# Bustamante: ‘Toquinho’ Stopped Because Miller Told Him To



## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

Could be true...who knows. One thing is for sure since there was no SOTN they both should be awarded FOTN!

Eleven months ago, Rousimar “Toquinho” Palhares’ decision to stop fighting mid-bout cost him dearly in a knockout loss to Nate Marquardt. Saturday night in Rio de Janeiro, history very nearly repeated itself. 

According to the Brazilian middleweight’s trainer, however, Palhares’ actions in the first round of his UFC 134 contest with Dan Miller have been misinterpreted. 

Unlike his September 2010 defeat at the hands of Marquardt -- which saw Palhares punched out after the submission specialist turned to referee Herb Dean and complained that Marquardt’s leg was slippery -- Brazilian Top Team leader Murilo Bustamante explained Sunday that Palhares’ premature celebration against Miller actually came as a result of mercy. 

Saturday night at Rio’s HSBC Arena, a heavy right head kick from Palhares felled Miller with 40 seconds remaining in the opening frame. The dazed New Jerseyite covered up as Palhares connected with half a dozen punches from above before coolly striding away, his arms raised in victory. Palhares leapt atop the Octagon fence to soak in the adoration from his hometown crowd, but there was one problem: the referee -- Dean, coincidentally -- never called a stop to the bout. 

“Just to clarify what happened during Toquinho’s fight,” Bustamante wrote on his personal Twitter account, “he told me that he stopped because his opponent said ‘stop, stop’ when he was punching him hard. Then, he stopped [hitting] him and thought that the fight was over and went to celebrate. Who can say now that ‘Toko’ isn’t a fair fighter? He is just too naive, but he has a big heart.” 

Review of the fight video by Sherdog.com proved inconclusive: If Miller did verbally submit, it was drowned out on television by the roar of the Rio audience. But, as he beckoned Palhares down from the cage, referee Dean’s words were loud and clear: “I did not stop the fight. You have to keep fighting.” 

And keep fighting they did. In a surprising turn, moments after touching gloves and resuming action, Toquinho found himself in a bad way, knocked down by a Miller combination. The Brazilian would regain his composure to finish the round with a takedown, though, and followed up with a dominant second period and a closer, but slower, third. Palhares wound up winning a lopsided unanimous decision with scores of 30-25, 30-27 and 29-27. 

On Sunday, Bustamante offered no complaints about the non-stoppage, nor the extra 10 minutes of work his charge allegedly had to put in. However, the former UFC middleweight champion did take issue with the company naming a lightweight scrap between Edson Barboza and Ross Pearson the evening’s best bout. 

“I think, as [with] everyone that watched the fight, that Toko should have won ‘Fight of the Night.’”


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## Hail the Potato (Jul 29, 2010)

I'd like to hear Miller's side of the story.
I initially thought that he thought that Herb stopped it when he was telling Miller to fight back, but if Miller said "stop. stop." then he (Miller) should have told the ref what happened and the fight should have been over. That's IF he actually told him to stop.


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## MMAnWEED (Aug 8, 2010)

I highly doubt Miller said stop. There are very few around that are tougher than the miller boys.


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## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

I'm watching it right now with the volume turned up.

Someone does say: "STOP".

You can hear it.


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## Rygu (Jul 21, 2008)

I just watched the ending again in slo-mo 5 times and I call bullshit, I saw nothing like that. Miller is tough as nails I doubt he would say stop over that.


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## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

Listen with the volume turned up. You can hear someone say: "STOP".


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## Indestructibl3 (Apr 2, 2009)

Trix said:


> Listen with the volume turned up. You can hear someone say: "STOP".


Sounds interesting - will watch it loud. Palhares has atrocious English though, does he even know what that means? (seriously)


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## Hail the Potato (Jul 29, 2010)

Trix said:


> Listen with the volume turned up. You can hear someone say: "STOP".


