# Jason Miller claims GSP greased against him too



## Rated (Nov 25, 2006)

*Edit: If you cannot keep from being an unbiased prick then stay out of this thread, I don't want this to be closed.*



> This natural desire to win and innate competitiveness that most athletes in any sport have is only the tip of the iceberg. Most of the people reading this article probably are not professional athletes. At least I’m assuming that Fight! Magazine can get this to more houses than mine and Dan Henderson’s, but think about if after a fight that I lost I said, “hey that guy had a roll of quarters in his glove!” Now even if it was true, it doesn’t matter, unless the ref pulls out the stack of George Washington’s from his hand and it is broadcast in high definition on every big screen in the arena. I just sound like a whiny bitch, and he got away with the whole thing, and makes me look like an even bigger sissy, for first of all, LOSING, second of all crying foul after the fact.
> 
> This time an anonymous MEGA arena, in a mega city, in front of a mega crowd, in a mega show, for what was then mega money to me. The stakes are much higher this time, and I had done my best to prepare for this single fight, even going so far as to NOT have a wild sex party the night before the fight, so that I could improve my mental focus. After a rough first round, I met in the center for round 2 and somewhere got taken down. “No biggie, my guard is good, he won’t hurt me here, and maybe I can pull off the submission, get a “Dumbass of the Night” award or something. While locked in my tight guard, I noticed that for some reason I was have trouble keeping my opponent’s head down. I practiced shirtless with my great training partners, and never had this much trouble keeping a guy from punching me. Was this guy uber strong or something? No exactly. After a couple more stiff elbows to my grillpiece, I felt the familiar slick that I would get every day at kickboxing practice on my nose and eyes, only it was on my opponents neck, now up 2 rounds, Vaseline!
> 
> ...


Sean Sherk has also made a few comments in the past about Georges St Pierre greasing during their fight, and BJ Penn’s camp says Matt Serra also complained. I suppose now we need to wait and see what some of Georges’ other opponents do. Personally, I’m interested to hear what Matt Hughes, Jon Fitch and Josh Koscheck have to say.

http://www.fightlinker.com/jason-miller-claims-gsp-greased-against-him-too.mma

Okay, here's what annoys me: Why did Miller not pursue this issue harder during the fight? The ref apparently ignored him but why not go back to his corner and complain again? The ref cannot keep ignoring you.

These accusations surfacing up after several months/years after the fight is just plain stupid. Why did the fighters not speak up *during* the fight?

I will have lost respect for GSP if there is truth to this issue but from what I can tell this was (supposedly) an isolated incident that happened last Saturday and it was (possibly) unintentional. I'm trying to be as unbiased as possible but unless there is more concrete evidence of GSP greasing, I find these accusations to be slanderous.

*+rep to anyone who can find me an interview of Sherk insinuating that GSP greases because I don't recall ever reading about it (or even hearing about it).* Seriously, why keep quiet until now? I do not even think GSP was even using that voodoo crap in those fights so who was greasing him then?


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## Wise (Oct 8, 2006)

The problem with Mayhem saying this is that dude is a complete clown and most people wont take him seriously, especially with how long its been since their fight.


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## Mc19 (Jul 6, 2006)

i suppose everyone who GSP beat is going to use this excuse now. Its amazing how vaseline can have this much impact on a fight:confused03:


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## southpaw447 (Mar 21, 2007)

This is ******* ridiculous. Why all of sudden when an accusation like this gets mainstream attention everyone else has to come forward.

I doubt this highly. I think people are just trying to find an excuse to justify getting their asses kicked.

Why would Sherk be bitching anyway. His fight with GSP spent most of the time on the feet and when he was taken down it's not like his tiny ass was going to be able to pull off a submission.


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## Hett (Apr 30, 2007)

GSP greased his back when I fought him too...true story.


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## Rated (Nov 25, 2006)

To be honest, I don't know how credible the thing about Sherk is. I read a lot of his interviews and never was there any indication that he thought GSP greases.

I just don't get it.


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## LV 2 H8 U (Nov 7, 2006)

Did you ever try and catch a greased pig?


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## Ald (Feb 17, 2008)

This is ironic. Was browsing for some evidence and found a post where Kenny Florian suggestion Huerta greased up.:laugh:

http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2008/8/22/599197/kenny-florian-accusing-rog


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## Hett (Apr 30, 2007)

LV 2 H8 U said:


> Did you ever try and catch a greased pig?


Just this one time at a bar after I had to much to drink and she was the only girl around.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

He greased on me too, man.


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## D.P. (Oct 8, 2008)

Well, what's done is done, Penn lost, Miller lost, everybody already lost. If they want to make something of it, do it in the next fight that Gsp has and make sure he's not greasing...that's it. No need for excuses.


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## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

Took Mayhem 4 years to bring it up?


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## Walker (May 27, 2007)

When I got beaten up by James Thomas in the 4th grade I swear that f*cker was greasing.


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## Where'stheCrow? (Nov 28, 2007)

First...I'm not saying GSP did or didn't do this.

I'm sure people have experienced this before where by saying or doing something a stigma is attached to you. You obviously don't want that so you don't say or do it. Then whenever one person says or does that thing, all of a sudden you have the courage to do the same. I know I have had it happen before, as I'm sure most have.


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## Red Baron (Jul 17, 2008)

i don't know shit about shit most times but i've got a buddy that is in real good shape and the guy sweats like a greased pig - a hell of a lot more than anyone else i know ( he says he's efficient) but maybe gsp sweats like a whore iunno


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## NGen2010 (Jun 3, 2008)

Mc19 said:


> ... Its amazing how vaseline can have this much impact on a fight:confused03:


Are you serious. It has a huge impact on a fight in MMA. Try submitting someone without grease, then with. Night and day.

If GSP does this, that is a real shame. To say it would not make a difference let's folks know who you support.


