# St. Pierre vs. Koscheck - UFC 74



## screenamesuck (Jun 29, 2006)

ufcmania.com 

“Well as of now, it looking like Kos is set to be fighting in AUG at UFC 74 and it’s looking like we will be taking on Georges St. Pierre. We have the contract and will be sending it back this week to the UFC! more updates to come in the next couple of days!”

– The official Web site of UFC welterweight contender Josh Koscheck confirms that he has been offered a contract to fight former 170-pound champion Georges St. Pierre at UFC 74 on August 25 in Las Vegas, Nevada.


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## The Legend (Jun 13, 2006)

Even though I like Kos a lot I have to go with my boy GSP so he can get his title back.


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## herton17 (Sep 13, 2006)

Ooooohhhh...nice, nice.


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## Foon (Jan 6, 2007)

Does GSP ever get an easy fight?


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## herton17 (Sep 13, 2006)

He did....vs Matt Hughes 2 LOL :laugh:


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## asskicker (Aug 27, 2006)

Foon said:


> Does GSP ever get an easy fight?


Well he got about the easiest fight anyones ever had to defend a title and he blew that.


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## TYKIDD (Dec 6, 2006)

Yea, as much as people wan't to put Serra on a pedestal, He just is not that good. St. Pierre should have had his head straight and put a beatdown. St. Pierre apparently needs difficult competition to keep his head staight. GSP by 2nd rd KO.


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## DangerMouse666 (Jul 9, 2006)

Kos is gonna get his 2nd loss with GSP. I'm not so sure on a TKO or KO but I see a submission comin' outta this fight late 2nd round.


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## TYKIDD (Dec 6, 2006)

DangerMouse666 said:


> Kos is gonna get his 2nd loss with GSP. I'm not so sure on a TKO or KO but I see a submission comin' outta this fight late 2nd round.



I don't agree. I can't think of any fights GSP has finished with a sub against top ranked opponets. Or any opponents for that matter. Kos lost by sub but that was because he took a huge punch that dropped him. So unless that exact scenario plays out again I see Kos losing by Ko or TKO. Kos is too strong and athletic and cautious fighter on the ground to get caught in a sub. Kos hardly throws when he is on top and on the ground so it is difficult to catch him in a sub.


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## FunkYou (Apr 22, 2007)

TYKIDD said:


> I don't agree. I can't think of any fights GSP has finished with a sub against top ranked opponets. Or any opponents for that matter.



Frank Trigg at UFC54. Not a difficult accomplishment but there is one at least.


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## JawShattera (Nov 1, 2006)

gsp by second or third round knockout or submission


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## flourhead (Jul 12, 2006)

GSP will win. he can't be taken down.


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

Kos by KO in the first.


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## herton17 (Sep 13, 2006)

Yeah man....KOS is the kinda guy that will go in there and knock GSP out. LOL
GSP is not Diego, and KOS won't be able to just stand there and box. GSP's striking skills are much crisper and he is much more experienced in the stand-up game. I realize KOS has learnt a lot and mainly works on his stand-up, but he is not quite there yet. 

That being said, KOS is gonna have to go for the takedown. How well he can execute it? I dunno. GSP is one strong mofo and KOS is one of the best wrestlers in the game. 
I just think GSP is gonna knock KOS out as soon as he gets comfortable, and KOS tries for a shot. 

GSP - second round KO. He is just too much for KOS right now.


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## UFCfan610 (Mar 28, 2007)

*hmmmm...*

Kos will take this one pretty easily. i know a lot of posters are gonna be riding with GSP but i think Kos is quicker, more athletic, a better wrestler, better takedowns and GSP's striking i think is over-rated. if he was fighting anyone else, i'd pick GSP but this is a really bad matchup for him. Kos by GnP in the 2nd or 3rd round.


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## flourhead (Jul 12, 2006)

UFCfan610 said:


> Kos will take this one pretty easily. i know a lot of posters are gonna be riding with GSP but i think Kos is quicker, more athletic, a better wrestler, better takedowns and GSP's striking i think is over-rated. if he was fighting anyone else, i'd pick GSP but this is a really bad matchup for him. Kos by GnP in the 2nd or 3rd round.


kos is quicker than GSP? hahahahaha


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## kamikaze145 (Oct 3, 2006)

*I have GSP*

GSP will win this one. He is a better striker and I also think he is a better athlete and this will be the first time and possibly the last time that Kos fights a better athlete than himself. Kos is getting to be a very good fighter but he is not yet ready for St. Pierre but I cannot see anyone walking through Kos so I am very interested to see how this fight goes because it will be a very good indicator of exactly where Koscheck is at this point of his career. I will also be excited to see if GSP has evolved his guard and overall bottom game at all because he is one of those guys who is hardly ever on his back but Kos has the ability to put him there. I see GSP winning this one by either 3rd round TKO or a unanimous decision but I think Kos will still be impressive and maybe even steal a round.


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## speedythief (Sep 23, 2006)

FunkYou said:


> Frank Trigg at UFC54. Not a difficult accomplishment but there is one at least.


Trigg isn't a can, he was considered a contender in that division at the time.

Jay Heiron wasn't much of a challenge for GSP. He's the only can Georges has fought in the UFC.


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## kamikaze145 (Oct 3, 2006)

UFCfan610 said:


> Kos will take this one pretty easily. i know a lot of posters are gonna be riding with GSP but i think Kos is quicker, more athletic, a better wrestler, better takedowns and GSP's striking i think is over-rated. if he was fighting anyone else, i'd pick GSP but this is a really bad matchup for him. Kos by GnP in the 2nd or 3rd round.


No way Kos wins this one easily. If he wins it will be a hard earned win. I see how you could think it is a bad matchup for GSP but I disagree. I do not think GSP's striking is overrated. He is not the most diverse striker but what he does on his feet he does really well and I think that the stand up will be his biggest advantage in this fight. I really cannot see Kos finishing this fight. I think if he wins it will have to be by decision. It will be very interesting to see how they match up as athletes though.


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

flourhead said:


> kos is quicker than GSP? hahahahaha


Yes he is. hahahahahahaha


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## kamikaze145 (Oct 3, 2006)

When you say quicker,do you mean has a quicker shot, lighter on his feet, quicker hands, or what?


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> Yes he is. hahahahahahaha


no he isn't HAhahahaha. Quicker takedowns, that's it.. and GSP shrugged off hughes' takedowns, Kos's aren't _that_ much better. But his handspeed is mediocre, his kicks are NOWHERE near as fast as GSP's and his GnP / Lay and Pray is a joke. He's gotten a lot better, but he's not on St. Pierre's level, as long as GSP has his head on straight for this one.


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## benn (Dec 4, 2006)

Are some ppl saying GSP isn't a top level fighter and Koschek is Top Notch never will be beat fighter now?


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## kds13 (Nov 27, 2006)

Kos by split decision. This is a very even fight, and I think Koscheck's wrestling will be the difference. Kinda sad too, GSP is my boy, but I hate this match up for him. Its gonna be a tough fight.


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## FunkYou (Apr 22, 2007)

speedythief said:


> Trigg isn't a can, he was considered a contender in that division at the time.



Wasn't saying he is a can but he doesn't seem to have much submission defence.


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

Koscheck doesn't have a prayer of taking GSP down. Matt Hughes made a career of taking people down to the ground and he could not do it to GSP at UFC 65. Kos takedowns are nothing special compared to Matt Hughes takedowns. This will most likely be a stand-up war.


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

Foon said:


> Does GSP ever get an easy fight?


GSP said he didn't want an easy fight! He said he wanted to face a tough opponent so he can get right back into title contention.


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## kds13 (Nov 27, 2006)

Bonnar426 said:


> Koscheck doesn't have a prayer of taking GSP down. Matt Hughes made a career of taking people down to the ground and he could not do it to GSP at UFC 65. Kos takedowns are nothing special compared to Matt Hughes takedowns. This will most likely be a stand-up war.


Are you kidding? Koscheck's wrestling is light years ahead of Hughes.

Kos went to Edinboro University, which has one of the top wrestling programs in the nation. Its on par with Iowa, Oklahoma and Texas. There, he was a 4 time Division 1 All American, a National Champion at 174 lbs. in 2001, and a 3rd best at 174 lbs. in 2002.

Hughes best finishes ever at Nationals was 5th place once. He was an All-American 1 time....at the Ju-Co ranks...not D-1 like Kos.


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## M_D (Apr 8, 2007)

Ok if this fight happened any other time I think it would be a closer match up with gsp still comming out on top but I think Kos drew the short straw. GSP is going to destroy kos, after losing the belt the way he did he is going tom be in that ring in the best condition of his life ready to fight.
In the words of the champ "I would hate to be his next opponate"

to the person that said Serra was a easy fight, why would you say that, serra is a great fighter


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

kds13 said:


> Are you kidding? Koscheck's wrestling is light years ahead of Hughes.


