# UFC 81 Payroll disclosed



## Braveheart (Oct 11, 2006)

The total disclosed payroll for the event was $892,000.

The full list of salaries included:

Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira ($200,000) def. Tim Sylvia ($100,000) 
Frank Mir ($80,000) def. Brock Lesnar ($250,000) 
Nate Marquardt ($52,000) def. Jeremy Horn ($25,000) 
Ricardo Almeida ($40,000) def. Rob Yundt ($5,000) 
Tyson Griffin ($36,000) def. Gleison Tibau ($11,000) 
Chris Lytle ($24,000) def. Kyle Bradley ($4,O00) 
Tim Boetsch ($12,000) def. David Heath ($6,000) 
Marvin Eastman ($14,000) def. Terry Martin ($12,000) 
Rob Emerson ($16,000) def. Keita Nakamura ($5,000) 


All the winning fighters received pay that awarded 50 percent “to show” and 50 percent as a “win bonus” — except for *Lesnar, who would have earned a $200,000 win bonus.*
http://mmajunkie.com/2008/02/04/ufc...antonio-rodrigo-nogueira-tim-sylvia-and-more/


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## joppp (Apr 21, 2007)

Looks like Dana spent some on brock. Luckily Nog and Tim got their FOTN bonus so Big Nog made the most :thumb02:


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## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

Kyle Bradley deserved more money after getting his ass-kicked that badly. Think about how much money the therapy alone will cost him :dunno:


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Kyle Bradley already got therapy Fedor>ALL didn't you see the ref giving him a hug after the fight.

Brock brought in a lot of fans for this fight so I think that it's fine he's making so much. 

Also Frank Mir and Nogueria are now much bigger names in a way thanks to Brock.


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## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

bbjd7 said:


> Kyle Bradley already got therapy Fedor>ALL didn't you see the ref giving him a hug after the fight.
> 
> Brock brought in a lot of fans for this fight so I think that it's fine he's making so much.
> 
> Also Frank Mir and Nogueria are now much bigger names in a way thanks to Brock.


Yves Lavigne can hug me anytime he wants


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## kds13 (Nov 27, 2006)

I'm cool with Brock getting paid as much as he did, because he looked good and, more importantly, will make the PPV buys look good. Good to see Nogueira get a bundle, as did Sylvia.


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## imrik32 (Dec 31, 2006)

Does anyone know if Boetsch got KO of the night? I hope he did. It was his first UFC fight wasn't it? If it was it was a hell of a performance.


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## BloodJunkie (Jun 18, 2007)

Fedor>all said:


> Kyle Bradley deserved more money after getting his ass-kicked that badly. Think about how much money the therapy alone will cost him :dunno:


LOL!! No doubt, he should get something for pain and suffering.......but then again, he should get fined for impersonating a professional fighter too!


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## BloodJunkie (Jun 18, 2007)

imrik32 said:


> Does anyone know if Boetsch got KO of the night? I hope he did. It was his first UFC fight wasn't it? If it was it was a hell of a performance.


No, Chris Lytle did.


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## wukkadb (Jan 1, 2007)

I'm glad to see Marquardt and Griffin making what they deserve:thumbsup:


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## MarijuanaSmoker (Jan 2, 2008)

id be so pissed if i was mir, didnt lesnar get like 100k to just show up where as mir got 80k and hes the previous champion? id be flipping and telling dana to shove something up his ass


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## Braveheart (Oct 11, 2006)

MarijuanaSmoker said:


> id be so pissed if i was mir, didnt lesnar get like 100k to just show up where as mir got 80k and hes the previous champion? id be flipping and telling dana to shove something up his ass



its not about how good you fight. its about how many tix you can sell.


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## Zemelya (Sep 23, 2007)

whoa Lesnar make shit loads of money... that's crazy, wonder how other fighters feel about that


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## MarijuanaSmoker (Jan 2, 2008)

Zemelya said:


> whoa Lesnar make shit loads of money... that's crazy, wonder how other fighters feel about that


I wouldntve bought a ppv or ticket on lesnars name alone (if he was fighting a can) it was mirs name that made me buy the ppv (well nog and sylvia, regardless though)

I knew if they threw lesnar a fighter with a record like his or just a bit better lesnar wouldve won, i bought the pay per view to see him lose, dont get me wrong i was on the edge of my seat the whole minute and a half but i was left very satisfied 

edit : meant to quote braveheart


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## BloodJunkie (Jun 18, 2007)

MarijuanaSmoker said:


> id be so pissed if i was mir, didnt lesnar get like 100k to just show up where as mir got 80k and hes the previous champion? id be flipping and telling dana to shove something up his ass


No, Lesnar got 250k to show and Mir was only getting 40k to show but got doubled to 80k for the win!! I would be telling Dana to shove 2 things up his ass!


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## BloodJunkie (Jun 18, 2007)

MarijuanaSmoker said:


> I wouldntve bought a ppv or ticket on lesnars name alone (if he was fighting a can) it was mirs name that made me buy the ppv (well nog and sylvia, regardless though)
> 
> I knew if they threw lesnar a fighter with a record like his or just a bit better lesnar wouldve won, i bought the pay per view to see him lose, dont get me wrong i was on the edge of my seat the whole minute and a half but i was left very satisfied
> 
> edit : meant to quote braveheart


Me too!!


