# Is Sage Northcutt the next Paige VanZant?



## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

WDYT?

Proof of concept~

1. UFC brings in complete unknown Paige VanZant.
2. PVZ becomes a big fan favorite/star.
3. UFC tries to replicate PVZ's success by scouting new talent.
4. UFC signs Sage Northcutt hoping he might blossom into PVZ 2.0. 
5. Northcutt is young, athletic and has blonde hair like PVZ. What more do you need?


:confused02:

















*For those who don't know who he is ^ Sage Northcutt will make his debut at UFC 192 against Francisco Trevino*.

Some are criticizing the UFC for promoting Northcutt possibly more than they promote veterans of the sport like Mousasi. I wouldn't be surprised if this topic comes up at some point, so here's a thread for it.

edit - Sage Northcutt UFC promo


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## King Daisuke (Mar 25, 2013)

Mainstream folks sure love the beautiful people. 

I say you can take your cute face and shove it up your ass.

It's ok, I'm a rather handsome man myself, so I can say it.


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

The problem with the 'Mousasi doesn't get promoted like this' logic is... Mousasi has been around for years and was promoted on entry to the UFC and then didn't really do anything. What are they meant to do, continue to hype up a fighter who can't string a run of wins together against anyone good?

The next generation is always more exciting than the current crop - especially the guys who've been around for a long time. We saw it with McGregor - everyone loved watching someone storm their way to the top. The fighter doesn't have to be good looking, I think Northcutt's athleticism and martial arts experience is enough to hype him up. He looks pretty exciting in the cage so why not? Hyping up Mousasi instead would be a big fat waste of time and money.


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

Trix said:


> Some are criticizing the UFC for promoting Northcutt possibly more than they promote veterans of the sport like Mousasi.


Not me. Never heard of this dude before you introduced him. Thanks for that, btw. Guy got my interest instantly, not for his looks, of course, his mom and his sister (if that was his sister in the picture) did, though. :thumbsup:


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

If this guy is good, the UFC have struck gold. My missus just walked past as I was reading the thread. She wanted to eat him up.


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## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

he's 19


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

I've never heard of the guy, but he's got some big ass quads.


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## Spite (Jul 7, 2009)

This guy will be Champion.

And then he'll probably be in the Expendables 5. Where he'll bang Ronda Rousey from pillar to post in some sex scene.

Then he'll bang her for real. Then he'll dump her for being to old and not famous enough.

Those are my predictions for this kid.


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## Adam365 (Jul 10, 2008)

"Is Sage Northcutt the next Paige VanZant?" i hope so he's dreamy


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## UKMMAGURU (Nov 15, 2009)

> Jason Floyd ‏@Jason_Floyd 5h5 hours ago
> Sage Northcutt is 5-0 and here are his opponents records per Sherdog: 0-2, 3-7, 2-2, 4-2, and 21-33-1


Just Saying.


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

:innocent01:


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## Joabbuac (Jan 31, 2009)

Sportsman 2.0 said:


> :innocent01:


Read up on the guy... he it insane, has never had a soda in his entire life, been doing 100 push ups a day since he was 5 years old... or something.


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

Joabbuac said:


> Read up on the guy... he it insane, has never had a soda in his entire life, been doing 100 push ups a day since he was 5 years old... or something.


I totally believe the guy. I am just stirring a little bit to point that people will believe the stories they want depending on the fact they like someone or not. People with average bodies who never got popped are having threads opened questioning their integrities, this kid is a freaking monster, but so far, not a word...


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## Joabbuac (Jan 31, 2009)

Sportsman 2.0 said:


> I totally believe the guy. I am just stirring a little bit to point that people will believe the stories they want depending on the fact they like someone or not. People with average bodies who never got popped are having threads opened questioning their integrities, this kid is a freaking monster, but so far, not a word...


Have you seen the testing numbers since the new measures? 

Tested 5 times: Ronda Rousey

Tested 4 times: Thiago Alves, Bethe Correia, Antonio Silva

Tested 3 times: Anthony Johnson, Jimi Manuwa

Tested 2 times: Jose Aldo, Andrei Arlovski, Daniel Cormier, Todd Duffee, Cezar Ferreira, Claudia Gadelha, Alexander Gustafsson, Hayder Hassan, Michael Johnson, Cristiane Justino, Conor McGregor, Frank Mir, Dustin Poirier, Kamaru Usman

Tested 1 time: Corey Anderson, Ryan Bader, Josh Barnett, Vitor Belfort, Jan Blachowicz, Tom Breese, Chico Camus, Alex Chambers, John Dodson, Rashad Evans, Paul Felder, Uriah Hall, Dan Henderson, Johny Hendricks, Max Holloway, Kyoji Horiguchi, Demetrious Johnson, Chad Laprise, Neil Magny, Takeya Mizugaki, Gegard Mousasi, Roy Nelson, Ross Pearson, George Roop, Erick Silva, Tony Sims, Tecia Torres, Francisco Trinaldo, Paige VanZant, Tyron Woodley

Certainly some people there who have had accusations thrown at them being proven clean (at least for now) Though i am surprised not to see Yoel Romero on there. 