I'll tell you what, If Koscheck wins this fight on the ground I'll put in my sig that "I'm kds13 b!tch and I can never reach the level he is on!" Vice Versa if he doesn't win! Deal?


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## Wise (Oct 8, 2006)

Wooooo, this is like a title fight minus the title. I like Kos better then most but I have to give the nod to GSP on this one. Hopefully he comes back really hungry after losing to Serra, I dont know if I would want to be the guy fighting an angry GSP on his comeback.


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

I'm excited for this. I give the nod to GSP, too, because it's hard to imagine him getting upset twice in a row. And yes, it would be an upset if Kos beat him. GSP has the edge standing, and he'll be the hardest opponent so far for Kos to try and take down. 
Even if he does, it'll be a tall order to keep him there without getting submitted.
If GSP keeps him sh*t together, it's hard not to believe him holding the title again by this time next year. He'll learn from the Serra loss just like he learned from the Hughes loss.


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## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

Damn this fight is TOO close to call.. I'll pick GSP though just because I've enjoyed his fights more than Koscheck's.

As for smack talk from Koscheck, I don't see him talking trash like he did with Diego. He's even gone as far as saying what a gentleman GSP is in interviews. The only smack-talk I can imagine coming from Koscheck is "I just see him as another obstacle in the way of me getting the title."

I really don't feel comfortable betting on this one though..


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

benn said:


> Are some ppl saying GSP isn't a top level fighter and Koschek is Top Notch never will be beat fighter now?


Bandwagons are funny that way, aren't they? Kos beats Diego, Serra beats GSP...all of a sudden Kos is a welterweight version of Fedor and GSP is a useless can.


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

Kos is practicly an undefeated fighter if it wasent for the lucky knee by Fickett. Hes gonna kill that overrated canadian *****. :thumbsup:


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> Kos is practicly an undefeated fighter if it wasent for the lucky knee by Fickett. Hes gonna kill that overrated canadian *****. :thumbsup:


Nothing against Kos, but it's pretty hard to justify calling a guy who beat Hughes, Penn, Sherk and Parisyan "overrated."


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## benn (Dec 4, 2006)

vandalian said:


> Nothing against Kos, but it's pretty hard to justify calling a guy who beat Hughes, Penn, Sherk and Parisyan "overrated."





Yep, AGREED.

Why do ppl see Kos as the baddest dude in the WW division now?
Is he really the baddest dude?:laugh:


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

benn said:


> Why do ppl see Kos as the baddest dude in the WW division now?
> Is he really the baddest dude?:laugh:


Where has anyone said Kos is the baddest dude in WW? 

All we are saying is hes gonna kill GSP


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> Kos is practicly an undefeated fighter if it wasent for the lucky knee by Fickett. Hes gonna kill that overrated canadian *****. :thumbsup:


hmmm, if you think GSP is overrated What is your opinion of Frank Trigg, Karo Paryisian, Matt Hughes, BJ Penn, Mayhem Miller, and Sean Sherk who all got beat by this "_overrated Canadian_"?


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

Bonnar426 said:


> hmmm, if you think GSP is overrated What is your opinion of Frank Trigg, Karo Paryisian, Matt Hughes, BJ Penn, Mayhem Miller, and Sean Sherk who all got beat by this "_overrated Canadian_"?


Trigg = Can

Sherk = Way above his natural wieght class

Penn = Penn won imo

Hughes = has no hands 


Serra exposed GSP and Kos will finish him


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> Trigg = Can
> 
> Sherk = Way above his natural wieght class
> 
> ...


I think Fickett exposed Kos when he hit him with that knee? I think he is way to overrated! Whats your opinion on that?


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## The Legend (Jun 13, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> Trigg = Can
> 
> Sherk = Way above his natural wieght class
> 
> ...


How did Serra expose GSP? He got a lucky punch in everybody knows it.


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

Bonnar426 said:


> I think Fickett exposed Kos when he hit him with that knee? I think he is way to overrated! Whats your opinion on that?



A lucky knee. That is his only loss. Can you come up with a better argument that.


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> A lucky knee. That is his only loss. Can you come up with a better argument that.


No such thing as luck. As far as I'm concern that kind of talk is bullsh*t! He threw a knee and it connected and it rocked Kos! Fickett did his job.


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## FunkYou (Apr 22, 2007)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> A lucky knee. That is his only loss. Can you come up with a better argument that.


Why is his loss down to luck and GSP's down to being exposed? Compare who they have beaten and its Kos who is the nearer to being overrated.


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## speedythief (Sep 23, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> Trigg = Can
> 
> Sherk = Way above his natural wieght class
> 
> ...


Weak sauce.


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## JawShattera (Nov 1, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> Trigg = Can
> 
> Sherk = Way above his natural wieght class
> 
> ...



your an idiot


please never post again...anyone else agree?


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## UFCfan610 (Mar 28, 2007)

*hmmmm...*



vandalian said:


> Bandwagons are funny that way, aren't they? Kos beats Diego, Serra beats GSP...all of a sudden Kos is a welterweight version of Fedor and GSP is a useless can.


LMAO!!! i just read this entire thread and can't find anything close to being said like this. can you find it and repost it for me.

that being said, Kos will win and then we all can come on here and read the 100's of threads full of excuses AGAIN. i just hope you come up with some new ones, please don't post the same excuses from last time.

excuses you can NOT use:
1. didn't train properly
2. underestimated his opponent
3. was injured
4. a lucky punch
5. he slipped
6. wasn't mentally prepared
7. he liked Kos so didn't want to hurt him

there are probably more but can't think of them right now. but these will NOT be accepted...lol.


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## 70seven (Mar 5, 2007)

Should be a good fight. GSP's wrestling ability migth come in handy. I really dont see KOS winning this. 

GSP second round with a KO/GnP.


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> A lucky knee. That is his only loss. Can you come up with a better argument that.


OK, so Fickett was just lucky, but Serra "exposed" GSP...? That's some kinda logic ya got goin' on there.


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

GSP getting the Karo treatment. He'll have to earn his rematch.


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## JawShattera (Nov 1, 2006)

chunklove is one fo the biggest morons on this forum, ive heard plenty of retarded shit from him


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## asskicker (Aug 27, 2006)

massage__dancer said:


> Ok if this fight happened any other time I think it would be a closer match up with gsp still comming out on top but I think Kos drew the short straw. GSP is going to destroy kos, after losing the belt the way he did he is going tom be in that ring in the best condition of his life ready to fight.
> In the words of the champ "I would hate to be his next opponate"
> 
> to the person that said Serra was a easy fight, why would you say that, serra is a great fighter


Matt Serra is not a "great" fighter by any walk of life. Going into that fight I considered him a straight up can. Now I consider him a good fighter but TUF 4 was a joke. I dont like sayin guys got lucky but Serra beating GSP doesnt make him great in my eyes especially after his performance against Lytle. It would have been more justifiable to kick him in the nuts and throw him out of the UFC than to give him a title shot after that match.


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

asskicker said:


> Matt Serra is not a "great" fighter by any walk of life. Going into that fight I considered him a straight up can. Now I consider him a good fighter but TUF 4 was a joke. I dont like sayin guys got lucky but Serra beating GSP doesnt make him great in my eyes especially after his performance against Lytle. It would have been more justifiable to kick him in the nuts and throw him out of the UFC than to give him a title shot after that match.


Matt Hughes performance against Lytle wasn't that awe inspiring either but I don't hear you calling for his resignation!:thumbsdown:


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## FunkYou (Apr 22, 2007)

The Lytle/Serra fight was truly awful and there is no way one win makes a great fighter but I can't wait to see if the hate that Serra has for Hughes will bring out the potential greatness.

Alternatively Hughes pickes him up slams him around and serra goes back to being a great teacher.


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## wukkadb (Jan 1, 2007)

This is a bad match up for GSP but I think he can win it. Strategy/game plan is going to be important in this fight


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## asskicker (Aug 27, 2006)

Bonnar426 said:


> Matt Hughes performance against Lytle wasn't that awe inspiring either but I don't hear you calling for his resignation!:thumbsdown:


I didnt say he should be fired. I just said it would be more justifiable than giving him a title shot after that win. Plus, Hughes' win while not great was much, much better than Serras


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

asskicker said:


> I didnt say he should be fired. I just said it would be more justifiable than giving him a title shot after that win. Plus, Hughes' win while not great was much, much better than Serras


I'm not trying to dissrespect you or anything. Its just the way you phrased made it sound that way. As far as Serra goes I'm not going to say he's one of the greats but from what I have seen, aside from the Lytle fight, he seems like a decent fighter! Your making it sound like he completely sucks balls and then some.