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## MarijuanaSmoker (Jan 2, 2008)

BloodJunkie said:


> :sarcastic07:
> 
> No, Lesnar got 250k to show and Mir was only getting 40k to show but got doubled to 80k for the win!! I would be telling Dana to shove 2 things up his ass!


uhhhh

uhhhhhhhh

uhhhhhhhhhhh

what the ****? :confused02: I think randy was onto something when he said dana treated his fighters poorly, lesnar is making just as much as randy was! wasnt randy making 250k to show and 250k to win?! well atleast we can all agree that nobody would top fedors pay (if he came to the ufc, 1 million dollars!) 

according to dana, fedor isnt in the top 5 heavy weights?

sounds like mr white needs a smack down.

edit : still cant get over this shit, who else in the mma world with one ******* fight, not even a good one at that, would me that kind of money? dont give me this highschool/college background horseshit, there are fighters with better credentials then that making 60k if they are lucky, every MMA fighter in the ufc should be up in arms


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## slugfest (Dec 31, 2006)

So now that all the wwe band wagon jumpers have fallen off the wagon. How much will Brock get for his next showing?


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## MarijuanaSmoker (Jan 2, 2008)

slugfest said:


> So now that all the wwe band wagon jumpers have fallen off the wagon. How much will Brock get for his next showing?


I feel he owes dana the next fight for free, not just for dana but every ufc fighter.


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## BloodJunkie (Jun 18, 2007)

MarijuanaSmoker said:


> uhhhh
> 
> uhhhhhhhh
> 
> ...


I hear you, its frustrating isn't it:angry02:


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## royalking87 (Apr 22, 2007)

wtf brock made 250k hes no where near good enough to even make 100


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## BloodJunkie (Jun 18, 2007)

slugfest said:


> So now that all the wwe band wagon jumpers have fallen off the wagon. How much will Brock get for his next showing?


He's probably gonna make the same next fight because he signed a fat contract BEFORE he proved himself.


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## Robb2140 (Oct 21, 2006)

Lesnar deserves big money, because he brought in new customers. The UFC is a business and the name of the game is to get new customers and hope they come back.

Lesnar did that, so he should be paid well. Your average WWE n00b didn't tune in to see Mir, Nog or Sylvia. They tuned in to see how a former WWE superstar would do in a real fight. Hardcore fans tuned in for Nog/Sylvia and to watch fights, but most of the hardcore's watch the PPV's regardless. Lesnar was paid to lure in the wrestling fans who wouldn't have normally watched.

I am not a Wrestling fan at all, but I will admit I was very curiose to see how he would do.


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

robb2140 said:


> Lesnar deserves big money, because he brought in new customers. The UFC is a business and the name of the game is to get new customers and hope they come back.
> 
> Lesnar did that, so he should be paid well. Your average WWE n00b didn't tune in to see Mir, Nog or Sylvia. They tuned in to see how a former WWE superstar would do in a real fight. Hardcore fans tuned in for Nog/Sylvia and to watch fights, but most of the hardcore's watch the PPV's regardless. Lesnar was paid to lure in the wrestling fans who wouldn't have normally watched.
> 
> I am not a Wrestling fan at all, but I will admit I was very curiose to see how he would do.


 I wish more people realized that fighter purses are not a function of fighter skill. They are a function of how badly Zuffa wants that fighter in the UFC and how willing that fighter is to choose the UFC over another organization, sport, or industry.


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## slugfest (Dec 31, 2006)

robb2140 said:


> Lesnar deserves big money, because he brought in new customers. The UFC is a business and the name of the game is to get new customers and hope they come back.
> 
> Lesnar did that, so he should be paid well. Your average WWE n00b didn't tune in to see Mir, Nog or Sylvia. They tuned in to see how a former WWE superstar would do in a real fight. Hardcore fans tuned in for Nog/Sylvia and to watch fights, but most of the hardcore's watch the PPV's regardless. Lesnar was paid to lure in the wrestling fans who wouldn't have normally watched.
> 
> I am not a Wrestling fan at all, but I will admit I was very curiose to see how he would do.


Good point, I just wonder how many new fans they will retain as a result of Brock, Could be a few I suppose.
Like you, I will pay for all ppv regardless. I just wonder if the wwe fans will slowly fall off the radar as time goes on and Brock is no longer the next big thing!
In the end ufc scored a good card drawer, and Lesnar scored a good deal.


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## MarijuanaSmoker (Jan 2, 2008)

robb2140 said:


> Lesnar deserves big money, because he brought in new customers. The UFC is a business and the name of the game is to get new customers and hope they come back.
> 
> Lesnar did that, so he should be paid well. Your average WWE n00b didn't tune in to see Mir, Nog or Sylvia. They tuned in to see how a former WWE superstar would do in a real fight. Hardcore fans tuned in for Nog/Sylvia and to watch fights, but most of the hardcore's watch the PPV's regardless. Lesnar was paid to lure in the wrestling fans who wouldn't have normally watched.
> 
> I am not a Wrestling fan at all, but I will admit I was very curiose to see how he would do.


figured they wouldve learned after seeing ken shamrock come back to the ufc. :laugh:


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## Robb2140 (Oct 21, 2006)

slugfest said:


> Good point, I just wonder how many new fans they will retain as a result of Brock, Could be a few I suppose.
> Like you, I will pay for all ppv regardless. I just wonder if the wwe fans will slowly fall off the radar as time goes on and Brock is no longer the next big thing!
> In the end ufc scored a good card drawer, and Lesnar scored a good deal.


If that card didn't excite a new fan that they don't like MMA. Just about every fight ended in a KO or a sub, lots of action and some great fights.

People that tuned in to see Brock, got to see a bunch of great fights, so I'm sure alot of them will be watching again.



jasvll said:


> I wish more people realized that fighter purses are not a function of fighter skill. They are a function of how badly Zuffa wants that fighter in the UFC and how willing that fighter is to choose the UFC over another organization, sport, or industry.


Exactly, Brock has a ton of money already and is not going to fight anywhere for 30K-50K.

I believe K-1 paid him around 500K for his 1st fight.


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## Biowza (May 22, 2007)

Seems like fine payouts. Lesnar brought the hype and the fans, so he deserves that much. All the guys earning sub 10k were pretty much the ones coming in on short notice.


