# Chael Sonnen "Everybody in the back knows Cain is the best HW"



## alizio (May 27, 2009)

"The media is always trying to determine and dictate who's the best guy in the world. In reality, we know who the real best guys in the world are because the community is so small. I'll go into a workout with four, five, six, eight UFC guys, and at the end of the workout we all know who the toughest guy is. It's the guys in the back, the guys in the locker room that truly know who's who, regardless of what the media says. A lot of times it's not the same guy.... Let's use the heavyweight division for example, the best fighter in the heavyweight division right now is a guy named Cain Velasquez. I don't think the media knows that, in fact I know they don't. But the guys in the back do. The same thing goes with us (the middleweight division). The guys in the back know who the tough guy is. If me and Anderson both walk in the back, believe me there's gonna be lot more of ‘Hey Mr. Sonnen' than ‘Hey Mr. Silva.' They know who's who, and everybody is gonna know who's who before the end of 2010."

-- Toast of the MMA town, number one middleweight contender Chael Sonnen, appeared on Pro MMA Radio this past Monday following his career defining victory over Nate Marquardt at UFC 109. And wouldn't you know it, the guy provided us with yet another great sound byte! This time, he tries to get the point across that the media, and everybody who isn't a fighter for that matter, has it all wrong when to comes to determining the sport's best fighters. We should be asking the fighters themselves. Of course we should, it's not like they would have a bias opinion or anything. Mr. Sonnen also shares some inside information with us regarding the UFC's heavyweight division. Apparently, everyone "in the back" knows that Cain Velasquez is the best guy out there. But you probably knew that already, right? Is Sonnen on the verge of completely losing his mind, or is he actually on to something and the rest of us just don't know it yet? Sound off, Maniacs.

http://www.mmamania.com/2010/2/10/1305265/ufc-quick-quote-everyone-knows

1st he wins me nice $ easily and now he speaks more truth, starting to like Chael (R) more and more by the day!!

The media and the haters cant hold on to this secret much longer. Next Sunday morning Cain Valasquez will have officially arrived as an MMA superstar and as i said before, he will be HW Champion in 2010. Cains "hype" doesnt come from fanboys and idiots in the media, it comes from the hardcore MMA community, from the fighters hes trained with from Machida to Rogers to AKA, everybody knows, more of you should know by just watching this beast dominante guys like Kongo and Rothwell who are top 20 guys and just flat out dont get tooled like that, nevermind by some new kid with 5 or 6 fights under his belt. Oh, the truth is gonna smack ppl in the head like a lead pipe and La Raza will be on top of the combat world where we belong!!! 

Once Cain brings MMA to the Latino mainstream, it will never be the same, we will make our mark like in boxing, Cain is just the beginning and will be the Godfather of the sport for us like Chavez once was in boxing, literally one fighter breeding a generation. VIVA LA RAZA!!! (and no, Tito doesnt instill feelings of Latino pride in any latino i know, he is very americanized)


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## NotDylan (Jul 13, 2009)

How often do all the top HW's workout together? Does that really happen?


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

NotDylan said:


> How often do all the top HW's workout together? Does that really happen?


 top guys work together all the time. you dont have to be the same weight class to recognize crazy talent.... they are some of the best fighters in the world, they would know talent when they see it. Chael isnt just tooting Cains horn for no reason, they arent in the same camp, he is just telling what he knows from experience, flat out.

Khov likes to big up Brett Rogers and even that guy sparred with Cain and afterwards whenever he named his personal top 5, it included Cain.... im sure he did that just to a nice guy too and help the UFC "hype" Cain up, right?? Would make sense if Brett was even in the UFC i guess.

Chael is being hilarious and bringing alot of insight we as fans may not know. You really dont believe most of the fighters know who the top guys are?? Who is for real etc etc??


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## funkyboogalooo (Jan 28, 2009)

> The guys in the back know who the tough guy is. If me and Anderson both walk in the back, believe me there's gonna be lot more of ‘Hey Mr. Sonnen' than ‘Hey Mr. Silva.' They know who's who, and everybody is gonna know who's who before the end of 2010."


 :confused02:


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## chosenFEW (Oct 25, 2009)

chael talking out his ass again...


and another thread with more cain groupie love by alizio. we will see who's the best heavyweight after cain gets worked by nog


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## Leed (Jan 3, 2010)

Mr. Sonnen is one helluva guy.


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

As a Frank Mir fan I love this guy. 

Only because with all the bullshit he talks people are gonna forget about all the shit that comes from Frank's mouth at times.


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

chosenFEW said:


> chael talking out his ass again...
> 
> 
> and another thread with more cain groupie love by alizio. we will see who's the best heavyweight after cain gets worked by nog


 only way to combat hate is love, baby 

You guys will see, the speed factor is so huge here and Nog fans are dismissing it. Cain is so much faster then Nog, Nog is gonna look slow motion, watch. Cain was consistently getting off before Rothwell and Kongo who i consider to both be better, quicker strikers then Big Nog. Cain is definately getting off 1st and more vs Nog, even if he loses.


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## LjStronge (Aug 29, 2007)

Fact is, regardless of Nog or Cain - Mir with beat them both.

Just my opinion obviously


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

sounds like the fact is, if Anderson Silva says play hip hop and Chael Sonnen says its Country music time, Cain Valasquez has the power to veto both these fools and play some reggaeton!!!

now thats something we can all be thankful for!!!


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## Machida Karate (Nov 30, 2009)

If there was a 220-230 weight divison i would of been saying that Cain is going to be the Champ a while ago....

The fact is, guys like Brock Lesnar are going to eat him alive....

He did good with Kongo and Rothwell, but Brocks wrestling and strength, i don't see how he is going to be able to control Brock or do his usual wear u out then beat u to hell style.....

I see him winning the dicision with Nog because Nog wont tire so quickly and has an amazing chin and calmness in a storm.

But do u see Cain on top of Brock? Or controling Brock? Lol i dont think thats even physically possible for a man of Cains size...

I see his raid of wins ending with Brock or Mir, and maybe Carwin because he is a beast and has good wrestling, and if Cain takes those shots like he did with Kongo with Shane.

He ain't getting up lol


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## michelangelo (Feb 1, 2009)

Chael Sonnen has lost all credibility. And he had little or none to begin with. 

Apparently, Cain Velasquez is vastly superior to Fedor, and Chael lords over all 185-ers in the imaginary locker room in that tiny and feebly outfitted compartment of his mind he calls his "imagination."

Somebody please snatch the crack pipe from Chael the next time you see him, as his hold on reality continues to slip even further from his already tenuous grip.


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## Machida Karate (Nov 30, 2009)

michelangelo said:


> Chael Sonnen has lost all credibility. And he had little or none to begin with.
> 
> Apparently, Cain Velasquez is vastly superior to Fedor, and Chael lords over all 185-ers in the imaginary locker room in that tiny and feebly outfitted compartment of his mind he calls his "imagination."
> 
> Somebody please snatch the crack pipe from Chael the next time you see him, as his hold on reality continues to slip even further from his already tenuous grip.


 
Yeah seriously i forgot about that comment about Silva.... Cmon anyone would rather talk to or be around Anderson more then Cheal, he needs to get over himself and get KTFO from Anderson....

He REALLY shouldn't give Anderson a reason to want to beat the piss out of you.... 

If he keeps talking this shit, and with his relentless style, i think Anderson is really going to put him out for a year from broken everything lol


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

Cain fecking rocks! I completely agree with alizio. Cain is something very special in the HW division. The truth shall come to the fore Sunday when he ravages Nog for 3 rounds.


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## Nefilim777 (Jun 24, 2009)

Haha, is this all a political ploy to get the 'brown' vote?! Strange for a republican! Seriously though... Interesting comment's from Chael, he's really starting to make waves in the UFC. I think Cain could do it this weekend, then what? The winner of the winner of Brock v Carwin/Mir?


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## Inkdot (Jun 15, 2009)

Ever since Chael got 2 nice wins (via lay and pray) in the UFC he all of a sudden starts running his mouth like Kos + Hardy + Tito all combined.

Someone needs to humble this guy so he can once again fall back into obscurity and shut the **** up!


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## Finnsidious (Mar 14, 2009)

michelangelo said:


> Chael Sonnen has lost all credibility. And he had little or none to begin with.
> 
> Apparently, Cain Velasquez is vastly superior to Fedor, and Chael lords over all 185-ers in the imaginary locker room in that tiny and feebly outfitted compartment of his mind he calls his "imagination."
> 
> Somebody please snatch the crack pipe from Chael the next time you see him, as his hold on reality continues to slip even further from his already tenuous grip.


 This.

Sonnen might even be partly right about Cain, he might be the UFC champ someday, but even a stopped clock is right twice a day.

Sonnen simply says too much crap. When you constantly say retarded things, no one will ever take anything you say seriously, even if you are actually right. Sonnen has cried wolf too many times in way too many stupid ways for anyone to listen to this guy.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

alizio said:


> only way to combat hate is love, baby
> 
> You guys will see, the speed factor is so huge here and Nog fans are dismissing it. Cain is so much faster then Nog, Nog is gonna look slow motion, watch. Cain was consistently getting off before Rothwell and Kongo who i consider to both be better, quicker strikers then Big Nog. Cain is definately getting off 1st and more vs Nog, even if he loses.


Yea I guess the only way Big Nog can beat him, is if he uses his experience and BJJ! He won't be able to go the same amount of effort as Cain.



LjStronge said:


> Fact is, regardless of Nog or Cain - Mir with beat them both.
> 
> Just my opinion obviously


Mir is overrated! Cain would do the same Lesnar did to him (size doesn't matter, Wrestling skills do). I think the chances are very high, that we will see this fight if Mir loses and Cain wins.



Inkdot said:


> Ever since Chael got 2 nice wins (via lay and pray) in the UFC he all of a sudden starts running his mouth like Kos + Hardy + Tito all combined.


Sonnen just wants some attention! I don't like him either, but he deserves all the Respect for his last performances. And Chael never lay and prays lol nobody works so hard on the ground like he does.


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## LjStronge (Aug 29, 2007)

I'm sorry - Mir is a lot bigger now, is VERY dangerous on the ground and Cain can get ROCKED a lot on the feet. With Mir's new standup I can see him dropping Cain and when Cain goes for the double leg - Mir sinks in the Choke.

I mean, seriously, you think Mir is going to be as bad as Kongo? lol - If Cain wants to sit on top of Mir an entire round like he did to Kongo (he didn't finish Kongo by the way) Mir will find a way to sink in a submission. Fact.


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## xeberus (Apr 23, 2007)




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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

LjStronge said:


> I'm sorry - Mir is a lot bigger now, is VERY dangerous on the ground and Cain can get ROCKED a lot on the feet. With Mir's new standup I can see him dropping Cain and when Cain goes for the double leg - Mir sinks in the Choke.
> 
> I mean, seriously, you think Mir is going to be as bad as Kongo? lol - If Cain wants to sit on top of Mir an entire round like he did to Kongo (he didn't finish Kongo by the way) Mir will find a way to sink in a submission. Fact.


