# Carter Williams tests positive for Cocaine



## Punishment 101 (May 4, 2006)

*A statement released today by the California State Athletic Commision noted, "Carter Williams, who last competed for Strikeforce/EliteXC on June 22, 2007 in San Jose, has tested positive for Cocaine. He has been fined $1,000. His suspension began at the conclusion of his bout on June 22, 2007 and will run through December 19, 2007."*



*SOURCE:* MMA WEEKLY - Your #1 Source for Daily MMA News, Interviews, Multimedia, and More


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## UFCFAN33 (May 29, 2006)

Man you would think the fighters are smart enough to know that they will be tested. Its ashame that they cant get their act together and get off drugs. I guess drugs are more important then their mma career!


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

It's crap though. Cocaine won't help you win a fight,just like marijuana.


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## ozz525 (Oct 5, 2006)

He kind of looks like a Coke head dosen't he? lol


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## ShadyNismo (Jun 18, 2007)

UFCFAN33 said:


> Man you would think the fighters are smart enough to know that they will be tested. Its ashame that they cant get their act together and get off drugs. I guess drugs are more important then their mma career!


fo real.. what a idiot man..


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> It's crap though. Cocaine won't help you win a fight,just like marijuana.


 Are you suggesting that fighters should be allowed to fight while on cocaine?


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## SnakePit (Mar 4, 2007)

UFCFAN33 said:


> Man you would think the fighters are smart enough to know that they will be tested. Its ashame that they cant get their act together and get off drugs. I guess drugs are more important then their mma career!


Dude, damn right. 

Plus, cocaine is so easy to get out of your system. It's gone in 72 hours. 

Very simple... don't do your lines within 5 days (2 extra to be safe) of the fight and when they test you after the fight (the only time they test you, lol), you pass. Then go back to hittin' the rock. 

Then again, these guys don't really get punished so what's it.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

jasvll said:


> Are you suggesting that fighters should be allowed to fight while on cocaine?


Nobody is allowed to do anything while on cocaine, it is illegal.
But I just don't get Athletic commisions fining people and suspending them for definately non-performance enhancing drugs. If I had the choice to fight someone on cocaine, or someone clean, I'd fight the cokehead, and probably kick his ass.


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## Josh3239 (Mar 4, 2007)

SAC should punish athletes when they are using drugs for the simple reason that they are using a substance that is both illegal in this country and banned from the sport. They know the law, they know what is not allowed, they know they will be drug tested. If they are to stupid to cut it out for the drug test, they deserve IMO to have their entire purse fined.

Cocain kills pain and makes people hyperactive... good luck.


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## the real hitman (Nov 24, 2006)

TheNegation said:


> Nobody is allowed to do anything while on cocaine, it is illegal.
> But I just don't get Athletic commisions fining people and suspending them for definately non-performance enhancing drugs. If I had the choice to fight someone on cocaine, or someone clean, I'd fight the cokehead, and probably kick his ass.


People on coke feel no pain


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## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

I want to watch athletes fight in the octagon, not street scum, that's what bumfights are for.. send Carter Williams and Melvin Guillard there.


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## southpaw447 (Mar 21, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> It's crap though. Cocaine won't help you win a fight,just like marijuana.


Actaully cocaine could help you in a fight if you think about it. Cocaine is one of the biggest and most powerful stimulants ever. But considering the effects could only last from 20 minutes to a couple of hours I doubt it would have helped him anyway. It's also been proven that not even steroids nor testosterone boosters can give you an deciet advantage in a fight. 

But it is against the law and the fighters who do it are giving the sport a bad rep.


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## southpaw447 (Mar 21, 2007)

the real hitman said:


> People on coke feel no pain


I think you've seen Scarface too many times. Just because you can't feel pain doesn't mean you won't taste canvas from a hard shot.


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## Josh3239 (Mar 4, 2007)

Actually, cocain used to be used in medicine as a pain killer. While, your not gonna become Tony Montana, it will sure kill the pain.


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## southpaw447 (Mar 21, 2007)

But like i said you could be on every pain killer or stimulant during a fight but you can't control what happens to you when you get smacked on your jaw.


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## the real hitman (Nov 24, 2006)

southpaw447 said:


> I think you've seen Scarface too many times. Just because you can't feel pain doesn't mean you won't taste canvas from a hard shot.


Im comparing being on coke vs being sober


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## TheNamesNelson (Dec 31, 2006)

Most employers drug test, and if theres any accident on the job you can bet you will be getting a drug test following that accident.

