roles over on his stomach and is getting crushed by like 5 clean shots that puts him out for good and than Carwin gives him 6 more shots after being out cold is retarded and injury worthy. What on earth was Dan Miragliotta thinking?
> 
> ...


Dan is a crappy ref. I always am prepared to see someone murdered whenever he is in there. Or he jumps in too early like the amir fight... I think that was him or mazagati... I hate both of those refs. Not only that but do you guys think he was justified splitting up the clinch so quickly?


----------



## bmo37 (Jun 1, 2008)

The505Butcher said:


> Dan is a crappy ref. I always am prepared to see someone murdered whenever he is in there. Or he jumps in too early like the amir fight... I think that was him or mazagati... I hate both of those refs. Not only that but do you guys think he was justified splitting up the clinch so quickly?


I agree those two refs are horrible when it comes to fighter safety or in the opposite retrospect stopping the fight for no reason. I still think Big John McCarthy was the best followed by Herb Dean and Mario Yamasaki.


----------



## Rusko (Feb 4, 2010)

Thunder1 said:


> I know I'm opening myself up to slaughter on this one. BUT Carwin has a better pro mma record at this point in his career than Fedor did at the same time.


Had been thinking the same thing, (his record). I hope he clears out HW division and then epic battle Carwin vs Fedor. Would be really nice to see.


----------



## monkey024 (Apr 6, 2010)

Personally I was looking forward to Mir going on to fight Lesnar again but I have to give credit where credit is due and am glad it was an exciting fight.

Good Luck Carwin.

But come on you have to see the truth of what this fight REALLY was....it was paid off and it was very easy to tell.

Mir barely throwing anything just taking shots on the side of the cage doing nothing, hell during the match Mir nodded his head saying he was "Ok." I also didnt see how legs "Buckle," Like some people have been saying he just seemed to go down to one knee and then when the ref didnt stop the fight he just flattened himself out...

WHO actually flattens out when they are considered "Knocked Out?" Most of the time they have no control and would be just slumped over NOT having their arms to the side of them like Mir had his.

Nothing to take away from Carwin and am looking for a damn good fight soon but come on. 

What sounds better and easier to promote? 
A monster that has a perfect record against the beast Lesnar?

or the Mir fight? 

They just used mir to sell seats then let Carwin win since he is a better platform to promote the next fight and then later down the road I bet they will come back to Mir and say he has been going crazy since the Carwin fight and all he thought about is getting back to Lesnar no matter what.

Guarantee.

Sorry just made a username to say that haha..


----------



## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

monkey024 said:


> Personally I was looking forward to Mir going on to fight Lesnar again but I have to give credit where credit is due and am glad it was an exciting fight.
> 
> Good Luck Carwin.
> 
> ...


And the dumbest first post award goes to.... :confused05:

I mean all that typing and not a drop of logic. Just a mir nuthugger refusing to accept reality. Knees buckling happens you get clocked 5 times full force by a 270 lb monster with bricks for hands. And then you point to him turtling up as proof of him not being knocked out lmao? He was hurt and almost out, then Carwin put his lights out completely. Wow Mir fakes it really well lol. He must've worked his ass off like a madman to put on those 30 lbs, obsessed over his rematch with Lesnar and won his Kongo fight just so he could get his $100000 bribe and fade into obscurity instead of becoming a star again. What a masterplan! :confused03:

What the heck I probably just fed a troll here.


----------



## kay_o_ken (Jan 26, 2009)

monkey024 said:


> Personally I was looking forward to Mir going on to fight Lesnar again but I have to give credit where credit is due and am glad it was an exciting fight.
> 
> Good Luck Carwin.
> 
> ...


haha wow...


did you not even watch the fight?


----------



## monkey024 (Apr 6, 2010)

Yup I watched the fight and that's how I saw it...

I dont know where one of you got the idea that I'm a Mir "Nuthugger," Is the word if I recall..Since I have no affiliation nor personal attachment to him I just wrote what I saw. 

If you cant see my points based on the promotional side of things then you are very narrow minded to say the least ;/.

UFC is a business and its revenue comes in the form of selling seats...easier to sell seats when one of the fighters is undefeated.

Also who said that Mir is going to fade into obscurity? Seems its the whole pot calling teakettle black here.


----------



## PheelGoodInc (Jul 23, 2009)

monkey024 said:


> Yup I watched the fight and that's how I saw it...
> 
> I dont know where one of you got the idea that I'm a Mir "Nuthugger," Is the word if I recall..Since I have no affiliation nor personal attachment to him I just wrote what I saw.
> 
> ...


LOL. Welcome to the forum, but sorry you came in this way.

Mir vs Lesnar 3 sells WAY more than Carwin vs Lesnar 1. There goes your theory.

There is no war Mir threw that fight.


----------



## limba (Jul 21, 2009)

Just rewatched the fight the other night.
I still can't believe how Mir fought this one. I'm not taking anything away from Carwin. props to him: came in and did pretty much the same thing he did in all of his previous fights.
It was like a replay of Mir-Lesnar 2.
I couldn't believe how easily he was reversed with his back to the cage, after having Carwin to the cage. I think that was way too easy for Carwin, even though he is a big strong guy. Where was this new strength he gained in his new training??
I just think he isn't used on carrying this weight on him in a fight against a huge guy like Carwin. He bulked up massivly in a short time and i think the fight against Congo screwed him a bit. He came in that one, got the quick victory and thought he is on another level. IMO it would have been better for him to test himself longer in that fight, to see how he can handle his new weight in a fight.


----------

