# Best pure athlete in the UFC/MMA.



## Dream-On-101 (Jun 4, 2009)

I vaguely remember seeing a thread similar to this one quite a while ago, but its always fun to revisit certain topics. 

I've been wondering about this quite alot recently, so thought i'd guage some opinions here. Who, in your opinion, is the best pure athlete you have ever seen in MMA? I'm trying to avoid an argument on what constitutes an athlete - just think incredible combinations of strength, speed, agility, explosive movement, endurance etc.

In the UFC at present, its hard to look past GSP. The lad is a sensational athlete. As we move up through the weight classes, both Brock and Overeem (ironically since they are going to fight) have both proven to be very impressive athletes considering their incredible mass. 

Outside of the UFC, and though he has a lot of holes in his game and is clearly not an elite level fighter anymore, Kevin Randleman always impressed me from an athletic standpoint. 


Opinions please :thumbsup:


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## leifdawg (Jan 1, 2008)

Brock, John Jones, Melvin Guillard. It's a tossup between those 3 IMO.


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## edlavis88 (Jul 12, 2009)

you can't not mention GSP here. He is no1 IMO.

Brock Lesnar, Jon Jones and anyone who has experience of playing other sports at a high level are usually high level athletes.


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## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

leifdawg said:


> Brock, John Jones, Melvin Guillard. It's a tossup between those 3 IMO.


Let's not forget GSP here, the man does gymnastics which is the most challenging thing for your body IMO.


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## drmz (Jun 24, 2009)

GSP, Jon Jones, Brock Lesnar, Palhares, Edgar


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## Dream-On-101 (Jun 4, 2009)

Good stuff. Melvin is an incredibly capable athlete, he is so quick it is very impressive to watch.


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

Jon Jones, Guillard, BJ, Anderson, Cain.

Honestly, I haven't been THAT impressed with GSP's gymnastic workouts, I expect better from such a pure athlete. GSP seems to really struggle with the rings in those gymnastics videos, there is a video of BJ from years ago working the gymnast rings, he seems to be much more natural with them.


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## Dr Gonzo (May 27, 2010)

Lesnar, Jones, GSP, BJ.


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

How can I be the only one that's mentioned Anderson?!! He's an athletic freak.

Aldo is up there too.


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

It depends on how you define "athlete".

St. Pierre seems to be on top as an allround athlete.
Probably few fighters could compete with Nick Diaz in a triathlon
Pudzianowski is without doubt the strongest athlete
And there are probably more fighters who have their athletic niche where they would top the other fighters.

So it's quite hard to tell who is the best pure athlete.


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## vilify (Mar 23, 2010)

GSP has a good physique but nothing he does inside the octagon screams "best athlete" 

I would say in no particular order -

Palhares
Jones 
Lesnar 
Melvin 
BJ penn 
Phil Davis 
Anderson Silva 
Hector Lombard 
Ben Henderson


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## Jebber (Oct 11, 2008)

Don't laugh - Forrest, dude can play a pretty mean game of basketball which to me indicates a fairly high athletic factor.


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## limba (Jul 21, 2009)

St. Pierre.

He is the most well rounded MMA fighter in the world and he also has the most well rounded training regim out there.


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## The Lone Wolf (Sep 23, 2008)

I disagree with the GSP pure athelete hype. The guy is great at what he does, yeah, but are you guys forgetting how much of a retard he looked swinging the bat in the TUF coaches challenge vs Koscheck?

To me a pure athlete can adapt easily to any physical challenge or situation. That, for me, isnt GSP.


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## Dream-On-101 (Jun 4, 2009)

The Lone Wolf said:


> I disagree with the GSP pure athelete hype. The guy is great at what he does, yeah, *but are you guys forgetting how much of a retard he looked swinging the bat in the TUF coaches challenge *vs Koscheck?
> 
> To me a pure athlete can adapt easily to any physical challenge or situation. That, for me, isnt GSP.



I'm neither agreeing nor disagreeing with you, i just thought i'd let you know i had an absolute LOL moment when i read the bolded part. 