I don't think Mir will even beat Carwin! This guy is very overrated now, because he landed a very nice shot at Kongo (wich didn't even rocked him) and locked in the choke. 

All you need to beat somebody like Mir, is a guy with decent BJJ defense ( Mir is not a phenom in BJJ ) and a top notch Wrestler like Brock, like Cain, like Carwin.


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## Inkdot (Jun 15, 2009)

BobbyCooper said:


> Sonnen just wants some attention! I don't like him either, but he deserves all the Respect for his last performances. And Chael never lay and prays lol nobody works so hard on the ground like he does.


Sonnen will not have my respect ever. They way he talks about people. 

Like when he said that Anderson Silva wears pink shirts and earrings, and that a guy like that "wouldn't last long in my home town"

What does he mean by that? Are his conservative ******* buddies gonna tie Andersons feet to the back of a truck and "go for a joyride, like dem good ol' days, YEEEHHHAAA!", I mean how are you supposed to interpreit that retared statement? 

Just because Anderson dosent fit into the narrow minded white christian conservative view of how someone is supposed to look "he wouldn't last long" in Chaels hometown?

They guy is not a douche, he is even worse, hes an a**hole and I hope he gets serioesly injured in his next fight.

Sorry about this rant I just get so angry with these kind of people. /rant off


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

Inkdot said:


> Sonnen will not have my respect ever. They way he talks about people.
> 
> Like when he said that Anderson Silva wears pink shirts and earrings, and that a guy like that "wouldn't last long in my home town"
> 
> ...


Me too! Don't get me wrong here I am a very big Chael Sonnen hater and what he said a bout Anderson is just under all dignity. Nobody should talk like that about somebody like Anderson, nobody!!!

I think he is a racist :dunno: 

And his political point of view sucks as well!

But I respect him as a fighter because he got heart, a spot where many others lack a lot. I give him Respect for his fighting mentality no more no less.


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## LjStronge (Aug 29, 2007)

BobbyCooper said:


> I don't think Mir will even beat Carwin! This guy is very overrated now, because he landed a very nice shot at Kongo (wich didn't even rocked him) and locked in the choke.
> 
> All you need to beat somebody like Mir, is a guy with decent BJJ defense ( Mir is not a phenom in BJJ ) and a top notch Wrestler like Brock, like Cain, like Carwin.


We'll have to agree to disagree dude, but I'm sure when Mir beats Carwin it will be a "Very Nice shot (which didn't even rock him) and lock in a choke" type of finish right?


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## xbrokenshieldx (Mar 5, 2007)

I really do like Chael, and I think his talking is entertaining. But I have to ask, who is 'everybody'. "Everybody knows who the toughest middleweight is." "everybody knows Cain is the best HW". Well where is he deriving this population from? Everyone at team quest? Everyone Chael hangs out with outside the ring? Every UFC employee? He seems to make vast generalizations and I am not quite sure who he is referring to.

With that being said, I do think Cain is a solid HW but I also think match-ups make fights. And I think Nog is a bad match-up for Cain. Great boxing, power and phenomenonal submissions... I don't see Cain getting by Nog.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

LjStronge said:


> We'll have to agree to disagree dude, but I'm sure when Mir beats Carwin it will be a "Very Nice shot (which didn't even rock him) and lock in a choke" type of finish right?


Yea I guess we have too 

he didn't impressed me in that Kongo fight! He could not show any type of improvement. I think his new weight will only be a huge dissadvantage for him in every aspect not only Cardio. We will see how he does against Carwin. I will definitely put my money on Shane here


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

WOOOOOOOOOOOOW

everytime this guy talks about MMA, he looks like a complete idiot. First he says he will take out GSP and some other guys in a parking lot to get to Silva, now he says everyone knows hes the toughest MW, and he says Cain the best HW?

I guess that one elbow that Marqaurdt threw from his back really did some MASSIVE brain damage, there are ways of getting attention for yourself, and this is the wrong way to do it!

Sonnen is starting to be waaaay worse then Tito...next time he does a interview, he will probably say he can beat Lesnar in a wrestling match... LOL


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## LjStronge (Aug 29, 2007)

BobbyCooper said:


> Yea I guess we have too
> 
> he didn't impressed me in that Kongo fight! He could not show any type of improvement. I think his new weight will only be a huge dissadvantage for him in every aspect not only Cardio. We will see how he does against Carwin. I will definitely put my money on Shane here


How can he not impress, what is he suppose to do, not go in for the kill once he puts one of the "best strikers in the division" on his arse?

He had the opportunity, he took it. It was beautiful!


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

LjStronge said:


> How can he not impress, what is he suppose to do, not go in for the kill once he puts one of the "best strikers in the division" on his arse?
> 
> He had the opportunity, he took it. It was beautiful!



are you joking? it was beautiful? The was far from looking anywhere near that. His wrestling was good, not trying to say it wasnt. He got rocked 3 times in that fight and couldnt finish Kongo in 15minutes of him being on his back, Mir finished Kongo in 2mins... 

it was a good win... but far from beautiful


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## WestCoastPoutin (Feb 27, 2007)

Man do I hate this guy.

During this post fight interview: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DU1afkJfQE&feature=player_embedded#at=222 

he says something to the effect of: Anderson speaks great english but goes around saying: "Se habla Espanol"

They speak spanish in Brazil now?

In Chael's mind, Anderson is a black, gay, mexican who listens to hip hop.


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## FrankMir20 (Dec 21, 2009)

BobbyCooper said:


> I don't think Mir will even beat Carwin! This guy is very overrated now, because he landed a very nice shot at Kongo (wich didn't even rocked him) and locked in the choke.
> 
> All you need to beat somebody like Mir, is a guy with decent BJJ defense ( Mir is not a phenom in BJJ ) and a top notch Wrestler like Brock, like Cain, like Carwin.


You will eat some crow


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## LjStronge (Aug 29, 2007)

Spec0688 said:


> are you joking? it was beautiful? The was far from looking anywhere near that. His wrestling was good, not trying to say it wasnt. He got rocked 3 times in that fight and couldnt finish Kongo in 15minutes of him being on his back, Mir finished Kongo in 2mins...
> 
> it was a good win... but far from beautiful


I don't understand this, you know that I wasn't talking about Cain right?


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## Mr. Sparkle (Nov 3, 2009)

Cain to me is like Machida***. Slowly building up with each fight and as he gains confidence, his victories will become more acute. I have no doubt that he'll beat Nog this weekend.

***Machida will have a much clearer win in the rematch. I find it odd that so many people think Shogun will walk through him. Anyway, no point in opening up this debate again.


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

LjStronge said:


> I don't understand this, you know that I wasn't talking about Cain right?


who were you talking about? you quoted somebody talking about Cain and replied to that, if you dont include a different name in your post, then of course I will take it as you talking about cain


:confused02:


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## LjStronge (Aug 29, 2007)

Spec0688 said:


> who were you talking about? you quoted somebody talking about Cain and replied to that, if you dont include a different name in your post, then of course I will take it as you talking about cain
> 
> 
> :confused02:


Go and read my post again.

I was talking about Mir being beautiful, lol and the fact that there is no way Cain is going to do the same to Mir as Brock did, mainly because

A) Mir is bigger now &
B) Cain couldn't even finish Kongo (in 3 rounds!)


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## Terror Kovenant (Nov 16, 2008)

BobbyCooper said:


> Yea I guess we have too
> 
> he didn't impressed me in that Kongo fight! He could not show any type of improvement. I think his new weight will only be a huge dissadvantage for him in every aspect not only Cardio. We will see how he does against Carwin. I will definitely put my money on Shane here


What more can you possibly do to impress you as a fighter? He walked in there, countered a supposedly superior striker, which put him on his ass, then choked him out....in less than a minute. That is exactly what any fighter wants to do, end the fight early and devastatingly. 

Yet Cain has to lay on him for 3 rounds and gets rocked each time.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

Terror Kovenant said:


> What more can you possibly do to impress you as a fighter? He walked in there, countered a supposedly superior striker, which put him on his ass, then choked him out....in less than a minute. That is exactly what any fighter wants to do, end the fight early and devastatingly.
> 
> Yet Cain has to lay on him for 3 rounds and gets rocked each time.


Of course it was impressive and early finish is always impressive! But still ppl already think that he can beat Brock now because of the Kongo fight..:confused05: where he really couldn't show any type of improvement. 

I mean come on, if you get hit with such a shot (especially in HW) then you get dropped or most of the time KO'd. Kongo wasn't even rocked by that shot, wich is even more impressive. 

I knew before that Mir can hit hard and drop ppl with one shot. Every HW can do that! But still he couldn't show anything new. He did nothing to deserve such a Hype train again. I stick with it, the extra weight will slow him even more down and he will gass in the Carwin fight.


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## LjStronge (Aug 29, 2007)

BobbyCooper said:


> I knew before that Mir can hit hard and drop ppl with one shot. Every HW can do that! But still he couldn't show anything new. He did nothing to deserve such a Hype train again. I stick with it, the extra weight will slow him even more down and he will gass in the Carwin fight.


Me and you have to sig bet dude, we just have to!


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

LjStronge said:


> Me and you have to sig bet dude, we just have to!


Sorry bud, but I just can't remove my Lyoto sig  

It's to beautiful!

but I would win anyway, so good for you


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## TapUout1 (Feb 8, 2010)

He had to be laughing when he said he and andy that everyone would be "mr sonnenin" guys funny, i'll give him that.


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

lol, got it totally wrong... I blame it on the morning! lol


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## NATAS (Jun 30, 2008)

LOL this is pure bullshit. Kongo was dropping Cain every time it stood on the feet for 10 seconds.

Nog is gonna rip his arm off.


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## Ivan (Feb 24, 2007)

I hope for his own sake that this is just self promotion not his actual beliefs well at least not all of them.. 

But even Will Smith thought he could beat Mike Tyson, if Silva and him ever fight i recommend that someone comes out with that as their entrance song.. or becks loser song where in the end he says sprechen sie deutsch baby = talk in german baby..

Silva is not in the UFC to speak English as he was not in Pride to speak Japanise.. just say you dislike him the way he is but not this way..


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## Diokhan (Jul 8, 2008)

I do believe that Cain is underrated by many, but no way he is top #3 HW right now. He will beat Nog, though.


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## Belfort (Aug 4, 2009)

WestCoastPoutin said:


> Man do I hate this guy.
> 
> During this post fight interview: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DU1afkJfQE&feature=player_embedded#at=222
> 
> ...


Man the second half of that interview was some of the funniest sh^t i have heard. This guy is such a tool please feed his ignorant ass to Anderson please! There is trash talk/fight hype and then there is plain stupidity... give this guy the fight he wants and he will get KTFO.

