# ***OFFICIAL*** - Georges St-Pierre vs. Jon Fitch DISCUSSION THREAD (pre/post)



## T.B. (Jul 4, 2006)

*WHO IS THE WORLD'S BEST WELTERWEIGHT?*​
Conduct all of your pre & post-fight discussion in HERE on the UFC 87: SEEK AND DESTROY main event....a LONG-AWAITED/HIGHLY ANTICIPATED welterweight showdown, between the reigning & defending UFC Welterweight Champion, *Georges "RUSH" St-Pierre*, as he defends his title against the well-rounded, always dangerous, former Purdue wrestling captain, American Kickboxing Academy standout, *Jon Fitch*. ALL other threads concerning this huge fight *WILL BE MERGED INTO THIS ONE*. 

Thanks guys.

- *T.B.*


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## rabakill (Apr 22, 2007)

Just watched the weigh ins and they both looked in great shape. This has potential to be an amazing fight, I hope GSP brings it on back to Canada. My guess is GSP by TKO in the third.


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## SlowGraffiti (Dec 29, 2007)

comeonnnnnnnnn gsppppppp


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## Aaronyman (Mar 1, 2007)

definitely gsp's toughest test to date


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## Aaronyman (Mar 1, 2007)

McCain said:


> he has already beaten his toughest test, twice.


i disagree...i think koscheck was his hardest fight


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## capt_america (Apr 16, 2007)

War Fitch !!!! :thumb01


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## capt_america (Apr 16, 2007)

McCain said:


> Oh yeah......what the hell happened to Josh?


hes 10X better after the GSP loss..


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## Dioxippus (Jun 30, 2008)

I'd really like to see GSP fight BJ again  I think this fight with Fitch may go to a decision. Either that or knockout because I don't see either guy giving up.


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

I'm intrested to see this fight. Personally I think his toughest fight in his career was BJ Penn by far.

I think GSP is just clearly better everywhere I'm just curious to see whether he proves it or not.


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

Probably GSP by TKO by 4th round. I don't see either engaging too quickly. But if they did it certainly would be fireworks right off the bat.


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## pipe (Jun 15, 2008)

Fitch looks in awsome shape


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## T.B. (Jul 4, 2006)

DAMN. What can I say about this fight that hasn't already been said? Well, LOTS...so, I hope you have something to drink! 

I'll start off with: *WHAT A MAIN EVENT!*

This is going to be the most competitive title fight in recent history between the two best fighters in welterweight division. We’re going to see a high paced fairly even bout throughout its duration with both fighters having their moments.

Lemme start off with Fitch, then I'll elaborate on GSP a bit:

The guy deserves this fight, no doubt about that. I was SO HAPPY when Karo got stopped, cause I knew Fitch was the clear cut #1 contender, and would finally get his shot at the gold. 

Fitch hasn't been defeated since 2002, when he lost to Wilson Gouveia via (T)KO. His UFC run is simply incredible:

- Unanimous Decision over Brock Larson
- Submission victory over Josh Burkman
- (T)KO of Thiago Alves
- Unanimous Decision over Kuniyoshi Hironaka
- Submission victory over Luigi Fioravanti
- Submission victory over (at THAT TIME) highly-touted BJJ practicioner, Roan Carneiro
- A close, split decision over a reincarnated Diego Sanchez
- Unanimous Decision over a very game Chris Wilson

DAMN. 

Now, we know Fitch working at AKA has molded him into an ELITE welterweight. His training partner, Josh Koscheck went to a decision with St-Pierre, so you KNOW Kos will have plenty of tips and insight to give Fitch, to give him any little advantage he can. That's big for Fitch. We all know about his AWESOME wrestling, and his GREAT ground control. He wasn't the Purdue wrestling captain by chance! BUT, can he control a fighter the CALIBER of Georges St-Pierre on the mat? It's hard to say. I think Fitch's JJ is not equal to GSP's, but it's not far off! Will Fitch submit G? I don't think so.

Fitch may have a straight wrestling advantage over GSP, but in terms of MMA wrestling, I think St-Pierre holds a bit of an advantage there. If GSP's on top, and Fitch is scrambling, we all have seen St-Pierre's SUPERIOR positioning & knowledge on the ground (especially in the 2nd Hughes fight, when G had Matt's back, and Hughes tried to reverse into GSP's guard...and before he was even close, GSP was already sprawling outta there - having NONE of it). 

Both fighters are very explosive, and are competent strikers. GSP is the more VERSATILE of the two standing, especially when it comes to kicks. St-Pierre's high kicks are thrown with such fluidity & power...IF he connects with one on Fitch, he could be in some trouble. If GSP connects with something heavy, and Fitch is hurt, I think GSP will finish him off with elbows. But, will he land anything? Depends on the angles Fitch uses. If he stays out of range, he won't get tagged with something heavy on the feet, BUT his shots will be tough to finish, cause they'll be coming from that much farther away. For Fitch to ever secure a STRONG double, he'll need to enter the "danger zone." AND, say Fitch gets in deep and is close to a TD....St-Pierre could quickly secure underhooks, and simply over-power Fitch in the clinch like we've seen him do many times (against great wrestlers, none the less). 

Look for GSP to keep Fitch's TD attempts at-bay, mixing lots of feints with some nice combinations. Fitch can also throw solid combos, but I don't see GSP ever standing right in front of him, waiting to get hit. His footwork & angles are too good, and he's NEVER flat-footed in there....so unless Fitch lands a "Serra-esque" bomb, I don't see him doing much to GSP standing (in terms of seriously damaging him). Fitch needs it on the ground, with GSP on his back. *Fun fact: St-Pierre has only been on his back for A MINUTE in all of his fights. A F*CKING MINUTE!* That has to tell you guys something. In each one of his bouts, GSP is the AGGRESSOR in the wrestling aspect. The dude is HARD to control! So, we'll see what happens.

The gameplan & insight from Kos in Fitch's corner, versus the master gameplan that St-Pierre will have formulated for him by Greg Jackson. ALSO, like St-Pierre always says: "I'm going to show something that nobody's ever seen before." We'll see if that rings true.

I could EASILY type for another HOUR about this fight, but I just want to see it play out! 

For prediction purposes: I'll go with St-Pierre via a DOMINATING Unanimous Decision. I'd like to see a finish, but Fitch is a tough bastard, so that's gonna be TOUGH!

IF their wrestling cancels each others out, we could see a long fight on the feet...like I said, unless something HEAVY is landed. This fight could very well go to a decision, and if it does, hopefully it's an exciting one! I wish both fighters the BEST OF LUCK, because I'm a fan of BOTH (no matter what happens). I don't look for much action in the first 2-3 minutes of the first round.....respect and a feeling-out process, but after that, this one is going to be *EPIC*. 

*EASILY* a Fight Of The Year Candidate.


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## Damone (Oct 1, 2006)

^ Swanky post.

This should be a great fight. As Aaronyman said, this is GSP's toughest test to date. Fitch is well-rounded, and is tough as hell. Matt Hughes, who I love, just isn't as well-rounded as Fitch, but the Hughes wins were great for GSP.


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## kilik (Oct 12, 2007)

I cant wait for this fight, at first the fight I was looking forward to the most was Huerta vs Florian but the closer this main event came the more I changed my decision to GSP vs Fitch. These two are the two best WWs in the world not just in the UFC. Both of them are as well rounded as you can be and show what you have to be great at MMA. If Fitch can get GSP on his back then I think he can control him, Fitch is one of the hardest fighters in the world to submit so I dont see GSP subbing him. 

This fight could definitely go all the way but I cant pick a winner... Ok im going with Fitch by UD or SD.


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

I'm beginning to think that GSP will change up his game plan and strike with Fitch (he made a comment about GSP not wanting to engage anymore) and then of course take him down at will. Anybody can win on any given night, but Fitch just hasn't fought the top tiered opponents that GSP has. 

JF = hybrid fighter - meaning no true martial arts background. Heck even his jiu jitsu is unorthodox; "guerilla jiiu jitsu???"

GSP = kyokushin karate, muay thai discipline

GSP should have the edge as he has more tools. He's gonna confuse Fitch to the point he doesn't know what's going down. Left jab, inside low kick, reverse side kick, hk, Muay Thai punch to low leg kick, 1-2 combo to take down, and hopefully we get to see a flying knee knock out in his arsenal! Amped for this fight!


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## pliff (Oct 5, 2006)

I see GSP winning round 1, Fitch round 2, GSP round 3 and GSP wins via TKO round 4.

Cant wait for this !


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## Rated (Nov 25, 2006)

To be honest, I'm extremely nervous about this fight because I don't want to see my boy GSP lose another title defence. I definitely know the haters wouldn't let it go if he were to lose to Fitch even though this is a ~60/40 IMO.


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## Goat Man (Oct 19, 2007)

This will be a great fight between two intelligent and skillful fighters. I like both these guys a lot, but see a UD and GSP reaing his hand.