I bet Northcutt has a few random tests coming himself.


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

Again, I am not trying to pass to the other side of my usual criticism. Everybody should be considered clean until proved otherwise, this kid is no different in my eyes. That was only about ...stirring.


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## Joabbuac (Jan 31, 2009)

Just giving you some extra ammo... a lot of Brazilians on that list.


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## PheelGoodInc (Jul 23, 2009)

Is it just me, or does he look like the bad guy from Karate Kid 3?


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## ReptilianSlayer (Sep 2, 2013)

Joabbuac said:


> Have you seen the testing numbers since the new measures?
> 
> Tested 5 times: Ronda Rousey
> 
> ...


No dos Anjos, intredasting.


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## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

Hes the next sergio pettis but in a much better division.

Look out!


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## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

Sportsman 2.0 said:


> :innocent01:


I'll say this much. Notice how Sage's left eyebrow raises / twitches a little as he speaks?






Eye twitching is one known side effect of steroid use.

:innocent01:

Lots of known steroid users have noted it from time to time. 

I'll try to find some examples so people don't think I'm saying random nonsense here.

*Anyone Else Get An Eye Twitch / MESO RX forums*
https://thinksteroids.com/community/threads/anyone-else-get-an-eye-twitch.8673/

*Is my cycle making my eyelid twitch? / steroid.com forum*
http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-.../365323-my-cycle-making-my-eyelid-twitch.html

*eye twitch / steroidology forum*
http://www.steroidology.com/forum/anabolic-steroid-forum/631888-eye-twitch.html


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

The pics of him from when he was a little kid show he's always had a freak physique, but he definitely looks like a roid head.


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## UFC_OWNS (Jul 7, 2010)

gazh said:


> Just Saying.


And /thread.


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## Joabbuac (Jan 31, 2009)

Sage Man Zant?


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## systemdnb (Dec 7, 2008)

The highlights they showed on that Dana White: Looking for a Fight show were pretty impressive. Even if his opponents haven't really had a ton of wins he showed great Karate, takes downs, top control and freak athleticism. I think he def has a chance at anyone not in the top 10 for sure. Good prospect.


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## oldfan (Mar 14, 2010)

The new UFC


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

And the kid just made quite a debut. And those flawless post fight flips, back and forward, just tell how sick his balance is.


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)




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## King Daisuke (Mar 25, 2013)

oldfan said:


> The new UFC


*taps out*


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

oldfan said:


> The new UFC


Hitler Youth UFC IMO, lol


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## Andrus (Oct 18, 2011)

What is crazy is that he's just 19 years old. I'd say he's the future of UFC and will be top7 in LW. He looked real good. And this was his debut fight....


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## Joabbuac (Jan 31, 2009)

Sportsman 2.0 said:


> And the kid just made quite a debut. And those flawless post fight flips, back and forward, just tell how sick his balance is.


That one after the interview seemed to defy the laws of gravity...


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

He looked good, real good. 

I was skeptical before the fight tbh, I read about him on some sherdog threads (yeah I accidentally went there to check some fight records







) and basically he looked like some overrated metrosexual justin beiber type maybe taking roids and beating up complete tomato cans, getting attention for his looks and the fact that he was playing grown up model as a kid. 

But man he was quick, aggressive and very well balanced. He used his Karate well, a bit like Machida with the side kicks and something like Conor with the hook kicks. Very good instincts with the smooth switch to double leg when the guy was covering up. And the post fight celebration looked like something out of the Matrix. 

Very interesting new addition, bright future, look forward to his next fights.


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

Liddellianenko said:


> I read about him on some sherdog threads (yeah I accidentally went there to check some fight records
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Sherdog is not a bad site, its *forum* is what is


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## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

Sage Man Vant's fight reminded me of Vitor vs Wanderlei.

How old was Vitor when he fought Wanderlei? I think he might've been around 19 also.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

I think Vitor was 19 yeah.

