# EliteXC: Kimbo vs Shamrock Discussion Thread



## NikosCC (May 16, 2007)

_*







*_
*ELITE XC: OCTOBER 4, 2008 ON CBS
venue: BankAtlantic Center in Sunrise, Florida
*​ * 



Main Card on CBS:*

Jake Shields vs. Paul Daley
Kevin "Kimbo Slice" Ferguson vs. Ken Shamrock
Gina Carano vs. Kelly Kobald
Benji Radach vs. Murilo "Ninja" Rua

*Preliminary Bouts:*

Cristiane Santos vs. Yoko Takahashi
James Edson Berto vs. Mike Aina
Seth Petruzelli vs. Aaron Rosa
Crafton Wallace vs. TBA
Lorenzo Borgomeo vs. Mickey Gomez
Robert McDaniel vs Alexander Shlemenko





EliteXC: Heat is an upcoming mixed martial arts event to be held by EliteXC on October 4, 2008 in Sunrise, Florida at the BankAtlantic Center. This is the third EliteXC show to be featured on CBS and marks the return of popular fighters Jake Shields, Gina Carano, Ken Shamrock & Kimbo Slice.


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## Judoka (Feb 23, 2007)

Stone Cold's thoughts on this fight(I thought it was good)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4aYpHEm5cs&feature=related


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## ThaFranchise (Dec 24, 2007)

Lol stone cold is the man. I havent really seen many paul daley fights, does my boy Jake the snake have much to worry about?


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## ShadyNismo (Jun 18, 2007)

Go Kimbo Go, can't wait to see it live :thumb02:


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## valvetronix (Feb 3, 2008)

I am so confused is Arlovski fighting?


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## Meshuggeth (May 26, 2008)

The main card is actually pretty exciting. We get to see Arlovski and Shields. Rua and Carano are good too.


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## 69nites (Jul 28, 2008)

ahh some more fights I have to watch on mute as to not have the commentators lower my intelligence...

I think I'll actually enjoy watching this one tho.


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## mrmyz (Nov 23, 2006)

the cards pretty one sided lol


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

Think you guys might enjoy this!

http://www.mmaforum.com/elitexc-str...vs-shamrock-discussion-thread.html#post673209

I hope Ken pulls an upset here! I really want him to win!


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## mrmyz (Nov 23, 2006)

Bonnar426 said:


> Think you guys might enjoy this!
> 
> http://www.mmaforum.com/elitexc-str...vs-shamrock-discussion-thread.html#post673209
> 
> I hope Ken pulls an upset here! I really want him to win!


agreed


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## stitch1z (Dec 9, 2007)

Aw hell! Cyborg is fighting on the preliminary card!!???

How can I see the preliminary bouts??? Anybody??

I'm really amped for this card!


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## LoganDaBoxer (Sep 30, 2008)

Meshuggeth said:


> The main card is actually pretty exciting. We get to see Arlovski and Shields. Rua and Carano are good too.


Yea, Arlovski will be fighting in this Affliction co-promoted match. Winner gets Fedor.


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## mrmyz (Nov 23, 2006)

LoganDaBoxer said:


> Yea, Arlovski will be fighting in this Affliction co-promoted match. Winner gets Fedor.


yeah so I guess we know who is fighting fedor next


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## LoganDaBoxer (Sep 30, 2008)

Ken Shamrock by leg lock.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

Shamrock via flying toehold. 

Anyone else notice shamrock looks very bored in that poster? 

Kimbo looks like a badass, too bad he sucks as much as Tito's girlfriend.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

*Mike Aina pulled out of the Edson Berto fight.*

*He is replaced by Conner "The Hurricane" Huen.*

This is a fight that I now want to see. Too bad it's in the Prelims. Huen is very well rounded. His ground game is pretty sick. But he'll stand with you also.


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## lpbigd4444 (Oct 1, 2008)

Michael Carson said:


> Shamrock via flying toehold.
> 
> Anyone else notice shamrock looks very bored in that poster?
> 
> Kimbo looks like a badass, too bad he sucks as much as Tito's girlfriend.


Isnt she his wife now? lol Anyway I love Ken Shamrock and respact what he was but he is 45 he is like 30 pounds lighter than Kimbo and he is gonna get killed. I truly fear for his health but I hope he can pull off the upset cuz that would be amazing. Having said all that, win or lose, Kimbo sucks and all he needs to do is fight 1 legit opponent to prove it. Oh how I would love to see Brock Lesnar go donkey kong on his head or see Mir or Nog snap his leg.


