# The Great Ronda Rousey VS Cristiane Cyborg Debate!!



## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

*To begin this thread I most definitely have my doubts that the fight may never take place due to Dana White protecting his investment and cash cow in Rhonda. 

I do believe that this is the only reason the fight hasn't happened yet....

If it did however I don't see Rhonda winning against a Cyborg that has settled into 135. 

11 of Cyborgs 12 Victories are by stoppage and I believe all of Rhondas wins are stoppage victories, we all know that these two are definitely taylor made for the big dog fight..... it would be a shame if they never had the chance to lock horns here.

I've seen just about all of both of their fights... I don't see how Rhonda wins here, that arm bar IMO isn't gonna be enough to put Cyborg away but this is just my opinion.

The reason that I opend this thread is because a lot of threads have turned into the what would happen if Rhonda/Cyborg happened.... so I decided to open up a poll.... I wanna see what the MMA Forum percentage rate would be on the favorite here....

So leave your opinions here and don't forget to vote!!!!


If this fight takes place in the next 18 months WHILE THEY ARE BOTH STILL IN THEIR PRIMES who would you pick and why??!

Let's hear your opinions people!!*


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

Cyborg takes it in my opinion. Cyborg is just as mean if not meaner than Ronda is, has the experience/skill to beat her. Honestly, outside of that judo throw/armbar, Ronda has very little to offer. She walks forward with her chin up and arms flinging until she can get close for a toss. 

All anyone has to do to beat Ronda is use some brain power and not run directly into her like basically everybody else has, keep her at a distance and punch her in the face. I would assume Cyborg has been around long enough to realize this.


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## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

I honestly think Rousey would win. Cyborg makes too many mistakes letting opponents take her down/get in top position. Mix that with Rousey's great throws and I see her getting in dominant position at some point and getting the submission.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Cyborg's a legitimate BJJ black belt she's no stranger to arm bars.... and I'd put money on top of that she's been training not only arm bar defense but counters to it all day....

I remember Rondas face when she was getting caught by Miesha in the striking dept... Ronda was hurting...

Cyborg is galaxys ahead of Tate when it comes to letting her hands go... speed, skill, power and combination wise.

I can see Cyborg knocking Ronda out.


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## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

She may be a black belt but she has put herself in bad positions many times. Let Ronda get full mount as easily as she gave it to Coenan multiple times and her arm isn't going to survive.

Cyborg is strong thanks to all the steroids she has taken, she throws powerful winging punches and is of course dangerous. She fights stupidly at times though and I think Rousey would capitalize at some point.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

I dont fancy any of the old school bunch to beat Ronda. If she loses, it'll be to somebody most of us dont even know about yet.

Ronda is part of the new breed. Unfortunately shes the only one at the moment. Im confident it wont stay that way.


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## JASONJRF (Nov 3, 2009)

_RIVAL_ said:


> *To begin this thread I most definitely have my doubts that the fight may never take place due to Dana White protecting his investment and cash cow in Rhonda.
> 
> I do believe that this is the only reason the fight hasn't happened yet....
> 
> !*


OMFG seriously dude. The you really think the only reason this fight hasen't happened is because Dana didn't want it? And because hes protecting Ronda? WTF does everyone live in a short term memory crazy world here???

First of all Dana tried to sign Guyborg when they brought in the Strikeforce women. But you dont remember that? Then Cyroid said she didn't want to be in UFC and chose to go to invicta. But you don't remember that? Then Tito had a press conference and said there is no way Cyborg could make 135 it would kill her. But you dont remember that? 

Also why the **** would the champ call out cyborg? It's just insane you think Dana is protecting Ronda from cyborg Ronda would beat cyborg and Ronda isn't scared of her. Cyborg now is complaining and wants in the UFC. But Cyborg chose not to be in the UFC and had a chance to be and that Ronda fight would have happened the only reason it didn't was because of Cyborg. Not Dana Not Ronda but Cyborg. SO PLEASE PLEASSE stop with all the bullshit and short memory.

Ronda would win her stand up is getting good and she would clinch and take cyborge down and dominate.


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## 3DLee (Aug 30, 2006)

IF Cyborg wins, i dont think itd be great for biz. Rhonda is America's sweetheart :hug: 

Do yall remember what happened to WMMA after Cyborg SMASHED Carano? It basically went down the toilet for YEARS. Not until another attractive darling like Rhonda came around did it gain momentum. 

Cyborg's bad for business because shes ugly. I'm sorry to be so shallow and honest. A lot of people probably consider me to be ugly too. But I'm not trying to sell ppvs.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

JASONJRF said:


> OMFG seriously dude. The you really think the only reason this fight hasen't happened is because Dana didn't want it? And because hes protecting Ronda? WTF does everyone live in a short term memory crazy world here???
> 
> First of all Dana tried to sign Guyborg when they brought in the Strikeforce women. But you dont remember that? Then Cyroid said she didn't want to be in UFC and chose to go to invicta. But you don't remember that? Then Tito had a press conference and said there is no way Cyborg could make 135 it would kill her. But you dont remember that?
> 
> ...



Cyborg was a 145er period. Her management was against the initial move to 135 so she did not initially fight in the UFC. Period.

She at that time was the 145lb champion when Strikeforce got absorbed.

The UFC instead of accomidating her they accomidated Rousey so Cyborg declined to drop weight to fight. My memory serves very well. Her management was also against it.... most fighters tend to listen to their management.

And we also all know that Tito Ortiz was her Manager.... And Tito is an idiot who screwed Cyborg over with that all because of the grudge he has against Dana.

Now.... that being resolved Cyborg has been calling for this fight for about a year. Dana on the other hand has done every thing from insult her to downright say no.

He's now telling her to test 135 first and maybe he will consider it. This is a fight that fans and Cyborg have been pushing for. For at least a year. 

Dana has stopped it time and time again and will not sign Cyborg period.

So Cyborg has taken it upon herself to drop to 135 and fight there and continue calling Ronda out all across social media and television. Even showed grace at her looks being insulted by Dana White.

Cyborg has been calling for this fight. She's been posting, tweeting Dana and the UFC for a year. She's done everything in her power to get in to the UFC

Dana's answer is and has been NO.

He is stopping this fight.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

If you say Guyborg and Cyroid your opinion automatically is reduced to 0% relevance.


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## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

Rival, we all know how much you hate Dana and the UFC but think of it from their shoes for once...

Why should they want to bring in a fighter that 

a) Has failed to make weight at 145 and shown no ability to make 135

b) If she were signed the only fight people would want is a title match which she has not earned at that weight

c) She is an obvious steroid user who has been caught in the past

She has liability written all over her... Yes she might be the best woman(if you want to call her that...) fighter out there but she also needs to be marketable. What if she is brought in and beats Rousey then fails a drug test? What if she is brought in and fails to make weight? Why should the UFC take all these gambles when they already have a much more marketable champion in Rousey?

The easy answer is they shouldn't. If Cyborg can prove she deserves the shot then give it to her and hope Rousey wins but until then Cyborg rightfully so has no place in the UFC...


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Here's my take on the situation.


1. Cyborg was trying to get Rousey to fight her at Featherweight. For her, this made sense because both Cyborg and Rousey were Featherweight fighters. A lot of people have had the opinion that if Cyborg drops down, her power will drain and it gives Rousey a huge advantage. She was petitioning for the fight to take place there, so she stuck to her guns.

2. When Rousey achieved the level of fame and popularity that she has, with the UFC BW divisionn only rising, Cyborg knew she could no longer try and convince Ronda to move up. She started testing the BW waters to see if she could make the weight, which so far is seemingly like she will from reports.

3. Cyborg was not signed to the UFC because she was a Featherweight fighter. She didn't want to drop down full stop. There were other options out there and really, it's not like the best fighters were BW or anything. It's was pretty much only Rousey.

4. The UFC hasn't signed her since because at first, she was straight off of being popped for steroids. She has since proven herself to be clean, so the UFC will be fine with brining her in now.

5. She previously said that she could NOT make Bantamweight. Not she's saying she can. If it turns out that she can't, what does the UFC do? They are waiting for her to prove she can make the weight. Once she proves it, it's probably an instantly title shot.




As for the fight itself, it's interesting.

Cyborg can easily KO Rousey coming in. Rousey's boxing is bad, her defence is even worse. She opens up straight away and Cyborg could hurt her very badly right off the bat.

Cyborg comes forward though. All Rousey has to do is come forward herself, get the clinch and Judo throw her hard to the ground. The problem with this is, Rousey rarely instigates the clinches, it's usually her opponents.