On topic Cain is not the best he doens't have the size or the power for the division - lesnar, mir or even Dos santos will destroy him. Maybe one day he will be the best but he's got a long way to go.


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## gwabblesore (May 2, 2007)

Lol Chael's politics are stupid but his shit talk is awesome :thumbsup:

First the Silva thing and now this. Chael's the man. However he'd lose to Silva and there's at least 3 or 4 HWs that could beat Cain :confused02:.


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## FrankMir20 (Dec 21, 2009)

Yes, and Chael knows this because he has trained with every HW,,oh wait..no he hasnt


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## Iuanes (Feb 17, 2009)

If Cain had some more impressive stand up I might get on his hype train. But he always is going to get beat by Brock with the tools he has, and be in danger of being knocked out by the rest of the HW's. The thing with Cain is that he is a natural athlete, and still young. The division could be his in the far future, but I don't think anytime soon.

As for Chael. This guy is going on a crazy talking streak. Probably the most impressive in UFC history. Talking about raising your profile. One day he's a one dimensional middling MW, the next day he's calling out the Champ, challenging a whole camp, beating a top contender, running for office, running his mouth, dumping on the entire way fans perceive the fight game, and still a one dimensional fighter. Amazing.


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## Servatose (Apr 21, 2008)

Every time Chael opens his mouth I'm more and more disappointed that Nate didn't beat him. The guy is a complete idiot. I think what angers me most about Chael is the fact that he pretends this imaginary locker room exists where he and random other fighters he takes a personal-liking to trains and are the king of the jungle there, and applies it to all of MMA. This guy is a total tool, and it's obvious he's not simply doing it for publicity. He really believes the bullshit he spouts off. It also baffles me how people can willingly support a moron like this. It's as if I'm still in high-school where people gravitate towards those who attempt to draw more attention onto themselves with their lack of maturity, deluded views, and shit-talk. I think it's a combination of Chael Sonnen and the fools that support him that anger me most, because it reminds me how stupid you can be in this world and still have supporters, if you have a big mouth and views that make no sense at all.


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## jonnyg4508 (Jan 30, 2010)

If people back up their toungue I have no problem with it. It isn't Sh*t talking to me. So far "Mr. Sonnen" is 1-0 with his talk. But please Chael, get real and quit acting like you know everything. If he beats Anderson he can talk all he wants. If he gets beat down, I hope he understands who "Mr. Silva" is. Hope that fight happens.


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## kc1983 (May 27, 2007)

alizio said:


> only way to combat hate is love, baby
> 
> You guys will see, the speed factor is so huge here and Nog fans are dismissing it. Cain is so much faster then Nog, Nog is gonna look slow motion, watch. Cain was consistently getting off before Rothwell and Kongo who i consider to both be better, quicker strikers then Big Nog. Cain is definately getting off 1st and more vs Nog, even if he loses.


This is a very valid point that many are overlooking. As soon as you mentioned the speed advantage being heavily in Cain's favour I immediately thought Fedor vs Nog. I can see Nog having a really hard time with Cain's speed and the ferocious pace he sets.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

alizio said:


> Khov likes to big up Brett Rogers and even that guy sparred with Cain and afterwards whenever he named his personal top 5, it included Cain.... im sure he did that just to a nice guy too and help the UFC "hype" Cain up, right?? Would make sense if Brett was even in the UFC i guess.
> 
> Chael is being hilarious and bringing alot of insight we as fans may not know. You really dont believe most of the fighters know who the top guys are?? Who is for real etc etc??


You sure like to mention my name in threads. I guess you think it gives you more credibility? 


The problem with this mindset is that Rogers and Chael haven't worked with every single HW. Sure, Chael might have worked with Cain and been impressed. But who's to say if he ever works with other HWs he might change his opinion?

The only way something like this is credible is when the person stating the opinion has worked with every person in that weight division, which is nearly impossible.




chosenFEW said:


> chael talking out his ass again...
> 
> 
> and another thread with more cain groupie love by alizio. we will see who's the best heavyweight after cain gets worked by nog


So much Cain love from alizio. :thumb02:

I like how everyone doesn't mention elephant in the room that Velasquez is a terrible stylistic match-up for the current champ.


For the record, this is Rogers' top 5:



> Fedor, Me, Werdum, Cain, Barnett


Funny how JDS destroyed Werdum.


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## FrankMir20 (Dec 21, 2009)

"Fedor, Me, Werdum, Cain, Barnett"

any top 5 list of HW's with Brett en Werdum in it is garbage in my eyes.


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

FrankMir20 said:


> Yes, and Chael knows this because he has trained with every HW,,oh wait..no he hasnt


 you really think there are that many HWs out there that Chael or ppl Chael trains with dont know about or havent trained with?? This guy has been with Team Quest 4EVER!!! Im willing to bet he has trained with or has intimate knowledge of nearly every top MMA fighter for the last 10 years. 

Its funny fans think they know who is the best but when a bigtime insider lets you in on something you all smoke him?? He ISNT friends with Cain. He ISNT in the same camp with Cain. He has NO REASON to say these things about Cain. He isnt hyping Cain up and for Gods sake HE IS A REPUBLICAN saying a Mexican is the best HW in the world!! 

You really think the MMA community is so big that the best fighters dont know each other?? talk about each other and know who is "real" etc etc?? You guys are jokes tbh. Chael might be a big mouth, egomaniac but ill take his assessment on MMA talent before i take some random fans.

I believe the fighters know who the toughest guys are. The most skilled guys etc etc ESP in the HW division, there just arent that many great HWs and word gets around REALLY fast.So fast that a guy like Cain couldnt find matchups in MMA outside of Strikeforce or UFC.... thats just on rep from "guys in the back" alone, something you guys seem to think doesnt exist but exists in EVERY sport.

Im sure Team Quest doesnt have ties all over the MMA community. Im sure Chael just randomly picked Cains name outta a hat to hype him up. Truth is the community is way too small for ppl not to know which guys are the top guys. 

What HWs do you think Chael would never have worked out with or never had very imtinate knowledge of how they work out and how good they are?? Fedor is the only one i can think of because he never trains in America. I bet literally every other HW Chael has trained with or somebody very close to Chael has trained with. You guys are acting like the community is so big when its the complete opposite. All the top guys know eachother and guys that know each other, getting info on eachother is very easy.

Chaels been around the game for along, long time, to say he simply worked out with Cain once and is just calling him the best for no reason is a joke to me. He obv has more insight into things then just one sparring session. He may not be right and Cain may not be the very best ATM but i sure as hell believe he and t anybody that has ever trained with Cain and other top HWs know that Cain belongs in that category, its not hard to tell for elite guys to tell who else is elite.

BTW just because somebody is a HW doesnt mean they train with all HWs.... that is just ridiculous, there arent enough elite HWs out there to train with, they train with lighter guys more then bigger guys.

Chael only has been training with one of the greatest HWs of all time most of his career. Including the heart of Randys prime. Im sure he doesnt know the difference between a future champ and cannon fodder. Wish Randy would speak up, i know he has also trained with Cain and i know, he knows the truth aswell  but he doesnt like to make waves like Chael unfortunately.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

alizio said:


> you really think there are that many HWs out there that Chael or ppl Chael trains with dont know about or havent trained with??
> 
> Its funny fans think they know who is the best but when a bigtime insider lets you in on something you all smoke him?? He ISNT friends with Cain. He ISNT in the same camp with Cain. He has NO REASON to say these things about Cain. He isnt hyping Cain up and for Gods sake HE IS A REPUBLICAN saying a Mexican is the best HW in the world!!
> 
> ...




This is the kind of rant alizio does when he gets frustrated and starts speculating. :thumbsup:


To say Chael (a MW who trains at Quest - a camp that doesn't currently have a SINGLE PROMINENT HEAVYWEIGHT) has trained with every single UFC HW is obviously silly. He's trained with Cigano, Gonzaga, Nog, Yvel, Duffee, etc? I can't find any records of him even having talked to most HWs, yet alone train with them extensively enough to form an opinion.


Plus he spent a lot of time in the WEC when they didn't even have a heavyweight division.


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## GKY (Jun 3, 2007)

Can anyone tell me why people type (R) after Chael Sonnens name


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> This is the kind of rant alizio does when he gets frustrated and starts speculating. :thumbsup:
> 
> 
> To say Chael (a MW who trains at Quest - a camp that doesn't currently have a SINGLE PROMINENT HEAVYWEIGHT) has trained with every single UFC HW is obviously silly. He's trained with Cigano, Gonzaga, Nog, Yvel, Duffee, etc? I can't find any records of him even having talked to most HWs, yet alone train with them extensively enough to form an opinion.
> ...


 true he only trained with one of the best HWs ever in his prime, right?? You are really ignorant to how the community is, you dont think a ton of guys go train with team quest or extreme couture guys?? two camps Chael is extremely tight with for over 10 years?? seriously?? you dont think in all that time of training with the top guys the world can offer, he knows the difference between real talent and hype?? again, seriously??

You think your opinion is valid because you are some keyboard warrior with no real experience with these guys. Discredit a guy who has been training with the best fighters in the world for over 10 years and his opinion?? yea Khov... im sure Chael wouldnt know a talented HW if he got slapped in the face by one (and im sure he has been).

What "records" are you talking about Khov?? talking out ur ass?? you dont think a ton of guys have walked in to train at team quest or that Chael has helped a ton of other guys prepare or improve their wrestling?? I know, he is only the best wrestler from the best wrestling camp ever, im sure he never got invited anywhere or knows nobody, not like you!! your on top of whats goin on!! 

Sometimes i wonder about you... simple concepts fly over your head, like grappling strength, now this?? you cant comprehend that you dont need to be the best HW to train with HWs and know who the best are?? You cant comprehend that the best fighters in the world know one of their own by training with them for only a few days?? You cant comprehend that camps and fighters help each other all the time and know a ton about each other?? wow

GKY, the reason ppl put Chael Sonnen (R) is a joke because he is a republican and thats how they identify which party they are with on TV, after their name either an (R) for Republican or a (D) for Democrat.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

alizio said:


> true he only trained with one of the best HWs ever in his prime, right?? You are really ignorant to how the community is, you dont think a ton of guys go train with team quest or extreme couture guys?? two camps Chael is extremely tight with for over 10 years?? seriously?? you dont think in all that time of training with the top guys the world can offer, he knows the difference between real talent and hype?? again, seriously??
> 
> You think your opinion is valid because you are some keyboard warrior with no real experience with these guys. Discredit a guy who has been training with the best fighters in the world for over 10 years and his opinion?? yea Khov... im sure Chael wouldnt know a talented HW if he got slapped in the face by one (and im sure he has been).




The difference here is I'm not going to start speculating. 


I know how small the MMA world is - my friend's student was Koscheck's first fight, my other friend has rolled with the Diaz bros and Fitch, my other friend actually worked closely with Chael and had his first fight in his organization.