I hear "fight back" from Herb Dean, not "stop" from Miller


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## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

Audio rip.

http://yourlisten.com/channel/content/101665/paul harris

You can hear it when the progress bar gets near the *n* on the yourliste*n*.com logo.

No timer, srry. Bah.


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## glalax (Aug 29, 2011)

This is exactly what I heard when I rewatched the incident over and over again. It clearly sounds like someone is yelling "stop" once during that onslaught, and immediatly after Palhares walks away with his hands raised. 

Ofc Palhares should have waited for Dean to pull him away, but this at least explains why he thought he had won. 


I really like and respect Dan Miller as a fighter and person, but I find his reaction after Palhares walks a way a bit suspicious. He gets up and walks towards the fence, his whole bodylanguage signals that he has accepted defeat. If he hadn't verbally tapped, I just cant understand why he didn't argue the "decision" or go after Palhares straight away. Only after Dean made it clear the fight wasn't over did he run over to engage.

Very tough fight though. Was hoping for Miller, and second round was painful to watch.


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## UFC_OWNS (Jul 7, 2010)

yeah i heard it too from the rip from trix, i think miller said it not herb


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## Hail the Potato (Jul 29, 2010)

glalax said:


> This is exactly what I heard when I rewatched the incident over and over again. It clearly sounds like someone is yelling "stop" once during that onslaught, and immediatly after Palhares walks away with his hands raised.
> 
> Ofc Palhares should have waited for Dean to pull him away, but this at least explains why he thought he had won.
> 
> ...


For all Miller knew at that time, Herb Dean may have stopped the fight. He was badly rocked and barely surviving, saw P. Harris celebrating. I'm not surprised that he was a little confused and thought it was over.


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## Indestructibl3 (Apr 2, 2009)

Trix said:


> Audio rip.
> 
> http://yourlisten.com/channel/content/101665/paul harris
> 
> ...


I'm pretty sure that's Herb Dean yelling 'fight back!'. The 'fight' is quite soft, but the 'back' is what sounds like 'stop', that's what I think anyway - have to rewatch the fight and watch HB's lips (ooh sounds creepy).


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## MMAnWEED (Aug 8, 2010)

It was definitely "fight back". Miller wouldn't act so surprised afterwards and like I said, he's as tough as they come. Either way it doesn't matter since Toquinho got the win in the end.


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## chilo (May 27, 2007)

Trix said:


> I'm watching it right now with the volume turned up.
> 
> Someone does say: "STOP".
> 
> You can hear it.


yup, and its clear.


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## Vale_Tudo (Nov 18, 2007)

I also heard "stop" when I watched this live, but I thought It was Herb. I even thought Miller was tapping with his right hand on his left shoulder, but replays proved me wrong. 
Either way someone says stop and Paul stops throwing punches.


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## Fard (Nov 5, 2010)

Definitely sounds like "stop" to me aswell.
Poor guy, I feel like after all the heat he was getting for holding on to some chokes for too long (that leglock was nasty, but in the heat of the battle...), he might have just been extra cautious not to throw any unnecessary punches.


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## LizaG (May 12, 2008)

No matter what was said it's only the Ref that decides when a fight is done, Palhares should have continued till HERB said it's time, we learnt that lesson from the last SF Challengers card that fighters don't decide on the finishing point of a fight.

Silly thing is Palhares could have pounded a few more shots and would probably have got the stoppage anyway, he just got too excited.


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## sg160187 (Apr 11, 2010)

Just to play devils advocate there have been instances where fighters have stopped hitting there opponent and claimed the win due to bad refs.

Scott Morris vs Pat Smith is an example.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwtJ6vMgeyM

I'd watch it on mute to save your ear drums from bleeding, also to be fair I think he was right to stop hitting him as he was definitely in no state to continue and I heard him say he would never tap or throw in the towel prior to the fight.

As for the audio clip I heard something that sounded like 'stop' around the time stated.

Also as far as Miller knew the ref may of grabbed Palhares and dragged him off so that's why he looked as if he had lost when he got up.