Cyborg is a BJJ gold medalist I believe, and even slammed LHW Tito Ortiz to get out of a triangle. That being said, I'm not sure if she avoids the armbar if it goes there. That'd be the most interesting aspect.

The longer the fight goes on, the more chance Cyborg has of winning.


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## AlphaDawg (Nov 16, 2009)

Cyborg TKO's her pretty early. Ronda is a god awful striker and KOing some bum doesn't change that. She keeps her chin straight up, keeps her hands low and flails her arms to throw strikes. She's begging to get KO'd and Cyborg is just the girl to do it. Yes, Ronda will probably get her down at some point but the girl has no patience and makes a ton of transitioning mistakes. Hence why Miesha was able to get up and survive the armbar for so long in the second fight.


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## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> 4. The UFC hasn't signed her since because at first, she was straight off of being popped for steroids. She has since proven herself to be clean, so the UFC will be fine with brining her in now.


With the UFC doing more random and pre-fight testing do you actually believe she would be fine? 

Funny thing is she blamed that steroid use on having difficulty cutting weight to 145, really makes you wonder what drugs she is going to have to take to get down to 135...


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

420atalon said:


> With the UFC doing more random and pre-fight testing do you actually believe she would be fine?
> 
> Funny thing is she blamed that steroid use on having difficulty cutting weight to 145, really makes you wonder what drugs she is going to have to take to get down to 135...


Not really relevant to anything. It's almost like people who dislike Cyborg don't want to see her fight Rousey because she might win, and they don't want a cheater to win anything.

I have to stop half way through this because the biggest fly of all time is currently annoying the shit out of me in my room.


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## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Not really relevant to anything. It's almost like people who dislike Cyborg don't want to see her fight Rousey because she might win, and they don't want a cheater to win anything.
> 
> I have to stop half way through this because the biggest fly of all time is currently annoying the shit out of me in my room.


I would like to see them fight and I don't think Cyborg's steroids would save her...

The point is that it doesn't make sense to the UFC. Cyborg is not a draw and never will be. Bringing her in does nothing helpful except build Rousey's reputation if she wins. What the UFC needs right now are stars, Rousey has become one of those stars and the last thing they need is for her to be knocked off in favour of a roided Brazilian. 

Its like the old Fedor vs Brock debate. The hardcores wanted to see that fight happen but in many ways it didn't make sense for the UFC and that is why it never happened. The main reason it didn't happen is because Fedor and his management were unwilling to work with the UFC though. If Cyborg is willing to earn a shot in the UFC then I think she will get it, that hasn't happened yet though.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Not really relevant to anything. It's almost like people who dislike Cyborg don't want to see her fight Rousey because she might win, and they don't want a cheater to win anything.
> 
> I have to stop half way through this because the biggest fly of all time is currently annoying the shit out of me in my room.


I don't like Cyborg and would love to see the fight. Pretty confident it would be a massive anticlimax. But if Cyborg actually won? How could anybody not uberlol at that outcome? Just picturing Danas face going a delicate shade of beetroot as he watches. Basically, even as a massive Ronda clithanger, this fight is pure win for my entertainment lobe regardless of the result.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Soojooko said:


> I don't like Cyborg and would love to see the fight. Pretty confident it would be a massive anticlimax. But if Cyborg actually won? How could anybody not uberlol at that outcome? Just picturing Danas face going a delicate shade of beetroot as he watches. Basically, even as a massive Ronda clithanger, this fight is pure win for my entertainment lobe regardless of the result.



Dana would shit a brick wall.


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## Term (Jul 28, 2009)

_RIVAL_ said:


> She at that time was the 145lb champion when Strikeforce got absorbed.
> 
> The UFC instead of accomidating her they accomidated Rousey so Cyborg declined to drop weight to fight.
> He is stopping this fight.


Cyborg was not the champ because she was stripped of the title and was suspended when Strikeforce was absorbed. They probably would have fought in Strikeforce if not for that fact. Cyborg has no one to blame but herself.


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

The only reason this fight hasn't happened yet is because Cyborg refused to fight and was released from the UFC. 

People can speculate all they want but the fact is, she was signed, she was offered the fight and she said no. Now miraculously she can make wait, even before she decided she could she was using Ronda's name to keep herself in the media. 

If anyone is ducking or running its not Ronda.

As far as the fight goes, Cris has shown me nothing that speaks to her having the ability to stop Ronda from taking her down and say what you want about her being a black belt but she wont last if Ronda is on top.


Cris likes the inside game, she likes the clinch and she likes to throw heavy. All of which put her right in Ronda's wheelhouse. If she wants to beat Ronda she'll have to stop the take down consistently enough to do big damage or stick to kickboxing because otherwise she wont avoid being thrown for five rounds. 

Ronda's striking,

So many people try to discredit her striking but she uses her striking to set up her clinch and ground game just fine and she'll use her Judo to set up her striking. 

Regardless you can assume one thing for sure if this turns into a striking contest Ronda will be in Cyborgs wheelhouse.

I do have issues with anyone saying Cyborg can handle Rousey on the ground. 

My reply would be Oh rly? Much like Ronda's TD's Ive seen nothing to convince me she can stop Ronda's top game, Cris may be able to stop the take downs to some extent but once you are under Ronda, its a losing battle. You just have got to get up and do so without overexposing yourself to submissions, easier said than done. 

I fully except that cyriod can go in and hurt Ronda, pounce and win. I just dont think its the most likely outcome. I think Cris will try and fight her game and that means she'll clinch and get tossed and Ronda will just rinse and repeat until she see's a opening and then she'll sub Cyborg and IMO by RNC in the second or third round.

If the fight goes for more than three rounds Cris will have an advantage, I think if she can keep Ronda from stopping her for three she can do it for five and in the later rounds when the shine has worn off thats when Cyborg will be most dangerous. 

So I might not be giving Cyborg a big chance at winning but if the fight goes longer than three rounds my opinion of who wins will shift to Santos.



Term said:


> Cyborg was not the champ because she was stripped of the title and was suspended when Strikeforce was absorbed. They probably would have fought in Strikeforce if not for that fact. Cyborg has no one to blame but herself.


She was striped for juicing, suspended, picked up by the UFC, refused to fight, and released. Dana was not going to make a weight class for a fighter that nobody else fights in. Any way you look at it 145 was a dead division and he needed challengers for Ronda, I cant see how he was protecting Ronda when he offered the fight.


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

420atalon said:


> c) She is an obvious steroid user who has been caught in the past


Anything but this. Dana does not care about this at all. He was buddy with Sonnen and the money he would draw being a cheater and even said Sonnen could run the UFC in the future. Also he would continue to feed Vitor fight after fight in Brazil because he had no TRT license to fight in U.S., and guess what, Vitor is fighting for the MW title out of those TRT victories all the same. No, being a former roid abuser has zero impact in Dana's decision.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

420atalon said:


> I would like to see them fight and I don't think Cyborg's steroids would save her...
> 
> The point is that it doesn't make sense to the UFC. Cyborg is not a draw and never will be. Bringing her in does nothing helpful except build Rousey's reputation if she wins. What the UFC needs right now are stars, Rousey has become one of those stars and the last thing they need is for her to be knocked off in favour of a roided Brazilian.
> 
> Its like the old Fedor vs Brock debate. The hardcores wanted to see that fight happen but in many ways it didn't make sense for the UFC and that is why it never happened. The main reason it didn't happen is because Fedor and his management were unwilling to work with the UFC though. If Cyborg is willing to earn a shot in the UFC then I think she will get it, that hasn't happened yet though.


Well in this case, let's just close it down. No female fighter will ever be a draw outside of Rousey.

Fact is, Cyborg is the second best female fighter out there. Also, this has been a fight fans have wanted to see for years, so by putting it on, that alone is a huge thing to achieve.

I don't get how ANY bit of this fight "doesn't make sense". If Cyborg was to beat Rousey, she's better. That would result in the best fighter being the champ, which is what the title is all about.

Regardless of that, Cyborg would OBVIOUSLY be a draw. Anyone on the planet who doesn't want to watch Julliana Pena Vs Cris Cyborg needs to stop watching MMA instantly.



Soojooko said:


> I don't like Cyborg and would love to see the fight. Pretty confident it would be a massive anticlimax. But if Cyborg actually won? How could anybody not uberlol at that outcome? Just picturing Danas face going a delicate shade of beetroot as he watches. Basically, even as a massive Ronda clithanger, this fight is pure win for my entertainment lobe regardless of the result.