Just because your job is MMA doesnt mean you should be free of all consequences. Think of the fight as your accident at work, and think of the athletic commission as your employer giving you a drug test. Cocaine is harmful, so he should be thanking them for the discipline.


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## Punishment 101 (May 4, 2006)

TheNamesNelson said:


> Most employers drug test, and if theres any accident on the job you can bet you will be getting a drug test following that accident.
> 
> Just because your job is MMA doesnt mean you should be free of all consequences. Think of the fight as your accident at work, and think of the athletic commission as your employer giving you a drug test. Cocaine is harmful, so he should be thanking them for the discipline.


I completely agree. well said :thumbsup:


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## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> Nobody is allowed to do anything while on cocaine, it is illegal.
> But I just don't get Athletic commisions fining people and suspending them for definately non-performance enhancing drugs. If I had the choice to fight someone on cocaine, or someone clean, I'd fight the cokehead, and probably kick his ass.


Haha :thumbsup: 

Anybody who's trying to honestly say that fighting on coke will help performance needs to try coke.


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## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

TheNamesNelson said:


> *Most employers drug test*, and if theres any accident on the job you can bet you will be getting a drug test following that accident.
> 
> Just because your job is MMA doesnt mean you should be free of all consequences. Think of the fight as your accident at work, and think of the athletic commission as your employer giving you a drug test. Cocaine is harmful, so he should be thanking them for the discipline.


Ive had about 7 jobs (Im 21) and not a single one drug tested.


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## AstroBouncer (Jan 4, 2007)

Working at mac donalds and the like isnt considered a job.


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## GodlyMoose (May 20, 2007)

Do they for some reason think that they're some how NOT going fail the drug tests?:confused02:


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## southpaw447 (Mar 21, 2007)

the real hitman said:


> Im comparing being on coke vs being sober


I know but even if you were under the influence during a fight, not feeling pain is one thing but you can;t control how you're brain responds to a punch and not even a drug can do that because the human head wasn't constructed to be hit.


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## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

AstroBouncer said:


> Working at mac donalds and the like isnt considered a job.


That was a really intelligent answer to my post ******* repped :thumbsup: 

Ive worked as waitor, as salesman, as front desk guy of a HUGE timeshare, construction, at a bank at a radio station and at a department store

None of the employees at any of those places were drug tested.


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## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

GodlyMoose said:


> Do they for some reason think that they're some how NOT going fail the drug tests?:confused02:


These people failing for coke are retarded. That shit's out of your system normally within 4 or 5 days, 10 at the absolute ******* most.


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## NikosCC (May 16, 2007)

*Williams Tests Positive for Cocaine*



> Former K-1 USA Grand Prix champion Carter Williams (Pictures) tested positive for cocaine following his stoppage loss on the co-promoted Strikeforce-EliteXC card June 22 in San Jose, Calif., the California State Athletic Commission revealed Wednesday afternoon.
> 
> The striker looked in poor condition prior to his fight with Paul Buentello (Pictures), and he offered a poor performance. Buentello (23-9-0) fended off uncharacteristic takedown attempts by Williams (3-2-0) before knocking out the heavyweight from Modesto, Calif. 10 seconds into round two.
> 
> ...


http://www.shitdog.com/news/news.asp?n_id=8118


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

There is no way in hell not feeling pain and being hyperactive can help someone in a professional fight!
You woulsd dive straight into a punch because you were hyperactive, and if you got put in an arm bar or choke not feeling pain wouldn't help you one bit.


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> There is no way in hell not feeling pain and being hyperactive can help someone in a professional fight!
> You woulsd dive straight into a punch because you were hyperactive, and if you got put in an arm bar or choke not feeling pain wouldn't help you one bit.


 Can you not control the flow of stupidity or are you simply unaware of its existence?


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

jasvll said:


> Can you not control the flow of stupidity or are you simply unaware of its existence?


Explain?


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> Explain?


 Ah, the answer presents itself.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

jasvll said:


> Ah, the answer presents itself.


Come on now, how is what I said stupid?


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> Come on now, how is what I said stupid?


 The fact that you have to ask precludes you from an understanding of the explanation.

It's the equivalent of asking how people know how to avoid hot surfaces while your hand is sizzling on a stove top.


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## SouthernStud (Jun 26, 2007)

gwabblesore said:


> Ive had about 7 jobs (Im 21) and not a single one drug tested.


what kind of jobs did you have??? the local grocery store? any job that you make decent money and is important will drug test you.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

jasvll said:


> The fact that you have to ask precludes you from an understanding of the explanation.
> 
> It's the equivalent of asking how people know how to avoid hot surfaces while your hand is sizzling on a stove top.