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## FunkYou (Apr 22, 2007)

MMAMORON! said:


> welll who will win at ufc i think it will nbe koscheck because his has the best elnbows. gsp is french and french people are gay.
> 
> p.s. ken sharock is the best !!!1



At the risk of feeding the troll - you are an idiot.


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## asskicker (Aug 27, 2006)

Bonnar426 said:


> I'm not trying to dissrespect you or anything. Its just the way you phrased made it sound that way. As far as Serra goes I'm not going to say he's one of the greats but from what I have seen, aside from the Lytle fight, he seems like a decent fighter! Your making it sound like he completely sucks balls and then some.


Well my hate for him comes from a combination of him being handed TUF 4 title, him being annoying as hell, and how hes made out to be this dominant fighter after one TKO. Yeah hes a good fighter but hes not great.


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## FunkYou (Apr 22, 2007)

asskicker said:


> Well my hate for him comes from a combination of him being handed TUF 4 title, him being annoying as hell, and how hes made out to be this dominant fighter after one TKO. Yeah hes a good fighter but hes not great.



I think "handed the title" is a bit harsh. the fight was rubish but Lytle did not do anything to make it exciting either. At the end of the day we would all love it of every fight was exciting but these are proffesionals and the most important thing to them is to win. Even if it means putting the audience to sleep instead of yor opponent.


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## zarny (Mar 4, 2007)

Kos is a dangerous fight for GSP. If GSP comes out like he did against Trigg or Hughes II I think GSP wins in the first or second round. He got knocked out though and Franklin looked apprehensive when he came back from getting KTFO. 

This will also be the first chance to see how Kos reacts to big time pressure. GSP is a huge step up from Diego and Kos didn't do a lot of damage in that fight.


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## asskicker (Aug 27, 2006)

FunkYou said:


> I think "handed the title" is a bit harsh. the fight was rubish but Lytle did not do anything to make it exciting either. At the end of the day we would all love it of every fight was exciting but these are proffesionals and the most important thing to them is to win. Even if it means putting the audience to sleep instead of yor opponent.


Im not saying it was boring. I mean it was boring but thats not my problem. My problem, is that in no way did Serra deserve that more than Lytle. So yes I firmly believe he was handed the title because he was TUF poster boy and he was poster boy because he was a loud mouth know it all.


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## Punishment 101 (May 4, 2006)

I hope GSP crushes Koscheck (sorry jdun) and i believe he will, i think theres a big difference in skill level between the 2, we will find out


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## flourhead (Jul 12, 2006)

JawShattera said:


> chunklove is one fo the biggest morons on this forum, ive heard plenty of retarded shit from him


yeah and that ***** neg repped me twice for the same post


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

flourhead said:


> yeah and that ***** neg repped me twice for the same post


Yeah, neg repped me, too, anonymously and for no apparent reason, but you could tell it was him.

Unless it was that mmamoron guy...he has to be kidding, right? Some kind of pardy? Nobody's that dumb.


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

Bonnar426 said:


> No such thing as luck. As far as I'm concern that kind of talk is bullsh*t! He threw a knee and it connected and it rocked Kos! Fickett did his job.


If you look in your dicionary then you would see that there is such a thing as luck and thats what happened when Fickett beat Kos. GSP has always had ovverrated hands and Serra has underrated standup so that was not luck. Dont be suprised if Kos starts getting the better of GSP on the feet.


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> If you look in your dicionary then you would see that there is such a thing as luck and thats what happened when Fickett beat Kos. GSP has always had ovverrated hands and Serra has underrated standup so that was not luck. Dont be suprised if Kos starts getting the better of GSP on the feet.


hmmm, so now were anaylzing fights just by looking at the dictionary?:laugh: Wow, your just amazing!:cheeky4:

Edit: So when did you come up with this wonderful revelation of GSP=Overrated and Kos=unstoppable?


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

JawShattera said:


> chunklove is one fo the biggest morons on this forum, ive heard plenty of retarded shit from him



I hope you get banned soon. All your doing is cursing like a little kid grow up man. If you think GSP will win then explain to me why im wrong dont call me names.


PS. Leave your name next time you red rep me loser


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## flourhead (Jul 12, 2006)

luck is in the dictionary but so is global warming so i'm not too sure about merriam websters credibility


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## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

flourhead said:


> GSP will win. he can't be taken down.


Koscheck has the best takedowns in the WW division, so we'll see about that. I think GSP will win, but this is going to be an extremely tough fight for him.


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## MMARocks (Jan 24, 2007)

I see GSP winning.
Good for KOS getting the shot, he put down that crazy freak.
I just hope it's a 3 round war, but that what I want to see in all fights anyway.


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

Bonnar426 said:


> hmmm, so now were anaylzing fights just by looking at the dictionary?:laugh: Wow, your just amazing!:cheeky4:
> 
> Edit: So when did you come up with this wonderful revelation of GSP=Overrated and Kos=unstoppable?


Where did i say to analyze fights using a dictionary? And where did i say that Kos is unstoppable either. Stop putting words in my mouth. 

Like I said before GSP has only dominated fighters who have no hands. If you put him against a real striker he get destroyed. That is what makes him ovverrated. Kos standup is getting better everyday and he is already a better wrestler than GSP. 

Now how can GSP beat Kos?


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> Where did i say to analyze fights using a dictionary? And where did i say that Kos is unstoppable either. Stop putting words in my mouth.
> 
> Like I said before GSP has only dominated fighters who have no hands. If you put him against a real striker he get destroyed. That is what makes him ovverrated. Kos standup is getting better everyday and he is already a better wrestler than GSP.
> 
> Now how can GSP beat Kos?


He's not a world class striker! He's just like Matt Hughes. He can't take punishment standing up so he'll go for the takedown. You don't believe me watch his fights with Fickett and Joslin. GSP shots are more crisp then Kos. So GSP has the edge in this fight.


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## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

The Fickett fight was back when Koscheck didn't know anything about striking. 

Jeff Joslin is a great striker, and he would make anyone look stupid on the feet. Koscheck knew he couldn't stand with him, so he resorted back to his wrestling. 

Koscheck striking has improved a ton.


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## herton17 (Sep 13, 2006)

Do you think Joslin's striking is better than GSP's ? 
I see Joslin mainly as a JJ guy....


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## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

Joslin's a better striker. He uses angles more, and is much more precise. He also calculates his strikes. He's just extremely technical. He also utilizes good head movement, and footwork.

GSP just puts it all together better. He's good in pretty much everything.


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## JawShattera (Nov 1, 2006)

gsp's a better all around striker than joslin but joslin has good strikes forsure


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## herton17 (Sep 13, 2006)

They're both karate guys, you know, I think it just matters how you re able to incorporate your striking with the rest of your game. GSP just does a better job of it, IMHO. I watched Joslin's fights in APEX and TKO, and I dont really see him as a 'great' striker.


Gonna go watch some basketball now.


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## Punishment 101 (May 4, 2006)

herton17 said:


> Do you think Joslin's striking is better than GSP's ?
> I see Joslin mainly as a JJ guy....



Tve trained with Jeff Joslin in the past , so i can answer that for you , NO he is not a better striker then GSP, but his striking and reach and lankyness is hard to deal with... Hes mainly a JJ guy , with decent standup , his wrestling game is not too good


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## southpaw447 (Mar 21, 2007)

FunkYou said:


> Frank Trigg at UFC54. Not a difficult accomplishment but there is one at least.


Took the words right out of my mouth Frank Trigg got TOOLED in that fight. Everyone including kevin james (king of queens) had trigg to win the fight and st pierre was a pretty big underdog.

Anyways KOS just signed his own death warrant and he's going to get tooled IMO worse than Matt Hughes II. I wonder if he'll use the same game plan he used against trigg but i doubt it. I'm going with GSP 2round TKO.



Bonnar426 said:


> He's not a world class striker! He's just like Matt Hughes. He can't take punishment standing up so he'll go for the takedown. You don't believe me watch his fights with Fickett and Joslin. GSP shots are more crisp then Kos. So GSP has the edge in this fight.


I agree his striking has improved but he's no where near st pierres level. GSP is a lot more explosive and definitley has a stand up advatage. I'm curious to see how KOS will come out of this fight too. I wonder if he'll stand or go for the takedown. If he's smart he'll take St Pierre down, but if Matt Hughes can't do it I don't think KOS will be able to either

I hope st pierre calls out matt hughes after the fight.


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## BrAinDeaD (Oct 15, 2006)

I cannot read any more. Too much nuthugging going on. 

I can only hope for a good exciting fight, which I'm confident it will be.


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

I think Kos has a good chance and I will bet my points on him. I think this will be Kos's true challenge and I am confident he will come through. With his excellent wrestling, vastly improving stand up, and intelligent fighting I think he stands to be a very good challenge for GSP. 