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## joey__stalin (Dec 31, 2006)

Mir kinda got the shorter end of the stick heh.


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

> Tim Sylvia ($100,000)


"I'm just the UFC's whipping boy"


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## Warchild (Feb 5, 2008)

Just my opinion, but all these guys are grossly underpaid....


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

Warchild said:


> Just my opinion, but all these guys are grossly underpaid....


Relative to MMA fighters in other promotions?


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## cplmac (Nov 14, 2007)

imrik32 said:


> Does anyone know if Boetsch got KO of the night? I hope he did. It was his first UFC fight wasn't it? If it was it was a hell of a performance.


I believe Lytle got KO of the night.


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## aellis1 (Apr 8, 2007)

imrik32 said:


> Does anyone know if Boetsch got KO of the night? I hope he did. It was his first UFC fight wasn't it? If it was it was a hell of a performance.


*Sylvia and *Nogueira - fight of the night

*Mir - submission of the night

*Lytle - KO of the night

*they each got an extra 60k


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## Warchild (Feb 5, 2008)

jasvll said:


> Relative to MMA fighters in other promotions?


No sir, relative to the sport as a whole. You take headliners like Chuck, Randy, Nog, Rampage.... how much do you think the UFC for example pulls in total gross per ppv? The punishment these guys take is voluntary granted but regardless, I believe their purse should at least be double what it currently is. Boxing which of course is more tenured and widely accepted, these top fighters can expect to make millions off one fight. I am not suggesting pay mma fighters millions but when is the last time you saw a RNC or a Triangle slapped on Roy Jones Jr? MMA fighters take just as much if not way more abuse and get paid chicken scratch in relation to how much the company must be making.


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## OmicMMA (Nov 19, 2007)

Paychecks are on thing. Sure their salaries dont look all too good, but if you have good managment you can usually tripple your fight income with sponsors and other endorsement. Plus, the exposure you get is priceless. I would fight in the UFC for free. Guys become millionares in two -three years....ummm and they dont get all that money from dana, and thats the way it should be!


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

Warchild said:


> No sir, relative to the sport as a whole. You take headliners like Chuck, Randy, Nog, Rampage.... how much do you think the UFC for example pulls in total gross per ppv? The punishment these guys take is voluntary granted but regardless, I believe their purse should at least be double what it currently is. Boxing which of course is more tenured and widely accepted, these top fighters can expect to make millions off one fight. I am not suggesting pay mma fighters millions but when is the last time you saw a RNC or a Triangle slapped on Roy Jones Jr? MMA fighters take just as much if not way more abuse and get paid chicken scratch in relation to how much the company must be making.


The boxing business model is completely different than what has evolved so far in MMA, and danger isn't a significant factor in pay for either sport, since the danger level isn't keeping fighters away.
http://www.mmapayout.com/2007/11/boxing-v-mma-pay-scale-business-models.html

I want to point out again that the UFC is still the top paying organization.

Finally, I want to ask why the UFC would double its payouts or raise them by one penny, for that matter, if their employees/independent contractors aren't requiring them to.

The UFC is a business, not a grandma handing out an allowance. If a fighter wants more, he negotiates for it. If he can't get the amount he wants, he looks to another promotion. If no promotion is offering what he wants, he either accepts the best offer, or heads to another industry. It's deceptively simple, the free market economy.


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## geekpipe (Dec 31, 2006)

*really*

For some reason i do not think people who watch WWE are really interested in UFC. I mean they know the WWE is fake...pure entertainment. UFC is pure skill and entertaining. I think WWE people would be bored with UFC as the little I have seen of the WWE it sure seems more of antics than matches besides the T&A they include in every show. Its a drama the WWE...just like your typical soap opera on daytime tv. The UFC is real people..real fighters...with real lives not a storyline made up in a executive office. Maybe these WWE people are curious about how brock did but woudl they pay $45? I just think they are too into the storyline of WWE to care about someone who is gone.

i think it was more of a draw for fight fans to see how a WWE type personality who was at one point a 'fighter' could do with talented practitioners of many martial arts.


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## cplmac (Nov 14, 2007)

The fighters need to organize then negotiate a contract collectively. I'm not sure how this would be feasible given the way contracts overlap but it would be the best way to settle the issue.

And geekpipe I totally agree the WWE is just a soap opera with amazing physical stunts. It's more about storyline than anything else. I prefer 24 or The Shield but different strokes for different folks. Being that the two are apples and oranges I think it's not unlikely at all that some WWE fans might really catch the MMA bug.


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## Ryan1522 (Oct 31, 2006)

I can't stand seeing a fighter only making $6000.... or for that matter, anything less than $15000. Let's say you fight 3, maybe 4 times a year, that adds up to 45K or 60K. All fighters should be making at least 45K a year (15K a fight) anything less than that is just embarassing. 

Kevin Garnett makes $289 000 a game people! 82 games in a year! UFC are scamming their fighters. No it isn't as big as the NBA, but $6000 for a fight is ******* ridiculous.


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## Warchild (Feb 5, 2008)

I agree the boxing model is completely different, won't argue with that a bit. Also, I am aware that the fighters stand to gain outside of the ring and that the sport is rather young as pointed out in my previous post. I simply feel that the fighters should earn more. I'm sure in time that will change but until then my opinion will stay the same.


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## Ryan1522 (Oct 31, 2006)

OmicMMA said:


> Paychecks are on thing. Sure their salaries dont look all too good, but if you have good managment you can usually tripple your fight income with sponsors and other endorsement. Plus, the exposure you get is priceless. I would fight in the UFC for free. Guys become millionares in two -three years....ummm and they dont get all that money from dana, and thats the way it should be!



That is so wrong. What is you source? And no your imagination does not count as a source. 

