# Mayweather: McGregor and Rousey are proof racism still exists in combat sports



## kickstar (Nov 12, 2009)

> They say (McGregor) talks a lot of trash and people praise him for it, but when I did it, they say I'm cocky and arrogant," Mayweather told Fight Hype. "So biased! Like I said before, all I'm saying is this, I ain't racist at all, but I'm telling you racism still exists."
> 
> "Laila Ali did the same thing in better fashion. Ronda Rousey, she's a good looking woman when she put it on. Laila Ali is a drop-dead gorgeous woman; I mean a naturally beautiful woman and can kick ass, but you never heard (the media) saying when she had I think somewhere around 10, 11, 12 fights that she was the baddest woman to ever fight on the planet."


http://www.foxsports.com/ufc/story/...mbat-sports-010516?cmpid=tsmtw:fscom:ufconfox


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

Mayweather has some good points. I believe racism is involved to a point, but it's not all about that. 

As I said before, UFC wouldn't even have a women's division today if Ronda Rousey wasn't able to "put on" that good look she does for photos and when she is at weigh ins. I don't even need to say "if she was black", but *if Ronda was ugly* beyond any production help, UFC women's division wouldn't exist no matter how good and dominant athlete Ronda was.


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## edlavis88 (Jul 12, 2009)

People definitely do say Conor is cocky and arrogant. Difference between them is away from the cage Conor seems to be a humble, family orientated guy... Flloyd is a criminal wife beater.

Jon Jones has had as much attention as anyone in MMA history so his argument is invalid anyways.


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

edlavis88 said:


> Jon Jones has had as much attention as anyone in MMA history so his argument is invalid anyways.


But Jon Jones is a well stablished bad ass champion with GOAT caliber now. Do you want to compare the hype and promotion Jones got before he went in to fight for the title with Conor's? Conor was already the best paid and talked about fighter even before earning the belt he just earned. Can't even start to compare pre belt Jones with pre belt Conor.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

edlavis88 said:


> Jon Jones has had as much attention as anyone in MMA history so his argument is invalid anyways.


Im pretty convinced if Jones had exactly the same fights but looked like Sage, his hype and earnings would have been twofold.

Truth is, racism still exists. Pretty much everywhere. Not just combat sports. Its sad, but thats what it is. All we can do is hope that this painfully slow creep towards equality actually gets there eventually.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

@CupCake, look at me, I'm deleting posts and avoiding arguments. Be proud of me. You're kind of like my mum right now. I'LL CLEAN MY ROOM LATER, GOSH!


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

Soojooko said:


> Truth is, racism still exists. Pretty much everywhere. Not just combat sports.


Yes, that's the problem. It's hard to tell whether there is specific racism in the UFC, but they indirectly support racism by serving the masses with racist mindset.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

Voiceless said:


> Yes, that's the problem. It's hard to tell whether there is specific racism in the UFC, but they indirectly support racism by serving the masses with racist mindset.


I don't think racism in sport is particularly conscious. Rather, a subtle undercurrent.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

edlavis88 said:


> Difference between them is away from the cage Conor seems to be a humble, family orientated guy... Flloyd is a criminal wife beater.


Humble? Show me one interview of Conor inside or outside the cage where he's being "humble" all through. The man is the farthest thing from it, it's not all an act, arrogant is who he is as a person.

Family oriented ... possibly, and that's nice. But it's relatively easy to buy your folks a car or two if you're making millions, though it's nothing to scoff at and still a pretty good thing. It's much tougher to actually commit to and raise a family though, so I don't get the "family man" idea about a guy who's just throwing his sausage to a girl without marriage or family. They seem happy together but I wouldn't qualify that as family man as yet.

If anything there are some interviews of Floyd where he is actually being pretty down to earth and humble. 

Racism is probably part of it, there's some racism in every race and country, and partly it's their own backgrounds like Floyd with the wifebeating and Jones with the DUIs, coke and crashes.



> But nah you're right they're white so that changes everything. Why isn't Floyd talking about Katie Taylor, the female amateur boxer who has pretty much smashed every conceivable competition known to female amateur boxing, yet the media in the world never talks about her? Why did he mention Laila and not Katie?


Because Katie Taylor isn't American, Ronda and Laila both are but the only major difference is race. Conor has crossed over well but generally American audiences don't care much for foreign athletes so Katie Taylor would be an apples and oranges comparison. 

Not to mention Taylor is an amateur boxer, not a professional like Ronda and Laila. By default amateurs have no hype behind them, that's the definition of "professional" i.e. having a pro org market and monetise you. Forget apples and oranges, it's more like apples and basketballs.


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## DonRifle (Jan 18, 2009)

Floyd Mayweather is one the the biggest dick heads on the planet. I can't think of a sportsperson with a more disgusting personality then he has. He has no honour in his own sport, has no respect at all for anyone in it other then himself, and its not for show thats actually what he is like. He treats women like dirt and sends his security guards to go up to peoples girlfriends so he can try and buy them. 
The reason flloyd is not popular is because he is a complete and utter *unt of epic proportions. He is never ever humerous or funny he is just a total horrible *unt. And now because people don't like him he's whining like a bitch, despite his 100's of millions of dollars.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)




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## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

Cain Velasquez being mexican, having a giant *BROWN PRIDE* tattoo on his chest & being called the baddest man on the planet after he took the title from Brock Lesnar is the ultimate example of the UFC being biased in favor of white people.

#whiteprivilege #irony #sarcasm #wtf


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> EDIT: Disappointed in myself for rising to this but in *2015* I feel like it's my human duty to call bullshit on 99.9% of "social justice".


I'm so stupid.


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

Soojooko said:


> I don't think racism in sport is particularly conscious. Rather, a subtle undercurrent.


Yes, and it's not a sports problem, it's in the society.



ClydebankBlitz said:


> Okay then, Holly Holm. Hands up how many of us knew about Holly Holm before she transitioned to MMA. No one? But wait, wasn't she the best female professional boxer in the world? More importantly, isn't she WHITE? But, and bare with me cause I'm clearly lost here.....how could she possibly be the best and white and not be well known and earning millions, don't those things go hand in hand?


No, you make a false logical conclusion. Blacks/Coloureds facing racial motivated restrictions/obstacles doesn't mean that every white person automatically gets the jackpot.
A -> B != B -> A

Yes, there are some Black stars like Anderson Silva, Jon Jones or Rampage Jackson, but how man Black fighters got such promotional hype like Northcutt, van Zant or McGregor BEFORE they actually really achieved something¿

Rousey had just 6 pro fights, before the UFC build a division for her. Megumi Fujii was on a f'ing 22-0 streak and the UFC gave Jack shit. Granted, Fujii is not American, but do you really think we would have WMMA in the UFC if Rousey was black¿


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

Trix said:


> Cain Velasquez being mexican, having a giant *BROWN PRIDE* tattoo on his chest & being called the baddest man on the planet after he took the title from Brock Lesnar is the ultimate example of the UFC being biased in favor of white people.
> 
> #whiteprivilege #irony #sarcasm #wtf


Well, what were they supposed to do¿ Continue calling Lesnar the badest man on the planet after he was beat to a bloody pulp by Velasquez¿

It's not about open racism and the promotion dropping N-bombs and stuff.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> OH MY GOD! Stop the presses...did you just give American privilege? Surely we should have some sort of riots or protests over this, that's absolutely shocking.
> 
> Okay then, Holly Holm. Hands up how many of us knew about Holly Holm before she transitioned to MMA. No one? But wait, wasn't she the best female professional boxer in the world? More importantly, isn't she WHITE? But, and bare with me cause I'm clearly lost here.....how could she possibly be the best and white and not be well known and earning millions, don't those things go hand in hand?
> 
> ...


Stop the presses another stupid post from Clyde completely missing the point loaded with broken analogies!

Racism doesn't mean there aren't any white or whatever guys getting screwed. It doesn't mean every white guy has to be a billionaire. It just means that the few are given PREFERENTIAL treatment are of the majority race (and it's not necessarily white, it'll be Asians in Asia etc.). 

I'm aware that there are Frankie Edgars and Holly Holms who are being screwed over or not being hyped proportional to their accomplishments either for whatever reasons ... just like in apartheid South Africa there were probably a few thousand poor white guys who weren't millionaires. Good news, apartheid wasn't racist then apparently!

So Jon Jones is a star in MMA, Tyson was in boxing etc ... do you know what their accomplishments were? THEY BEAT EVERYONE. FOR YEARS. AFTER WINNING THE BELT. You know what Conor's accomplishment is? HE JUST WON A REAL BELT 2 WEEKS AGO. Now tell me who's more hyped and making more money and who has more accomplishments? 

Ok maybe Conor is "promoting himself" more (whatever that means if the org wasn't supporting him) but what about Ronda? Beating a bunch of Kung Fu blue belts makes here the best 135 lb female mma fighter ... scratch that ... best FIGHTER EVER? 

How many talk shows did Dana or the media send Jones to? How many red carpet appearances? How many award shows? How many times was he hailed as a role model for kids?

How many times did he hang him out to dry for "ruining" a top heavy card by not taking a 1 week replacement who had secretly been prepping for him? Keep in mind this is easily currently the most accomplished fighter IN THE HISTORY OF THE SPORT. 

Now compare that to some fat one dimensional chick beating cans who just got exposed, who was "never going to fight in the UFC" according to the same guy that spent the next few years selling her to every single media outlet as the greatest combat athlete of all time, who could not only beat Jones but the champ in the weight class above her? You're right, that's totally normal.

If you want to prove your point, give me an example of a black / brown / non white guy who was hyped BEYOND their accomplishments (unlike Jones / Tyson / Ali who earned it with their accomplishments). Not examples of white people who also had it bad, that doesn't prove shit. 

I'm not even a "social justice warrior", I'm not out to change or eliminate racism, it'll probably always exist at some level in every race and society including black people, it's just people's nature to be prejudiced towards those they consider closer to themselves. I'm just not going to be blind to it though.

Oh and if you don't want to talk about something, DON'T TALK ABOUT IT. 

Clyde: "I'm not going to respond to SJWs" ... types ignorant page long bullshit in every thread related to race.

Clyde: "I don't care how fighters get paid, not gonna talk about it" ... is the first token stooge, 2 posts down from the OP, defending the UFC's shit pay scale in EVERY SINGLE fighter pay thread since the dawn of time.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

I give up.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

I think I made it was far as "Ronda Rousey is fat chick". I gave it a shot. 2016 me isn't rising to it anymore. Have fun fighting for that poor little black guy that needs your strong white knowledge to defend him. :thumb02::thumb02::thumb02:


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> I give up.


You just proved you didn't understand the first line voiceless wrote. 

Giving examples of white people that DIDN'T get promoted doesn't prove lack of racism. There were white people in the deep south during slavery who also DIDN'T get rich. Weidman, Marciano, Edgar, IT DOESN'T MATTER. Read the logic. 

Give examples of black people who DID get promoted BEYOND their accomplishments. You can't. Just like you can't give an example of a black guy during slavery that got made a president or officer or manager or something. You can name thousands of white guys who also WEREN'T presidents, generals etc., that doesn't mean jack. Every single one who WAS, was white.