I honestly think this is a bad fight for GSP, not that he isn't a great fighter, but style wise it isn't a good match up. Kos's take downs are much better than Hughes, and while I won't say his GnP is better I think he will be able to position GSP for GnP better. If GSP wins, it won't surprise me, but I am going to bet that Kos comes out and does the job. I just hope it isn't a borefest, but I think for this fight the smarter strategy appears to be to engange GSP and not let him go. If Kos can time it right he can turn one of GSP's high kicks into a takedown to GnP.


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

Kos TD > GSP TD Defense by miles


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> Kos TD > GSP TD Defense by miles


What do you base this on?


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

Bonnar426 said:


> What do you base this on?


Watching their fights :laugh:


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> Watching their fights :laugh:


Okay, which fight of Koschecks gave you this impression? 
Diego Sanchez Decision (Unanimous) 
Win Jeff Joslin Decision (Unanimous) 
Win Jonathan Goulet Submission (Strikes) 
Win Dave Menne Decision (Unanimous) 
Win Ansar Chalangov Submission (Rear Naked Choke) 
Loss Drew Fickett Technical Submission ( 
Win Pete Spratt Submission (Rear Naked Choke) 
Win Chris Sanford KO (Punch) 
Win Luke Cummo Decision (Unanimous) 
Win Cruz Chacon Submission (Neck Crank) 

Which one of these fighters had TD defense that was worth a damn?


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## wukkadb (Jan 1, 2007)

Bonnar426 said:


> Okay, which fight of Koschecks gave you this impression?
> Diego Sanchez Decision (Unanimous)
> Win Jeff Joslin Decision (Unanimous)
> Win Jonathan Goulet Submission (Strikes)
> ...


What amazing wrestlers has GSP defended takedowns against? Kos is a better wrestler than Hughes AND Sherk (in my opinion).


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## herton17 (Sep 13, 2006)

Why didnt KOS go for takedowns against Diego? Its not just wrestling skill that comes into play when you re on the ground...You gotta be careful where you gonna land and what kind of position you re gonna end up with on the ground. 
The point is, even if they end up on the ground, GSP may come out in a better position. If not, he'll almost certainly pull guard. KOS's striking is not good enough to just waltz in there and throw GSP around (even if GSP had no TD defense). But he does. And its good, real good. 

Although KOS's wrestling may be better than Hughes', it doesnt mean that he applies it much better to MMA. Matt has been doing it for a very long time, and very succesfully at that. GSP made his wrestling ability look mediocre. Dont think KOS can dominate him in that aspect or any other aspect. I ll take Hughes over KOS in a MMA fight any day, even though they both have similar styles. Why? Experience...MMA experience.


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

wukkadb said:


> What amazing wrestlers has GSP defended takedowns against? Kos is a better wrestler than Hughes AND Sherk (in my opinion)


Hughes made a career of taking people down. If Matt wanted thier asses on the ground that is where they will go. Even Randy Couture said, That when Matt goes for a takedown its very RARE that the other fighter doesn't go down. So far that shows GSP has some pretty awesome takedown defense. 

So I will issue the same answer to you? Of all of Koschecks opponents, who had takedown defense that was worth a damn?


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## herton17 (Sep 13, 2006)

You got it buddy. Matt is known for his wrestling, its what he does.


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

wukkadb said:


> What amazing wrestlers has GSP defended takedowns against? Kos is a better wrestler than Hughes AND Sherk (in my opinion).


Exactly. Kos is a much better wrestler than Hughes. Joe Rogan even stated that during the Joslin fight. Sherk was also in a higher wieght class than he should have been so of course he couldent take down GSP. 

Kos could take down GSP (or anyone for that matter) anytime he wants.


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## speedythief (Sep 23, 2006)

I'll bet dimes to dollars that GSP stands with Kos for a minute than explodes for the takedown. Koscheck's TD will be tested first.

Wrestlers are typically very uncomfortable working off their back. Sanchez blew it but I think GSP knows that putting Kos on the mat will be a huge advantage for him.


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> Exactly. Kos is a much better wrestler than Hughes. Joe Rogan even stated that during the Joslin fight. Sherk was also in a higher wieght class than he should have been so of course he couldent take down GSP.
> 
> Kos could take down GSP (or anyone for that matter) anytime he wants.


You are just ignoring my question! Because you know what the answer is and you don't want to admit it. None of them had very good TD defense. None of those matches suggest he can actually breakthrough GSP TD defense!


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## herton17 (Sep 13, 2006)

You know what it is? GSP has never been in TUF. Thats why hsi TD defense sucks... hahaha :thumbsdown:


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

herton17 said:


> You know what it is? GSP has never been in TUF. Thats why hsi TD defense sucks... hahaha :thumbsdown:


I guess so...:laugh:


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## wukkadb (Jan 1, 2007)

Matt Hughes and Sean Sherk are both excellent wrestlers with good take downs, I take back what I said before. BUT, Kos is still much better than both of them. I don't think that he has faced anyone with GOOD TD defense yet, but he's been a successful wrestler for a very long time, and I think they have good TD defense, maybe not though?


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## herton17 (Sep 13, 2006)

They usually do have good takedown defense, but they are very uncomfortable working from their backs. 
Also, being a better collegiate wrestler doesnt directly translate into being a better MMA wrestler. There are far too many variables in MMA to consider when going for a takedown, as opposed to a wrestling match. This is why I believe that KOS won't present much more of a problem than Hughes (in terms of wrestling) - if any. Hughes is a great test in the field for anyone, and GSP certainly proved his worth there.


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

wukkadb said:


> Matt Hughes and Sean Sherk are both excellent wrestlers with good take downs, I take back what I said before. BUT, Kos is still much better than both of them. I don't think that he has faced anyone with GOOD TD defense yet, but he's been a successful wrestler for a very long time, and I think they have good TD defense, maybe not though?


Thank you wukkladb.:thumbsup: Repped for a good answer! Listen, I'm not saying it impossible for Koscheck to win this fight or even take GSP down. I read his bio and I know he is a good wrestler. But its not going to be an easy fight for Kos. I think GSP TD defense and crisp striking skills will cause a problem for Kos and ultimatly win him (GSP) the match! That is my view!


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## wukkadb (Jan 1, 2007)

Bonnar426 said:


> Thank you wukkladb.:thumbsup: Repped for a good answer! Listen, I'm not saying it impossible for Koscheck to win this fight or even take GSP down. I read his bio and I know he is a good wrestler. But its not going to be an easy fight for Kos. I think GSP TD defense and crisp striking skills will cause a problem for Kos and ultimatly win him (GSP) the match! That is my view!


I 100% agree, however I think GSP will end up on his back at least once and I guarantee Kos will be on his back :thumbsup:


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## LivingDedMan (May 10, 2007)

Good news! This will be a good fight.


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

1. Kos will take GSP down.
2. GSP has overrated hands.


Kos is better than GSP on the feet and on the ground!


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## herton17 (Sep 13, 2006)

Youre right. KOS's record of fighters he's beaten clearly shows his dominance in the sport in the WW division. Please.

Get off your high horse and give the man the respect he deserves.


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

herton17 said:


> Get off your high horse and give the man the respect he deserves.


Ill get off if you get off GSP's ****. The guy is good but really just hype. Of course you gonna look like a good striker when you put him in there with Sherk and Hughes. Kos will destroy him.


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## LivingDedMan (May 10, 2007)

Kos won't destroy GSP, as if. GSP will KO him IMO, but it'll be a good fight.


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## Grotty (Jul 21, 2006)

This is the best time for Koscheck to fight GSP , GSP will be less confident and KOscheck is an arrogant sod and believes more in himself after Sanchezs embarrasing fight.


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## greygoose (Dec 15, 2006)

Koscheck is going to win this one. Sorry Gsp fans. Kos it more Naturally athletic and is a bad match up for Gsp. IF he takes Gsp down he has the advantage. If he stands up it will be close but I think Kos is smart enough to come in with the right game plan. Kos in my opinion is the best wrestler in the ww division. Gsp stand up is overated, he is good but not great like everyone thinks. Gsp chin is questionable now. Matt Serra was able to knock him out and Matt Serra is not known to be a ko guy. I know anyone can get caught at any time but great strikers would not let this happen.


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## FunkYou (Apr 22, 2007)

greygoose said:


> I know anyone can get caught at any time but great strikers would not let this happen.


You right that anyone can get caught. And great strikers do get knocked out as well. Cro Cop for example.


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## DangerMouse666 (Jul 9, 2006)

kds13 said:


> Kos by split decision. This is a very even fight, and I think Koscheck's wrestling will be the difference. Kinda sad too, GSP is my boy, but I hate this match up for him. Its gonna be a tough fight.