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## ZZtigerZZ81 (Jul 8, 2006)

Aaronyman said:


> definitely gsp's toughest test to date


I think even an unmotivated BJ from their fight offered more of a challenge to GSP. 

GSP is better then Fitch everywhere. GSP was not better then GSP everywhere.

In a much less elaborate fashion then T.B.:

I think GSP has this one pretty much wrapped up. He just needs to stay calm and work his gameplan. Fitch is a tough test, but GSP has seen and beaten more talented competition. GSP owns the g'n'p and wrestling categories. He has beaten (owned) better wrestlers. Fitch's only advantage (though slight) is throwing hands. GSP could keep his range and work his angles by utilizing kicks, but that may open him up to takedown attempts. I don't think we will see too many kicks in the first couple of rounds. There will be a lot of tension and feeling out at this time. Fitch should take advantage of this and come out strong in the beginning because we all know GSP gets much stronger as the fight goes on. If this goes past 3 it is all GSP. I know Fitch has been training hard for this fight, but you can't just step it up and expect to be on the same level with a couple months of training the way someone else has been training for years. 

GSP by g'n'p TKO in the 3rd. War GSP!!!!


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## The Legend (Jun 13, 2006)

GSP by UD in a fight that is a lot closer then many people think and could be FOTN, and I agree Fitch is GSP's toughest test to date.


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## GeGGosbg (Apr 22, 2007)

-This is just my opinion of what I think-


Jon Fitch is a REALLY tough dude, he's a TOUGH dude.

He's the Forrest Griffin of the WW division, but I think GSP is more skilled than what Rampage is.

So I think GSP will still have the crown after this night is over.

But it will be a great fight.


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## The Finisher (Mar 23, 2008)

GSP is going to school him on his feet.


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## T.B. (Jul 4, 2006)

Here we go ladies and gentlemen....

MAIN EVENT TIME.


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## IcemanCometh (Mar 9, 2007)

how is the fight going? Started yet?


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## T.B. (Jul 4, 2006)

IcemanCometh said:


> how is the fight going? Started yet?


Entrances as we speak...


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## IcemanCometh (Mar 9, 2007)

thanks man....I don't think I missed much from what I am seeing on the forum


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

Great entrance by Fitch, great suit by the Crow. 

This could be a great war or GSP via takedowns.


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## deanmzi (Oct 15, 2006)

GSP v Kos reduex


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

Oops. Wrong thread.


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## Gudster (Aug 4, 2007)

Fitch is getting his ass handed to him..


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## deanmzi (Oct 15, 2006)

Getem Gsp


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## deanmzi (Oct 15, 2006)

IF only GSP had a little heavier hands


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## Gudster (Aug 4, 2007)

Round one 10-8 GSP.


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## T.B. (Jul 4, 2006)

And people said GSP didn't have acclimated striking......HA


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## ezcw (May 9, 2007)

Fitch really hanging in there through a nasty assbeating. I'm suprised he hade it outta 1


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## deanmzi (Oct 15, 2006)

COME ON GSP - finish his ass already


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## The Finisher (Mar 23, 2008)

Just like I said. Fitch is not a top fighter.

And I love how this is his biggest challenge! Hughes/Sherk/Penn anyone!??!


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## purple_haze (Oct 24, 2006)

i can't believe fitch made it out of that round alive. utter destruction on gsp's part and lol fitch just made a smirk on his face like he has something up his sleeve on the beginning of round 2


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

Fitch held in there through the first when he was rocked. He showed a lot of heart.


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## Gudster (Aug 4, 2007)

GSP is slowing down man.. this better not be mental..


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

GSP isn't slowing down at all. It's 5 roumds he doesn't want to burn out right away.


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## mwhite18 (Feb 3, 2008)

:thumb02: Yes gsp just put him in a hammerjack flapper plapper. Maaaaaaaaaan WAR ROGAN


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## kilik (Oct 12, 2007)

This is going 5 rounds. Cmon Fitch you can turn this around!

EDIT: Best UFC card this year.


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

It's gonna end this round. TKO by GSP.


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## deanmzi (Oct 15, 2006)

probably give round 2 to GSP 10-9, although not very convicing


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

deanmzi said:


> probably give round 2 to GSP 10-9, although not very convicing


It could have gone 10-9 Fitch. It was close.


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## T.B. (Jul 4, 2006)

Great 2nd round for the Fitchmiester!


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## mwhite18 (Feb 3, 2008)

this will be all over for gsp if fitch just puts his dick in his ass


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## The Finisher (Mar 23, 2008)

T.B. said:


> Great 2nd round for the Fitchmiester!


At the most he tied. He certainly didn't win, and most likely he lost.


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## deanmzi (Oct 15, 2006)

God Damit Gsp Can't Finish It!


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## Terry77 (Jan 5, 2007)

Can't say nothing about Fitch's effort, he'll make St. Pierre work for it


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## ezcw (May 9, 2007)

Fitch has got crazy heart


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## jmneo (Jan 16, 2008)

fitch is tough. i didnt give him enough credit.


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## deanmzi (Oct 15, 2006)

GSP needs to go for the flying knee - Fitch is almost prime for it


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## T.B. (Jul 4, 2006)

Big, BIG RESPECT to Fitch for hanging in this fight. The man is an absolute survivor in there! 

Propz to the dude FOR SURE.


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## ezcw (May 9, 2007)

Goldberg is being just plain terrible in this fight. Even for himself.


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## deanmzi (Oct 15, 2006)

bad 4th round so far


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## mtxsub7 (Jun 2, 2008)

lmao goldberg is so retarded


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

deanmzi said:


> bad 4th round so far


It's been a good 4th round. GSP has been controlling him and working the GnP the whole time.


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## deanmzi (Oct 15, 2006)

that switch right there probably saved the 4th round for GSP


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## Gudster (Aug 4, 2007)

Unless Fitch submits or knocks out GSP looks like he's lost this.


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## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

Wow! Now I doubt that St. Pierre would survive against Thiago Alves.

I'm surprised. St Pierre looks so-so. He looks like he's hoping for a decision -- again.

Lackluster showing by both fighters.

Where's the killer instinct of an elite champ?


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## deanmzi (Oct 15, 2006)

GSP starting 5th round strong - glad he didn't just run cause he has it won. Nice title defense for George


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## Cochise (Aug 3, 2007)

Great fight, Fitch really impressed me. But not as much as GSPs wrestling! That is some badass skills right there.


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## mtxsub7 (Jun 2, 2008)

SILVA>ALL said:


> Wow! Now I doubt that St. Pierre would survive against Thiago Alves.
> 
> I'm surprised. St Pierre looks so-so. He looks like he's hoping for a decision -- again.
> 
> ...


agreed


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

SILVA>ALL said:


> Wow! Now I doubt that St. Pierre would survive against Thiago Alves.
> 
> I'm surprised. St Pierre looks so-so. He looks like he's hoping for a decision -- again.
> 
> ...


Are you watching the right fight? GSP has done great on the feet and looked to finish it multiple times and he took down Fitch, who has a 70% TDD rate according to Rogan, at will. How do you think he looked lackluster?


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## NameChange (Mar 4, 2007)

SILVA>ALL said:


> Wow! Now I doubt that St. Pierre would survive against Thiago Alves.
> 
> I'm surprised. St Pierre looks so-so. He looks like he's hoping for a decision -- again.
> 
> ...


I think you are watching the wrong fight.....


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## Bonnar426 (Jul 18, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> Wow! Now I doubt that St. Pierre would survive against Thiago Alves.
> 
> I'm surprised. St Pierre looks so-so. He looks like he's hoping for a decision -- again.
> 
> ...


What fight are you watching? Obviously not this one!


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## The Finisher (Mar 23, 2008)

Alves will give GSP a war.


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## ezcw (May 9, 2007)

SILVA>ALL said:


> Wow! Now I doubt that St. Pierre would survive against Thiago Alves.
> 
> I'm surprised. St Pierre looks so-so. He looks like he's hoping for a decision -- again.
> 
> ...


GSP would have finished 3-4 ordinary fighters in the separate beatdowns he gave Fitch.


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## deanmzi (Oct 15, 2006)

GSP does not have big hands of Leben, Alves, etc but he is very precise with his strikes - if did have a bit heavier hands then he might have been able to KO Fitch - he could put him down just not out.


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## deanmzi (Oct 15, 2006)

The Finisher said:


> Alves will give GSP a war.


still has to beat Diego :dunno:


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## bmo37 (Jun 1, 2008)

excellent fight well earned title defense for GSP, and some balls on Fitch


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## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

NameChange said:


> I think you are watching the wrong fight.....


No, I'm watching the right fight.

St Pierre couldn't finish Fitch the way his hype supposed he would.

BJ Penn >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> St Pierre, no doubt now.

