# Dana White hopes Brett Rogers doesn't KO Fedor; Still wants Fedor in UFC



## Nos5 (Oct 11, 2007)

http://www.fiveknuckles.com/mma-news/Dana-White-weighs-in-on-Fedor-Emelianenko-vs-Brett-Rogers.html

I agree with Dana here. I think Brett Rogers has a good chance of beating Fedor and people are counting him out. I don't think Fedor is overrated like Dana, but I think Rogers is really underrated.


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## JiPi (Oct 3, 2009)

Did Dana just called Brett Rogers: Buck Rogers?? 

Or was it a typo?...knowing Dana I don't think it was a typo!


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## Adam365 (Jul 10, 2008)

What does that mean if he loses to rogers, the UFC won't take him because he has one loss on his record? He's gonna lose one day so what, all great fighters have lost sometime or another.


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## Blitzz (Apr 13, 2009)

> "The reality is, I hope that Buck Rogers doesn't knock him out, because I want to get Fedor in the UFC. I want to see him fight Brock Lesnar. He's fighting a dangerous guy. I don't think he's that good, I think he's overrated and I think he might get knocked out." -Dana White
> 
> UFC President Dana White gives his thoughts on Strikeforce's upcoming CBS debut main event match up between Fedor Emelianenko and Brett Rogers. Emelianenko recently rebuffed the UFC's offer to compete in its heavyweight division for a guaranteed title shot against Brock Lesnar. The organization reportedly offered the Russian superstar a 6-fight $30 million dollar contract, but was turned down in favor of a deal with Strikeforce who offered to co-promote events with Emelianenko's management team, M-1 Global.
> 
> ...


Brett Rogders has a punchers chance. Once Fedor gets him on the ground it is a matter of minutes until the fight is over.


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## swedish_fighter (Jul 12, 2009)

To me this sounds like Dana is admitting that Fedor is not just fighting bums outside the UFC.. :thumbsup::thumbsup:

Dana is giving this "Buck" guy a lot of credits when calling him "a dangerous guy"..


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## Alienspy (Jan 30, 2007)

Think about this. When a fighter loses for the first time, they get super motivated to come back. And more often then none they go on a rampage tear. If Fedor happens to lose this one, which could be a possiblity since anything can happen. Imagine Fedor going ape shit motivated and just coming back and destroying everything in his path and beating Rogers in a rematch. If this happens, he would absolutely be more viable to the ufc then anything else.


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## Emericanaddict (Dec 31, 2006)

Dana is simply setting up for incase Brett does win so that Dana can draft him into the UFC and say "Oh look I said he was the shizz and Fedor wasn't but Fedor cant hangs so ill take Rogers instead so my boys can whoop on him and take Fedor down a peg sine he wont sign with me LOLZ!"


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## rogi (Aug 26, 2007)

Emericanaddict said:


> Dana is simply setting up for incase Brett does win so that Dana can draft him into the UFC and say "Oh look I said he was the shizz and Fedor wasn't but Fedor cant hangs so ill take Rogers instead so my boys can whoop on him and take Fedor down a peg sine he wont sign with me LOLZ!"


Knowing Dana, this is what is likely going on.


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## DanTheJu (Mar 3, 2007)

Adam365 said:


> What does that mean if he loses to rogers, the UFC won't take him because he has one loss on his record? He's gonna lose one day so what, all great fighters have lost sometime or another.


He already has a loss and a No Contest!


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## Soakked (Feb 5, 2007)

I'll take anything that Dana says with a grain of salt regarding a fighter not in his organization :sarcastic12:.


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## leifdawg (Jan 1, 2008)

Alienspy said:


> Think about this. When a fighter loses for the first time, they get super motivated to come back. And more often then none they go on a rampage tear. If Fedor happens to lose this one, which could be a possiblity since anything can happen. Imagine Fedor going ape shit motivated and just coming back and destroying everything in his path and beating Rogers in a rematch. If this happens, he would absolutely be more viable to the ufc then anything else.


Usually that scenario plays out early in a fighter's career (see GSP). But in all likelihood, Fedor's career is winding to a conclusion. It would not surprise me to see him retire after a decisive loss.


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

I hope fedor loses


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## name goes here (Aug 15, 2007)

^ Lol so much Vitriol 

But yeah, Fedor is closer to the end of his career than the start I think, all I have to go on though is looking challenged by A.A. perhaps A.A. was fighting awesome that night

http://video.mma-tv.net/?z=7709

I dunno


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## Curly (Aug 20, 2007)

Lets keep this in perspective guys, its Brett Rogers. If Fedor thought he was a threat he would not be fighting him. If Brett survives the first round it will be a mental victory for him.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

Soakked said:


> I'll take anything that Dana says with a grain of salt regarding a fighter not in his organization :sarcastic12:.


Exactly.

I hope Dana really did say Buck Rogers, b/c that is a) hilarious and b) be a good nickname for Brett Rogers.


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## Finnsidious (Mar 14, 2009)

One of these fighters is overrated, Dana is just a little confused about which one. Fedor is 30-1 and has beaten a laundry list of great fighters, with a few cans sprinkled in.

The combined record of Rogers opponents is 69-59, with 15 of those wins belonging to the only decent fighter he has beaten, arlovski. Some of Rogers 10 wins include victories over such luminaries as Mark Racine, 0-2 in his illustrious career, and Stan Strong, 0-1. Thats right, 0-1, his only fight in his entire career was a KO loss to Rogers. In other words, Rogers beats up guys that won a bar fight and decided to turn pro, and found out the difference between professionals and amatuers, and Fedor beats guys like Crocop and Nog.

So say it with me, which one of these fighters is overrated?

I'm a huge Fedor fan, and even I'm a little disgusted by this fight, Rogers is a total waste of time for Fedor. I think contractual issues are the reason Fedor isn't in the UFC, he isn't ducking anyone, but Rogers, sheesh.


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

Finnsidious said:


> One of these fighters is overrated, Dana is just a little confused about which one. Fedor is 30-1 and has beaten a laundry list of great fighters, with a few cans sprinkled in.
> 
> The combined record of Rogers opponents is 69-59, with 15 of those wins belonging to the only decent fighter he has beaten, arlovski. Some of Rogers 10 wins include victories over such luminaries as Mark Racine, 0-2 in his illustrious career, and Stan Strong, 0-1. Thats right, 0-1, his only fight in his entire career was a KO loss to Rogers. In other words, Rogers beats up guys that won a bar fight and decided to turn pro, and found out the difference between professionals and amatuers, and Fedor beats guys like Crocop and Nog.
> 
> ...


I think fedor is overrated, he hasnt beat anyone good in 5+ years. Even arlovski was out striking him until he got caught. He's still a top 10 heavyweight just not #1 at the moment, more like #7.


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

Adam365 said:


> What does that mean if he loses to rogers, the UFC won't take him because he has one loss on his record? He's gonna lose one day so what, all great fighters have lost sometime or another.


It would definitely drop his stock by quite a bit. No one was saying Arlovski sucked when Fedor KO'ed him, but as soon as he lost to a relative unknown like Rogers, Dana was saying he didn't want Arlovski back anymore.


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## ZeroPRIDE (Apr 12, 2006)

Emericanaddict said:


> Dana is simply setting up for incase Brett does win so that Dana can draft him into the UFC and say "Oh look I said he was the shizz and Fedor wasn't but Fedor cant hangs so ill take Rogers instead so my boys can whoop on him and take Fedor down a peg sine he wont sign with me LOLZ!"


draft?


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

Adam365 said:


> What does that mean if he loses to rogers, the UFC won't take him because he has one loss on his record? He's gonna lose one day so what, all great fighters have lost sometime or another.


It's symbolic. From a business perspective, Fedor represents the only legitimate, competitive product from an opposing company. The legitimacy of that product is less about the product itself (Fedor), but the allure & clout of his persona...ie.. invincible, untouchable, number one MMA’ist in the world, virtually flawless record, so if Rogers wins, that perfect product becomes tainted and Fedor becomes “just another great fighter,” and not, Feyador the myth. 

MMA has tons of, “just another great fighter,” but currently, Fedor is an exclusive product, however, if he loses, Fedor falls out of the stratosphere and joins the pack of, “just another great fighter.” Therefore, in Dana’s [business] eyes, a Fedor loss would equate to his competition dramatically dropping in stock.

