# CM Punk's vicious kicks



## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

I know it was for a WWE promo, that he wasn't training back then etc. but still. :thumb02:


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Because of his terrible crescent kick move in WWE, I assume he was told to kick with the inside of his leg.


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

Not turning the hip won't get him very far in MMA striking.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Voiceless said:


> Not turning the hip won't get him very far in MMA striking.


That's like saying "Not connecting your punches won't get you far in MMA" when watching two guys sparring.


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## _RIVAL_ (Mar 7, 2008)

I hate the fact that this is coming into fruition... /rant


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> That's like saying "Not connecting your punches won't get you far in MMA" when watching two guys sparring.


No it's not. Purposely not connecting (hard) in sparring while maintaining good technique is done to not get injured. Having bad technique while kicking a heavy bag is just having bad kicking technique. If you can't even kick well against an immobile practice target you won't kick better against a life opponent.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Voiceless said:


> No it's not. Purposely not connecting (hard) in sparring while maintaining good technique is done to not get injured. Having bad technique while kicking a heavy bag is just having bad kicking technique. If you can't even kick well against an immobile practice target you won't kick better against a life opponent.


Having bad technique while kicking the heavy bag DURING WWE SCHEDULED PROGRAMMING.

He wasn't "kicking the heavy bag", he was doing a quick whatever segway into whatever match he had coming up. He was kicking that way because it's how his move was performed in the ring.


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## Hennessy (Feb 28, 2011)

man everywhere you look online, so much hate for CM Punk. 

I don't know if the guy is able to hold a candle to the guys in the UFC but by god let him try. I also don't get the argument that pro wrestlers are supposedly not "real" athletes, and therefore unable to do MMA....this is coming sometimes from guys with a blue belt in BJJ who probably roll twice a week and win some cute little tourneys by guard pulling....Not saying that there is anything bad about that. Just saying I would feel weird judging tough as nails pro wrestlers and basically denying them the right to join MMA. 

Now I get that a guy with a 0-0 record shouldn't really jump into the mix of the top MMA organisation right away but it also doesn't make any sense for him to fight for lets say One FC first. If he loses, there would be no value in him coming to the UFC anymore. 

It's okay to be sceptical. I am too. But some people are so damn disrespectful to ALL pro wrestler who try out in MMA just because these guys do some pretty stupid storys and such. 

What about guys like Matt Mitrione? you are telling me Footballers are more likely to be successful in MMA just because the sport is unscripted? No hate for them?

If you really think those "fake" wrestlers can't do shit, try fighting one. Please...


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Essentially, if you say a pro wrestler can't learn how to fight, it's like saying a BJJ guy can't learn how to strike. You don't hear people saying "A BJJ black belt is going to fight in MMA? But he doesnt know how to punch!".


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## Trix (Dec 15, 2009)

:thumb02:


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## Joabbuac (Jan 31, 2009)

Pssst.... Wrestling not real.... its scripted... these were not real kicks.


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## Rygu (Jul 21, 2008)

Wow that form, look out MWs.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Alright so we're just going to keep pretending this is CM Punk training actual muay thai yeah?


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## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

Hennessy said:


> man everywhere you look online, so much hate for CM Punk.
> 
> I don't know if the guy is able to hold a candle to the guys in the UFC but by god let him try. I also don't get the argument that pro wrestlers are supposedly not "real" athletes, and therefore unable to do MMA....this is coming sometimes from guys with a blue belt in BJJ who probably roll twice a week and win some cute little tourneys by guard pulling....Not saying that there is anything bad about that. Just saying I would feel weird judging tough as nails pro wrestlers and basically denying them the right to join MMA.
> 
> ...


Dude, absolutely noone in this thread was saying or trying to make the arguments you just pointed out. You were literally the 1st one. This thread was created as a joke, by all means i'm rooting for Punk.


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## GarethUFC (Sep 12, 2007)

Let me start by saying i've never seen 5 seconds of CM Punk in the wwf (It will always be the wwf to me! **** wildlife!)
But I wish him well, I've trained MMA for a short time and I know how hard it is... If he puts in the time then I wish him the best!


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## Hennessy (Feb 28, 2011)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Essentially, if you say a pro wrestler can't learn how to fight, it's like saying a BJJ guy can't learn how to strike. You don't hear people saying "A BJJ black belt is going to fight in MMA? But he doesnt know how to punch!".


Exactly


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## Hennessy (Feb 28, 2011)

Rauno said:


> Dude, absolutely noone in this thread was saying or trying to make the arguments you just pointed out. You were literally the 1st one. This thread was created as a joke, by all means i'm rooting for Punk.