Finally I know ref's today are better than yesteryear :thumb02:


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## Inkdot (Jun 15, 2009)

Is it just me that can't hear anyone saying stop? Maybie I'm getting old hehe...


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## michelangelo (Feb 1, 2009)

It's a simple rule: fight until the ref stops you. If he can't figure it out by now...


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## BWoods (Apr 8, 2007)

Miller never said stop. What everyone is hearing is Herb saying "fight back" and having it be drowned out by the noise.

I think it just comes down to Rousimar being a little too excited and not understanding any English whatsoever.


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## Indestructibl3 (Apr 2, 2009)

BWoods said:


> *Miller never said stop. What everyone is hearing is Herb saying "fight back" and having it be drowned out by the noise.*
> 
> I think it just comes down to Rousimar being a little too excited and not understanding any English whatsoever.


Yup, what I said.


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## AmdM (Apr 13, 2010)

Indestructibl3 said:


> Sounds interesting - will watch it loud. Palhares has atrocious English though, does he even know what that means? (seriously)





BWoods said:


> Miller never said stop. What everyone is hearing is Herb saying "fight back" and having it be drowned out by the noise.
> 
> I think it just comes down to Rousimar being a little too excited and not understanding any English whatsoever.


Everybody knows the meaning of stop,
it got internationalized due to the traffic stop sign.










Besides, it´s clear he knows the meaning from the post fight interview on UFC.com
http://uk.ufc.com/media/UFCRIO-POST-PALHARES-MILLER


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## Couchwarrior (Jul 13, 2007)

I've watched it over and over and also listened to the audio file but I just can't hear it. Is it supposed to be right before Herb shouts "fight back"?


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## prolyfic (Apr 22, 2007)

MIller knows that if he wanted out that Stop is not the way....you tap...And the ref doesnt just yell stop with his mouth but with his whole body. He made a big mistake he is human maybe he heard stop but its crazy to think that Miller yelled stop instead of tapping if he wanted out.


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## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

If someone was yelling stop, and I can't hear it in any of the stuff provided, it wasn't Miller. Miller gets up and the first thing you can see him say is 'WTF?' as he is pissed about an early stoppage. His corner points out to him the fight is still on and he goes to chase down Phalares but Herb stops him.

This is the bad side of what happens with a fighter assumes a fight is over before the ref stops it. A fight isn't over until Herb Dean has forced himself between you and your opponent.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

Cool, so Palhares can understand that in english but not "let go of the ******* cage."


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

NO. I just listened to that audio clip 5 times and each time Herb Dean says "FIGHT BACK!". "STOP" was never once picked up in that audio segment.

So, Paul Harris is a liar as well as a cheater, a retard and a sick f u c k that enjoys holding on to submissions for too long.

He's worse than Cheick Kongo.


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## LL (Mar 12, 2011)

I thought Palhares didn't understand English at all? If so, how would he know what Miller said.

This guy is just plain dumb.


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## amoosenamedhank (Sep 2, 2009)

sg160187 said:


> Just to play devils advocate there have been instances where fighters have stopped hitting there opponent and claimed the win due to bad refs.
> 
> Scott Morris vs Pat Smith is an example.
> 
> ...


I think Matt Brown vs Pete Sell is also a good example... Matt Brown was basically just saying "do I really need to keep going?!?"


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## G_Land (Aug 11, 2009)

No way was that "stop" it was fight back. But it was loud as hell out there Im surprised you can hear anything at all


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## AmdM (Apr 13, 2010)

I´m sure someone will ask Herb about it soon enough.

Anyway, i´m cringing by the comments about Toquinho understanding the meaning of "Stop".
Everybody in the f*****g world knows the meaning of Stop.


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## G_Land (Aug 11, 2009)

Never been to afghanistan eh? lol


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## Ape City (May 27, 2007)

chilo said:


> yup, and its clear.