Dana will forever take Fedor, but wanting Fedor to lose is more about wanting Strikeforce to suffer.


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## Finnsidious (Mar 14, 2009)

Actually I see I'm giving Rogers too much credit. I added up his opponents record and got it wrong the first time. If Fight Finder is accurate, Rogers opponents are 69-69, not 69-59 like I originally posted.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Anyone that states that Fedor is overrated is a maroon, same people that claim Brock is overrated too. Has Fedor even lost a round in his professional career, other than the MD stoppage and he came back and trounced that dude (not the MD) the next time they fought. Fedor spars with Gegard frequently and I think Gegards is pretty damn good. Fedor will destroy Grim and likely anyone else he faces for the next 2-3 years. Its too bad we won't see him fight Lesnar, I actually think Lesnar would have a solid shot in that one as he'd have a good 50 pound advantage.


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

Samborules said:


> Anyone that states that Fedor is overrated is a maroon, same people that claim Brock is overrated too. Has Fedor even lost a round in his professional career, other than the MD stoppage and he came back and trounced that dude (not the MD) the next time they fought. Fedor spars with Gegard frequently and I think Gegards is pretty damn good. Fedor will destroy Grim and likely anyone else he faces for the next 2-3 years. Its too bad we won't see him fight Lesnar, I actually think Lesnar would have a solid shot in that one as he'd have a good 50 pound advantage.


fixed: "Gegard spars with Fedor frequently." Fedor is the superlative, Gegard is the humble recipient :thumb02:


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## name goes here (Aug 15, 2007)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> I think fedor is overrated, he hasnt beat anyone good in 5+ years. Even arlovski was out striking him until he got caught. He's still a top 10 heavyweight just not #1 at the moment, more like #7.


I think this is because whenever fighters come up against Fedor, they always come in to fight the best fight of their entire career. Look at Randleman v Fedor or Hunt v Fedor.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

VolcomX311 said:


> fixed: "Gegard spars with Fedor frequently." Fedor is the superlative, Gegard is the humble recipient :thumb02:


So true, lol.


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## swedish_fighter (Jul 12, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> I think fedor is overrated, he hasnt beat anyone good in 5+ years. Even arlovski was out striking him until he got caught. He's still a top 10 heavyweight just not #1 at the moment, more like #7.


Brock and the other UFC guys needs to prove themselves against Fedor or at least someone of his caliber in order to be ranked above him. Fedor already has proven that he can crush guys of brock size and bigger..

Fedor still #1..


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> I think fedor is overrated, he hasnt beat anyone good in 5+ years. Even arlovski was out striking him until he got caught. He's still a top 10 heavyweight just not #1 at the moment, more like #7.


lol. Name me the other 6!

I respect the opinion that Fedor isn't #1, but if so, then who is? Seriously, who?

The only name anybody could be considering is Lesnars, and he probably is the biggest threat. BUT, if we are talking about rankings then Lesanr simply hasn't done enough to be ranked #1 by a long shot. Both of Fedors last 2 fights were against top 5 heavyweights as would have the Barnett fight.

#7 indeed... * snigger *


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## FredFish1 (Apr 22, 2007)

actually Fedor has lost a couple of rounds. Fedor vs Arona, gift decision imo


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Fedor vs. Arona was even at best, Fedor was never really in danger, IMO.


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## Curly (Aug 20, 2007)

VolcomX311 said:


> It's symbolic. From a business perspective, Fedor represents the only legitimate, competitive product from an opposing company. The legitimacy of that product is less about the product itself (Fedor), but the allure & clout of his persona...ie.. invincible, untouchable, number one MMA’ist in the world, virtually flawless record, so if Rogers wins, that perfect product becomes tainted and Fedor becomes “just another great fighter,” and not, Feyador the myth.


This is the best post I have read today. VERY TRUE!:thumbsup:


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

Who's #1 right now? Well as much as I HATE to admit it, Brock lesnar is. He has the belt in the best MMA org and has defended it against his only loss. He also called fedor out. Fedor has NEVER fought a guy as strong as brock while at the same time having that much athleticism. Fedor has NEVER fought a wrestler like brock either.

Also, anyone who fedor beat, brock could beat. Nog? randlemann? tim sylvia ( lol )? AA? None of those fighters in their prime would make it a round with brock.

So I'm sorry to say, but as long as brock lesnar is alive, fedor is not going to be #1....except maybe in russia...the same place they believe communism is a "good" idea.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Who's #1 right now? Well as much as I HATE to admit it, Brock lesnar is. He has the belt in the best MMA org and has defended it against his only loss. He also called fedor out. Fedor has NEVER fought a guy as strong as brock while at the same time having that much athleticism. Fedor has NEVER fought a wrestler like brock either.
> 
> Also, anyone who fedor beat, brock could beat. Nog? randlemann? tim sylvia ( lol )? AA? None of those fighters in their prime would make it a round with brock.
> 
> So I'm sorry to say, but as long as brock lesnar is alive, fedor is not going to be #1....except maybe in russia...the same place they believe communism is a "good" idea.


Ok, lets assume I agree with you. ( I dont )

Who are the other five fighters that would put Fedor at #7. Back up your trollism with some kind of sense.

And, consider this... Lesnar has NEVER fought anybody as skilled as Fedor.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Hmmmm....not sure Brock dominates Big Nog like you believe he would. Also Coleman was a similar fighter to Brock when Fedor defeated him. As good as Brock is and he may be the best, I think you undervalue Fedor just a little bit.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Who's #1 right now? Well as much as I HATE to admit it, Brock lesnar is. He has the belt in the best MMA org and has defended it against his only loss. He also called fedor out. Fedor has NEVER fought a guy as strong as brock while at the same time having that much athleticism. Fedor has NEVER fought a wrestler like brock either.
> 
> Also, anyone who fedor beat, brock could beat. Nog? randlemann? tim sylvia ( lol )? AA? None of those fighters in their prime would make it a round with brock.
> 
> So I'm sorry to say, but as long as brock lesnar is alive, fedor is not going to be #1....except maybe in russia...the same place they believe communism is a "good" idea.



This post leads me to believe you will be banned within the week. You're such a troll, you never have the same opinion in any two threads, you just stir up drama and say the dumbest things anyone could ever say.


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## rahildeziner (Jun 7, 2009)

hey

is there any MMA Fighter. I wanna hire one.

do pm me if intrested.


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> This post leads me to believe you will be banned within the week. You're such a troll, you never have the same opinion in any two threads, you just stir up drama and say the dumbest things anyone could ever say.


How did I contradict myself? I hate brock, and hate the WWE. Fact is brock is a hell of a wrestler and athlete. He;s dominated the competition so far, called out fedor, got no response.

Hes the #1 HW in the world right now. Fedor had the chance to disprove that, and he didn't.

You see where im going with this?


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

khoveraki said:


> This post leads me to believe you will be banned within the week. You're such a troll, you never have the same opinion in any two threads, you just stir up drama and say the dumbest things anyone could ever say.


These kinds of posts are unnecessary. Stick to the topic, and let mods do the moderating.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

I think that Lesnar vs. Fedor would be great but Fedor does not have anything to prove to anyone? Right? Maybe he is hesitant to face Brock, maybe not? But I too get tired of people saying he is "overrated" why is he overrated he is basically undefeated? Brock has fought six times. I believe stating he is #7 in the world is disrespecting him, truly I do.


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

Curly said:


> This is the best post I have read today. VERY TRUE!:thumbsup:


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> How did I contradict myself? I hate brock, and hate the WWE. Fact is brock is a hell of a wrestler and athlete. He;s dominated the competition so far, called out fedor, got no response.
> 
> Hes the #1 HW in the world right now. Fedor had the chance to disprove that, and he didn't.
> 
> You see where im going with this?


Do you know how rankings work? They are based on consistency. Brock has won his last 3 fights. How would that make him the #1 ranked HW in the world? In the UFC, yes.

Why am I bothering with you. Claiming Fedor is #7 in the world is clearly a provocative comment that has no purpose but to annoy people. I gave you the chance to explain and list the 5 other fighters and you continue to provoke without being productive. Enough now. I'm not going to respond to this shit from here on in.