What!? Kos is not on his level at all it will be an uneven fight. If it even goes all three rounds it will be UD for GSP. If Kos goes in the same as against Sanchez, GSP will pick him apart.


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

Ok, so far Kos has shown to have cleaner wrestling than Hughes. Hughes had a problem taking GSP down, but then again Hughes wrestling has gotten sloppy. I am not saying he still doesn't have the skill, but I am saying he has focused on so much else for so long that his wrestling isn't nearly as prevelent as it used to be. Kos's wrestling on the otherhand has been sharp, clean, and solid. I am sure if he stays in the game as long as Hughes the same thing will happen to him, but it hasn't yet. GSP does not have bad takedown defense, and I am pretty sure that Kos's first attempt will probably go bust because I don't think that GSP can just be grabbed and thrown down. You have to grab GSP during an exchange, or when he throws a kick. And Kos's wrestling ability doesn't only mean better takedowns, it also translates into getting out of guard and putting someone into a bad position easier.

I honestly see this fight going very late second or mid third. I can also see this fight going to a decision. I do feel that Kos will be put on his back at some point during this fight, and however he reacts will decide who wins. I am confident in Kos, and I think on his back he will pull a wicked guard, throw some blows from below, and it depends if he can control GSP while he is on top, which I think he can. Kos hates to be on his back, but it's not like he has never been there before.


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## cabby (Sep 15, 2006)

KOS ftw. As much as I like GSP I see Koscheck winning.


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## herton17 (Sep 13, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> Ill get off if you get off GSP's ****. The guy is good but really just hype. Of course you gonna look like a good striker when you put him in there with Sherk and Hughes. Kos will destroy him.


I m not on anyone's nuts. When I m trying to make a point, I argue it and try to support it with some sort of information that I know or have witnessed. You simply throw 'facts' out there that have no basis for truth. Whatever, Its kinda pointless arguing with someone who wont listen.


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## speedythief (Sep 23, 2006)

greygoose said:


> Koscheck is going to win this one. Sorry Gsp fans. Kos it more Naturally athletic and is a bad match up for Gsp. IF he takes Gsp down he has the advantage. If he stands up it will be close but I think Kos is smart enough to come in with the right game plan. Kos in my opinion is the best wrestler in the ww division. *Gsp stand up is overated, he is good but not great like everyone thinks. Gsp chin is questionable now.* Matt Serra was able to knock him out and Matt Serra is not known to be a ko guy. I know anyone can get caught at any time but great strikers would not let this happen.


The back of his head is what is vulnerable, but the same goes for any fighter. Serra didn't hit him on the button, that's not what happened in that fight. Have somebody clip you behind the ear and see how long it takes you to get rubbery legs. Not fun.

And for everyone saying GSP's stand-up is overrated, his striking is very technical. He doesn't come out and throw bombs like Riggs, Haynes, whoever. We didn't see much in his fight with Serra, it was a bad one, besides some swift Kyokushin high kicks, but he is better than that. It's not perfect--I think Penn got the better of the stand-up in their fight--but it is much better than most 170's.


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## herton17 (Sep 13, 2006)

GSP's standup has gotten better since the BJ fight, also. Remember, he is a very young guy. If he wants to use his jab and circle, he can avoid takedowns and score a unani for sure. But he'll knock KOS out...you ll see.


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## ozz525 (Oct 5, 2006)

It will be a great fight. I hope GSP wins, But I don't know.


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## jdun11 (Apr 23, 2006)

Kos by GnP stoppage in the 2nd round:thumbsup:,that KO loss to Serra did something mentally to GSP...u heard it here


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## Brydon (Jan 13, 2007)

"Also, being a better collegiate wrestler doesnt directly translate into being a better MMA wrestler. There are far too many variables in MMA to consider when going for a takedown, as opposed to a wrestling match. This is why I believe that KOS won't present much more of a problem than Hughes (in terms of wrestling) - if any. Hughes is a great test in the field for anyone, and GSP certainly proved his worth there" - Hereon 17

Your completly right here, since when does being a better collegiate wrestler mean your better at MMA e.g. Rashad knocking Salmon's head off even though Salmon beat him in college!

Koschecks standup looked terrible against Diego, no combo's and his chin was so far out it looked like he was tryin to kiss Diego rather than fight him.

Koschecks trains 90% stand up. That means his wrestling isnt that great any more as he barely trains it. I dont care if he used to be a superb wrestler if he's not training it now then its not gunna be that good. Also his GnP wont be much improved or his subs and more importantly in this fight his submission defence. There's to many aspects in MMA to spend 90% of your time training just stand up.

I hope GSP KO's koschecks crap talkin mouth, although seein Koscheck tap from a submission would be just as good.


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## IronMan (May 15, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> Ill get off if you get off GSP's ****. The guy is good but really just hype. Of course you gonna look like a good striker when you put him in there with Sherk and Hughes. Kos will destroy him.


Clearly, you are retarded, so let me lay this out for you so that you can understand this.

GSP has fought 3 quality wrestlers in his career 4 times. His record is 3-1, that one loss being to Matt Hughes, which he later avenged. He KO'd Sean Sherk (the only man in history ever to finish Sherk, and one of 2 to beat him) and Frank Trigg, who, though he is not the same caliber of wrestler that Kos is, does have a very similar fighting style. In his three wins (which were all three of his recent fight), he has smashed his opponents, none of those fights going past the 2nd round.

His 1 loss and other almost loss have been to submission guys, though not necessarily by submission. He prepared himself for a submission fight in both those cases (though probably more against Serra than against Penn, because of the added concern of BJ's striking ability) and obviously lost focus of what Serra was capable of standing up. This doesn't even play into his fight against Kos.

Alot of people think that GSP doesn't look like a strong guy, at least not the way that Kos does, but he is strong. He handled Hughes in the ring their last fight both by defending his takedowns and out striking him. Kos may be a better striker than Hughes, he may even be a better wrestler, but if you are going to tell me that Josh Koscheck is stronger than Matt Hughes (still the greatest welterweight champion in the history of the sport) then you are delusional.

Not only did GSP out muscle Hughes, who is stronger than Koscheck, but he prevented Hughes from doing exactly what Kos is going to try to do. Yes, Kos says that he will try and work kicks and we know that his striking is decent, but if he thinks that he can strike with GSP, he is going to find himself in the same situation Hughes did. He is going to find that he is getting smashed standing up and he's going to be so worn down after taking leg kicks, punches and possibly even a handful of knees, he's not even going to be able to out wrestle GSP.

What I'm saying is, this could go like the Matt Hughes fight, if Kos is dumb enough to believe that he can strike with GSP, or this could go like the Sherk fight, if Kos decides he doesn't want to strike with Rush and tries to take him down.

Kos needs to find a new way to fight GSP, because if he fights him the way that he has fought any other fight and comes in with that kind of game plan, he's going to get destroyed.


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## The Legend (Jun 13, 2006)

I only disagree with you on one thing and that is GSP does look strong when he comes out. Even though I like Kos a lot who besides Dirty Sanchez (who I think is overrated to an extent) has he fought that is on the level of people of GSP's level opponents?


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## Stapler (Nov 18, 2006)

IronMan said:


> Clearly, you are retarded, so let me lay this out for you so that you can understand this.
> 
> GSP has fought 3 quality wrestlers in his career 4 times. His record is 3-1, that one loss being to Matt Hughes, which he later avenged. He KO'd Sean Sherk (the only man in history ever to finish Sherk, and one of 2 to beat him) and Frank Trigg, who, though he is not the same caliber of wrestler that Kos is, does have a very similar fighting style. In his three wins (which were all three of his recent fight), he has smashed his opponents, none of those fights going past the 2nd round.
> 
> ...


I agree. I don't see Koscheck controlling Georges St. Pierre on the ground, St. Pierre has only really been finished by Matt Hughes on the ground and that was from an arm bar and i really dont see Koscheck even attempting one.

I don't count the Serra pounding him out loss, that only happened because Serra rocked him on the feet and he just couldnt recover, i dont think Koscheck will catch Georges with a huge shot on their feet, he hasn't really shown he has heavy hands in the past.

While we're on the this topic, I've been wondering what would happen if Koscheck fought Hughes. I think Hughes would win just because.. but ill admit Koscheck has better wrestling, better standup, and better takedowns..

I dunno, i just cant picture an inexperienced Koscheck with only one good name on his list of wins beating the most dominate welterweight champion of all time. :dunno:

Would be a sad day in MMA history indeed...


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

herton17 said:


> I m not on anyone's nuts. When I m trying to make a point, I argue it and try to support it with some sort of information that I know or have witnessed. You simply throw 'facts' out there that have no basis for truth. Whatever, Its kinda pointless arguing with someone who wont listen.