Guys become millionaires in 2-3 years eh? Jeremy Horn must be like a billionaire by now right?


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## Warchild (Feb 5, 2008)

Some sort of union perhaps... lol. I know that sounds sort of crazy but hey, whatever works.


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## wallysworld191 (Mar 28, 2007)

they spent less than a million on all the fighters on the card combined.

pretty boy floyd mayweather made 14 million his last fight, which was essectial a hard worked fight.


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## OmicMMA (Nov 19, 2007)

Ryan1522 said:


> That is so wrong. What is you source? And no your imagination does not count as a source.
> 
> Guys become millionaires in 2-3 years eh? Jeremy Horn must be like a billionaire by now right?


Nah its not wrong. Horn has never been one to PROMOTE himself. He has faught over 100 fights. I dont think this man is in it for the money. 

2-3 mainstream in the UFC will make you very,, very well off expecially if you fight like roger, forrest, clay, or rampage. 

Oh and a good example of someone being a multi millionare in two or three years is offcourse rampage. 

I know buisness and i know if you want to be just a fighter, follow horns career, if you want to be rich and famous, follow jacksons...

thank you dodadodadododo


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

MarijuanaSmoker said:


> id be so pissed if i was mir, didnt lesnar get like 100k to just show up where as mir got 80k and hes the previous champion? id be flipping and telling dana to shove something up his ass


Frank Mir's thoughts:


> Brock Lesnar is the reason why this place sold out; let's be honest. I cant draw those fans in. I got it out of my head a long time ago that you get paid according to how well you fight. That has nothing to do with it. You get paid according to how many tickets you sell. With that understanding, Frank Mir doesn't sell as many tickets as Brock Lesnar. I probably couldn't sell as many in the next bout, with him coming off a loss and me coming off a win.


http://mmamania.com/2008/02/04/fran...white-during-ufc-81-brock-lesnar-fight-audio/


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## badguy (Sep 5, 2007)

The fighters negotiate their own contract with Dana. Nobody holds a gun to their head and tells them to sign on the dotted line. Now if you can't make a living in MMA then you need to reconsider your career choice. And if your not established as a fighter or don't have any media attention behind you its pretty hard getting the big bucks. The UFC is a company and people fail to realize that. When the UFC reports earnings people panic when their profit is down but yet they want the UFC to dish out more cash. 

Think about it; if a fighter that came in with no media or fan attention and asked for 30k per fight would you give it to him? Probably not. Then why are you asking Dana too? Plus once the fighters contract has expired they could negotiate for a larger one and have more leverage if they managed to put on good performances and entertained the fans. UFC right now is the big time, they should be considered some of the lucky few that fight in the organization because there are probably a slew of others that would do it for free.

Next time you complain don't blame Dana blame the fighter for signing the contract, and as other people have stated if you have good management then you can get yourself some sponsors to help you out along the way.


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## BloodJunkie (Jun 18, 2007)

jasvll said:


> Frank Mir's thoughts:
> http://mmamania.com/2008/02/04/fran...white-during-ufc-81-brock-lesnar-fight-audio/


That was great jasvll! I like Mir more after hearing that interview, he has a great attitude and IMO is very classy.

:thumbsup: repped


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## Breadfan (Jan 3, 2008)

jasvll said:


> Frank Mir's thoughts:
> http://mmamania.com/2008/02/04/fran...white-during-ufc-81-brock-lesnar-fight-audio/


Thanks for this post! i can't rep you again right now, but boy howdy this was a great listen!


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## wallysworld191 (Mar 28, 2007)

badguy said:


> The fighters negotiate their own contract with Dana. Nobody holds a gun to their head and tells them to sign on the dotted line. Now if you can't make a living in MMA then you need to reconsider your career choice. And if your not established as a fighter or don't have any media attention behind you its pretty hard getting the big bucks. The UFC is a company and people fail to realize that. When the UFC reports earnings people panic when their profit is down but yet they want the UFC to dish out more cash.
> 
> Think about it; if a fighter that came in with no media or fan attention and asked for 30k per fight would you give it to him? Probably not. Then why are you asking Dana too? Plus once the fighters contract has expired they could negotiate for a larger one and have more leverage if they managed to put on good performances and entertained the fans. UFC right now is the big time, they should be considered some of the lucky few that fight in the organization because there are probably a slew of others that would do it for free.
> 
> Next time you complain don't blame Dana blame the fighter for signing the contract, and as other people have stated if you have good management then you can get yourself some sponsors to help you out along the way.


as a fighter i can explain to you in detail why you are wrong.

first off, to start mma (this is for the average person), you need over a years training in thai and jits, thats ganna be almost a grand in training right there, or more. you'll need to be able to take off work when ever you want for fights, you need to be able to train atleast 2 hours a day. and you'll need to be able to pay for your trips to corner people or be in fights or be in amature tournys.

from there after you've made your way through some amature rankings and your ready to move to the pros (generally, after about 5 years of training this is possible) you then have to get your name out there and promote your self, usually creating videos (costs money) then you have to win some pro fights that you might make 400 dollars for...lets say you win 2 fights, 5000-800= still way in the hole on time and money. 

from there after you make it to minor circuit pro fights like cage rage, youll start getting paid about 4 grand a fight....which you get about 1k of after the rest goes back to expenses. also, around this time you have to become a full time fighter, or you wont be able to compete....so that grand goes to the bills on your one bed room apartment.

the next step would be to move your way up to the ufc, and still probably make 4 grand a fight until you've established your name. so after about 6 years in you havent yet broke even.

once you become good, and start making 30 to 40k a fight you can then pay your bills and afford to live an average middle class life style, but your not exactly going to be throwing money around. and your just then finally starting to break even.

after that if you end up making the big money, you make 250k a fight (this is super elite) your then just cracking the high class income level, and can afford a nice house car etc....your far from rich though, and alot of your money goes back out the door.

in boxing you can pay your bills a after training and fighting for probably 3 years....