I think Cyborg beating Rousey saves WMMA for UFC. If Rousey beats Carano, Cyborg, Correira and Holm, there is literally no female fighter who could get a title shot.



slapshot said:


> The only reason this fight hasn't happened yet is because Cyborg refused to fight and was released from the UFC.
> 
> People can speculate all they want but the fact is, she was signed, she was offered the fight and she said no. Now miraculously she can make wait, even before she decided she could she was using Ronda's name to keep herself in the media.
> 
> ...


I was actually going to rep you until you threw in that one Cyroid. Relevance reduced to 0%, but you were so close.


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## LizaG (May 12, 2008)

People need to stop this Cyborg roiding shit, compared to some UFC fighters that got a second or third chance, she got popped *once*. In the grand scheme of things she's a fcking saint!

Cyborg via 1st round destruction.


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

CupCake said:


> People need to stop this Cyborg roiding shit, compared to some UFC fighters that got a second or third chance, she got popped *once*. In the grand scheme of things she's a fcking saint!
> 
> Cyborg via 1st round destruction.


In the grand scheme of things she's a cheat and thats that.


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## SmackyBear (Feb 14, 2008)

Well said, slapshot. 

Despite all the black belt comments, her IBJJF gold medals are at purple belt. How many people does women's purple HW have? Like eight?

After her second gold, she was promoted to brown. I don't think she's competed since then.

It's an impressive accomplishment for a person, but it pales in comparison to Rousey's bronze at Olympic judo. Combined with the fact that I haven't seen much from her on the ground in MMA, and I'm not sure where all the talk that she's going to survive the ground with Rousey comes from.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

^Chris Weidman is one of UFC's best jitz guys with a brown belt and 3 submission victories


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## SmackyBear (Feb 14, 2008)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> ^Chris Weidman is one of UFC's best jitz guys with a brown belt and 3 submission victories


Yeah, but with one year of training, he almost choked out Andre Galvao (a world champion BB who won silver at ADCC that year) like five years ago. As far as I know, Cyborg doesn't have a similar match against someone comparable, like Gabrielle Garcia.

Plus his main grappling background was in wrestling, not BJJ. His folkstyle wrestling credential that is comparable to BJJ belt rank is his NCAA tournament All-American status.


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## Killz (Oct 5, 2009)

I'd take Cyborg over Rousey but like I've said in other threads, I think the longer it takes for them to make this fight, the better chance Rousey has of winning.

I'd love to see Cyborg smash her all over the place though.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

SmackyBear said:


> Yeah, but with one year of training, he almost choked out Andre Galvao (a world champion BB who won silver at ADCC that year) like five years ago. As far as I know, Cyborg doesn't have a similar match against someone comparable, like Gabrielle Garcia.
> 
> Plus his main grappling background was in wrestling, not BJJ. His folkstyle wrestling credential that is comparable to BJJ belt rank is his NCAA tournament All-American status.


So being a several time gold medallist in BJJ competitons < nearly submitting someone, but not.


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

Ronda vs Cyborg on the mat is intriguing to say the least. Any comment saying one would dominate the other is pure speculation. Ronda is Olympic caliber *Judo* fighter, where Cyborg has competed successfully and trained Jiu Jitsu for longer time. Grappling wise, Jiu Jitsu offers way more attacks and defenses than Judo. That means we will know soon enough how Ronda's Jiu Jitsu training has evolved apart from her incredible Judo. I believe her Olympic background, toughness and discipline helps her a lot in learning new things and she is showing that in her striking as well.

She has a combination hard to beat at this moment in comparison to other fighters she dominated: Explosive Judo throws that stun girls on impact and fast set up of an trade marked armbar. Now, still powerful throws plus vicious GNP and then, her striking is getting better.

Cyborg is no can, though. She would still be the one more complete on the ground, I guess, because in BJJ, the fight starts when it gets to the ground, where in Judo, fight frequently ends when one hits the ground. 

I definitely want to see that clash.


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## LizaG (May 12, 2008)

I'm very interested to see how Justino looks in her first fight at 135, but if she fights like she does at 145...and as impressivley, then I'd say Cyborg wrecks Rousey.


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

CupCake said:


> I'm very interested to see how Justino looks in her first fight at 135, but if she fights like she does at 145...and as impressivley, then I'd say Cyborg wrecks Rousey.


you and others have said that consistently but you cant say how because its just a wish.


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## LizaG (May 12, 2008)

Well yeah^^^

It's just a wish/prediction/whatever...


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

slapshot said:


> you and other have said that consistently but you cant say how because its just a wish.


That can go either way, really...


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## JASONJRF (Nov 3, 2009)

_RIVAL_ said:


> Cyborg was a 145er period. Her management was against the initial move to 135 so she did not initially fight in the UFC. Period.
> 
> She at that time was the 145lb champion when Strikeforce got absorbed.
> 
> ...


Yea exactly she has done everything in her power to get this fight exept take it when it was offered and exept the UFC's deal and move to 135 when it was ******* offered common.

Also to say Dana just is saying no no is false you see what you want to. What Dana said was idiot Tito did a press conference saying that a doctor said Cyborg would die if she drops to 135, then Dana laghed and said he didn't want to be the first one to have her fight at 135. 
Also Dana said let's see her get to 135 and fight a couple times and see he didn't say no. He didn't even say he hates her or anything he just said what actually makes sense if you listen and stop thinking Dana's out to save Ronda and all this BS. 

In fact I think Dana is saving Guyborg from Ronda not the other way around.


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> So being a several time gold medallist in BJJ competitons < nearly submitting someone, but not.


Again, belts mean shit.

Especially at the UFC level where aptitude means more. If you want to fabricate a fantasy where Cyroid has the skills to beat Ronda on the ground that's fine.

Hell Ill even throw you a bone and say Ronda is beatable because of the risks she's willing to take wile going for something she's ferreting out.

But if all you got is that she's brazilian so she has better brazilian jujitsu HAHA HA HA HAHA..

You do know that Judo and BJJ are in many ways a lot of the same, its like a husky and a malamute. Ronda holds the accolades and the record to back up her ability's. 

Cyroid has accolades too, peds, a third place win at Abu Dhabi, some purple belt first place wins in 11 and 12 and thats it. None of that shit says she can use her BJJ in the cage the way Ronda does, none of it. 

Did Cristiane have a world class fighter jump on her every morning with armbars when she was 10? Im sorry people but Ronda is being sold short again in the hope that she'll be beat. 

I realize some people think all Judo is are trips, sweeps, reaps and throws but they have never walked into a quality dojo and had to rendori. It almost always hits the floor and from that point on BJJ or judo practitioners look about the same if they have been instructed properly. 

If you want to talk about Cris having superior stand up you wont see me arguing about it, but that and her core strength are the only advantages she has and the core strength is debatable.

Oh and Ronda has a better record, she's beat better fighters than Cyroid has...

I guess thats it for me because I just dont see anyone changing their mind because of the debate but I cant wait til they fight.


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

JASONJRF said:


> Also Dana said let's see her get to 135 and fight a couple times and see he didn't say no.


Apparently Gina Carano wouldn't be required to prove herself at 135 in order to fight Ronda after... how many years not even competing? :confused02:



slapshot said:


> You do know that Judo and BJJ are in many ways a lot of the same, its like a husky and a malamute.


Yeah, I heard in both people use to wear white GIs, isn't it? :happy01:


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## GlassJaw (Sep 21, 2012)

This all hinges on Cyborg's ability to safely make 135 without losing a ton of her physicality. I voted for Cyborg because I think she can definitely keep the fight on the feet. I think Rousey is used to having a little bit of a physical advantage over her opponents, and it may be pretty surprising after she takes that first punch or can't effectively get off her throws in a clinch. I just hope Cyborg makes weight safely and knows how to manage it. I would hate to see a slow and drained Cyborg get beat up in a lousy fight.


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

MMA-Sportsman said:


> Yeah, I heard in both people use to wear white GIs, isn't it? :happy01:


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

slapshot said:


> I knew better than to view your post but sometimes you just cant look away from the train wreck.