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Adam365 said:


> What does that mean if he loses to rogers, the UFC won't take him because he has one loss on his record? He's gonna lose one day so what, all great fighters have lost sometime or another.


In most cases no, but when you have a guy avoiding competition for years, while hanging on to his #1 status, and then gets beat, yeah, Dana should turn his back on him. If Fedor loses, I would love to see Rogers in the UFC and Fedor left in Strikeforce with his "co-promotion" deal.


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## UltimateMan (Sep 30, 2009)

<a href="http://www.1cast.com/l/211345">Ultimate Fight for PPV Supremacy</a>

He will definitely lose.. either way Dana White is confident with the fighters within his organization. The proceeds for himself along with the fighters (win or lose) are insurmountable.


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Soojooko said:


> ...Claiming Fedor is #7 in the world is clearly a provocative comment that has no purpose but to annoy people.....


But he may indeed be about #7. The thing is, we don't know, because he won't fight in the best league. If Rogers beats him, where should we rank him? 

Any good fighter could conceivably keep a good record by avoiding the UFC. Nog, Crop and HH would be racking up the wins in other leagues. Is it really such a stretch to say that Fedor would have a worse record in the UFC?


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Who's #1 right now? Well as much as I HATE to admit it, Brock lesnar is. He has the belt in the best MMA org and has defended it against his only loss. He also called fedor out. Fedor has NEVER fought a guy as strong as brock while at the same time having that much athleticism. Fedor has NEVER fought a wrestler like brock either.
> 
> Also, anyone who fedor beat, brock could beat. Nog? randlemann? tim sylvia ( lol )? AA? None of those fighters in their prime would make it a round with brock.
> 
> So I'm sorry to say, but as long as brock lesnar is alive, fedor is not going to be #1....except maybe in russia...the same place they believe communism is a "good" idea.


 

Not quite Russia: 


http://blog.mmaratings.net/2009/08/heavyweight-top-10.html


CC420


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

Calminian said:


> But he may indeed be about #7. The thing is, we don't know, because he won't fight in the best league. If Rogers beats him, where should we rank him?
> 
> Any good fighter could conceivably keep a good record by avoiding the UFC. Nog, Crop and HH would be racking up the wins in other leagues. Is it really such a stretch to say that Fedor would have a worse record in the UFC?


Here we go again. Fedors last two fights were against TOP 5 competition. Barnett was ranked 3rd when he was due to fight Fedor. Every body is jumping the gun and acting like Fedor has been fighting bums but that hasn't happened yet. Ok, if he beats Werdum, Overeem and Rogers and then stays in Strikeforce fighting cans then by all means, call him what you want. BUT THAT HASN'T HAPPENED YET.


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Soojooko said:


> Here we go again. Fedors last two fights were against TOP 5 competition. Barnett was ranked 3rd when he was due to fight Fedor. Every body is jumping the gun and acting like Fedor has been fighting bums but that hasn't happened yet. Ok, if he beats Werdum, Overeem and Rogers and then stays in Strikeforce fighting cans then by all means, call him what you want. BUT THAT HASN'T HAPPENED YET.


If you're asking if I agree nostalgic mma organizations are complicit, I answer with a resounding affirmation. The idea that the babyfat assassin was shot to #2, is criminal at worst. And if I'm not mistaken, many of them shot Sylvia and AA's rankings up as well prior to their Fedor fights. Hence my frustration with these ranking organizations. 

I'm hoping many are starting to see the light. But only a brutal loss is going to convince most of them.


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## Drogo (Nov 19, 2006)

Calminian said:


> If you're asking if I agree nostalgic mma organizations are complicit, I answer with a resounding affirmation. The idea that the babyfat assassin was shot to #2, is criminal at worst. And if I'm not mistaken, many of them shot Sylvia and AA's rankings up as well prior to their Fedor fights. Hence my frustration with these ranking organizations.
> 
> I'm hoping many are starting to see the light. But only a brutal loss is going to convince most of them.


Sylvia and AA rankings were appropriate based on their records and opponents at the time. You keep claiming this fantasy of inflated rankings to try and justify your under rating of Fedor. He has consistently fought and beaten top 5 ranked fighters his entire career with one roughly two year hiatus after Pride collapsed. Since then he crushed two top 5 guys. 

I can just see all the MMA rankings guys on conference call. 

"Well AA and Sylvia have beaten a bunch of strong fighters and held the UFC belt but we know they really suck, time to drop them down the list..oh wait they are fighting Fedor? Oh, ok lets put them top 5 even though we know that is lol." 

Credible.

What benefit would a bunch of independant ranking sites/publications get from inflating Fedor's opponent's rankings exactly?


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## GKY (Jun 3, 2007)

Without reading too much of the thread..why are people getting so upset. Dana didn't say anything wrong. Bret could theoretically KO Fedor with a "lucky punch" (by which I mean a punch that wouldn't usually land). 

People really gotta get off the whole Dana is evil koolaid they are being fed.

Fedor is slightly overrated, people say he is a K1 level striker with Abu dhabi championship level BJJ and olimpic wrestling. In reality, he is a high level Judo guy whose Judo translates very well into MMA with good BJJ and very good hands. However, he would get subbed by Roger Gracie in a grappeling match, pinned by Alexander Karelin in a wrestling match and KO'ed or decisioned by Ernesto Hoost in a Kickboxing bout..so in that respect yes he is overrated.


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

sylvia a top 5 HW? HAHA, funny. Rogers isnt even a top 10 hw. 

All the talent is in the UFC right now. The reality is, the UFC would expose fedor just like it did to cro cop.


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Drogo said:


> Sylvia and AA rankings were appropriate based on their records and opponents at the time. ...


All I can say, is, how is it a guy gets cut from the UFC and yet gets a ranking boost? The guy got beat by a natural LHW, badly, then gets cut, then shoots up in the rankings. And how is it this same guy beats AA twice, and then AA shoots up in the rankings even higher? 

The system is flawed. We're never going to see eye to eye, especially if you're a hardcore Fedor fan. You can try till you're blue to convince me that Fedor is not a ducker, it's not going to happen. The guy doesn't want competition. I really hope it backfires, and Rogers KO's him. Only something like that is going to change minds.


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## turbohall (Aug 6, 2009)

Ok I like Fedor, but I like Brock more. My questions is if Rogers beats Fedor does UFC go for Rogers? I know if Fedor wins then the UFC will still want Fedor. But everyone needs to remember, Rogers has never fought someone like Fedor and Fedor has never fought in a cage. So this will be a very good fight I think.


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

I think fedor is just scared of losing his "#1 in the world" title. I guess it would suck having that many fans lose hope because of you. He has to know deep down he isn't #1 right?


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

turbohall said:


> Ok I like Fedor, but I like Brock more. My questions is if Rogers beats Fedor does UFC go for Rogers? I know if Fedor wins then the UFC will still want Fedor. But everyone needs to remember, Rogers has never fought someone like Fedor and Fedor has never fought in a cage. So this will be a very good fight I think.


If Rogers beats Fedor, you bet, he'll be invited to the UFC. Even if he loses with dignity, he may be invited. If he gets destroyed, well, probably not. That's my guess.



YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> I think fedor is just scared of losing his "#1 in the world" title. I guess it would suck having that many fans lose hope because of you. He has to know deep down he isn't #1 right?


To be honest, it probably has more to do with is disdain for Dana.


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> sylvia a top 5 HW? HAHA, funny. Rogers isnt even a top 10 hw.
> 
> All the talent is in the UFC right now. The reality is, the UFC would expose fedor just like it did to cro cop.


 
I think Tim Sylvia sucks and he won his belt when the div was weak, but I gotta say at one point Cro Cop was the man in the UFC and I dont think the UFC was his downfall, I think he just lost hunger....(or roids):confused05:

*sits and awaits the countless neg reps from my sarcastic remark about Cro Cop on roids*

*it was HGH*

CC420


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## Freiermuth (Nov 19, 2006)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> sylvia a top 5 HW? HAHA, funny. Rogers isnt even a top 10 hw.
> 
> All the talent is in the UFC right now. The reality is, the UFC would expose fedor just like it did to cro cop.