On a related note i thought he ran like a complete retard in the countdown to GSP V Shields. 


I think Jon Jones i definately up there. Other things to note would be that in terms of endurance, Cain Velasquez has exceptional cardio given his size. He is also clearly very strong and has good explosive movement.


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## John8204 (May 13, 2010)

Two guys not mentioned already 

Matt Mitrione, who seems like he's a healthy smaller version of Brock.

Michael Johnson, who is more of an athlete than an MMA guy.


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## panthony (Nov 12, 2006)

Josh Koscheck appears to be a natural athlete, GSP seems to be someone that works extremely hard.


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## AmdM (Apr 13, 2010)

John8204 said:


> Two guys not mentioned already
> 
> *Matt Mitrione, who seems like he's a healthy smaller version of Brock.*
> 
> Michael Johnson, who is more of an athlete than an MMA guy.


Are you sure you´re talking about Matt and Brock?


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## the_widowmaker (Aug 31, 2009)

Jason MacDonald.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

The Lone Wolf said:


> To me a pure athlete can adapt easily to any physical challenge or situation. That, for me, isnt GSP.


Yep. Thinking about it, I agree with this. I imagine GSP trying to play soccer would be lol worthy.

As somebody above me said, GSP works the hardest and is the most committed. His whole life is dedicated to training and learning. He is pretty damn impressive, whichever way you cut it.

But he's not a pure athlete. Like Wolfo said, those dudes are good at anything physical. I'm sure we're all known one or two dudes like that in your lives. They stand out because they dont even have to try. Its all easy. If you consider yourself this type, then I envy you.raise01:


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## ASKREN4WIN (Jul 12, 2011)

If were taling best *pure* athlete, I would say Hershal Walker. I just heard an interview with him and he said his diet in college was 12 snickers bars a day and he is arguably the best college football player ever. He then said his current diet is one shake a day. He aquired his physique through push-ups and sit-ups alone. The guy is a physical specimen. I know he is old, but if we are talking pure athletes it does not get any more pure than him.


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## Chileandude (Jan 17, 2008)

Dream-On-101 said:


> I think Jon Jones i definately up there. Other things to note would be that in terms of endurance, Cain Velasquez has exceptional cardio given his size. He is also clearly very strong and has good explosive movement.


Pretty good recovery time too.


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## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

This is not even a debate....Brock Lesnar and its not even that close. Just look at the size of the man and the things he can do.


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## The Lone Wolf (Sep 23, 2008)

marcthegame said:


> This is not even a debate....Brock Lesnar and its not even that close. Just look at the size of the man and the things he can do.


Again i wasnt impressed with what i saw of Lesnar in his coaches challenge vs JDS, especially since he was supposed to have had trials for the NFL and be pretty good at American Football. I mean, he kicks like a freakin spazz!

For those who are interested. . . 
Lesnar (sorry about the quality)






GSP





Edit: um, not sure i've done this right  help?


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## AmdM (Apr 13, 2010)

The Lone Wolf said:


> Again i wasnt impressed with what i saw of Lesnar in his coaches challenge vs JDS, especially since he was supposed to have had trials for the NFL and be pretty good at American Football. I mean, he kicks like a freakin spazz!
> 
> For those who are interested. . .
> Lesnar (sorry about the quality)
> ...



Fixed that 4 u


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## John8204 (May 13, 2010)

AmdM said:


> Are you sure you´re talking about Matt and Brock?


They may be the same height but Matt is about 20 pounds lighter than Brock.


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## The Lone Wolf (Sep 23, 2008)

AmdM said:


> Fixed that 4 u


Thanks man, not so good with the interweb  what did i do wrong?