Alright, alright. I was having a joke. Of course both BJJ and Judo come from the same background, being similar in many aspects, but this down here is basically what defines their differences and what me and others were referring to while you were making it sound these differences wouldn't be that relevant. Check out the bold part. This is common knowledge. :thumbsup:



> Brazilian Jiu Jitsu vs. Judo -
> Both judo and Brazilian Jiu Jitsu are similar in many ways. This is mainly because both emanate from the ancient Japanese art of jujutsu or jujitsu in some fashion. Judo was in essence formulated by Dr. Jigoro Kano (sometimes written at Jigori). Kano's art was formulated with the idea of it being practiced as a sport; hence, some of the more dangerous moves of jujutsu were taken out (killing moves, etc.). By doing so, however, sparring or newaza became more heavily utilized and possible. Therefore, judo became practiced in schools, etc., in a full go manner. Brazilian Jiu Jitsu was invented by the Gracie family of Brazil, most notably Helio Gracie . Simply put, the patriarch of the family/Helio's father, Gastao Gracie, helped a Kodokan Judo master named Mitsuyo Maeda (at the time the terms judo and jujutsu were often used interchangeably) with business in Brazil. In turn, Maeda taught Gastao's eldest son, Carlos, the art of judo. Carlos taught the rest of his brothers in the family what he had learned, including the smallest and frailest of them, Helio. Helio was often at a disadvantage when practicing the art because many of the moves in judo favored the stronger and larger fighter. Thus, he developed an offshoot of Maeda’s teachings that favored leverage on the ground over brute strength and refined the formula for fighting from one’s back on the ground. Helio's art eventually became known as Brazilian Jiu Jitsu or Gracie Jiu Jitsu.
> Below are some of the specifics on each art. Then follow the links (or numbered links) for the story on some of the greatest and most influential Brazilian Jiu Jitsu vs. Judo matches of all time.
> 
> ...


http://martialarts.about.com/od/styles/ss/Top-Brazilian-Jiu-Jitsu-Vs-Judo-Fights-Characteristics-Great-Fights-Etc.htm


----------



## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

http://martialarts.about.com/od/styles/ss/Top-Brazilian-Jiu-Jitsu-Vs-Judo-Fights-Characteristics-Great-Fights-Etc.htm[/QUOTE]


MMA-Sportsman said:


> Alright, alright. I was having a joke. Of course both BJJ and Judo come from the same background, being similar in many aspects, but this down here is basically what defines their differences and what me and others were referring to while you were making it sound these differences wouldn't be that relevant. Check out the bold part. This is common knowledge. :thumbsup:
> 
> 
> 
> http://martialarts.about.com/od/styles/ss/Top-Brazilian-Jiu-Jitsu-Vs-Judo-Fights-Characteristics-Great-Fights-Etc.htm


LOL, you really think your saying something I dont know dont you. You know why Ronda is better at BJJ than most? Because of her Judo mentality. As far as it being more complete Ill bet you my judo sensei teaches more complete BJJ techneques than most BJJ sensi so whatever.

The focus in judo is standing. Wile BJJ generally speaking is focused on the mat, that doesn't mean the techniques are different in fact they are the same, you may focus on those ground techniques more but in general you dont use different techniques. 

I pull rubber guard frequently am I now a BJJ practitioner? Just like if a BJJ guy pulls off an Tai Otoshi. There is a misconception that Judo is all throws but at least where I trained the ground game was focused on 50/50. 

Oh and if you really want to know something about judo and BJJ just click this link sakurabushidokan.homestead.com


----------



## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

^^^^ I would love to see that, but it doesn't show for me this time. I liked the Homer one, though.


----------



## sucrets (Jul 8, 2007)

I too suspect that the reason this hasn't happened is because dana wants to protect his precious little cnut.


----------



## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

sucrets, please explain to me what the UFC does if they sign Cyborg and she can't make FW (like she herself previously stated).

slapshot, submission def is a lot easier tham submission off. Who is better at submissions? Rousey, by a landslide. I don't just mean armbars either. In WMMA, speed and accuracy in your submissions is a lot more important than in men's MMA, where patience and waiting for the right opportunity is more important. In all submissions, even though we haven't seen more from Rousey, I'd be willing to wager that Rousey is better at subs than Cyborg by a mile.

Cyborg MIGHT have the Jitz to get the guard though. NO female fighter is stopping Rousey from getting the guard, which is ridiculous, and Cyborg's BJJ background could see her stall for a stand up.

With the overcommitment of Cyborg's techniques, a throw could genuinely end this fight.


----------



## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

I think Cyborg would have had her chance to beat Rousey when they were in Strikeforce together. I think Rousey is too well rounded, and overall just better than Cyborg now. Sure Cyborg probably hits a lot harder, but Rousey has been focusing on body shots which don't require as much power to put someone down, you can ask McMann yourself. 

When it comes to stopping the takedown, Cyborg has only had success for people who shoot a single/double that she can out power, there is no out-powering Ronda because power doesn't matter. Ronda throws you and then you have to deal with it. Cris is too sloppy on the ground, gives up position too easily, and makes too many mistakes like leaving free arms for anyone to grab. Sure she would probably try to calm these issues in prep for a fighter like Ronda, but it wouldn't matter.

I'm not saying Cybord can't win, just that I don't think it is likely. I think Ronda would lose in a boxing/kick boxing fight, but that isn't what she will be in against Cyborg. She would come in, throw a couple shots, let Cyborg wade in, throw her on the ground and then we would see if Cyborg can last 3 rounds being ridden like Cupcake did. Sooner or later it would end with Ronda getting her hand raised again.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

slapshot said:


> LOL, you really think your saying something I dont know dont you. You know why Ronda is better at BJJ than most? Because of her Judo mentality. As far as it being more complete Ill bet you my judo sensei teaches more complete BJJ techneques than most BJJ sensi so whatever.
> 
> The focus in judo is standing. Wile BJJ generally speaking is focused on the mat, that doesn't mean the techniques are different in fact they are the same, you may focus on those ground techniques more but in general you dont use different techniques.
> 
> ...


Wow, somebody got a butt hurt from being overshadowed big time by Jiu Jitsu throughout the years. Ok, man. I get it. FYI, I love both and I believe Judo and BJJ complete each other, but keep denying facts of history by saying they are all the same and your Judo sensei can teach better BJJ than a Jiu Jitsu one. Unless you are calling any BJJ black belt a sensei... :dunno:

Talk about being biased...


----------



## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Liz Carmouche has two submission victories in her career and nearly took out Rousey.


----------



## SmackyBear (Feb 14, 2008)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> So being a several time gold medallist in BJJ competitons < nearly submitting someone, but not.


In this context, yes. The women's BJJ purple HW is paper thin and far below BB level. Andre Galvao is a legit world champion BB. 

Also, you didn't address my point that Chris' belt rank isn't analogous to Cyborg's since Chris' primary grappling background is folkstyle wrestling, where he has considerable accolades.


----------



## GDPofDRB (Apr 18, 2013)

I still have rousey winning this by sub. I think Vegas would say -400 rousey.


----------



## 420atalon (Sep 13, 2008)

_RIVAL_ said:


> Cyborg's a legitimate BJJ black belt she's no stranger to arm bars....


I just noticed that she actually isn't a black belt. 

Not that surprising really considering all the mistakes she has made in other fights.

I really do think Rousey would submit her fairly easily. The only thing that would save Cyborg briefly is her strength.


----------



## King Daisuke (Mar 25, 2013)

I'd like to state a fact: Ronda has said multiple times that she will not fight Cyborg. Her reasoning changes but she has said it more than once. That's a fact. Yet she's willing to fight Gina Carano at 145...


----------



## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

King Daisuke said:


> I'd like to state a fact: Ronda has said multiple times that she will not fight Cyborg. Her reasoning changes but she has said it more than once. That's a fact. Yet she's willing to fight Gina Carano at 145...


Ronda has said before how she admires Carano for putting female MMA on the spotlight when it was still so new. It's all respect. Cyborg however has been extremely vocal towards Ronda, why should Ronda go to her weight class if Cyborg is the one doing the call outs. 

Cyborgs camp stated that she would die if she tried to make 135, now she's making her 135 debut so...


----------



## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

King Daisuke said:


> I'd like to state a fact: Ronda has said multiple times that she will not fight Cyborg. Her reasoning changes but she has said it more than once. That's a fact. Yet she's willing to fight Gina Carano at 145...


fabricated, taken out of context to convey a bias...


> "I've said before, I don't care if she's injecting horse semen into her eyeballs, I'll fight her, but that's just my personal decision," Rousey told Yahoo! Sports' Kevin Iole. "


Ronda has said she will fight Cyborg repeatedly, your facts are not so factual.




> Dana White: We offered Cris Cyborg same deal as Ronda Rousey, but they turned it down





> The champion seemed intrigued by the idea of facing Cyborg, "Of course I'm interested," Rousey told Fox Sports 1. "I'm not going anywhere - she knows where I'm at."