Yeah, Tim was top-5....he was the UFC HW champ, lost to another top-5 guy by a UD. Obviously he isn't top-5 any more but at that time he was. Just like LT (NFL) isn't top-5 right now, but when Big Tim was the UFC HW champ, LT was the NFL's MVP.


Guys in Brett's situation are always dangerous, he's really got nothing to lose here and everything to gain, plus he can hit like a truck and Fedor has eaten some shots before.


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Freiermuth said:


> Yeah, Tim was top-5....he was the UFC HW champ, lost to another top-5 guy by a UD. Obviously he isn't top-5 any more but at that time he was. Just like LT (NFL) isn't top-5 right now, but when Big Tim was the UFC HW champ, LT was the NFL's MVP.


Except the NFL didn't suck at the time. The HW div. did.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

HexRei said:


> These kinds of posts are unnecessary. Stick to the topic, and let mods do the moderating.



He's polluting a lot of threads, I hardly even read any of the new threads any more if he's in them. I won't voice my opinion any more about him but he's clearly a troll and has gotten away with so much.


I don't get a lot of the hate people have for Rogers, he doesn't seem like the brightest guy but he's no Lesnar. I'll feel bad when Fedor destroys him in the first round, it'll hurt his livelihood pretty bad. I don't think he'll be having five figure fights for years after it.

Reminds me a lot of Kimbo Slice. Vicious standup, not very technical, big heart, and a ton of need.


I can see him getting a big head if he rocks Fedor though.


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## Drogo (Nov 19, 2006)

Calminian said:


> All I can say, is, how is it a guy gets cut from the UFC and yet gets a ranking boost? The guy got beat by a natural LHW, badly, then gets cut, then shoots up in the rankings. And how is it this same guy beats AA twice, and then AA shoots up in the rankings even higher?
> 
> The system is flawed. We're never going to see eye to eye, especially if you're a hardcore Fedor fan. You can try till you're blue to convince me that Fedor is not a ducker, it's not going to happen. The guy doesn't want competition. I really hope it backfires, and Rogers KO's him. Only something like that is going to change minds.


Sylvia lost to Couture, beat Vera who was undefeated at the time including demolishing Mir (who you think would beat Fedor), then lost to Nog who was #2 at the time. Not absurd that he wasn't knocked out of the top 5 given his opponents. What rankings boost are you referring to? Why don't you show me some sites or publications that increased his ranking after he left the UFC? 

AA was on a five fight win streak after he lost to Sylvia, that probably had something to do with him maintaining a high ranking. 

You present these absurd conspiracy theories with no evidence and then you're surprised when people don't agree with you? Yeah the UFC destroyed the big names that Fedor beat.

Nog got beat by Fedor twice and then demolished Randy but you'd probably claim that Randy would beat Fedor. Herring took Lesnar the distance and Fedor TKO'd Herring in round 1 but hey, Lesnar would still beat Fedor easy. If only Fedor would fight quality competition like Min Soo Kim that Lesnar beat or a 16-10 45 year old LHW. lol.


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> He's polluting a lot of threads, I hardly even read any of the new threads any more if he's in them. I won't voice my opinion any more about him but he's clearly a troll and has gotten away with so much.....


By merely saying that Fedor is overrated and not #1, he's a troll? Oy!


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

Calminian said:


> By merely saying that Fedor is overrated and not #1, he's a troll? Oy!


I recommend that you read more of his posts.


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## Freiermuth (Nov 19, 2006)

Calminian said:


> Except the NFL didn't suck at the time. The HW div. did.


Touche Sir haha!

But the fact is, he was ranked (cut from UFC for not being marketable) and Fedor finished him w/ ease after not fighting in a while.


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

Drogo said:


> Sylvia lost to Couture, beat Vera who was undefeated at the time including demolishing Mir (who you think would beat Fedor), then lost to Nog who was #2 at the time. Not absurd that he wasn't knocked out of the top 5 given his opponents. What rankings boost are you referring to? Why don't you show me some sites or publications that increased his ranking after he left the UFC?
> 
> AA was on a five fight win streak after he lost to Sylvia, that probably had something to do with him maintaining a high ranking.
> 
> ...


MMA-math=/=actual fights

I don;t think coture can beat fedor, but I think lesnar and mir could with ease. UFC has a weak HW division and I really think fedor would have a hard time in it.


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## Smiley Face (Oct 5, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> MMA-math=/=actual fights
> 
> I don;t think coture can beat fedor, but I think lesnar and mir could with ease. UFC has a weak HW division and I really think fedor would have a hard time in it.


Lesnar, yes.

Mir, no.


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## BWoods (Apr 8, 2007)

I've said before, regardless of what happens in this fight Fedor will drop a few spots in my HW top 10. He's fighting a guy he SHOULD beat without problem, going to an orginization that only has 3 legit fights for him (Rogers, Werdum, and Overeem) and foregoing the stonger heavyweight division that the UFC is offering. No matter if he steamrolls through all three of the mentioned fighters they won't be enough for me to call him the best anymore.

To be completely honest I don't believe Fedor has fought the best guys in the last 2 or 3 years. Since 2007 he's beaten Hong-Man Choi,Matt Linand, Tim Sylvia and Andrei Arlovski. We all agree that Choi was never a threat to Fedor. Lindland is a middleweight and would have slammed Fedor if he didn't hold onto the ropes to set up the Judo reversal. Silvia had been very unimpressive when he was cut by the UFC. Being beaten for 5 rounds by Couture, laying on Vera for 3 rounds and being subbed by Nog. Arlovski was a little more impressive but he hadn't been fighting top 10 guys. Beating Werdum in a boring fight, Cruz by cheapshot, an overrated Ben Rothwell (the guy sit just outside of the top 10 to me, but he was ranked like 9 at the time of the AA fight) and Roy Nelson. 

For those who will counter that by saying "but Feyodor was going to fight Barnett, hur!" Seriously now, do you really believe that fight was going to happen? I never really believed that fight was going to go down from the second it was announced. I had a feeling Josh was going to somehow find a way out of that match or not fight Fedor as well as he could have. They're so buddy/buddy that I just couldn't see this fight, that we've been wanting for years to see, actually take place.

Now I'm not trying to say Fedor doesn't have the skill to be the top guy in the world and maybe P4P, but if he doesn't fight the best possible fights then I can't keep him at the top and feel as if its right.

To be Rogers is overrated. He shouldn't be in the top 10 at all. Beating Andrei Arlovski gives you a name, but it shouldn't give you a ranking. Anyone who is willing to hate on Shane Carwin but agrees with Brett Rogers' 7th place ranking should know that Carwin's opposition has had a higher winning percentage and more overall fights than Rogers'. Both guys are similar to me in their career paths, 10-0 and 11-0, but if you watch a Rogers highlight you'll see the kind of guys he's fighting. They both beat top 10 ranked guys (Granted I believe Gonzaga was a bit overrated at the time) but Carwin has certainly faced the higher calibur fighters. 

If Fedor wins this fight he'll be number 2 or 3 to me, behind Lesnar and/or Nog. Depending on how impressive he is. If he loses to Rogers then he'll be out of the top 5 to me, but I'll acknowledge Brett as a legit top 10 and possibly top 5. And I really do think its possible for Brett to win this. He doesn't seem like the guy who will crumble under pressure like Tim Sylvia. 

I've had a bad habit of rambling as of late. It must be because I'm so bored here at work. TL;DR version is I believe Fedor should lose rank no matter win or loss at the end of the Rogers fight, because he isn't fighting the best guys.

Some of you will disagree with me and I respect that. I'm not going to argue about it, this is just what I believe.


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

Only way he can be #1 is if he steps up and beats lesnar, till then hes not the best. The best would fight anyone to prove they are a better fighter.

Even if he lost to lesnar I would consider him #2 ( as long as its not like a 1st round tko )


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Freiermuth said:


> Touche Sir haha!
> 
> But the fact is, he was ranked (cut from UFC for not being marketable) and Fedor finished him w/ ease after not fighting in a while.


So did Mercer. :dunno:



BWoods said:


> I've said before, regardless of what happens in this fight Fedor will drop a few spots in my HW top 10. He's fighting a guy he SHOULD beat without problem, going to an orginization that only has 3 legit fights for him (Rogers, Werdum, and Overeem) and foregoing the stonger heavyweight division that the UFC is offering.