But to counter all your speculation and this entire thread... Demian Maia trains extensively with JDS and said he's the future champion of the division and the best prospect. The difference being... Maia has trained or competed with Frank Mir, Nog, Gonzaga, and others.



You don't think Maia would know where the real talent is?? Really??? After all if you don't you're discrediting everything he's ever done!!!!


:thumbsup:


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> The difference here is I'm not going to start speculating.
> 
> 
> I know how small the MMA world is - my friend's student was Koscheck's first fight, my other friend has rolled with the Diaz bros and Fitch, my other friend actually worked closely with Chael and had his first fight in his organization.
> ...


 again, Chael doesnt regularly train with Cain, he isnt his coach or his friend. So ty, come again!!

Wandy said Maias standup was top notch too..... its alot different when its your trainer/coach/teammate hyping you up then just some random top fighter who has NO REASON to say things like that.

If it was Fitch, Kos, Swich or Mendez saying these things, its obv a grain of salt. Chael really has no reason to put himself out there for Cain Valasquez so answer me this Khov, why would he say that? Cain promised him the Latino vote in Oregon??

Did he also promise Rogers some hot mamacitas for showing him love too?? you think Rogers is the real deal,argue with anybody that discredits him but when he says Cain is the real deal, you scoff?? seriously, how weird and haterish is that??


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

alizio said:


> true he only trained with one of the best HWs ever in his prime, right?? You are really ignorant to how the community is, you dont think a ton of guys go train with team quest or extreme couture guys?? two camps Chael is extremely tight with for over 10 years?? seriously?? you dont think in all that time of training with the top guys the world can offer, he knows the difference between real talent and hype?? again, seriously??
> 
> You think your opinion is valid because you are some keyboard warrior with no real experience with these guys. Discredit a guy who has been training with the best fighters in the world for over 10 years and his opinion?? yea Khov... im sure Chael wouldnt know a talented HW if he got slapped in the face by one (and im sure he has been).
> 
> ...


I don't disagree with what you're saying in terms of the MMA networking an experienced fighter like Chael has, but at the same time, just because an experienced MMA'ist expresses an unprovoked opinion, doesn't make it fact. 

It's Chael's opinion Cain's the best, but that opinion is already a bit questionable considering Brock & Mir are also in the HW division. I think Cain/Nog will be a good fight, but I don't see Cain/Brock being that competitive, considering the two are the same beast in terms of style, only Brock is bigger, stronger, and arguably as quick if not quicker version of the same beast. You keep bringing up Cain's elusive, superior BJJ defense, which I won't disagree with because I don't know, but I can say Mir probably knows more BJJ in comparison to Cain and we saw how much that helped against Brock. All this to say, nothing about Cain points him to be better then Mir or Brock, especially Brock, so Chael calling Cain the best in the HW division is shaky in "my opinion" at best. 

I'm not saying Cain isn't good or even great, I'm just saying, just because Chael said it, doesn't really mean jack. It's an opinion and until Chael has sparred or wrestled with Brock or rolled with Mir, what is he basing this on? 

I'm not arguing against your personal opinion on Cain, we all have our favorite prospects. I'm arguing against how much legitimacy your giving Chael's opinion in the face of so many obvious obstructions to calling Cain the best, such as the existence of Brock & Mir.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

alizio said:


> again, Chael doesnt regularly train with Cain, he isnt his coach or his friend. So ty, come again!!
> 
> Wandy said Maias standup was top notch too..... its alot different when its your trainer/coach/teammate hyping you up then just some random top fighter who has NO REASON to say things like that.
> 
> ...


Chael also said that Belfort is the much better fighter then Anderson and much tougher opponent.. :confused05:
He also said Belfort never lost a stand up fight..:confused05:

Just a quick advice, this guy talks a lot of rubbish when the day is long. No discredit to Cain at all by myself!


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## Servatose (Apr 21, 2008)

alizio said:


> you really think there are that many HWs out there that Chael or ppl Chael trains with dont know about or havent trained with?? This guy has been with Team Quest 4EVER!!! Im willing to bet he has trained with or has intimate knowledge of nearly every top MMA fighter for the last 10 years.
> 
> Its funny fans think they know who is the best but when a bigtime insider lets you in on something you all smoke him?? He ISNT friends with Cain. He ISNT in the same camp with Cain. He has NO REASON to say these things about Cain. He isnt hyping Cain up and for Gods sake HE IS A REPUBLICAN saying a Mexican is the best HW in the world!!
> 
> ...


This post baffles me to no end, Sir. I'll make this short and sweet. MMA is a sport where one fighter competes with another, for an specific number of rounds. The winner is determined by either a judge's decision, knock-out, submission, or if the referee deems the fight is a no-contest. In MMA there is always a clear winner or loser. There's nothing to be left to speculation. No where in MMA rules does it say the winner is determined by which guys Chael Sonnen says are the toughest. My point is, your logic is flawed severely if you think you need to be an MMA fighter to see who the best martial artists are. That's not how MMA is. They fight and show the world who the toughest is. 

I'm completely dumbfounded by how anyone couldn't realize this, and furthermore believe that by stating you'd believe what Chael said over that what a fan had to say is just a demonstration of ignorance. Because it doesn't matter what anyone says. The proof of who the strongest in each division is already there. I don't care if Chael Sonnen said Cain Velasquez was the biggest badass in MMA. Brock Lesnar is the HW division's champion. I don't care if Chael Sonnen says Vitor Belfort is more of a threat to him than Anderson Silva. Vitor's been beaten by wrestlers in the near past, and Anderson hasn't lost (excluding his D/Q) in about six years. So go on believing what you will, but it's no mystery to anyone that the top fighter in each of the UFC's divisions are its champions.


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## AlphaDawg (Nov 16, 2009)

I LOL'd at the title. What a joke. Best HW? haha


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

BobbyCooper said:


> Chael also said that Belfort is the much better fighter then Anderson and much tougher opponent.. :confused05:
> He also said Belfort never lost a stand up fight..:confused05:
> 
> Just a quick advice, this guy talks a lot of rubbish when the day is long. No discredit to Cain at all by myself!


I could just said this instead of my long-winded post :confused05:

Good, concise points.


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## AlphaDawg (Nov 16, 2009)

Sorry. Pressed button twice.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

VolcomX311 said:


> I could just said this instead of my long-winded post :confused05:
> 
> Good, concise points.


Next time I write it earlier  Promised^^


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

VolcomX311 said:


> I don't disagree with what you're saying in terms of the MMA networking an experienced fighter like Chael has, but at the same time, just because an experienced MMA'ist expresses an unprovoked opinion, doesn't make it fact.
> 
> It's Chael's opinion Cain's the best, but that opinion is already a bit questionable considering Brock & Mir are also in the HW division. I think Cain/Nog will be a good fight, but I don't see Cain/Brock being that competitive, considering the two are the same beast in terms of style, only Brock is bigger, stronger, and arguably as quick if not quicker version of the same beast. You keep bringing up Cain's elusive, superior BJJ defense, which I won't disagree with because I don't know, but I can say Mir probably knows more BJJ in comparison to Cain and we saw how much that helped against Brock. All this to say, nothing about Cain points him to be better then Mir or Brock, especially Brock, so Chael calling Cain the best in the HW division is shaky in "my opinion" at best.
> 
> ...


 good post and good points!! +rep!!

FTR i dont think Chael coming out and saying Cain is the best HW in the world makes it a fact. Im just showing ppl that the "hype" around Cain isnt from the UFC and the Media, its been mostly from fighters who have trained with Cain.

Obviously somebody saying your the best doesnt make you the best but ppl talking about Cain like he is just hype and not a top fighter when LITERALLY every fighter that has ever trained with him has said the same thing.... from Rogers and Machida to Chael, Randy and AKA.....

he may not be the best he would obv need to prove it but those that think he doesnt belong near the top despite what literally every knowledgeable fighter and trainer who has ever seen Cain up close.... well your getting pretty silly with the hate. 

I dont want ppl to think Cain is the best right now, i want him to earn it. I want ppl to respect the work the kid has put in. The class and the way he goes about carrying himself. His skills and his heart.

Win or lose Cain will have more respect and more fans on Sunday morning, i would bet everything i own on that.

Anytime a fighter is talking about himself (like chael with anderson and belfort comments), coach, trainer or a teammate, everything is a grain of salt imo they say things to hype themselves and teammates up all the time. But tell me, when do guys randomly throw a guy who isnt there teammate out there as the "Best" just for no reason unless they believe it?? Im sure the fighters have conversations all the time about so and so and who is the best etc. If Chael feels this way about Cain i would be hard pressed to believe he is the only one and i would be hard pressed the believe there isnt a very solid reason why.

The only time other ppl saying your the best matters... is when its a fighter this forum likes!! Khov posts things like a random interview where in passing Anderson says Fedor is the best... oh thats PROOF!!! did anderson train with every HW in the world?? has he even ever trained with Fedor?? Funny how things work but alas nobody likes Cain or Chael so this is just a joke but when Anderson says that, its big news and PROOF!! right, khov?? Rememeber this ppl, anytime any fighter says Fedor is the best from now on, IT MEANS NOTHING!! Dont be a hypocrite like Khov guys

Chael was a joke for saying he would beat Nate, he is a joke for saying he will beat Anderson or Belfort, he is a joke for saying Cain is the best HW.... what are you guys gonna say if all of this comes true?? haha Chael is gonna own the MMA world, im on the bandwagon!


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## michelangelo (Feb 1, 2009)

I just realized why Chael gives interviewa and quotes in which he comes across as a selfish and obnoxious 12 year old......

It's because his fight style is so boring, he puts himself at risk of being cut from the UFC even if he loses just ONE match. 

Therefore, the provocative (but highly illogical, even seemingly delusional) trash talk is cheap (in all sense of the word) insurance from being tossed to the side of the road (at least not without making a big stink about it) in the event of a loss or yet another snoozer decision victory.

Jon Fitch + trash talk (+ 15 lbs.) = Chael Sonnen


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

michelangelo said:


> I just realized why Chael gives interviewa and quotes in which he comes across as a selfish and obnoxious 12 year old......
> 
> It's because his fight style is so boring, he puts himself at risk of being cut from the UFC even if he loses just ONE match.
> 
> Jon Fitch + trash talk (+ 15 lbs.) = Chael Sonnen


He just earned the "fight of the night honor"..:confused02:

I think his fights are exciting!


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

BobbyCooper said:


> He just earned the "fight of the night honor"..:confused02:
> 
> I think his fights are exciting!


fight of the night honor on a card with a ton of short fights, and if they were long....werent very good. not a very big accomplishment on that card


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

honestly i think Chael brings more insight into how things are among the fighters then anybody else. He says the things alot of fighters prob dont have the courage to say on camera. Its a shame that alot of ppl are trying to bash him into silence, i want him entertaining and i want to hear more.

He honestly seems truthful most of the time. He always says things that dont get mentioned like "im not delusional, i know all the guy at the top are tough as hell, including Anderson Silva" but nobody mentions that. He has fun, brings some jokes and some truth and ppl are getting all mad.