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## Hunter89 (Mar 24, 2008)

If anything of what he is saying is true, you cannot take anything away from GSP's talents, its not like he's taking steroids or other performance enhancing drugs, the guy is clearly talented, thats for sure, and was the better fighter in every single win in the UFC, i mean applying alittle bit of vaseline into the back of the neck wouldn't stop a talented Ju-Jitsu guy being able to stop someone posturing up, id imagine they'd have to apply it all over the back and the shoulders and arms etc for it to be a real problem. and the with the camera focus on the corner's of each fighter at the end of the rounds, and the time they get between rounds, it would get noticed, if they were gettin greased by their corner men, and i can't see them appling it before the fight, and it being still effective with the amount of clothes they wear coming into the octagon


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## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

Maybe GSP is really slimey when he sweats?

This is getting ridiculous now, from the Penn fight there would not have been enough vaseline contact to make much of a difference, in the other fights I am thinking the same considering nothing was ever mentioned.


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## the unknown (Jun 23, 2007)

This is all easily checked! Go back and review each and every one of GSP's fights!

If his corner dipped their hand deep in to a jar of Vaseline and rubbed it over him, it will all b e there to open viewing...period.

Now, if a lil Vaseline from a couple of small spots migrates during intense battle that's to be expected.

Be it MMA or boxing, Vaseline is a goto product of corners. Why after all these years isn't the product banned if it poses this negative effect that guys bring forward AFTER THE FACT?

The real fact is Vaseline in the way it is used on open camera poses NO adverse effect to a oppisition fighter...period.

I hope these whining f**ks continue this because like I've said before, they will create their own ruin. They will be tagged for what they are, whining, sniveling half wits that fans will excise from the sport! One way or the other!

Rant off


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## Gallows (Oct 16, 2006)

Strange that we've heard nothing about this before.

A lot of GSP's opponents are pretty blunt and honest, and certainly wouldn't hesitate to say that he was cheating if they felt he was cheating.

This isn't like **** or molestation where the victims would feel shame and want to keep quiet about their suffering, this is a competition between two fighters beating the snot out of each other. Most people would love to have a reason to blame for their beatdowns.

I also don't see any quotes from those other fighters concerning this. It just says they said it but never actually gives proof. Just because it's written doesn't mean it's true. It sounds more like yellow journalism than anything else.

Also, I seriously doubt GSP was greasing his whole career, gets to Greg Jacksons camp and says "'ey I bin greezing my 'ole career, can you keep greezing me?" "Sure GSP, whatever, no one will care I'm sure".

This is just absurd.


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## Mc19 (Jul 6, 2006)

NGen2010 said:


> Are you serious. It has a huge impact on a fight in MMA. Try submitting someone without grease, then with. Night and day.
> 
> If GSP does this, that is a real shame. To say it would not make a difference let's folks know who you support.


 lmao, yeah because sherk had so many submission attempts against the guy. these guys got beat by a better fighter, end of story.


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Hmmm I'm not someone who is going to take Mayhem that seriously but IMO if you aren't at least considering this stuff as serious about GSP you are blind. This is starting to get pretty ugly IMO.


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## Where'stheCrow? (Nov 28, 2007)

Gallows said:


> This isn't like **** or molestation where the victims would feel shame and want to keep quiet about their suffering, this is a competition between two fighters beating the snot out of each other. Most people would love to have a reason to blame for their beatdowns.


I was talking more along lines of a whistleblower. Look at the heat BJ was getting after the fight for just mentioning the incident. He didn't say he was going to appeal or anything and people jumped all over him. A lot of people wouldn't want to deal with that shit, especially if they thought it wouldn't do any good anyways.

These new claims are probably just a bunch of b.s. anyways.


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## Rated (Nov 25, 2006)

Where'stheCrow? said:


> First...I'm not saying GSP did or didn't do this.
> 
> I'm sure people have experienced this before where by saying or doing something a stigma is attached to you. You obviously don't want that so you don't say or do it. Then whenever one person says or does that thing, all of a sudden you have the courage to do the same. I know I have had it happen before, as I'm sure most have.


Yeah, I totally get what you are saying but what I don't get is that they may be worried about being a bitch for accusing someone of cheating, yet they are fine with calling them out after they have been "exposed." To me, that's being bitch.

Like Miller is saying how important that fight was to him and he even stopped with his crazy orgies so he wouldn't lose his mojo and shit, but he's worried about looking like a bitch for calling foul? That just doesn't make any sense.


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## Where'stheCrow? (Nov 28, 2007)

Rated said:


> Yeah, I totally get what you are saying but what I don't get is that they may be worried about being a bitch for accusing someone of cheating, yet they are fine with calling them out after they have been "exposed." To me, that's being bitch.
> 
> Like Miller is saying how important that fight was to him and he even stopped with his crazy orgies so he wouldn't lose his mojo and shit, but he's worried about looking like a bitch for calling foul? That just doesn't make any sense.


I come from a baseball background and I can tell you from experience that if I noticed something fishy, I tended to leave it alone for the coach to catch, as did many of my teammates. Anyways, that example was just used to try and maybe explain why people are showing up late to the party with this thing. I don't know if I completely buy it though.


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Well look at the response when BJ supposedly came out and said GSP greased when in fact the NSAC was the one who accused him. BJ got trashed was called a sore loset I can't blame him for not wanting to come foward but I don't really believe him.


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## Walker (May 27, 2007)

bbjd7 said:


> Hmmm I'm not someone who is going to take Mayhem that seriously but IMO if you aren't at least considering this stuff as serious about GSP you are blind. This is starting to get pretty ugly IMO.


bbjd7- I haven't commented on the situation because I'm going to wait and see how it fully plays out but Mayhem saying this now means absolutely zero to me. It if was a case of GSP doing this in all of his fights then why not more accusations or at least other fighters and camps saying something at least to the effect of looking into it or warning officials pre-fight they think it might be happening.

I'm not going to judge GSP on wild accusations and I'm honestly going to go back and re-watch more of GSP's fights because I have seen Nurse massage GSP and work on his breathing before. 

If it is true as a huge fan I will be devastated but right now I'll wait to see how this plays out before condeming GSP of any willful cheating or even his cornermen.


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

This is getting stupid! What next, Pete Spratt is going to complain that GSP greased up! If Mayhem wasn't going to complain after the fight 4 years ago why bother doing it now?