> It always goes without saying, but Ronda Rousey isn't exactly one for keeping a low profile. Fellow Olympic medalist Sara McMann hit the nail on the head recently when she said of the Strikeforce darling, "When she wants it, she gets it." And as you all know, Rousey wants Cris Cyborg.
> 
> Well, maybe that's not entirely true. Rousey wants to fight Cyborg and cash-in on a monster payday, sure. _*But Rousey wants fight Cyborg on her terms, at 135 pounds, and she's made no secret about it.*_ In fact, in recent a interview with Sherdog Radio, Rousey admitted she could easily bulk back up to featherweight and meet Cyborg there. But for her, that's not the point.
> 
> ...


http://www.mmafighting.com/2012/10/...yborg-santos-strikeforce-superfight-drug-test


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

It's been Dana saying no for at least the past 12 months not Rhonda.


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## King Daisuke (Mar 25, 2013)

King Daisuke said:


> I'd like to state a fact: Ronda has said multiple times that she will not fight Cyborg. Her reasoning changes but she has said it more than once. That's a fact. Yet she's willing to fight Gina Carano at 145...


What I meant to type was "she doesn't want to fight Cyborg". Was a rough weekend at work, sorry.


----------



## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

_RIVAL_ said:


> It's been Dana saying no for at least the past 12 months not Rhonda.


But what would you do though? Cyborg has never proven that she can make the only weight UFC has.


----------



## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> But what would you do though? Cyborg has never proven that she can make the only weight UFC has.


Outside of Rhonda Cyborg is who comes up when people talk about the best WMMA fighter.... 

That being said she get's paid to fight not to sign....so I'd sign her. Hell if she can't make weight she gets cut simple as that.

If Rhonda really is the best than they fight and she retains her title...... if Cyborg is better than we have a new champion at 135 it doesn't need to be so political..... Cyborg's credentials are good enough to warrant an immediate title shot.

Cyborg VS Rhonda is the most compelling WMMA fight out there, I doubt anybody can honestly dispute that.


----------



## Killz (Oct 5, 2009)

_RIVAL_ said:


> Outside of Rhonda Cyborg is who comes up when people talk about the best WMMA fighter....
> 
> That being said she get's paid to fight not to sign....so I'd sign her. Hell if she can't make weight she gets cut simple as that.
> 
> ...


Cyborg isn't a sell-able 'pretty face' of Womens MMA that Dana wants so the fight will never happen anyway IMO.

It would be a marketing disaster if (not that) pretty Ronda get's brutalised by a chick who looks a bit like a dude.


----------



## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Killz said:


> Cyborg isn't a sell-able 'pretty face' of Womens MMA that Dana wants so the fight will never happen anyway IMO.
> 
> It would be a marketing disaster if (not that) pretty Ronda get's brutalised by a chick who looks a bit like a dude.



This is what I've been saying... Dana White is the one stopping this fight from happening.


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## Killz (Oct 5, 2009)

_RIVAL_ said:


> This is what I've been saying... Dana White is the one stopping this fight from happening.


Oh yeah, I know, I was agreeing with you


----------



## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Killz said:


> Oh yeah, I know, I was agreeing with you


Aside from that fight I'd definitely be up for Cyborg VS Holly Holms.


----------



## Killz (Oct 5, 2009)

_RIVAL_ said:


> Aside from that fight I'd definitely be up for Cyborg VS Holly Holms.


I dont think they'd risk even bringing Cyborg to the UFC as there is no way she doesnt batter the whole division on her way to a title shot.


----------



## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Killz said:


> I dont think they'd risk even bringing Cyborg to the UFC as there is no way she doesnt batter the whole division on her way to a title shot.


God I'd love to see her shake 135 down.


----------



## Killz (Oct 5, 2009)

_RIVAL_ said:


> God I'd love to see her shake 135 down.


Can you imagine? It'd be a massacre!


----------



## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Killz said:


> Can you imagine? It'd be a massacre!


Hell IMO the fans would eat it up... Cyborg is marketable as hell.... she's not blonde haired and blue eyed but the girl is a wrecking machine....

I mean... who else are they talking about in WMMA besides Rhonda and Cyborg on that level and the UFC & Invicta have a good handful of talent.....

It always comes down to these two, and rightfully so.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Juliana Pena Vs Cyborg would be epic.


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

Ronda should train herself a laser guided oblique kick and stomp Cyroids knees into mashed potatoes lol.


----------



## LizaG (May 12, 2008)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Juliana Pena Vs Cyborg would be epic.


And *VERY *short


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

Sorry. I just dont see this mythical Cyborg monster people are talking about.

She looked great against a lot of mediocre MMA fighters. But this is Rousey we are talking about. Shes looked incredible against similar calibre fighters. I would say far more impressive.

Cyborg is powerful and relentless. Far more then any of her opponents. But in Rousey she is matched. She is young, strong and fearless. Theres no evidence Cyborg is any stronger. They are both very strong in the context of WMMA.

I honestly give Cyborg no chance at all.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

Soojooko said:


> She looked great against a lot of mediocre MMA fighters..


That can be said about Ronda as well, right? You just replace KOs for submissions and... voilá!


----------



## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

Soojooko said:


> Sorry. I just dont see this mythical Cyborg monster people are talking about.
> 
> She looked great against a lot of mediocre MMA fighters. But this is Rousey we are talking about. Shes looked incredible against similar calibre fighters. I would say far more impressive.
> 
> ...


Ronda has faced a higher caliber of fighters than Cris IMO.


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

MMA-Sportsman said:


> That can be said about Ronda as well, right? You just replace KOs for submissions and... voilá!


That's the point I was making, except Ronda has been more impressive destroying similar calibre fighters to Cyborg.

I have no doubts Ronda would have put Coenen away with far less effort.


----------



## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Soojooko said:


> I have no doubts Ronda would have put Coenen away with far less effort.


Can't count Connen out... she'd be an easy top 5 at 135 that's one crafty veteran.


----------



## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

_RIVAL_ said:


> Can't count Connen out... she'd be an easy top 5 at 135 that's one crafty veteran.


She's tough no doubt about it but against Rousey I think she would get torched. I dont whole heatedly buy into comparing fighters by fighters they both beat or hypothetically would beat anyway.


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

_RIVAL_ said:


> Can't count Connen out... she'd be an easy top 5 at 135 that's one crafty veteran.


Being a veteran only counts for something when you've experienced a situation before. But Ronda is a whole new level of WMMA competitor. None of the existing top girls have fought or trained with anything like her. I'm pretty confident that she wont lose to anybody older then her. It'll come from some other young hungry next level chick.


----------



## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Soojooko said:


> Being a veteran only counts for something when you've experienced a situation before. But Ronda is a whole new level of WMMA competitor. None of the existing top girls have fought or trained with anything like her. I'm pretty confident that she wont lose to anybody older then her. It'll come from some other young hungry next level chick.


IMO it's gonna come from Cristiane Cyborg if Zuffa gets that contract.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

*More fuel.*



> *Cris Cyborg fires back after being criticized: "She is too low level."*
> 
> Brazilian says rival hasn't "a single bit of education" and provokes: " If she were so sure about what she says, she would already have accepted fighting me."
> 
> ...


http://sportv.globo.com/site/combate/noticia/2014/09/cris-cyborg-rebate-ronda-apos-ser-criticada-ela-e-muito-baixo-nivel.html


----------



## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

It actually is pretty sad all the shit Cyborg's getting. I get the feeling that it really does affect her, specifically the comparisons to Wanderlei etc. That being said, she's a hothead in the cage anyways so I see her only embracing it to fight.


----------



## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> It actually is pretty sad all the shit Cyborg's getting. I get the feeling that it really does affect her, specifically the comparisons to Wanderlei etc. That being said, she's a hothead in the cage anyways so I see her only embracing it to fight.


What's funny is that she never attacked Dana personally... she just made it very known that she wanted Rhonda and she's even going to drop 10 lbs to fight her... Dana was pretty out of line for his Wanderlei comments.


----------



## Term (Jul 28, 2009)

_RIVAL_ said:


> What's funny is that she never attacked Dana personally... she just made it very known that she wanted Rhonda and she's even going to drop 10 lbs to fight her... Dana was pretty out of line for his Wanderlei comments.


I thought the stuff Dana said about Cyborg looking like Wanderlei was un-called for. I thought that was really unprofessional, and just not a nice thing to do, but Dana has never been what you would call professional, or all that nice to people he doesn't like for whatever reason.


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> It actually is pretty sad all the shit Cyborg's getting. I get the feeling that it really does affect her, specifically the comparisons to Wanderlei etc. That being said, she's a hothead in the cage anyways so I see her only embracing it to fight.