You seem to be the one arguing that being on cocaine would be an advantage in a pro MMA fight, so please explain how, and why what I saidd was stupid.


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> You seem to be the one arguing that being on cocaine would be an advantage in a pro MMA fight, so please explain how,


 I never argued that. I argued that fighters who test positive for cocaine should be punished. You continue to argue otherwise, which suggests your hand is still on the stove.

Whether or not it's performance-enhancing is irrelevant, because it is clearly performance-altering, and puts the fighter at a greater risk in the ring, and last time I checked, one of the athletic commissions' primary functions was the protection of fighters.



> and why what I saidd was stupid.


 Not until you take your hand off the stove.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

jasvll said:


> I never argued that. I argued that fighters who test positive for cocaine should be punished. You continue to argue otherwise, which suggests your hand is still on the stove.
> 
> Whether or not it's performance-enhancing is irrelevant, because it is clearly performance-altering, and puts the fighter at a greater risk in the ring, and last time I checked, one of the athletic commissions' primary functions was the protection of fighters.
> 
> Not until you take your hand off the stove.


Then you and me aren't on the same page at all you retard. That post was about why being on cocaine wouldn't help you in a fight. It was a response to the people who said 'you feel no pain on coke' when I said I would rather fight a coke head than a sober fighter. For **** sake.
What I may or may not think about drugs in sport was not presented in that post. And maybe when I said I would like to beat up a crackhead, maybe, just maybe you might have thought 'This man could possibly be joking'. Or even the other thread when I said I wanted to see Jay Cutler fight Pete Doherty, maybe that might have been a clue?


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## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

The fact is cocaine and marijuana are NOT performance enhancing drugs. They would NOT help you in a fight. No ******* way. I promise, anybody who says otherwise is just plain wrong.

For this reason I think that steroids should be penalized more harshly than pot or coke.

There should be a penalty for coke because raising your heart rate like that going into a fight, which also raises your heart rate, is not safe. Itd be comparable to doing _more_ coke and your heart freaking out would be like a coke overdose.

Pot on the other hand would do no such thing. It'd just **** up your reaction time and you'd probably get knocked out in the first round. I suppose that's unsafe as well but no more unsafe than coming into a fight, say, without getting any sleep the night before. 

Bottom line Nick Diaz got ROBBED :thumbsup:


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> Then you and me aren't on the same page at all you retard. That post was about why being on cocaine wouldn't help you in a fight. It was a response to the people who said 'you feel no pain on coke' when I said I would rather fight a coke head than a sober fighter. For **** sake.
> What I may or may not think about drugs in sport was not presented in that post. And maybe when I said I would like to beat up a crackhead, maybe, just maybe you might have thought 'This man could possibly be joking'. Or even the other thread when I said I wanted to see Jay Cutler fight Pete Doherty, maybe that might have been a clue?


 Stove = hot...hand on stove = bad


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

gwabblesore said:


> The fact is cocaine and marijuana are NOT performance enhancing drugs. They would NOT help you in a fight. No ******* way. I promise, anybody who says otherwise is just plain wrong.


 Performance is altered and fighter safety is jeopardized. That's why substances are banned.



> For this reason I think that steroids should be penalized more harshly than pot or coke.


 They are.



> There should be a penalty for coke because raising your heart rate like that going into a fight, which also raises your heart rate, is not safe. Itd be comparable to doing _more_ coke and your heart freaking out would be like a coke overdose.
> 
> Pot on the other hand would do no such thing. It'd just **** up your reaction time and you'd probably get knocked out in the first round. I suppose that's unsafe as well but no more unsafe than coming into a fight, say, without getting any sleep the night before.


 Personally, I'm relieved the athletic commissions aren't taking their cues from message board posters.  



> Bottom line Nick Diaz got ROBBED :thumbsup:


 Diaz cheated himself out of a win.

Seriously, he couldn't wait until the day after his fight?


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> Nobody is allowed to do anything while on cocaine, it is illegal.
> But I just don't get Athletic commisions fining people and suspending them for definately non-performance enhancing drugs. If I had the choice to fight someone on cocaine, or someone clean, I'd fight the cokehead, and probably kick his ass.


See jasvll, if you had quoted this, then your comment would have made sense, since you didn't, and quoted a post that had nothing to do with what you are now saying, you look like a retard and have nothing to argue with.
Next time quote the post that you are trying to argue against.
You actually appeared intelligent in the Chris Benoit threads....now, especially with your last post, you look quite stupid.