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

wallysworld191 said:


> as a fighter i can explain to you in detail why you are wrong.
> 
> first off, to start mma (this is for the average person), you need over a years training in thai and jits, thats ganna be almost a grand in training right there, or more. you'll need to be able to take off work when ever you want for fights, you need to be able to train atleast 2 hours a day. and you'll need to be able to pay for your trips to corner people or be in fights or be in amature tournys.
> 
> ...


 Assuming you're right about everything, all you've shown is that fighters that want more money sooner should train to become boxers.


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## BloodJunkie (Jun 18, 2007)

wallysworld191 said:


> as a fighter i can explain to you in detail why you are wrong.
> 
> first off, to start mma (this is for the average person), you need over a years training in thai and jits, thats ganna be almost a grand in training right there, or more. you'll need to be able to take off work when ever you want for fights, you need to be able to train atleast 2 hours a day. and you'll need to be able to pay for your trips to corner people or be in fights or be in amature tournys.
> 
> ...


I see your points but I just wanted to point out that making 250k is hardly just breaking into high class and buying a house and car. did you know that if you make 100k A YEAR in america than you have made more than 90% of all Americans? I dont mean to split hairs so please dont be offended I just thought I'd point that part out because it took away from from your otherwise great argument in defense of up and coming fighters.:thumbsup:


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## Deadpool (Dec 14, 2006)

These salaries are an embarrassment. The payout ranges are ridiculous. It's no wonder so many fighters are willing to jump to other organizations. If the UFC didn't have such a choke on the market there would be no way to justify such gross differences. I mean yeah, I understand it's a heavyweight belt but some of these guys are basically fighting for nothing. Consider the time they have to put into their career (key word, career). Pulling in 6k isn't going to help cut cost at all. It does give one hell of an incentive to become a big name though.

I wish there were some figures on the amount of cash that comes from sponserships. Everyone rushes to use that claim to defend the UFCs wages but no one has statistics.


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## Flak (Jul 1, 2007)

I know several pro triathletes that manage to scrap a living on similar payouts to MMA. Sponsorship is key.


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## Deadpool (Dec 14, 2006)

Flak said:


> *manage to scrap a living.*


Look at the majority of sports with as much exposure as MMA. If UFC wants to be considered the head of the game it should make an example that puts these guys up there with other high caliber athletes.

I'm not saying sport salaries are justify, I just think these guys are getting grossly underpaid. Still, i'd love statistics about the amount of money that can come in from sponsers.


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## Flak (Jul 1, 2007)

Triathlon is much bigger than MMA, and it's still a niche sport. Crappy pay comes with the territory.


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## OmicMMA (Nov 19, 2007)

I may have been a little harsh and one sided getting my point across, but as a fighter i know how it sucks, but as a buisness man as well, i know how to make it better. All i was tryn to say before is yeah i know these payouts suck, but fighting in th UFC once would earn you 10 times the local and naitonal endorsments. When jason macdonald faught in the ufc for his first time the dude came back to red deer and next thing you know his name was everywhere. He had tv ads, ads in the paper...there are many other ways to make money as a fighter guys, i just hope we can all get in on these so were not starving!

YES, compared to everyother sport, ufc does pay the least!


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## wallysworld191 (Mar 28, 2007)

jasvll said:


> Assuming you're right about everything, all you've shown is that fighters that want more money sooner should train to become boxers.


That's pretty much exactly what I am saying...If you are in it to make a quick buck, box.

also when i was sayinhg 250k is just cracking high class i was saying that in comparission to other athletes....look at how much that pitcher signed for the other day...what like 250 mill or something?

boxing is the best comparison for a sport of similar exposure (even though it gets less) and boxers in the bottum rung of things make as much or more than the undercard of the ufc.

one of my training partners (jose gonzalez fought on espn 2 the other night)....he got a 25k signing bonus, when something like that amount for each fight...thats like being on the undercard of the ifl, or actually more like being on cage rage. where a fighter would make like a grand. thats 25x the pay roll, wait no...50x times.

Randy couture arguably the most popular fighter right now made 500k for his last fight. mayweather is no where near the popularity of randy couture (you dont see pretty boy giving motivation speeches to the green bay packers before a game) and made 28x the salarie for a less grossing fight.

no imagine what a guy like mike tyson made? then compare that to randy couture.


mma's popularity is comparible to the NBA in the 18-35 male range (yeah way way more popular than triathalon dude) just ask random guys who won the nba championship last year, or who the league mvp was...then ask some ufc questions, like whos the heavyweight champ, or who was fought alot last year. promise itll be about the same.

i promise you will see a big change in mma fighter pay roll in the future, most likely the near future. because when you crunch the numbers, it doesnt add up.


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## All_In (Aug 23, 2007)

Deadpool said:


> Look at the majority of sports with as much exposure as MMA.


Which sports did you have in mind there? 

I often wondered why MMA fighters were paid so much less than boxers. And I've realized I'm not so much shocked at how little MMA fighters get, but by how MUCH boxers get. I don't get it.:confused02:


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## All_In (Aug 23, 2007)

wallysworld191 said:


> i promise you will see a big change in mma fighter pay roll in the future, most likely the near future. because when you crunch the numbers, it doesnt add up.


Hope you have your numbers ready, because I know Jasvil is gonna be all over that statement...lol


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

wallysworld191 said:


> That's pretty much exactly what I am saying...If you are in it to make a quick buck, box.
> 
> also when i was sayinhg 250k is just cracking high class i was saying that in comparission to other athletes....look at how much that pitcher signed for the other day...what like 250 mill or something?
> 
> ...


 You're trying to compare a sport that's less than a decade old to sports that have been around for centuries. It makes no sense. Imagine what boxers or basketball players made when those sports were just developing.