The problem is she was juicing and got caught. Which begs a couple of questions: How much of her career was spent juicing - and - If she hadn't got caught would she have carried on taking PEDS. Thats what agitates me personally; I think she would have happily come to the UFC and won fights while cheating. I cant support this kind of arsehole. I guess Dana feels the same.


----------



## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Soojooko said:


> I cant support this kind of arsehole. I guess Dana feels the same.



I doubt that's the issue... he brought in Rafael Feijao directly off of a steroid suspension and Antonio Bigfoot Silva who had tested positive a year prior to entering the UFC.


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

_RIVAL_ said:


> I doubt that's the issue... he brought in Rafael Feijao directly off of a steroid suspension and Antonio Bigfoot Silva who had tested positive a year prior to entering the UFC.


Fair point. I guess its just me then.


----------



## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Soojooko said:


> The problem is she was juicing and got caught. Which begs a couple of questions: How much of her career was spent juicing - and - If she hadn't got caught would she have carried on taking PEDS. Thats what agitates me personally; I think she would have happily come to the UFC and won fights while cheating. I cant support this kind of arsehole. I guess Dana feels the same.


Dont get me wrong, people should hate her and she is in NO way an advocate of the sport. But people get more personal with her and I defo think she is affected by it.


----------



## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Dont get me wrong, people should hate her and she is in NO way an advocate of the sport. But people get more personal with her and I defo think she is affected by it.


True. She should be called out for what she was concerning the sport - a roided cheater, just as Belfort, Sonnen and so on. But attacking her looks has nothing to do with the sport.


----------



## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

It's when Dana backed up Ronda on it all. Like Ronda is gonna say it, it's a fight and people diss each other's looks all the time. But the way she does it and is also backed up, it's like some ***gt mean girls shit.


----------



## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

She reserves most of it for cyborg, she's more respectful with most of the other girls. I dont have a issue with anything she said about cyroid but then I dont like him either.


----------



## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

slapshot said:


> She reserves most of it for cyborg, she's more respectful with most of the other girls. I dont have a issue with anything she said about cyroid but then I dont like him either.


She's nice to other fighters because she knows the fights are bullshit and pretends they are worth being in the cage. Like you actually think Gina Carano is the biggest threat to the title? Bullshit.


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

Rouseys position is total understandable in my opinion. Look, Cyborg beat up a *lot* of women. And its highly likely she was juiced and her opponent wasn't in a fair few of those fights. And as I said, she would have probably carried on if she hadn't got busted.

Shes willing to get in the cage, knowing full well she has an unfair advantage, and happily beat the shit outta some poor cow. That says a lot for her character as well as all the other cheating twats. I cant fecking stand them.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

Soojooko said:


> Rouseys position is total understandable in my opinion. Look, Cyborg beat up a *lot* of women. And its highly likely she was juiced and her opponent wasn't in a fair few of those fights. And as I said, she would have probably carried on if she hadn't got busted.
> 
> Shes willing to get in the cage, knowing full well she has an unfair advantage, and happily beat the shit outta some poor cow. That says a lot for her character as well as all the other cheating twats. I cant fecking stand them.


I fully understand and share this sentiment with you regarding this subject (juicing). But I am also all for people being granted second chances to overcome their own mistakes. It's not like she murdered someone. She cheated, she was caught, lost the belt for that, dignity, money, opportunities, fans... If she is to fight clean now, and she's been doing that for quite a while now, what's the problem? What's in the past, is in the past.


----------



## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

Mark Hunt would demolish them both.


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

Canadian Psycho said:


> Mark Hunt would demolish them both.


*sigh*

What I wouldn't give to see Cyborg vs Hunt.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

Canadian Psycho said:


> Mark Hunt would demolish them both.


By sitting on them.


----------



## PheelGoodInc (Jul 23, 2009)

How do spammers always have such horrendous grammar? I mean really. I know the programmers are probably from out of country. But come on, with the technology out there you think they could construct a normal sentence in their attempted scams...


----------



## BrianRClover (Jan 4, 2008)

Sidebar/question here.

Do you guys/gals think this fight has reached a hype level where it could headline an arena by itself? And I mean a REAL arena not a Vegas arena, 50,000+ seats?

I voted Rhonda by the by, I think she's truly a phenom in her genre.


----------



## King Daisuke (Mar 25, 2013)

BrianRClover said:


> Sidebar/question here.
> 
> Do you guys/gals think this fight has reached a hype level where it could headline an arena by itself? And I mean a REAL arena not a Vegas arena, 50,000+ seats?
> 
> I voted Rhonda by the by, I think she's truly a phenom in her genre.


Nah, they're still women.


----------



## Swp (Jan 2, 2010)

Debate roids vs talent ?


----------



## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Paul Harris > Rhonda


----------



## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

I wonder how many more training partners Overeem has injured since this thread was opened...


----------



## Canadian Psycho (Apr 22, 2007)

http://fansided.com/2014/09/22/cris-cyborg-making-135-pound-debut-dec-5-invicta-fc-10/



> Cris Cyborg will finally be making the move that mixed martial arts fans have been waiting for.
> 
> It was announced on Monday morning that the Invicta FC featherweight champion will be shedding 10 pounds for a drop down to 135-pounds. Cyborg’s debut in the women’s bantamweight division will be coming on Dec. 5 at Invicta FC 10.
> 
> The news was announced in a special edition of the UFC Minute.


It has begun!


----------



## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

She's putting in the work to get where she has to go.


----------



## anderton46 (Apr 23, 2010)

For me, if this fight happened however long ago it was originally supposed to happen 1/2 years? I think Santos wins, but now rousey has fought more fights, she's improved and Cyborg has hardly fought I think Rousey wins now.


----------



## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> If you say Guyborg and Cyroid your opinion automatically is reduced to 0% relevance.


Guyborg and Cyroid.

I think Scotland should have voted for independence.

Now I'll watch while you implode .


----------



## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Don't worry, after what has went down the opinion of a Scotsman is worth less than 0 these days.


----------



## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Don't worry, after what has went down the opinion of a Scotsman is worth less than 0 these days.


Unless you need advice on wearing dresses. Because you guys got that shit down.


----------



## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> She's nice to other fighters because she knows the fights are bullshit and pretends they are worth being in the cage. Like you actually think Gina Carano is the biggest threat to the title? Bullshit.


I dont have any reason to feel Ronda is lying when she says she dislikes Cris for fighting dirty. 

Cyroid basically validated everyone's suspicions by dropping the weight and fighting. She could have had the fight a year ago...

At this point I dont care about all the bureaucracy, just get the fight inked.


----------



## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

slapshot said:


> I dont have any reason to feel Ronda is lying when she says she dislikes Cris for fighting dirty.
> 
> Cyroid basically validated everyone's suspicions by dropping the weight and fighting. She could have had the fight a year ago...
> 
> At this point I dont care about all the bureaucracy, just get the fight inked.


A lot of that had to do with her shitty ass management. 

They set her back 2 years with that.


----------



## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

Rousey vs Cyroid could headline a PPV. I have no doubt about that, especially because Cris is perceived to be a equal to Ronda and the other girls aren't. 

I think it would be a shame to put this fight on a card that needs to be carried, couple it with a big co-main event and watch the cash flow in.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

Cyborg was told she couldn't make weight by earlier doctor evaluations. She made the decision not to drop to 135 based on those evaluations.

Now she is being advised by a different team and making the cut. Simple: You don't cut weight when your doctors say you can't. When your doctors say you can, you go ahead and try the cut.


----------



## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

*Ronda Rousey interview.*

Very nice interview with Ronda performed by Flavio Canto, Brazilian Olympic Judo medalist. I can't embbed the video. 

Flavio makes a quick introduction in Portuguese and in about 50 seconds into the video they start talking in English.

http://sportv.globo.com/site/programas/sensei-sportv/noticia/2014/09/ronda-revela-infancia-gorducha-e-que-foi-confundida-com-um-dos-hanson.html


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

MMA-Sportsman said:


> Very nice interview with Ronda performed by Flavio Canto, Brazilian Olympic Judo medalist. I can't embbed the video.
> 
> Flavio makes a quick introduction in Portuguese and in about 50 seconds into the video they start talking in English.
> 
> http://sportv.globo.com/site/programas/sensei-sportv/noticia/2014/09/ronda-revela-infancia-gorducha-e-que-foi-confundida-com-um-dos-hanson.html


Doesn't work in my region. But reading the translation, I see Ronda is keen to face Bethe Correia in Brazil. Take note, Jon Jones, you big blouse.