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## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

Ugh, Mayhem even writes like he _thinks_ he is funny. :sarcastic12:

If there was any validity to the accusations of these fighters, this would have been investigated much sooner. Sounds like a bunch of guys sore over either their unanimous beatdowns or angry because they put money on BJ winning. :dunno:


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## Shoegazer (Jun 23, 2007)

Where there's smoke...

Should be interesting to see if one or more additional GSP opponents come out and say something. Are they all just jealous? The whole thing does seem pretty improbable, but hey, when you get ultra-competitive athletes fighting for ridiculous fame and fortune...

What's next, energy workers in a fighter's corner?


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## fjurado (Oct 23, 2008)

I have greased up my butt cheeks.....it makes my kicks come up faster!!!!!!!!!:thumb02:


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Walker said:


> bbjd7- I haven't commented on the situation because I'm going to wait and see how it fully plays out but Mayhem saying this now means absolutely zero to me. It if was a case of GSP doing this in all of his fights then why not more accusations or at least other fighters and camps saying something at least to the effect of looking into it or warning officials pre-fight they think it might be happening.
> 
> I'm not going to judge GSP on wild accusations and I'm honestly going to go back and re-watch more of GSP's fights because I have seen Nurse massage GSP and work on his breathing before.
> 
> If it is true as a huge fan I will be devastated but right now I'll wait to see how this plays out before condeming GSP of any willful cheating or even his cornermen.


I agree but I think it can't just be thrown away as a bunch of guys making stuff up.

Some stuff obviously went down in the BJ fight I think we need to let some more of this to come out but we shouldn't just let this pass. Because while I don't think it has had a real impact on the fights cheating is cheating.


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## Negative1 (Feb 4, 2007)

Not that I agree with anyones side in this entire thing but has anyone ever tried to wipe vaseline off your skin with a towel? It doesn't work very well. It takes multiple wipes with a moist towel to clean vaseline off skin.

Just my 2 cents I thought I'd contribute.


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## Davisty69 (May 24, 2007)

This after the fact crap is stupid. If you really had a problem you should have said something at the time.

Who knows, maybe the guy is just really slippery.


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## Rated (Nov 25, 2006)

bbjd7 said:


> Well look at the response when BJ supposedly came out and said GSP greased when in fact the NSAC was the one who accused him. BJ got trashed was called a sore loset I can't blame him for not wanting to come foward but I don't really believe him.


Well I do agree with the fact that fighters might get trashed for calling foul, I think the BJ case is a bit of the extreme considering the whole build up of the fight.

It's also the fact that the fighters don't do it at the moment that makes it really dubious. If you call it during the fight you can make certain of what is going on. If GSP was really greasing and they went up there and took their time checking, they could have just DQ/NC it. But doing it *after* the fight, especially when you got dominated, makes you look like a douche for trying to discredit the other fighter.

Like at least BJ is doing it right after. These people are coming out several years after to call foul. What can they prove from doing this? Regardless of the outcome, GSP's victories will forever be tarnished because the seed of doubt has already been planted.


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Personally I don't buy Mayhem at all I'm just not sweeping all these things under the rug.


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## Wombatsu (Jul 10, 2006)

Negative1 said:


> Not that I agree with anyones side in this entire thing but has anyone ever tried to wipe vaseline off your skin with a towel? It doesn't work very well. It takes multiple wipes with a moist towel to clean vaseline off skin.
> 
> Just my 2 cents I thought I'd contribute.


very fair point, i was thinking even if you wipe it it doesnt come off anyhow. I say give it time and see what happens, my guess is his corner have a case to answer not GSP himself so much.


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## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

> Kizer: Penn yet to file UFC 94 appeal, St. Pierre's corner could face action
> by John Morgan on Feb 02, 2009 at 7:15 pm ET
> While the utter domination of B.J. Penn by Georges St. Pierre during the two champions' UFC 94 main-event bout cannot be questioned, the tactics implemented by the Canadian's team between rounds of Saturday's fight has left the group open for disciplinary action.
> 
> ...


Just posting this so that perhaps we can stop with the whole, 'Do you know how hard it is to remove vaseline? It takes more than a tiny swipe with a towel' line that is becoming so famous around these parts. You're hearing it from the horse's mouth... GSP was thoroughly wiped down, and while it still may not have been efficient enough in your eyes, no longer can anyone claim that he was merely given a quick once-over with the towel, which many here have done on the basis of a few seconds of video footage, not seeming to care about what we've missed when the camera panned away. Good Lord... at this rate, I'm going to be really deep into the red. Defending GSP hasn't been very good for my rep these past few days. Lousy BJ fans


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## M_D (Apr 8, 2007)

now I must be reading mayham's post differently for the way I read it he was not making excuses for his lost and said he would have lost anyways most likely, he is just saying that he tried to contact the ref about feeling vasaline and was ignored. 

so far I have not herd any fighter say that this was the reason why they lost or that they would have won with out this done so I dont see why members on here are saying taht these fighters are just making excuses for why they lost


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## mercom (Jun 16, 2007)

i think half the people defending GSP in this thread didnt see the fight or read the article, implying that vaseline was never even put on his back. but as for my opinion on the matter, GSP would have beat BJ either way. Its still cheating


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## NGen2010 (Jun 3, 2008)

Mc19 said:


> lmao, yeah because sherk had so many submission attempts against the guy. these guys got their asses kicked by a better fighter, end of story.


Listen, I like GSP and BJ and all the others had their [email protected]@ handed to them from GSP. I'm not taking anything any from GSP - just saying it is a shame if it is true. Why would GSP or his corner do something when they know he is faster, strong and more talented than his opponents. The only thing he seems to lack is a chin - if you can hit him - and you can't really lube that up. We'll yuo could I guess.


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## capt_america (Apr 16, 2007)

i think its on the UFC 56 DVD bonus footage where Sherk accused GSP of oiling..


