# Pro-Wrestling Done Right



## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-dJngBfpEY

Sakuraba vs Kiyoshi Tamura 1.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juTC0lwaves

Saku vs Tamura 2.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juTC0lwaves

Saku vs Tamura 3 part 1.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bDLqmXfNEg

Part 2.

http://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/search/Volk+Han/video/x3rplg_volk-han-vs-kiyoshi-tamura_school

Tamura vs Volk Freakin' Han!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrccNIv0tmM

Minoru Suzuki vs Masakatsu Funaki.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfOmtC5Q_gU

Akira Maeda vs Yamazaki (UWF). Part 1.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wPB_v4waSuY

Part 2.

This is how I like my pro-wrestling: Realistic, groundbreaking and emotional. A lot of the UWF stuff was way, way, way before its time, same with Rings. Volk Han was the badass, who pulled off crazy leg-locks, all while showing little to no emotion. Minoru Suzuki was the badass, little punk, who smirked when he kicked you in the leg. Maeda was the asskicker, who would kick your face in if you mess with him. Tamura was the spunky underdog. 

I don't watch pro-wrestling anymore, mostly because it's freakin' stupid. I wouldn't mind watching 2 guys work a shoot style match, though, as I really enjoy those. I liked what I saw from Big Mouth Loud, U-Style was fun and Hustle is hilarious, but other than that, I got nothing. 

So yeah, what is pro-wrestling done right in your opinion? I know, me making a pro-wrestling topic? Well, watching Volk Han leg-lock fools got me motivated to make one.

Discuss.


----------



## brownpimp88 (Jun 22, 2006)

For me, Pro-Wrestling was done perfectly in the 90s. When the storylines were interesting and not so stupid. And the wrestlers weren't all Chris Masters. Perhaps it was because I was younger, but the days of Sid Vicious comedy and The Rock and stuff were perfect.


----------



## plazzman (Mar 29, 2007)

Yeah to me it doesn't get any better than the Attitude era, sheer perfection.


----------



## NikosCC (May 16, 2007)

The early 90's was the greatest Wrestling era. Thats when we had good guys and bad guys, Hulk Hogan was dominating, The warrior was all roided up and the storylines were fantastic. Who can honestly tell me that when the undertaker was introduced everyone wasn't like AHHH HELL YEAH haha


----------



## Pyros (Apr 16, 2008)

I still watch it sometimes, but yeah the storylines now are garbage, however there are some new wrestlers that put on a good show, for example on ECW this week the Evan Bourne match was good stuff, beatiful shooting star press at the end.


----------



## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

As far as the 90's North American pro-wrestling scene goes, nothing tops 1992-1994 (Pre-Hogan) WCW. You had great feuds like Sting vs Vader, Bill Watts booking and a roster that was unreal.

I'm wondering just how good was Sakuraba's pro-wrestling career, as I haven't really paid enough attention to it outside of the Tamura matches and the Bad News Allen match. TheNegation needs to get his ass in here and tell me about Saku's pro-wrestling career. Oh, and he had that one match with Ohtani that I thought sucked.


----------



## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

Man I wrote a massive rant on ECW, FMW, CZW and XPW(I hated the last two) Attitude era, New Jack, Meng/Haku, Hayabusa, Mike awesome, Masato Tanaka.............loads of other stuff....

Then I click to post and their was a database error, whole thing went down the shitter

I may write another tomorrow, I have other things to rant about tonight.

On Sakurabas Pro-Wrestling career, man I like his matches, but it seriously pains me to see Sakuraba lose to guys like Koji Kanemento.


----------



## wukkadb (Jan 1, 2007)

Awesome links thanks for sharing. Cool stuff man, I wouldn't even call this pro-wrestling, it's like watching two guys work a shooto-style match, like you said. Awesome


----------



## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

I watched this one CZW match that had this one guy named Ric Blade in it. Just horrible. Dude botched every move he tried, it was embarrassing.



> Awesome links thanks for sharing. Cool stuff man, I wouldn't even call this pro-wrestling, it's like watching two guys work a shooto-style match, like you said. Awesome


Yep, and you really can't go wrong with guys like Tamura, Han and Suzuki. Those guys always produce great match after great match.

Even though I'm a huge Frank Shamrock fan, I still haven't seen his Rings match against TK. I bet that's great.


----------



## djants (Jun 19, 2008)

Was UWF what was shown as 'Bushido' on Bravo in the UK?

If so I remember that and it was really well done. I watched it for a while and it built up Gary Albright as a monster to a big showdown with Tanaka (?). made you able to actually suspend your disbelief.