Good comparisson actually. You usually get those blitz's two ways. You can be like Chuck Vs Tito and do them a bit slower, picking your shot and hitting hard, or you can throw loads but because of the frequency almost all of them have no power. Like that early Vitor one, Sage was throwing bombs. The little elbow he switched in there was beautiful too. Very hard to switch between the punches and elbows like that. Quite a traditional practise. Bit of Wing Chun style or Pencat Silat.


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

19 yrs old Vitor blitz punches had no power?


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## MK. (Dec 16, 2012)

He cold be the next GSP, seems really focused and dedicated about becoming one of the greats.

Has the freak body to back it up as well, hopefully he keeps improving. I heard during the post fight presser that his dad is his coach and he doesn't train with any team.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

MK. said:


> He cold be the next GSP, seems really focused and dedicated about becoming one of the greats.
> 
> Has the freak body to back it up as well, hopefully he keeps improving. I heard during the post fight presser that his dad is his coach and he doesn't train with any team.


Yeah this struck me as well, how he said he's known he'd be in the UFC since age 9. He's obviously been training hard since then, hardcore karate, wrestling, and jitz, and a peak physical and diet regime since that early age.

It's weird seeing the generation come up now that actually had the UFC as a mainstream thing to idolise when growing up ... we had the fake WWE bullshit and just used to try out useless clotheslines and drop kicks :laugh:.

At first I thought his dad had been one of those types that push their kid too hard, take away their childhood and live vicariously through them ... but the guy just seems dedicated to helping his son achieve his dreams.

I like his attitude as well. Very humble and grounded in spite of everything he has genetically and has worked for. Champ / greats material if he keeps it real and doesn't let it go to his head.


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## arkanoydz (Mar 15, 2010)

Didn't know what to expect from this kid and was pleasantly surprised. It's gonna be interesting to see him in some wars, broken nose, cut up, bloody, etc :thumb02:
Would love to see how he fares against Wonder Boy Thompson [I know he's a 155er for now but at 6'0'' I see him able to move up to WW with no problem, especially in a few yrs from now].


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

arkanoydz said:


> Didn't know what to expect from this kid and was pleasantly surprised. It's gonna be interesting to see him in some wars, broken nose, cut up, bloody, etc :thumb02:
> Would love to see how he fares against Wonder Boy Thompson [I know he's a 155er for now but at 6'0'' I see him able to move up to WW with no problem, especially in a few yrs from now].


That'd be a great fight, war of the young, long pedigreed prospects. 

With the kind of BMI this kid has maintained though, there's no real reason for him to ever move up to WW even at 6'0".


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## arkanoydz (Mar 15, 2010)

Liddellianenko said:


> That'd be a great fight, war of the young, long pedigreed prospects.
> 
> With the kind of BMI this kid has maintained though, there's no real reason for him to ever move up to WW even at 6'0".


While I do see him moving up to WW & bulking up a bit more without issues, I do see your point - 
he could just as easily stay at 155 and keep making weight without difficulty, even as the years advance. Don't know much about him but the little I've seen/read online leads me to think he's all about discipline


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## Leed (Jan 3, 2010)

I can't wait till a guy like Dwight Howard or Deandre Jordan follows a lifestyle like this. Imagine a guy 6ft11 265 pounds of pure athletic beast that has trained MMA since he was 5? Holy shit!


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## amoosenamedhank (Sep 2, 2009)

Joabbuac said:


> That one after the interview seemed to defy the laws of gravity...


I seriously just watched that flip 3 times... I'm still not exactly what the hell I just watched. :jaw:


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

amoosenamedhank said:


> I'm still not exactly what the hell I just watched. :jaw:


The laws of physics getting bitch slapped.


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## hellholming (Jun 13, 2009)

gifs?


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## amoosenamedhank (Sep 2, 2009)




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## Joabbuac (Jan 31, 2009)

Being Neo>>>>PEDS


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## Term (Jul 28, 2009)

Didn't even muss his hair. :sarcastic06:


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## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

Sportsman 2.0 said:


> And the kid just made quite a debut. And those flawless post fight flips, back and forward, just tell how sick his balance is.


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## SM33 (Sep 22, 2009)

I am uneducated about this Sage guy but simultaneously, does he really deserve this publicity? He's 19 years old, he's 6-0, he just won his UFC debut because his opponent slipped(from what I remember)...Why the hype??

Machida was trained lifelong, his record is no better than others'. Jon Jones got the fame as a youngster in the sport and became victim of it, gave in to drugs etc. Conor seems to be handling it but I think he gets a lot of help and I think his astronomically cocky nature helps. I see this Sage hype as unwarranted and possibly negative for his career.