That's where he is clearly beneath Fedor and Silva, unreliable killer instinct.


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

The Finisher said:


> Alves will give GSP a war.


No it won't. It'll look like the first round of this fight but instead of Alves surviving like Fitch he'll end up TKO'ed.


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## deanmzi (Oct 15, 2006)

Ha BJ in the ring - guess that settles who he fights next


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## Cochise (Aug 3, 2007)

Did anyone else lawl at BJ?


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## kilik (Oct 12, 2007)

That fight lived up to my expectations, I wanted Fitch to win but man GSP is great. BJ vs GSP I got to go with GSP after seeing what he just done to Fitch. BJ is great aswell but man, cant wait for their fight.


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## purple_haze (Oct 24, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> Wow! Now I doubt that St. Pierre would survive against Thiago Alves.
> 
> I'm surprised. St Pierre looks so-so. He looks like he's hoping for a decision -- again.
> 
> ...


dude you seriously have no clue what your talking about honestly. GSP dominated Fitch throughout the whole match minus round 2.


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## NameChange (Mar 4, 2007)

SILVA>ALL said:


> No, I'm watching the right fight.
> 
> St Pierre couldn't finish Fitch the way he's hype supposed he would.
> 
> BJ Penn >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> St Pierre


Really?

By the reply I quoted seemed like u was watching a imaginary fight. Oo Amazing. GSP will dominate BJ as bad as he did fitch...


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## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> Wow! Now I doubt that St. Pierre would survive against Thiago Alves.
> 
> I'm surprised. St Pierre looks so-so. He looks like he's hoping for a decision -- again.
> 
> ...


First thing first... Alves has to make weight.
Odds are he wont.


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## Guy (Feb 17, 2008)

No need to hate on GSP. He looked great against the number 2 Welterweight in the world. Why all the hate and doubt? Geez fellas.


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## towwffc (Jan 1, 2008)

wow GSP was right he is better than Fitch in every single aspect of the game...Props to Fitch for not getting finished. He got rocked quite a few times...


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## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

NameChange said:


> Really?
> 
> By the reply I quoted seemed like u was watching a imaginary fight. Oo Amazing. GSP will dominate BJ as bad as he did fitch...


They've met before... it went the same way this fight did... it was a UD for GSP.

Basically GSP would BJ down and BJ would get back up.

Should they meet again, it will prolly play out like last time.


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## sicc (Mar 4, 2007)

Maybe I have bad memory, but didn't KOS do just as well as Fitch against GSP? Actually, KOS didn't even take any damage and went the full 5 rounds with GSP.


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## kilik (Oct 12, 2007)

Why all the GSP hate? after seeing what he just did to one of my favourite fighters I have to give GSP respect, he dominated Fitch. 

BJ vs GSP is going to be a great fight.


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## Zarlok (Jul 8, 2008)

Well, ended as I expected. Fitch is damn tough kid. GSP is just a supreme athlete. Why is that guy not winning gold medals for Canada? Hell, pick an event, he could probably medal in it. Crazy.


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## Superman55 (May 3, 2007)

Excellent fight. I came into this fight hoping Fitch would win, because I was very apprehensive about GSP's mental game and how he would handle it. After this fight, I have gained a whole new level of respect for both fighters. Fitch is the toughest dude in the UFC (Minus Nog). GSP is definitely mentally ready, and I am so excited for GSP vs Penn.


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## gm2685 (Aug 27, 2006)

Did anybody see the smirk on GSP's face in the corner before the 3rd? He knew exactly what he was going to do to Fitch.

The only flaw that I saw in GSP was that he didn't have the same gas tank as he use to. He seemed very sluggish after the 2nd round.That's expected when you pack on some muscle though.


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## Drogo (Nov 19, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> No, I'm watching the right fight.
> 
> St Pierre couldn't finish Fitch the way his hype supposed he would.
> 
> ...


What hype was that? Most people picked GSP by decision and a close one. GSP crushed him 50-44, 50-44, 50-43. Fitch is known to be almost impossible to finish and GSP came very close twice, he probably would have finished anyone else in the division easily. I think you are confusing killer instinct with recklessness. Just because GSP isn't swinging for the fences like some guys do doesn't mean he isn't trying to finish or isn't punishing the guy.


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## NameChange (Mar 4, 2007)

McCain said:


> he cant finish fights agaist good fighters


Who has finished Fitch? Alves didn't he dropped Fitch, then lost....


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## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

McCain said:


> he cant finish fights agaist good fighters


??? 

He played a smart game.
He capitalized on Fitch's mistakes... used his longer reach... took Fitch down and used GSP's patented G&P.

Considering that Fitch hasnt been finshed before, I dont see how come you expect so much from GSP... geeze, they are both strong fighters.


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## kilik (Oct 12, 2007)

sicc said:


> Maybe I have bad memory, but didn't KOS do just as well as Fitch against GSP? Actually, KOS didn't even take any damage and went the full 5 rounds with GSP.


He went 3 rounds with GSP. But look at how much damage Fitch took and still survived. I agree Kos didnt take that much damage but that was mainly because GSP was looking for submissions when on the ground with Kos.

EDIT: Fitch hurt GSP much more than Kos did.


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## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

NameChange said:


> Who has finished Fitch? Alves didn't he dropped Fitch, then lost....


Yep.

Fitch is a strong mofo... he's just not as skilled as GSP.


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

McCain said:


> he cant finish fights agaist good fighters


Fitch's chin and heart are unbelievable. If that was any other fighter they would have been out during 4 different occasions. It takes nothing away from GSP that he didnt finish him.


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## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

LOL!

I am laughing at the guys who are mad that I was dissapointed with St Pierre.

Of course he dominated Fitch, but I wasn't looking for a "domination", I was looking for a finish...I was looking for a kill.

I wanted an "Anderson Silva kills Franklin", or "Fedor kills Tim Sylvia", not a points fight.

The ELITE tag is on St Pierre and so the onus is upon him to stamp his authority more resolutely than a unanimous decision.

I don't doubt that he won the decision, but for a fighter purpoted to be so head and shoulders above his competition, that was not Silva-esque or Fedor-esque. 

That was not a kill, just a good old rasslin' smother.


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## GMW (Nov 15, 2006)

That was fedor or Silva domination to me. 

But I don't hold onto the a finish is the end all of domination.


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## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> LOL!
> 
> I am laughing at the guys who are mad that I was dissapointed with St Pierre.
> 
> ...


You are entitled to your expectations.

IMHO, you simply give no credit to Fitch.

The ww division is stacked, there are lots of tough competition.


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## bcbigdawg (Oct 15, 2006)

McCain said:


> he cant finish fights agaist good fighters


Well...I guess him and McCain will be like two peas in a pod then. McCain wont be able to finish either.

Seriously...There can be no judgement towards his abilities as a result of him not finishing an unbelievable grinder like Fitch. GSP controlled him, and dominated him like Fitch has never had done to him before. Everyone will try to compare him to other champions but the truth is that they all control fights differently.


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## Drogo (Nov 19, 2006)

I also was impressed by GSP's stand up since there has been some talk about him being weak or tentative there. He dropped Fitch twice and owned him more standing than he did on the ground. I think if he had stood back and let Fitch get up after he rocked him he would have KO'd him.


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## strauss (Apr 22, 2007)

SILVA>ALL said:


> LOL!
> 
> I am laughing at the guys who are mad that I was dissapointed with St Pierre.
> 
> ...


Co-Sign 100%.

BJ Penn would of wiped the floor with the George that showed up tonight.


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## T.B. (Jul 4, 2006)

Don't worry...

For all the negative responses to GSP's performance, *southpaw447* will be in here soon enough to set up shop on all your asses.

Should be great.


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## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

strauss said:


> Co-Sign 100%.
> 
> BJ Penn would of wiped the floor with the George that showed up tonight.


Disagree.

BJ Penn would not 'wipe the floor' with GSP.

It would probably playout like it did before... going the distance... UD for GSP.


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## strauss (Apr 22, 2007)

Drogo said:


> I also was impressed by GSP's stand up since there has been some talk about him being weak or tentative there. He dropped Fitch twice and owned him more standing than he did on the ground. I think if he had stood back and let Fitch get up after he rocked him he would have KO'd him.


GSP stand up is good at best, but not dominate like a Silva, I can see from this fight and the Serra fight is that he doesn't react well when he is being pressured. BJ gonna get him next time.


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## strauss (Apr 22, 2007)

attention said:


> Disagree.
> 
> BJ Penn would not 'wipe the floor' with GSP.
> 
> It would probably playout like it did before... going the distance... UD for GSP.


What was so impressive about GSP victory?:dunno:

I expected way more from him, his days are numbered.


----------



## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

attention said:


> You are entitled to your expectations.
> 
> IMHO, you simply give no credit to Fitch.
> 
> The ww division is stacked, there are lots of tough competition.