Also, MMA's business model is fundamentally different than boxings. Take a look at this for a good analysis of the differences:
http://www.mmapayout.com/2007/11/boxing-v-mma-pay-scale-business-models.html

As for crunching the numbers, I'd love to see your spreadsheets.


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## UraRenge (Jun 24, 2007)

Jasvil that is a great responce. When Football just started they got paid minimum wage, I remember Johnny Unitas had to work at a steel mill( I think it was a steel mill not 100% sure, it was something like that) to pay his bills. Sam goes for other sports too. I think MMA will eventually shell out more money to fighters, IF the sport keeps evolving, but I don't think it will be in the neccessary near future.


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## dvddanny (Feb 4, 2007)

I'm completely ok with that payroll, i mean most mainstream sports started out just like that, look at the stories of football players from decades ago, most had to work during the off season just to make a living. The sport was more like a part-time job then a career. Yea it sucks but thats the state that MMA is in now, yea most high level fighters aren't part-time their full-time but they can afford it because they have great sponsors who give them plenty of money while they aren't working (aka fighting) and i'll be willing to bet that high level fighters makes a huge percentage of their income from sponsors not prize money.

wallysworld191, i don't think people know as much about ufc as they do about NBA, not by a long shot. About 95% of the people i know who are extremely knowledgeable about the NBA couldn't tell me who the UFC Champs are, most didn't even know there was a title fight at the last UFC, maybe you hang out with a MMA savvy group but the majority of people don't know squat about mma. From my experience the common fan for UFC is usually a person who themselves practiced some sort of martial arts at some time in there life (tai kwon do, bjj, judo, boxing, wrestling, etc)


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## wallysworld191 (Mar 28, 2007)

That is a great response i gatta say, but i was ready for it.
Also in comparison to those sports you have to compare the value of a dollar from their time. a football player that made 4000 in 1952 when the sport was 30 years old, woulda been about the same as making 28,000 now. (couldnt find a good source for how much it was, but i did see they got 25 a day for meals alone) also you have to compare its popularity at the time (much less popular, 8,000 to 10,000 fans was a good showing.)

so if mma is roughly 30 years old, and lets say a fighter makes 28k in a year right, that would be equal to about 3900. so maybe the pay is about the same, but certainly the popularity is higher (and theres a chance they pay is less, because its quite likely that nfl players made more than that, and most mma fighters dont make that much)

on to how much the ufc makes in a ppv. in the last ppv the ufc made 2,437,890, which was relatively low because they only had 7k paid spectators, when its normally double that.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mma/news?slug=mmajunkie-UFC_81_Live_Gate&prov=mmajunkie&type=lgns

now when randy couture fought GG, they sold 520,000 ppv's at 40 bucks a pop thats 20800000 in revenue. 
http://www.mmapayout.com/2008/12/ufc-pay-per-view-business-in-2007.html

total the two together and you get 23 and a quarter million dollars. so 23 million minus lets say the total pay out of ufc which was 1,450,000 you get a grand total of 21,800,000 in profit after the fighters, dana white has said they spend about 2 mill a show in the production/advertisement. so they make roughly 20 million each ppv event (now they are upping the price to 45, also the couture gg, was an average ppv number, the ufc 76 card was one of the most expensive ones as far as fighters go, and ufc 81 was one of the least production at the gate ufc's in the last 5 years, so some times they could make 40 million) 
http://www.allmmanews.com/2007/09/30/ufc-76-fighter-payouts/

so the ufc desk jockeys make 20 million when all of the fighters (the ones that do the work) make a million combined.

seem a bit unfair to anyone else?

compare the big number fights like liddel, ortiz 2 (over a million ppv buys) to the salary of that event, and your talking double that number. not including the ufc's endorsement deals (mickeys, xyience, toyo, etc) 

is that clear enough.


on another note, im in college, and live with a college basketball player...i know in great detail that market.


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## benny (May 28, 2007)

wallysworld191 said:


> That is a great response i gatta say, but i was ready for it.
> Also in comparison to those sports you have to compare the value of a dollar from their time. a football player that made 4000 in 1952 when the sport was 30 years old, woulda been about the same as making 28,000 now. (couldnt find a good source for how much it was, but i did see they got 25 a day for meals alone) also you have to compare its popularity at the time (much less popular, 8,000 to 10,000 fans was a good showing.)
> 
> so if mma is roughly 30 years old, and lets say a fighter makes 28k in a year right, that would be equal to about 3900. so maybe the pay is about the same, but certainly the popularity is higher (and theres a chance they pay is less, because its quite likely that nfl players made more than that, and most mma fighters dont make that much)
> ...


I feel ya man, but your opinions on this subject will probably fall on deaf ears. i have been flamed myself for the same opinion. 
most people don't care what a fighter makes unless they see a direct correlation to the amount they pay for on a PPV then it will only be to complain.


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

> UFC 81 Payroll disclosed 02-06-2008 09:24 PM whats your prob. with people dissing the ufc buisness practices


 Since you're anonymous, I'll have to address your question here and hope to baby Jesus that you see it.

First, let me say that I will not be returning the neg rep, so you can safely reply without putting your green dots in danger.

Second, I have to ask, how have I disrespected anyone? Is it because I disagree with them and explain why, rather than attack them personally or even better, punish them by abusing the reputation system? I'd love to be able to post within the guidelines you're setting forth (for the love of Shiva, no more red dots), but since I'm not sure exactly what I've done to bring down your wrath, I need you to help me improve my posting. What opinions am I allowed to have and which are forbidden? Please advise.