Understand the logic? Who am I kidding it's you, just repeat yourself for 5 more pages.

EDIT: You deleted your post while I responded, nm.


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## TheAuger (Jun 30, 2011)

People throw out "racism" any chance they get, to explain why x, y, & z happens. What WifeBeater is trying to claim is total nonsense.

Racism has little or nothing to do with it. We are all born with inherent bias when it comes to ethnicity. It's human nature, our tribe mentality. We are naturally drawn to people who look or act like ourselves. 

There are far more Caucasian people in this world that have access to sports/athletes/entertainers than any other ethnicity in the world. Add in our inherent bias & there is no surprise why lighter skinned athletes are more popular & sometimes get a free pass when compared to darker skinned athletes.

That's life. Deal with it. Not everything that negatively effects different ethnicities is about racism.


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

a) racism exists

b) just saying "CONOR AND RONDA!" does not racism make. These are not good examples of racism.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

TheAuger said:


> People throw out "racism" any chance they get, to explain why x, y, & z happens. What WifeBeater is trying to claim is total nonsense.
> 
> Racism has little or nothing to do with it. We are all born with inherent bias when it comes to ethnicity. It's human nature, our tribe mentality. We are naturally drawn to people who look or act like ourselves.
> 
> ...


What you described is the very definition of racism, preferring people based on similarity rather than merit. Then you go on to say of course that's not racism.

But yes I agree it's human nature to an extent so whatever.


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## Hiro (Mar 9, 2010)

Hang on... Floyd Mayweather is an irritating dumbass who happens to be good at boxing. He has a reputation for avoiding fights, fighting safe, fighting boring and hanging around with celebrities such as Justin Bieber. And he expects the same reaction from fans as McGregor gets from MMA fans?

McGregor and Mayweather are worlds apart. There is nothing interesting or compelling about Mayweather, he doesn't finish fights, he isn't anything different, he doesn't offer any kind of entertainment outside of the ring. McGregor, like or not, offers all of that and more. 

Also worth mentioning is the UFC promotion machine. Boxing suffers from being promoted in a fragmented and independent manner. The UFC make stars if they see star potential, and they put huge campaigns into doing so. That's why Ronda got the attention she got, not to mention she also finished a heap of fights in devastating fashion.

We're comparing apples and oranges and some people are calling racism. That's ridiculous.

Rampage Jackson - came over from Pride talking about black on black crime etc and knocked out Chuck Liddell - the current poster boy of the UFC who happened to be white. Did Rampage not get the star treatment and the love from fans? Sure he did, he got it all - he was a star overnight. Everyone loved Rampage until he lost and turned into a cry baby. Where was the racism then?

The reality is - some people are likeable and marketable and some are not so much. Putting that solely down to skin colour is ridiculous.

It's all about personality and fight style - not skin colour.


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## TheAuger (Jun 30, 2011)

Liddellianenko said:


> What you described is the very definition of racism, preferring people based on similarity rather than merit. Then you go on to say of course that's not racism.
> 
> But yes I agree it's human nature to an extent so whatever.


This is the definition of racism:

"The belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races."

That is not at all what I said in my post. No where did I say anything about humans having a natural affinity towards believing a specific ethnicity is superior or inferior. What I said is that it is natural to gravitate towards people similar to you. That goes for whites, blacks, Asians, Hispanic/Latinos, & every other ethnicity on this planet. That doesn't make it racism. 

Natural bias =/= Racism.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

White people are drawn more to white people these days? That's news to me. Did you guys not grow up with NWA, Keenan and Kel, The Rock, Kareem Campbell, Mike Tyson, Skates from Streets of Rage, Tia and Tamera and Friday?


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## TheAuger (Jun 30, 2011)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> White people are drawn more to white people these days? That's news to me. Did you guys not grow up with NWA, Keenan and Kel, The Rock, Kareem Campbell, Mike Tyson, Skates from Streets of Rage, Tia and Tamera and Friday?


Having an inherent bias towards people like you, doesn't mean you don't like people of other ethnicities. It just means that naturally you are drawn to other people like you. It's tribe shit. It's been that way since jump street for Homos. 

And our inherent bias isn't just about ethnicity. It encompasses all sorts of human traits.


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## Spite (Jul 7, 2009)

TheAuger said:


> We are all born with inherent bias when it comes to ethnicity. It's human nature, our tribe mentality. We are naturally drawn to people who look or act like ourselves.


I agree with this to an extent.

My favorite fighter is Anderson Silva but I will always support Michael Bisping over him. It's not a race issue its a cultural one, Bisping (at heart) is culturally very similar to the kind of people I associate with, that is working class people who like a bit of banter.

Birds of a feather flock together. That is why we often see such divides in society.


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## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

Anyone whose ever paid attention to the UFC should know, racism, intended or not exists in that company.

Conor, Brock, Liddell, Rousey, Chuck, Tito, GSP, Chael, all top draws all white, meanwhile Anderson Silva and Jon Jones were blasted publicly after UFC 112 when Dana threatened to cut Anderson and blamed Jon for UFC 151 being cancelled. Hell, Chuck Liddell was the poster boy for skinheads.

No black ring girls, no black commentators, no public black figures like Dana, Lorenzo, Joe Silva, etc. And this is coming from a white person. Not all coincidence.


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

Soojooko said:


> I don't think racism in sport is particularly conscious. Rather, a subtle undercurrent.


I think its all complete bullshit spewed by a racist black guy. Racists for whatever reason love to blame all their problems on racism, funny how they dont correlate it correctly.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Spite said:


> I agree with this to an extent.
> 
> My favorite fighter is Anderson Silva but I will always support Michael Bisping over him. It's not a race issue its a cultural one, Bisping (at heart) is culturally very similar to the kind of people I associate with, that is working class people who like a bit of banter.
> 
> Birds of a feather flock together. That is why we often see such divides in society.


Ahhh no doubt about that what so ever. Maybe it's different in other places but does any white guy think "I know where he's coming from because he's white"? You ever gonna cheer for Wladimir Klitschko over Anthony Joshua because Wlad's a white guy?


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## TheAuger (Jun 30, 2011)

Spite said:


> I agree with this to an extent.
> 
> My favorite fighter is Anderson Silva but I will always support Michael Bisping over him. It's not a race issue its a cultural one, Bisping (at heart) is culturally very similar to the kind of people I associate with, that is working class people who like a bit of banter.
> 
> Birds of a feather flock together. That is why we often see such divides in society.


Exactly. 

There are definitely racists of all ethnicities among the fan bases of the world. But the main reason why some athletes are more popular than others or some get a pass for their behavior, is that people like them. If you are likable & have a strong regional following, you can't get away with more. Both Conner & Ronda have that, while Jones, even though he is a bad mofo, doesn't.


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

LL said:


> Anyone whose ever paid attention to the UFC should know, racism, intended or not exists in that company.
> 
> Conor, Brock, Liddell, Rousey, Chuck, Tito, GSP, Chael, all top draws all white, meanwhile Anderson Silva and Jon Jones were blasted publicly after UFC 112 when Dana threatened to cut Anderson and blamed Jon for UFC 151 being cancelled. Hell, Chuck Liddell was the poster boy for skinheads.
> 
> No black ring girls, no black commentators, no public black figures like Dana, Lorenzo, Joe Silva, etc. And this is coming from a white person. Not all coincidence.


What BS..

You dont give a man a job because he's black and almost as good as Joe Rogan at color commentating that would be racist. You give the top person the job regardless of race.


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## John8204 (May 13, 2010)

He's not wrong, but it isn't a black/white thing. Arguably the biggest reason Pride went under was it's inability to create and market top Asian fighters. Conor McGregor and Ronda Rousey are stars partially due to their race but mostly due to how they win and the fact that they serve two distinct marketing groups, women and Irish. Mike Tyson wasn't a draw because he was black, he was a draw because he was small and KO'd people in devastating fashion. 

A better example towards bias in MMA is Herschel Walker and CM Punk. The UFC believes that a white professional wrestler is a better draw than an african american former football player. As a HW fighter it would have been fine and understandable to give him a 3 fight contract.

An example towards bias in MMA would be what the UFC did to Yves Edwards. A UFC history lesson, the UFC wanted to promote BJ Penn as a champion. They bring him in, he goes 3-0 beats Caol Uno, loses a decision to Jens Pulver. 

So what does the company do, well they fire Jens Pulver, he's not a draw.

Step two they book a tournament...and here are the brackets

Caol Uno vs Yves Edwards
Din Thomas vs Fabiano Iha
BJ Penn vs Paul Creigton
Matt Serra vs Kelly Dullanty

BJ and Serra basically got byes, so they face each other and one of them gets to the "finals" for an easy win, after all one guy already beat Uno and Thomas while the other guy should be 7-0 thanks to a shocking spinning back fist by Shonie Carter. The games clearly rigged...well what happens BJ and Caol have a draw..no champion. 

So what happens after that, Matt Serra loses to Din Thomas. Goes on to win two decisions against Jeff Curran and Ivan Menjivar the division folds.

Din Thomas isn't seen from against until the UFC brings him back for TUF 4

Caol Uno loses his next fight to Hermes Franca..and he's back to Japan.

So now if you've made it this far you are likely saying to yourself..okay the division sucks it's thin filled with cans.

no it's not, the UFC brings in

Mike Brown
Duane Ludwig
Josh Thomson
Hermes Franca
Genki Sudo
Rich Clementi
Ivan Menjivar

So what ends up happening...basically you now have four new top guys, Franca, Edwards, Serra, and Thomson. Edwards beats Franca and Thomson is the clear top LW in the division he should have either faced Matt Serra or his fight Thomson should have been a title fight.

And the UFC dumps the division.

Maybe that doesn't stand on it's own... maybe that's just a coincidence. Perhaps race has nothing to do with it.

What about the other black champions the UFC had.

Maurice Smith - gone 2000 - year before Zuffa comes in
Kevin Randleman - gone 2002 - year after Zuffa comes in
Carlos Newton - gone 2004 
Yves Edwards - 2003/2004 - division gone

The next time the UFC comes close to having four black active and former champions.

2010 when they bring Edwards back and we have Anderson Silva, Rashad Evans, and Quinton Jackson.

Five years later with the UFC as a monopoly how many current and former black champions are on the roster

Jones, Edwards, Cormier, Evans, Silva, Johnson, Henderson, Jackson

4 in 2002, 0 in 2006, 4 in 2010, 8 in 2014

What do you want to bet that when the contracts run out in the next 2/3 years that number drops below 4 again.



slapshot said:


> What BS..
> 
> You dont give a man a job because he's black and almost as good as Joe Rogan at color commentating that would be racist. You give the top person the job regardless of race.


Cote, Hardy, Stann, Florian, Bonnar, Rogan, Goldberg, Mir, Couture, Baroni, Anik, Werdum, Gooden, Bravo, Sherk, Trigg

I don't think they've ever had a black commentator and the stats would be devastating to look at.