But again, If I'm wrong about him, someone please educate me. I see it as a squeaky clean, 19 year old fighter raised and trained by dad, thrown into a world of media, expectations and all the evils and temptations that associate, all because fans keep typing his name on forums.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

Trix said:


>


Any kid could do that on a trampoline, it's getting that kind of air on solid ground that's a problem. Especially without any forward running momentum, just standing casually and front flipping 360 ... ridiculous.



SM33 said:


> I am uneducated about this Sage guy but simultaneously, does he really deserve this publicity? He's 19 years old, he's 6-0, he just won his UFC debut because his opponent slipped(from what I remember)...Why the hype??
> 
> Machida was trained lifelong, his record is no better than others'. Jon Jones got the fame as a youngster in the sport and became victim of it, gave in to drugs etc. Conor seems to be handling it but I think he gets a lot of help and I think his astronomically cocky nature helps. I see this Sage hype as unwarranted and possibly negative for his career.
> 
> But again, If I'm wrong about him, someone please educate me. I see it as a squeaky clean, 19 year old fighter raised and trained by dad, thrown into a world of media, expectations and all the evils and temptations that associate, all because fans keep typing his name on forums.


He didn't slip, Sage caught his kick and then swarmed him. The swarming was amazing, quick punches and short elbows and a perfectly timed switch to a smooth double leg for the finish. 

If it was so easy to finish every time a guy slipped who wasn't even hurt, we'd see twice as many finishes in the UFC.

I agree it's too early to put such high expectations on him, people need to wait and watch a bit. But at the same time, some guys just show mad potential and the right attitude early ... I knew Machida was going to be champ from his first UFC fight. same with Jones and fairly early with Weidman. Sage has the same signs, but yes it's early, let's see how he does against some real competition.


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

This kid has some serious fast twitch muscles. Hours upon hours of conditioning and resistance training. 

If he has chin, heart, and mental soundness then he's the new MMA prototype 3.0. The first being Frank Shamrock, followed by GSP, and now Sage. 

The Bronx was fast, deadly, but was frail. 

Barboza is flashy, but not the most durable.

Rory is a contender, but has a breaking point.

Only Cain + JDS was able to win the championship belt oh and the ex-lhw champ from that generation. 

I've always stated that we'll have test tube athletes coming soon. 

Hope he doesn't burn out the way Todd Marinovich did.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

No_Mercy said:


> This kid has some serious fast twitch muscles. Hours upon hours of conditioning and resistance training.
> 
> If he has chin, heart, and mental soundness then he's the new MMA prototype 3.0. The first being Frank Shamrock, followed by GSP, and now Sage.
> 
> ...


This, and here's Florian's take on how crazy some of his accomplishments are, given his age:

http://www.mmafighting.com/2015/10/...rges-st-pierre-rousey-conor-mcgregor-mma-news


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## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

Liddellianenko said:


> Any kid could do that on a trampoline, it's getting that kind of air on solid ground that's a problem. Especially without any forward running momentum, just standing casually and front flipping 360 ... ridiculous.


In my eyes...

If that's the best Sage can do.

It shows he's been slacking off hardcore.

If he were active he should look more like this.






Its a lot easier to do flips than it used to be given how much easier it is to get access to a trampoline to learn and practice.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

Trix said:


> In my eyes...
> 
> If that's the best Sage can do.
> 
> ...


You do realize that Sage also trains a little MMA along with all the acrobatics, right? He can do 1000 things the guys in that video cant.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

Soojooko said:


> You do realize that Sage also trains a little MMA along with all the acrobatics, right? He can do 1000 things the guys in that video cant.


This. When these guys can also walk on to a relevant collegiate wrestling team with 2 years of experience, then I'll be impressed. Also, he's NINETEEN.


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## oldfan (Mar 14, 2010)

The kid is impressive, no doubt about that. But when i see all the instant attention he's getting.... I hear one of the voices in my head whispering remember Todd duffy?


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

oldfan said:


> The kid is impressive, no doubt about that. But when i see all the instant attention he's getting.... I hear one of the voices in my head whispering remember Todd duffy?


Duffee was a big athletic dude who had next to zero background in martial arts or combat sports. In addition to hardcore athletic training his whole life, Northcutt has been training Karate since he was 6, made State high school wrestling and a collegiate wrestling team with very little experience. Completely different comparisons. 

A more valid comparison would be Lesnar, a super athlete who also had a strong combat sports background in wrestling ... who blew into the UFC and became HW champ, or Jones, another athlete from a super athlete family who had an early background in wrestling and is a contender for GOAT.