Yeah you have a point here. By all means I didn't mean you exactly with my reply and yeah it was kinda out of context. I saw that too after I posted it. 

Its just that you read a lot about this topic all the damn time these days and I kinda never said anything. Now it just came over me.

Wasn't pointed at you though.


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## Rygu (Jul 21, 2008)

The only way this whole CP Punk thing isn't a complete and utter embarrassing joke is if his first fight is against someone on the *current* UFC roster. If they sign some can just to fight him, then we all will know the true state of the UFC.


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## aerius (Nov 19, 2006)

Rygu said:


> Wow that form, look out MWs.


Chris Weidman is going to have a much harder time checking those kicks than he did against Anderson Silva.


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## Rygu (Jul 21, 2008)

aerius said:


> Chris Weidman is going to have a much harder time checking those kicks than he did against Anderson Silva.


For sure, I bet he's working on that right now as I type this.


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## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

There's at least 1 guy that can help him..


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## slapshot (May 4, 2007)

Rauno said:


> There's at least 1 guy that can help him..


oh man, your killing me with that LMFAO!


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## Iuanes (Feb 17, 2009)

He looks like that angry kid at the gym with those kicks.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Rygu said:


> The only way this whole CP Punk thing isn't a complete and utter embarrassing joke is if his first fight is against someone on the *current* UFC roster. If they sign some can just to fight him, then we all will know the true state of the UFC.


100% my issue with it. How can they recruit a low level guy who is in no way a draw just to fight another low level guy? It was to be someone at the bottom of the division. Maybe someone at like 6-0.


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## Rygu (Jul 21, 2008)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> 100% my issue with it. How can they recruit a low level guy who is in no way a draw just to fight another low level guy? It was to be someone at the bottom of the division. Maybe someone at like 6-0.


Exactly, I will take this fight as serious as any other fight as long as he fights a guy who is on the roster as of right now. I will respect Punk for taking the fight as well as nobody on the current roster is a shitty fighter. If they sign a guy just to fight him, we might as well be watching Bodog.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Essentially, if you say a pro wrestler can't learn how to fight, it's like saying a BJJ guy can't learn how to strike. You don't hear people saying "A BJJ black belt is going to fight in MMA? But he doesnt know how to punch!".


Nope, because BJJ is a legitimate fighting skill on it's own even without standup, but pro wrestling is useless soap opera garbage. 

A top BJJ fighter can hold his own even with mediocre or practically non-existent standup like vintage Maia. A no-skilled guy getting a 1 year crash course worth of standup / grappling will specialise in a big fat NOTHING.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Rygu said:


> Exactly, I will take this fight as serious as any other fight as long as he fights a guy who is on the roster as of right now. I will respect Punk for taking the fight as well as nobody on the current roster is a shitty fighter. If they sign a guy just to fight him, we might as well be watching Bodog.


A 0-0 fighter who's a draw? Sure, stick him in there.

An under 3 fights guy who hasn't went through TUF that no one cares about? Nope.

Guilherme Vasconcelos (3-2) could be good.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Liddellianenko said:


> Nope, because BJJ is a legitimate fighting skill on it's own even without standup, but pro wrestling is useless soap opera garbage.
> 
> A top BJJ fighter can hold his own even with mediocre or practically non-existent standup like vintage Maia. A no-skilled guy getting a 1 year crash course worth of standup / grappling will specialise in a big fat NOTHING.


Plenty of newcomers fight after their first year in MMA training, and those people might not be in great shape or also don't train with some of the best on the planet.


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## Liddellianenko (Oct 8, 2006)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Plenty of newcomers fight after their first year in MMA training, and those people might not be in great shape or also don't train with some of the best on the planet.


Not at the UFC level, with Mitrione being the sole exception. Mitrione is a freak elite athlete from a REAL competitive physical sport who started in a shallow UFC division. There are no other examples of these plenty of newcomers in the UFC after their first year of training, not since the UFC 1-3 days.

I get that they're going to feed Punk an equally unskilled and inexperienced bum, but unless they keep lining up fake fighters like that he's going to get creamed the moment he fights an actual fighter.


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## Hammerlock2.0 (Jun 17, 2009)

All I have to say is that Alberto Del Rio is 9-5 in MMA with wins against mostly nobodies but also a decision loss against a certain Kazuhiro Nakamura, proving that even though his day job has nothing to do with actual competition and the lack of years of MMA training pro-wrestlers can still hold their own in the ring.


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## prospect (Mar 26, 2014)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Essentially, if you say a pro wrestler can't learn how to fight, it's like saying a BJJ guy can't learn how to strike. You don't hear people saying "A BJJ black belt is going to fight in MMA? But he doesnt know how to punch!".


id argue its more like saying an actor/actress cant fight in the ufc .