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

LL said:


> Anyone whose ever paid attention to the UFC should know, racism, intended or not exists in that company.
> 
> Conor, Brock, Liddell, Rousey, Chuck, Tito, GSP, Chael, all top draws all white, meanwhile Anderson Silva and Jon Jones were blasted publicly after UFC 112 when Dana threatened to cut Anderson and blamed Jon for UFC 151 being cancelled. Hell, Chuck Liddell was the poster boy for skinheads.
> 
> No black ring girls, no black commentators, no public black figures like Dana, Lorenzo, Joe Silva, etc. And this is coming from a white person. Not all coincidence.


We had a black ring girl until it came out that she'd done hardcore porn and forgot to mention it to the UFC. Jamilette is Cuban-Mexican, not Cain Mexican, but born and lived in Mexico Mexican.

We had a somewhat public black figure in the UFC, as public as Joe Silva really, in Burt Watson who wrangled the fighters for weighins for like ten years until recently. I also think I read somewhere that Joe Silva is hispanic in descent. There are black talking heads associated with MMA and UFC specifically, Rashad for example. But from what I've seen, the best black athletes gravitate toward higher paying sports like football or basketball, and that affects not only the fanbase but the amount of retiring fighters they can bring in for non-athletic roles in the UFC.

Also just because there aren't a lot of black people in the org doesn't automatically mean someone is excluding black people. For example, Dana and the Fertittas own most of the UFC, thats' why they are automatically public figures associated with the UFC. Should they randomly give a part of the company away to a black person to make things balanced?


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## John8204 (May 13, 2010)

HexRei said:


> We had a black ring girl until it came out that she'd done hardcore porn and forgot to mention it to the UFC. Jamilette is Cuban-Mexican, not Cain Mexican, but born and lived in Mexico Mexican.
> 
> We had a somewhat public black figure in the UFC, as public as Joe Silva really, in Burt Watson who wrangled the fighters for weighins for like ten years until recently. I also think I read somewhere that Joe Silva is hispanic in descent. There are black talking heads associated with MMA and UFC specifically, Rashad for example. But from what I've seen, the best black athletes gravitate toward higher paying sports like football or basketball, and that affects not only the fanbase but the amount of retiring fighters they can bring in for non-athletic roles in the UFC.
> 
> Also just because there aren't a lot of black people in the org doesn't automatically mean someone is excluding black people. For example, Dana and the Fertittas own most of the UFC, thats' why they are automatically public figures associated with the UFC. Should they randomly give a part of the company away to a black person to make things balanced?


Did the UFC employ Rashad at FOX, or did FOX pick Rashad, and Edwards, and Cormier, and Koscheck.

Having 1 black ring girl in 10 years doesn't seem like all that much.

As for your belief that the UFC has to bring in black people. Well we don't ask the NHL to bring in black people, but when every other company seems to be filled with black fighters, yet the top company has very few the statistic irregularities should not be ignored.


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

Don't people also think Connor is cocky and arrogant? I think there are a lot of people who don't like Connor for those reasons. I think if Connor wasn't Irish and didn't have the pledged allegiance of the whole of Ireland, and was just another American fighter with a big mouth (say like Chael), he'd still be big, but not McGREGOR!!!! big. He also wouldn't have gotten the shots he got so quickly if he didn't bring a whole country with him everytime he fought. 

Also, I think Ronda Rousey was pushed harder to become main stream pop culture than female boxing ever was, or ever will be. If Ali was knocking girls out in seconds fight after fight, she or anyone who could do that would catch more main stream traction. People like extreme domination, which is why Tyson is the most revered by pop culture, but not by hardcore boxing fans at all. I don't think it's all racism, there are a lot of factors in play.


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

John8204 said:


> Did the UFC employ Rashad at FOX, or did FOX pick Rashad, and Edwards, and Cormier, and Koscheck.


Fox did, but was Rashad interested in doing ringside commentary at UFC events or did he want to do what he's doing now? Was he even interested? Additionally, simply talking intelligently about fights does not mean you have the skills to present ringside. We've seen lots of people fail trying, too.



> Having 1 black ring girl in 10 years doesn't seem like all that much.


 I agree actually, I'm just not ready to chalk it up to intentionally racist policies.



> As for your belief that the UFC has to bring in black people. Well we don't ask the NHL to bring in black people, but when every other company seems to be filled with black fighters, yet the top company has very few the statistic irregularities should not be ignored.


What other companies? Are we talking about other MMA orgs, or companies like the NFL that pay more for a month of a contract than a top MMA fighter sees in a year?


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## Joabbuac (Jan 31, 2009)

Liddellianenko said:


> If you want to prove your point, give me an example of a black / brown / non white guy who was hyped BEYOND their accomplishments (unlike Jones / Tyson / Ali who earned it with their accomplishments). Not examples of white people who also had it bad, that doesn't prove shit.



I took this as a challenge... 

Non-white MMA fighters hyped beyond their accomplishments.

Kimbo Slice, Houston Alexander,Alistair Overeem, Uriah Hall, Sokoudjou, Melvin Guillard, Luiz Cane, Brandon Vera

Non-white boxers hyped beyond their accomplishments.

Jeff Lacy, Naseem Hamed, any black HW since Wladimir Klitschko started to dominate.


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## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

Liddellianenko said:


> If you want to prove your point, give me an example of a black / brown / non white guy who was hyped BEYOND their accomplishments


Overrated black people.

Kanye West, Beyonce, Barack Obama, Jay Z, Whoopi Goldberg, Ben Carson, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, Spike Lee, Don King.

Overrated white people.

Bill Gates, Donald Trump, Steve Jobs, George Bush, Paul Krugman, Richard Dawkins, Sam Harris, Christopher Hitchens, Alan Greenspan, Hugh Grant, JJ Abrams.

Wait. Was this supposed to prove something?


----------



## John8204 (May 13, 2010)

HexRei said:


> Fox did, but was Rashad interested in doing ringside commentary at UFC events or did he want to do what he's doing now? Was he even interested? Additionally, simply talking intelligently about fights does not mean you have the skills to present ringside. We've seen lots of people fail trying, too.


True but this is every guy I know that did commentary for the UFC.

Cote, Hardy, Stann, Florian, Bonnar, Rogan, Goldberg, Mir, Couture, Baroni, Anik, Werdum, Gooden, Bravo, Sherk, Trigg

I don't know who the Brazilian commentators are. But King Mo was very good when he called the first Invicta show, not for the UFC.




> I agree actually, I'm just not ready to chalk it up to intentionally racist policies.


Which is perfectly fine, but it seems to me everytime anyone brings up race it's automatically "it doesn't exist". And that's it's own problem.




> What other companies? Are we talking about other MMA orgs, or companies like the NFL that pay more for a month of a contract than a top MMA fighter sees in a year?


I'm talking other MMA companies, Bellator, Strikeforce, Pride, WSOF, WEC.


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

John8204 said:


> TWhich is perfectly fine, but it seems to me everytime anyone brings up race it's automatically "it doesn't exist". And that's it's own problem.


When you say racism, a lot of people probably think Rosa Parks time and therefore think it doesn't exist anymore.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> @CupCake, look at me, I'm deleting posts and avoiding arguments. Be proud of me. You're kind of like my mum right now. I'LL CLEAN MY ROOM LATER, GOSH!


Avoiding baiting people and arguing and making sure to think before you type? GOOD JOB CLYDE! :hug:

Ronda got hype fast because she's a woman, let's be real here. It's a case of this whole "feminism" phase going on where everyone is trying to show how amazing women are. She got lucky and landed in the right exact spot during the right era, nothing more nothing less. "women can do anything, and should be paid lots of money!" is the big fad going on right now, and she just so happened to have been in the perfect position to take advantage of that. Every interview is "you're a woman, do you make as much money as the men in the UFC?". That's mentioned in like every interview. She was on the view or some female dominated show and all the women were flapping their arms in praise. That's all it was with her, just got popular at the right time in the right place and she blew up, it has nothing to do with her being white. She/the UFC took ahold of this whole feminism movement and ran with it, and as such was in the media constantly and was big and did lots of interviews which lead to movies, and so on.

Conor brought a whole country with him and was, from what I understand, very popular before even coming to the UFC. Do you know why Bisping is the highest paid fighter in the UFC? Let me tell you - it isn't 'cause he's white. It's 'cause of where he's from the and market he tapped into when he got popular and the crowd that he draws. It's the same thing with Conor, except Conor is a better fighter than Bisping, had the legit potential to win the title (and did), and had an extreme personality to market. Again, it has nothing to do with the fact that he's white, anyone with a brain can see all the reasons why Conor and Ronda got popular, it has to do with tapping into an entire country and tapping into the whole "feminism/women deserve more" crowds and exploiting them to the highest degree. They did the same thing with Bisping, hell they do the same thing with Brazilians by having 90% of the card have Brazilian fighters when they do fights over there. They are constantly using whatever they can to make money off guys, be it for their nationality like Bisping/Conor/brazilians, or be it exploiting the whole feminism movement with Ronda and "women power!" stuff.


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## John8204 (May 13, 2010)

Voiceless said:


> When you say racism, a lot of people probably think Rosa Parks time and therefore think it doesn't exist anymore.


Also ego, people hate to think of the advantages they have had in life and will defend their notion of self above all else.

It's like when people hated Jon Jones for being "fake". Okay I can understand that...but it's only Jon Jones who's hated for being fake has any white fighter ever been universally hated for being "fake".

World War III is starting right now in the middle east between Shi'a and Sunnis do you think either groups thinks that they are racist, even though those races have been artificially created by their own societies.

But that's the middle east, we are so much more evolved and better than those people...right....


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

John8204 said:


> Also ego, people hate to think of the advantages they have had in life and will defend their notion of self above all else.
> 
> It's like when people hated Jon Jones for being "fake". Okay I can understand that...but it's only Jon Jones who's hated for being fake has any white fighter ever been universally hated for being "fake".
> 
> ...


Sonnen was hated for being "fake". People hated his act and many people called him a clown. Most people on this forum were against him as well, only a select few enjoyed his act.


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## John8204 (May 13, 2010)

M.C said:


> Sonnen was hated for being "fake". People hated his act and many people called him a clown. Most people on this forum were against him as well, only a select few enjoyed his act.


I thought it was about 50/50, but nobody cared about Sonnen until he started acting "fake".


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

John8204 said:


> I thought it was about 50/50, but nobody cared about Sonnen until he started acting "fake".


Most people wanted to see him lose so he would shut his mouth. As for being popular for his act, you are right. He started doing that, fought Silva and almost beat him, and he blew up. Shit talking and what not brings views, both positive and negative views (hello Conor). Many people tuned into the second fight just to see him get KO'd. 

So yeah, Jones is most certainly not the first person to be called out on being fake.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

@M.C., I'm usually never wrong in my debates, I usually just write massive paragraphs on stupid topics like the UFC being racist by promoting Conor McGregor.

*Looks at the rest of your post*

It looks like I'm not needed :laugh:


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## Evo (Feb 12, 2007)

Soojooko said:


> Truth is, racism still exists. Pretty much everywhere. Not just combat sports. Its sad, but thats what it is. All we can do is hope that this painfully slow creep towards equality actually gets there eventually.