Besides, a major part of Northcutt's potential is his mental game. He seems like he totally has his head on straight, and he's aimed for this for most of his young life. Someone with that much focus and discipline almost always goes far. Duffee was just some dude who got into MMA because he got injured during football.


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

The potential is there and it's undeniable.

Martial arts background

Physical gifts

mentally strong

well rounded


Nothing indicates he'll be anything but a contender or a champ. Not a single thing, Duffee was slow with poor technique. He was huge and that's pretty much it.


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## Joabbuac (Jan 31, 2009)

I think people should take move of a "wait and see" approach to these prospects.


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## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

Soojooko said:


> You do realize that Sage also trains a little MMA along with all the acrobatics, right? He can do 1000 things the guys in that video cant.


His background is... karate.

This means... he used to be good at acrobatics.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

Trix said:


> His background is... karate.
> 
> This means... he used to be good at acrobatics.


Karate has like 2 flying kicks total, and one of them is the crane kick Machida used, that an un-acrobatic rock like me can do. It's the least acrobatic traditional striking martial of all time. You might be confusing it with Tae-Kwon-Do or Kung-Fu. 

Incidentally he does happen to have a black belt in TKD as well, so that's where some of the acrobatics come from.

Don't know what you're trying to prove with it though. That the guy is extremely multi-talented as we're saying, with a BB in Karate and TKD, mad acrobatics, a BJJ purple belt, a reasonable collegiate and high school wrestling background, a 6 ft tall 5% body fat frame, and a 6-0 pro MMA record at age 19? 

When one of those trampoline jumpers in your videos achieve even half of that, my eyebrows will be sufficiently raised. Please feel free to post any of their backgrounds to compare.



Joabbuac said:


> I think people should take move of a "wait and see" approach to these prospects.


Where's the fun in being a bandwagon fan? Half the fun of these forums are predictions, what's the point if you hold back opinions until the guy is 3 seconds from winning a belt before you say "This guy's gonna be champ, I call it!". 

It's not even that crazy, many recent champs like Jones, Weidman, Cain, Machida etc. had guys predicting they'd win the belts from their first or second UFC fights alone. Everyone saw Jones' potential the way he was dumping vets like Bonnar with greco slams no one had seen before, or Cain steamrolling every guy without even breathing heavy. And yes, McGregor as well, though we'll see if he ever gets a real belt.

And even the ones that don't become champs usually reach contender level at least, like Phil Davis, Stephen Thompson etc. It's not that hard to extrapolate based on existing accomplishments and performances.



oldfan said:


> The kid is impressive, no doubt about that. But when i see all the instant attention he's getting.... I hear one of the voices in my head whispering remember Todd duffy?


Also just watched this ... it's his first ever AMATEUR fight at age 17, and an early stoppage in a fight he was dominating at that. Followed by 11 straight finish wins. I'll take note of that and write off Aldo, JDS and Anderson as well then.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

I really don't see the problem with getting excited over promise. It doesnt matter what they turn out like. Still get plenty of enjoyment speculating and discussing. If he turns out shit, what exactly have I lost by getting excited?

Be mighty boring if we waited for a fighter to have 6 fights in the UFC before discussing him/her.


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## oldfan (Mar 14, 2010)

the kid has a sister that wants to fight ronda. ...tuff family


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## ReptilianSlayer (Sep 2, 2013)

I'm not on the bandwagon yet. Saying that, I've only seen one of his fights (his UFC debut) and haven't research much into him. I'll make judgment after I watch his second fight in the UFC.

Right now, I definitely get a Rory MacDonald vibe with the early hype he's getting, especially with Florian claiming he's going to be "GSP X 10".

Rory is an elite fighter, but I don't think he'll ever hold gold or be a dominant champ. For me when I assess a fighter, the fighter has to have one area where they are ELITE in and no one else can touch them, and every where else they are incredibly well rounded.

Like Rory, I get the impression this guy's incredibly well rounded in every facet of the game, but doesn't have that one area where he's almost untouchable in.

Anderson Silva had the striking
GSP wrestling
Cain wrestling
Jones wrestling
Aldo striking
Werdum BJJ

You need to be a wizard in one particular area and a master at everything else to be one of the goat's in this game.

Anyone got links to a bunch of his other fights?


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

ReptilianSlayer said:


> I'm not on the bandwagon yet. Saying that, I've only seen one of his fights (his UFC debut) and haven't research much into him. I'll make judgment after I watch his second fight in the UFC.
> 
> Right now, I definitely get a Rory MacDonald vibe with the early hype he's getting, especially with Florian claiming he's going to be "GSP X 10".
> 
> ...