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## 69nites (Jul 28, 2008)

lpbigd4444 said:


> Isnt she his wife now? lol Anyway I love Ken Shamrock and respact what he was but he is 45 he is like 30 pounds lighter than Kimbo and he is gonna get killed. I truly fear for his health but I hope he can pull off the upset cuz that would be amazing. Having said all that, win or lose, Kimbo sucks and all he needs to do is fight 1 legit opponent to prove it. Oh how I would love to see Brock Lesnar go donkey kong on his head or see Mir or Nog snap his leg.


Kimbo walks at 240

Ken fights at 205. 

if ken cuts any kind of weight that's closer to a 10 lbs difference in weight.

I had assumed that Kimbo was cutting down to 205 and not Ken fighting at HW which is really making this an even closer matchup....


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## lpbigd4444 (Oct 1, 2008)

If Ken fights 205 and Kimbo is 240 then that confirms my point. What is your point? Kimbo isn cutting to 205 cuz that is impossible for a man his size and with that muscle mass. He isn gonna cut 35 lbs and I really think they are fightin heavyweight.


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## 69nites (Jul 28, 2008)

lpbigd4444 said:


> If Ken fights 205 and Kimbo is 240 then that confirms my point. What is your point? Kimbo isn cutting to 205 cuz that is impossible for a man his size and with that muscle mass. He isn gonna cut 35 lbs and I really think they are fightin heavyweight.


kimbo walks (and fights) at 240 

most 205ers walk around at _*at least*_ 220. most cut much more than that.

I personally cut from over 215 to 185 if that gives you any perspective on weight cutting.

EDIT: I just checked the weigh ins and Slice weighed in at 234.5 and Ken weighed in at 206.5. this fight is seriously a joke. ken is .5lbs over LHW.


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## lpbigd4444 (Oct 1, 2008)

I have perspective on weight cutting cuz i used to wrestle. My point is shamrock doesnt weight like 220 he is always about 205 and as you have now pointed out kimbo is much heavier which only proves the point i made


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## jongurley (Jun 28, 2008)

lpbigd4444 said:


> Isnt she his wife now? lol Anyway I love Ken Shamrock and respact what he was but he is 45 he is like 30 pounds lighter than Kimbo and he is gonna get killed. I truly fear for his health but I hope he can pull off the upset cuz that would be amazing. Having said all that, win or lose, Kimbo sucks and all he needs to do is fight 1 legit opponent to prove it. Oh how I would love to see Brock Lesnar go donkey kong on his head or see Mir or Nog snap his leg.


Thank You,,:thumbsup:


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## mrmyz (Nov 23, 2006)

makes you wonder why shamrock isnt fighting middle weight instead


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

69nites said:


> Kimbo walks at 240
> 
> Ken fights at 205.
> 
> ...


Actually, Ken was about 220 at his last fight vs Buzz Berry. I am having a lot of trouble understanding why he lost 15 pounds between this fight and the last, but I'm hoping it's because he's been working on technique and cardio instead of weight training *fingers crossed* because if he just lazed around for long enough to lose fifteen pounds of muscle (he certainly doesn't look like he has less bodyfat than ever before) then I'm a little scared for the 700 points I bet on him.


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## mrmyz (Nov 23, 2006)

HexRei said:


> Actually, Ken was about 220 at his last fight vs Buzz Berry. I am having a lot of trouble understanding why he lost 15 pounds between this fight and the last, but I'm hoping it's because he's been working on technique and cardio instead of weight training *fingers crossed* because if he just lazed around for long enough to lose fifteen pounds of muscle (he certainly doesn't look like he has less bodyfat than ever before) then I'm a little scared for the 700 points I bet on him.


If thats the case, (I dont know much about shamrocks weight in his last fight) then he has probably been working his conditioning alot. The way hes built he wouldnt have lost that much muscle in between fights. Alot of fightes I know when they stop training as hard they gain weight but its a mix of muscle and fat because most fighters over train.

One of my freinds stoped training for two months and his conditioning went to shit but when we rolled for the first time in 2 months it felt like he was ALOT stronger. He ended up gaining like 10 pounds and Im sure a good chunk of it was muscle.

Frank shamrock has mentioned this in seminars a couple of times. I was at a frank shamrock seminar in california and some one asked a question about weight lifting for martial arts and shamrock said that he doesnt weight lift as much as you think. Said he does weight training 2 - 3 months a year and only when hes not training for a fight and went into detail about guys that are injured and the muscle mass sky rockets because they arent training as hard.