I never mentioned anything about Fitch, I talked about St Pierre.

No one compares Fitch to Fedor or Silva, a lot of people compare St. Pierre to both.

Of course, against Fitch, he is better -- "judges' decision wise" -- but on a Fedor and Silva stratosphere, St Pierre is just "okay".

I honestly expected him to finish Fitch by the second, perhaps I swallowed too much of his hype.

He lost to Serra, decisioned against Koscheck and decisioned tonight, again.


----------



## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

strauss said:


> What was so impressive about GSP victory?:dunno:
> 
> I expected way more from him, his days are numbered.


Lets see... he beat a guy who was undefeated.
Fitch was taken down at will... no one has done that to him before.
GSP changed levels targeting the legs... throwing the jab to the face.


----------



## bcbigdawg (Oct 15, 2006)

strauss said:


> Co-Sign 100%.
> 
> BJ Penn would of wiped the floor with the George that showed up tonight.


Now dont get me wrong....And I do think BJ could beat GSP, and BJ is Top 5 in the world but....BJ beat a natural 145 pound tired and 1 dimensional Jens Pulver....then he beat a young talented overmatched Joe Daddy who was on the big stage for the first time.....then he beat an off cycle, rusty fighter who could not match up skill for skill.

GSP is none of the above and everyone is in this "He has to be like Anderson funk." GSP decisively beat a young well rounded, strong willed, good chined fighter EASILY.
BJ would not wipe the floor and you can guarantee that GSP will pick up his game for BJ


----------



## Goat Man (Oct 19, 2007)

strauss said:


> What was so impressive about GSP victory?:dunno:
> 
> I expected way more from him, his days are numbered.


You're dreaming, troll.


----------



## Meshuggeth (May 26, 2008)

No one commented on the end of the 3rd round? Awesome strikes from GSP.


----------



## kilik (Oct 12, 2007)

How can you blame GSP because Fitch has one of the biggest hearts and chins in the UFC? Fitch took DAMAGE, he wasnt going to give up that fight.


----------



## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> I never mentioned anything about Fitch, I talked about St Pierre.
> 
> No one compares Fitch to Fedor or Silva, a lot of people compare St. Pierre to both.
> 
> ...


IMHO, GSP was playing a defensive and smart game.

There was talk that GSP could not defend his title... a mark of a true champion... he prolly wanted the win more than the finish. I dont fault him for that.

If he got the KO or Sub, great.
But the win takes priority.

He also decisioned against Penn, Miller, and Karo... is that something to be embarrassed about?


----------



## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

GSP is such a monster.

I'm not sure who is going to be able to beat him with all of his skills.


----------



## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

What a war! Hats off to Fitch. He's got some serious heart. How many times did he get dropped and still got up to fight. GSP vs Penn then GSP vs Anderson Silva somewhere down the road.


----------



## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

strauss said:


> What was so impressive about GSP victory?:dunno:
> 
> *I expected way more from him, his days are numbered.*


Your's probably will be too.


----------



## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

attention said:


> Lets see... he beat a guy who was undefeated.
> .


Rashad Evans too is undefeated...maybe if Chuck beats him, Chuck is automatically better than Jardine and Rampage (???) :confused02:


----------



## strauss (Apr 22, 2007)

kilik said:


> How can you blame GSP because Fitch has one of the biggest hearts and chins in the UFC? Fitch took DAMAGE, he wasnt going to give up that fight.


If that was Silva Fitch would of got knocked out 5 times already, just admit you like I fell victim to the UFC hype machine. Even though im a hater I admit he's good, But if I was a title contender I would be licking my chops. GSP doesnt have that killer instinct that greats like Hughes,Liddell,Fedor and Silva has. GSP is a sitting duck IMO.


----------



## Meshuggeth (May 26, 2008)

GSP rocked Fitch like 40 times and completely outwrestled him, Fitch couldn't do much on the ground. I don't know whats wrong with some of you. Pretty one sided win in my opinion. GSP shows that he is the real deal (like he hasn't before?).


----------



## strauss (Apr 22, 2007)

mjbish23 said:


> Your's probably will be too.


I don't care, im not one of the bandwagon boys here, I will speak nothing but the truth.


----------



## Gallows (Oct 16, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> I honestly expected him to finish Fitch by the second, perhaps I swallowed too much of his hype.
> 
> He lost to Serra, decisioned against Koscheck and decisioned tonight, again.


I think that line of thinking is flawed, but your certainly welcomed to it. Gosh, Fedor's never had decision wins against tough opponents, and neither has A Silva... oh wait, yes they have.

Of course, maybe I enjoyed the fight more because I came in with no expectation of who was going to win or by whatever method.


----------



## NameChange (Mar 4, 2007)

strauss said:


> I don't care, im not one of the bandwagon boys here, I will speak nothing but the truth.


Haha ur mad, ur boy got mauled... I'm a Fitch/GSP fan..:thumb02:


----------



## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

bbjd7 said:


> GSP is such a monster.
> 
> I'm not sure who is going to be able to beat him with all of his skills.


BJ Penn.

St Pierre = Point Scoring "Decision Monster". 

Fedor and Anderson Silva = Natural Born Killers...*No Points Necessary. *

Real champs bay for blood, and find it.


----------



## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> Rashad Evans too is undefeated...maybe if Chuck beats him, Chuck is automatically better than Jardine and Rampage (???) :confused02:


What does that got to do with my quoted comment?

You've taken it out of context and replied with something ridiculous.


----------



## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

:laugh:

Let me know when Silva starts fighting guys that are anywhere near his level at MW before you start shitting on GSP for cleaning out a much more stacked division.


----------



## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

strauss said:


> I don't care, im not one of the bandwagon boys here, I will speak nothing but the truth.


When are you going to start speaking this truth?


----------



## bcbigdawg (Oct 15, 2006)

I agree Anderson Silva is the better fighter and Fedor had an impressive win.

Name me one fighter that came into an Anderson Silva or Fedor fight that was

1/As well rounded as Fitch
2/Undefeated in the UFC
3/Beat opponents of the combined quality of Fitches last 8 fights
4/Was undefeated in the last 5 years
5/Has the same chin and will as Fitch

Think about it and if anyone says Tim Sylvia or Rich Franklin, your already wrong because I think Fitch could beat the Franklin that lost to Anderson. And Tim Sylvia would be raped by Fitch if he was 170


----------



## strauss (Apr 22, 2007)

Fedor>all said:


> :laugh:
> 
> Let me know when Silva starts fighting guys that are anywhere near his level at MW before you start shitting on GSP for cleaning out a much more stacked division.


So you gonna act like Silva didn't clean house, and dominate someone in a heavier division.


----------



## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

GSP has cleaned out the most loaded divison in the sport who can really complain about not getting a title shot?

The winner of Thiago Alves vs Sanchez will have a case but Thiago needs to make weight first.

GSP has beaten Kos, Fitch, Hughes, Serra, and Karo that's 5 of the top 10 WW's.

Find me another fighter who can say that.

He also has beaten Sherk and BJ who would be top 170'ers if they didn't drop down.

GSP = #1 P4P I'm not sure how people can debate that.


----------



## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

strauss said:


> So you gonna act like Silva didn't clean house, and dominate someone in a heavier division.


I'm not denying anything about his achievements, I'm simply stating that the WW division has FAR more depth than the MW division, something you'll find difficult to deny. GSP has dominated far more accomplished mixed martial artists than Anderson has, plain and simple.


----------



## capt_america (Apr 16, 2007)

im rooting for Fitch in this fight and i have to agree that GSP is one of the greatest right now.. i expected him to collapse mentally at the middle of the fight but he is totally focused.. his striking and wrestling are high levels.. 

Fitch has nothing to be ashamed of.. he fought a great fight but fell short.

IMO GSP should fight Thiago Alves first before fighting BJ..


----------



## Goat Man (Oct 19, 2007)

strauss said:


> I don't care, im not one of the bandwagon boys here, I will speak nothing but the truth.


To the deluded, even their confusion rings of truth to their ears.


----------



## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

bbjd7 said:


> GSP has cleaned out the most loaded divison in the sport who can really complain about not getting a title shot?
> 
> The winner of Thiago Alves vs Sanchez will have a case but Thiago needs to make weight first.
> 
> ...


Agreed completely! :thumb02:


----------



## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

capt_america said:


> im rooting for Fitch in this fight and i have to agree that GSP is one of the greatest right now.. i expected him to collapse mentally at the middle of the fight but he is totally focused.. his striking and wrestling are high levels..
> 
> Fitch has nothing to be ashamed of.. he fought a great fight but fell short.
> 
> IMO GSP should fight Thiago Alves first before fighting BJ..


Fitch tagged GSP... that cut over GSP's eye was huge.

Neither Fitch nor GSP is known for gassin' out... but the pace they set was insane... both guys were suckin air at the end of each round.