Edit: Ha, kinda screwed up on the rep i gave you too. i'm such a tard


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## St.Paul Guy (Mar 8, 2011)

1 GSP
2 Jon Jones
3 Brock Lesnar
4 BJ Penn
5 Anderson 

Other notables: Koscheck, Mitrione, Schaub, Sonnen, Bendo, Aldo

I have little doubt GSP could compete professionally in any sport he dedicated himself too. With the possible exception of basketball, but that is barely even a sport. :laugh:


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## The Lone Wolf (Sep 23, 2008)

St.Paul Guy said:


> I have little doubt GSP could compete professionally in any sport he dedicated himself too. With the possible exception of basketball, but that is barely even a sport. :laugh:


So could Fitch, who openly admits he's not athletically gifted, he's just a damned hard worker. Athleticism indicates it comes with ease, not hard work and persistence. Would be pretty cool to have a charity special of Average Joe, but with UFC fighters


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## St.Paul Guy (Mar 8, 2011)

The Lone Wolf said:


> So could Fitch, who openly admits he's not athletically gifted, he's just a damned hard worker. Athleticism indicates it comes with ease, not hard work and persistence. Would be pretty cool to have a charity special of Average Joe, but with UFC fighters


GSP learned to be the best wrestler in MMA in a few years. I doubt he outworks everybody else by that much.

And no. Fitch could not have competed professionally in any sport he chose. He is one of the biggest overachievers in MMA.


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## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

The Lone Wolf said:


> Again i wasnt impressed with what i saw of Lesnar in his coaches challenge vs JDS, especially since he was supposed to have had trials for the NFL and be pretty good at American Football. I mean, he kicks like a freakin spazz!


Kicking that kind of ball has nothing to do with athleticism or your skills on the football field. He was a defensive tackler not a kicker.


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## Life B Ez (Jan 23, 2010)

Honestly, the best pure athlete is probably Nick Diaz. The guy competes in triathlons for fun.


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## ASKREN4WIN (Jul 12, 2011)

St.Paul Guy said:


> 1 GSP
> 2 Jon Jones
> 3 Brock Lesnar
> 4 BJ Penn
> ...


Sorry I accidently did a duplicate post.


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## ASKREN4WIN (Jul 12, 2011)

St.Paul Guy said:


> 1 GSP
> 2 Jon Jones
> 3 Brock Lesnar
> 4 BJ Penn
> ...


What about Anthony Pettis? I cant see many fighter pulling off that kick against Bendo.


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## John8204 (May 13, 2010)

I don't get why people are claiming BJ is a pure athlete. Almost all athletics require a high level of cardio vascular ability and BJ's cardio is some of the worst in MMA.


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## The Lone Wolf (Sep 23, 2008)

Rauno said:


> Kicking that kind of ball has nothing to do with athleticism or your skills on the football field. He was a defensive tackler not a kicker.


Well my knowledge of American Football is zero, all i know is that it makes more sense than Rugby 

But when i say he kicks like a spazz, it means his foot to eye co-ordination sucks, and like Soojooko said, guys who are great athletes are good at any physical activity you ask them to do. They can throw balls, hit balls, jump, run, kick whatever the hell you ask them to do, and they'll do it pretty damned well.

And FYI Soojooko, i'm one of those guys :thumb02:


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## suniis (Mar 30, 2010)

Brock, JBJ, Phil Davis, GSP, Guillard, Bendo.

However, as someone mentioned before, H.Walker has got to be it...


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## leifdawg (Jan 1, 2008)

Rauno said:


> Let's not forget GSP here, the man does gymnastics which is the most challenging thing for your body IMO.


Just because he is training gymnastics doesn't mean he can do it at a high level. I see GSP as a pretty good athlete who works his ass off to maximize his potential, but not having the natural athleticism of some of the other guys.



drmz said:


> GSP, Jon Jones, Brock Lesnar, Palhares, Edgar


I'm gonna need some explanation on Palhares and Edgar. Edgar is quick, but not overly quick for his size.


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## leifdawg (Jan 1, 2008)

The Lone Wolf said:


> Again i wasnt impressed with what i saw of Lesnar in his coaches challenge vs JDS, especially since he was supposed to have had trials for the NFL and be pretty good at American Football. I mean, he kicks like a freakin spazz!