Here's the delicious part of this racist talk. When you mention racism here, which color are you thinking of when you say it? When you, and others, say racism is still a problem today what they're really saying is most white people are still racist whether they're doing it consciously or not.

I love how it's ok to imply things like that and it's not racist. It's not racist to assume that the reason people don't like mayweather is because he's black and they're white (that's what's implied).

I get really tired of this double standard sometimes. He only assumes it's racist because he's black, which is automatically implying that white people are more racist than other races, and that kind of thinking IS RACIST.

I always find the people screaming racism all the damn time are the only ones obsessed with someones skin color.


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

Evo said:


> Here's the delicious part of this racist talk. When you mention racism here, which color are you thinking of when you say it? When you, and others, say racism is still a problem today what they're really saying is most white people are still racist whether they're doing it consciously or not.
> 
> I love how it's ok to imply things like that and it's not racist. It's not racist to assume that the reason people don't like mayweather is because he's black and they're white (that's what's implied).
> 
> ...


Nice try, trying to tell that racism doesn't actually exist and only people who point out racism have actually racist thinking...

Yes, people from all skin colours can be racist and there ARE racists from all skin colours, BUT that doesn't make racism performed by white people (that in the Western world are on average in higher power position and therefore have a bigger impact on the lives of those experiencing the racism) less racist.

But I forgot, the US has a black president (why is he actually called "black"¿ His mother is white), so there is no racism in the US anymore (a part from those that point out racism of course) - delicious :sarcastic12:


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## DonRifle (Jan 18, 2009)

Voiceless said:


> Nice try, trying to tell that racism doesn't actually exist and only people who point out racism have actually racist thinking...
> 
> Yes, people from all skin colours can be racist and there ARE racists from all skin colours, BUT that doesn't make racism performed by white people (that in the Western world are on average in higher power position and therefore have a bigger impact on the lives of those experiencing the racism) less racist.
> 
> But I forgot, the US has a black president (why is he actually called "black"¿ His mother is white), so there is no racism in the US anymore (a part from those that point out racism of course) - delicious :sarcastic12:


And Obama's actually Irish believe it or not. 

But I'm not sure how we Irish can be determined as white since I am translucent in winter and pink in the summer?


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## Anteries (Oct 22, 2010)

DonRifle said:


> Floyd Mayweather is one the the biggest dick heads on the planet. I can't think of a sportsperson with a more disgusting personality then he has. He has no honour in his own sport, has no respect at all for anyone in it other then himself, and its not for show thats actually what he is like. He treats women like dirt and sends his security guards to go up to peoples girlfriends so he can try and buy them.
> The reason flloyd is not popular is because he is a complete and utter *unt of epic proportions. He is never ever humerous or funny he is just a total horrible *unt. And now because people don't like him he's whining like a bitch, despite his 100's of millions of dollars.


Conor McGregor is one the the biggest dick heads on the planet. I can't think of a sportsperson with a more disgusting personality then he has. He has no honour in his own sport, has no respect at all for anyone in it other then himself, and its not for show thats actually what he is like. He treats women like dirt and sends his security guards to go up to peoples girlfriends so he can try and buy them. 
The reason Conor is not popular is because he is a complete and utter *unt of epic proportions. He is never ever humerous or funny he is just a total horrible *unt. And now because people don't like him he's whining like a bitch, despite his 100's of millions of dollars.:thumb02::thumb02:


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## DonRifle (Jan 18, 2009)

Anteries said:


> Conor McGregor is one the the biggest dick heads on the planet. I can't think of a sportsperson with a more disgusting personality then he has. He has no honour in his own sport, has no respect at all for anyone in it other then himself, and its not for show thats actually what he is like. He treats women like dirt and sends his security guards to go up to peoples girlfriends so he can try and buy them.
> The reason Conor is not popular is because he is a complete and utter *unt of epic proportions. He is never ever humerous or funny he is just a total horrible *unt. And now because people don't like him he's whining like a bitch, despite his 100's of millions of dollars.:thumb02::thumb02:


Racist!!!


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

Anteries said:


> ... The reason Conor is not popular ...


:laugh:

Compared to who? Beyonce?


----------



## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

Joabbuac said:


> I took this as a challenge...
> 
> Non-white MMA fighters hyped beyond their accomplishments.
> 
> ...


Kimbo had 10000 youtube videos and a fanbase of millions before he came over, and he was not given any special treatment ... the UFC brought him in to debunk him, not hype him, he was treated like crap on TUF not hyped which they could have easily edited to make it so if they wanted. This counters your point more than proves it.

Houston Alexander, Overeem, Hall, Sokoudjou etc. were all hyped EXACTLY according to their accomplishments at the time and not a hair more. How many of them were given undeserved (or any) title fights like Sonnen was or easy stylistic matchups? How many were featured in promos, videogame / magazine covers, talk shows etc.? How many were paid anything significantly over their level? None.

Alexander KOd a top 10 LHW in his debut, he was given some leeway then dropped when it turned out he wasn't as good as his early fights. Same with Sokoudjou, who KOd not one but two top 10s outside the UFC. I don't see how that's being hyped BEYOND accomplishments.

Overeem won the K1 GP and racked up an enormous line of KOs outside the UFC, he was given a usual fight or two at his level, and now he's being dropped as a free agent even after his impressive record. 

Hall was slightly hyped because he was the most exciting fighter on a TUF season filled with complete noobs and one other decent guy, and he certainly didn't get any gift fights or easy roads.

Luiz Cane and Brandon Vera were undefeated fighters who were finishing top 15s easily, they got dropped as soon as that stopped. Vera was dropped after losing a fight in which his opponent tested positive for high T.

How is any of this preferential treatment? They got what they earned with their records, no more, maybe less. 

Now Sonnen getting a title shot at LHW with ZERO wins at that weight, Rousey being hailed as the greatest fighter of all time or Conor being gifted a title shot for beating cans and a borderline top 10 (which he later vindicated by facing Mendes albeit at short notice, but it was undeserved initially) ... give me the non white equivalent of that.



Trix said:


> Overrated black people.
> 
> Kanye West, Beyonce, Barack Obama, Jay Z, Whoopi Goldberg, Ben Carson, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, Spike Lee, Don King.
> 
> ...


Maybe you didn't get the memo, we were talking about the UFC not every media outlet in society. I'm aware that there are many liberal media outlets that not only hype black or minority personalities but may be biased towards them. Give me examples from the UFC.

Wait was this supposed to prove something?


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## edlavis88 (Jul 12, 2009)

Liddellianenko said:


> Now Sonnen getting a title shot at LHW with ZERO wins at that weight, Rousey being hailed as the greatest fighter of all time or *Conor being gifted a title shot for beating cans and a borderline top 10 (which he later vindicated by facing Mendes albeit at short notice, but it was undeserved initially) ... give me the non white equivalent of that.*


I think everyone agrees Sonnen's shot was BS. Ultimately I think it came down to the UFC trying to cash in on his popularity/infamy at the time.

Conor is a terrible example though as his route to the belt is pretty much identical to Jon Jones. 

Both came in got a few very impressive wins over favourable opponents, both took a small step up to facing a fringe top 10 guy, beat them handily and got their shot straight after.
I'm not sure if everyone's memory is that bad or just a lot of people didn't follow MMA a few years ago but Jones was being groomed as a future champ from a very early stage and the UFC pushed him down the public's throat just as much as they have been with Conor and Ronda, the only difference is they didn't have as many platforms back then to promote on. If they had the FOX deal in place and fight pass etc, we'd have been getting Bones Jones content 24/7.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

TheAuger said:


> This is the definition of racism:
> 
> "The belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races."
> 
> ...


This is fine when it's at a personal level .. you wanna make friends / relationships with people your own race / community / religion / whatever ? That's fine, it's personal preference. 

When it's done at an institutional level it is racism. Modern societies claim to function mostly as meritocracies and that's a hollow claim if you always pick the less capable guy based on color. Especially sports, the whole point of sports is supposed to be about who the best is, not who the best is of the color that people like.

Yeah it's human nature, but one doesn't have to play pretend just because it is. It is what it is.



edlavis88 said:


> I think everyone agrees Sonnen's shot was BS. Ultimately I think it came down to the UFC trying to cash in on his popularity/infamy at the time.
> 
> Conor is a terrible example though as his route to the belt is pretty much identical to Jon Jones.
> 
> ...


Jones was 7-0 in the UFC if you count the Hamill "loss" for what it was, and undefeated in MMA. Conor was 5-0, with 2 bad losses outside the UFC. 

Jones' best win was Bader, also an undefeated solid top 10 (I think #7 or 8 at the time), TUF winner, NCAA Div I All American and the current #1/#2 LHW contender. Conor's best win was Dustin freakin Poirier who had a patchy record at FW, no credentials, was moved into the UFC's "top 10" FW list just a few hours before the Conor fight was announced, and isn't even top 15 at LW. 

The comparison is not valid.



> Ronda got hype fast because she's a woman, let's be real here. It's a case of this whole "feminism" phase going on where everyone is trying to show how amazing women are. She got lucky and landed in the right exact spot during the right era, nothing more nothing less. "women can do anything, and should be paid lots of money!" is the big fad going on right now, and she just so happened to have been in the perfect position to take advantage of that. Every interview is "you're a woman, do you make as much money as the men in the UFC?". That's mentioned in like every interview. She was on the view or some female dominated show and all the women were flapping their arms in praise. That's all it was with her, just got popular at the right time in the right place and she blew up, it has nothing to do with her being white. She/the UFC took ahold of this whole feminism movement and ran with it, and as such was in the media constantly and was big and did lots of interviews which lead to movies, and so on.


Feminism is of course the major reason behind Ronda's push but it's not the only reason ... Mayweather makes a good point about Laila Ali, also a woman, also an (arguably more impressive) fighter, not hailed as the GOAT or next female role model.


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## edlavis88 (Jul 12, 2009)

Liddellianenko said:


> Jones was 7-0 in the UFC if you count the Hamill "loss" for what it was, and undefeated in MMA. Conor was 5-0, with 2 bad losses outside the UFC.
> 
> Jones' best win was Bader, also an undefeated solid top 10 (I think #7 or 8 at the time), TUF winner, NCAA Div I All American and the current #1/#2 LHW contender. Conor's best win was Dustin freakin Poirier who had a patchy record at FW, no credentials, was moved into the UFC's "top 10" FW list just a few hours before the Conor fight was announced, and isn't even top 15 at LW.
> 
> The comparison is not valid.


That's all very subjective. You obviously rate the lightheavyweight division above the featherweight division, which is fair enough, but from a purely objective perspective the wins of Conor and Jones in terms of the rankings of their opponents (according to fightmatrix archive) at the time of fighting are very comparable.

Conor had: Brimage (32nd), Holloway (19th), Brandao (22nd), Porier (8th) and Siver (15th)

Jones had: Bonnar (31st), O'Brien (29th), Hamill (21st - LOSS), Vera (16th), Matyushenko (19th), Bader (8th)...

I'm not sure how you can look at that and say they haven't followed similar paths?