Sorry, but most of your examples are not valid.

GSP had zero wrestling base when he started in the UFC, he was a Kyokushin Karate striker (similar to Sage) with basic self-taught wrestling (where Sage has actual background) and a basic BJJ blue belt (where Sage has a purple). Yet everyone saw the signs with him destroying guys like Karo in his debut and his incredible athleticism.

At the start of his WEC career, Aldo was just a BJJ and soccer convert to Muay Thai, with as much striking background as half the guys on this board.

Jones had a decent wrestling background but certainly not something no one could touch him in. He was a Junior college and New York state champ in high school, but both are essentially lower tier competitions compared to NCAA Div I champs like Davis or Olympic and world championship contenders like Cormier etc. 

Of your examples, only Werdum and Cain are close to your point ... and Cain wasn't an NCAA champ either ... a standout All American, sure, but Lesnar had twice the credentials with his multiple championships and was overall the better wrestler in their fight. Lesnar took Cain down early while Cain only managed to wrestle defensively. What won Cain the fight over the bigger, better wrestler in Lesnar was his aggression and WELL ROUNDEDNESS.

Werdum's BJJ is the only one that was truly untouchable in his division, but he still got tooled by every elite fighter he faced until recently, when he became WELL ROUNDED, the very thing you say is not a factor.

What did Conor have that no one could "touch him" in? Plumbing? He is a recently-taught striker with nothing driving him except discipline, good instincts, great training and nutrition methodology and most importantly strong self-belief. His "untouchable" skillset has already gotten him tapped out handily twice and pounded like a pancake for 2 rounds another time, but of course his potential was never in doubt.

Yet another guy comes along with the same sort of early focus, self-belief and elite training and nutrition and the Conor bandwagon gets all salty. I've noticed it on all the boards, he's stealing the attention and thunder. 

Because this guy is everything Conor is, with the same sort of excitement around his debut ... same sort of dominant, fast twitch karate kicks and boxing striking, born athleticism, peak physique, same self-belief, same young age when he started. The difference is Sage is also a decent, well rounded and humble human being on top of that instead of a greedy, self-absorbed douchebag, and so it's far more likely he'll go farther, more than a fake belt, and they don't like that one bit.

He is nothing like Rory. Rory was a quiet, psychotic looking teen nutjob with a chip on his shoulder and no area where he shined. Sage is a good, well-raised kid who's been training and visualising every single aspect needed to be a UFC champ since the age of 9. 

I was never on board the "Rory will be champ one day" talk either, any more than I was with Duffee, Diego Sanchez, Bisping, Gustaf, Thiago Silva etc. ... these guys never had "it". I was with GSP, Jones, Weidman, Lesnar, JDS, Machida, Nurmogomedov, and now Sage, long before they rose to top 10. The only ones I was wrong about were Davis and Glover, and even they hit top 5 at least.


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## ReptilianSlayer (Sep 2, 2013)

Liddellianenko said:


> Sorry, but most of your examples are not valid.
> 
> GSP had zero wrestling base when he started in the UFC, he was a Kyokushin Karate striker (similar to Sage) with basic self-taught wrestling (where Sage has actual background) and a basic BJJ blue belt (where Sage has a purple). Yet everyone saw the signs with him destroying guys like Karo in his debut and his incredible athleticism.
> 
> ...


Jesus Christ you have completely misinterpreted my entire post.

I'm not talking about backgrounds or accomplishments outside of MMA, I'm talking about skills inside the Octagon.

So, INSIDE the octagon.

GSP had the best wrestling
Jones had the best wrestling
Cain had the best wrestling
Aldo had the best striking
Werdum BJJ
Anderson striking

I don't care for backgrounds, because like you said, GSP didn't have any background in wrestling at all, but he managed to become arguably the best and most feared wrestler in MMA.

It was clear to see Jones had monster MMA wrestling in his fight with Stephan Bonnar. Cain, early on his career was a wrestling powerhouse too. Aldo, always had sick striking in MMA. McGregor the same, Anderson the same.

Again, I'm not talking about backgrounds outside of MMA, I'm talking about skills inside of the sport.

If you want to become one of the goats in this sport you need to specialize in one area and be incredibly well rounded at every thing else. The proof is in the pudding - as is the case with all the fighters I listed.

So, when I see Sage amaze me in one particular area of the game, I'll make my judgment, but right now it's too early to tell.

Also, you really need to rewatch the Cain/Brock fight because it was Cain who was the better MMA wrestler in that fight - and also, go and take a look at the Cain/Brock predictions thread on this forum while you're at it.