Have you ever seen a kicker in American football, as a group they are probably the least athletic position in pro sports, most golfers have better physiques. If you're good at it, you can kick well into your 40s.

This guy is a multiple time all-pro kicker...












Life B Ez said:


> Honestly, the best pure athlete is probably Nick Diaz. The guy competes in triathlons for fun.


Triathlons are more about heart and endurance than pure athleticism. Now if you had said he competes in decathlons I would be there with you.



The Lone Wolf said:


> Well my knowledge of American Football is zero, all i know is that it makes more sense than Rugby
> 
> But when i say he kicks like a spazz, it means his foot to eye co-ordination sucks, and like Soojooko said, guys who are great athletes are good at any physical activity you ask them to do. They can throw balls, hit balls, jump, run, kick whatever the hell you ask them to do, and they'll do it pretty damned well.
> 
> And FYI Soojooko, i'm one of those guys :thumb02:


Trying kicking a football sometime, if you have never done it, or haven't done it recently it can be really awkward because of the oblong shape.


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## Steroid Steve (Oct 1, 2010)

Wow no one said Jose Aldo? he'd probably be playing professional soccer somewhere if he didn't find MMA. I couldn't see GSP being too successful in any other sports other than MMA really. Maybe bodybuilding, but is that actually a sport? GSP is purely a MMArtist. I wouldn't necessarily say what GSP does makes him a "pure" athlete. He's definitely one of the most professional athletes, nonetheless, considering how he approaches MMA and takes care of his body.

I think Jon Jones is the best overall and pure athlete because he probably could have been successful in anything he chose to do, and he actually did more than just one sport while growing up. He was a wrestler, football player, and he picked MMA up and is dominating after only studying it for about 4 years. Supposedly, he learned and pulled off moves that he watched on youtube. That's pretty impressive.


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## Dream-On-101 (Jun 4, 2009)

Now i come to think about it Brock Lesnars combine stats are freely available on the internet for anyone who wishes to search them. The combine is an excellent indicator of raw athleticism, and Brock did exceedingly well weighing around 285lbs. 

His bench press was damned impressive, but it was his 40 yard dash time that i think amazed the most people. Very quick, explosive human being.


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## Tazomazo1 (Sep 2, 2011)

Donald Cerrone or GSP i think.


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## The Lone Wolf (Sep 23, 2008)

leifdawg said:


> Have you ever seen a kicker in American football, as a group they are probably the least athletic position in pro sports, most golfers have better physiques. If you're good at it, you can kick well into your 40s.
> 
> This guy is a multiple time all-pro kicker...
> 
> ...


I'm not saying that anyone who can kick a ball well is a great athlete. But a great athlete *should* be able to kick a ball well, and throw well, and run well etc.

And yes, i can kick a ball and it not be awkward. I'm the type of guy that Soojooko talked about. The kinda guy that people get p!ssed off with because i'm good at any sport i try my hand (or foot) at


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## Ape City (May 27, 2007)

GSP /thread.


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## Ciaci (Feb 9, 2011)

drmz said:


> Palhares


Palhares? Just curious why? Rousimar Palhares?!?


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## Roflcopter (Sep 5, 2008)

Guillard.


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## The Dark Knight (Jun 29, 2008)

CB Dollaway is incredibly athletic. Very strong, fast and explosive. 

Brock Lesnar used to be able to do a shooting star press, which is basically a reverse somersault when he was in the WWE. For a near 300 pounder that is a big big deal. 

GSP and Jon Jones, obviously. Koscheck is probably the most athletic fighter there if there was one.


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## mastodon2222 (Feb 4, 2010)

Dream-On-101 said:


> I vaguely remember seeing a thread similar to this one quite a while ago, but its always fun to revisit certain topics.
> 
> I've been wondering about this quite alot recently, so thought i'd guage some opinions here. Who, in your opinion, is the best pure athlete you have ever seen in MMA? I'm trying to avoid an argument on what constitutes an athlete - just think incredible combinations of strength, speed, agility, explosive movement, endurance etc.
> 
> ...