So what he believes in himself above all others?? If you want to be the best, you better!!

The only difference between Chael and Micheal Jordan or Tiger Woods is those guys have better PR ppl, they are assholes too tho.


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## zarny (Mar 4, 2007)

Sonnen is always good for sound bytes and he is entitled to his opinion. Not every fighter "in the back" will agree with his assessment though.

Although I don't train mma or fight I have competed in several sports at a high level. I agree that often who the athletes think is the best is often different than media and fans. You simply get a different perspective when you compete rather than watch.

However I also know there are athletes who look amazing in practise that just can't seem to translate that success when it counts. Practise players, gym fighters...every sport has their term.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

Spec0688 said:


> fight of the night honor on a card with a ton of short fights, and if they were long....werent very good. not a very big accomplishment on that card


Thats right! But this fight really blew me away :thumbsup:

I was fascinated by it and I truly believe it would be the fight of the night on many many other cards.


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## Thelegend (Nov 2, 2009)

alizio said:


> honestly i think Chael brings more insight into how things are among the fighters then anybody else. He says the things alot of fighters prob dont have the courage to say on camera. Its a shame that alot of ppl are trying to bash him into silence, i want him entertaining and i want to hear more.
> 
> He honestly seems truthful most of the time. He always says things that dont get mentioned like "im not delusional, i know all the guy at the top are tough as hell, including Anderson Silva" but nobody mentions that. He has fun, brings some jokes and some truth and ppl are getting all mad.
> 
> ...


worst comparison EVER

-chael does a lot of talking and this is just another questionable quote from a guy that is now getting enough recognition to have a mic stuck in his face or a media person present when he rants.


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

zarny said:


> Sonnen is always good for sound bytes and he is entitled to his opinion. Not every fighter "in the back" will agree with his assessment though.
> 
> Although I don't train mma or fight I have competed in several sports at a high level. I agree that often who the athletes think is the best is often different than media and fans. You simply get a different perspective when you compete rather than watch.
> 
> However I also know there are athletes who look amazing in practise that just can't seem to translate that success when it counts. Practise players, gym fighters...every sport has their term.


 very well written and alot of what im trying to say. even in poker, the average fan will say "phil hellmuth is the best" or something along those lines, but the average player will say somebody totally different. Ill go with the players opinions everytime.

I also agree with the "practice" player reference. see it all the time in hockey and boxing when i was younger, the best player in the practice cant handle the pressure of the moment. Cain is definately the best player in practice, anybody that has trained with him will tell you that. He has also been very impressive in every outting but yes this will definately be the big moment on the big stage, can he do it vs a top 5 guy like he does in the gym vs everybody?? im getting goosebumps just thinking about finding out 

poster above me, you obv dont know the "real" Micheal Jordan, shit talking, swearing, bad mouthing, teammate trash talking, im the best ever MJ baby!!! just youtube "chamillionaire on jordan" if you want just a small sample. he just had the nike machine behind him and he basically never said anything. never gave an opinion on anything controversial and his PR ppl were the best in the bizz. His hall of fame speech was another classy touch by a classy guy.


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

alizio said:


> honestly i think Chael brings more insight into how things are among the fighters then anybody else. He says the things alot of fighters prob dont have the courage to say on camera. Its a shame that alot of ppl are trying to bash him into silence, i want him entertaining and i want to hear more.
> 
> He honestly seems truthful most of the time. He always says things that dont get mentioned like "im not delusional, i know all the guy at the top are tough as hell, including Anderson Silva" but nobody mentions that. He has fun, brings some jokes and some truth and ppl are getting all mad.
> 
> ...



OH NO YOU DIDNT!?!? 

Sonnen is a up and coming Tito Ortiz, I cant believe some of you guys stand this shit but then go on and bash Tito for his trash talking.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

alizio said:


> very well written and alot of what im trying to say. even in poker, the average fan will say "phil hellmuth is the best" or something along those lines, but the average player will say somebody totally different. Ill go with the players opinions everytime.


haha thats great :thumb02: 

11 Bracelets baby^^ how can he not be the best Poker player of all time?? :laugh:

The best are always the ones who never talk about it, because others already do!

by the name of Phil Ivey


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## Thelegend (Nov 2, 2009)

well i meant worst comparison by talent and level of recognition compared to respective sport.



Spec0688 said:


> OH NO YOU DIDNT!?!?
> 
> Sonnen is a up and coming Tito Ortiz, I cant believe some of you guys stand this shit but then go on and bash Tito for his trash talking.


i hate the trash talk of them both-this guy has done nothing but lay and pray and talk nonsense. his comments have been borderline racist and retarded at times (a great republican up and comer lol). all i can say is he better hope silva retires fast or else silva is gonna send him home in a body bag in the form of a matchbox being played out to the burial site to the tune of the austin powers theme song.


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

MJ can talk shit about his team because he is one of the best ever, that is also a team sport so things are viewed differently. Where was sonnen 1 year ago? He gets a couple of wins under his belt and becomes king kong, dude wont stfu...


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## michelangelo (Feb 1, 2009)

Chael Sonnen is a lot closer to Kurt Rambis or Mark Madsen than he is to Michael Jordan.

Dude, I am worried about you.



alizio said:


> The only difference between Chael and Micheal Jordan or Tiger Woods is those guys have better PR ppl, they are assholes too tho.


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## Wookie (Jul 20, 2008)

Sonnen really has no right to talk like he's the best ever. He likes Cain because he trains with him simple as that. Cain got rocked multiple times against Kongo. If Kongo would have had a ground game it could have been a very different fight. Chael talks like he would walk through Silva. He always gets submitted when he fights someone who's good at bjj. His striking isn't anywhere near Silva's level. He can keep talking his delusional replublican garbage, he should just know, noboby's buying it!


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

alizio said:


> again, Chael doesnt regularly train with Cain, he isnt his coach or his friend. So ty, come again!!




So Chael hasn't seem anything of Cain that we haven't seen...? That's not very good to hear when we're trying to believe Chael based off exclusive knowledge (that he doesn't actually possess).


And as far as Sonnen being the most honest guy on camera... he did tell us that he'll never pull guard because he's a republican and they don't do jiu-jitsu. Then he proceeded to pull guard in the third round against Marquardt. Sonnen is a great trash-talker and is a really funny guy to listen to, and it seems (like Mir but unlike Tito) he has a plan with the crazy things he says.


Maybe he's trying to hype up Cain because he has a big bet on Nog? :thumb03:


And man, am I the only one who really wants to see this crazy world behind closed doors where Chael is scarier than Silva, Cain is the top of the division and there seems to always be hoe-downs? :thumb02:


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> So Chael hasn't seem anything of Cain that we haven't seen...? That's not very good to hear when we're trying to believe Chael based off exclusive knowledge (that he doesn't actually possess).
> 
> 
> And as far as Sonnen being the most honest guy on camera... he did tell us that he'll never pull guard because he's a republican and they don't do jiu-jitsu. Then he proceeded to pull guard in the third round against Marquardt. Sonnen is a great trash-talker and is a really funny guy to listen to, and it seems (like Mir but unlike Tito) he has a plan with the crazy things he says.
> ...


you honestly have alot of trouble with sarcasm.... that stuff about being a republican and BJJ and not pulling guard... you take every word a fighter says 100% seriously. Hell, you even thought Forrest Griffin was REALLY ON QUALUDES cuz he joked around about it, lol. Enuff said on that, my kids have a better sense of sarcasm then you.

he HAS trained with Cain, both camps are pretty close to each other (aka and quest). I said he doesnt trian regularly with him, they arent teammates or friends but he knows him, and knows plenty of ppl that know him aswell.

I really think the only reason he said it about Cain is because he actually believes it. I dont see Chael as the kind of guy putting his neck on the line to big up others, in fact, i cant think of one time he has said something like this??

FTR i didnt compare Chael to Tiger or MJ in terms of skill, just personality but those 2 guys just have huge PR marketing machines behind them but make no mistake both are douchebags, liars, egomaniacs. Sadly it seems part of what it takes for alot of ppl to be the best, they need to have a supernatural belief in themselves regardless of what anybody thinks.


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## Thelegend (Nov 2, 2009)

> there seems to always be hoe-downs?


dude its an underground phenomenon and chael is the best eva!!!:happy01:



alizio said:


> I really think the only reason he said it about Cain is because he actually believes it. I dont see Chael as the kind of guy putting his neck on the line to big up others, in fact, i cant think of one time he has said something like this??


well he did say he would go through gsp and evans to get to maquart and something along the lines of wanting silva to beat vitor because he though vitor was a tougher opponent.


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## NotDylan (Jul 13, 2009)

Get trolled.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

alizio said:


> he HAS trained with Cain, both camps are pretty close to each other (aka and quest).




So it seems that he'd have something to gain from promoting him after all. Especially considering that Quest has no competing HWs.


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## michelangelo (Feb 1, 2009)

And Kongo only had two weeks to train!



Wookie said:


> Sonnen really has no right to talk like he's the best ever. He likes Cain because he trains with him simple as that.* Cain got rocked multiple times against Kongo. *If Kongo would have had a ground game it could have been a very different fight. Chael talks like he would walk through Silva. He always gets submitted when he fights someone who's good at bjj. His striking isn't anywhere near Silva's level. He can keep talking his delusional replublican garbage, he should just know, noboby's buying it!


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## Alex_DeLarge (Sep 5, 2006)

This guy is a real life troll, interesting. I mean really, is this shit "hyping" a potential fight between Sonnen/Silva? Highly unlikely.


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

Thelegend said:


> dude its an underground phenomenon and chael is the best eva!!!:happy01:
> 
> 
> 
> well he did say he would go through gsp and evans to get to maquart and something along the lines of wanting silva to beat vitor because he though vitor was a tougher opponent.


 again, obvious jokes vs serious backstage insight. Chael is a funny guy. Did you really take him serious when he said that whole gsp, rashad thing?? he was obv joking but at the sametime asking for respect. nobody gave it to him after that statement obv it was all "nate is gonna PWN him", "Nate is gonna embarrass him" blahblahblah and after Chael went out and did what he said he would do, ppl downgraded it. 

He says alot of off the wall stuff. He also says alot of stuff that is very interesting. As the poster above and i discussed, behind the scenes of any major sport or event (from poker to ballet) there is always this kind of talk. Who is really the best?? The ppl at the top are in the best position to know.

Its like my poker analogy earlier. When the players talk you get names like Chip Reese (RIP), Daneil Alaei, JC Tran Barry Greenstien. Ask the average fan and you get Daniel Negraneu, Phil Hellmuth/Ivey and Gus Hanson. 

I would like to hear more talk from other fighters on how they feel divisions and fighters stack up but most fighters dont have the courage to speak truthfully about how they feel like Chael does nevermind in a hilarious way.