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## TheSuplexor (Jun 2, 2006)

i was expecting steroids, what a dummy


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> See jasvll, if you had quoted this, then your comment would have made sense, since you didn't, and quoted a post that had nothing to do with what you are now saying, you look like a retard and have nothing to argue with.
> Next time quote the post that you are trying to argue against.
> You actually appeared intelligent in the Chris Benoit threads....now, especially with your last post, you look quite stupid.


 I apologize for assuming you had the ability to retain information, especially about your own posts.

I won't make that mistake again, so here goes:
stove = hot...hand on stove = bad.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

jasvll said:


> I apologize for assuming you had the ability to retain information, especially about your own posts.


What did I have to go on?? You quoted the wrong thing and didn't even make an arguement. I am supposed to psychically guess you are saying that fighters should be punished for abusing illegal drugs when you quote me explaining how cocaine cannot help someone win a fight and say ''Can you not control the flow of stupidity or are you simply unaware of its existence?''Is that what you expected? Cos if it is you are a ******* idiot.


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> What did I have to go on?? You quoted the wrong thing and didn't even make an arguement. I am supposed to psychically guess you are saying that fighters should be punished for abusing illegal drugs when you quote me explaining how cocaine cannot help someone win a fight and say ''Can you not control the flow of stupidity or are you simply unaware of its existence?''Is that what you expected? Cos if it is you are a ******* idiot.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

jasvll said:


>


Rather than admit you were wrong you went and took the time to find that pic?


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> Rather than admit you were wrong you went and took the time to find that pic?


 If you agree that Carter Williams should be punished for testing positive for cocaine, your initial count of stupidity will be removed.

If you agree that cocaine is a performance-altering drug, and that some fighters will benefit from its effects and others will suffer, and that either way, they shouldn't be allowed to fight with it in their system, the second count of stupidity will be removed.

When your record is clear of both counts, you'll have shown that it is safe for you to be near the stove. Until that time, I should tell you, don't touch the glowing red swirl:


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

jasvll said:


> If you agree that Carter Williams should be punished for testing positive for cocaine, your initial count of stupidity will be removed.
> 
> If you agree that cocaine is a performance-altering drug, and that some fighters will benefit from its effects and others will suffer, and that either way, they shouldn't be allowed to fight with it in their system, the second count of stupidity will be removed.
> 
> When your record is clear of both counts, you'll have shown that it is safe for you to be near the stove. Until that time, I should tell you, don't touch the glowing red swirl:


Dude, take a step back and look at yourself. You made a mistake, failed to defend it and now you are searching the internet for pictures of stoves. Stoves. You are(I think) attempting to be funny. You are not suceeding, and I find it sad that there is someone sitting at a computer going to thistrouble to try and prevent themselves looking stupid. You tried to make a funny comment on what you somehow percieved I was writing a while back, and failed as it had nothing to do with what I was saying. You need to stop now. You are just digging a bigger hole for yourself.


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> Dude, take a step back and look at yourself. You made a mistake, failed to defend it and now you are searching the internet for pictures of stoves. Stoves. You are(I think) attempting to be funny. You are not suceeding, and I find it sad that there is someone sitting at a computer going to thistrouble to try and prevent themselves looking stupid. You tried to make a funny comment on what you somehow percieved I was writing a while back, and failed as it had nothing to do with what I was saying. You need to stop now. You are just digging a bigger hole for yourself.


 If you took the time to look at the thread, you'd realize (around the same time you realized the stove was hot, I'm afraid) that I had been calling you stupid since the beginning, and virtually everything you've said, up to and including now has verified it. 

This is my last post on the subject of your intelligence, so from here on out, you're on your own:


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## WouldLuv2FightU (Jul 17, 2006)

Does anyone have a list of fighters that have tested positive for coke?


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

jasvll said:


> Are you suggesting that fighters should be allowed to fight while on cocaine?


You seem to be getting even more desperate. Do you not realise I can just read back and quote you? This is the only other message you adressed to me in this thread before this. You did not call me stupid.
Now I will explain what then happened, cos you don't seem to get it. I replied to some other people(not you) who were saying coke made you feel no pain, explaining why I felt Cocaine would not help you win a fight. You proceeded to quote me on this, call me stupid but offer no arguement or explanation. After I asked you why you did this, you explained (after a while) that you were saying that fighters should be punished for doing illegal drugs, and that I was arguing that they shouldn't. You then said I should have known this even though you quoted a post that had nothing to do with it and didn't actually argue the point. Since then you have been refusing to explain how I should have known this, why you quoted that particular post that had nothing todo with what you were saying and have only posted pictures of hot stoves to go alongwith your odd metaphor for me asking what you were talking in the first place.
Now don't post again until you want to admit just how bad you fucked up child.