I agree with most of the guys on the lists, but I can't go with Brock; while he's strong, explosive and agile, he lacks alot of eye-hand coordination and freaks out when punches start flying - can't put him on my list.


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## osmium (Mar 6, 2007)

From an endurance and quickness standpoint I would say Cruz is the most impressive.



mastodon2222 said:


> I agree with most of the guys on the lists, but I can't go with Brock; while he's strong, explosive and agile, he lacks alot of eye-hand coordination and freaks out when punches start flying - can't put him on my list.


I don't think you can consider hand eye coordination an athletic ability. It is more so a learned skill you have to train your body to have the correct reaction. With the story that came out about Bryce Harper I think you have to actually question how much quality of sight even matters.


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## dlxrevolution (Jul 16, 2009)

I'd say GSP, Jones, Rashad, and Guillard. I would say Brock, but he just has too many holes.

Outside the UFC: If he was 20 years younger, Hershel Walker. The guy did literally everything.


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## The Lone Wolf (Sep 23, 2008)

osmium said:


> From an endurance and quickness standpoint I would say Cruz is the most impressive.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think you can consider hand eye coordination an athletic ability. It is more so a learned skill you have to train your body to have the correct reaction. With the story that came out about Bryce Harper I think you have to actually question how much quality of sight even matters.


I'd say hand-eye coordination is more a basic motor skill. If youre lacking there then surely you cant be considered a pure athlete?


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## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

Here is my problem with people that are saying gsp,bones,etc. If you look outside the ufc and other sports there are neck and neck with guys like chad johnson,dwade,derrick rose,andrian peterson,etc. At the end of the day there are in the norm of top athlete. 

Then you have a guy like Brock Lesnar...when he topped the scale at 300 pounds, there is rarely anyone who could match his athleticism. Lesnar at 265 moves like a light heavy weight.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

I have a cousin. Hes over weight and has done very little sports in his life. But, god damn it, everything he tries, comes easy to him. He can throw deadly straight. Has absurd stamina for somebody of his size. He can jump like a fecking rabbit. He started playing soccer recently, and has immediately made his local team playing on the wing. "the wing" being the position that requires a LOT of running. I have zero doubt that if he starting training in ANY sport, he would advance far quicker then 99% of the rest. That, for me, is what I consider "pure" or "natural" athleticism. This is why somebody like Penn would be high on my list. Sure, he lacks commitment... but he is capable of being the very best at any sport I think.

However, when the definition of a term like "athleticism" is so subjective, I doubt this thread will conclude anything! :confused02:


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## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

Soojooko said:


> I have a cousin. Hes over weight and has done very little sports in his life. But, god damn it, everything he tries, comes easy to him. He can throw deadly straight. Has absurd stamina for somebody of his size. He can jump like a fecking rabbit. He started playing soccer recently, and has immediately made his local team playing on the wing. "the wing" being the position that requires a LOT of running. I have zero doubt that if he starting training in ANY sport, he would advance far quicker then 99% of the rest. That, for me, is what I consider "pure" or "natural" athleticism. This is why somebody like Penn would be high on my list. Sure, he lacks commitment... but he is capable of being the very best at any sport I think.
> 
> However, when the definition of a term like "athleticism" is so subjective, I doubt this thread will conclude anything! :confused02:


Penn it is tricky, he got into bjj and got quite good, his flexibility is amazing. But then his boxing which was suppose to be solid got destroyed by edgar who looked much faster,etc. I think penn might just be an elite athlete with the skills to match. 

i said lesnar, but if you look at a dude like silva, with his speed and the things he does in there such as his head movement. How much of that is skills and how much is just athletic abilities?


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## GoodfellaGr (Aug 16, 2011)

the best in each devison is actually the champion..so
LW: Edgar (for extreme conditioning and speed and explosion)
WW: GSP ( for everything)
MW: i would say the "old" Ace Franklin ( extreme conditioning and power for that weight class)
LH: Forrest Griffin and Bones Jones ( for everything)
HW: Cain (for STAMINA conbined with so much power and speed, he is like Edgar just 10 times bigger)

Finally, Lesnar is not a good athlete. His cardio is sooo weak, his power is huge but ok for a man that big, maybe Carwin is stronger ( but slower ofc). Also Lesnar for sure uses drugs for his abilities, not that the other doesnt but him and Overeem are so fake.