Cain popped immediately back up from Brocks take downs and then proceeded to dump Brock onto the mat with a single leg take down and start hammering Brocks face in. THAT was the changing point in the fight - you know, when Cain took Brock down and actually did some thing with it, Cain WORKED Brock in the wrestling department, schooled him at his own game.


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## oldfan (Mar 14, 2010)

Liddellianenko said:


> Duffee was a big athletic dude who had next to zero background in martial arts or combat sports. In addition to hardcore athletic training his whole life, Northcutt has been training Karate since he was 6, made State high school wrestling and a collegiate wrestling team with very little experience. Completely different comparisons.
> 
> A more valid comparison would be Lesnar, a super athlete who also had a strong combat sports background in wrestling ... who blew into the UFC and became HW champ, or Jones, another athlete from a super athlete family who had an early background in wrestling and is a contender for GOAT.
> 
> Besides, a major part of Northcutt's potential is his mental game. He seems like he totally has his head on straight, and he's aimed for this for most of his young life. Someone with that much focus and discipline almost always goes far. Duffee was just some dude who got into MMA because he got injured during football.





Liddellianenko said:


> Karate has like 2 flying kicks total, and one of them is the crane kick Machida used, that an un-acrobatic rock like me can do. It's the least acrobatic traditional striking martial of all time. You might be confusing it with Tae-Kwon-Do or Kung-Fu.
> 
> Incidentally he does happen to have a black belt in TKD as well, so that's where some of the acrobatics come from.
> 
> ...





Liddellianenko said:


> Sorry, but most of your examples are not valid.
> 
> GSP had zero wrestling base when he started in the UFC, he was a Kyokushin Karate striker (similar to Sage) with basic self-taught wrestling (where Sage has actual background) and a basic BJJ blue belt (where Sage has a purple). Yet everyone saw the signs with him destroying guys like Karo in his debut and his incredible athleticism.
> 
> ...


:laugh:
That's quite the case of keyboard diarrhea you have. That's a shame because I would imagine that when you aren't turkey squirting all over your keyboard you probably have passably adequate reading comprehension. That's all it would take to realize that I never said there are any similarities between Sage and Todd. At all. My post did imply that there is a similarity in the way verbose internet idiots are gushing all over sage like he's some superhero savior because he had an impressive debut against a nobody and he's pretty. But never mind me old friend you just go on sqwertin. Never give up hope that somewhere out there is somebody who is as impressed with your posts as you are.


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

It looks like he has done the best with his potential so far. Very disciplined, superb work ethic, set goal for years, trained in multiple aspects of the game. So he definitely looks promising. Hopefully the early start with hard competition doesn't backfire on him, as full contact fighting does accumulate damage on your body and most people I know that started early got joint (mostly knee) problems already in their early twenties.

When the thread came up I also had to think of MacDonald (who, even though not a champ is at least a sure Top5 and even #1 contender at the moment which is more than most people on Earth can claim), but Northcutt is different in that MacDonald started training MMA right away, while Northcutt first trained different disciplines and shone there individually. This could give him an edge later, as he doesn't just understand the different aspects from an MMA point of view which he trains now but also from the point of view of those individual different disciplines.

Actually, he rather comparable to Stephen Thompson who was a Karate/Kickboxing stand-out and is a Machado protegé. I have the impression though that even though being on a 5 fight win streak, Thompson doesn't get much attention and still is somewhat of a fringe prelim fighter.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

oldfan said:


> :laugh:
> That's quite the case of keyboard diarrhea you have. That's a shame because I would imagine that when you aren't turkey squirting all over your keyboard you probably have passably adequate reading comprehension. That's all it would take to realize that I never said there are any similarities between Sage and Todd. At all. My post did imply that there is a similarity in the way verbose internet idiots are gushing all over sage like he's some superhero savior because he had an impressive debut against a nobody and he's pretty. But never mind me old friend you just go on sqwertin. Never give up hope that somewhere out there is somebody who is as impressed with your posts as you are.


Oh I'm sure a few people like my posts, apparently I got voted best forum debater on here last year but they never decided to give out the badge, maybe because I rubbed some mods the wrong way :laugh:.

http://www.mmaforum.com/end-year-awards/192313-mmaf-end-year-awards-best-debater.html 

I don't expect geriatric fools who think they have some sort of "internetz humor" them kids nowadays like, to catch on to valid points though. Too bad you got lost on the way to sherdog and ended up here, you'd fit right in there.