You're being generous. Rogers is the only true legit fighter, mainly because he's still unknown (or should I say, still has unknown questions). The other two aren't even good enough for the UFC.


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Only way he can be #1 is if he steps up and beats lesnar, till then hes not the best. The best would fight anyone to prove they are a better fighter.
> 
> Even if he lost to lesnar I would consider him #2 ( as long as its not like a 1st round tko )


 
Not to argue but let me ask this. Why must the guy that already has a proven legacy and many more fights prove he isnt #1 against a guy that has like 5 fights and just got into the sport.......

In other words why doesnt LesNAR just go to Strikeforce and step to Fedor???

CC420:confused02:


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Because he's never beaten anyone worth a damn _by today's standards_.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

Good point coldcall.

That would be bad though, mmkay, because it would ruin all the speculation in this thread.


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## Smiley Face (Oct 5, 2009)

IMO I believe Brock would overpower Fedor on the ground once the take down onslaught from Lesnar begins. Fedor has been cut before a couple of times and If Brock can keep on focusing on causing a cut while on the ground he can very well get a cut stoppage or a Mir like TKO. If Brock didn't want to stand with Mir, he won't with Fedor. The scary thing is we see a new Brock Lesnar every single time he fights and his size/reach/power would be very hard to overcome. This isn't Hong Man Choi or Tim Sylvia. (No disrespect to them, they are good fighters but Brock would demolish them just as easy as Fedor did but only with relentless ground and pound)

Again, this is just my opinion. You can agree to disagree. It is just what I believe.



coldcall420 said:


> Not to argue but let me ask this. Why must the guy that already has a proven legacy and many more fights prove he isnt #1 against a guy that has like 5 fights and just got into the sport.......
> 
> *In other words why doesnt LesNAR just go to Strikeforce and step to Fedor???*
> 
> CC420:confused02:


Contract. I'm sure Brock (vice versa Fedor) would love to face him if it were possible in a couple of months. (Which isn't)


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

Calminian said:


> Because he's never beaten anyone worth a damn _by today's standards_.


 
Nog twice, Cro Cop, Sylvia, Andrei Arlovski....yeah he just fights old bums like Jose Canseco and Hershal Wallker.....

I forgot....:thumbsup:

CC420


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

Calminian said:


> Because he's never beaten anyone worth a damn _by today's standards_.


*facepalm*


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## Smiley Face (Oct 5, 2009)

I'm not going to say that Fedor hasn't beaten anyone worthy in the last couple of years...

In fact, it is quite the opposite.

Rogers = Top 10 (Who he'll fight next)
Barnett = Somewhere around the Top 10 lol (If this bout happened)
Arlovski = Top 5
Sylvia = Top 10


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

coldcall420 said:


> Nog twice, Cro Cop, Sylvia, Andrei Arlovski....yeah he just fights old bums...


couldn't a said it better myself. Thanks for making my point. 



:-) said:


> I'm not going to say that Fedor hasn't beaten anyone worthy in the last couple of years...
> 
> In fact, it is quite the opposite.
> 
> ...


I still don't get why AA is above Rogers and Sylvia.


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## Smiley Face (Oct 5, 2009)

Calminian said:


> couldn't a said it better myself. Thanks for making my point.


None of those fighters were 'bums' when Fedor fought them.

The only bum Fedor fought was Zulu... and that was 4 years ago.


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

:-) said:


> None of those fighters were 'bums' when Fedor fought them.


Bum is a strong word. And I agree, they weren't bums when he fought them relative to the field at the time. But by today's standards, they can't compete. They're not on the level of Lesnar, Carwin, dos Santos, Valasquez, and possibly Rogers. Rankings need to be based on the current field of fighters.


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

Calminian said:


> couldn't a said it better myself. Thanks for making my point.


They aren't bums but all of them except nog have been cut from the ufc. And its not like nog could beat brock.


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> They aren't bums but all of them except nog have been cut from the ufc. And its not like nog could beat brock.


I admit, bum is a strong word. I was responding to someone who used the word.


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

Calminian said:


> couldn't a said it better myself. Thanks for making my point.
> 
> 
> 
> I still don't get why AA is above Rogers and Sylvia.


 
Im not sure you can make a point....:confused05: Never fact based just hearsay you'd get killed as a lawyer....

Let ask you this, why does it matter, since were not going to see it happen??

CC


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

Calminian said:


> Bum is a strong word. And I agree, they weren't bums when he fought them relative to the field at the time. But by today's standards, they can't compete. They're not on the level of Lesnar, Carwin, dos Santos, Valasquez, and possibly Rogers. Rankings need to be based on the current field of fighters.


Agreed, and I think those fighters you mentioned would ALL give fedor a hard time. Much more of a fight than anyone in strikerforce would.


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## Smiley Face (Oct 5, 2009)

Calminian said:


> I still don't get why AA is above Rogers and Sylvia.


I believe Arlovski was Top 2-5 when he fought Fedor and also before he fought Rogers. 

Andrei was ranked higher than Tim because he was on a 5 fight win streak (the last 2 years before he fought Fedor) with wins over Werdum (In the Top 10 at the time) and Nelson (IFL Champion / just outside of the Top 10 / Great grappler). 

Sylvia has gone 1-4 in the last 2 years with an unexcitful win over non ranked Brandon Vera.


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Agreed, and I think those fighters you mentioned would ALL give fedor a hard time. Much more of a fight than anyone in strikerforce would.


Wow, man, you're in the red. I had the same thing when I spoke up about Fedor's, well let's call it, slightly elevated status.


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## Toxic (Mar 1, 2007)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> They aren't bums but all of them except nog have been cut from the ufc. And its not like nog could beat brock.


Neither Arlovski or Sylvia were cut from the UFC, Sylvia asked to be released because after losing to Couture and Nog he knew he was a long way away from getting another title shot and his manager was starting Adrenaline MMA which at that time had just merged with M-1 (the merger went under quickly) and was making steps towards becoming a major force, since Sylvia was generally disliked by fans Dana let him have his wish. Arlovski on the other hand just felt unappreciated and thought he was worth a lot more money than the UFC was willing to pay him so when his contract expired they couldn't come to terms and judging by what Affliction payed him his demands were probably much higher than those of any other UFC fighter at the time.


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## Smiley Face (Oct 5, 2009)

Calminian said:


> Wow, man, you're in the red. I had the same thing when I spoke up about Fedor's, well let's call it, overrated status.


Tell me/us why you doubt Fedor?

Why is he overrated in your opinion?

Who is actually the #1 HW in MMA in your mind?

Come on, tell us what you are REALLY thinking. :confused05:


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Toxic said:


> Neither Arlovski or Sylvia were cut from the UFC....


Yeah, but come on. Isn't it sort of like a guy resigning, to avoid getting fired? Neither of them had a future in the UFC.



:-) said:


> Tell me/us why you doubt Fedor?
> 
> Why is he overrated in your opinion?
> 
> ...


To put it is a nutshell, every fighter he's beaten has been beaten worse elsewhere. It's a little deeper than that, but I gotta go watch Chuck's stiff dance moves.

Top 5 HW's

Lesnar
Carwin
dos Santos (?)
Valasquez (?)
Mir (?)

Those last 3 are interchangeable.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

Calminian said:


> Yeah, but come on. Isn't it sort of like a guy resigning, to avoid getting fired? Neither of them had a future in the UFC.


It's sort of like conjecture.


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## Toxic (Mar 1, 2007)

I hate the argument that Arlovski wasn't a legitimate opponent, fact is Arlovski is a guy who has always had a questionable jaw but he was a major force before that fight and was a very legitimate threat to Fedor, even now AA is still a beast who is a major threat to any HW, fact is that AA's stock has really unfairly dropped due to the brutal nature of which Roger's finished him and the fact is was so early in the fight. Honestly it was really a flash knock out that did little to prove anything we already didn't know about AA and that is that Arlovski can't take a brutal shot.


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## Charles Lee Ray (May 4, 2008)

Calminian said:


> Yeah, but come on. Isn't it sort of like a guy resigning, to avoid getting fired? Neither of them had a future in the UFC.



Neither of them were close to getting fired. Arlovski was on a three fight win streak in the UFC and would have gotten a title shot had he resigned. Sylvia last fight was a title fight. I wouldn't classify either as not having a fututre in the UFC at the time.