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

edlavis88 said:


> That's all very subjective. You obviously rate the lightheavyweight division above the featherweight division, which is fair enough, but from a purely objective perspective the wins of Conor and Jones in terms of the rankings of their opponents (according to fightmatrix archive) at the time of fighting are very comparable.
> 
> Conor had: Brimage (32nd), Holloway (19th), Brandao (22nd), Porier (8th) and Siver (15th)
> 
> ...


You missed Gusmao which is one extra win, and you counted the Hamill fight as a loss when we all know what it was, that's how. Dana obviously counted that as a win, he said as much:

http://www.mmaconvert.com/2013/04/25/dana-white-sickened-by-l-on-jon-jones-record/

Those elbows should have been a warning or a point deduction at worst, instead the worst ref in MMA jumps to a DQ.

7-0 vs 5-0 are not similar paths. Dozens of fighters have mediocre 5 win streaks right now without title shots, not a single guy with a 7 UFC win streak has gone without a title shot in his very next fight in UFC history.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

Liddellianenko said:


> Feminism is of course the major reason behind Ronda's push but it's not the only reason ... Mayweather makes a good point about Laila Ali, also a woman, also an (arguably more impressive) fighter, not hailed as the GOAT or next female role model.


Her last fight was almost a decade ago (well to be more accurate, Ronda only has 13 fights so to compare it, on Ali's 13th fight it was the year 2002, so a decade and a half), long before this whole feminist movement started. Feminism has been around a long time, but not like it is today where you can't turn on the TV without some woman talking about women's rights somewhere. It's an entirely different world regarding "women power" than it was 14 years ago.

Also, you're talking about different promoters, different people, different values, different numbers, different goals. The UFC's goal was to promote Ronda as the greatest female fighter ever and exploit the "women's power" as much as they possibly could in a world where you can't sneeze without a woman popping up going "OH MY GOD, WHAT YOU THINK ONLY YOU CAN SNEEZE? I CAN SNEEZE TOO, SEE WATCH *ACHEW*, YEAH, HOW YOU LIKE THAT YOU SEXIST PIG, WE CAN DO IT TO!". They also did it in a different company, in a different sport. It's all very, very different. 

It's an entirely different world than it was 14 years back in an entirely different sport ran by entirely different people, while being marketed to an entirely different type of person, and as such Ronda was able to get the popularity/fame she has. Comparing her to Laila doesn't work, at all.


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## DonRifle (Jan 18, 2009)

Liddellianenko said:


> Jones was 7-0 in the UFC if you count the Hamill "loss" for what it was, and undefeated in MMA. Conor was 5-0, with 2 bad losses outside the UFC.
> 
> Jones' best win was Bader, also an undefeated solid top 10 (I think #7 or 8 at the time), TUF winner, NCAA Div I All American and the current #1/#2 LHW contender. Conor's best win was Dustin freakin Poirier who had a patchy record at FW, no credentials, was moved into the UFC's "top 10" FW list just a few hours before the Conor fight was announced, and isn't even top 15 at LW.
> 
> ...


Conor was a Cage Warrios champ in two weight classes in the UK JJ was nothing when he came to the UFC. Poirier was number 5, he worked his way pretty steadily up the top 15. And the reality is he then fought Mendez even though it wasn't originally scheduled. But we all know why he got the title shot, it wasnt because of his celtic skin it was because of his celtic mouth and KO'ing of fools left and right. It is in no way about skin colour whatsover. I'd be willing to accept there may be some slights that have gone on in the UFC, but the preferential treatment if any Conor received was because of his ability to promote. Exactly the same for Chael. Chael wasn't even loved he was mostly hated, but that brings people too. 
Can you imagine if John Jones was actually likeable and not a complete fake who has even admitted to being a fake on camera? He would be a mega star and the world would love him and hail him. I respect the hell out of his skills but its almost impossible to like the guy as a person


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

DonRifle said:


> Conor was a Cage Warrios champ in two weight classes in the UK JJ was nothing when he came to the UFC. Poirier was number 5, he worked his way pretty steadily up the top 15. And the reality is he then fought Mendez even though it wasn't originally scheduled. But we all know why he got the title shot, it wasnt because of his celtic skin it was because of his celtic mouth and KO'ing of fools left and right. It is in no way about skin colour whatsover. I'd be willing to accept there may be some slights that have gone on in the UFC, but the preferential treatment if any Conor received was because of his ability to promote. Exactly the same for Chael. Chael wasn't even loved he was mostly hated, but that brings people too.
> Can you imagine if John Jones was actually likeable and not a complete fake who has even admitted to being a fake on camera? He would be a mega star and the world would love him and hail him. I respect the hell out of his skills but its almost impossible to like the guy as a person


See that seems biased to me ... you think Jones is not likeable and a "fake", yet everything Conor does is "for the camera" (your own words) i.e. fake but in his case that is "genius promotion"! 

That's the thing these guys are talking about, when a black guy talks shit, he's characterised as "unlikeable", "fake", "a thug" ... when a white guy like Conor or Sonnen does it, it's he a "brilliant promoter", "selling tickets", and the best one yet in this thread ... "a humble family man" outside the camera lights :laugh:.

So the white guy having uncommitted sex with some chick is "a family man" because he has been saintly enough to not dump her yet, yet the long time married black guy raising and providing well for 3 kids is never once mentioned as a "family man". 

The white guy who hasn't shown a single shred of humility in his entire life is characterised as "humble" and the black guy who actually tries to be humble but makes mistakes is characterised as "fake" and encouraged to go "full heel" whereby he'll be openly hated more. 

Your own words about Mayweather are that "he has no honor and respect for anyone in the sport" and this apparently doesn't strike you as the least bit of ironic when 90% of your time on the forum is spent hanging off the nuts of a guy that talks about "killing" every single one of his opponents, killing and enslaving women and children, heavily disrespects every single opponent he's faced and their families and every single country apart from his own little rock.

I'm not saying Conor's rise has been entirely due to his race, but a black guy playing the same cards as him would have been hated and reviled whereas Conor is continually defended for the exact same things and touted as a "good guy outside of the act" for giving out a couple of cars and splurging his entourage - something Mayweather also does but is hated for and characterised as "extravagant" and "greedy" for. 

In reality Mayweather and Conor are the exact same persona other than the ex-wife beating and womanising, which I'll give you. But then Conor has hardly had time at the top whereas Mayweather has dealt with all that money and fame for more than a decade. When Jones and Mayweather were at Conor's point in their careers, they hadn't done any of these sorts of things but were still hated as fake and arrogant.


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## DonRifle (Jan 18, 2009)

Liddellianenko said:


> See that seems biased to me ... you think Jones' in not likeable and a "fake", yet everything Conor does is "for the camera" (your own words) i.e. fake but in his case that is "genius promotion"!
> 
> That's the thing these guys are talking about, when a black guy talks shit, he's characterised as "unlikeable", "fake", "a thug" ... when a white guy like Conor or Sonnen does it, it's he a "brilliant promoter", "selling tickets", and the best one yet in this thread ... "a humble family man" outside the camera lights :laugh:.
> 
> ...


The problem is you've never got Conor's sense of humour, this statement above is testament to that! Jones doesn't have a sense of humour at all. He does DUI, drugs wouldnt take short notice fights (opposite of Conor) and mows down pregnant women. Hardly humourous trash talk about wresting his balls on peoples foreheads and red panty night!
In fact the only thing he's done thats likeable or funny in his whole tenure outside the ring in the UFC is roar like a lion after he hit cormier in that presser. And he got a lot of press, and attention and PPV buys because of it!!


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## Leed (Jan 3, 2010)

Liddellianenko said:


> See that seems biased to me ... you think Jones' in not likeable and a "fake", yet everything Conor does is "for the camera" (your own words) i.e. fake but in his case that is "genius promotion"!
> 
> That's the thing these guys are talking about, when a black guy talks shit, he's characterised as "unlikeable", "fake", "a thug" ... when a white guy like Conor or Sonnen does it, it's he a "brilliant promoter", "selling tickets", and the best one yet in this thread ... "a humble family man" outside the camera lights :laugh:.
> 
> ...


NBA must be racist too, right? Nothing to do with most black guys being more skilled, athletic, better genes etc? Or if they are black it doesn't count as racism?


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

Leed said:


> NBA must be racist too, right? Nothing to do with most black guys being more skilled, athletic, better genes etc? Or if they are black it doesn't count as racism?


Um yes it's because they're more skilled at basketball. Give me an example of a black guy being promoted beyond his skills, we've already dealt with this bullshit non-defence, see my response to Clyde.

Black guys earning success in proportion or less than their skills doesn't mean anything, they've earned it. 

People are pointing out Sonnen, Conor, Rousey etc. for their hype BEYOND their accomplishments at the time.

And yes for the longest time the NBA was racist until the late 60s when the best basketball players weren't selected and the entire league was a bunch of less athletic white guys being promoted as the best simply because of bias, even in the 60s there weren't more than a handful. That's exactly why people bring things like this up.


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## Leed (Jan 3, 2010)

Liddellianenko said:


> Um yes it's because they're more skilled at basketball. Give me an example of a black guy being promoted beyond his skills, we've already dealt with this bullshit non-defence, see my response to Clyde.
> 
> Black guys earning success in proportion or less than their skills doesn't mean anything, they've earned it. People are pointing out Sonnen, Conor, Rousey etc. for their hype BEYOND their accomplishments at the time.


Anytime there is a high draft pick white guy, fans shit on them, some famous person, actor I think, even posted a video on twitter when Kristaps Porzingis was drafted saying "who the **** is this ******* white guy?" or something along those lines. It's basically common sense that white guys can't play basketball, and he had some legit skills and experience before the draft.

So you still don't understand why Sonnen, Conor, Rousey got their hype? After all this time and pages?


----------



## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

Leed said:


> Anytime there is a high draft pick white guy, fans shit on them, some famous person, actor I think, even posted a video on twitter when Kristaps Porzingis was drafted saying "who the **** is this ******* white guy?" or something along those lines. It's basically common sense that white guys can't play basketball, and he had some legit skills and experience before the draft.
> 
> So you still don't understand why Sonnen, Conor, Rousey got their hype? After all this time and pages?


I'm not talking about random racist black guys posting rants about skilled white guys being picked, I want an example of institutional bias against said white guy compared to other guys at his level in the field. 

Was Kristaps Porzingis dumped because he was white? Paid less than his accomplishments? Promoted less? I doubt it.

I understand the varying apparent reasons Conor (trash talk), Rousey (feminism), Sonnen (trash talk), Forrest (TUF), Chuck (dominant career and company man) etc. got preferential treatment, but those same reasons have existed for many black fighters but it didn't pan out for them or get them the same reactions, that's what I'm saying.



DonRifle said:


> The problem is you've never got Conor's sense of humour, this statement above is testament to that! Jones doesn't have a sense of humour at all. He does DUI, drugs wouldnt take short notice fights (opposite of Conor) and mows down pregnant women. Hardly humourous trash talk about wresting his balls on peoples foreheads and red panty night!
> In fact the only thing he's done thats likeable or funny in his whole tenure outside the ring in the UFC is roar like a lion after he hit cormier in that presser. And he got a lot of press, and attention and PPV buys because of it!!