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

prospect said:


> id argue its more like saying an actor/actress cant fight in the ufc .


But whether you consider it to be or not, a pro wrestler IS an athlete.

And as for Matt Mitrione, it's a physical and competitive sport....containing NO punches, NO kicks, NO wrestling, NO submissions.

I'd argue that a dude like Big E Langson would easily be a better MMA fighter than 99% of NFL players.


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## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

Pro wrestlers are athletes, just not competitive ones.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Rauno said:


> Pro wrestlers are athletes, just not competitive ones.


In a company like ROH they certainly are. WWE loves it's big bodybuilders but actual professional wrestling is about having the most athleticism, being able to perform the most amazing moves and utilising high risk manoeuvres.

I'd argue that there are more amazing athletes in pro wrestling than MMA.


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Essentially, if you say a pro wrestler can't learn how to fight, it's like saying a BJJ guy can't learn how to strike. You don't hear people saying "A BJJ black belt is going to fight in MMA? But he doesnt know how to punch!".


Nobody says a pro wrestler can't LEARN to fight. Everybody can. Of course they're athletes and athleticism is always a good base when you wan't to learn to fight. But you have to invest time in learning REAL techniques with RESISTING training partners in live sparring. Pro wrestling as such is just choreographed pretend to fight. It has as much to do with real fighting as stage fencing with Olympic fencing.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Voiceless said:


> Nobody says a pro wrestler can't LEARN to fight. Everybody can. Of course they're athletes and athleticism is always a good base when you wan't to learn to fight. But you have to invest time in learning REAL techniques with RESISTING training partners in live sparring. Pro wrestling as such is just choreographed pretend to fight. It has as much to do with real fighting as stage fencing with Olympic fencing.


Yeah outside of athleticism, pro wrestling has nothing to do with MMA (with a fighter like Punk anyways that doesn't train strength or anything). I didn't claim it did. Punk IS learning to fight with real techniques and resisting training partners. This video has nothing to do with real fighting.


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> Yeah outside of athleticism, pro wrestling has nothing to do with MMA (with a fighter like Punk anyways that doesn't train strength or anything). I didn't claim it did. Punk IS learning to fight with real techniques and resisting training partners. This video has nothing to do with real fighting.


As long as he seriously trains, all power to him to compete in MMA. It's great if he wants to test himself. Nothing to say against that. But jumping into an Olympic swimming pool, when all you've done so far was laying in a bathtub sounds odd. For me the idea of him trying out at TUF (Mitrione didn't win, but obviously did well enough to still get a shot in the UFC, so there is the example) seems much more reasonable than to go against a fighter on the current UFC roster. But then again, we all know the UFC is more about money than being a legitimate sport...

Edit: He may have a problem though. In pro wrestling they use fake punches and fake kicks which he now has in his memory and unlearning and correcting a wrong (in the sense of MMA) technique can be harder than learning a complete new technique. So I can see it happening that when under the pressure of a real MMA fight his brain goes back to the techniques he's been used to for so many years.


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## Iuanes (Feb 17, 2009)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> In a company like ROH they certainly are. WWE loves it's big bodybuilders but actual professional wrestling is about having the most athleticism, being able to perform the most amazing moves and utilising high risk manoeuvres.
> 
> I'd argue that there are more amazing athletes in pro wrestling than MMA.


I would disagree. Pro-wrestling is about having a psychological impact via an image and telling a story in the ring. The most successful wrestlers are almost never the best athletes. Look at Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Steve Austin, John Cena. They have a look and are able to tell a story and rock a mic. High risk stuff is usually used by guys who DON'T have these traits in order to offer something.

I would say wrestling has a lot of great performers over great athletes, though there are great athletes too, its not about being athletic. 

Most of them don't know how to fight, or know about the rigours of competition, or facing an opponent who actually wants to break you.

It is important to take everything on a case by case. basis. But even if you think about MMA regulars who made the jump to UFC and were outclassed, think about a guy with no fighting experience making the jump.


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## Hennessy (Feb 28, 2011)

Liddellianenko said:


> Nope, because BJJ is a legitimate fighting skill on it's own even without standup, but pro wrestling is useless soap opera garbage.
> 
> A top BJJ fighter can hold his own even with mediocre or practically non-existent standup like vintage Maia. A no-skilled guy getting a 1 year crash course worth of standup / grappling will specialise in a big fat NOTHING.


Are you really telling me that a blue belt in sport BJJ is "tougher" than lets say Nakamura? Just because the job he does is a scripted show. 