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## WouldLuv2FightU (Jul 17, 2006)

nevermind


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## AdRath (Nov 16, 2006)

All Carter Williams wanted to do was earn some money for more coke. now he has to resort to sucking dick for coke. Bob Sagat seen him. poor guy. lol


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> You seem to be getting even more desperate. Do you not realise I can just read back and quote you? This is the only other message you adressed to me in this thread before this. You did not call me stupid.


 Yes, I did. I even got repped for it, but both the post and the rep have disappeared, which suggests the mods didn't like me calling people stupid. The truth scares them, it seems. My exact words were, 'Wow, you're stupid,' and I stand by them.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

jasvll said:


> Yes, I did. I even got repped for it, but both the post and the rep have disappeared, which suggests the mods didn't like me calling people stupid. The truth scares them, it seems. My exact words were, 'Wow, you're stupid,' and I stand by them.


I flame people all the time and my posts don't dissapear. Do you smell that.....horses......no wait....cows.....I got it, it's bullshit!
And you still haven't explained the logic behind you quoting me and arguing against a point I wasn't making. Could you do that, finally?:thumb02:


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## SupremeTapout (Feb 1, 2007)

He should have known better. Thats all I gotta say, if he has a problem I hope he gets help but other than that, oh well, not like I care much, he isnt a big name fighter. I do see a patern tho with MMA and Coke. I dont know what to make of it...


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## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

jasvll said:


> Personally, I'm relieved the athletic commissions aren't taking their cues from message board posters.



Why? Cuz the athletic commission knows better than I do what kind of dangers drugs pose? Youre completely lost in your NSAC nuthuggery if you honestly think that every action they make is an educated decision for the health of the fighters.


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## WouldLuv2FightU (Jul 17, 2006)

gwabblesore said:


> Why? Cuz the athletic commission knows better than I do what kind of dangers drugs pose? Youre completely lost in your NSAC nuthuggery if you honestly think that every action they make is an educated decision for the health of the fighters.


It doesn't matter if pot or coke helps them fight, what if they need emergency care from a doctor because of what happened in the fight, having coke or weed or any of the other banned substances on the list will negatively affect your reactions to anything they try to do to you. I don't see how that is so hard to understand. You don't do drugs while your on the job, it's as simple as that. It's like that everywhere in the working world. Get a real job and you will find that out.


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## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

WouldLuv2FightU said:


> It doesn't matter if pot or coke helps them fight, what if they need emergency care from a doctor because of what happened in the fight, having coke or weed or any of the other banned substances on the list will negatively affect your reactions to anything they try to do to you. I don't see how that is so hard to understand. You don't do drugs while your on the job, it's as simple as that. It's like that everywhere in the working world. Get a real job and you will find that out.


Read the post before my last dude, then respond to _that_

You fight with me EVERY ******* THREAD ive listed my jobs earlier in the thread and while I might not have a super resume there are people I HAVE WORKED WITH who _do_ and dont get drug tested. Maybe Im just in a weird corner of the country?


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## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

WouldLuv2FightU said:


> It doesn't matter if pot or coke helps them fight, what if they need emergency care from a doctor because of what happened in the fight, having coke or weed or any of the other banned substances on the list will negatively affect your reactions to anything they try to do to you. I don't see how that is so hard to understand. You don't do drugs while your on the job, it's as simple as that. It's like that everywhere in the working world. Get a real job and you will find that out.


In case you dont want the burden of backtracking to the post where i explained this...marijuana in a fight, are you ******* kidding me?!!?? It'd be no worse for your health than coming in without sleep or coming in after eating way too much food or coming in after taking cough medicine 

Coke on the other hand will get your heart rate too high

this is all basic


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## WouldLuv2FightU (Jul 17, 2006)

gwabblesore said:


> In case you dont want the burden of backtracking to the post where i explained this...marijuana in a fight, are you ******* kidding me?!!?? It'd be no worse for your health than coming in without sleep or coming in after eating way too much food or coming in after taking cough medicine
> 
> Coke on the other hand will get your heart rate too high
> 
> this is all basic


Your an idiot if you don't think pot has any affect on your heart rate either.