Conor's humor is childish and Jones has done similar things but is predictably hated for it. 

The DUIs, coke etc. came after many years of Jones dealing with fame and fortune, let's see how Conor fares in a few years if he's still accomplished half of what Jones or Mayweather have. As I edited earlier, Jones and Mayweather were hated for their cockiness and fakeness long before these acts came to light so that's not the only reason they were hated. 

They were hated for the same personality traits that are glorified in Conor ... Conor has "confidence", Jones has "cockiness". Conor has a "promotion persona", Jones is "fake". Conor "does well for the people around him with expensive cars and luxuries", Mayweather "is a blingy money-blinded c*nt surrounded by yes men he buys".


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## DonRifle (Jan 18, 2009)

Liddellianenko said:


> I'm not talking about random racist black guys posting rants about skilled white guys being picked, I want an example of institutional bias against said white guy compared to other guys at his level in the field.
> 
> Was Kristaps Porzingis dumped because he was white? Paid less than his accomplishments? Promoted less? I doubt it.
> 
> I understand the varying apparent reasons Conor (trash talk), Rousey (feminism), Sonnen (trash talk), Forrest (TUF), Chuck (dominant career and company man) etc. got preferential treatment, but those same reasons have existed for many black fighters but it didn't pan out for them or get them the same reactions, that's what I'm saying.


Nobody has talked trash like Conor ever in the histroy of the sport. chael was the only one in any way close and he was scripted. 
Ronda is light years or was light years ahead then any other female on a variety of levels. Chuck was iconic and Forrest was part of the best fight ever. Your argument doesn't hold up!

The only argument Ive seen that may hold up in this debate is Johns listing of all the lower guys that got cut with shit records compared to other races that got cut maybe in a slower way. There may be some truth to that


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## Leed (Jan 3, 2010)

I like how we are ignoring the huge potential everyone saw in Conor even before he was in the UFC and just mention trash talk. The guy might end up being the GOAT and just knocked out the #1 P4P fighter in the world, you can't sit there with a straight face and tell me that the promotion wasn't deserved and that the potential he had hasn't been fulfilled and then some. People who were "undeservingly hyping him up" were saying this guy could be champ, this guy could be something big etc. Has that not happened ALREADY? And couldn't he achieve even MORE?


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

Leed said:


> I like how we are ignoring the huge potential everyone saw in Conor even before he was in the UFC and just mention trash talk. The guy might end up being the GOAT and just knocked out the #1 P4P fighter in the world, you can't sit there with a straight face and tell me that the promotion wasn't deserved and that the potential he had hasn't been fulfilled and then some. People who were "undeservingly hyping him up" were saying this guy could be champ, this guy could be something big etc. Has that not happened ALREADY? And couldn't he achieve even MORE?


Yeah but we're comparing to guys like Jones and Mayweather here who showed every bit as much potential and have achieved 20 times more already but are more hated / were more hated when they were at Conor's level. Conor MAY become GOAT, Jones and Mayweather already ARE.

Conor has a very large fanbase and people defending him, not something you see much with Jones or Mayweather. That's what started the thread. Also from the UFC's perspective, Jones was never given as much leeway and promotion as Conor.


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## edlavis88 (Jul 12, 2009)

Liddellianenko said:


> Yeah but we're comparing to guys like Jones and Mayweather here who showed every bit as much potential and have achieved 20 times more already but are more hated / were more hated when they were at Conor's level. Conor MAY become GOAT, Jones and Mayweather already ARE.
> 
> Conor has a very large fanbase and people defending him, not something you see much with Jones or Mayweather. That's what started the thread. Also from the UFC's perspective, Jones was never given as much leeway and promotion as Conor.


Again i'm not sure if you've paid close enough attention, Jones was pushed to the heavens by the UFC, they only stopped when Jones hung himself out to dry by starting a public brawl and taking cocaine and running someone down! The UFC were behind him until he kept cocking it up.
There is also a big difference between bravado and real life. I have never met any white combat sports fan who doesnt have the highest of respect for Mayweather and his career, almost all rate him as the greatest of all time. The difference is hes shown himself to be morally corrupt. 

you suggest its racist that Conor isnt as hated as Flloyd or Jones but i'd argue it would be laughable if you'd suggest Conor who has literally done nothing controversial in his personal life should be as hated as a wife beater and a guy who got coked up and commited a hit and run! To me race has nothing to do with who i like or dislike its how they act, Mayweather and Jones have earned the dislike they get. Although i have heard Jones has turned a corner and is pushing to be be a better person, if thats the case i will happily cheer him when he climbsback in the cage.


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## Leed (Jan 3, 2010)

Liddellianenko said:


> Yeah but we're comparing to guys like Jones and Mayweather here who showed every bit as much potential and have achieved 20 times more already but are more hated / were more hated when they were at Conor's level. Conor MAY become GOAT, Jones and Mayweather already ARE.
> 
> Conor has a very large fanbase and people defending him, not something you see much with Jones or Mayweather. That's what started the thread. Also from the UFC's perspective, Jones was never given as much leeway and promotion as Conor.


When Jones became champ and when he also started to talk shit, he got more hype behind him (just like how Conor talks shit and gets promoted). When that coke incident happened and the first DUI's, people here were actually bitching that Jones got away with it and UFC covers his ass. When he got in to rehab "motherfukin Dana saving his money cow with a PR stunt, damn Jones with his special treatment, what about Nick Diaz??" Not to mention, Jones-Cormier at that point was one of the biggest fights in history, huge hype behind it. 
Speaking of Cormier, also was pretty hyped up with huge potential, one could argue he got an easy title shot by beating Cummings and grandpa Henderson, just so the UFC could make the biggest fight in LHW history.
Not to mention Conor is a pretty unique personality, I recently watched his first MMA Hour interviews, you can't tell me the guy isn't amusing, he hasn't had any fights in the UFC and yet the guy talks mad shit, how he is the 2 WC world champ, how he's the best, how he is going to become the champ, the GOAT, run through the divison and then goes out and does that and in 3 years knocks out the #1P4P fighter in 13 seconds. How is that not amazing? When you do something like that, I don't care if your black, hispanic or asian, get all the hype and money you want, cause I'm gonna watch you and be excited about it. Love him or hate him, There's a million people saying Conor is something special (not only white people btw), that he is the modern day Ali (hey, why does he get compared to a black guy, not fair), has that "it" factor, yet you are arguing that it's a race thing and it wouldn't have happened if he was black. 
I was hooked on Conor after I saw his first fight and first interview, he is the only reason I got interested in MMA again, I know some people who feel the same way, there are many white guys out there and I can't say or hear the same about anyone of them, makes you wonder, maybe there actually is something more about the guy than just skin color... or even the trash talk.


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## DonRifle (Jan 18, 2009)

I've seen Liddell do this before!! Not quite trolling, but his own specialised between the lines trolling!! :laugh:


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

It must really suck to hate Conor McGregor. Sitting there, DESPERATE for this guy to get knocked out, and then 13 seconds later your swimming in your own tears thinking "Shit, what do I say now? I know...the UFC is racially biased towards this guy, that's it, boom, Liddell you've done it again you goddamn genius".


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> It must really suck to hate Conor McGregor. Sitting there, DESPERATE for this guy to get knocked out, and then 13 seconds later your swimming in your own tears thinking "Shit, what do I say now? I know...the UFC is racially biased towards this guy, that's it, boom, Liddell you've done it again you goddamn genius".


I don't get so hung up on MMA wins, unlike you I have too much going on in real life. Still have a stellar record on MMA predictions overall and win or lose the guy you're waving your dick over is still a douchebag, have fun living vicariously through him.


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## Leed (Jan 3, 2010)

Liddellianenko said:


> I don't get so hung up on MMA wins, unlike you I have too much going on in real life. Still have a stellar record on MMA predictions overall and the guy you're waving your dick over is still a douchebag, have fun living vicariously through him.


No one is denying Conor is cocky an arrogant, he says it himself, cocky and confident in prediction and preperation but always humble in victory and defeat.

But do you really not see the line between being a dick who talks trash opposed to being a dick who talks trash and also beats up women in their spare time?


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## edlavis88 (Jul 12, 2009)

Leed said:


> No one is denying Conor is cocky an arrogant, he says it himself, cocky and confident in prediction and preperation but always humble in victory and defeat.
> 
> But do you really not see the line between being a dick who talks trash opposed to being a dick who talks trash and also beats up women in their spare time?


I'm pretty sure the message of this thread is 'you're a racist if your suggest Mayweather and Conor are different' so I'd suggest no Liddell can't see the difference.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

Leed said:


> No one is denying Conor is cocky an arrogant, he says it himself, cocky and confident in prediction and preperation but always humble in victory and defeat.
> 
> But do you really not see the line between being a dick who talks trash opposed to being a dick who talks trash and also beats up women in their spare time?












So humble in victory, my bad. The guy is a douche in preparation and a douche in victory, in every post fight press conference when he is supposedly being "humble".

He's not a wife-beater because he doesn't have a wife yet.

I'm not saying I support Floyd because it's never right to hit women except to save your life or something, but relationships have more highs and lows when you're supporting each other as a family, Conor hasn't been in those shoes yet and he hasn't had that fame and money very long yet.

I can respect his accomplishments but he is a dick, that's not an act, I'm sick of people pretending or convincing myself otherwise.


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## edlavis88 (Jul 12, 2009)

This race arguement also misses the obvious point that rousey is probably one of the most hated people in combat sports (if not all of sports) at the moment! Last time I checked she's still the same white girl who Flloyd thinks is unfairly adored for her skin colour. 

Ultimately there will be a small percentage of people who judge on race, sex, creed, colour, religion, sexuality and all that other unimportant stuff, but most are intelligent enough to base their opinions on personality and actions, its why Flloyd will never be loved and why Ronda has gone down in people's estimation, they're both just unpleasant people.

Also Liddell... your last post is dangerously close to excusing beating up your wife.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

edlavis88 said:


> This race arguement also misses the obvious point that rousey is probably one of the most hated people in combat sports (if not all of sports) at the moment! Last time I checked she's still the same white girl who Flloyd thinks is unfairly adored for her skin colour.
> 
> Ultimately there will be a small percentage of people who judge on race, sex, creed, colour, religion, sexuality and all that other unimportant stuff, but most are intelligent enough to base their opinions on personality and actions, its why Flloyd will never be loved and why Ronda has gone down in people's estimation, they're both just unpleasant people.
> 
> Also Liddell... your last post is dangerously close to excusing beating up your wife.


Sure they are both unpleasant people, this isn't a defence of Floyd by any means, I'm no fan. 

But the media did and still push Ronda (even after her complete destruction) as a female role model, the best female athlete, and (I kid you not) the most popular woman in the world. Whereas Floyd was pushed in the media as a bling-bling spoilt thug with some talent, even before the domestic violence.

Also you missed my edit:


> I'm not saying I support Floyd because it's never right to hit women except to save your life or something,


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## Leed (Jan 3, 2010)

Liddellianenko said:


> So humble in victory, my bad. The guy is a douche in preparation and a douche in victory, in every post fight press conference when he is supposedly being "humble".
> 
> He's not a wife-beater because he doesn't have a wife yet.
> 
> ...