The funny part to me is those other fighters who may talk shit behind closed doors (in my experience most ppl do) about others get applauded for being "classy and respectful" in interviews when really they are just scared to say what they really think.

Another reason i like Frank Mir, he gives you his real feelings about things. 

Best interviews are Chael, Frank and Brock and its not even close. If you like tp be spoonfed a bunch of PG Grade A bullshit then keep applauding the lame Fedor, Anderson and GSP interviews (partial credit to GSP for being unintentionally hilarious at times and for the whole Mat Hughes "not imbressed" and his "riddum" stuff, but he is usally way too nice and respectful when in all likelyhood he feels he will crush everybody). I hope Chael can bring some real heat from Anderson, lets see another side of him not just the side he wants us to see.


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## Thelegend (Nov 2, 2009)

first things first-i love me some smack talk. if done in the right way (muhammed ali comes to mind) it can make not only one person more recognized but the guys he talks about as well. chael has said some things that aren't "politically correct"-something about anderson not being able to survive where he came from (which made me ROFL considering he's probably from some gated suburb) because he wears pink shirts (as if that means he's a homosexual).

-as a fighter, he has inside info fans aren't privy to but he has almost no wieght behind his opinion in my mind because of some of the things he has already said. he feels as though he knows who the best are based on his "questionable" view of mma. he might know more than most fans but he talks as though cain is the best based on training with the guy not on his performances in fights. Training is only so effective in guaging who the best is in the level of competitors you train with, joe smoe looks like a HOF against some guys just taking up mma (not that im saying he trains against scrubs).

Chael does not know everyboby,his camp isn't that high up there talent wise imo and he is a douche which i consider *fact* and the main reason he keeps giving us so many WTFLOLBBQ quotes to rag on scratch our heads about or question his IQ.:bored01:


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## Alex_DeLarge (Sep 5, 2006)

Thelegend said:


> first things first-i love me some smack talk. if done in the right way (muhammed ali comes to mind) it can make not only one person more recognized but the guys he talks about as well. chael has said some things that aren't "politically correct"-something about anderson not being able to survive where he came from (which made me ROFL considering he's probably from some gated suburb) because he wears pink shirts (as if that means he's a homosexual).
> 
> -as a fighter, he has inside info fans aren't privy to but he has almost no wieght behind his opinion in my mind because of some of the things he has already said. he feels as though he knows who the best are based on his "questionable" view of mma. he might know more than most fans but he talks as though cain is the best based on training with the guy not on his performances in fights. Training is only so effective in guaging who the best is in the level of competitors you train with, joe smoe looks like a HOF against some guys just taking up mma (not that im saying he trains against scrubs).
> 
> Chael does not know everyboby,his camp isn't that high up there talent wise imo and he is a douche which i consider *fact* and the main reason he keeps giving us so many WTFLOLBBQ quotes to rag on scratch our heads about or question his IQ.:bored01:


Lawls jus as long as u remimber him u doin exacry wut he wunts!1

I know, I hate hearing that too. You're right though, there are levels of trash talking ediquette. Sonnen is pretty low in that chain of command. Truth is, I think Sonnen believes most of the things he says. His whole camp is a bunch of captain cuntfaces.


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## Servatose (Apr 21, 2008)

Alex_DeLarge said:


> His whole camp is a bunch of captain cuntfaces.


Well said.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

alizio said:


> again, obvious jokes vs serious backstage insight. Chael is a funny guy.




Just curious. With all this bashing of other people's experience or personal insight... have you ever met Chael? Or know anyone who met him?



Sonnen is great at hyping up things and getting a lot of attention when it really counts. :thumbsup:


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## Chileandude (Jan 17, 2008)

You can be the best fighter on the planet while in the gym, but you have to be the best inside the ring.


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## diablo5597 (Nov 12, 2008)

Maybe Chael is biased for good wrestlers.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

Chileandude said:


> You can be the best fighter on the planet while in the gym, but you have to be the best inside the ring.




Agreed. I hear Rashad has explosive submissions while training. Fitch has really great technical striking in training.


Sometimes it just doesn't translate well. It works in other ways too. A sparring session between Fedor and Shogun would probably look like Shogun is easily outstriking Fedor... but we all know that Shogun would likely get KO'd in the cage.


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## Indestructibl3 (Apr 2, 2009)

alizio said:


> Chael is being hilarious and bringing alot of insight we as fans may not know.


This^^ is what makes me like Chael even more. He's like the ghostbuster of the locker-room.


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## jcal (Oct 15, 2006)

alizio said:


> you really think there are that many HWs out there that Chael or ppl Chael trains with dont know about or havent trained with?? This guy has been with Team Quest 4EVER!!! Im willing to bet he has trained with or has intimate knowledge of nearly every top MMA fighter for the last 10 years.
> 
> Its funny fans think they know who is the best but when a bigtime insider lets you in on something you all smoke him?? He ISNT friends with Cain. He ISNT in the same camp with Cain. He has NO REASON to say these things about Cain.* He isnt hyping Cain up and for Gods sake HE IS A REPUBLICAN saying a Mexican is the best HW in the world!! *
> 
> ...


What kind of good republican would lie like that? (sarcasm) Maybe he is trying to get the latino votes. There are alot of latinos in Oregon. I put Cain in the top 5 but IMO Brock would beat him at the moment. And im sure 95% of the world would walk by Chael to shake hands with Silva in the 'locker room'. Cain will beat Nog though. But then theres Carwin, JDS, Mir, Brock and those are all super tough fights for Cain.


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## IndependentMOFO (Feb 23, 2009)

Before Chael defeated Nate and he talked trash everyone had their arms in the air and shouted blasphemy. 

After Chael defeated Nate and he talks trash he "starts to grow" on people and they "like him more and more each day". This is one ridiculous bandwagon.


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

Chileandude said:


> You can be the best fighter on the planet while in the gym, but you have to be the best inside the ring.


 such an insightful point!! +rep!! 

and here i thought Chael was talking about an undefeated HW who has looked impressive in every outting moving up the ladder. But obviously we are just talking about some guy that rocks ppl in the gym but hasnt rocked ppl in the UFC yet, right??

Cain has lived up to the "hype" so far. Pretty much the reason he has the hype is because he keeps crushing ppl. When the only performance ppl can downgrade about you is a 3 round beatdown of a top 20 fighter, i think you are likely doing alot of things right. The fighters in the back see Cain demolishing ppl in training and demolishing RESPECTED fighters in one sided beatdowns.

Cain shouldnt be respected because Chael Sonnen said so. Or because i said so. Open your eyes to how good this kid really is, thats the hype Sonnen is talking about. Thats what everybody who has come within 10 feet of him training is talking about. Thats what a beaten down Kongo and Rothwell are talking about. How can i kid so new to the game come in and just devastate two veterns with 30fights a piece?? wow, alot of ppl are missing the boat in a big way. 

If/when he beats Nog, his last 3 wins will be steadily moving up the ladder, top 20, top 15 and Nog would be top 5, over 3 guys with almost a combined 90 MMA fights and countless other professional fights/grappling. WOW. Number 1 contender.

Soon its what you will be talking about. Wow, how did i not see how amazingly good this kid Cain Valasquez is. It has nothing to do with him being Latino. I could follow Frankie Edgar or Huerta or plenty of other guys. 

The reason Latinos love Cain is because we can see it. He is a born fighter. Not every Mexican fighter gets this level of respect, believe me. The kid is special and soon the world will see.

I will bump THIS POST on sunday, when the 1st "Should Nog retire??" thread is made. NO, Nog shouldnt retire, he is a legend and he is still a great fighter, Cain is just the future, the evolution of the division. Nog will still beat alot of HWs.


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

alzio, is that a gold platter you use or a silver one?


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## Alex_DeLarge (Sep 5, 2006)

khoveraki said:


> Sonnen is great at hyping up things and getting a lot of attention when it really counts. :thumbsup:


Yeeah, cause...so many people, and I mean UFC fans, knew of him before the Marquardt fight...? Shit, he wasn't even supposed to be in the co-main event for that card.

If he was great at hyping fights, people would care when he fights. Just recently, no one had interest in Marquardt/Sonnen because they thought Nate would virtually destroy him. He sure hyped that one up pretty good....

And previously before that, no one was interested seeing this guy fight. Can you remember one thing this guy said in his previous pre-fight interviews that he made him deserve the claim "great at hyping fights?" And "I didn't tap" doesn't constitute as great hype. I can remember many things that BJ Penn said about GSP, that GSP said about BJ Penn, that Dan Hardy said/did to Marcus Davis, etc. I can't remember a single thing Chael Sonnen has said before any fight and I really doubt you could either.

Like I said, there are levels of trash talk. Most of the time when guys trash talk, they exaggerate a bit, but there atleast there is a small truth to it. With Sonnen, he just talks ridiculous things that have no merit behind it what so ever. He's just a typical Team Quest pud, the entire camp is that.

Now Jesus, this guy has one huge recent win and all of a sudden ridiculous comments like this are being made towards this guy. Let's just calm down with them, eh?


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## joe davola (Feb 10, 2010)

i couldn't stand sonnen at first actully i really despised him but lately I AM STARTING TO BELEIVE


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## sicc (Mar 4, 2007)

.................................


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## ZeroPRIDE (Apr 12, 2006)

stop with the race shit and talk mma please.


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## Rusko (Feb 4, 2010)

First of all stop telling your life story in each and every post you make. Every message you posted can be minimalized to 5 short sentences. Long posts don't mean you are right, it just pisses people off who read them, beause they wasted a bunch of time proving something to you and you didnt get anything.

You can like Cain no problem with that but dude, chill the ff down. 

Could you just simply say that you think he is future best HW? because everything is possible

becuase even with his 6 - 0 you cant say he is, like someone else said you gotta hold the belt.

Win over Nog is good for his carreer but that wount mean he is the best neither. 

Beat nog , carwin or mir and then brock then ppl would happily call him best UFC HW.

If you want him so bad to be rank 1 in the world. He gotto beat fedor, after he beats UFC guys.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

Alex_DeLarge said:


> Yeeah, cause...so many people, and I mean UFC fans, knew of him before the Marquardt fight...? Shit, he wasn't even supposed to be in the co-main event for that card.
> 
> If he was great at hyping fights, people would care when he fights. Just recently, no one had interest in Marquardt/Sonnen because they thought Nate would virtually destroy him. He sure hyped that one up pretty good....
> 
> ...




I take it you never watched WEC?

And he doesn't have won huge win. He beat Filho, Okami, Miller, and Marquardt. Besides Maia Vitor and Silva, that's basically all the MWs who matter in the UFC.


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

alizio said:


> Thats what a beaten down Kongo and Rothwell are talking about.


Having beat Kongo on the resume is losing its stock these days, just say'n :confused05: Cain did football tackle Rothwell to death, but it was a legitimate beat down either way. 