It happened to shogun. He was out of commision for awhile and a lot of guys who train with him were saying that he was fatter but like 20 times stonger. Go fig?

So all of that leads me to beleive that he has been working conditioning and technique really hard. If so then he isnt planning to stand and trade with Kimbo he wants to take it to the ground. My only concern is shamrocks chin has been in question the last couple of fights.

Im hoping he can get a good game plan together and make this happen.


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

mrmyz said:


> If thats the case, (I dont know much about shamrocks weight in his last fight) then he has probably been working his conditioning alot. The way hes built he wouldnt have lost that much muscle in between fights. Alot of fightes I know when they stop training as hard they gain weight but its a mix of muscle and fat because most fighters over train.
> 
> One of my freinds stoped training for two months and his conditioning went to shit but when we rolled for the first time in 2 months it felt like he was ALOT stronger. He ended up gaining like 10 pounds and Im sure a good chunk of it was muscle.
> 
> ...


I can believe the weight gain but I think that's probably more due to keeping the same diet (old habits die hard) as you had when training harder. As for the strength, I just have a tough time believing that working less results in a meaningful net strength gain. I can see why someone rollin with them might feel they are stronger because when grappling, extra weight bearing down on your opponent can feel like extra strength. I mean perhaps someone with an insane routine could cut out their workouts and their body would keep building insane muscle for perhaps a while but a normal human's body would balance out. IMHO.



> So all of that leads me to beleive that he has been working conditioning and technique really hard. If so then he isnt planning to stand and trade with Kimbo he wants to take it to the ground. My only concern is shamrocks chin has been in question the last couple of fights.
> 
> Im hoping he can get a good game plan together and make this happen.


Ya man I hope so. I want Ken to win simply because I want Kimbo's weaknesses to be exposed. I like the guy himself but I do not like his fans and I'm tired of EXC protecting him. I want someone to wreck him bad, and I know Ken has the raw skill. I'm just afraid that Ken fucked this one up like most of his other fighter over the last decade and we will see him lose badly. Again. Due to poor preparation and gameplan.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

I was hoping super roiding massive Ken would show up for this fight, alas it was not to be.


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## mrmyz (Nov 23, 2006)

TheNegation said:


> I was hoping super roiding massive Ken would show up for this fight, alas it was not to be.


he would lose, super massive roiding ken is strong and all but the problem is all of that is useless if you dont fight smart. IE Tito vs ken 2 and 3. He kept running str8 at tito while tito used angles and set up the take down. You need to fight smooth calm and collected in the ring. When you let your emotions control you, you will get owned by higher level guys. Its one of the reasons I think clay guida will never be able to fight on the same level as BJ and Florian.



HexRei said:


> I can believe the weight gain but I think that's probably more due to keeping the same diet (old habits die hard) as you had when training harder. As for the strength, I just have a tough time believing that working less results in a meaningful net strength gain. I can see why someone rollin with them might feel they are stronger because when grappling, extra weight bearing down on your opponent can feel like extra strength. I mean perhaps someone with an insane routine could cut out their workouts and their body would keep building insane muscle for perhaps a while but a normal human's body would balance out. IMHO.
> 
> 
> 
> Ya man I hope so. I want Ken to win simply because I want Kimbo's weaknesses to be exposed. I like the guy himself but I do not like his fans and I'm tired of EXC protecting him. I want someone to wreck him bad, and I know Ken has the raw skill. I'm just afraid that Ken fucked this one up like most of his other fighter over the last decade and we will see him lose badly. Again. Due to poor preparation and gameplan.


I do a lot of personal training so Ive seen it happen in person. The average time it takes for people to start losing streghnth is 2 weeks. After 2 weeks of not working out your body will begin to get weaker but if your over training theres alot more fatigue and things in your muscle which it needs to work out so instead of just lieing dormant for 2 weeks you are actually becoming stronger because your recovering from over training.

So it would be the same thing as if you were working out. Arnold mentioned this in his encyclopedia of body building and I beleive Mike Mahler and Lou Foreigno sp? said something about it to. So for the 2 weeks you will be getting stronger and its a combination of healing and you being allowed to tap into your full potential.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

Of course, but it's not like he will fight smart anyway. I mean at least he might have had a chance but I doubt he'd even be able to muscle Kimbo to the floor in the state he is in now. He was way more ripped for the Berry fight, I was hoping he'd continue down that line. I wanted him to chow up looking like this









He's screwed either way most likely, but still.