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## Negative1 (Feb 4, 2007)

M_D said:


> now I must be reading mayham's post differently for the way I read it he was not making excuses for his lost and said he would have lost anyways most likely, he is just saying that he tried to contact the ref about feeling vasaline and was ignored.
> 
> so far I have not herd any fighter say that this was the reason why they lost or that they would have won with out this done so I dont see why members on here are saying taht these fighters are just making excuses for why they lost


Exactly.

It's totally out of the realm of possibility because GSP is their favorite fighter.

But for the record I want to reiterate that I am not taking anyones side because it won't change my view of either fighter which ever way it pans out.


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## Where'stheCrow? (Nov 28, 2007)

capt_america said:


> i think its on the UFC 56 DVD bonus footage where Sherk accused GSP of oiling..


After I saw your post I did kinda remember something so I popped in the dvd and you're right. Sherk says GSP was slippery and he must have been oiling. He says he couldn't grab him at all. Good catch because I forgot all about that.


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## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

M_D said:


> now I must be reading mayham's post differently for the way I read it he was not making excuses for his lost and said he would have lost anyways most likely, he is just saying that he tried to contact the ref about feeling vasaline and was ignored.
> 
> so far I have not herd any fighter say that this was the reason why they lost or that they would have won with out this done so I dont see why members on here are saying taht these fighters are just making excuses for why they lost


Even then, why would you wait four years to publicize it? Cheating is cheating, whether it's a big fight or not. Look at it this way, there are cameras and eyes on the corner at ALL times, greasing for an advantage would be impossible to hide.

This made no difference in the outcome of the fight, and it really looked like an absent minded mistake by the cornerman. He should receive a stern warning, but it's ludicrous to question GSP's last fights because of this incident.


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## SpecC (Nov 18, 2007)

when i clicked this, i thought it was a joke


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

Fedor>all said:


> Even then, why would you wait four years to publicize it? Cheating is cheating, whether it's a big fight or not. Look at it this way, there are cameras and eyes on the corner at ALL times, greasing for an advantage would be impossible to hide.
> 
> This made no difference in the outcome of the fight, and it really looked like an absent minded mistake by the cornerman. He should receive a stern warning, but it's ludicrous to question GSP's last fights because of this incident.


Couldn't have said it better myself.


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## jasonc84 (Nov 9, 2007)

Negative1 said:


> Not that I agree with anyones side in this entire thing but has anyone ever tried to wipe vaseline off your skin with a towel? It doesn't work very well. It takes multiple wipes with a moist towel to clean vaseline off skin.
> 
> Just my 2 cents I thought I'd contribute.


I've been thinking the exact same thing!! Vaseline does not come off easily, even with water you gotta work to get it off. Whipping off GSPs back would not sufficiently clear it up.


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## name goes here (Aug 15, 2007)

They probably thought they'd just be thought of as bad sports at the time. For all they knew GSP could just be naturally greasy. You don't question the ref.

There are two possibilities at this point. GSP is lying. Or BJ, Miller, and Sherk are lying


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## jasonc84 (Nov 9, 2007)

name goes here said:


> They probably thought they'd just be thought of as bad sports at the time. For all they knew GSP could just be naturally greasy. You don't question the ref.
> 
> There are two possibilities at this point. GSP is lying. Or BJ, Miller, and Sherk are lying


To me it says a lot that fighters are now coming out, regardless of the time they did not want to look they were making excuses from what i'd assume. Now that BJ has made himself that scapegoat i think they feel comfortable in admitting their suspicions. :dunno: just my two cents


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## Rabid (Oct 7, 2007)

I thought it was really telling in the Mayhem/GSP fight when Miller grabbed GSP's leg to do a takedown and his corner was yelling "RETARD STRENGTH" and you could see Miller hoisting with all his might and George didn't even budge. 

I think GSP is going to be having some trouble being on top for such a long time, there is a natural tendency in our nature to start to hate really successful people. 

Aren't Mayhem and BJ Penn good buddies?


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

Woopdi...f***ing doo...mo money/fame mo problems. What's new...

Suppose everyone wants a rematch with GSP now.


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## Darkgecko (Apr 21, 2008)

The only good thing about all of this nonsense is that the Athletic Commision should keep a better eye on this crap. The ref checks for fingernails and grease before the fight, why aren't they checked before each round?


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## Bazza89 (Dec 31, 2006)

I've gotta say, even though I don't really trust Mayhem, after three different fighters have spoke up even the most die-hard GSP fan has to admit that it's very suspiscious.

I do think it's peoples GSP love clouding their judgement a bit TBH, just like after the Serra fight no-one gave him any shit for taking away from Serra's victory,
imagine if how much hate BJ would have got if he'd been accused of this. 

At the end of the day, nobody knows the truth except for GSP and his corner, I think the best thing to come of this will be more vigilance regarding greasing between rounds, I think it's still gonna taint GSP's victories in the eyes of a lot of people though.


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## TERMINATOR (Jul 6, 2008)

Damn grease


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## Vale_Tudo (Nov 18, 2007)

This is getting ridicules, why not start complaining about the nipple tweak aswell? Stiffer nipples could scratch the opponents eye out


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## bail3yz (Apr 22, 2007)

I am really surprised at how biased some of you are being. Miller nor BJ are using this as an excuse. 

You guys are hating on Miller for bringing it up 4 years late.. but if he brought it up right after the fight he would have been hated on for being a sore loser, poor sport, etc. In my opinion it makes more sense for him to bring it up now, then it did before. If he brought it up before, he would have been the only one fighting it.. and he would have lost.. and likely lost a lot of fans. He brings it up now... when something like this happens... hes no longer fighting alone.. and it doesnt hurt his repetition as much. Its like a when a rapist gets caught lol, a bunch of previous victims come forward that never said anything before.


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## Rated (Nov 25, 2006)

To me, it hurts his rep way more to bring it up now than to bring it up during the time of the fight. I guess someone is going to have to go back and look to see if GSP had someone else rubbing him down throughout his career because he was not with Nurse/Jackson during those fights.