Cain has potential, no doubt, but it's a bit early to be dubbing him with any superlatives, such as "the best in the HW." It's like people calling Gegard the next Fedor, or the best 205'er in the world. He's shown outstanding potential as a 205'er and shown similarities to his jedi master, Fedor, but it's still too early to be dubbing Gegard anything but a promising up & comer, same with Cain, imho.


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## NATAS (Jun 30, 2008)

All this Cain hype is really making me into a hater, he seems alright but im still saying Brock, Mir and NOG mess up his SHIZ all day every day


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## chris&snoop (Feb 12, 2010)

Its an opinion, thats all it is. 

Fighters have opinions, and some like Sonnen dont know how to keep it to themselves. Hes coming off his biggest win, so is obviously feeling it right now, they see things in the gym that we dont, but we all get to see the fighters in the cage - where it really matters. Gym fighting is one thing where fighters have to hold back a little in terms of striking especially, and I'm sure Sonnen does believe what hes saying, but its just an opinion. 
For my money, JDS will be the next HW champ. Cain may be great at one thing (wrestling) but his chin looked suspect against Kongo, and I doubt he can really dominate on the ground against a HW with a superbe ground game. The nic thing is, we'll get to see exactly what hes made of against Nog. That will go a long way in teelling us how hes shaping up in the title picture.


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## jcal (Oct 15, 2006)

alizio said:


> such an insightful point!! +rep!!
> 
> and here i thought Chael was talking about an undefeated HW who has looked impressive in every outting moving up the ladder. But obviously we are just talking about some guy that rocks ppl in the gym but hasnt rocked ppl in the UFC yet, right??
> 
> ...


Thats so funny but true. + Repped for insight Alizio.:thumbsup: And I dont want Nog to retire either BTW.


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## Ivan (Feb 24, 2007)

I've seen south park kids train behind the scenes and El Pollo Loco looks to be better then anybody else on this planet and he is not afraid to die in that ring.. 

2500 viewed this thread and Sonnen got his free commercial.. good job on that..


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## BrutalKO (Oct 5, 2006)

...I think Cain is in the top 4 of UFC HW's (Mir/Carwin/Dos Santos) but not the best yet. No doubt Velasquez has the ability to be champion. If he dominates Nogueria, takes out one of the other 3, then there is a strong case for Cain as the best HW...

*...Dos Santos & Cain seem to be on a head-on collision. I've been hoping that they meet. JDS vs. Velasquez would be mindblowing...*


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

BrutalKO said:


> ...I think Cain is in the top 4 of UFC HW's (Mir/Carwin/Dos Santos) but not the best yet. No doubt Velasquez has the ability to be champion. If he dominates Nogueria, takes out one of the other 3, then there is a strong case for Cain as the best HW...
> 
> *...Dos Santos & Cain seem to be on a head-on collision. I've been hoping that they meet. JDS vs. Velasquez would be mindblowing...*


this just proves that you Cain fans are so far up his ass its ridiculous, you basically list the top 4 HWs, but dont include a fighter whos still the champ,and beat Mir convincingly.

its going to be a beautiful day when Cain gets stomped by big nog, or even if he does somehow beat nog... he wont stand a single chance against Mir/Carwin/Lesnar and possibly JDS.

Cain has a weak chin, and all those guys listed about have some form of a ground game, which Kongo didnt...


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

Spec0688 said:


> this just proves that you Cain fans are so far up his ass its ridiculous, you basically list the top 4 HWs, but dont include a fighter whos still the champ,and beat Mir convincingly.
> 
> its going to be a beautiful day when Cain gets stomped by big nog, or even if he does somehow beat nog... he wont stand a single chance against Mir/Carwin/Lesnar and possibly JDS.
> 
> Cain has a weak chin, and all those guys listed about have some form of a ground game, which Kongo didnt...


I noticed that, too. JDS a more imminent opponent then Brock in terms of becoming the best? Who's the champion? :confused02:


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

the road lesnar has taken to the title makes it very questionable that he is the best HW. Fighting Mir again wouldnt really prove it either, we know how that matchup looks.

I hope Cain gets to fight a guy he can beat 3x in 5 fights aswell. Get some wins Kongo!!!

weak chin?? what a joke. . Just watch the fight, tell me taking those bombs and recovering instanting into takedowns in a weak chin?? Yea. Maybe his chin was out there on a platter that fight, thats a legit point to make. Cain openly admitted he made mistakes that fight. The guy took 2 humungous, flush shots back to back from one of the most powerful HW strikers in the world and not only ate them both, secured a impressive takedown and control. That was poor head movement and having your arms down before a takedown. His chin was impressive. Is Big Nog gonna hit him harder or more flush then Kongo did that night??? Doubtful and Cain looks better everytime we seem him. If Kongo couldnt put him down with those shots i dont see Nog putting Cain down.

The sign of a Champion is how disappointed Cain was in himself and apolagetic to his camp and fans after he basically demolished Kongo for 14:30. He knew the mistakes he made and acknowledged them immediately and looked so much crisper in the next fight vs a guy who i was much more worried about then Kongo tbh (Rothwell).

Ppl may hate the hype, but theres not alot to hate about Cain as a person except the tattoo that seems to get more attention then it deserves.


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## chris&snoop (Feb 12, 2010)

alizio said:


> If Kongo couldnt put him down with those shots i dont see Nog putting Cain down.
> 
> Ppl may hate the hype, but theres not alot to hate about Cain as a person except the tattoo that seems to get more attention then it deserves.


I see Nog submitting Cain, not knocking him out. Cain does receive alot of hype, 1., because hes a new exciting fighter with tons of potential. 2., hes Mexican and as such provides Dana with a legitimate fighter in which to try and build the brand in Mexico. 
If Cain didnt want a huge amount said about his tattoo, having it done across his chest is a bizarre choice no?


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## Ashurum (Sep 23, 2009)

I see Nog taking this. Not that Cain can't pull out a win though.

Analyzing it Nog and Cain both have pretty bad stand up. Neither has huge power in their fists and the feet.. well they should stay on the ground. 

I think this fight will go to the ground because that is were both fighters want to be. Nog wants to set up a submission Cain wants to ground and pound. Nog is notoriously tough and Cain will need to be careful to not fall into something.

Cain is pretty aggressive on the ground so I see Nog taking advantage of his aggression and pulling a submission. Cain doesn't have the finishing power. The only way I see Cain winning is with a tenative ground and pound plan and taking it to a decision and he doesn't seem like the type to just lay and prey on purpose.


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

like I said Alizo... Do you have his balls on a gold platter or is it silver??


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

alizio said:


> the road lesnar has taken to the title makes it very questionable that he is the best HW. Fighting Mir again wouldnt really prove it either, we know how that matchup looks.


I know what you're saying. He got a short road to the championships, but he beat the champion nonetheless. All the free opportunities in the world doesn't mean anything if you don't have the ability to make use of it. If I got a free shot at Lyoto 100/100 time he'd win, because I don't have the abilities to make use of the opportunity. I get the short road argument in regards to Brock, but opportunities don't inherently translate to success. 

I also get the hesitation to call Brock "the best" fighter in the UFC HW, because the word best is more comfortably described by superior talent (and in MMA terms, talent usually implies technicality) and we all know Brock isn't the most technical fighter in the world, but he is still considered the most dominating fighter in the UFC HW and talent isn't everything. 

Look at Manhoef vs Lawler, Manhoef lost, but I certainly still don't consider Lawler a "better" fighter. I don't know what to call it, but I know pure talent in terms of technicality isn't the only thing that wins fights. Brock may not have the technicalities in terms of striking or more traditionally respected skills like working off the back, but his wrestling is legit and that's all your boy Chael has, too. That's not a slam at you or Chael, I'm just saying, I can see people not jumping ON the Brock train, but I don't see why he keeps getting disrespected (apart from his theatrical shenanigans). Being big doesn't automatically make you good, do we need to bring up Bob Sap?


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

alizio said:


> Fighting Mir again wouldnt really prove it either, we know how that matchup looks.


So it's impossible for Brock to prove himself? :confused02:


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## michelangelo (Feb 1, 2009)

*Carwin* and *Cain* are both moderately overrated, but you can't blame Dana for pushing both of these guys. Up until 2009, the HW division was stagnant and lacking in quality contenders. 

*Brock* brought some excitement to the division but very little experience. *Mur* was fat and out of shape. *Kongo* was more infamous than famous, notorious primarily for his devastating testicle strikes. *Mirko* was a bust. Guys like *Tim Sylvia, Arlovski *and *Gonzaga* proved disappointingly inconsistent. 

So by 2008 standards, the UFC's HW division is in pretty good shape right now. 

Cain to get back to the topic, is untested. He has not yet fought a high caliber, top 5 heavyweight. *Nogueira* will be his first legitimate test. 

Nogueira looked solid against Couture, and is amazing from the guard. 

Cain is younger, has fewer injuries, and shows no fear, partially due to his mental toughness but also because of his inexperience, as he's faced either lower level competition, or quality opponents without proper preparation (Kongo). 

It will be tough for Nog to submit a very strong and young opponent, but he can grind out a decision: he's bigger, and has the edge in experience. *Nog by submission or more likely by decision. *


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## The_Senator (Jun 5, 2008)

> Chael Sonnen "Everybody in the back knows Cain is the best HW"


I'm laughing


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

VolcomX311 said:


> I know what you're saying. He got a short road to the championships, but he beat the champion nonetheless. All the free opportunities in the world doesn't mean anything if you don't have the ability to make use of it. If I got a free shot at Lyoto 100/100 time he'd win, because I don't have the abilities to make use of the opportunity. I get the short road argument in regards to Brock, but opportunities don't inherently translate to success.
> 
> I also get the hesitation to call Brock "the best" fighter in the UFC HW, because the word best is more comfortably described by superior talent (and in MMA terms, talent usually implies technicality) and we all know Brock isn't the most technical fighter in the world, but he is still considered the most dominating fighter in the UFC HW and talent isn't everything.
> 
> Look at Manhoef vs Lawler, Manhoef lost, but I certainly still don't consider Lawler a "better" fighter. I don't know what to call it, but I know pure talent in terms of technicality isn't the only thing that wins fights. Brock may not have the technicalities in terms of striking or more traditionally respected skills like working off the back, but his wrestling is legit and that's all your boy Chael has, too. That's not a slam at you or Chael, I'm just saying, I can see people not jumping ON the Brock train, but I don't see why he keeps getting disrespected (apart from his theatrical shenanigans). Being big doesn't automatically make you good, do we need to bring up Bob Sap?


 im a brock fan i think he is definately a top HW but that gold on his waist doesnt make him automatically the best HW. Randy isnt a top 5 anymore. The only real top 5 guy Brock is fighting is Frank Mir, over and over and over again. I know he can beat Frank, its good matchup for him. He could likely beat the other top 5s but until he proves it he has hardly proven he is by far the best HW in the UFC. Another Mir fight really doesnt go far in proving it either. At least Carwin was an intrigueing matchup.