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## Toxic (Mar 1, 2007)

Calminian said:


> Yeah, but come on. Isn't it sort of like a guy resigning, to avoid getting fired? Neither of them had a future in the UFC.


Your right if your a former champion who loses your belt and then goes on a 3 fight winning streak including wins over a top 10 HW and a top prospect (which Obrien was at the time) you obviously have no future, come on thats like saying the UFC should just cut Nog and Mir now.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

It is unfortunate that Fedor could not come to an agreement with the UFC and honestly he is now one of the smaller HWs out there but he is also deceivingly strong when it comes to power in terms of both takedowns and punching. Additionally that ***** thing he does, he is one of the best if not THE best in the WORLD at that. At the very least he deserves our (UFC Fans) respect not ridicule. Calling him the 7th best HW out there when he is basically undefeated is indeed ridicule.


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## Drogo (Nov 19, 2006)

Calminian said:


> To put it is a nutshell, every fighter he's beaten has been beaten worse elsewhere. It's a little deeper than that, but I gotta go watch Chuck's stiff dance moves.


Like Herring? Fedor beat him a lot easier than Lesnar did, by your logic that is evidence that Fedor is better than Lesnar. I guess you just pretend that fight never happened. 

I also assume you aren't going to produce some evidence of your claims of inflated rankings. Come on, this should be easy if AA and Sylvia shot up ranks after losses then show me some before and after rankings where that happened.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Its funny that people list Carwin so high, his only real strong win was vs. Gonzaga? The other 10 wins were against people that are what old timers refer to as "Ham & Eggers". The same Gonzaga who also lost to Couture and Werdum (2x). Yet he is better than Fedor? Really? Come on now.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

Calminian said:


> Top 5 HW's
> 
> Lesnar
> Carwin
> ...


Right. Enough of this shit. Why is Dos Santos ranked higher than Fedor? If you don't somehow explain this using some kind of reasonable logic I'm going to assume you are just being provocative to wind people up and ignore you from here on in.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Calminian's logic will be that Dos Santos KOd Cro Cop and Fedor did not. Even though Fedor dominated a younger and better Cro Cop. The logic is faulty and silly, similar to that of Carwin.


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## swedish_fighter (Jul 12, 2009)

If brock is so good at wrestling why did he lose to MIR.. Why did he fail to control Couture (a much lighter opponent that pretty much pushed brock against the cage all the time). Brock with all his "super" strength had no way of getting free from there.. 

Brock is the one overrated IMO. He has failed to shine vs ANY of his opponents. He NEVER fought any bignames in their prime like Fedor has (due to the fact that UFC has no big name heavyweights..). A superior striker like fedor would knock him silly. Fedor also got a much better ground game than anyone Brock ever fought in the UFC. The guy is kicking Olympic wrestlers in wrestling.. Wow..

Also the guy is a ***** champ.. You think that its a small sport?? Think again, Its probably as big if not bigger than wrestling in america. http://www.mmatko.com/fedor-emelianenko-takes-russian-combat-*****-championships-2009-win/

He is fighting BIG ass opponents there that focus soley on *****, I think that proves he got excellent ground game. Brock is the one that has failed to prove himself, brock has a sucky MMA record compared to Fedor. Fedor still #1 no matter what Dana claim.. Dana alway claim to have the best.. But all "the best" of the UFC has lost to fedor. Its a fact, Fedor has bashed a load of UFC CHAMPIONS.. UFC = good at commercial, every one look like "the best" when they are in the UFC thanks to all "hype" they present.. When they leave (still with a great record, dana stabs them in the back and start talking shit about them..)..


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Wow, how do you really feel?


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Samborules said:


> Calminian's logic will be that Dos Santos KOd Cro Cop and Fedor did not. Even though Fedor dominated a younger and better Cro Cop. The logic is faulty and silly, similar to that of Carwin.


But that old Cop is actually younger than Carwin, You left that part out.

Yeah, I just don't buy into this crap that all the Pride HW's are all old and washed up now. They're all still young. They all suddenly started losing right when the joined the UFC. Hmmmm. Could it possibly be they didn't actually get worse? Could it be the competition just got better? I know, I know. Painful even to consider that.


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## swedish_fighter (Jul 12, 2009)

Calminian said:


> But that old Cop is actually younger than Carwin, You left that part out.
> 
> Yeah, I just don't buy into this crap that all the Pride HW's are all old and washed up now. They're all still young. They all suddenly started losing right when the joined the UFC. Hmmmm. Could it possibly be they didn't actually get worse? Could it be the competition just got better? I know, I know. Painful even to consider that.


Its possible competition today are better. But crocop was out of shape no doubt in my mind.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

By younger, Calminian, I mean in terms of ring mileage. Carwin has 11 fights, Cro Cop has 35, that is a big difference. I think what you are seeing is bigger fighters not necessarily better. Who has Carwin submitted or Brock for that matter. So far they have used their power and striking to dominate opponents. Would love to see either one or both face a HEALTHY Nog and then see what happens. Plus even you must admit that Fedor punches pretty hard as he KOd AA and Sylvia with what one punch basically? Yes I know he techinically beat Sylvia via choke but the one punch that knocked him down really ended that fight. I just cannot fathom how Fedor is "worse" than Carwin who has one legit win on his record and thats over Gonzaga, the man that lost to Werdum 2x.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

Calminian said:


> But that old Cop is actually younger than Carwin, You left that part out.
> 
> Yeah, I just don't buy into this crap that all the Pride HW's are all old and washed up now. They're all still young. They all suddenly started losing right when the joined the UFC. Hmmmm. Could it possibly be they didn't actually get worse? Could it be the competition just got better? I know, I know. Painful even to consider that.


Way to avoid my question.

Are you suggesting that the CroCop that just fought Dos Santos is the same version that faced Fedor? And even if it was, that's enough to put Santos above Fedor?

Enough. This is silly. * leaves building *


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## Smiley Face (Oct 5, 2009)

Soojooko said:


> Way to avoid my question.
> 
> Are you suggesting that the CroCop that just fought Dos Santos is the same version that faced Fedor? And even if it was, that's enough to put Santos above Fedor?
> 
> Enough. This is silly. * leaves building *


Dos Santos isn't even close to the Top 5. He beat Werdum who is a ranked fighter... I'll give him that, but how does that win over Mirko Cro Cop who hasn't looked good since 2006 give him a spot above Fedor?

Calminian can't be for real... he just can't.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Cro Cop is definitely slower, the ring miles got to him for sure. He was lightning quick 5 years ago. Not any more. I think Grim is a similar fighter to Carwin so this dispute will be somewhat settled on Nov. 7th.


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

swedish_fighter said:


> Brock and the other UFC guys needs to prove themselves against Fedor or at least someone of his caliber in order to be ranked above him. Fedor already has proven that he can crush guys of brock size and bigger..
> 
> Fedor still #1..





Calminian said:


> Wow, man, you're in the red. I had the same thing when I spoke up about Fedor's, well let's call it, slightly elevated status.


Even though you wont answer this....How can you watch the video above and not think Fedor could K/O Rogers...

Before (if you do respond) you hit me with the smarts......i know they are not the same guys one obviously Randleman but the power is there...

At this point Im convinced you are someone that just likes to go against logic to be difficult....not really worth engaging in any kind of serious MMA discussion.....sad!!!

CC420


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

I can't help but write-off people who think Fedor is overrated or ducking opponents.



Have you ever seen ANY of his fights? Do you guys think you know something that GSP, BJ Penn, Diego Sanchez, Bas Rutten, Sylvia, Wanderlei, etc don't? They all think he's the #1 p4p and #1 heavyweight in the world. 

And how would Lesnar beat Fedor exactly? His "overwhelming" size? Fedor has fought bigger fighters. His "flawless wrestling?" Lesnar couldn't even take down Couture. Couture got EASILY outwrestled by Nog, someone who Fedor threw around like a rag doll. MMA math or not, Lesnar COULDN'T outwrestle Couture. 

Lesnar is going to outstrike Fedor. Say that sentence aloud without laughing, I dare you. 