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

Soojooko said:


> Doesn't work in my region. But reading the translation, I see Ronda is keen to face Bethe Correia in Brazil. Take note, Jon Jones, you big blouse.


Damn, that sucks. It happens to me sometimes as well and I have no clue why. So much for *W*orld *W*ide *W*eb...

Hopefully somebody uploads it to Youtube soon.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Soojooko said:


> Doesn't work in my region. But reading the translation, I see Ronda is keen to face Bethe Correia in Brazil. Take note, Jon Jones, you big blouse.


Smh. typical.

You say this now, but everyone would be bitching that Jones is taking easy fights if he was keen to face Bethe Correia.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Smh. typical.
> 
> You say this now, but everyone would be bitching that Jones is taking easy fights if he was keen to face Bethe Correia.


:laugh:

Nice.


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Smh. typical.
> 
> You say this now, but everyone would be bitching that Jones is taking easy fights if he was keen to face Bethe Correia.


typical, beth is always unrated.


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## leifdawg (Jan 1, 2008)

CupCake said:


> People need to stop this Cyborg roiding shit, compared to some UFC fighters that got a second or third chance, she got popped *once*. In the grand scheme of things she's a fcking saint!
> 
> Cyborg via 1st round destruction.


IMO steroids are an even bigger advantage for women as it allows them to gain man-like strength.


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## Stun Gun (Oct 24, 2012)

I didn't read any of this thread except the last page and have no intention to do so. But I think Ronda would win a fight at 135 because she is the better grappler. Cyborg murders her on the feet though.


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

Stun Gun said:


> I didn't read any of this thread except the last page and have no intention to do so. But I think Ronda would win a fight at 135 because she is the better grappler. Cyborg murders her on the feet though.


Until she can prove that she can keep the fight standing for five rounds its a moot point IMO.


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## prospect (Mar 26, 2014)

slapshot said:


> Until she can prove that she can keep the fight standing for five rounds its a moot point IMO.


Women fights go for 5 rounds? I had no idea That's possible


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

prospect said:


> Women fights go for 5 rounds? I had no idea That's possible


She wont even be able to stop the TD for one..

Are woman's title fights just three? If so I hadn't noticed because Ronda gets all her work done in the first..

I believe you are wrong and that title fights are all 5 rounds.


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

slapshot said:


> She wont even be able to stop the TD for one..
> 
> Are woman's title fights just three? If so I hadn't noticed because Ronda gets all her work done in the first..
> 
> I believe you are wrong and that title fights are all 5 rounds.


Maybe he meant that women, in contrast to a lot of male fighters, actually really go for the finish and Rousey just finishes her opponents. That's why you don't see women fights longer than three rounds.


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## prospect (Mar 26, 2014)

Yeah.. I guess slap isn't really better than average


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

prospect said:


> Yeah.. I guess slap isn't really better than average


So you get waned for baiting in another thread and just jump to the next and start baiting in this one... nice.


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## prospect (Mar 26, 2014)

What ?? That was completely harmless and civil... 

I'd say you're baiting me right now


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

prospect said:


> What ?? That was completely harmless and civil...
> 
> I'd say you're baiting me right now


ahh, my bad I must have took it wrong, lol.

The average IQ in the US is falling but last time I looked it was 100. 

Im well above that, evolution its a bitch.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

Cyborg fights at 135 in December.... Rhonda defends in January....

The stars may be aligning for this one...


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

_RIVAL_ said:


> Cyborg fights at 135 in December.... Rhonda defends in January....
> 
> The stars may be aligning for this one...


Ronda.

I'm not stopping until we're spelling these things right.


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Ronda.
> 
> I'm not stopping until we're spelling these things right.


Honda?


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

slapshot said:


> Honda?


MMA goddess Honda Housey, of course!


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Ronda.
> 
> I'm not stopping until we're spelling these things right.


Sue me. Every Rhonda I've ever met was spelled "Rhonda"... leave it to creative parents to change things around and screw up important things like online MMA debates.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

_RIVAL_ said:


> Sue me. Every Rhonda I've ever met was spelled "Rhonda"... leave it to creative parents to change things around and screw up important things like online MMA debates.


There is no excuse for people to spell Ronda and Conor wrong. They are two of the most talked about people in MMA today.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> There is no excuse for people to spell Ronda and Conor wrong. They are two of the most talked about people in MMA today.


Trust me bud that wasn't an excuse. It was a direct disreguard to people spelling the same names in different ways.

I don't care enough to check.


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

So, it became a spelling thread... :thumb02:

Well, after you are aware of the correct spelling, why keep typing it wrong? Only to piss off Clyde? :laugh:

Hehe, I confess reading "Rhonda" kind of hurt my eyes too, but not as much as writing Palhares as "Paul Harris".

I've noted there were some "Al*a*stair" Overeem around too, maybe even is a thread title.


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## LizaG (May 12, 2008)

So.......maybe see where this all stands after Cyborg fights at 135. Then I'm sure she and Dana can talk numbers. Aside from Cat it's the only exciting fight for Ronda in the near future.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

*Ronda Rousey Says Cris Cyborg Should Be Charged With Attempted Homicide.*



> If UFC women’s bantamweight champion Ronda Rousey had her way, not only would she never fight Cris “Cyborg” Justino, but the current Invicta FC featherweight champion would also be in jail.
> 
> “That girl, in my eyes, should be charged with attempted negligent homicide,” Rousey said during Monday’s edition of The MMA Hour.
> 
> ...


Source -----------> http://www.mmaweekly.com/ronda-rousey-says-cris-cyborg-should-be-charged-with-attempted-homicide


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## AlanS (Jun 16, 2009)

Rousey says some dumb crap.


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## TanyaJade (Aug 31, 2010)

I don't understand Rousey sometimes.
She's been saying stuff about Justino for years, yet seemingly has no interest in moving up or is even willing to accommodate to fight her? (to my knowledge)

IMO it's a weak move to call someone out and tell them to cut weight.


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## King Daisuke (Mar 25, 2013)

It's happening! Ronda's going full retard! :laugh:


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

> “Coming into the cage with performance-enhancing drugs is the equivalent of walking in there with a weapon”


This is a very ignorant thing to say. We have discussed a lot about who has punching power and who hasn't. Could Big Nog have been killed by Roy Nelson when that bomb landed on his head? Same with Struve, when demolished by Hunt. Does Ronda believe if Minotauro and Struve would take all imaginable PEDs up to the limit of not killing themselves of overdose, they would straight away punch harder than Nelson and Hunt respectively? Do PEDs give you superpowers so you could punch a hole through a brick wall?

Use of PEDs makes you a cheater, not a potential murderer in anyway.

All these statements mean one clear thing: Ronda is afraid of Cyborg big time. Otherwise she wouldn't be speaking of things from the past. She would be saying out loud she barely can't wait to Cyborg wins her battle at 135 decisevely, so they can finally face each other and then she would prove she is the best and carry on trashing Justino.


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## LizaG (May 12, 2008)

Oh god Ronda *stop talking*!!!

Does she have the same PR team as Jon Jones?


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## John8204 (May 13, 2010)

I love dumb ill-tempered Ronda almost as much as I love drunk Jon Jones.

I'm also pretty sure Cyborg's drug usage was to cut weight


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## LizaG (May 12, 2008)

Cyborg's last bust was for something she took to help cut weight, she's missed weight before in Strikeforce and had trouble for a while with the 145 cut.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

TanyaJade said:


> I don't understand Rousey sometimes.
> She's been saying stuff about Justino for years, yet seemingly has no interest in moving up or is even willing to accommodate to fight her? (to my knowledge)
> 
> IMO it's a weak move to call someone out and tell them to cut weight.


To be fair, theres no avenue for the fight to happen at 145. The division doesn't exist in the UFC. Even if they sign Cyborg and have a one-off scuffle at 145, what happens if Chris wins? Where does she go from there? She will still have to drop to 135 if she wants to stay in the UFC meaning she'll have to fight Rousey again for the belt. So really, she needs to drop weight first.


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## SmackyBear (Feb 14, 2008)

I'm absolutely for more athletes shaming steroid cheats, but it'd be nice if she could just do that without making stupid points. I mean, "attempted negligent homicide?" How can you attempt anything through negligence? Attempted homicide is obviously ridiculous, but there is some chance steroid users in combat sports could be charged with assault.