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## americanfighter (Sep 27, 2006)

It's really hard to say.if I had to say it would be Jones Melvin and GSP however its already Bern said it's a toss up.


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## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

GoodfellaGr said:


> the best in each devison is actually the champion..so
> LW: Edgar (for extreme conditioning and speed and explosion)
> WW: GSP ( for everything)
> MW: i would say the "old" Ace Franklin ( extreme conditioning and power for that weight class)
> ...


How can you say his cardio is so weak? He has never shown any signs of weak cardio in the ufc.


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

marcthegame said:


> How can you say his cardio is so weak? He has never shown any signs of weak cardio in the ufc.


Same thought here. Even on the contrary, I was quite impressed by his cardio in his only 3 round decision fight (against Heath Herring). He didn't look at all like the typical gassed heavy weight that lacks coordination in his movements, but still looked relatively fresh at the end of round 3. I think he is overrated as a fighter, but his cardio seems to be one of his smallest problems.


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## Dream-On-101 (Jun 4, 2009)

Lesnar easily lasted the 15 minutes against Herring. I would be willing to bet he is alot stronger than Carwin on all lifts (their respective combine stats attest this to a certain point) and in general is just a superior athlete to Shane. Quicker, Bigger, Stronger, better cardio etc. Not saying he is the best pure athlete in the UFC, but he is definately up there, whereas Shane would be pretty far down my list. He is slow as hell for a start.


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## hellholming (Jun 13, 2009)

Roy Nelson


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## ESPADA9 (Oct 13, 2006)

Life B Ez said:


> Honestly, the best pure athlete is probably Nick Diaz. The guy competes in triathlons for fun.


Not sure I would consider Triathlons a sign of pure athleticism, endurance sure but agility, speed, explosive power, skill etc not so much. I did triathlons and raced road bikes (which I think was harder) for years and I think wrestling requires more pure “athleticism”.

I know Nick and Nate regularly compete in Olympic distance triathlons and place pretty well which for endurance is impressive, what is so impressive is that they can compete in MMA at such a high level and are still competitive in such a different extreme endurance sport (IMHO most people in MMA carry too much muscle to be considered good candidates for triathlons).


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

Pretty sure TUF and all his fights has proved JDS is much more athletic than Brock. He's faster, more agile, more explosive.


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## Dream-On-101 (Jun 4, 2009)

I disagree. Junior is significantly lighter than Brock and i doubt he could do alot of the things Brock can athletically speaking. Even in the TUF trials (which Junior won) if you watch it Brock was clearly quicker than Junior. 

I doubt Juniors combine stats would match up to Brocks, even though he is lighter:

NFL Combine - weighed in at 283 lbs, ran a 4.7 40, had a vertical jump of 35 inches, a standing long jump of 10 feet, and was able to bench 225 lbs at 40 reps.

I also doubt he could do this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6k1LxVogkQ

I am not trying to rag on Junior, i really like him as a fighter and have even been lucky enough to meet him before. I think he is a superior fighter to Brock, i just dont think he is a superior athlete. All conjecture of course.


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## xbrokenshieldx (Mar 5, 2007)

Aren't you all forgetting Jason "The Athlete" MacDonald. It is in the f*ckin name.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

Dream-On-101 said:


> I disagree. Junior is significantly lighter than Brock and i doubt he could do alot of the things Brock can athletically speaking. Even in the TUF trials (which Junior won) if you watch it Brock was clearly quicker than Junior.
> 
> I doubt Juniors combine stats would match up to Brocks, even though he is lighter:
> 
> ...



Junior was way quicker off the line than Brock on the show. And JDS can do the Showtime kick, I don't see why he couldn't do what Brock did.


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