I never said these were 'facts' im just giving my own opinion. Its pretty hard to argue with someone who keeps repeating 'GSP has good TD defense' or 'Kos sucks'. You really havent said anything that will convince me that GSP will win or that he cant be taken down. Now go bother with someone else so we can get on with our lives.


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## Duffman (Mar 30, 2007)

*kos could take this one*

gsp has some great fights in his past but i think kos is on his way up and i feel like he could pull this one off with some wreslting


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## jdun11 (Apr 23, 2006)

Kos may not have the gorilla stregnth that Hughes has but his shot is so much more explosive. I have never seen his shot get stuffed EVER...GSP hasnt seen anything like it. Sherk has quick takedowns but Kos is a much bigger guy and he is simply a better wrestler. If Kos fights a smart fight he will win. If he thinks he is suddenly Chuck Liddell and tries to strike with GSP he WILL lose. But if he uses his takedowns and starts to elbow GSP than I see GSP getting rattled and losing the fight.


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## herton17 (Sep 13, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> I never said these were 'facts' im just giving my own opinion. Its pretty hard to argue with someone who keeps repeating 'GSP has good TD defense' or 'Kos sucks'. You really havent said anything that will convince me that GSP will win or that he cant be taken down. Now go bother with someone else so we can get on with our lives.


Buddy, I never said KOS sucks, okay? 

I, as Ironman stated, gave you examples of very good wrestlers that GSP made look mediocre: Sean Sherk, Matt Hughes and a great judo guy - Karo. 
You, on the other hand, seem to think that KOS's application of wrestling to MMA is far beyond what Hughes' and Sherk's is, and that's fine; you can believe whatever you want. KOS is a great wrestler, but he is still green in terms of MMA. Hughes and Sherk are season vets. I realize you re probably too young to have watched much MMA before TUFs and I dont condemn you for that, but you have to learn to realize that just because ROgan said : "KOS is a better wrestler than Hughes" it doesnt mean he is gonna make GSP look like an idiot in the ring. Ask Rogan whom he'd put his money on in an MMA match - Hughes or KOS. Most of us know its Hughes. 
This is the last comment I am making to you regarding this topic, I m done wasting my time convincing someone of something they choose not to be convinced of.


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## jdun11 (Apr 23, 2006)

IMPALED 666 said:


> :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
> I would love to sig bet with you


I bet you thought Diego was gonna kill Kos too right :thumbsdown:


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## Wise (Oct 8, 2006)

Hughes did come into the second fight with a terrible game plan though. By the time he tried to resort to going for the shoot he had eaten so many leg kicks that he had no power behind them. Sherk on the other hand did pretty much did the opposite terrible thing of that and thats just blatantly do nothing but try for takedowns. If Kos is going to take this hes going to have to come out VERY aggresive with his stand up and use it to set up his take downs instead of just diving at GSP from outside. If Kos tries to fight GSP like he did Diego he is going to get punished, hopefully hell come out with said above strat though.


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## Bliz (Apr 22, 2007)

I think GSP is probably the most over-rated fighter in MMA today and is undeservingly praised because his fighting style. He lost to Hughes cleanly and lost to Serra whether his "head was out of it" or not. In my opinion, he lost to BJ Penn, too, but that's debatable. On the other hand, he is a great fighter that could beat any welterweight in the world when he's on his game. It is my opinion, however, that Josh Koscheck is quickly climbing the ladder to the top of the WW division and that he will beat GSP. Anyone who is under the impression that GSP is going to coast through this one needs to replay the Serra tape.


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

Bliz said:


> I think GSP is probably the most over-rated fighter in MMA today and is undeservingly praised because his fighting style. He lost to Hughes cleanly and lost to Serra whether his "head was out of it" or not. In my opinion, he lost to BJ Penn, too, but that's debatable. On the other hand, he is a great fighter that could beat any welterweight in the world when he's on his game. It is my opinion, however, that Josh Koscheck is quickly climbing the ladder to the top of the WW division and that he will beat GSP. Anyone who is under the impression that GSP is going to coast through this one needs to replay the Serra tape.


I agree 100%. I hate when all this nuthugging for GSP going on its hilarious. Kos will dominate him worse than Serra.


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## benn (Dec 4, 2006)

WOW

Koschek beats Diego and all of a sudden he has one of the best stand ups in the world?

Better yet we all should call GSP a can!!!!


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## FunkYou (Apr 22, 2007)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> I agree 100%. I hate when all this nuthugging for GSP going on its hilarious. Kos will dominate him worse than Serra.



Aren't you doing exactly the same thing for Kos. The fact is you have two fighters who are near the top of their division and it will hopefully be a good close fight. IMO it is too close to call definitely one way or the other.


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## raymardo (Jun 21, 2006)

TYKIDD said:


> I don't agree. I can't think of any fights GSP has finished with a sub against top ranked opponets. Or any opponents for that matter.


Frank Trigg.


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

benn said:


> WOW
> 
> Koschek beats Diego and all of a sudden he has one of the best stand ups in the world?
> 
> Better yet we all should call GSP a can!!!!


:laugh: I wonder how many of the Koschek bandwagon-hoppers were calling GSP unstoppable before the Serra fight.
It's funny...when St. Pierre was being called one of the best pound-for-pound fighters in the world a few months back, I don't remember too many people in this forum disagreeing.


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## FunkYou (Apr 22, 2007)

vandalian said:


> :laugh: I wonder how many of the Koschek bandwagon-hoppers were calling GSP unstoppable before the Serra fight.
> It's funny...when St. Pierre was being called one of the best pound-for-pound fighters in the world a few months back, I don't remember too many people in this forum disagreeing.


And the ones who did most definitely didn't throw Koschecks name into the hat.


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## sicc (Mar 4, 2007)

I'm one of the few, but I honestly think KOS can beat GSP.


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## wukkadb (Jan 1, 2007)

Bliz said:


> I think GSP is probably the most over-rated fighter in MMA today and is undeservingly praised because his fighting style. He lost to Hughes cleanly and lost to Serra whether his "head was out of it" or not. In my opinion, he lost to BJ Penn, too, but that's debatable. On the other hand, he is a great fighter that could beat any welterweight in the world when he's on his game. It is my opinion, however, that Josh Koscheck is quickly climbing the ladder to the top of the WW division and that he will beat GSP. Anyone who is under the impression that GSP is going to coast through this one needs to replay the Serra tape.


He lost to Hughes cleanly? That round was very close, with GSP landing more hits and a very good spinning back kick, then he got arm-barred with 1 second left. If GSP would of held on and tried to defend it instead of tapping immediately, he would of won that fight. I'm not a huge fan of GSP personally, but I think you have to give him respect/credit when it's due. In two years he beat(in a convincing fashion): Karo, Jay Hieron, Mayhem, Frank Trigg(when he was considered #2 WW), Sherk, and Hughes. Come on now.


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## kamikaze145 (Oct 3, 2006)

what is up with all of the GSP bashing going on? He lost a fight so everything else he has ever accomplished is unimportant and since Kos beat Diego Sanchez in a stand up fight then he is the man? Beating Diego is a solid accomplishment and I will give Kos credit. But if outpointing him in a fight that was mostly spent on the feet makes him better than GSP than I disagree. I really think GSP is going to make everyone remember why he was so respected before his fight with Serra. I for one, still have GSP ranked #1 at WW. I have Kos at 4.


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## Kameleon (Apr 20, 2006)

*GSP should walk through Kos. I'll give Kos his credit by beating Diego but I don't see Kos beating GSP.*


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## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

kamikaze145 said:


> what is up with all of the GSP bashing going on?


I honestly don't know. It seems like they have all come out of the woodwork ever since Serra beat him.


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## smooth810 (Apr 13, 2007)

Kos wins this by takedown....He will pound him out...


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## kamikaze145 (Oct 3, 2006)

I was just reading some posts, i think about jens and bj and some people were making sig bets, i think we need to make a sig bet on this one. Any takers?


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## jdun11 (Apr 23, 2006)

This fight is simple, if Kos can take GSP down he wins. If he cant he will get KTFO. 

End of discussion.


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> I agree 100%. I hate when all this nuthugging for GSP going on its hilarious. Kos will dominate him worse than Serra.


Your the last person on this forum to be accusing others of nutthuggery. Your practically swinging off of Josh Koschecks nuts like a kid who swings off a rope tied to a tree branch. 

You hadn't made one solid arguement on why Kos would run threw GSP other then "Joe Rogan says Kos is a better wrestler then Matt Hughes!" Newb!


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## jdun11 (Apr 23, 2006)

IMPALED 666 said:


> KOS wont take him down


ahahahah noone can stop Kos' takedowns...Noone ever has and noone ever will:cheeky4:


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

jdun11 said:


> This fight is simple, if Kos can take GSP down he wins. If he cant he will get KTFO.
> 
> End of discussion.