ReptilianSlayer said:


> Jesus Christ you have completely misinterpreted my entire post.
> 
> I'm not talking about backgrounds or accomplishments outside of MMA, I'm talking about skills inside the Octagon.
> 
> ...


I got you, what I'm saying is most of those guys developed those "in octagon" skills you mentioned during the course of their UFC career. The ones predicting their greatness at the beginning of their careers didn't have those skills to go by, just their general athleticism, past achievements and mindset. 

No one was saying GSP is the greatest MMA wrestler of all time based on him taking down Karo a few times, or Jones flipping Bonnar a couple of times, or Weidman beating Bongfeldt. Hindsight is 20/20. Just like no one is remarking about Sage's standup dominance based on him destroying a journeyman. But the signs are there. 

I mean I don't get how can categorise him as "not" having any elite standup dominance based on him destroying a guy on the feet in 10 secs, and just being some sort of generalist doomed to gatekeeperdom. Because he proceeded to also tool the guy on the ground?

Not to mention all of the guys you mentioned are successful only because of their well roundedness ... GSP's takedowns work 99% of the time because he tooled people on the feet and had them worried about the hands, when he suddenly ducked under for a shot. There is no way he would beat Koscheck or Hughes in a pure wrestling match, it was his well rounded stand up that set up the takedowns.


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## ReptilianSlayer (Sep 2, 2013)

Liddellianenko said:


> Oh I'm sure a few people like my posts, apparently I got voted best forum debater on here last year but they never decided to give out the badge, maybe because I rubbed some mods the wrong way :laugh:.
> 
> http://www.mmaforum.com/end-year-awards/192313-mmaf-end-year-awards-best-debater.html
> 
> ...


I don't think I have ever proclaimed someone to be the next goat or the next top champ after watching their first ever fight in the UFC, s'all I'm saying.

Jones' debut against André Gusmão impressed me, I saw some thing, but I had to wait until his next fight or two to clearly gauge his talent. Then came the Bonnar fight, and it was clear the kid was something special.

There was McGregor vs. Brimmage, which was also very impressive, but it wasn't enough to declare him as a future champ. More time was needed, more performance.

Remember, Sage Northcutt has ONE fight in the UFC, just one - and it ended VERY quickly. I was impressed, I saw a kid with some serious killer instinct, power and discipline, but that short segment isn't enough for me to start hyping him as as "GSP X10," as Florian put it.

More time is required, more performance.


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## Joabbuac (Jan 31, 2009)

Liddellianenko said:


> Where's the fun in being a bandwagon fan? Half the fun of these forums are predictions, what's the point if you hold back opinions until the guy is 3 seconds from winning a belt before you say "This guy's gonna be champ, I call it!".


I can be a fan without claiming they are set for greatness... and i won't say they are set for greatness without truly believing it. Northcutt will be interesting to watch, but he has proved nothing against anything even approaching a good fighter yet.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

ReptilianSlayer said:


> I don't think I have ever proclaimed someone to be the next goat or the next top champ after watching their first ever fight in the UFC, s'all I'm saying.
> 
> Jones' debut against André Gusmão impressed me, I saw some thing, but I had to wait until his next fight or two to clearly gauge his talent. Then came the Bonnar fight, and it was clear the kid was something special.
> 
> ...





Joabbuac said:


> I can be a fan without claiming they are set for greatness... and i won't say they are set for greatness without truly believing it. Northcutt will be interesting to watch, but he has proved nothing against anything even approaching a good fighter yet.


Yeah that's exactly what I said in my first post in the thread. He needs a few more performances to be definitely categorised as a potential great or champ, and GSP x 10 is obviously hyperbole as no guy can ever come close to 10 times that in a lifetime. Most people would be hard pressed to exceed him let alone multiple times that. 

He shows real potential is all I said, and can't be pigeon-holed into the "overhyped prospect" mold right now though.


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## EVERLOST (May 28, 2007)

Im just not a" buy into the hype " kinda guy. I just want to watch people fight and I get real tired of all this crap being rammed down my throat all the time. Just fight and shut up. That includes you UFC.


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## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

Stephen Thompson was on a similar boat before/after his debut as well.


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## Spite (Jul 7, 2009)

Northcutt is the most interesting new fighter I've seen in a long, long time.

I think his sucess depends on how well he handles fame. He's going to have a lot of distractions, especially woman.

If all goes well, he will be the David Beckham of MMA.


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## Joabbuac (Jan 31, 2009)

Spite said:


> If all goes well, he will be the David Beckham of MMA.


Waste of talent?


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## Spite (Jul 7, 2009)

Joabbuac said:


> Waste of talent?


But well paid


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