How would you know what kind of a guy is Conor in his relationship? Obviously I don't know either, so I'm not arguing about it, but to use marriage as an argument? My parents have been together for 25+ years, they are not married, so fuk my dad, he's not a real family man right?

No one is even trying to convince you he isn't a dick or to like him, we are pointing out the obvious why some people like Conor and dislike Floyd.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

Leed said:


> How would you know what kind of a guy is Conor in his relationship? Obviously I don't know either, so I'm not arguing about it, but to use marriage as an argument? My parents have been together for 25+ years, they are not married, so fuk my dad, he's not a real family man right?
> 
> No one is even trying to convince you he isn't a dick or to like him, we are pointing out the obvious why some people like Conor and dislike Floyd.


Your dad had kids and stuck together with your mom to raise you, that makes him a family man regardless of whether he gave it the marriage label ... unless he was abusive or violent or something.

Conor has a girlfriend he enjoys boning. That's nice and all but "family man" it isn't.


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## edlavis88 (Jul 12, 2009)

Family goes beyond, your significant other imo. And also Conor's girlfriend that 'he enjoys boning' has been his girlfriend for the last 12 years if I'm not mistaken, its not hard to see Conor vaues his family.

back to the point Muhammad Ali's trash talk make both Conor and Flloyd look like kids who just learnt their first swear word, he was black and is adored by pretty much everyone to this day. 
I don't think fans are as fooled by media hype as you think Liddell. I genuinely think Flloyd is hated for his clearly dubious personal life along with his arrogance.

I do feel for him to an extent there are many sportsmen over the years who have been just as sh*t as him and haven't been judged, but I dont think it's a race thing! I mean Mike Tyson is a convicted rapist and OJ murdered people and both are more well loved than Flloyd. I genuinely do get his annoyance but it isn't racism!


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## DonRifle (Jan 18, 2009)

Floyd is universally hated because he is a *unt. It's not even a debate. Everyone in this forum knows it


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

edlavis88 said:


> Family goes beyond, your significant other imo. And also Conor's girlfriend that 'he enjoys boning' has been his girlfriend for the last 12 years if I'm not mistaken, its not hard to see Conor vaues his family.
> 
> back to the point Muhammad Ali's trash talk make both Conor and Flloyd look like kids who just learnt their first swear word, he was black and is adored by pretty much everyone to this day.
> I don't think fans are as fooled by media hype as you think Liddell. I genuinely think Flloyd is hated for his clearly dubious personal life along with his arrogance.
> ...


OJ isn't liked by a single white person I know what're you talking about ... all of his apologists are black racists.

The very reason Ali became Muhammad Ali from Cassius Clay was BECAUSE of racism and disenchantment. He was refused entry into restaurants and called a ****** fresh after winning the Olympic medal for his country and beaten down with chains by a supremacist motorcycle gang whose leader he then knocked out, if you read / believe his biography. He had barely any welcome in his own home town after everything he accomplished. 

Both bad examples.

Tyson ... was Tyson. He's the most destructive fighter in history. Bar none. I mean Foreman, Anderson, Wanderlei, Liddell, Conor and Lawler all look like point fighters next to him, and he was doing this with 16 oz gloves and using only his hands. He had his share of fans in spite of his personal failings, because he was just unbelievable. 

Not to mention both the **** and domestic violence case against him are incredibly shady and look like money making schemes against a simpleton rich celebrity. The woman that he apparently raped had made the same accusations against others before him, and she willingly went to his hotel room at 2 am, was she expecting to play nintendo? 

Conor values his parents, has shared some of his financial success with them. That's admirable, but giving a small chunk of your earnings to your folks is pretty easy, especially if they had a good relationship with him, RAISING a family takes more time and commitment. 

We don't know if Floyd would have done the same for his folks because the guy didn't have the same luxury ... his mother died of a heroine addiction and his dad was in jail for selling drugs.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

Is there really a debate here? Does anybody seriously believe there is zero racism in sports?


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Poor Floyd. It's almost like beating his wife was not his fault at all. At least he middle finger his opponent after a fight though right?


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Soojooko said:


> Is there really a debate here? Does anybody seriously believe there is zero racism in sports?


Which sports are racist? Boxing, where most of the top fighters in history were black? Or MMA, where half of the top fighters in the top 10 are black? Or soccer, where most of the greatest players of all time were black? Or basketball, where all of the top players were black? How about American football? Where half of the top players are black? At least it's not the music industry....where most of the big chart toppers are black.

No one's saying racism doesn't exist...but come on mate dude's over there saying the UFC is racist because none of Dana, Lorenzo or Frank are black. Reminds me of this song.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Which sports are racist? Boxing, where most of the top fighters in history were black? Or MMA, where half of the top fighters in the top 10 are black? Or soccer, where most of the greatest players of all time were black? Or basketball, where all of the top players were black? How about American football? Where half of the top players are black? At least it's not the music industry....where most of the big chart toppers are black.
> 
> No one's saying racism doesn't exist...but come on mate dude's over there saying the UFC is racist because none of Dana, Lorenzo or Frank are black. Reminds me of this song.


Im not sure what your point is.

Im not talking about blatant racism. Its subtle but still prevalent. How can it not be when society has not dealt with race issues 100%? To say there's no racism in sport is the same as saying there is no racism, period.

Its speculative for sure, but I reckon that if Mayweather was the exact same boxer but white, he would have made even more money.

EDIT

Out of curiosity, I searched for the highest paid footballers in the world. Football being a very multi cultural sport and all. We can al agree there are a LOT of very successful back footballers. But the top 15 goes like this: 2 are black and 13 are white. Even though it backs up my argument a touch, I was still surprised at the imbalance if im honest.


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## Spite (Jul 7, 2009)

Liddellianenko said:


> The woman that he apparently raped had made the same accusations against others before him, and she willingly went to his hotel room at 2 am, was she expecting to play nintendo?


Well.

The story goes that she said he could have his way with her, if she could not beat Mike Tyson on Mike Tysons Punch Out for the Nintendo.

Ain't nobody can beat Mike Tyson on Mike Tysons Punch Out.

She cried foul play, insisting the 'B' button was faulty.


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## DonRifle (Jan 18, 2009)

Soojooko said:


> Its speculative for sure, but I reckon that if Mayweather was the exact same boxer but white, he would have made even more money.
> 
> EDIT
> 
> Out of curiosity, I searched for the highest paid footballers in the world. Football being a very multi cultural sport and all. We can al agree there are a LOT of very successful back footballers. But the top 15 goes like this: 2 are black and 13 are white. Even though it backs up my argument a touch, I was still surprised at the imbalance if im honest.


What about Joe Calzaghe. Undefeated 47-0 I think. Earned massively less amounts of money then Floyd. Should he complain that the world is anti-welsh or something? 

Name the best black players in the world right now? Toure and Neymar. Both i bet in that top 15. Probably 50% of them are hispanic/Latino right? Do hispanic people get lumped in with white people in order to make a case for black people? 
Off the top of my head Suarez, Aguero, Messi, Rodriguez, Falcao are all from south america and probably in that list. Unless you present a clear picture of the demographic of who is playing football to start with and the % of whites, blacks, asians, hispanic latinos etc, it makes no sense to say there should be more black players in that list. The fact is if a black player is good enough he gets a huge fee and he gets bought. Benteke, Mangala, Sterling were they the 3 biggest transfers last year? All black. 
We are now getting into social justice warrior territory where people are going looking for problems. 
Racism exists in sport in a big way, in places like Russia where they throw banana's at the player and chant monkey chants. Which I might add the black players happily play through for a paycheck when they could go to another league and take a salary cut in order to make a statement. But anyway, solving the clear problems its whats important, not manufacturing them off statistics that are not relevant to the actual real participants etc. The top leagues in the world all have populations who are caucasion dominant. If one in 4 people in a place are black, it should mean a 1 in 4 balance, not a 2 in 4 balance in order to satisfy a false sense of justice.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Soojooko said:


> Im not sure what your point is.
> 
> Im not talking about blatant racism. Its subtle but still prevalent. How can it not be when society has not dealt with race issues 100%? To say there's no racism in sport is the same as saying there is no racism, period.
> 
> ...


But it's not just anti-black racism. That's not the only thing race in the world, nor is it the only race to have faced hardships. I know you didn't say that it was, but that's always how these conversations go.

I really REALLY don't think May would have made that money if he was white. That's his thing. Do you think anyone gives two shits if Adrien Broner is a white guy? He's just be cheesy and embarassing instead of arrogant and irritating. That's the appeal and why he sells tickets. Who's more popular; 34-0 Gennady Golovkin (who's an absolute knockout machine) or 34-0 Mike Tyson? OBVIOUSLY Tyson. The reason? An entire package. Kid coming from the projects with a major chip on his shoulder. His race, his background, his look, his weight. Everything was a factor as to the appeal. Race can be a positive as well.

I was more meaning "great" football players, not as much money. Money is weird in football. It's a little bit different these days too with the rise of Germany and Holland to the level they are at. English football has also kind of over taken a bit. France and Brazil aren't where they were 10 years ago and black players from England aren't rising to huge levels anymore so that will likely be some inconsistencies. Guys like Rooney were never as good as guys like Zidane but he probably earns more than Zidane ever would. The top players though like Ronaldinho and Henry definitely earned their worth.

I think people just read into shit too much. Like you're throwing money at me right now when this is a thread based on the comments of the highest paid sports person of all time, who happens to be a black guy. If you check the Forbes top 10 all time, 5 guys are black, 3 are "white", one is Spanish (is that white? Race is weird) and one is Filipino. That's just because that's who the best people are. Black guys didn't earn more than white guys on this list cause they are black. If Daniel Sturridge was playing like Messi he'd be getting Messi money too. If white players played like LeBron James they'd be getting paid what he's getting paid.

I keep wasting too much time on this shit. Racism exists, sure, but everyone's constantly trivialising it with these small "maybe thats racist or maybe its just a reflection of skill" bollocks. Right now, throw me your top 10 list of British boxers and you'll probably have maybe two white guys in there, three at most. The media, imo, shows black people absolutely smashing almost every field and that's because these people who happen to be black ARE smashing it. Liddell thinks Mayweather is being made the bad guy? Go on a boxing site and start a Mayweather Vs Pacquiao discussion and see who has more fans.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

DonRifle said:


> in places like Russia...


Yeah for everyone, whenever I talk, really about anything, assume I'm not referring to either Russia or Italy :laugh:.


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## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

slapshot said:


> What BS..
> 
> You dont give a man a job because he's black and almost as good as Joe Rogan at color commentating that would be racist. You give the top person the job regardless of race.


Umm, Rogan isn't a good commentator he lost all credibility with his bias coverage of Ronda, making Ronda out to be a mystical creature for KO'ing Bethe Correia. Please, Rogan is terrible.