Jdun11, I consider you to be a very intelligent poster. I posted this same question to another poster, who was obviously just a nutthugger, and I wanted your take on it? Which of these fights gave you the impression that Koscheck can break threw GSP TD defense? Which one of those fighters had solid TD defense? 
Diego Sanchez Decision (Unanimous) 
Win Jeff Joslin Decision (Unanimous) 
Win Jonathan Goulet Submission (Strikes) 
Win Dave Menne Decision (Unanimous) 
Win Ansar Chalangov Submission (Rear Naked Choke) 
Loss Drew Fickett Technical Submission ( 
Win Pete Spratt Submission (Rear Naked Choke) 
Win Chris Sanford KO (Punch) 
Win Luke Cummo Decision (Unanimous) 
Win Cruz Chacon Submission (Neck Crank)


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## speedythief (Sep 23, 2006)

Kos's win over Jon Goulet was outstanding. Goulet is a middle of the pack fighter who crushed Luke Cummo. He trains with GSP and has a similiar style with the frantic pace he pushes and the emphasis on big forearms and elbows in the ground-and-pound. Koscheck took him down and destroyed him.

But Goulet isn't the BJJ and wrestling fighter that GSP is. When Koscheck fought Jeff Joslin, at one point Joslin slipped him into a triangle choke. Immediately Koscheck panicked and looked into his corner with a "deer in the headlights" expression. I think the round ended so he got out.

I for sure think Kos has talent and he is going to be a tough match for GSP, but he didn't get tested against Sanchez. He hasn't fought Parysian or Hughes or Penn. The step up in competition is going to be tremendous, especially coupled with the fact that St. Pierre is going to be trying to avenge his last bur-form-ance like a madman.

I don't see this fight ending by knock-out, though. Either referee stoppage from ground-and-pound or a unanimous decision.


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## ID06 (Dec 31, 2006)

Damone said:


> I honestly don't know. It seems like they have all come out of the woodwork ever since Serra beat him.


Just like the Gonzaga fans after he beat Cro Cop

Anyone seem to notice a trend here?


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## Wise (Oct 8, 2006)

Damone said:


> I honestly don't know. It seems like they have all come out of the woodwork ever since Serra beat him.


Its almost a fair trade with the people who thought GSP was an invincible god before the loss.


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

Wise said:


> Its almost a fair trade with the people who thought GSP was an invincible god before the loss.


I wonder what people will say when it comes time for Fedor to lose?:dunno:


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

Bonnar426 said:


> Your the last person on this forum to be accusing others of nutthuggery. Your practically swinging off of Josh Koschecks nuts like a kid who swings off a rope tied to a tree branch.
> 
> You hadn't made one solid arguement on why Kos would run threw GSP other then "Joe Rogan says Kos is a better wrestler then Matt Hughes!" Newb!



Oh the irony. :laugh:

The stuff youve been saying makes you look like your hopping up and down on GSP **** like a pogo stick. 

Find one post where i have been 'swinging' on his balls? None. I have only stated that Kos is a bad style for GSP and will beat him. Ive given you arguments that he is a better wrestler and how GSP is has ovverrated stand up but you ignore them in your posts. Noobert.


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## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

> I wonder what people will say when it comes time for Fedor to lose?:dunno:


"Fedor's a can"

"See, I told you that Fedor was overrated!"

"Fedor hasn't beaten anyone good"

"Fedor only looked good beating cans"

"Pride fighters suck lolzzzz!"

"lol at people thinking Fedor was unbeatable. I told you all along that he'd lose!"

"Fedor was nothing more than a rope grabbing cheater! Lindland would've beaten him if he hadn't grabbed the ropes!"

On & on. MMA fans are sort of annoying.


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## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

Fedor won't be beaten, he'll come to the UFC eventually, destroy everyone that he fights and retire the greatest warrior the world has ever known. Don't hate me because I tell it like it is! :laugh:


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## Rated (Nov 25, 2006)

I love how all the trolls come out from underneath their bridges after St. Pierre lose to Serra. I know St. Pierre is a bad match-up for Koscheck, but the same could be said for Koscheck as well. Even though Koscheck is a great wrestler, St. Pierre is no slouch either. If St. Pierre fights Koscheck like he did against Trigg's he will win (i.e. he needs to surprise Koscheck and put him on his back).


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## Brydon (Jan 13, 2007)

Im up for a sig bet. I dont know how though so someones gunna have to tell me. Im goin for GSP to win.


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## southpaw447 (Mar 21, 2007)

GSP by 3rd round Stoppage or 1st round KO


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

vandalian said:


> :laugh: I wonder how many of the Koschek bandwagon-hoppers were calling GSP unstoppable before the Serra fight.
> It's funny...when St. Pierre was being called one of the best pound-for-pound fighters in the world a few months back, I don't remember too many people in this forum disagreeing.


I am not a bandwagon-hopper, I thought Kos would beat Diego, hell I bet my sig on it and won. I, like 99.9% of the people, just counted Serra out and was surprised when he won. But that did not make me forgot what GSP has done or accomplished. I said it when we had this same thread almost a month ago that if GSP fought anyone else I think he would win. I just think style wise that Kos is a bad match for him. I will not be devistated if GSP wins, that means he came up with a game plan and it worked, but GSP seems to use very little in the way of game plans and goes into the ring and lets his talent and training do the work. The problem is when you fight an opponent who knows their weaknesses (sp?) and makes a plan so that they don't matter and you don't have a plan to make them matter than he no longer has any disadvantages. 

I do not see this fight being a blow out one way or another. I see this fight being a rough fight where both mens chins are going to get tested. Both mens TD will get tested. In the end I see a very late second round, or mid third round GnP stoppage by Kos. Although it could easily be a Decision in which it could go either way. GSP has a history of doing well with points in rounds, so if I was Kos I would make sure I finished the fight.

BTW I think it is funny that both of these men hate to train with weights, they prefer to train and get strong off of their opponents.


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## ufcrules (Jan 11, 2007)

Given what's happened over the last few months in the UFC, either guy could take this. They're both good fighters. If I had to pick a guy, I'm saying GSP by KO in 2. KOS standup looks like it has improved a TON. Diego was scared to move inside for a reason. I still think GSP will outclass him standing though. He learned his lesson vs serra on not being aggressive enough. GO GSP!


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## e-thug (Jan 18, 2007)

Im hoping for the love of entertainment that GSP wins. Kos was really cautious against Sanchez, so what is this going to be like?? 





Bonnar426 said:


> Jdun11, I consider you to be a very intelligent poster. I posted this same question to another poster, who was obviously just a nutthugger, and I wanted your take on it? Which of these fights gave you the impression that Koscheck can break threw GSP TD defense? Which one of those fighters had solid TD defense?
> Diego Sanchez Decision (Unanimous)
> Win Jeff Joslin Decision (Unanimous)
> Win Jonathan Goulet Submission (Strikes)
> ...



Bonnar this is an excellent point! you get repped for that.:thumbsup:


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## jdun11 (Apr 23, 2006)

e-thug said:


> Im hoping for the love of entertainment that GSP wins. Kos was really cautious against Sanchez, so what is this going to be like??
> 
> 
> 
> ...


But Kos has never had his shot stuffed...EVER.. So it doesnt really matter who hes faught. All his opponents prepare to stop the takedown but they cant. If Kos makes a bunch of attempts I guarantee hed gets the take down


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## benn (Dec 4, 2006)

jdun11 said:


> But Kos has never had his shot stuffed...EVER.. So it doesnt really matter who hes faught. All his opponents prepare to stop the takedown but they cant. If Kos makes a bunch of attempts I guarantee hed gets the take down




Soo,

what are ya tryna say?


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## histrung (Apr 22, 2007)

speedythief said:


> When Koscheck fought Jeff Joslin, at one point Joslin slipped him into a triangle choke. Immediately Koscheck panicked and looked into his corner with a "deer in the headlights" expression. I think the round ended so he got out.
> 
> I for sure think Kos has talent and he is going to be a tough match for GSP, but he didn't get tested against Sanchez. He hasn't fought Parysian or Hughes or Penn. The step up in competition is going to be tremendous, especially coupled with the fact that St. Pierre is going to be trying to avenge his last bur-form-ance like a madman.


Excellent point..

When the bell rings, school will be in session for Koscheck and GSP will be a very good teacher.

Just my .02

And as Chucky Liddel says, being a great wrestler is one thing, but being a great wrestler when your getting hit in the face is something totally different.