IMHO, Alves should fight one match where he makes weight before a title shot...
If he can make weight and win, great... give him a shot.
But if he doesnt, Alves should not be allowed to compete at ww.


----------



## bcbigdawg (Oct 15, 2006)

strauss said:


> So you gonna  act like Silva didn't clean house, and dominate someone in a heavier division.


It was James Fricken Irvin.....If it was Rampage or Forrest I would be like ....oh...dam....but it would be like GSP moving up and fighting Leban....good fighter and all but about 1/100 of the skills and GSP would own him.

I still think Anderson is better but think about GSP at Andersons Age?


----------



## GMW (Nov 15, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> BJ Penn.
> 
> St Pierre = Point Scoring "Decision Monster".
> 
> ...


BJ penn has 3 decisions in 13 wins. 
Fedor has 7 decisions in 28 wins. 
Anderson has 5 in 22 wins (The lowest at like 22% i believe)
And GSP has 5 in 17 wins.

They all score decision victories. 

Post BJ penn 3 of GSP's 5 wins have come from finishing an opponent.

Look at who he didn't finish? Fitch and Koscheck, two top level wrestlers who are very resilient. 

At the same time though, GSP completely controlled them, beating them at the only place they are considered world class. What is more dominating then beating someone at the only thing they are good at? Sure, if he had finished it would of been slightly more, but to act like he doesn't dominate like Fedor or Silva is ridiculous, to me at least.


----------



## SlowGraffiti (Dec 29, 2007)

SILVA>ALL and Strauss are just butthurt because their baby Fitch lost. Go whine more.


----------



## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

Fedor>all said:


> :laugh:
> 
> Let me know when Silva starts fighting guys that are anywhere near his level at MW before you start shitting on GSP for cleaning out a much more stacked division.


This "much more stacked division" is a tired and excuse-y argument.

Of course, relatively equal competion appears relatively more competitive, thus the illusion of "stacked".

But the reality is, take most of those WW fighters and weigh their aptitude against the MW division, P4P, and they'd seem lackluster.

Of course the fact that Anderson Silva rapes the MW division is excuse enough to pretend MW is weak. Personally, I see nothing spectacular about the WW division and I wish Dana would just hand over St Pierre to Marquardt to prove my point.

In my view, the WW division is equally mediocre, thus appearing more competitive.

Insult me for my view, as is predictable, but to me, it's a fact...a fact very un-useful to Fedor-philes, particularly toward the purpose of undermining the MW division, for obvious reasons.


----------



## cdtcpl (Mar 9, 2007)

I'll put it simply, I am very proud of how well Fitch did, he didn't give up when a lot of people did. I hope he improves and gets a rematch.


----------



## lazer (Apr 8, 2007)

I think the bottom line is that GSP was fighting a tough opponent in his division ...I mean ,.isn’t that what it’s all about… …to fight someone that deserves a shot at him and someone that will give his personal all?? I think GSP prevailed due to his overall experience and natural ability. …it was no easy road for him as well …he’s been in the game for awhile.


----------



## GMW (Nov 15, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> This "much more stacked division" is a tired and excuse-y argument.
> 
> Of course, relatively equal competion appears relatively more competitive, thus the illusion of "stacked".
> 
> ...


The MW division is bland has been going on long before Silva. It's actually received more credibility lately then it did in the past. 

GSP vs Marquardt, sure marquardt might win because of size, his point was that the WW fights are better fighters due to their athleticism and technical ability, not that they would actually beat their respective counterparts in the MW division. 

When you look at the skill sets in the MW division, they aren't as acclaimed as in the WW division.


----------



## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Silva>ALL the MW divison has always sucked.

Franklin dominanted it and Franklin really has never been a dominant guy.

Marquardt is good but nothing amazing, Same with Henderson at 185.

The entire MMA MW divison is lackluster IMO and the UFC MW divison lacks most of the top names.


----------



## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

cdtcpl said:


> I'll put it simply, I am very proud of how well Fitch did, he didn't give up when a lot of people did. I hope he improves and gets a rematch.


If they do meet again, I would be worried for GSP.

Fitch is an animal... and GSP might not be able to get away with as much as he did the next time they meet.


----------



## bcbigdawg (Oct 15, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> This "much more stacked division" is a tired and excuse-y argument.
> 
> Of course, relatively equal competion appears relatively more competitive, thus the illusion of "stacked".
> 
> ...


What....are you stupid......did your mom drop you as a baby? Its like saying I wish Dana would hand over James Irvin to Anderson Silva to prove a point. Oh...wait....bin done already....how in the hell is GSP pounding on Marquardt going to prove anything?


----------



## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

bbjd7 said:


> Silva>ALL the MW divison has always sucked.
> 
> Franklin dominanted it and Franklin really has never been a dominant guy.
> 
> ...


If you, of all the posters here, gave me a different post, I'd be knocked over by a feather.

Of course you have more surrogates subscribing to your opinion, for discernable reasons, but numbers don't sway fact.

I will as usual get pummelled with negative reps for my usual MMA blasphemy...go ahead, fact is not dissuaded by disfavor.

Georges St Pierre couldn't finish a guy who is nowhere near the P4P list, albeit, like Rashad Evans, undefeated.


----------



## oboedrew (Aug 7, 2008)

SILVA>ALL said:


> BJ Penn.
> 
> St Pierre = Point Scoring "Decision Monster".
> 
> ...



Even Fedor has had to settle for decision wins a few times. And GSP has finished fights with Matt Hughes (twice), Matt Serra, Sean Sherk, and Frank Trigg. Not a bad record. Granted, Anderson Silva has finished a higher percentage of his fights in the past few years. But your characterization of GSP as a guy who can't finish fights and of Fedor and Silva as guys who require no judges... that's just inaccurate.

Cheers,
Drew


----------



## Alex_DeLarge (Sep 5, 2006)

People always overrate the WW division because of MMAweeklys power rankings. 

They don't understand the fact that guys like Marquardt, Franklin, Henderson, Okami, Kampmann, Palhares are all equally as dangerous as Koscheck, Fitch, Alves, Karo, etc.


----------



## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

SILVA>ALL said:


> If you, of all the posters here, gave me a different post, I'd be knocked over by a feather.
> 
> Of course you have more surrogates subscribing to your opinion, for discernable reasons, but numbers don't sway fact.
> 
> ...


Fitch may not be in the P4P list but he is undoubtedly the #2 WW in the world so it really isn't taking anything away from GSP that he didn't finish him. You aren't giving Fitch the credit he deserves for being a tough fighter.


----------



## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Fitch is more well rounded than anyone Anderson has faced.

Who has Anderson faced besides Henderson that was ranked on the P4P list because GSP has beaten BJ, and Hughes both guys who were at the top of it.

And just for the record I don't neg rep I believe I've given 1 neg rep since I have been a member on this site.


----------



## attention (Oct 18, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> ...
> Georges St Pierre couldn't finish a guy who is nowhere near the P4P list, albeit, like Rashad Evans, undefeated.


???
GSP has fought the top tier fighters in the ww division.
What does this have to do with p4p?

Stylewise, this was predestined to be a grinded out decision.

IMHO, its like expecting a KO or Sub when Sherk and Hughes fought... it simply was not going to happen.


----------



## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

Alex_DeLarge said:


> People always overrate the WW division because of MMAweeklys power rankings.
> 
> They don't understand the fact that guys like Marquardt, Franklin, Henderson, Okami, Kampmann, Palhares are all equally as dangerous as Koscheck, Fitch, Alves, Karo, etc.


None of those MW fighters are as talented or accomplished as the listed welterweight fighters. The MW division lacks well-rounded fighters, everyone but Anderson is VERY one-dimensional.


----------



## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

Alex_DeLarge said:


> People always overrate the WW division because of MMAweeklys power rankings.
> 
> They don't understand the fact that guys like Marquardt, Franklin, Henderson, Okami, Kampmann, Palhares are all equally as dangerous as Koscheck, Fitch, Alves, Karo, etc.


Alex, you're getting a positive rep from me.

But, I pray for your reputation (since the "usually angry objectors" are watching), Anderson Silva is meant to be "great" just because MW sucks, not because his striking skills are remarkable. 

The cozy notion helps certain people sleep around here, so don't break their bubble or they'll break your Rep.

It's a silly world we live in.


----------



## GMW (Nov 15, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> Alex, you're getting a positive rep from me.
> 
> But, I pray for your reputation (since the "usually angry objectors" are watching), Anderson Silva is meant to be "great" just because MW sucks, not because his striking skills are remarkable.
> 
> ...


[Condescending douchebag remark disregarding everything you said]

[Ad hominem about your mom]


----------



## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

GMW said:


> [Condescending douchebag remark disregarding everything you said]
> 
> [Ad hominem about your mom]


English, please. :wink01:


----------



## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

GMW said:


> [Condescending douchebag remark disregarding everything you said]
> 
> [Ad hominem about your mom]


LMAO

How predictable is it that Acoustic comes in here and starts talking about Anderson Silva because attention has shifted from him to GSP momentarily? Too funny.