----------



## eric2004bc (Apr 27, 2008)

the 90s were the best days of wrestling(back when it was called WWF), the story lines were good back then not like they are now and the wrestlers back then were so much better the rock, stone cold, mankind. when mankind V triple H in hell in the cell and mankind got thrown through the top of the cage, and big show V shane Mcmahn and he chockslammed him off the titontrone.

ah good times


----------



## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

djants said:


> Was UWF what was shown as 'Bushido' on Bravo in the UK?
> 
> If so I remember that and it was really well done. I watched it for a while and it built up Gary Albright as a monster to a big showdown with Tanaka (?). made you able to actually suspend your disbelief.


Yeah, that's the UWFi, which is basically UWF with Takada running things. 

Yeah, Albright vs Takada was a pretty well worked feud, nice bits of realism, though, to be honest, Takada never really did much for me as a shoot style worker. I'm sure many shoot style fans would kill me for saying that, but I just didn't like him and his Rocky Balboa imitating. It got old.


----------



## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

I really liked the 90's era with Randy Savage and Sting and Ultimate Warrior. Bret Hart and Shawn Michaels were some of my favorites. I never watched the Japanese stuff because I was young and didn't know about it but pro wrestling used to be so awesome.


----------



## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

I'm with you man, Takada was not cool.


God, czw/xpw waas part of my rant. It's like they bought the whole hardcore elementof ecw and brought it to new, highly retarded levels, missing the entire pont of ECW. 
They had some cool spots, like ZZandig and Mondos bump from the shed roof and New Jack with the highest Balcony dive I have ever seen, but the wrestling sucked really hard.

Vader was awesome
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A984hEAc31I


----------



## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

Okay, TheNegation, what's the verdict on Saku's pro-wrestling work? I need to know if it's as good or better than Kiyoshi Tamura. I've only seen a few Saku matches. IVPVideos.com is selling a Saku's greatest hits comp.

Also, those Bas Rutten shoot style matches that Terry77 posted a little while back were cool.


----------



## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

Damone said:


> Okay, TheNegation, what's the verdict on Saku's pro-wrestling work? I need to know if it's as good or better than Kiyoshi Tamura. I've only seen a few Saku matches. IVPVideos.com is selling a Saku's greatest hits comp.
> 
> Also, those Bas Rutten shoot style matches that Terry77 posted a little while back were cool.


OK, have you tracked down all the matches you can find on youtube and dailymotion?
If not
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aygOxvwCprQ&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-QK9c1_4BgI&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJ-xPhg77FU&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQAT-Wr3iPk&feature=related

You'll love the last one.

Honestly these should be able to make your mind up for you.


I would say Saku is better, but then you have to remember I am a fan of Saku and not of Tamura.

It's at least as good, if you like Tamura then you are obviously going to like Sakus matches. I'd say get the thing.


----------



## Negative1 (Feb 4, 2007)

I still like pro-wrestling, I tune into RAW every now and then but man, has it ever gone down hill.

I heard Taker retired, anyone confirm this/care?

I miss the old ECW. Hearing the audience chant E C W ! like they really believed in it, these days it just sounds soo forced. 

Just a few days ago on gaytube, I was watching a list of the 'Holy Sh*t' moments in pro-wrestling. I got to about #50 before I stopped watching and went to bed but jesus, brings back alot of memories. Some of those things those guys did in WWF/WWE and ECW back then, it was insane. It was hard to believe that it was all scripted watching them.


----------



## Pyros (Apr 16, 2008)

Taker retiring is storyline, he was thrown out of the WWE because he lost a match to Edge.


----------



## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

To answer the original question of this thread, this is how I like my Pro-Wrestling, ridiculous and violent.
I was into the whole, Undertaker, Ultimate Warrior, The Rock stuff as a kid, but then I saw ECW stuff and was like "Whoah, wrestling can be like this?"

ECW was more extreme, had better wrestlers from places like Japan and Mexico....I was hooked.

I can still watch this stuff and be amazed at the spots and the athletic ability of these guys.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5Y8QT6GP38
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p7L33VGCB3s&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wH_BVriPHh8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_eXqyyzMvA


----------



## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

TheNegation said:


> OK, have you tracked down all the matches you can find on youtube and dailymotion?
> If not
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aygOxvwCprQ&feature=related
> 
> ...


Thank you, kind sir, I will get the thing. That Kashin match was a blast. Sakuraba can perform one swank german suplex.


----------



## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

I had no idea Jushin Liger had an MMA match with Suzuki, how the hell did I miss that?

I also never knew Taka Michinoku had an MMA bout....

http://www.larryweaver.com/blog/2008/01/ufc-vs-wwe-pro-wrestlers-mma-fighters.asp

Man I gotta find some of these videos.