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

jdun11 said:


> But Kos has never had his shot stuffed...EVER.. So it doesnt really matter who hes faught. All his opponents prepare to stop the takedown but they cant. If Kos makes a bunch of attempts I guarantee hed gets the take down


Exactly what i was saying. Repped. Has GSP been taken down before? Yes. Has Kos ever had his takedowns stopped? No. Its academic. A 3 year old to figure it out.


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## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> Exactly what i was saying. Repped. Has GSP been taken down before? Yes. Has Kos ever had his takedowns stopped? No. Its academic. A 3 year old to figure it out.


That makes no sense.

Just because Kos hasnt been taken down before in the past does NOT make it academic in the future.

IMHO, Kos hasnt fought anyone like GSP before... this fight will be a reality check for fans of either fighter.


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## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

One_Love said:


> KOS will get KO'd
> 
> thats a fact


...hmmm... i gonna differ there...

I think it will go do the decision... and GSP will take it.

I see GSP sitting back more this time, waiting for Kos to bring it to him. He will keep a greater distance between the 2 of them so that he can see the shot better...
I see GSP moving around alot... working leg kicks on Kos just like Hughes... waitin for the opportunities...

I think Kos will try to do the same, score points on punches... avoiding the takedown...

but this is where GSP will win, cause GSP has better standup... IMHO.

... it will go the distance, UD to GSP


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## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

I'm predicting GSP to win via split decision.


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## libertywrestler (Sep 24, 2006)

koscheck by unanimous decision


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## libertywrestler (Sep 24, 2006)

histrung said:


> Excellent point..
> 
> When the bell rings, school will be in session for Koscheck and GSP will be a very good teacher.
> 
> ...


to bad for gsp that kos is an amazing wrestler no matter what's going on, he can just take gsp down and beat on him if he wants


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

With all this buzz in here already, sounds like UFC's got a winner either way.


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## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

libertywrestler said:


> to bad for gsp that kos is an amazing wrestler no matter what's going on, he can just take gsp down and beat on him if he wants


thats a good point... but I think that experience will work against him... old habits being hard to break...

thats where GSP's bjj will come in handy and why I think Kos will prolly want to keep it standing up

if he truly was unmatched on the mat, why didnt he take Diego there? ... cause he knew that was a bad move, better to out box him...

it wont be that clear cut vs GSP... 
Standing or on the mat, there is no clear victory for him vs GSP


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

vandalian said:


> With all this buzz in here already, sounds like UFC's got a winner either way.


Agreed. The only other fight getting this much debate and attention is Liddell vs Rampage. Obviously the UFC is starting to get its match making skills back!


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## histrung (Apr 22, 2007)

libertywrestler said:


> to bad for gsp that kos is an amazing wrestler no matter what's going on, he can just take gsp down and beat on him if he wants


I think GSP will win, but more than anything I just want to see a good fight. 




vandalian said:


> With all this buzz in here already, sounds like UFC's got a winner either way.


Agreed. I'm excited about the fight. Hope it lives up to the hype!


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## Chunkyluv360 (Jan 29, 2007)

attention said:


> thats a good point... but I think that experience will work against him... old habits being hard to break...
> 
> thats where GSP's bjj will come in handy and why I think Kos will prolly want to keep it standing up
> 
> ...


I havent seen GSP submit anyone accept Trigg. Also GSP doesnt have a huge experience factor over Kos if anything Kos has an experience factor since hes been wrestling longer than GSP. My prediction: Kos is gonna kill him.


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## frankinaug (Jul 12, 2006)

I think Kos has a wrestling advantage over GSP but not a huge one. GSP has exhibited excellent takedown defense against Hughes. I think one thing that excities me about this fight is that we have guys with excellent cardio whose styles match up in an interesting manner. The UFC did a good job with this fight match up.


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## Grotty (Jul 21, 2006)

This is potentially a good matchup, both have strengths in their game so it will be interesting to see who takes what stance, plus GSP is coming of a loss so lets see how this affects him good or bad?


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## adminmma (Apr 10, 2006)

I truly hope GSP wins. I'm not a fan of Kos, and GSP losing to him would be like a knife in the chest. :laugh: 

But we shall see. If GSP sticks with the same gameplan he had against Hughes i could see him winning. Stay to the outside, leg kicks until Kos doesn't want to stand up anymore.


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## kamikaze145 (Oct 3, 2006)

Even though KOS has improved on his feet i think GSP will bring out his bad habits and exploit him in the stand up game. I am really looking forward to seeing who is stronger.


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## MHughesbestever (May 15, 2007)

If GSP doesnt win where does he go next?


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## herton17 (Sep 13, 2006)

herton17 said:


> Yeah man....KOS is the kinda guy that will go in there and knock GSP out. LOL
> GSP is not Diego, and KOS won't be able to just stand there and box. GSP's striking skills are much crisper and he is much more experienced in the stand-up game. I realize KOS has learnt a lot and mainly works on his stand-up, but he is not quite there yet.
> 
> That being said, KOS is gonna have to go for the takedown. How well he can execute it? I dunno. GSP is one strong mofo and KOS is one of the best wrestlers in the game.
> ...


I think this is a pretty legit post...Why the neg-rep for it?


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## benn (Dec 4, 2006)

benn said:


> Soo,
> 
> what are ya tryna say?




I get a neg rep for asking this question.:thumbsdown: 



I think I know who it would be.


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## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

Chunkyluv360 said:


> I havent seen GSP submit anyone accept Trigg. Also GSP doesnt have a huge experience factor over Kos if anything Kos has an experience factor since hes been wrestling longer than GSP. My prediction: Kos is gonna kill him.


Its not about getting the sub... its about shutting down all that your opponent has to offer... taking him outta his comfort zone and force him to make mistakes...

Kos has been wresting longer ... fair enuf.

GSP has a proven track record vs elite wrestlers and BJJ:
Hughes, BJ, Trigg, Sherk, Mayhem, Karo... 

Now, how about Kos? who has he fought that is even close to the calibre of GSP? Diego? Diego doesnt strike the way GSP does...

*Im getting neg rep'd as well for not being a Kos nuthugger


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## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

neg rep'd again by some coward that is afraid to leave their name...

next time grow a pair and sign it 

you are one seriously pathetic Kos nuthugger


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## kamikaze145 (Oct 3, 2006)

attention said:


> Its not about getting the sub... its about shutting down all that your opponent has to offer... taking him outta his comfort zone and force him to make mistakes...
> 
> Kos has been wresting longer ... fair enuf.
> 
> ...


I agree, there is no reason to believe KOS will smash GSP. GSP is not exactly a slouch in the wrestling game in case no one has noticed


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## helix2301 (Apr 17, 2007)

*KOS vs GSP*

I have to say I am a big fan of both these guys KOS is one of my all time favorites on the ground he will put up a fight standing GSP has a big advantage. But that is in Augest KOS could improve his standup greatly by then. KOS is training 80% standup because wrestling is like second nature to him. GO KOS and GO GSP will be a great fight.


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## histrung (Apr 22, 2007)

Im my opinion, wrestling and bjj are two entirely different beasts. Just because your a state champion wrestler doesn't automatically translate into the octagon. It certainly helps and is an excellent platform for a ground and pound type of fighter, but to compare the two.. I'd take the bjj fighter over the wrestler.

If being a great wrestler was all that it took, them Matt Hamill would be a contender in the light heavyweight division.

This is not a knock on KOS for his wrestling, I just don't see the logic that KOS fans use his wrestling skill for being a contender when the rest of his game needs work. 

GSP is a better ALL round fighter than KOS, that is why he will win.

And for my neg rep, being a GSP ball licker is better than a KOS ball licker. :cheeky4:


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## ufcrules (Jan 11, 2007)

histrung said:


> And for my neg rep, being a GSP ball licker is better than a KOS ball licker. :cheeky4:


Do we really have to lick anyones balls??:laugh: GSP should hammer KOS but after Serra, I have questions about GSPs jaw. He took a few pretty good shots but got severely hurt with a shot that didn't look all that nasty. Hoping that isn't a trend with him.


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## brief (Nov 19, 2006)

It would be pretty funny if Kos pulled off another snooze win, blanket style, against GSP. Funny if you think how frustrated GSP would be if he lost again, and in such a manner.


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## Mr. Mayhem (May 6, 2007)

asskicker said:


> Well he got about the easiest fight anyones ever had to defend a title and he blew that.


 Please don't remind me


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

vandalian said:


> With all this buzz in here already, sounds like UFC's got a winner either way.


Why the hell would somebody neg rep me for that?:dunno: 
OK, that's just confusing...


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## kamikaze145 (Oct 3, 2006)

all this talk about GSP vs. KOS is getting me pumped up lol I cant wait


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## hollando (Apr 11, 2007)

would these ****ers just sign on the dotted line already


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## southpaw447 (Mar 21, 2007)

Anybody for a sig bet? I'm taking St Pierre!


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