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## WouldLuv2FightU (Jul 17, 2006)

M_D said:


> now I must be reading mayham's post differently for the way I read it he was not making excuses for his lost and said he would have lost anyways most likely, he is just saying that he tried to contact the ref about feeling vasaline and was ignored.
> 
> so far I have not herd any fighter say that this was the reason why they lost or that they would have won with out this done so I dont see why members on here are saying taht these fighters are just making excuses for why they lost


Great post. :thumbsup:



Canadian Psycho said:


> Just posting this so that perhaps we can stop with the whole, 'Do you know how hard it is to remove vaseline? It takes more than a tiny swipe with a towel' line that is becoming so famous around these parts. You're hearing it from the horse's mouth... GSP was thoroughly wiped down, and while it still may not have been efficient enough in your eyes, no longer can anyone claim that he was merely given a quick once-over with the towel, which many here have done on the basis of a few seconds of video footage, not seeming to care about what we've missed when the camera panned away. Good Lord... at this rate, I'm going to be really deep into the red. Defending GSP hasn't been very good for my rep these past few days. Lousy BJ fans


You know what else came from the horses mouth? That not once, but twice in a row, by 2 different cornermen, an undetermined amount of vaseline was indeed put on GSP's neck and back. I like how you picked out one insignificant paragraph out of that entire article just to have something bad to say against a select few BJ fans. 



Bazza89 said:


> I've gotta say, even though I don't really trust Mayhem, after three different fighters have spoke up even the most die-hard GSP fan has to admit that it's very suspiscious.
> 
> I do think it's peoples GSP love clouding their judgement a bit TBH, just like after the Serra fight no-one gave him any shit for taking away from Serra's victory,
> imagine if how much hate BJ would have got if he'd been accused of this.
> ...


Great post as well, took the words right outta my mouth with the 2nd paragraph. Think about if GSP, Matt Hughes, and Jens Pulver were accusing BJ of greasing, I would bet my left nut that the majority of people would not even think twice about bashing BJ to no ends about it. I don't even think that's debatable.

Although I do have to disagree with one tiny part, I can't say for certain whether or not GSP had any knowledge of being greased, although it's possible.



bail3yz said:


> I am really surprised at how biased some of you are being. Miller nor BJ are using this as an excuse.
> 
> You guys are hating on Miller for bringing it up 4 years late.. but if he brought it up right after the fight he would have been hated on for being a sore loser, poor sport, etc. In my opinion it makes more sense for him to bring it up now, then it did before. If he brought it up before, he would have been the only one fighting it.. and he would have lost.. and likely lost a lot of fans. He brings it up now... when something like this happens... hes no longer fighting alone.. and it doesnt hurt his repetition as much. Its like a when a rapist gets caught lol, a bunch of previous victims come forward that never said anything before.


Another great post. I was gonna say something similar.

It's like the GSP diehards have no reading comprehension. He made it crystal clear with that piece he wrote that he wasn't taking anything away from the win nor did he think it was a reason for him losing. But fanboyism has a side effect of selective reading I guess. All they saw was "GSP blah blah blah blah blah blah greased".


I'm not even saying GSP won those fights because of some vaseline, he would have beaten all of them anyway. But that doesn't mean what his cornermen (and possibly GSP himself) are doing is right or ok. It's not something to be taken lightly. Cheating is cheating.

It's funny when a guy takes steroids and still loses people have no trouble lynching him and calling him a dirty cheater, even though it obviously had no effect on the outcome of the fight. GSP and his camp are special though right?

If it comes to light that these accusations ARE true, it wouldn't change my opinion of GSP being a top 3 fighter in the world and undoubtedly #1 WW in the world. All it would do is lower my respect for his character. Which really doesn't mean much to me, as I watch MMA for the fights, not the personalities.

Also, just wanted to add this in for shits and giggles. I'm not saying this to prove a point just something to think about, Rashad and Diego have both been accused of greasing in the past as well. In case your missing the point...."Greg Jackson"


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## Stratisfear (Oct 16, 2006)

It's much more likely that Penn, Sherk, and Miller are lying. I mean, this is GSP we're talking about here, right?

...


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## Darkgecko (Apr 21, 2008)

WouldLuv2FightU said:


> It's damned if they do and damned if they don't. If they accuse them of greasing during the fight, and end up being wrong, they get bashed for it.


I agree with most of what you said. The real problem here is that fighters should not have to complain about this shit. There is an Athletic Commission for a reason. They have a guy, and this guy's job is to stand there and observe the corner men, the doctors, and the fighter. If anything shady is going on, guess who's to blame. They even get a fancy red jacket.

There were like 60 cameras in the arena that night, I'm sure the NSAC will look at all of the video evidence, and talk to everyone involved. Whether someone greased GSPs back or not, the problem is obviously that noone is checking for this crap.

If it comes out that it was intentional, then I have a hard time believing that GSP didn't know it was happening.


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## joppp (Apr 21, 2007)

southpaw447 said:


> This is ******* ridiculous. Why all of sudden when an accusation like this gets mainstream attention everyone else has to come forward.
> 
> I doubt this highly. I think people are just trying to find an excuse to justify getting their asses kicked.
> 
> Why would Sherk be bitching anyway. His fight with GSP spent most of the time on the feet and when he was taken down it's not like his tiny ass was going to be able to pull off a submission.


IMO it's like this: The vaseline that maybe by mistake was applied on GSP's back by mistake was definately NOT enough to have a grease-effect. What I do believe is that GSP is a guy who get's sweaty quickly from his pace, and sweat is a slippery SOB. These fighters are just seeing connections that's not there!

How can anyone get more slippery than when they're sweaty, anyways? I think the friction is pretty much zero when I grapple with a sweaty guy (only difference is they are usually not topless).


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## shatterproof (Jul 16, 2008)

I think Miller's statements are BS. He should have said somehting back then or kept his mouth shut. He's just looking for a rematch with the champ, imo.

BJ has a legit gripe, we've all seen it. But ultimately a tiny bit of vas on his back did not win the fight for him. 4 dominating rounds did -- with takedowns and striking.


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## Baby Jay D. (Apr 25, 2008)

Davisty69 said:


> This after the fact crap is stupid. If you really had a problem you should have said something at the time.
> 
> Who knows, maybe the guy is just really slippery.