And come on, there are more Pro-Wrestling fans than this lurking on the site.


----------



## Negative1 (Feb 4, 2007)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsKfo3OUvao&feature=related

I don't know which promotion this was but that was just insanity. I have only seen another thing worse than that and that was the Big Show throwing Al Snow from a gorilla-press onto some chairs set up like that.

That promotion CZW is hardcore but they're just hardcore because they can be, they have nothing else going for them and they overuse the lightbulbs. ECW was the perfect blend of wrestling and hardcore.

New Jack in not correct between the ears I might add.

Hmmmm, what else can I ramble about :confused02:

The Sabu vs Funk barbedwire ropes match was overall, not a good idea. The though of Sabu cutting his bicep open makes me crinch. :confused05:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cap4mOJ6N2E

That, has got to be the dumbest thing I've ever witnessed. What on gods green earth possessed them to do an emerald fusion off a house threw a sinlge table? I don't get it, honestly I dont. I realize the influence hardcore wrestling has on some people but jesus.

More on this subject when I have the time.


----------



## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

TheNegation said:


> I had no idea Jushin Liger had an MMA match with Suzuki, how the hell did I miss that?
> 
> I also never knew Taka Michinoku had an MMA bout....
> 
> ...


Suzuki vs Liger was hilarious. Liger fought with his mask off and even attempted this flip type kick that didn't even phase Minoru. Of course, Minoru Suzuki ended up smoking him. 

Never did see the Taka fight, I'm interested.


----------



## Steph05050 (Jun 4, 2008)

NikosCC said:


> The early 90's was the greatest Wrestling era. Thats when we had good guys and bad guys, Hulk Hogan was dominating, The warrior was all roided up and the storylines were fantastic. Who can honestly tell me that when the undertaker was introduced everyone wasn't like AHHH HELL YEAH haha


yes 90s wrestling was the best no doubt....back also when it was wwf u kno cant stand it now


----------



## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

lolz


----------



## Chileandude (Jan 17, 2008)

I can't believe there's no love for Ring of Honor.

Easily the top wrestling promotion in america right now in terms of "p-Wrestling done right"

And still, ProWrestling NOAH and Dragon Gate in Japan are putting good shows.

Memorable stuff from Ring of Honor

you should look out for Samoa Joe vs Kenta Kobashi 

Lance Storm vs Bryan Danielson 

The Briscoe Brothers vs Generico/Steen - Ladder war

Samoa Joe vs CM Punk 2

Could keep on going but im a tad drunk right now.


----------



## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

Negative1 said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsKfo3OUvao&feature=related
> 
> I don't know which promotion this was but that was just insanity. I have only seen another thing worse than that and that was the Big Show throwing Al Snow from a gorilla-press onto some chairs set up like that.


I can think of so many worse spots, even just from ECW, but especially from XPW and CZW



Negative1 said:


> That promotion CZW is hardcore but they're just hardcore because they can be, they have nothing else going for them and they overuse the lightbulbs. ECW was the perfect blend of wrestling and hardcore..


I'd agree with this yeah, ECW had it right. Those constant lightbulb spots get really, really old.



Negative1 said:


> New Jack in not correct between the ears I might add.


New Jack was awesome, best spots I've honestly ever seen and the dude has hilarious mic skills.



Negative1 said:


> Hmmmm, what else can I ramble about :confused02:
> 
> The Sabu vs Funk barbedwire ropes match was overall, not a good idea. The though of Sabu cutting his bicep open makes me crinch. :confused05:


Any Barbed wire match is idiotic.



Negative1 said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cap4mOJ6N2E
> 
> That, has got to be the dumbest thing I've ever witnessed. What on gods green earth possessed them to do an emerald fusion off a house threw a sinlge table? I don't get it, honestly I dont. I realize the influence hardcore wrestling has on some people but jesus.
> 
> More on this subject when I have the time.


Dumbasses are fun.


----------



## Chileandude (Jan 17, 2008)

Samoa Joe vs AJ Styles in RoH around 2003.

http://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/search/samoa+joe/video/x4v00n_aj-styles-vs-samoa-joe_sport

not the best of works but it has some brilliance.


----------



## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

Damone said:


> lolz


YES! That fight was hilarious. 

For me, the best pro wrestling matches I enjoyed were the endless series between Misawa, Kobashi, Kawada, Hansen, etc. back in the glory days of AJPW. Baba is the GOAT booker. Also if your a nerd for pro wrestling like I was, check out the recent match between Nakamura and Mutoh for the IWGP

For North America wrestling, Ric Flair in his day is always good (Steamboat, Sting, Vader, even Randy Savage). Ring of Honor puts on some serious quality as well, big fan of Bryan Danielson and the Briscoe brothers.