I don't think it is clear at all...i'll listen again b ut the quality just isn't there to say for sure what is said or who says it.


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## AmdM (Apr 13, 2010)

I´ve re-watched the fight right now with the sound up there.

The only voice i can hear is Herb telling Dan to "Fight back",
besides, Dan's lips seem to not be moving at all during the beatdown.

Also, who thinks the fight should have been stopped at round 2? It was a f*****g massacre.


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## hellholming (Jun 13, 2009)

Even if Herb yelled "Fight back", Palhares could have interpreted it as "stop" if he heard it badly.


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

If this is true then its another piece of sh1t reffing from Herb Dean, which would not surprise me at all.


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

AmdM said:


> I´ve re-watched the fight right now with the sound up there.
> 
> The only voice i can hear is Herb telling Dan to "Fight back",
> besides, Dan's lips seem to not be moving at all during the beatdown.
> ...


Yea for real, Herb is a double standards ref, he stopped the Nate/Palhares fair much less that what went down in that second round, in fact he stopped that fight for less than what Palhares gave Miller in the first round surrounding this incident, I don't trust his judgement at all, Herb is a Zuffa player and makes calls based on results the UFC wants to see, I truly believe he is on the Zuffa payroll, his reffing of late has been very suspect to raise the question is he favoring one fighter over the other.


Other examples aside from the Fedor stoppage when he could not wait to dive in there at the first opportunity, another example was the Jones/Shogun fight, I swear the gouging of the mouth and nose that Jones was puling on Shogun is illegal yet Herb let Jones get away with it, dont get me wrong I think Jones is that good a fighter he was winning that fight whatever, but Herb was on his side.

In fact I already said in another post, when you look closely at the second round, Miller was taking that beating with his eyes closed, I think he was trying to imagine he was somewhere else in order to cope with the pounding he was taking. seens to me Herb is happy to jump in and stop a fight if its the right result that the UFC wants, how he could let that continue after some of the stoppages I have seen him pull recently just proves a definite in balance in his judgement, I think he is a crooked ref on Zuffas payroll.


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## AmdM (Apr 13, 2010)

I don't think covering the mouth/nose is illegal.


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

AmdM said:


> I don't think covering the mouth/nose is illegal.


I think it comes under the rules around gouging of the face area which you will find is illegal.


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## hellholming (Jun 13, 2009)

AmdM said:


> I don't think covering the mouth/nose is illegal.


nope, it's not.

it's a great tactic to disturb the breathing pattern of an opponent.


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

hellholming said:


> nope, it's not.
> 
> it's a great tactic to disturb the breathing pattern of an opponent.


Gauging the face area, eyes, Noise and Mouth is illegal, if that was not gauging then what is?

There was another suspect attack in that fight that really rocked Shogun, in fact he never truly recovered from it, when Shogun was getting up at one point, Jones through a kick to the head while Shogun still had his hand on the floor, tho be it as it landed Shogun did pull his hand up but only in a reflex action in response to the kick coming straight in on his face, is a very grey area, that kick was landing if Shogun moved his hand or not and it landed hard shin to the head, rocked Shogun badly, did a lot of damage, Shogun never recovered from it in fact you could argue it was the first step leading to the TKO, Herb did not do a dam thing about it.


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## hellholming (Jun 13, 2009)

gauging has alwats been illegal, but just putting your hand over an opponents mouth hasn't been.... Until 2008. I just read up on it:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/34945-mma-rule-changes-made-by-abc

"They also placed a ban on using the hand to smother an opponent. The days when we see competitors laying on the ground and the only action is covering the mouth and nose will be a thing of the past."


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## Hail the Potato (Jul 29, 2010)

KillerShark1985 said:


> Gauging the face area, eyes, Noise and Mouth is illegal, if that was not gauging then what is?


Covering is not gouging, gouging is gouging.