Oh wait, Lesnar's just too good, he's going to rush in and easily take down Fedor and ground and pound him. He did it to Mir! And Mir has beat such names as a near-death Nog, Tank Abbott, and _Lesnar_! Plus he's only been beaten by ace heavyweights Vera, Cruz, Freeman...Mir himself said Fedor would destroy him. That was, of course, before Mir lost to Lesnar and decided to be Lesnar's #1 fan.

So Lesnar would definitely outwrestle Fedor. Fedor's only a twelve time world ***** winner. Lesnar won a NCAA wrestling championship once! 

Plus Fedor's only ever TKO'd or KO'd 8 or 9 top heavyweight strikers. That's nothing compared to how Lesnar can... totally hit Heath Herring in the face. Yeah! Man he hit him. Lesnar's the best.


But alright, Lesnar isn't the only one in the UFC. The UFC has a few other top heavyweights.

Well he's beaten Nog 2.5 times so he's out. According to the UFC, Carwin is the #1 contender. Except... Rogers is ranked higher and has beaten better fighters than Carwin. Interesting. And we covered Mir in an above paragraph.



Damn you guys for making me resort to my old sarcastic self. Apologies preemptively to Coldcall.

But really. Just THINK. Would Lesnar, a one time wrestling champ and poor, poor striker stand a chance against Fedor? Even in a grappling match?
Forget the hype, forget Dana White's unparalelled marketing. Watch the fights. Look at the credentials and backgrounds and opponents and talent.

I want Fedor in the UFC too. Not because he'd be challenged any more than he would in strikeforce though. But because DW's marketing is powerful and would potentially have Fedor fighting more often, and I could watch it at a sports bar instead of ordering showtime. Plus he'd become 10x more popular.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Well said!


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## joshua7789 (Apr 25, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> I can't help but write-off people who think Fedor is overrated or ducking opponents.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Good points except for the not being able to outwresle couture. Randy is one of the best wrestlers in mma. I dont know what the deal was with the Nog fight, but not being able to out wrestle couture isnt a knock on anybody. The dude is an olympic caliber wrestler. Other then that, agree. I dont know how much success Fedor would have getting Lesnar to the ground, but i also dont know how much Lesnar would have in getting Fedor to the ground either. I dont think that Lesnar could beat Fedor right now, but maybe in a year or two when he has gotten some real training time under his belt. You cant deny that a guy with those physical tools would be pretty hard to deal with if he had half of the mma knowledge of someone like Fedor or Couture.


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## shatterproof (Jul 16, 2008)

everytime fedor fights... out come the 'this time he's gonna lose!' folks (of course, usually aware that he HAS lost before). 

he'll lose big one day... but i wouldnt go betting the farm on it any time soon, fellas.


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## GMK13 (Apr 20, 2009)

honestly imo , i dont see fedor coming to the ufc. he doesn't seem interested. i think he may not want to fight lesnar.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

joshua7789 said:


> Good points except for the not being able to outwresle couture. Randy is one of the best wrestlers in mma. I dont know what the deal was with the Nog fight, but not being able to out wrestle couture isnt a knock on anybody. The dude is an olympic caliber wrestler. Other then that, agree. I dont know how much success Fedor would have getting Lesnar to the ground, but i also dont know how much Lesnar would have in getting Fedor to the ground either. I dont think that Lesnar could beat Fedor right now, but maybe in a year or two when he has gotten some real training time under his belt. You cant deny that a guy with those physical tools would be pretty hard to deal with if he had half of the mma knowledge of someone like Fedor or Couture.



Agreed that Couture is a world-class wrestler. I have his book and the points and demonstrations are amazing - a total asset for any MMA fighter looking to improve their wrestling game.

My point wasn't that Couture isn't great, my point was that Lesnar's wrestling is overrated, and it's also his only strong point. Grappling vs Grappling, Fedor still wins. 

Thinking he's become irrelevant is pretty absurd, after his three fights and capturing the strikeforce belt, I'm sure UFC will make a strong offer and Fedor won't have as strong of M1 ties.


If we should be mad at anyone for not going to UFC, it should be Mousasi. Joe Silva and the UFC never made the offer and he was signed too quickly. The HW division is about the same in both organizations, but the LHW division is 10000x more stacked in the UFC.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

khoveraki said:


> I can't help but write-off people who think Fedor is overrated or ducking opponents.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Quoted for truth.

But yeah, keyboard warriors always know more than the top figures and players/fighters in a sport! Duh!


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

Lesnar didnt outwrestle couture? LOL, how did he beat him then....a roundhouse kick? A lightning fast left hook? LOL.

Couture got dominated in that fight, I give the old man props for trying to wrestle lesnar but he got destroyed.


Yeah i've watched ALL of fedors fights, like I said hes a top 10 HW but not #1. He hasnt proven himself in years.

It's physics people. Lesnar would come into the fight at nearly 300 pounds of raw muscle, and fedor is a small HW. Lesnar would bull rush fedor, take him to the ground and pound his face into obvlivion. Anyone who thinks differently is just buying into old pride nostalgia.


As far as ***** goes, you guys know he lost his last ***** fight right?


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## joshua7789 (Apr 25, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Lesnar didnt outwrestle couture? LOL, how did he beat him then....a roundhouse kick? A lightning fast left hook? LOL.
> 
> Couture got dominated in that fight, I give the old man props for trying to wrestle lesnar but he got destroyed.
> 
> ...


How is knocking Arlovski out in the first round not proving yourself? Andrei was on a five fight win streak against top level competition and a top five heavyweight when they fought. Id say he has proven himself just fine.


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## Smiley Face (Oct 5, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Lesnar didnt outwrestle couture? LOL, how did he beat him then....a roundhouse kick? A lightning fast left hook? LOL.
> 
> Couture got dominated in that fight, I give the old man props for trying to wrestle lesnar but he got destroyed.
> 
> ...



:confused05: 

Here we go again. Get the oven ready lol.

I agree with the part that Lesnar could get Fedor to the ground and cause damage. It's possible. Fedor has been cut open before.


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

joshua7789 said:


> How is knocking Arlovski out in the first round not proving yourself? Andrei was on a five fight win streak against top level competition and a top five heavyweight when they fought. Id say he has proven himself just fine.


Did you watch the whole fight? Arlovski was out striking fedor until he foolishly went for a knee and got tagged.

Fedor looked horrible in that fight.


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## joshua7789 (Apr 25, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Did you watch the whole fight? Arlovski was out striking fedor until he foolishly went for a knee and got tagged.
> 
> Fedor looked horrible in that fight.


My memory is a little silly, so remind me, who won that fight? Thats right, Fedor knocked him out in the first round. Close doesnt count in mma, a win is a win.


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

True but it showed fedors stand up is overrated. There are much better strikers in the UFC hw division.


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## Smiley Face (Oct 5, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Did you watch the whole fight? Arlovski was out striking fedor until he foolishly went for a knee and got tagged.
> 
> Fedor looked horrible in that fight.


Fedor was not getting outstruck in that fight. He was able to dodge every shot Arlovski threw at him. AA was only able to keep Fedor at bay. I bet you forgot that Fedor KO'd Andrei while going for a retarded flying knee. 

We need gifs of Fedor slipping all of Andrei's shots.


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## swpthleg (Dec 31, 2006)

Slipping all of Andrei's shots, aka slipping all the shots from some of the best hands in MMA.


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

:-) said:


> Fedor was not getting outstruck in that fight. He was able to dodge every shot Arlovski threw at him. AA was only able to keep Fedor at bay. I bet you forgot that Fedor KO'd Andrei while going for a retarded flying knee.
> 
> We need gifs of Fedor slipping all of Andrei's shots.


Fedor was backed into a corner and looking hurt when Andrei threw that ill-timed knee IIRC...


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## Smiley Face (Oct 5, 2009)




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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

Rewatching the fight for the 100th time now. I remember fedor getting tagged a few times, and like hex said he was looking hurt ( looked dazed to me ) and arlovski went in to finish him with a knee.


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## JustLo (Oct 7, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Rewatching the fight for the 100th time now. I remember fedor getting tagged a few times, and like hex said he was looking hurt ( looked dazed to me ) and arlovski went in to finish him with a knee.


Actually, Fedor didn't get hit once. His head got pawed at a few times but he never actually got hit with one punch. Then he finished the fight with one blow.