John8204 said:


> I love dumb ill-tempered Ronda almost as much as I love drunk Jon Jones.
> 
> I'm also pretty sure Cyborg's drug usage was to cut weight





CupCake said:


> Cyborg's last bust was for something she took to help cut weight, she's missed weight before in Strikeforce and had trouble for a while with the 145 cut.


I'm sorry, but that is just incorrect. Winstrol, which she popped for, is significantly more anabolic than testosterone. It isn't like she was taking diuretics.

Steroids being referred to as cutting, which Winstrol often is, doesn't mean they actually help people lose weight in a vacuum. It just means bodybuilders use them in the cutting part of their cycle, but bodybuilder cutting and MMA weight cutting aren't the same thing at all. Winstrol doesn't retain water, so it helps the muscles look much more defined. Some bodybuilders claim it burns fat, but there's no real evidence of that.

Cyborg is bound to have used it to put on muscle and because it has relatively low androgenic effects compared to anabolic effects, not to help her make 145. Tons of women use it to get the good bang (muscle growth) for their buck (virilizing side effects) in a steroid.


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## John8204 (May 13, 2010)

SmackyBear said:


> I'm sorry, but that is just incorrect. Winstrol, which she popped for, is significantly more anabolic than testosterone. It isn't like she was taking diuretics.
> 
> Steroids being referred to as cutting, which Winstrol often is, doesn't mean they actually help people lose weight in a vacuum. It just means bodybuilders use them in the cutting part of their cycle, but bodybuilder cutting and MMA weight cutting aren't the same thing at all. Winstrol doesn't retain water, so it helps the muscles look much more defined. Some bodybuilders claim it burns fat, but there's no real evidence of that.
> 
> Cyborg is bound to have used it to put on muscle and because it has relatively low androgenic effects compared to anabolic effects, not to help her make 145. Tons of women use it to get the good bang (muscle growth) for their buck (virilizing side effects) in a steroid.


She got popped for Stanozolol Metabolites
http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2012/1/6/2688239/cyborg-santos-steroids-positive-test-strikeforce

And they have found that dietary supplements can have such drugs as stanozolol, metandienone, dehydrochloromethyltestosterone and oxandrolone hidden in them.

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/745220_4



> Faked Dietary Supplements Contaminated With 'Classic' Anabolic Steroids
> 
> Since 2002, dietary supplements have appeared on the market, which are probably intentionally spiked with high amounts (more than 1 mg/g) of 'classic' anabolic steroids, not declared or declared with non-approved or fancy names on the label. Among these, steroids including stanozolol, metandienone, dehydrochloromethyltestosterone and oxandrolone have been identified. All these steroids are orally effective drugs based on their 17-alkyl group. These dietary supplements are advertised as leading to enormous enhancement of strength and lean body mass. The concentrations of the anabolic androgenic steroids are in the therapeutic or supratherapeutic range per serving leading to positive doping cases detectable for several days and weeks, respectively, depending on the type of steroid administered.
> 
> ...


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## SmackyBear (Feb 14, 2008)

John8204 said:


> She got popped for Stanozolol Metabolites
> http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2012/1/6/2688239/cyborg-santos-steroids-positive-test-strikeforce
> 
> And they have found that dietary supplements can have such drugs as stanozolol, metandienone, dehydrochloromethyltestosterone and oxandrolone hidden in them.
> ...


Okay. I'm not sure what that has to do with this.

Stanozolol is the same thing as Winstrol. And Cyborg didn't exactly use the tainted supplement excuse, she said a coach gave her a supplement to cut weight and it had Stanozolol, but she never looked at the ingredients or ran them by her doctor. Conveniently, she also never named the supplement.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

How would she know the name if she never even looked at it?


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## SmackyBear (Feb 14, 2008)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> How would she know the name if she never even looked at it?


Well, just because she said she never looked at the ingredients of the supplement doesn't mean that she never looked at the name of the supplement. In fact, for her to trace the failure to a specific supplement, you could reasonably infer that she looked into all supplements she was taking after a surprise failure. Assuming you believe that this isn't a flimsy, post hoc excuse.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

SmackyBear said:


> Well, just because she said she never looked at the ingredients of the supplement doesn't mean that she never looked at the name of the supplement. In fact, for her to trace the failure to a specific supplement, you could reasonably infer that she looked into all supplements she was taking after a surprise failure. Assuming you believe that this isn't a flimsy, post hoc excuse.


I think the majority of it all is just stupidity. I dont think most people PLAN to roid up. I think they are just uneducated on what they are taking.


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## oldfan (Mar 14, 2010)

Here's some funny stuff from Bloody elbo. I kinda agree with Cyborg on Ronda. She doesn't want this fight.












> Cyborg doesn't seem to be happy with the state of Women's MMA. As the dominant champion had an 'AMA' session at the UG, she voiced her opinion on the topic and had some very interesting 'advice' for women who plan to enter mixed martial arts. Check out some quotes as she answered questions from the fans:
> 
> What advice would you give to a young woman getting started as a MMA fighter today?
> 
> ...


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

puppy's?


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

Dont read what Ronda said, watch it. You lose a lot of context. Still not the best way to express herself.

She was saying that if a fighter kills another fighter on roids it would be murder and the fighter on roids would be charged and the sport would suffer. 

She's out of her depth with the statement though, I dont think you can charge a fighter and even if you did good luck getting a conviction for murder lol..

Ronda is channeling Alex Jones lol..

She just hates cyroid. Besides Cyroid was the one who started the crap talking and the Media are the ones poking the fighters every five minutes about eachother..



John8204 said:


> She got popped for Stanozolol Metabolites
> http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2012/1/6/2688239/cyborg-santos-steroids-positive-test-strikeforce
> 
> And they have found that dietary supplements can have such drugs as stanozolol, metandienone, dehydrochloromethyltestosterone and oxandrolone hidden in them.
> ...


Its a mild steroid as well as a diuretic and its also the most abused steroid used by woman in all sports...So she would have to be the biggest moron not to know she was taking it. 

She knew exactly what she was taking and why..


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## King Daisuke (Mar 25, 2013)

Cyborg said:


> I think Ronda has the type of personality where she needs the attention.


She might be on to something...


Here's a question for Ronda:

So if a death happened in the Octagon, but there was no steroids involved, are you saying that then the sport wouldn't suffer? Because these things happen in MMA?


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## realdeal (Nov 6, 2014)

*Regardless*

I think it will be a great fight. I think MMAF becoming more mainstream so to speak is a great thing. My daughters both watch fights when I can get them, or show them highlights on the internet, with a sort of realization, hey this is something I could do too. I love it either way.


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

King Daisuke said:


> She might be on to something...
> 
> 
> Here's a question for Ronda:
> ...


She's saying the same thing everyone else has been saying, I guess they all are attn whore's too. 

You act like she picked the questions, I bet the fighters get more sick of the same questions than the fans.


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## King Daisuke (Mar 25, 2013)

slapshot said:


> She's saying the same thing everyone else has been saying, I guess they all are attn whore's too.
> 
> You act like she picked the questions, I bet the fighters get more sick of the same questions than the fans.


I don't think anyone's ever suggested that PED=murder?


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

King Daisuke said:


> I don't think anyone's ever suggested that PED=murder?


Only if the fighter kills his/her opponent then gets popped for peds, I thought that part was obvious..

Quite a few fighters have said the same thing, Dana said it or implied legal action could be taken, tj desantis has used the same scenario on beatdown. Its actually quite a prevalent opinion.


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

Eating organic food and training compound lifts gives similar results to taking PED's without the massive crashes. Nobody knows how to train properly or eat right, it just takes more discipline and hard work than PEDs. 

I know a 60 year old doctor that's so strong, fit and durable he would embarrass most UFC fighters in the gym. The only guys that really need PED's are heavyweights trying to add on more muscle than their frames will allow. PED's aren't going to result in a death any more than organic food and deadlifts.


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## King Daisuke (Mar 25, 2013)

slapshot said:


> Only if the fighter kills his/her opponent then gets popped for peds, I thought that part was obvious..
> 
> Quite a few fighters have said the same thing, Dana said it or implied legal action could be taken, tj desantis has used the same scenario on beatdown. Its actually quite a prevalent opinion.


I'm not getting dragged into a debate about PEDs (For the record: I'm against them). The following quote is why I think Ronda's going full retard:



> If UFC women’s bantamweight champion Ronda Rousey had her way, not only would she never fight Cris “Cyborg” Justino, but the current Invicta FC featherweight champion would also be in jail.
> 
> “That girl, in my eyes, should be charged with attempted negligent homicide,” Rousey said during Monday’s edition of The MMA Hour.


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