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

hellholming said:


> gauging has alwats been illegal, but just putting your hand over an opponents mouth hasn't been.... Until 2008. I just read up on it:
> 
> http://bleacherreport.com/articles/34945-mma-rule-changes-made-by-abc
> 
> "They also placed a ban on using the hand to smother an opponent. The days when we see competitors laying on the ground and the only action is covering the mouth and nose will be a thing of the past."


Thank YOu, I knew I was right, Rogans commentary made me question myself during the fight about that rule, its illegal pain and simple and you just found exactly when the rule was brought into force, Rogan should have known better for calling it legal but that can be forgiven as for Herb Dean he should have dam well known better been in his position, and action should be taken against him for incompetence in doing his job at the very least.


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## sg160187 (Apr 11, 2010)

Weird I was sure I head Rogan comment on how its a good tactic...


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

sg160187 said:


> You are allowed to cover the opponents mouth/nose area. I've seen it done hundreds of times and even hears Rogan comment on how it's a great way to unsettle breathing patterns.


That is BS Rogan was talking sh1t when he was saying that, he was ether unware of the rule chance that outlawed this action or was playing along trying to sell the illegal move to the public along with Herb Dean allowing this illegal action in order to give Jones an advantage,

If Rogan was unaware Herb dam well should not have been, but its there in writing just read the fuking link hellholming has posted, it was outlawed in 2008, any time since then you have seen it used like in the Jones/Shogun fight to was fcuking illegal.

Herb Dean is ether a fcuking dirty ref on Zuffas pay books or incompetent, ether way he should not be alowed back into the octagon and should be investigated for his actions.

And if he missed a verbal submission like this topic highlights that again is a fcuking unforgivable mistake and to add to the issue Miller got fcuking battered in that second round after the fight should have been over, if that is what happened Herb should never be allowed to ref again ever.



sg160187 said:


> Weird I was sure I head Rogan comment on how its a good tactic...


Rogan did say that sh1t, you can forgive a commutator but not a ref. When it boils down the ref had the power to stop it from happening, the commutator could not do a dam thing about it only make the public aware of what was happening,


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## Hail the Potato (Jul 29, 2010)

KillerShark1985 said:


> That is BS Rogan was talking sh1t when he was saying that, he was ether unware of the rule chance that outlawed this action or was playing along trying to sell the illegal move to the public along with Herb Dean allowing this illegal action in order to give Jones an advantage,
> 
> If Rogan was unaware Herb dam well should not have been, but its there in writing just read the fuking link hellholming has posted, it was outlawed in 2008, any time since then you have seen it used like in the Jones/Shogun fight to was fcuking illegal.
> 
> ...


That article also mentions 2 other rule changes that I didn't (still don't) think were implemented in the UFC:

"They redefined the illegal hit to the back of the head to where it protects the crown of the head down the spine in a strip with one inch on either side of the spine. That should do away with the head getting hit directly behind the ear and resulting in the loss of a point.

The downward elbow strike was re-admitted, since the rule was originally set to stop someone from elbowing in the back of the head. Now that they have a clear definition as to where the illegal blow would be they reinstated the downward elbow strike."


I'm not sure how accurate this article is. I'll look for the rules online because I would like to know for sure
EDIT:
http://www.ufc.com/discover/sport/rules-and-regulations#15
"
The following acts constitute fouls in a contest or exhibition of mixed martial arts and may result in penalties, at the discretion of thereferee, if committed:
Butting with the head
Eye gouging of any kind
Biting
Spitting at an opponent
Hair pulling
Fish hooking
Groin attacks of any kind
Putting a finger into any orifice or any cut or laceration of an opponent
Small joint manipulation
Striking downward using the point of the elbow
Striking to the spine or the back of the head
Kicking to the kidney with a heel
Throat strikes of any kind, including, without limitation, grabbing the trachea
Clawing, pinching or twisting the flesh
Grabbing the clavicle
Kicking the head of a grounded opponent
Kneeing the head of a grounded opponent
Stomping a grounded opponent
Holding the fence
Holding the shorts or gloves of an opponent
Using abusive language in fenced ring/fighting area
Engaging in any unsportsmanlike conduct that causes injury to an opponent
Attacking an opponent on or during the break
Attacking an opponent who is under the care of the referee
Attacking an opponent after the bell has sounded the end of the round
Timidity, including, without limitation, avoiding contact with an opponent, intentionally or consistently dropping the mouthpiece or faking an injury
Throwing opponent out of ring/fighting area
Flagrantly disregarding the instructions of the referee
Spiking an opponent to the canvas on his head or neck
Interference by the corner
Applying any foreign substance to the hair or body to gain an advantage"