I wouldn't fight you in every thread if you weren't wrong in every thread.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

WouldLuv2FightU said:


> Your an idiot if you don't think pot has any affect on your heart rate either.
> 
> I wouldn't fight you in every thread if you weren't wrong in every thread.


Pot doesn't have a significant effect on the heart rate.
Never done it I presume?


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## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

WouldLuv2FightU said:


> *Your an idiot if you don't think pot has any affect on your heart rate either.*
> 
> I wouldn't fight you in every thread if you weren't wrong in every thread.


You are really REALLY lost here, stick to sucking BJ Penn's dick that's your forte

peace bro :thumb02:


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## WouldLuv2FightU (Jul 17, 2006)

Wow, you guys are both complete morons. Thanks for clarifying.


And BTW, I smoke pot 3-5 times a day, everyday. If you guys both smoke and still don't realize it affects your heart rate, maybe you should find a new dealer. Your weed is shit.


Cannabis (drug) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The health and psychological consequences of cannabis use - chapter 6
Quitting Marijuana Smoking
SpringerLink - Journal Article
NIDA - Research Report Series - Marijuana Abuse
NIDA - Publications - NIDA Notes - Vol. 17, No. 3 - Research Findings
marijuana effects by marijuana addiction.info
Cardiovascular system effects of marijuana -- Jones 42 (11 Supplement): S58 -- The Journal of Clinical Pharmacology
Triggering Myocardial Infarction by Marijuana -- Mittleman et al. 103 (23): 2805 -- Circulation
Effects of Marijuana - The Health Effects of Marijuana
Effects-Of-Marijuana.com - Information regarding the long and short term effects of marijuana
Marijuana information from Narconon International

^^ In case you don't realize, those are links, you click them and they take you to a website. 



> Recent findings indicate that smoking marijuana while shooting up cocaine has the potential to cause severe increases in heart rate and blood pressure. In one study, experienced marijuana and cocaine users were given marijuana alone, cocaine alone, and then a combination of both. Each drug alone produced cardiovascular effects; when they were combined, the effects were greater and lasted longer. The heart rate of the subjects in the study increased 29 beats per minute with marijuana alone and 32 beats per minute with cocaine alone. When the drugs were given together, the heart rate increased by 49 beats per minute, and the increased rate persisted for a longer time. The drugs were given with the subjects sitting quietly. In normal circumstances, an individual may smoke marijuana and inject cocaine and then do something physically stressful that may significantly increase risks of overload on the cardiovascular system.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

Look as someone who has done both drugs, they are not comparable. I didn't say it had no effect, it just doesn't have a significant effect. Smoke as much as you want, physically exert yourself, you aint getting a heart attack.
3-5 times a day everyday? You memory must be shot, and I would watch out for scizophrenia down theline.


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## WouldLuv2FightU (Jul 17, 2006)

TheNegation said:


> Look as someone who has done both drugs, they are not comparable. I didn't say it had no effect, it just doesn't have a significant effect. Smoke as much as you want, physically exert yourself, you aint getting a heart attack.
> 3-5 times a day everyday? You memory must be shot, and I would watch out for scizophrenia down theline.


It's not the point whether or not is has a "significant effect". Doubling your heart rate is pretty significant if you ask me. The point is, it is unneccesarily unsafe. 

Firstly, someone could have an underlying heart condition, and a change in heart rate can have adverse affects on that person while their adrenaline is shooting through the roof and physically exerting themselves simultaneously.

Secondly, if they need emergency care immediately following the fight, having even a little bit of pot or coke in your system can cause negative reactions to a lot of the shit paramedics use.

Who is liable for these things? The state athletic commission is, hence the reason they have these substances BANNED! It's not that hard to figure out!


And to the memory and schizo comment, you'd be surprised what a healthy diet can do for a guy. Even being a pothead, I still have better grammar and vocabulary than 80% of the people on this forum, I still have sharp long-term memory, I am healthy, and have absolutely no trouble retaining information. My short term memory isn't the greatest though, but I can live with that. Pot and all drugs for that matter affect everyone differently, which is another legit reason to have them banned in sports and the workplace, they have different affects on different people, which makes it unpredictable, which makes it something no one wants to be liable for.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

WouldLuv2FightU said:


> It's not the point whether or not is has a "significant effect". Doubling your heart rate is pretty significant if you ask me. The point is, it is unneccesarily unsafe.
> 
> And to the memory and schizo comment, you'd be surprised what a healthy diet can do for a guy. Even being a pothead, I still have better grammar and vocabulary than 80% of the people on this forum, I still have sharp long-term memory, I am healthy, and have absolutely no trouble retaining information. My short term memory isn't the greatest though, but I can live with that. Pot and all drugs for that matter affect everyone differently, which is another legit reason to have them banned in sports and the workplace, they have different affects on different people, which makes it unpredictable, which makes it something no one wants to be liable for.