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## Deadpool (Dec 14, 2006)

wallysworld191 said:


> That is a great response i gatta say, but i was ready for it.
> Also in comparison to those sports you have to compare the value of a dollar from their time. a football player that made 4000 in 1952 when the sport was 30 years old, woulda been about the same as making 28,000 now. (couldnt find a good source for how much it was, but i did see they got 25 a day for meals alone) also you have to compare its popularity at the time (much less popular, 8,000 to 10,000 fans was a good showing.)
> 
> so if mma is roughly 30 years old, and lets say a fighter makes 28k in a year right, that would be equal to about 3900. so maybe the pay is about the same, but certainly the popularity is higher (and theres a chance they pay is less, because its quite likely that nfl players made more than that, and most mma fighters dont make that much)
> ...


Does anyone have anything to refute this? I'd love to see it.


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## Chileandude (Jan 17, 2008)

Brock has to be a draw.

Former Pro Wrestling superstar Lance Storm an admitted very cheap guy who didn't even buy WWE PPVs bought the event, he also said that if Brock had a fight tomorrow, he would buy the ppv again. im also gonna quote him on "I’d pay huge money to see Brock Lesnar vs. Tim Silvia".

So at least with the prowrestling fanbase, Brock is putting asses on seats.


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## milkkid291 (Dec 31, 2006)

Jasvll, where's the link you had about how the UFC is completely different from other sports and particulary boxing because it pays for nearly EVERYTHING.


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

Before anyone reads this, I want to be clear. I'm all for the fighters making more money. Every year since Zuffa bought the UFC has brought the fighters higher pay, and I hope that continues forever. I just don't think Zuffa is underpaying them based on the current market conditions.



wallysworld191 said:


> That is a great response i gatta say, but i was ready for it.
> Also in comparison to those sports you have to compare the value of a dollar from their time. a football player that made 4000 in 1952 when the sport was 30 years old, woulda been about the same as making 28,000 now. (couldnt find a good source for how much it was, but i did see they got 25 a day for meals alone) also you have to compare its popularity at the time (much less popular, 8,000 to 10,000 fans was a good showing.)
> 
> so if mma is roughly 30 years old, and lets say a fighter makes 28k in a year right, that would be equal to about 3900. so maybe the pay is about the same, but certainly the popularity is higher (and theres a chance they pay is less, because its quite likely that nfl players made more than that, and most mma fighters dont make that much)


 Why do you say MMA is 30 years old? The sport of MMA in the American market is 7 years old, tops. The old UFC's were niche events and were quickly knocked down by the state governments. It wasn't until Zuffa worked with the commisisons to get regulation that it became a sport. Even then, Zuffa didn't turn a profit until early 2007 (according to a CNN interview with White from last year).



> on to how much the ufc makes in a ppv. in the last ppv the ufc made 2,437,890, which was relatively low because they only had 7k paid spectators, when its normally double that.
> http://sports.yahoo.com/mma/news?slug=mmajunkie-UFC_81_Live_Gate&prov=mmajunkie&type=lgns


 Normally double that? I don't think so. Your source clearly shows that that's not the case:


> UFC 81 (2/2/08) -- 10,583 attendance (7,167 paid) for $2,437,890 live gate
> 
> UFC 79 (12/29/07) -- 11,075 attendance (10,968 paid) for $4,994,000 live gate
> 
> ...





> now when randy couture fought GG, they sold 520,000 ppv's at 40 bucks a pop thats 20800000 in revenue.
> http://www.mmapayout.com/2008/12/ufc-pay-per-view-business-in-2007.html
> 
> total the two together and you get 23 and a quarter million dollars. so 23 million minus lets say the total pay out of ufc which was 1,450,000 you get a grand total of 21,800,000 in profit after the fighters, dana white has said they spend about 2 mill a show in the production/advertisement. so they make roughly 20 million each ppv event (now they are upping the price to 45, also the couture gg, was an average ppv number, the ufc 76 card was one of the most expensive ones as far as fighters go, and ufc 81 was one of the least production at the gate ufc's in the last 5 years, so some times they could make 40 million)
> ...


 According to your source, the UFC made an average of about $17.7 million per event in gross revenue:


> UFC - 4,885,000 ($194.5 million)(11)


http://www.mmapayout.com/2008/12/ufc-pay-per-view-business-in-2007.html
Assuming your costs of production are about right and adding in the bonuses (let's say $50,000 x 4, the last event was $60,000 x 4, though), we can estimate an average revenue per event of 14,050,000, which is significantly lower than your estimate. Let's not forget that the PPV distributors want their share of the revenue, which is 60/40 in favor of Zuffa. That leaves them with about $8.43 million. Keep in mind, we haven't factored in the back end deals the top fighters like Couture, Liddell, and Hughes have, which can knock off several % points off the revenue. Let's say it's just 1% for the sake of this discussion. That knocks us down to $8.29 million. Oh, we can't forget to add in the royalty payments for the producers, director, writers, musicians, etc. Let's say that totals just 2% for this discussion (it should be more). That knocks us down to $8 million. A slightly lower number, wouldn't you agree?



> compare the big number fights like liddel, ortiz 2 (over a million ppv buys) to the salary of that event, and your talking double that number. not including the ufc's endorsement deals (mickeys, xyience, toyo, etc)


 The Liddell/Ortiz rematch is a statistical outlier, beating the next highest event by 275,000 buys, which is higher than the total number of one event and near the total of several others.

You're also forgetting to factor in the international expansion costs which have 'more than doubled' production costs, and also, the more than $70 million bust that was the Pride acquisition. Let's also be sure to add in the administrative costs of running Zuffa, probably around 100 full time staff.

You're also forgetting that, like any growing business, the majority of revenue is being reinvested into the company, signing new fighters, lobbying for regulation in new states and countries, securing larger venues, etc. Just because Zuffa generates a given revenue, doesn't mean White and the Fertitas are hoarding it for themselves. 