I don't see "covering the mouth"


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## MMAnWEED (Aug 8, 2010)

Covering the mouth is 100% legal. It's been done numerous times without any type of warning or penalty. Also, like mentioned above, it is not seen anywhere in the rules. 

Find me a source that shows otherwise.


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

Hail the Potato said:


> That article also mentions 2 other rule changes that I didn't (still don't) think were implemented in the UFC:
> 
> "They redefined the illegal hit to the back of the head to where it protects the crown of the head down the spine in a strip with one inch on either side of the spine. That should do away with the head getting hit directly behind the ear and resulting in the loss of a point.
> 
> ...


Well since its an amendment to the rules its possible the UFC did not update there site with this information, or there web master took this information off an old source.

I thin kyou will find that the officials rule book is much bigger than that what the UFC has on there site, but I guess Joe Rogan makes it legal cos he says so :sarcastic12:

And its not something you see often, give me one other example aside from the Jones/Shogun fight since 2008 when you have seen this tactic applied?


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## marcthegame (Mar 28, 2009)

That hitting to the back of the head thing needs to be enforce, i see it all the time.


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## hellholming (Jun 13, 2009)

Well, colour me confused.... The covering of the mouth and/or nose is not in here either:

http://www.abcboxing.com/unified_mma_rules.html


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

for the record the UFC rules is a rip straight off Wiki, which we all know can be incomplete or inaccurate, I looking into this myself atm.


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

Sherdog comfirms that these changes happened

http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/Revamped-Rules-Expand-Weight-Divisions-13533



> Smothering the mouth or nose of an opponent has been added to the Unified Rules' fouls list, prohibiting a fighter from using his hand to prevent his opponent's ability to breathe. According to the new verbiage, this does not include choke attempts where a fighter's mouth is covered by his opponent's arm


It talks of the same meeting on the same date reporting on a meeting that took place July 2008 where the rules of MMA where reviewed and changes where made.

Another quote from the Sherdog Artical



> The amended document -- drafted by the ABC's MMA Chairman Dale Kliparchuk, New Jersey State Athletic Control Board Deputy Attorney Nick Lembo, ABC President Timothy Leuckenhoff, California State Athletic Commission Executive Officer Armando Garcia* and veteran referee "Big" John McCarthy -- primarily provided clarifications to the already existing Unified Rules instituted in April 2001 that serve as a regulatory beacon for the sport throughout North America


It all look very much above board to me, would be nice to see this amended document, could be the case the info we have online is out of date from the officials scores ikely do to lack of been assed to update the websitewe, but then its not like the ref and officals have to rely on the web to gain access to the rules,the fact is the refs will have access to the amened document snd should be upto date on the rules much more so than the general public, so whats on the web could be out of date from link posted prior to this.


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## hellholming (Jun 13, 2009)

well, the last link I posted is not out of date in reference to the changes made in 2008, since it was posted on July 30 2009.. However, the changes made in 2008 are not in there.


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

hellholming said:


> well, the last link I posted is not out of date in reference to the changes made in 2008, since it was posted on July 30 2009.. However, the changes made in 2008 are not in there.


Like I say refs will not rely on what is posted on the web to inforce the rules of MMA, if this meeting took place and this rule chance was made it does not need to be added to there website to make it official.