People need to understand that this is a repost of a blog Miller did a long ass time ago. :dunno:


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## WouldLuv2FightU (Jul 17, 2006)

shatterproof said:


> I think Miller's statements are BS. He should have said somehting back then or kept his mouth shut. He's just looking for a rematch with the champ, imo.
> 
> BJ has a legit gripe, we've all seen it. But ultimately a tiny bit of vas on his back did not win the fight for him. 4 dominating rounds did -- with takedowns and striking.


Well if you read the blog it clearly says (and this is pretty much the entire reason he wrote the blog in the first place) is that he DID say something back then but the ref ignored him. After the ref ignored him he probably realized that further pursuing the accusations, especially since he ended up gettin decimated, would make him look like a jackass.

Also, Jason is retired from MMA and knows damn well he is in no position to be fighting for the UFC WW Title right now.



Baby Jay D. said:


> People need to understand that this is a repost of a blog Miller did a long ass time ago. :dunno:


That's cool, didn't know that...woulda been cooler if that was mentioned in the OP.



> This GSP greasing thing does not seem to be going away. Obviously there’s all the videos and gifs and accusations and explanations from the incident at UFC 94. But now we’re starting to hear from GSP’s past opponents that they thought he was greased up for their fights too. Jason Miller (who fought Georges back in 2005) just went on the Underground forums *and reposted a column he wrote for Fight! Magazine,* implying that the column was about St Pierre:


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## ZZtigerZZ81 (Jul 8, 2006)

Where'stheCrow? said:


> First...I'm not saying GSP did or didn't do this.
> 
> I'm sure people have experienced this before where by saying or doing something a stigma is attached to you. You obviously don't want that so you don't say or do it. Then whenever one person says or does that thing, all of a sudden you have the courage to do the same. I know I have had it happen before, as I'm sure most have.


I agree...kind of like a whistle blower of a big company.



Fedor>all said:


> Even then, why would you wait four years to publicize it? Cheating is cheating, whether it's a big fight or not. Look at it this way, there are cameras and eyes on the corner at ALL times, greasing for an advantage would be impossible to hide.
> 
> This made no difference in the outcome of the fight, and it really looked like an absent minded mistake by the cornerman. He should receive a stern warning, but it's ludicrous to question GSP's last fights because of this incident.


But when is a good time to bring this up? BJ did it after the fight and still got tons of flack for it. I think it is a big deal because of who is being accused in this case. After all, how could the most professional and classy fighter in the UFC be responsible for this?




bail3yz said:


> I am really surprised at how biased some of you are being. Miller nor BJ are using this as an excuse.
> 
> You guys are hating on Miller for bringing it up 4 years late.. but if he brought it up right after the fight he would have been hated on for being a sore loser, poor sport, etc. In my opinion it makes more sense for him to bring it up now, then it did before. If he brought it up before, he would have been the only one fighting it.. and he would have lost.. and likely lost a lot of fans. He brings it up now... when something like this happens... hes no longer fighting alone.. and it doesnt hurt his repetition as much. Its like a when a rapist gets caught lol, a bunch of previous victims come forward that never said anything before.


agreed.



Rated said:


> To me, it hurts his rep way more to bring it up now than to bring it up during the time of the fight. I guess someone is going to have to go back and look to see if GSP had someone else rubbing him down throughout his career because he was not with Nurse/Jackson during those fights.


He did bring it up at the time of the fight (both did BJ's complaints were taken seriously and Miller's were dismissed/ignored). But you do bring up an interesting point about having different cornermen. 


I think this is a very similar situation to the New England Patriots "Spygate Scandal". Is it illegal? Yes. Does it give you an advantage? Yes. Is it the only reason you won? No. 

Against BJ though, this would give him a much greater advantage. Because BJ's guard game is based upon neutralizing the opponent. When you can't get a high guard or prevent posturing, you won't be successful at neutralizing your opponent. It is a shame that this happened, but it should not be dismissed just because he is your favorite fighter.


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## Bazza89 (Dec 31, 2006)

shatterproof said:


> I think Miller's statements are BS. He should have said somehting back then or kept his mouth shut. He's just looking for a rematch with the champ, imo.
> 
> BJ has a legit gripe, we've all seen it. But ultimately a tiny bit of vas on his back did not win the fight for him. 4 dominating rounds did -- with takedowns and striking.


I highly doubt Mayhem's after a title shot. He fights at 185 now anyway and has shown no interest in returning to the UFC.

Why is it that people keep going on about how it didn't change the result when nobody, including BJ and his camp is claiming it did. Everyone knows that GSP would have won either way but if GSP was greased up then it doesn't matter because it's still cheating.


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## pipe (Jun 15, 2008)

Hmmmmmmmmmm.


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## Rated (Nov 25, 2006)

My bad, I waas not aware this was a repost column. I read the quote from another post and decided to repost it here.

And I know Miller said he complained about it (stated in my previous post). I just think that he should have tried harder seeing as how serious he took the fight but was not very firm about seeking justice (if GSP did grease).

I just confused how GSP could go through his whole career greasing and not get caught with it. There are a shitload of cameras everywhere. You would think someone, even a casual fan, would see it and point it out. It's just hard to believe that after BJ did it, there were so many others calling him out now.


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## kds13 (Nov 27, 2006)

You know what they all have in common? They get manhandled and embarrassed by GSP and looked like they didn't even deserve to be there. 

If it takes this long to bring it up, it's almost assuredly BS.


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## ZZtigerZZ81 (Jul 8, 2006)

kds13 said:


> You know what they all have in common? They get manhandled and embarrassed by GSP and looked like they didn't even deserve to be there.
> 
> If it takes this long to bring it up, it's almost assuredly BS.


Certainly you aren't serious. Is there a statute of limitations on greasing?

And how long did it take Miller? During the fight he complained about it. Then he made this post on a blog back in 2005 soon after the fight. How long did it take Sherk? The only known incident was on the UFC 56 DVD, not sure when that was filmed though. How long did it take BJ? During the fight and soon after as well.

So, now does that hold water?