----------



## Alkhir (Mar 3, 2008)

I noticed something new in GSP tonight, he suddenly has good power in his hands! He dropped Fitch twice with powerful shot, I didn't expected to see that.


----------



## Alex_DeLarge (Sep 5, 2006)

I could care less about reputation. As far as the MW division hasen't accomplished as much as people in the WW division, I find that hard to believe.

There is no way to tell which one is actually better. Again, people just thrive on that power rankings on MMAweekly. Josh Koscheck, Alves, Fitch, Karo are not as dangerous as Rich Franklin, or Dan Henderson, or Nate Marquardt. It's a pointless argument.


----------



## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

Fedor>all said:


> LMAO
> 
> How predictable is it that Acoustic comes in here and starts talking about Anderson Silva because attention has shifted from him to GSP momentarily? Too funny.


I was just going to ask when this thread got changed from one about GSP to one about Anderson.

Acoustic needs to loosen his grip on Silva's nuts he turns every thread he posts in into a thread about Silva.


----------



## GMW (Nov 15, 2006)

Fedor>all said:


> LMAO
> 
> How predictable is it that Acoustic comes in here and starts talking about Anderson Silva because attention has shifted from him to GSP momentarily? Too funny.


Wait dar.

Is silva>all... the acoustic?


----------



## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

GMW said:


> Wait dar.
> 
> Is silva>all... the acoustic?


See what happens when you go to school? You miss out on things like this, yes silva>all is acoustic.


----------



## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

Alex_DeLarge said:


> I could care less about reputation. As far as the MW division hasen't accomplished as much as people in the WW division, I find that hard to believe.
> 
> There is no way to tell which one is actually better. Again, people just thrive on that power rankings on MMAweekly. Josh Koscheck, Alves, Fitch, Karo are not as dangerous as Rich Franklin, or Dan Henderson, or Nate Marquardt. It's a pointless argument.


Nate Marquardt and Rich Franklin are the most well-rounded fighters that Silva has fought, and they're really the most well-rounded fighters that he could possibly fight. Dan Henderson has no ground game beyond control, Palhares' striking isn't so hot, Thales Leites has great BJJ but terrible conditioning and meh striking, and the list goes on.

In the WW division the fighters are just more well-rounded and the fights are generally more competitive because there isn't such a drastic difference in skill between the champion and the opponent's he's fighting. You can say "Well that's because GSP isn't as good of a fighter as Silva", but that's turning a blind-eye to his opponents, and his overall achievements as a fighter.

How many accomplished top 10s has Anderson Silva beaten, just out of curiosity?


----------



## GMW (Nov 15, 2006)

mjbish23 said:


> See what happens when you go to school? You miss out on things like this, yes silva>all is acoustic.


Omg....icecream truck brb.

Anyways, this should be interesting then.


----------



## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

Fedor>all said:


> LMAO
> 
> How predictable is it that Acoustic comes in here and starts talking about Anderson Silva because attention has shifted from him to GSP momentarily? Too funny.


Yah!

Context bud, context.

It is not about Silva...or Fedor, who you conveniently IGNORE that I mentioned as well, it's about Georges St Pierre's relative position as relates to the P4P list vis a vis his performance tonight.

Relativity infers an alternative position worthy of mention for contrast. Fedor and Silva are positions worthy of mention in weighing the P4P list.

My argument was that GSP doesn't live up to his hype...and like Rashad, he is "a little too often" a "no closer".

Context. Don't pluck me out of my meaning.


----------



## GMW (Nov 15, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> Yah!
> 
> Context bud, context.
> 
> ...


I'd like an explanation of why finishing is actually so important. The goal is to win, but difference does the manner actually make?


----------



## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

GMW said:


> I'd like an explanation of why finishing is actually so important. The goal is to win, but difference does the manner actually make?


A finish to tell a fight has been won deciseively. But I think just about anyone would have to agree what we saw from GSP tonight was just as impressive as any knockout or submission.


----------



## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

GMW said:


> I'd like an explanation of why finishing is actually so important. The goal is to win, but difference does the manner actually make?


Well, if that's your standard, you have the right to suffice in it.

Rashad must be one of the best LHW you've ever watched because he never fails in delivering on that standard. 

As a matter of fact, I'm predicting that he'll deliver on your standard when he fights Chuck. 

Enjoy Rashad, the Lionheart. :wink01:


----------



## sub fan (Jan 11, 2008)

That was a good fight, GSP dominated but Fitch just would not give up, I got to give him props. There is nobody in the WW division that can stop GSP's takedowns, and his striking seems to be improving in every fight. The only challenge out there for him is B.J Penn.


----------



## GMW (Nov 15, 2006)

vandalian said:


> A finish to tell a fight has been won deciseively. But I think just about anyone would have to agree what we saw from GSP tonight was just as impressive as any knockout or submission.


A finish can leave as much doubt as a decision though. How many times do we hear, "x beat y due to luck," or "it wouldn't happen in the rematch."

Picture the chaos after Lesnar vs Mir, as opposed to the questions after GSP vs koscheck. 

In theory, a finish should add a level of definitiveness to a fight. In practice, it doesn't do that over a decision as much as expected.



SILVA>ALL said:


> Well, if that's your standard, you have the right to suffice in it.
> 
> Rashad must be one of the best LHW you've ever watched because he never fails in delivering on that standard.
> 
> ...


You never fail to impress.

I don't think I took a stance in that quote. It was actually a question.


----------



## Meshuggeth (May 26, 2008)

I may be exaggerating but I saw GSP rock Fitch A LOT of times. Fitch has quite the chin. Those strikes at the end of the 3rd (was it?) were pretty brutal.


----------



## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

sub fan said:


> That was a good fight, GSP dominated but Fitch just would not give up, I got to give him props. There is nobody in the WW division that can stop GSP's takedowns, and his striking seems to be improving in every fight. The only challenge out there for him is B.J Penn.


Meh. I really believe GSP's gonna maul Penn this time. And I hope that's what happens, because as much as I love BJ Penn, he doesn't deserve to be anywhere near that welterweight belt right now.


----------



## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

vandalian said:


> A finish to tell a fight has been won deciseively. But I think just about anyone would have to agree what we saw from GSP tonight was just as impressive as any knockout or submission.


Only one thing more impressive than a decision, a finish.

There's no genius that's requisite in figuring that out.

I don't understand, no matter how unanimous, a decision is equivalent to a man begging for mercy with a tap-out, or losing his conciousness to another man's brutality.

There's no comparison.

Fedor kills, Silva kills...St Pierre scores points.


----------



## maggie1008 (Jul 11, 2008)

alot of great champions have wins by decision.

GSP finishes most of is fights. Sometime the guy on the other side is just that tough

props to fitch for taken a beaten and keep on fighting


----------



## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

vandalian said:


> Meh. I really believe GSP's gonna maul Penn this time. And I hope that's what happens, because as much as I love BJ Penn, he doesn't deserve to be anywhere near that welterweight belt right now.


The Penn/GSP fight that's coming up is a non title fight.


----------



## yellow_fever (Aug 9, 2008)

SILVA>ALL said:


> LOL!
> 
> I am laughing at the guys who are mad that I was dissapointed with St Pierre.
> 
> ...


Sometimes when you've won, there's no need to finish, it's like the Colts taking a knee at the end of a game vs. the Lions when they're up 40-15, why risk injury when you know you've won. GSP is really secure about himself, so I can totally understand him just "taking a knee". It's just being smart. This is why GSP is so great.

GSP's got this "bruce lee" type of attitude about him that I love... after that loss to Serra, he didn't freak out, he just calmly analyzed what happened, adapted and learned from it, which is why I dont understand why people question his mental toughness. If he fell off the wagon after the serra fight, I could understand, but he keeps getting better and he's not even 30 yet. When Bruce Lee was developing his style of martial arts, I think fighters like GSP are what he was trying to create.

Great fight... I thought the fight should've been stopped in the round when fitch was eating knees, but it was a great call by Yves for letting it go on cause Fitch was obviously able to continue.


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## GMW (Nov 15, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> Only one thing more impressive than a decision, a finish.
> 
> There's no genius that's requisite in figuring that out.
> 
> ...


GSP's decision rate is 29%
BJ penn and Fedor are both in the mid 20's.
and Silva is in the low 20's.

3 of GSP's last 5 fights have been finished. 

I was going to pull up Fedor's record as a comparison of decisions but I noticed several of his last fights were meaningless. So, I'll find some other point.

hell, fedors record is actually ridiculously padded. Against legit opponents he probably has 35% decisions.