The whole worked shoot thing in Japan is irrelevant now with MMA, and it looks silly to me now. Like I watched Josh Barnett against Don Frye and it was terrible. But check out Mark Coleman's pro wrestling stints that shit is gold:laugh:

My nerdage for pro wrestling has subsided the past few years, but I still check out time to time. Boxing was my first love for real fighting, but MMA completes the picture and pro wrestling's overall interest fades because of it. I just try to take it as great working and not "fake".


----------



## Sinister (Nov 19, 2007)

In the past couple years I have by far seen the most innovative wrestling put on, from Dragon Gate, NOAH, CHIKARA, PWG, and ROH to name probably the best promotions going.

TNA used to be heaven for me to watch until they turned there product into the Kurt Angle variety hour. This and the lack of characters in the indy scene really turned me off pro-wrestling.

As far as the best time in wrestling, really it just all depends where you look. I believe the 80's had by far the greatest matches, 90's changed wrestling and gave it a new outlook with deeper and more creative story lines, and right now wrestling just seemed to fall apart on the mainstream. You just don't see the love that the WWE used to have for itself, it's only a shell of what it once was and will never be again.


----------



## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

Terry77 said:


> The whole worked shoot thing in Japan is irrelevant now with MMA, and it looks silly to me now. Like I watched Josh Barnett against Don Frye and it was terrible. But check out Mark Coleman's pro wrestling stints that shit is gold:laugh:


I liked what I saw of Tamura's U-Style stuff, as it reminded me of the old UWF. I've always loved me some Rings and UWF, so of course, I'd like that stuff. 

I am curious to see his match with Don Frye, though, as that can't be anything but a train wreck. Don Frye is still wrestling? Yeesh...

Frye did manage to get a good match out of Scott Norton, though.

What do you think of Maeda's Rings and the UWF?

All Japan's 70's stuff was ridiculously good. Like, the Destroyer vs Mil Mascaras, their series ruled. Brisco vs Funk was great.


----------



## Chileandude (Jan 17, 2008)

i think a worked shoot can still work, it would look just like a normal MMA match and you would never even notice it was fake.....

the problem is that egos make that hard to pull off.


----------



## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

I thought Barnett and Fryes match wasn't that bad actually.......


----------



## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

I liked Barnett's match with Tamura from U-Style. Then again, I like just about anything from Kiyoshi Tamura.


----------



## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

I never really like Tamura, and the whole MW GP fiasco has not done much to resolve the situation........


----------



## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

Why don't you like Tamura, and didn't he break his hand fighting Funaki? It's not like he broke it on purpose.

You better like Volk Han.


----------



## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

Damone said:


> Why don't you like Tamura, and didn't he break his hand fighting Funaki? It's not like he broke it on purpose.
> 
> You better like Volk Han.



I know he injured himself, but it's still he's fault Saku had to fight Manhoef. I don't know if he broke his hand, but if so for some reason I didn't think the injury was that serious.


Volk Han is awesome, both as a wrestler and a fighter.


----------



## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

At least you think Volk Han is awesome. He really is. Great fighter and great pro-wrestler. His whole career is overlooked by many MMA fans. The guy had excellent *****.

He makes pro-wrestling look manly. He is amazing.


----------



## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

It's not really that I dislike Tamura, I just prefer Saku, cos hes my hero, and Funaki, cos he's a badass.

Tamura never seemed to have what either of those guys had for me.




ROH seems pretty cool, but if I watch Pro-wrestling now, it's mostly old matches, and it's about 90% for the nostalgia.


----------



## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

Damone said:


> I liked what I saw of Tamura's U-Style stuff, as it reminded me of the old UWF. I've always loved me some Rings and UWF, so of course, I'd like that stuff.
> 
> I am curious to see his match with Don Frye, though, as that can't be anything but a train wreck. Don Frye is still wrestling? Yeesh...
> 
> ...



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xexrDXpjWo I didn't like it, but there's not much good from Frye. Dude's a fighter before a wrastler. 

RINGS pre MMA and UWF were a great concept for its time and it drew some ridiculous money. Honestly, I have not checked out enough as you and others, but it made Antoni Inoki's bullshit look even worse. Maeda was a pretty big prick to everybody on the Japanese wrastling scene though (I think), I know he hated Inoki at least and did some legit hurtin on guys.

AJPW was the shit for stiff matches. Kobashi/Dr. Death for example http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AsjhRd9JHU Shame the company is a bit of a side show now

Terry Funk pre broken down old man and Ric Flair were classics. A lot of people will hate Bret Hart, but he's another guy I loved as a kid and his work is top notch as well.


----------