HexRei said:


> We had a black ring girl until it came out that she'd done hardcore porn and forgot to mention it to the UFC. Jamilette is Cuban-Mexican, not Cain Mexican, but born and lived in Mexico Mexican.
> 
> We had a somewhat public black figure in the UFC, as public as Joe Silva really, in Burt Watson who wrangled the fighters for weighins for like ten years until recently. I also think I read somewhere that Joe Silva is hispanic in descent. There are black talking heads associated with MMA and UFC specifically, Rashad for example. But from what I've seen, the best black athletes gravitate toward higher paying sports like football or basketball, and that affects not only the fanbase but the amount of retiring fighters they can bring in for non-athletic roles in the UFC.
> 
> Also just because there aren't a lot of black people in the org doesn't automatically mean someone is excluding black people. For example, Dana and the Fertittas own most of the UFC, thats' why they are automatically public figures associated with the UFC. Should they randomly give a part of the company away to a black person to make things balanced?


They've had one black ring girl in 15 years, and how many flat plastic white girls? You're telling me they can't find one beautiful black woman? They're everywhere.

Oh and what did they do to Burt? They canned him despite the fact he did everything for them, preparing all the fighters, checking their weight, taking care of them, they sold him out and turned on him because he upset their precious Ronda.

And Rashad is a fighter, Rashad was hired to be a fighter, same with Cormier. They're not analysts they're fighters.

Why don't you look at the facts the UFC only promotes white people, Sage and Paige are being groomed and they are...

White, as was Brock, was Liddell, as was Tito, as was GSP, as is Conor and Ronda, meanwhile Aljamain Sterling can't even get a pay raise and he's ranked FIFTH and could be fighting for a title in 2016, Phil Davis has wins over Lyoto Machida(even though he shouldn't), Gus, and Glover and they let him walk but keep Dan Hardy. The only non champions that got promoted that were black was Rampage vs Rashad and they did that themselves with TUF and primetime and the staredowns after Rampage beat Jardine. That's a fact, all of those facts. Black people do not get equal treatment in the UFC.

I bet they'd never send Conor into a cage with the knowledge his opponent was roided to the gills like they did to Jones when he fought Vitor.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

@LL :laugh: yeah I hate when the UFC turns on guys like Burt but protects guys like Tito forever and never says a bad word about him.

Aljamain Sterling didn't get a pay rise? That's SHOCKING. That's so shocking I actually don't know who Jon Fitch and Jake Shields are. Who are those guys?

At least the white God that is Nate Diaz is getting paid well eh?


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

LL said:


> They've had one black ring girl in 15 years, and how many flat plastic white girls? You're telling me they can't find one beautiful black woman? They're everywhere.


Kind of a ****ed up thing to say- are you claiming that they can just grab any attractive black woman and jam her on the stage whether she wants to work for them or not? Huzzah, now affirmative action is the new slavery!

You should attend a UFC soon and tell all the Brazilian ring girls (I think we have three or four?) that they aren't dark-skinned enough for your taste. Oh, and the mexican one. 



> Oh and what did they do to Burt? They canned him despite the fact he did everything for them, preparing all the fighters, checking their weight, taking care of them, they sold him out and turned on him because he upset their precious Ronda.
> 
> And Rashad is a fighter, Rashad was hired to be a fighter, same with Cormier. They're not analysts they're fighters.
> 
> ...


Pssst... Burt quit. 

Davis' UFC run was boring as hell.. There are plenty of boring white people the UFC doesn't care about keeping around either.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Josh Thompson, a white guy, got the exact same Phil Davis treatment.

I'm just waiting for someone to mention Alistair Overeem. Isn't he being criminally underpaid too? :laugh:


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## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

I don't agree with this at all really. Guys like Usain Bolt, Lebron James, Tiger Woods are all mega superduper stars. Floyd just isn't liked.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Rauno said:


> I don't agree with this at all really. Guys like Usain Bolt, Lebron James, Tiger Woods are all mega superduper stars. Floyd just isn't liked.


Tiger Woods is the king of guy who can shag around on his bird massively and only get called a legend for it :laugh:


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

Kevin Lee is more racist than Dana White.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

Spite said:


> Well.
> 
> The story goes that she said he could have his way with her, if she could not beat Mike Tyson on Mike Tysons Punch Out for the Nintendo.
> 
> ...


The truth finally comes out 

How many more lives did that monster ruin with that level? :sad03:


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

I dunno how anyone can watch that documentary on the case and not call bullshit on the ra.pe case of Tyson. She went up to his room, went into the toilet where there was a phone, took out something like a tampon or anti-pregnancy device....some form of fanny apparatus....left the bathroom and then the bad stuff happened? There was so much going on with Tyson's legal team and Don King and everything else as well. There's a lot going on with it anyways and I think Tyson got done because he "fit the bill" (which doesn't mean because he was black before someone harps up about that). Then again, if he actually did do it then imagine how horrendous this paragraph is that I'd be defending a heavyweight world champion boxer who did that to an 18 year old girl?


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## edlavis88 (Jul 12, 2009)

Sportsman 2.0 said:


> Kevin Lee is more racist than Dana White.


Kevin Lee can't be racist, he is black. Don't be so preposterous!


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## Rusty (Apr 13, 2010)

If Mayweather finished fights at the same rate as Ronda and Conor he would be as loved as Tyson, Ali, or any other fighter. 

I don't like Floyd because he's an illiterate, point fighter that brags about wasting money and hasn't knocked out an opponent since the sucker punch on Ortiz. 

Make no mistake, I'm as racist as the next guy but I don't hate Floyd because he is black.


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## Sportsman 2.0 (Jul 10, 2012)

edlavis88 said:


> Kevin Lee can't be racist, he is black. Don't be so preposterous!


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Josh Thompson, a white guy, got the exact same Phil Davis treatment.
> 
> I'm just waiting for someone to mention Alistair Overeem. Isn't he being criminally underpaid too? :laugh:


Just saw this one and wanted to address it ... Josh Thompson lost 3 straight and his overall UFC record in his last run was 1-3. Davis lost ONE split decision and he was cut, his overall UFC record was 9-3-1. 

There is zero comparison between these two cuts, one was a clear top 10, fringe top 5 even, the other had dropped out of the top 15.


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## DonRifle (Jan 18, 2009)

Rusty said:


> I don't like Floyd because he's an illiterate, point fighter that brags about wasting money and hasn't knocked out an opponent since the sucker punch on Ortiz.


What really made me hate the guy was what he said to the old interviewer after the fighter. Can't think of a person in the sports with such little class.


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## edlavis88 (Jul 12, 2009)

Liddellianenko said:


> Just saw this one and wanted to address it ... Josh Thompson lost 3 straight and his overall UFC record in his last run was 1-3. Davis lost ONE split decision and he was cut, his overall UFC record was 9-3-1.
> 
> There is zero comparison between these two cuts, one was a clear top 10, fringe top 5 even, the other had dropped out of the top 15.


Phil Davis wasn't cut. He's said so himself. He said he'd like to have stayed with the UFC but didn't think the offer was good enough so went to Bellator.


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## DonRifle (Jan 18, 2009)

edlavis88 said:


> Phil Davis wasn't cut. He's said so himself. He said he'd like to have stayed with the UFC but didn't think the offer was good enough so went to Bellator.


Phil Davis stank up the division. The most boring LHW of all time, was a blessing he didn't take the UFC offer! Also came at a time when they had just filed the anti-trust monopoly case. Smart business by the UFC


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

edlavis88 said:


> Phil Davis wasn't cut. He's said so himself. He said he'd like to have stayed with the UFC but didn't think the offer was good enough so went to Bellator.


Ok never mind then, it was someone else that brought up that example anyway.


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

Rusty said:


> If Mayweather finished fights at the same rate as Ronda and Conor he would be as loved as Tyson, Ali, or any other fighter.
> 
> I don't like Floyd because he's an illiterate, point fighter that brags about wasting money and hasn't knocked out an opponent since the sucker punch on Ortiz.
> 
> Make no mistake, I'm as racist as the next guy but I don't hate Floyd because he is black.


Exactly. The greater populace understands KO and TKO's, not the technical aspects of the sweet science. Obviously, enough people do get it to make Mayweather the rich man he is, but I think Mayweather would be on Tyson status if he were more fighter than boxer. 

Ronda isn't just big because she's a white girl, it's because she was taking out her opponents in a freakishly quick & effective manner time and time again (like Tyson). People who don't get MMA, still understand utter domination. I think being white and "attractive" certainly helps, but she is by no means the prettiest female MMA fighter, just the most dominant (past tense). Miesha was around long before Ronda and she's hotter, imo, and no less white, but no one cared cause she wasn't finishing fights in seconds time and time again.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Liddellianenko said:


> Ok never mind then, it was someone else that brought up that example anyway.


That's why I mentioned Josh btw. It was roughly the same situation between him and Phil, both different from Shields, Fitch and Okami. The UFC didn't really press to renew either Josh or Phil. They cut Shields, Fitch and Okami. They want to resign Bendo, Sterling and Overeem but those 3 are seeing what offers they can get from others first.


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

VolcomX311 said:


> Exactly. The greater populace understands KO and TKO's, not the technical aspects of the sweet science. Obviously, enough people do get it to make Mayweather the rich man he is, but I think Mayweather would be on Tyson status if he were more fighter than boxer.
> 
> Ronda isn't just big because she's a white girl, it's because she was taking out her opponents in a freakishly quick & effective manner time and time again (like Tyson). People who don't get MMA, still understand utter domination. I think being white and "attractive" certainly helps, but she is by no means the prettiest female MMA fighter, just the most dominant (past tense). Miesha was around long before Ronda and she's hotter, imo, and no less white, but no one cared cause she wasn't finishing fights in seconds time and time again.


Megumi Fujii - 22-0 win streak (before she got blatantly robbed), with 18 finishes, 14 in the first round.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

Soojooko said:


> Im not sure what your point is.
> 
> Im not talking about blatant racism. Its subtle but still prevalent. How can it not be when society has not dealt with race issues 100%? To say there's no racism in sport is the same as saying there is no racism, period.
> 
> ...


The top 10 highest paid basketball players are all black, not one single white guy. You're saying that isn't racist, but having most of the top paid football players being white is? In fact, 74% of NBA players are black. That's a pretty big advantage there, should I now call racism? That seems like pretty legit discrimination right there, they seem to be putting a lot more focus on black guys than white guys, that's ridiculous isn't it? Very, very racist against white people, absolute nonsense.


...Or instead of me using that type of moronic thinking, lets use the human brain and do some logical thinking here, and realize that the best players in basketball are in fact black (thus more of them are put in the NBA and the top paid guys are black), and that many of the very best players in football are in fact white, and that they get paid as such? Yeah, that sounds more logical.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Voiceless said:


> Megumi Fujii - 22-0 win streak (before she got blatantly robbed), with 18 finishes, 14 in the first round.


Fedor Emelianenko - 31-1 with 27 finishes. He's Russian, so I suppose I would call him "ultra white". Never signed by the UFC despite being the greatest heavyweight fighter of all time, a top 3 fighter of all time, and would be joining a highly established division. NOT RACIST.

Megumi Fujii - 22-0 win streak (before she got blatantly robbed), with 18 finishes, 14 in the first round. Never signed by the UFC. Would have to have a division created and tailor made around her. RACIST.


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