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

GMW said:


> A finish can leave as much doubt as a decision though. How many times do we hear, "x beat y due to luck," or "it wouldn't happen in the rematch."
> 
> Picture the chaos after Lesnar vs Mir, as opposed to the questions after GSP vs koscheck.
> 
> ...


I know. And I agree with what you're saying here. GSP's fights against Serra are prime examples. How convincing was Serra's win? Less convincing than GSP's win, to be sure.


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## evzbc (Oct 11, 2006)

GSP's win....ok.

BJ Penn will win. GSP is good, but he's not BJ Penn/Anderson Silva.


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

SILVA>ALL said:


> Only one thing more impressive than a decision, a finish.
> 
> There's no genius that's requisite in figuring that out.
> 
> ...


75% of Fedor's wins have come by way of some of T/KO or submission. Some could argue that his recent fights against cans should not be counted which would lower the percentage a little.

Anderson has a finishing percentage of 77%.

GSP has finished 65% of his fights. 

That's not that bad and statistically if he finished 2 more fights he would have a the same percentage as Anderson. You really can't say he doesn't finish fights when you look at the facts.


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## vandalian (Oct 14, 2006)

Not only that, but GSP has finished top-ranked opponents (Serra, Hughes x2, Trigg, Sherk) regularly.


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## GMW (Nov 15, 2006)

mjbish23 said:


> 75% of Fedor's wins have come by way of some of T/KO or submission. Some could argue that his recent fights against cans should not be counted which would lower the percentage a little.
> 
> Anderson has a finishing percentage of 77%.
> 
> ...


We're only discussing finishing rates.

This becomes a lot different when win-loss ratio is mixed in. (then fedor like wtf pwnz all)


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

GMW said:


> We're only discussing finishing rates.
> 
> This becomes a lot different when win-loss ratio is mixed in. (then fedor like wtf pwnz all)


Did you read what I wrote? I said Fedor has finished 75% of his fights he's won, Silva has finished 77% and GSP 64%. Those are finishing rates.


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## sub fan (Jan 11, 2008)

vandalian said:


> Meh. I really believe GSP's gonna maul Penn this time. And I hope that's what happens, because as much as I love BJ Penn, he doesn't deserve to be anywhere near that welterweight belt right now.



I am rooting for Penn and still believe he has a good chance to beat GSP, yes GSP has improved a lot since their last fight but so has Penn, the guy has completely rededicated himself, did you see him in the ring after the fight?! He looked like he wanted to fight GSP right there. Man this one's going to be good....


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## GMW (Nov 15, 2006)

mjbish23 said:


> Did you read what I wrote? I said Fedor has finished 75% of his fights he's won, Silva has finished 77% and GSP 64%. Those are finishing rates.


I meant it like, "we're only discussing finishing rates atm but if we added in this it gets so much worse"


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

GMW said:


> I meant it like, "we're only discussing finishing rates atm but if we added in this it gets so much worse"


Ah I gotcha. No matter how you put it it's obvious GSP finishes fights. Saying he doesn't is just stupid.


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## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

evzbc said:


> GSP's win....ok.
> 
> BJ Penn will win. GSP is good, but he's not BJ Penn/Anderson Silva.


I'll digress from comparing GSP to either Anderson or Fedor, but if he beats Bj Penn(without yet another decison), at his current performance, I'd be the first to apologize for underestimating him. I'd be worthy of the usual villification associated with "acoustic".

Some guys are fond of suggesting that I seek out villification for kicks -- what thrill does negative reps bring? It's silly.

I argue my views which, unless they pay homage to Fedor's divinity -- the first born son of Mars, the ancient god of war, are usually met with hostility and rage as though I were a person that was so insane to believe that the earth was not the center of the universe in Medieval times.

Go further and applaud Anderson Silva and that becomes your Rep-death.

The petty imps will red your reputation if you don't submit to their mma faiths -- look at my rep for evidence. The mice have thrown a tantrum and turned it red. Hehe!


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

SILVA>ALL said:


> I'll digress from comparing GSP to either Anderson or Fedor, but if he beats Bj Penn(without yet another decison), at his current performance, I'd be the first to apologize for underestimating him. I'd be worthy of the usual villification associated with "acoustic".
> 
> Some guys are fond of suggesting that I seek out villification for kicks -- what thrill does negative reps bring? It's silly.
> 
> ...


Just be happy we didn't rep you like Zarlok. Next time you want to bitch about your rep take a look at his. It was even worse then it is now.


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## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

mjbish23 said:


> Just be happy we didn't rep you like Zarlok. Next time you want to bitch about your rep take a look at his. It was even worse then it is now.


I don't bitch about it, I laugh about it.

If rep bothered me, BBJDZ (whatever his name is) would be right everytime, Fedor undefeatable, Anderson Silva a wimp bullying a weak MW division and Georges St Pierre would be the greatest finisher in MMA's history...of course, I don't believe in the popular myths.

Georges St Pierre is what he proved himself to be tonight, Fedor is human and Anderson Silva does not owe his brilliants to the UFC's MW division, he was doing well even prior to his arrival here.

Those arguments are "blasphemy" here...and I am happy to play the heretic to the mmaforum's MMA saints. :thumb03:


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## BloodJunkie (Jun 18, 2007)

SILVA>ALL said:


> I don't bitch about it, I laugh about it.
> 
> If rep bothered me, BBJDZ (whatever his name is) would be right everytime, Fedor undefeatable, Anderson Silva a wimp bullying a weak MW division and Georges St Pierre would be the greatest finisher in MMA's history...of course, I don't believe in the popular myths.
> 
> ...


This post has no place in this discussion. Your continual sarcastic posts regarding Fedor and Anderson Silva "blasphemies" and "god like, mythical status"...yadda yadda are wearing thin. Do you feel the need to complain about that in every thread you post in? I'm warning you now, do not make another post of that nature in this thread.


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## GMW (Nov 15, 2006)

BloodJunkie said:


> This post has no place in this discussion. Your continual sarcastic posts regarding Fedor and Anderson Silva "blasphemies" and "god like, mythical status"...yadda yadda are wearing thin. Do you feel the need to complain about that in every thread you post in? I'm warning you now, do not make another post of that nature in this thread.


But the imps are making his rep red....


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## name goes here (Aug 15, 2007)

Fitch has great recovery, Gsp nearly finished several times.


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## SILVA>ALL (Jul 22, 2008)

BloodJunkie said:


> This post has no place in this discussion. Your continual sarcastic posts regarding Fedor and Anderson Silva "blasphemies" and "god like, mythical status"...yadda yadda are wearing thin. Do you feel the need to complain about that in every thread you post in? I'm warning you now, do not make another post of that nature in this thread.


No offense was intended against the rules of the forum, mod.

That said, do to my account as your privileges require of you if my posts were out of line.


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## bbjd7 (Apr 9, 2007)

Let me clear this up.

Dominanting an entire fight even if you don't finish can be just as impressive as a finish as long as you are doing damage the whole time.

GSP isn't Lyoto Machida he doesn't have a finishing problem.

And when you look that much better 4 5 rounds then another top 5 guy in your divison it makes it clear you are the best in your divison by alot.


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## pliff (Oct 5, 2006)

bbjd7 said:


> Let me clear this up.
> 
> Dominanting an entire fight even if you don't finish can be just as impressive as a finish as long as you are doing damage the whole time.
> 
> ...



Dominating for 5 rounds proves way more than an 8 second KO IMO. 

GSP showed why he is champ and anyone trying to take the title from him has a lot of work ahead of him..


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## ZZtigerZZ81 (Jul 8, 2006)

I am not going to read through the previous 13+ pages, but this was a great showing by GSP and what he said after it was exactly right. This is what Fitch needed to make it to the next step. That is why Lyoto is so scary because he hasn't gotten that first loss to drive him to get better yet.

GSP had this one easily the whole fight. He started by rocking him early and though Fitch recovered I am not sure he ever fully recovered. This was a case of GSP's record against great competition coming through and being the difference. I viewed this as the best SEC team against a middle of the road Big 10 team.


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## Walker (May 27, 2007)

ZZtigerZZ81 said:


> I am not going to read through the previous 13+ pages, but this was a great showing by GSP and what he said after it was exactly right. This is what Fitch needed to make it to the next step. That is why Lyoto is so scary because he hasn't gotten that first loss to drive him to get better yet.
> 
> GSP had this one easily the whole fight. He started by rocking him early and though Fitch recovered I am not sure he ever fully recovered. This was a case of GSP's record against great competition coming through and being the difference. I viewed this as the best SEC team against a middle of the road Big 10 team.