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## Darkgecko (Apr 21, 2008)

pipe said:


> Hmmmmmmmmmm.


Hilarious


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## bail3yz (Apr 22, 2007)

Rated said:


> My bad, I waas not aware this was a repost column. I read the quote from another post and decided to repost it here.
> 
> And I know Miller said he complained about it (stated in my previous post). I just think that he should have tried harder seeing as how serious he took the fight but was not very firm about seeking justice (if GSP did grease).
> 
> I just confused how GSP could go through his whole career greasing and not get caught with it. There are a shitload of cameras everywhere.* You would think someone, even a casual fan, would see it and point it out.* It's just hard to believe that after BJ did it, there were so many others calling him out now.


This is how he got caught during the BJ fight (unless that was just a rumor). But from what I heard, it was someone watching the fight that first approached the NSAC about it. BJ/his corner were told after the fight what happened by the NSAC.

Also, I doubt he did it every fight.. theres alot of fights where the risk wouldnt be worth it.


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

How many people are sitting there thinking... "ahhhh shit"

I see the allegations, and I see a case against GSP. There's no turning back now, every victory in his career is slightly tainted whether or not he actually cheated. It's frustrating as shit, on the one hand you are pissed your favorite fighter is accused of cheating. On the other you see the case and you see that it will mark him forever no matter how stupid it seems.


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## kano666 (Nov 2, 2007)

Fedor>all said:


> Even then, why would you wait four years to publicize it? Cheating is cheating, whether it's a big fight or not. Look at it this way, there are cameras and eyes on the corner at ALL times, greasing for an advantage would be impossible to hide.
> 
> This made no difference in the outcome of the fight, and it really looked like an absent minded mistake by the cornerman. He should receive a stern warning, but it's ludicrous to question GSP's last fights because of this incident.


I disagree with this being an "absentminded mistake by the cornerman". I think cornermen at this level know what is proper and what is potentially a little extra edge. Read NSAC Keith Kizer's quote above. He says that after he was alerted to possible greasing by an inspector, he closely watched Greg Jackson rubbing GSP's back with some vaseline (not a lot, but a little). The cornermen know there are cameras and attention on them, obviously they can find ways to do it discreetly. The fact that two separate GSP cornermen made the same "absentminded mistake" in consecutive rounds strongly suggests a well-planned strategy.

I'm not saying the greasing won the fight. BJ got his ass whooped. But lots of people were criticising him for bringing up greasing, and the article with Kizer seems to vindicate him. Looks like his corner raised the greasing issue at the end of Rd 1 and left it to the NSAC to take care of after that. That seems like the best course of action to me.


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## Baby Jay D. (Apr 25, 2008)

bail3yz said:


> This is how he got caught during the BJ fight (unless that was just a rumor). But from what I heard, it was *someone watching the fight that first approached the NSAC about it*. BJ/his corner were told after the fight what happened by the NSAC.
> 
> Also, I doubt he did it every fight.. theres alot of fights where the risk wouldnt be worth it.


Chuck Liddell was the first to bring this to the NSAC guys in between the first and second round. They then waited till after the second round to see if it happened again. When it did, they took action and had GSP wiped down.


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## WouldLuv2FightU (Jul 17, 2006)

Does anyone have any GIFs that show the wipe down? 

The only GIF I have seen clearly shows GSP instantly standing up and walking away from the red-suited guy the second the towel touches his body. The GIF ends with the red-suited guy walking the opposite direction out of the camera view and GSP standing and preparing for the ref to ask him if he's ready for the next round.

Kizer says he was thoroughly wiped down, but the video footage I have seen says otherwise :dunno: someone got some better GIFs to post? Otherwise I'm assuming Kizer is being overly cautious in his statements for fear of incriminating such a beloved and talented fighter by saying he was thoroughly wiped down.


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## CornbreadBB (Jul 31, 2008)

I didn't want to bring this up, but GSP has been greasing against me for years. I always kinda liked it though.


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## XitUp (Jan 11, 2007)

They should strip him of his belt and make BJ champ in all weight classes.


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## D.P. (Oct 8, 2008)

At first I didn't wanna give any thought to it or pay any attention to it, cuz in reality, I thought it wouldn't matter anyway. But this seems to be getting pretty serious.


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## name goes here (Aug 15, 2007)

Stratisfear said:


> It's much more likely that Penn, Sherk, and Miller are lying. I mean, this is GSP we're talking about here, right?
> 
> ...


That doesn't make any sense. Just because a guy seems nice, doesn't make it more or less likely he cheated.


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## CornbreadBB (Jul 31, 2008)

hottrizzy15 said:


> Can this sport get any faker?


I know right?! You can tell all that blood is red syrup! God, when will people learn!? I mean look at Takayama after the Frye fight, he's clearly faking all those bruises.


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## zarny (Mar 4, 2007)

Has anyone actually watched the video footage of Nurse rubbing GSP?

The amount of vaseline that could have even possibly been rubbed on GSP is so miniscule it's ridiculous.


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## bail3yz (Apr 22, 2007)

zarny said:


> Has anyone actually watched the video footage of Nurse rubbing GSP?
> 
> The amount of vaseline that could have even possibly been rubbed on GSP is so miniscule it's ridiculous.


Wow... I am so sick of hearing this.

When you watch the PPV.. do they show GSPs corner the entire time between rounds.. every round? No they dont.. so dont assume thats all the footage. NSAC seen them doing it on two occasions, and they were told about it by Chuck.. who seen it prior to those 2 occasions. And for the record.. in the video footage that is available.. Nurse rubs GSP face.. then his shoulders.. then his face again.. he definitely could have got a good amount on his shoulders. As you can see in this video


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## ZZtigerZZ81 (Jul 8, 2006)

bail3yz said:


> Wow... I am so sick of hearing this.
> 
> When you watch the PPV.. do they show GSPs corner the entire time between rounds.. every round? No they dont.. so dont assume thats all the footage. NSAC seen them doing it on two occasions, and they were told about it by Chuck.. who seen it prior to those 2 occasions. And for the record.. in the video footage that is available.. Nurse rubs GSP face.. then his shoulders.. then his face again.. he definitely could have got a good amount on his shoulders. As you can see in this video


You know Chuck probably brought it up because he lost to Rashad or Jardine(obviously didn't think it would change the outcome), but no one brings up the fact that he might be bitter or a sore loser because if anyone is loved more then GSP; it has to be Chuck, but BJ is bitter and a sore loser because he wants people to abide by the rules. I don't care either way. I was one of the outspoken ones when Franca and Sherk tested positive. I want all rules to be followed at all times. I think that is a little too much to expect, but still doesn;t stop me from wishing it could happen.