The key to Brock will be able to outlast him and eventually get him on his back. Cain Valasquez has a better chance then most IMO.

If you cant get Brock on his back or at the very least nullify his TDs, you have slim to no chance imo. Mir cant do either IMO, neither could Nog, JDS has an off chance with the power in his hands to rock Brock and get him on his back. I doubt Brock is 1/10th the fighter on his back that he is on top and i bet he has a helluva time getting a great top control guy off him.


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

alizio said:


> im a brock fan i think he is definately a top HW but that gold on his waist doesnt make him automatically the best HW. Randy isnt a top 5 anymore. The only real top 5 guy Brock is fighting is Frank Mir, over and over and over again. I know he can beat Frank, its good matchup for him. He could likely beat the other top 5s but until he proves it he has hardly proven he is by far the best HW in the UFC. Another Mir fight really doesnt go far in proving it either. At least Carwin was an intrigueing matchup.
> 
> The key to Brock will be able to outlast him and eventually get him on his back. Cain Valasquez has a better chance then most IMO.
> 
> If you cant get Brock on his back or at the very least nullify his TDs, you have slim to no chance imo. Mir cant do either IMO, neither could Nog, JDS has an off chance with the power in his hands to rock Brock and get him on his back. I doubt Brock is 1/10th the fighter on his back that he is on top and i bet he has a helluva time getting a great top control guy off him.


you say THIS and yet, you have such a strong opinion on Cain. Dude...please stop posting in this thread, you just make yourself look more and more biased everytime you post. How can you possibly give Cain more credit for beating Kongo and a slow fat Rothwell. Kongo is known as having the *WORST* ground game in MMA.

The fact is that this is Cains FIRST fight against a solid ranked opponent, no matter how many times Brock faces Mir, he is beating a top 5 RANKED opponent.


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

Spec0688 said:


> you say THIS and yet, you have such a strong opinion on Cain. Dude...please stop posting in this thread, you just make yourself look more and more biased everytime you post. How can you possibly give Cain more credit for beating Kongo and a slow fat Rothwell. Kongo is known as having the *WORST* ground game in MMA


 you should take a reading comprehension course perhaps?? i never once in this entire thread said i think Cain should be ranked number 1 right now. Nor did i say i think Cain should be ranked above Lesnar right now. I give Cain credit for destroying everybody he has ever fought, yes, why wouldnt i?? he is going about getting to the top the right way, he is working his way up, nothing is being gifted to Cain. When he reaches the top, the proper way, nobody will be able to say shit and ppl like you will be eating it.

Dismissing both Kongo and Rothwell as just nobodies proves how ignorant you are. They definately arent the top guys but when do you see ppl roll thru either of them like that?? You prob cant answer anything other then Frank Mir on Kongo.... but guess what, Frank is a top guy too. Cain is not only coming up the ladder, he is shooting up it and demolishing tough as nails veterns like they were the green rookies, not him.

Also literally saying Kongo has the worst ground game in all of MMA??? Kongo is an elite fighter and while his ground game may not be up there with the best to say it is the worst in the entire sport is exxaggerating to a stupid degree that makes anything you say hard to take seriously. He wouldnt last in the sport at all if he had literally the worst ground game in it.... worse then Nagys?? Worse then Kimbos??? and these are just guys u see on Main cards of MAJOR orgs.... imagine guys in smaller ones, you really think Kongo wouldnt tank over most HWs?? lol w/e there goes your credibility.

NEW FLASH FOR UNINFORMED PPL!!! Kongos ground game is below average but hardly as bad as some of you ppl make it out to be. Fact is, he faced two of the best ground game HWs back to back in their primes. Most HWs get tooled the same way, Nog is just the next one, will you guys say Nog has no ground after Mir and Cain both beat him too?? Likely not, its just Mir and Cain are TREMENDOUS competition at the top of the food chain and Kongo couldnt hang.


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## Halebop (Oct 10, 2006)

If I can have just one Chael Sonnen crazy speak a week until he fights for the title I will be a happy person. Fighters should have out their pens and pads. Chael Sonnen has successfully inserted himself into the MMA community conversation. Well played, sir. And he's funny the way he seems to talk down to everyone. I think thats going to be his schtick and why we all want to see him fight.


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## Spec0688 (Sep 9, 2007)

alizio said:


> You prob cant answer anything other then Frank Mir on Kongo.... but guess what, Frank is a top guy too.


what??


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## BrutalKO (Oct 5, 2006)

Spec0688 said:


> this just proves that you Cain fans are so far up his ass its ridiculous, you basically list the top 4 HWs, but dont include a fighter whos still the champ,and beat Mir convincingly.
> 
> its going to be a beautiful day when Cain gets stomped by big nog, or even if he does somehow beat nog... he wont stand a single chance against Mir/Carwin/Lesnar and possibly JDS.
> 
> Cain has a weak chin, and all those guys listed about have some form of a ground game, which Kongo didnt...


...Up his ass? So you are referring to me? Instead calling out someone and insulting them with high school mentality, just get real. Cain has no chin? Kongo rocked him badly a few times and to no avail. Have you seen anybody yet in the UFC pick up Kongo and throw him around like a ragdoll? No.


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## BrutalKO (Oct 5, 2006)

alizio said:


> you should take a reading comprehension course perhaps?? i never once in this entire thread said i think Cain should be ranked number 1 right now. Nor did i say i think Cain should be ranked above Lesnar right now. I give Cain credit for destroying everybody he has ever fought, yes, why wouldnt i?? he is going about getting to the top the right way, he is working his way up, nothing is being gifted to Cain. When he reaches the top, the proper way, nobody will be able to say shit and ppl like you will be eating it.
> 
> Dismissing both Kongo and Rothwell as just nobodies proves how ignorant you are. They definately arent the top guys but when do you see ppl roll thru either of them like that?? You prob cant answer anything other then Frank Mir on Kongo.... but guess what, Frank is a top guy too. Cain is not only coming up the ladder, he is shooting up it and demolishing tough as nails veterns like they were the green rookies, not him.
> 
> ...


..."You should take a reading comprehension course perhaps". Nice 1...


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## Davisty69 (May 24, 2007)

Jesus, this is formatted horribly... 

And Sonnen is such a tool. I dislike him more and more every time I read his verbal diarrhea. You will lose to Silva, and fade back into obscurity.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

He walks the line between being funny and hyping the fight, to just being a f8cking douche who I'd love to see get beaten up. 

That "I live in a nice neighborhood, he'd get run out" comment is just too goddamn snotty. I realize he was talking about a silly pink shirt, but it comes off as, "in my nice neighborhood, we run people of color out."

That alone wins him an express ticket to Whupassland.


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## alizio (May 27, 2009)

Chael Sonnen (R) says i told you so.

maybe ppl will realize behind all the hilarious stuff, Chael hits us up with nuggets of truth and inside info.

What is everybody gonna say when he and Cain are both Champions like he predicted?? Damn the crow eating and tongue lashing Chael is gonna give ppl is gonna make the one im giving this forum look like a swedish massage hahahaha


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## JimmyJames (Dec 29, 2009)

alizio said:


> Chael Sonnen (R) says i told you so.
> 
> maybe ppl will realize behind all the hilarious stuff, Chael hits us up with nuggets of truth and inside info.
> 
> What is everybody gonna say when he and Cain are both Champions like he predicted?? Damn the crow eating and tongue lashing Chael is gonna give ppl is gonna make the one im giving this forum look like a swedish massage hahahaha


Cain and Sonnen champs at the same time???? Never gonna happen my friend.


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## Indestructibl3 (Apr 2, 2009)

JimmyJames said:


> Cain and Sonnen champs at the same time???? Never gonna happen my friend.


Not in the immediate future, but there is a big chance it will eventually happen.


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## TheBadGuy (Dec 30, 2009)

Indestructibl3 said:


> Not in the immediate future, but there is a big chance it will eventually happen.


No there isn't. Well Cain got good chances but Chael? In MW there is Anderson, Belfort, Bisping, Wanderlei...and let say Maia. Chael cant beat any of those guys and you think he can be a champ. No way..


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## Johnni G (Dec 2, 2009)

JimmyJames said:


> As a Frank Mir fan I love this guy.
> 
> Only because with all the bullshit he talks people are gonna forget about all the shit that comes from Frank's mouth at times.


Even the Brock assasination thread?


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## munkie (Sep 28, 2009)

I can't imagine how annoying it would've been to hear Sonnen talking out of his nose over the radio! I can't wait till Silva shatters his face, maybe that will fix it. Till then, Sonnen needs to shut the **** up cuz he talks nothing but retarded shit out of his retarded ass.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

TheBadGuy said:


> No there isn't. Well Cain got good chances but Chael? In MW there is Anderson, Belfort, Bisping, Wanderlei...and let say Maia. Chael cant beat any of those guys and you think he can be a champ. No way..


lol what? Did you saw his last fight :confused02:

He would kill Bisping on the ground same with Wandy. Maia could sub him again no question and Belfort would probably lose to a decision as well.

He can beat The Spider too, if he sticks to his roots wich he will.


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## Indestructibl3 (Apr 2, 2009)

TheBadGuy said:


> No there isn't. Well Cain got good chances but Chael? In MW there is Anderson, Belfort, Bisping, Wanderlei...and let say Maia. Chael cant beat any of those guys and you think he can be a champ. No way..


Weren't we saying the same thing about Marquardt? who is better than Bisping and Wanderlei. TBH his toughest matchup at MW is Maia, because his strength is wrestling and his safezone is on top, Maia is a BJJ beast who subbed him the last time - Belfort/A.Silva won't be able to do that.


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## TheBadGuy (Dec 30, 2009)

But Belfort and Silva would kill him in stand up. He could get Silva down but not Belfort. 

Well we saw what happened against Maia. 

And Chael aint gonna beat Spider or Belfort. OK i admit that he could beat Bisping and maybe Wandy but there is always someone tougher in MW than Sonnen.


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## jcal (Oct 15, 2006)

Indestructibl3 said:


> Weren't we saying the same thing about Marquardt? who is better than Bisping and Wanderlei. TBH his toughest matchup at MW is Maia, because his strength is wrestling and his safezone is on top, Maia is a BJJ beast who subbed him the last time - Belfort/A.Silva won't be able to do that.


I agree with you here except I dont think maia- Silva is gonna be that competitive. And even though Silva isnt a wrestler he had no problem with Hendo at all. And he stopped Marquart also, something Chael could not do.


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## ESPADA9 (Oct 13, 2006)

Cain is a phenomenal wrestler with very well rounded skills but he’s a small heavyweight and will not get Brock or Shane down so easily.
I wonder what he would do against JDS? Would he take him down because I don’t think anyone standing with JDS has a very long life expectancy.

The HW division keeps getting more interesting.


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## BobbyCooper (Oct 26, 2009)

He needs to take JDS down!


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## limba (Jul 21, 2009)

I guess he wasn't talking nonsense.
Sonnen has a big mouth, but it's not all b****it.


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