Many MMA news sources reported on this meeting, Sherdog, MMAJunkie and loads of others if you look into it, its very likely this meeting did take place from what I can see and that this rule exists, I find it hard to believe that all these news scorses pulled this meeting out of there ass and added this rule in error, more so when other rules listed in the reports like the weight classes for example are correct and is now common knowledge, so why would this be wrong?


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## hellholming (Jun 13, 2009)

I have no idea... It's weird.


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## KillerShark1985 (Jan 6, 2010)

hellholming said:


> I have no idea... It's weird.


I am willing to bet its right, and unless there has been an amendment since that rules out this chance then its stands, and I can't see why they would rule out this rule it would not make sense for them to do so since lets be real that technique is cheap and suck ass and deserved to be outlawed.


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## AmdM (Apr 13, 2010)

That Sherdog link also states that downward elbows are allowed...


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## SmackyBear (Feb 14, 2008)

Almost all the rules changes from that ABC meeting were rejected. Not just by the UFC either, but by influential commissions, several of whom weren't even represented at Montreal. Downward elbows as fouls are still there, the "headphone" definition of the back of the head was rejected and the mohawk rule was replaced with a hybrid definition, weight classes didn't change, and you can still smother people.

Discussion and review of unified rules of MMA, presented to ABC, 7-30-09



> ABC Montreal 2008
> 
> 
> At this convention, a document proposing amendments to the Unified Rules was released to the membership. This document included controversial topics such as drastic weight class changes and liberalizing permissible elbow strikes, among other changes. After the conclusion of the convention, the ABC’s President, Tim Lueckenhoff, formed this Committee to review the original unified rules and the amendments proposed in Montreal.


They made many changes to the Montreal rules, and then their recommendations were accepted at the July 2009 ABC meetings.


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## kc1983 (May 27, 2007)

Bullshit....Herb Dean was RIGHT there the entire time I'm pretty sure he would have heard Miller say "Stop".


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## Term (Jul 28, 2009)

Inkdot said:


> Is it just me that can't hear anyone saying stop? Maybie I'm getting old hehe...


You and me both, I can't even hear anyone say fight back in that clip. All I hear is Goldberg and Florian.


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## G_Land (Aug 11, 2009)

I could'nt hear the "fight" all I here is "back"


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

Wait. You guys are wearing headphones when listening to the audio clip, right?


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## G_Land (Aug 11, 2009)

Yeah a pretty expensive pair...I just can't hear it


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## Mckeever (Apr 26, 2009)

G_Land said:


> Yeah a pretty expensive pair...I just can't hear it


Audio Technika's man, best headphones ever.

I played it 5 times and heard fight back every time.

I was worried mainly about the people who said they couldn't hear any words at all lol


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## Rygu (Jul 21, 2008)

I definitely heard someone say stop, but it also definitely was not Miller.


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## Term (Jul 28, 2009)

Mckeever said:


> I was worried mainly about the people who said they couldn't hear any words at all lol


Well I'm 50 and they say the first three things to go are your hearing, memory and I can't remember the third.

:tongue01:


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## Drogo (Nov 19, 2006)

KillerShark1985 said:


> I am willing to bet its right, and unless there has been an amendment since that rules out this chance then its stands, and I can't see why they would rule out this rule it would not make sense for them to do so since lets be real that technique is cheap and suck ass and deserved to be outlawed.


I'll take that bet, how much you want to do?


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

sg160187 said:


> Just to play devils advocate there have been instances where fighters have stopped hitting there opponent and claimed the win due to bad refs.
> 
> Scott Morris vs Pat Smith is an example.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwtJ6vMgeyM


At that time (UFC 2) the referee didn't have the power to stop the fight. That was only introduced a couple of UFCs later. There also were no judges or time limits at that time. It was basically almost a pretty different sport back then.


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## Sousa (Jun 16, 2007)

The audio clip , I can't hear Herb Dean at all . Just the crowd muffling sound


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