Umm, yes it is. I said it wasn't significant and you called me a moron for it. 
And some of those links you gave..... 

Pot doesn't effect spelling or grammar, or long term memory. It effects short term memory, and if you get diagnosed with schiz, well you'll be sorry for those 3-5 joints a day.

Also I aint arguing it should be used by fighters, I am just arguing it isn' that dangerous. People don't get heart attacks from abusing pot.


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## WouldLuv2FightU (Jul 17, 2006)

TheNegation said:


> Umm, yes it is. I said it wasn't significant and you called me a moron for it.
> And some of those links you gave.....


No, my original point was not whether or not it was a significant difference, and once again it can double, which is pretty significant. And sorry for the moron thing, it was mostly aimed towards gwabble, but you joined in, so I had to include you too. And all I did was type "heart rate increase, marijuana" on Google and went through the first 2 pages of links. I don't care how stupid or cheesy they are, the fact remains that pot affects your heart rate. 



> Pot doesn't effect spelling or grammar, or long term memory. It effects short term memory, and if you get diagnosed with schiz, well you'll be sorry for those 3-5 joints a day.


Definately not 3-5 joints a day...I would be toasted. 3-5 bowls a day is more like it. And I'd like to know where you get your info from. There is no proof that weed causes schizophrenia. Weed can, however, contribute to depression, which in turn can cause schizo if the depression is not under control. But that is still just heavy speculation. It depends on the person, and a lot of other factors that contribute to mental illnesses.



> Also I aint arguing it should be used by fighters, I am just arguing it isn' that dangerous. People don't get heart attacks from abusing pot.


Well gwabblesore was arguing that, and he was who I was mostly directing my post to, not so much you. Like I said you sorta just jumped in. And actually if someone has an underlying heart condition, then yes pot can cause a heart attack if enough of it is smoked. You seem to just base your claims on your own personal experiences. Pot affects everyone differently. And if you have say, an enlarged heart, or irregular heart beat, or high cholesterol, and your heart rate increases by 100%, there's a good chance something can go wrong. Just because it hasn't happened to you or anyone you know doesn't mean it's impossible. People who have heart problems usually know not to smoke pot, or at least large quantities of it, so luckily it hasn't been a big issue thus far. But there are a lot of heart problems that don't have symptoms for a lot of people. I'm not saying it is very likely to happen, but it can happen. If a guy with a heart condition smokes a big fat blunt and then goes and plays a game of full-court basketball, he has a very good chance of getting a heart attack. And believe it or not, it happens! Kids and young adults have died during football and basketball games before.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

WouldLuv2FightU said:


> Definately not 3-5 joints a day...I would be toasted. 3-5 bowls a day is more like it. And I'd like to know where you get your info from. There is no proof that weed causes schizophrenia. Weed can, however, contribute to depression, which in turn can cause schizo if the depression is not under control. But that is still just heavy speculation. It depends on the person, and a lot of other factors that contribute to mental illnesses.


It was all over the news a couple years ago when it was breaking news. After many tests were performed they found it seemed to increase the possibility of scizophrenia to heavy users. One of the articles was in national geographic, I'll try to find it. We don't know what causes schizo or even understand it at all yet though. When I had to keep vsiting a mental hospital it scared the shit outta me how many potheads were there, I probably know more than most about this because someone in my immediate family was diagnosed with schizophrenia last year.


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## WouldLuv2FightU (Jul 17, 2006)

TheNegation said:


> It was all over the news a couple years ago when it was breaking news. After many tests were performed they found it seemed to increase the possibility of scizophrenia to heavy users. One of the articles was in national geographic, I'll try to find it. We don't know what causes schizo or even understand it at all yet though. When I had to keep vsiting a mental hospital it scared the shit outta me how many potheads were there, I probably know more than most about this because someone in my immediate family was diagnosed with schizophrenia last year.


Well, hopefully it isn't true, or if it is, hopefully all the good shit I eat will help counteract some of that...as soon as I start hearing voices you can bet I will kick that habit lol...I need to quit anyway. Shit gets expensive.

EDIT: I do remember reading something about a link between schizo and weed before, but it was talking about a certain kind of weed called "skunk", which contains more than 20x the amount of THC as normal weed. It's real popular and abundant in the UK, but not so much America, at least not where I live.