I really think that if you pro wrässle for a long time, you are at least able to take a hit or two. and depending on who coached you, you might also know a hold/hook or two as well so I don't understand why a blue belt is more suited for joining MMA than guy who has years of experience in pretending to get hit


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Iuanes said:


> I would disagree. Pro-wrestling is about having a psychological impact via an image and telling a story in the ring. The most successful wrestlers are almost never the best athletes. Look at Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Steve Austin, John Cena. They have a look and are able to tell a story and rock a mic. High risk stuff is usually used by guys who DON'T have these traits in order to offer something.
> 
> I would say wrestling has a lot of great performers over great athletes, though there are great athletes too, its not about being athletic.
> 
> ...


That's WWE exclusive. No one in ROH will ever win a match by leg drop or whatever you call John Cena's finisher. WWE puts guys like Big Show in main events.


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## Iuanes (Feb 17, 2009)

ClydebankBlitz said:


> That's WWE exclusive. No one in ROH will ever win a match by leg drop or whatever you call John Cena's finisher. WWE puts guys like Big Show in main events.


I wouldn't say ROH and other smaller orgs characterize wrestling though. There's a reason why they are a niche organizations and relatively unsuccessful. THey don't resonate as well with a lot of people. Any wrestling vet will tell you is much more important HOW you use your techniques than having flashy techniques. All the most popular companies WWE, WCW, ECW, had a mixture of both athleticisim and showmanship, but its the image and showmanship which define wrestling. Bare athleticism is the requirement to perform, but success and product are determined by showmanship.

It's also important to remember that wrestling is essentially COOPERATIVE. An a lot of the crazy stuff is enabled by the other guy.


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## Voiceless (Nov 8, 2010)

Hammerlock2.0 said:


> All I have to say is that Alberto Del Rio is 9-5 in MMA with wins against mostly nobodies but also a decision loss against a certain Kazuhiro Nakamura, proving that even though his day job has nothing to do with actual competition and the lack of years of MMA training pro-wrestlers can still hold their own in the ring.


But he trained under Marco Ruas and the Nakamura fight was in his third year of MMA. Before that, when he faced real competition (CroCop), he got head kick KOed in 46 seconds. And 2004 isn't really comparable in terms of professionalism to today's MMA.



Hennessy said:


> Are you really telling me that a blue belt in sport BJJ is "tougher" than lets say Nakamura? Just because the job he does is a scripted show.
> 
> I really think that if you pro wrässle for a long time, you are at least able to take a hit or two. and depending on who coached you, you might also know a hold/hook or two as well so I don't understand why a blue belt is more suited for joining MMA than guy who has years of experience in pretending to get hit


Who talks about BJJ blue belts¿ Liddellianenko spoke about vintage Maia and other high level BJJ practitioneers, not about some recreational hobby roller.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Iuanes said:


> I wouldn't say ROH and other smaller orgs characterize wrestling though. There's a reason why they are a niche organizations and relatively unsuccessful. THey don't resonate as well with a lot of people. Any wrestling vet will tell you is much more important HOW you use your techniques than having flashy techniques. All the most popular companies WWE, WCW, ECW, had a mixture of both athleticisim and showmanship, but its the image and showmanship which define wrestling. Bare athleticism is the requirement to perform, but success and product are determined by showmanship.
> 
> It's also important to remember that wrestling is essentially COOPERATIVE.  An a lot of the crazy stuff is enabled by the other guy.


Define "unsuccessful"? Some of WWE's current biggest superstars, including Punk, are from ROH. TNA's biggest stars are from ROH. Japan's current biggest gaijin (?), AJ Styles, is from ROH.

Wrestling isn't defined by showmanship. WWE is defined by showmanship. WCW had David Arquette as their champion at one point. If you're going to say professional wrestling isn't about athletes, watch ROH or Lucha Libre.

I at no point have said anything in training, like the cooperativeness, has any translation to MMA.


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## M.C (Jul 5, 2008)

Amusing indeed. I do wonder what his technique looks like for real, though. Any videos of his real training?


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## Rauno (Nov 20, 2009)

M.C said:


> Amusing indeed. I do wonder what his technique looks like for real, though. Any videos of his real training?


I don't think so. Aside from BJJ and the other thing he claimed he had a background on, i wonder if he's ever trained stand-up before the whole MMA career thing. 

Here's Joe Rogan in comparison, funy when the guy interviewing could you about your new UFC deal could wreck you.


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## RangerClydeTheBlue (Jul 11, 2012)

Well I can kick 500 times better than this video and I've only been training martial arts for about 4 years with no athletics training ever, so I don't feel the WWE video is enough to go off of.

That being said, I'm sure anyone who knows Punk from WWE doubts he can do that well. He seemed to lack flexibility and wasn't particularly athletic.


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