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## XitUp (Jan 11, 2007)

HexRei said:


> Actually, Ken was about 220 at his last fight vs Buzz Berry. I am having a lot of trouble understanding why he lost 15 pounds between this fight and the last, but I'm hoping it's because he's been working on technique and cardio instead of weight training *fingers crossed* because if he just lazed around for long enough to lose fifteen pounds of muscle (he certainly doesn't look like he has less bodyfat than ever before) then I'm a little scared for the 700 points I bet on him.


pfft, I've got 5000 on him. Let's just hope he doesn't try brawling or take a dive.


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

Hearts of fire


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

XitUp said:


> pfft, I've got 5000 on him. Let's just hope he doesn't try brawling or take a dive.


If he doesn't spend the whole fight trying to take it to the ground, I am gonna go to Georgia and beat him up myself.


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## brief (Nov 19, 2006)

I live on the west coast and direct tv is showing it delayed, that sucks. Anybody know of any live feeds? :confused02:


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## stitch1z (Dec 9, 2007)

Man, I want to see the prelims!!!!


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## boodaddy614 (Jul 18, 2008)

of course Kimbo gonna kill ken shammy. The pic from the weigh ins look like a post-fight snapshot. Kimbo with his arms up flexing, and poor Ken Shammy looking off into the crowd, dazed and defeated.


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## 69nites (Jul 28, 2008)

well now that ken's been disqualified....


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

Epic fail.

Frank props himself up, Mauro goes over the top w/metaphor. SAVED! What the hell is installed in Frank's teeth?


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

Well, Silverback is replacing Ken! Well, he did beat Dan Severn so he might be able to pull off a victory!

Frank seemed pissed that Ken cut his eye.


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## KSliceIZNice (Jun 2, 2008)

Shamrock is a fuckin COWARD!!! 6 stitches proves to me he's afraid, but to spar before the fight is just a joke. I've seen many boxing matches where one boxer gets cut, goes to the ring doc, and claims they cannot see(basically waiving the white flag out of fear). This is exactly what Ken Shamrock is doing. He's a pansy and a coward and should retire to a reality tv show alongside Hulk Hogan. 

People talk all this trash about Kimbo's lack of a groundgame. They even bash him for fighting these washed up bums, but the guy is a beast and, I think, could knock out anyone in MMA. Kimbo doesnt pick his fights, he just fights those they put up against him. 

KIMBO SLICE IZ NICE!!!!


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

KSliceIZNice said:


> Shamrock is a fuckin COWARD!!! 6 stitches proves to me he's afraid, but to spar before the fight is just a joke. I've seen many boxing matches where one boxer gets cut, goes to the ring doc, and claims they cannot see(basically waiving the white flag out of fear). This is exactly what Ken Shamrock is doing. He's a pansy and a coward and should retire to a reality tv show alongside Hulk Hogan.
> 
> People talk all this trash about Kimbo's lack of a groundgame. They even bash him for fighting these washed up bums, but the guy is a beast and, I think, could knock out anyone in MMA. Kimbo doesnt pick his fights, he just fights those they put up against him.
> 
> KIMBO SLICE IZ NICE!!!!


You do realize Ken said he wanted to fight and even went to 3 doctors but none of them would clear him? It wasn't Ken's choice to not fight it was the doctors.


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

Bonnar426 said:


> Well, Silverback is replacing Ken! Well, he did beat Dan Severn so he might be able to pull off a victory!
> 
> Frank seemed pissed that Ken cut his eye.


Can they call up Severn now? 

Didn't Ninja just get knocked out?


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

Ninja and Radach almost had a double KO but they both recovered and the round just ended.


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

KSliceIZNice said:


> Shamrock is a fuckin COWARD!!! 6 stitches proves to me he's afraid, but to spar before the fight is just a joke. I've seen many boxing matches where one boxer gets cut, goes to the ring doc, and claims they cannot see(basically waiving the white flag out of fear). This is exactly what Ken Shamrock is doing.


Um, no. The commission won't let him fight because that cut is a fight-ending cut in and of itself. Blood would be pouring into Ken's eye and the fight would be stopped.


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## UFC 100 (Mar 11, 2008)

That just blows that Shamrock doesn't get to fight Kimbo tonight was looking forward to that fight. Cut over the eye pretty weak imo :thumbsdown:


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

Not if you saw where the cut was. It's a fight ending cut and the second Ken got hit it would have burst open and blood would be in his eye.


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

That's a very cut 240 pounds, Arlovski is a beast.


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## mrmyz (Nov 23, 2006)

awesome event. Great to see that benji could pull it off I really thought he was going to have more trouble then he did but its great for him. hes a nice guy and trains hard


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