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

WouldLuv2FightU said:


> Well, hopefully it isn't true, or if it is, hopefully all the good shit I eat will help counteract some of that...as soon as I start hearing voices you can bet I will kick that habit lol...I need to quit anyway. Shit gets expensive.


Don't bother quiting, just do what I do, enjoy it a couple times a year.


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## Punishment 101 (May 4, 2006)

Theres alot worse shit out there then chronic thats forsure.

& any drug can increase the chances of schizo not just buds (which prolly happens to 1 in 1000 daily pot smokers)

As BJ would say, smoke n roll


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## Boxing>MMA (Apr 20, 2007)

Cocaine and alcohol are the only drugs worth taking AMEN


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

Punishment 101 said:


> Theres alot worse shit out there then chronic thats forsure.
> 
> & any drug can increase the chances of schizo not just buds (which prolly happens to 1 in 1000 daily pot smokers)
> 
> As BJ would say, smoke n roll


I have never heard this in my life. Alcohol and caffiene increase chances of schizo eh? Bullshiat


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## Punishment 101 (May 4, 2006)

TheNegation said:


> I have never heard this in my life. Alcohol and caffiene increase chances of schizo eh? Bullshiat


Alright let me make this a lil more clear for you... DRUGS that you SMOKE


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## PrideFan123 (Apr 8, 2007)

Lay off the nose candy Williams!


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

Punishment 101 said:


> Alright let me make this a lil more clear for you... DRUGS that you SMOKE


It was a joke, relax. But it is bullshit. they have done tests on marijuana specifically leading them to believe it increases the risk of schizophrenia. Not all things you smoke, not crack, not heroin, marijuana.


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## PrideFan123 (Apr 8, 2007)

TheNegation said:


> It was a joke, relax. But it is bullshit. they have done tests on marijuana specifically leading them to believe it increases the risk of schizophrenia. Not all things you smoke, not crack, not heroin, marijuana.


You guys both need to smoke a fatty blunt and chill.


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## WouldLuv2FightU (Jul 17, 2006)

TheNegation said:


> It was a joke, relax. But it is bullshit. they have done tests on marijuana specifically leading them to believe it increases the risk of schizophrenia. Not all things you smoke, not crack, not heroin, marijuana.


I found those tests. They could be right, but they could be a little over-exaggerated. The people that participated in the studies were at the same age as the normal age that schizophrenic symptoms arise. In other words, the study could have just demonstrated the fact that the time schizo symptoms usually arise, is around the same time people normally start smoking pot. Also, a lot of the studies were done on people in the military, one of the biggest studies was done on the Swedish Army. Being in the military is already known to be the #1 cause of schizo aggrevation. So again it could just be a coincidence.

Basically, from what I gathered, you have to have schizo in order for weed to cause it. Weed can't make schizo appear out of nowhere, you develop schizo over time based on what happens in your life and how your brain chemistry is, marijuana COULD just trigger the schizo earlier than it originally would have triggered.

Anything that affects your brain chemistry or perception can trigger schizo. None of those studies said marijuana CAUSES schizo, they said it aggrevates it and causes it to show symptoms earlier. The only thing that CAUSES schizo, is either being born with it, developing it throughout childhood as the brain develops, unknown reasons, and being in the military and especially in combat/war. Those are the known CAUSES, weed is being investigated as an aggrevator, and poorly investigated I might add. Doing studies on young adults who are in the military who happen to smoke pot and have schizo does not tell me pot causes schizo. It tells me that symptoms arise in the late teens/early 20s, and are more common in people who have been in the military.

Schizophrenia.com - Marijuana Cannabis and Schizophrenia


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## TheNegation (Jun 11, 2007)

Well it has to be said that we know very little about schizophrenia itself, so we can't know too much about how it can be caused. If marijuana was only found to trigger it, that would be scary enough. You aint gonna know if you are prone until you are diagnosed.


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## WouldLuv2FightU (Jul 17, 2006)

TheNegation said:


> Well it has to be said that we know very little about schizophrenia itself, so we can't know too much about how it can be caused. If marijuana was only found to trigger it, that would be scary enough. You aint gonna know if you are prone until you are diagnosed.


I agree, I'm not trying to say the whole study is shit, just that it has some obvious flaws. You are right, schizophrenia is still largely a mystery, like every other brain problem, like Alzheimer's and epilepsy and savants. I might just use this as motivation to cut back. :thumbsup:


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