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

It's obvious it happened, but most likely inadvertant. There's always two sides of the coin, but when you have such a lop sided defeat; Mayhem, Hughes, Serra, Triggs, Parisyan, Hieron, Koschek, Sherk, Penn, a who's who of MMA etc...etc...etc...it's irrelevant. Let the man bask in his glory. But if I was Phil Nurse I'd prolly make a formal apology for the sake of clearing GSP's name entirely. Hate to see his wins be marred like that. 

Skills and solid game plans won the fight(s).


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## Robopencil (Feb 7, 2007)

bail3yz said:


> Wow... I am so sick of hearing this.
> 
> When you watch the PPV.. do they show GSPs corner the entire time between rounds.. every round? No they dont.. so dont assume thats all the footage. NSAC seen them doing it on two occasions, and they were told about it by Chuck.. who seen it prior to those 2 occasions. And for the record.. in the video footage that is available.. Nurse rubs GSP face.. then his shoulders.. then his face again.. he definitely could have got a good amount on his shoulders. As you can see in this video


The second time the NSAC saw it, it was just a shoulder rub. Nurse wasn't allowed to touch his face that round.


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## name goes here (Aug 15, 2007)

I like the gi (judo jacket)...


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## Robopencil (Feb 7, 2007)

name goes here said:


> I like the gi (judo jacket)...


You mean during his entrance? The refs check fighters bodies and gloves before they fight.


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## M_D (Apr 8, 2007)

ZZtigerZZ81 said:


> You know Chuck probably brought it up because he lost to Rashad or Jardine(obviously didn't think it would change the outcome), but no one brings up the fact that he might be bitter or a sore loser because if anyone is loved more then GSP; it has to be Chuck, but BJ is bitter and a sore loser because he wants people to abide by the rules. I don't care either way. I was one of the outspoken ones when Franca and Sherk tested positive. I want all rules to be followed at all times. I think that is a little too much to expect, but still doesn;t stop me from wishing it could happen.


yeah it could not be because he saw people do something against the rules of a sport that he has belonged to for years and loves and wanted to make sure that they did not break the rules anymore


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## name goes here (Aug 15, 2007)

Robopencil said:


> You mean during his entrance? The refs check fighters bodies and gloves before they fight.


No just randomly musing on what mma would be like with everyone wearing clothes. Not to say it would be better or worse - just musing.


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## vaj3000 (Dec 28, 2008)

roflmao....millers one funny guy. So miller brought it up and the ref called it fine. No probs.


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## WouldLuv2FightU (Jul 17, 2006)

vaj3000 said:


> roflmao....millers one funny guy. So miller brought it up and the ref called it fine. No probs.


Well it's not for sure if it was fine or not, seeings how he didn't even check before he said it was fine.


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## TheNinja (Dec 10, 2008)

I don't know what to think at first I though BJ was being a baby..But the evidence is stacking up against GSP..I'm a big time Georges Fan...I just hope this gets sorted out..I just find it hard to believe..BJ, Jason Miller, Matt Hughes, and those *cameras* were lying but only time will tell


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## Bazza89 (Dec 31, 2006)

And Sherk and maybe even Serra. has anyone got any proof Serra said something about this aswell BTW?

It does look bad for GSP at this point TBH. I just hope it's investigated thoroughly and any guilty parties are punished accordingly.


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## ZZtigerZZ81 (Jul 8, 2006)

M_D said:


> yeah it could not be because he saw people do something against the rules of a sport that he has belonged to for years and loves and wanted to make sure that they did not break the rules anymore


He said that he had seen them do it before...I was assuming that it was in one of his fights. It wasn't a shot at Chuck. It was more a shot at people reaming BJ for doing the right thing.


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## TERMINATOR (Jul 6, 2008)

This s**t is getting old. You got a buch of jeolous fighters that have to find some way in making the best not look as good. If you cant take a defeat like a man maybe you are in the wrong buisness


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## XitUp (Jan 11, 2007)

TERMINATOR said:


> This s**t is getting old. You got a buch of jeolous fighters that have to find some way in making the best not look as good. If you cant take a defeat like a man maybe you are in the wrong buisness


Moron, all of the fighters in question have said that they got beaten by a better fighter. No one is saying GSP sucks cos of this.


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## TERMINATOR (Jul 6, 2008)

XitUp said:


> Moron, all of the fighters in question have said that they got beaten by a better fighter. No one is saying GSP sucks cos of this.


Easy big shooter. Its called opinions, what are you trying to do hurt my feelings.


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## XitUp (Jan 11, 2007)

Yup. It's how I get my kicks


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## HeavyRob (Nov 3, 2008)

you know, I fought GSP a while back. I think I'm gonna come out and say it now... but I think he used excessive amounts of vaseline. if not for this greasiness, I would've beaten him, no doubt.


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## UseOf_A_Weapon (Aug 6, 2007)

I don't see where miller says that this is GSP he's talking about. Also, I love that magazine. I have that issue on my bookshelf someplace.


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## Alkhir (Mar 3, 2008)

I just rewatched the fight and at no point during round 2 is Miller talking to the ref... So I don't know if he mixed up with the round or something but I really didn't see anything...


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## TeamNogpwns (Dec 5, 2008)

I'm not going to question BJ on this issue because the Athletic Commission saw it and wiped him down. but also I'm going to believe GSP and think that it was an accident, after all GSP obviously didnt need to cheat to beat any of those guys including BJ.


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## Hellboy (Mar 15, 2008)

GSP is a cheat. 

His backflip is also pretty ordinary.


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