Great college football reference- me likey. :thumbsup: Also I'm visiting a friend this weekend so I don't have a lot of comp time and I can't read through the previous posts either. Freakin' loved this fight- I couldn't sit down and I'm pretty sure my buddy's wife thinks I'm absolutely crazy but so far she's been "cool" this morning and bonus- fixing breakfast for us as well. :thumb02:

GSP's much maligned stand-up looked absolutely great- for all the "only a jab" talk- how many power right hand shots did GSP land- multiple. Utilizing the Superman low kick combo was nice, honestly I'd like to see him develope a superman kick to the body because his opponent always covers up and leaves his midsection wide open. LOVED the spinning back fist- as always great ground control elbows as always but he really used punches in full guard to great effect. I thought GSP would be able to finish Fitch but I credit Fitch's toughness more than anything else. I can't wait to rewatch this fight and their respect for each other at the end should be showed to anyone who thinks this sport is barbaric or "cock fighting". That display could teach all sports what true respect and class towards an opponent is really about.

That's all I can say for right now the eggs and bacon and ready. :thumb02:


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## aerius (Nov 19, 2006)

bbjd7 said:


> Let me clear this up.
> 
> Dominanting an entire fight even if you don't finish can be just as impressive as a finish as long as you are doing damage the whole time.


No kidding. I don't remember people crying about how Randy Couture couldn't finish when he gave Tim Sylvia a 5 round beating. In fact most people here were going "holy crap, Randy is ******* amazing, he just tooled Sylvia for 5 rounds!"


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## Aaronyman (Mar 1, 2007)

a finish in the later rounds would have been nice...but i'm satisfied.....i like fights finished

and that spinning backfist was really really cool...


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## ozz525 (Oct 5, 2006)

Man I am scared for BJ. GSP was a ******* monster today. Fitch didn't stand a chance. GSP was stuning Fitch with his jab. After all the shit that Fitch talked, I expected more. But it is good to see GSP get that first defense out of the way.


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## yorT (Apr 22, 2007)

Total domination by GSP. I am surprised how quickly fitch could recover from those bombs. Also gsp proved how good his stand up is, tagging fitch left and right.raise01:


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## SlowGraffiti (Dec 29, 2007)

Postfight interview:

reporter: Jon, do you think you hurt him at all?

Jon: I hope..

<audience laughs>

Jon: Oh God I hope so, I was trying


Pretty much the story of the fight.


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## No_Mercy (Oct 17, 2006)

Definitely a stellar performance by "RUSH!" I'd have to say the fact that Fitch took or for lack of better words ABSORBED everything GSP threw at him and was able to recover was equally impressive. Can't remember the last time I saw a fighter take that much punishment for five rounds straight and still put up a fight.

QUOTE OF THE NIGHT!

"After third round I was looking at the clock and Jon Fitch and he never die. You know I tried to finish him many times. After the first round I tried everything I saw him like fell down and come back. I was like my GOD what do I have to do to beat this guy..........I have to kill him to win."


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## SlowGraffiti (Dec 29, 2007)

Was Mandy Moore in the audience cheering her boy on?


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## All_In (Aug 23, 2007)

I'm aware Fitch isn't the best boxer, but can we finally stop bitching about GSP's striking?


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## MJB23 (Jan 26, 2007)

SILVA>ALL said:


> I don't bitch about it, I laugh about it.
> 
> If rep bothered me, BBJDZ (whatever his name is) would be right everytime, Fedor undefeatable, Anderson Silva a wimp bullying a weak MW division and Georges St Pierre would be the greatest finisher in MMA's history...of course, I don't believe in the popular myths.
> 
> ...


If it doesn't bother you then why do you continually bring it up?


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## Fedor>all (Oct 22, 2006)

SILVA>ALL said:


> My argument was that GSP doesn't live up to his hype...and like Rashad, he is "a little too often" a "no closer".
> 
> Context. Don't pluck me out of my meaning.


Once again, line-up some top 10 fighters that aren't as one-dimensional as the ones Anderson has been fighting, and we'll see if he can maintain his finishing rate.




All_In_GSP said:


> I'm aware Fitch isn't the best boxer, but can we finally stop bitching about GSP's striking?


I agree, I think the people arguing that GSP tries to shy away from striking have been silenced, seeing as he absolutely knocked the snot out of Jon repeatedly.


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## MetalMunkey (Oct 14, 2006)

All_In_GSP said:


> I'm aware Fitch isn't the best boxer, but can we finally stop bitching about GSP's striking?


Fine, I'll eat crow and say that GSP has definitely (not defiantly) improved his stand up. Happy?


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## SuzukS (Nov 11, 2006)

Poor Jon.. Although I was rooting for him there was no doubt that GSP is better than him in every aspect of MMA, as GSP said pre-fight.


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## r00kie (Jul 8, 2008)

I was hoping St-Pierre would win in a dominant fashion and he did.. Im so glad *nuthug GSP*


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## enufced904 (Jul 17, 2008)

This was an awesome fight. I was expecting more from Fitch but GSP controlled every round. I didn't think it was gonna go all 5 but Fitch has a strong heart and never gave up. Great fight!


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

bcbigdawg said:


> It was James Fricken Irvin.....If it was Rampage or Forrest I would be like ....oh...dam....but it would be like GSP moving up and fighting Leban....good fighter and all but about 1/100 of the skills and GSP would own him.
> 
> I still think Anderson is better but think about GSP at Andersons Age?


EEk lets not get too ahead of ourself here, Leban is way more dangorus to GSP than Irvin was to Silva, styles make fights.


SILVA>ALL said:


> LOL!
> 
> I am laughing at the guys who are mad that I was dissapointed with St Pierre.
> 
> ...


And there it is,
You dont respect Fitch as one of the best fighters in MMA today so you expected to see more, I however disagree with you and can say that Fitch is one of the p4p best mma fighters he's just not flashy.


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## oboedrew (Aug 7, 2008)

slapshot said:


> And there it is,
> You dont respect Fitch as one of the best fighters in MMA today so you expected to see more, I however disagree with you and can say that Fitch is one of the p4p best mma fighters he's just not flashy.


You misunderstood my post. I wasn't saying anything about Fitch. The point of my post was that GSP is perfectly capable of finishing fights, and that sometimes even the best have to settle for decision wins. The fact that GSP wasn't able to finish this particular opponent doesn't make him any less of a champion. It just means Fitch is tough as nails.

Cheers,
Drew


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## joey__stalin (Dec 31, 2006)

I wasn't that surprised by the outcome of that fight, heh. 

Although, I was surprised by BJ's ninja like stealth ability in sneaking into the octagon and appearing out of nowhere, challenging GSP lol


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## Walker (May 27, 2007)

joey__stalin said:


> I wasn't that surprised by the outcome of that fight, heh.
> 
> Although, I was surprised by BJ's ninja like stealth ability in sneaking into the octagon and appearing out of nowhere, challenging GSP lol


I know they want to hype the "super fight" but I hated BJ's attempt to hype this fight. First off it was following one of the classest and most respectful endings to a fight with GSP and Fitch kneeling together to pay respect to one another. Then you have BJ jumping in there to ruin GSP's moment with "Huh GSP you wanna fight? Huh GSP Huh, you wanna make it happen?" BS. BJ sounds like a junior high schooler trying to pick a fight on the playground- "Huh Steve you wanna fight me after English class? Huh huh you wanna go?". Wrong place and time especially following what had transpired shortly before hand. :thumbsdown:


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## Goat Man (Oct 19, 2007)

Walker said:


> I know they want to hype the "super fight" but I hated BJ's attempt to hype this fight. First off it was following one of the classest and most respectful endings to a fight with GSP and Fitch kneeling together to pay respect to one another. Then you have BJ jumping in there to ruin GSP's moment with "Huh GSP you wanna fight? Huh GSP Huh, you wanna make it happen?" BS. BJ sounds like a junior high schooler trying to pick a fight on the playground- "Huh Steve you wanna fight me after English class? Huh huh you wanna go?". Wrong place and time especially following what had transpired shortly before hand. :thumbsdown:


That is the truth. And just like BJ to degrade one of the classiest afterfight moments.


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## FedorsFan (Jul 19, 2008)

GSP didn't stand out in anything except for his takedowns during that fight. It's one of the two: either Jon Fitch is so good, or GSP is overrated. Since I'm biased towards both fighters, I'd go with the first option


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

Goat Man said:


> That is the truth. And just like BJ to degrade one of the classiest afterfight moments.


Im no BJ fan but when Nick Diaz got in the ring w/ KJ Noon’s everyone said the same thing, Nick Diaz was this Nate Diaz should not have been there bla bla, then we find out the truth that the promoters basically shoved him in there and said make it exciting so guess my take on it is skeptical



oboedrew said:


> You misunderstood my post. I wasn't saying anything about Fitch. The point of my post was that GSP is perfectly capable of finishing fights, and that sometimes even the best have to settle for decision wins. The fact that GSP wasn't able to finish this particular opponent doesn't make him any less of a champion. It just means Fitch is tough as nails.
> 
> Cheers,
> Drew


No I just miss clicked the quote then had to leave, I totally agree with you.


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