If you're interested in more accurate numbers and more insight into Zuffa's business operations, read these two articles:

http://www.sherdog.com/news/articles.asp?n_id=9528

http://www.sherdog.com/news/articles.asp?n_id=10140

Now, could White and the Fertitas keep too much money away from the fighters? Of course, but we'll be able to tell when that happens, because Zuffa will find itself increasingly unable to resign current fighters and sign new ones as they head for EliteXC, StrikeForce, HDNET Fights, K1, Bodog, etc.. It's how the market works.


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## benny (May 28, 2007)

Unfortunately their style of buisness is like microsoft, buy and kill the compition , so it may be awhile before anybody else poses a real threat for fighter contracts.


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## badguy (Sep 5, 2007)

badguy said:


> The fighters negotiate their own contract with Dana. Nobody holds a gun to their head and tells them to sign on the dotted line. Now if you can't make a living in MMA then you need to reconsider your career choice. And if your not established as a fighter or don't have any media attention behind you its pretty hard getting the big bucks. The UFC is a company and people fail to realize that. When the UFC reports earnings people panic when their profit is down but yet they want the UFC to dish out more cash.
> 
> Think about it; if a fighter that came in with no media or fan attention and asked for 30k per fight would you give it to him? Probably not. Then why are you asking Dana too? Plus once the fighters contract has expired they could negotiate for a larger one and have more leverage if they managed to put on good performances and entertained the fans. UFC right now is the big time, they should be considered some of the lucky few that fight in the organization because there are probably a slew of others that would do it for free.
> 
> Next time you complain don't blame Dana blame the fighter for signing the contract, and as other people have stated if you have good management then you can get yourself some sponsors to help you out along the way.





wallysworld191 said:


> as a fighter i can explain to you in detail why you are wrong.
> 
> first off, to start mma (this is for the average person), you need over a years training in thai and jits, thats ganna be almost a grand in training right there, or more. you'll need to be able to take off work when ever you want for fights, you need to be able to train atleast 2 hours a day. and you'll need to be able to pay for your trips to corner people or be in fights or be in amature tournys.
> 
> ...


You proved my point, if you read what I wrote then, if you can't make money in the sport why do it for a career?


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## jasvll (Mar 28, 2007)

benny said:


> Unfortunately their style of buisness is like microsoft, buy and kill the compition , so it may be awhile before anybody else poses a real threat for fighter contracts.


 I agree with this. I'm not a fan of either business model, although I do see some merit to Zuffa's arguments for isolationism at this stage in the game. At some point, though, the other promotions will be strong enough (keep an eye on HDnet Fights and EliteXC) to compete directly with the WEC and UFC and at that point, I hope Zuffa is open-minded enough to rethink its business model.


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## wallysworld191 (Mar 28, 2007)

jasvll said:


> Before anyone reads this, I want to be clear. I'm all for the fighters making more money. Every year since Zuffa bought the UFC has brought the fighters higher pay, and I hope that continues forever. I just don't think Zuffa is underpaying them based on the current market conditions.
> 
> Why do you say MMA is 30 years old? The sport of MMA in the American market is 7 years old, tops. The old UFC's were niche events and were quickly knocked down by the state governments. It wasn't until Zuffa worked with the commisisons to get regulation that it became a sport. Even then, Zuffa didn't turn a profit until early 2007 (according to a CNN interview with White from last year).
> 
> ...


the football wasnt what it is now until the 60's and it was then when the nfl and the afl combined creating the real pro league. also ive seen fights that took place in the late 70's, ufc purchase by zuffa is the equivilent, in my mind. but comparing the two, probably wasnt my wisest decision.

i didnt look up the attendance things, i just remember the texas and ohio events bringing in 18k people, and the uk ones doing about the same. the vegas shows are always smaller because the venues arnt as big. all and all you got me there. 17 million vs 20 million isnt that different, especially since i didnt add in alot of stuff. i already included all of the bonus, and director/production stuff in with the 2 million per show cost that dana spelled out, so you didnt need to cut all that money out. the ppv people want to have the ufc's and fights, because high purchase items like that cause them to be picked up by more stations and increase there sales so it doesnt cost zuffa much. 15 million in profit seems more realalistic to me.


now about all the other stuff you mention....I am really speaking on an event by event basis, but you failed to consider the tv money they are making from their shows etc. 

i agree their business model isnt built well for pure profit, but fantastic for stablity, and building a market. boxing has a much better system for profit...but dont get me started on there problems.

also because of zuffa not being a public company i have a strong feeling much of their revenue is hiddin for good reason. (mayweather delahoya apparently sold 2 million ppv buys, when i know that less than 10 bars in missouri (hell there was one in kc 0 in springfield, and i assume 1 in stl) showed the fight, when every bar i can think of plays every fight every time, ususally purchasing it 5 times or so. seems a bit fishy. also i tried hard to watch that fight, and failed. i asked alot of people if they saw it, my grandpa (former pro boxer) was the only one i could find. so how did it sale so much more than every ufc?

i love the ufc, but to me zuffa is a combo don king and lamar hunt....great at promoting, great for advancing, and still terrible at the same time. i mean we are talking about a boxing promoter and two hotel owners (cream of the shady crop if you follow me)

all arguements aside, i imagine that me and you have very similar views on the arguement, it just came out the way in which we are both playing devils advocate, cause i could truely careless how much zuffa makes, i just think the fighters should progressively make more, and are a bit behind at the moment. 

and as for why do it as a career if it cant pay your bills, maybe like the old football players, its some peoples calling, maybe like teachers who get paid in the mid twenties a year range. or all of the olympians....the list goes on, when you love something such as this sport, its what you do, you make the sacrafice, no one becomes a fighter just to get paid, they wouldnt make it out of their first fight, being able to have it as a career is just a major bonus, although not practical. 

yeah i think thats all i have to say


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