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

JustLo said:


> Actually, Fedor didn't get hit once. His head got pawed at a few times but he never actually got hit with one punch. Then he finished the fight with one blow.


Watch the fight, he got hit by a right jab a few times. The first few seconds the announcers even call it.

Fedor was cornered and about to be k.o'd when he threw a random lucky hook that connected.

i'd like to see an arlovski vs fedor 2 because I think next time arlovski wouldnt be foolish enough to throw a flying knee.


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## JustLo (Oct 7, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Watch the fight, he got hit by a right jab a few times. The first few seconds the announcers even call it.
> 
> Fedor was cornered and about to be k.o'd when he threw a random lucky hook that connected.
> 
> i'd like to see an arlovski vs fedor 2 because I think next time arlovski wouldnt be foolish enough to throw a flying knee.



I did watch the fight. I even watched the slow motion youtube video of him dodging/slipping everything.


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## GMK13 (Apr 20, 2009)

> JustLo;1014111]I did watch the fight. I even watched the slow motion youtube video of him dodging/slipping everything.


i'm not saying fedor didn't win cause obviously he did. but are you seriously telling me he didn't get hit one time? when he clearly did.


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## Smiley Face (Oct 5, 2009)

HexRei said:


> Fedor was backed into a corner and looking hurt when Andrei threw that ill-timed knee IIRC...


Was Fedor hurt by that front/push kick Andrei threw?

Maybe he played 'hurt' to lure Andrei in.

Who knows.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

So we're sitting here discussing whether or not Fedor maybe got tagged lightly by some jabs by a fantastic Freddy-Roach trained fighter with a longer reach... That's the best we can come up with for why Lesnar would beat him?


Everyone who thinks Arlovski was dominating in that fight has only watched it once. Watch the full slow motion ones online. Fedor did a lot of tyson-esque shoulder glances and head movements and never got tagged with anything powerful. In the prefight interview he said he'd do exactly that, get the rhythm and speed of Arlovski's punches and then test his chin. I can't believe people are trying to use that fight, which ended in a brutal first round KO, as an example that Fedor is overrated.


Go to the fight statistics website, Fedor gets hit less on average than Machida. Lands higher percentage of takedowns than Lesnar. It's hard to overrate any aspect of this guy's game.

And are we forgetting when MIR SUBMITTED LESNAR WITHIN THE LAST YEAR? He's lost recently to someone Fedor would certainly dominate. His standup has major wholes, his submission game is non existent, and we're impressed nowadays when he throws one mid leg kick. 

We can say however that his career may be winding down as he's focusing more on family, and after his 3 strikeforce fights may not have much ambition left for the UFC.


edit: are we also arguing legitimately that a pushkick hurt him at all? Pushkicks aren't even really meant to hurt...


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## JustLo (Oct 7, 2009)

I saw some posted earlier, but here is pretty much all the slow motion gif's from the fight. Fedor -maybe- got hit with one jab and the pushkick. 

Regardless, it was thoroughly dominate. How good do you have to be to make it look like you were getting outstruck and the only way you can see the parry/slipping brilliance is in slow motion? He just pushes those strikes away like nothing. What's Brock going to do? Strike even faster than AA? Lawl.

http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f61/s...on-aa-vs-fedor-aa-couldnt-do-anything-910291/


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

:-) said:


> Was Fedor hurt by that front/push kick Andrei threw?
> 
> Maybe he played 'hurt' to lure Andrei in.
> 
> Who knows.


Not likely, imho. Not Fedor's style.


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## sttywilliam (Oct 7, 2009)

Dana still wants Fedor yet he won't stop bad-mouthing him. Hah. He sure knows a way to a fighter's heart. Just ask Rampage.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

HexRei said:


> Not likely, imho. Not Fedor's style.


True in one sense, but it's way more his style to set up an opponent than to be _that_ injured from a pushkick. He didn't honestly look dazed at ALL as soon as Arlovski came flying at him. He snapped to attention and delivered a perfect hook.


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

khoveraki said:


> True in one sense, but it's way more his style to set up an opponent than to be _that_ injured from a pushkick. He didn't honestly look dazed at ALL as soon as Arlovski came flying at him. He snapped to attention and delivered a perfect hook.


that doesn't mean he wasn't stunned. it means he recovered. just as he did against fujita and randleman.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

UGH!!!!!!!

Fedor is as honest as they come, he admitted when Fujita tagged him that he was stunned, he came back and choked out Fujita like a minute later. He said he was never once in trouble vs. AA, NOT ONCE and the fight was going how he planned. People are grasping at straws here, can we all please agree that Brock is 5-1 and Fedor is 30-1 and technically 30-0 with the 1 being a loss due to a cut and he later avenged that "loss". 5-1, yes Brock would be 60 pounds bigger and yes he could win and yes he is a great athlete but he would be facing the greatest ***** practitioner in the world today and the heaviest hands that he has faced, yes Fedor's hands are heavier than Mir's. Again, Fedor WAS NOT remotely hurt or stunned vs. AA, he would have admitted that he was as he admitted when he fought Fajita and WAS stunned. At the HW class most of the combatants possess one punch KO power, no one is disputing that but saying that Fedor is basically a "bum" is just ignorant. Yes, IGNORANT! With all due respect.


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## Seperator88 (Jul 12, 2009)

Samborules said:


> UGH!!!!!!!
> 
> Fedor is as honest as they come, he admitted when Fujita tagged him that he was stunned, he came back and choked out Fujita like a minute later. He said he was never once in trouble vs. AA, NOT ONCE and the fight was going how he planned. People are grasping at straws here, can we all please agree that Brock is 5-1 and Fedor is 30-1 and technically 30-0 with the 1 being a loss due to a cut and he later avenged that "loss". 5-1, yes Brock would be 60 pounds bigger and yes he could win and yes he is a great athlete but he would be facing the greatest ***** practitioner in the world today and the heaviest hands that he has faced, yes Fedor's hands are heavier than Mir's. Again, Fedor WAS NOT remotely hurt or stunned vs. AA, he would have admitted that he was as he admitted when he fought Fajita and WAS stunned. At the HW class most of the combatants possess one punch KO power, no one is disputing that but saying that Fedor is basically a "bum" is just ignorant. Yes, IGNORANT! With all due respect.



yea i think almost everyone here will agree with you and we all know a thing or two about fedor, but everyone also knows that anything can happen in mma and brett rogers has some heavy hands without a doubt, i mean honestly the guy hasn't fought enough for us to know his skill. it's always the underdog up and commer that pulls the upset no one saw coming, the old guys everyone knows dont come around and beat champs, save randy


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Grim has a punchers chance, agreed.


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## Soojooko (Jun 4, 2009)

This thread is like an annoying itch on my arse. I really don't want to scratch, but I have to...

Look, there are two camps. Fedor Is/Isn't overrated. At 130 posts it's clear nobody is going to change anybody else's opinion. The pro-Fedor arguments have been made time and time again as have the same pro-Lesnar retorts. Like some kind of timeless archetypal conflict : good vs evil, USA vs USSR, David vs Goliath, Lennon vs McCartney.

Brothers... I'm begging, Give up. There are going to be no defectors in this war. It's pointless. ( even though it is so satisfying to scratch )


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

I can buy that people think Lesnar could beat him but saying Fedor is #7 or only in the top 10 is a slap in the face to every MMA fan. With all due respect.


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## leifdawg (Jan 1, 2008)

Samborules said:


> I can buy that people think Lesnar could beat him but saying Fedor is #7 or only in the top 10 is a slap in the face to every MMA fan. With all due respect.


IMO Fedor's choice to turn down the UFC's more than fair offer was a slap in the face to every MMA fan.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

I believe your operational definition of "fair" is different from "his". And this is apples and oranges. Rampage, Tito and Coutoure have had issues with UFC as well. There are always two sides to every story.


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## leifdawg (Jan 1, 2008)

Samborules said:


> I believe your operational definition of "fair" is different from "his". And this is apples and oranges. Rampage, Tito and Coutoure have had issues with UFC as well. There are always two sides to every story.


From all accounts the big stepping stone was co-promotion. Which would be well above the fair level. Fedor isn't God. Hell, he isn't even a big draw in America.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

He is big enough to draw a strong contract from the UFC, while I wish he accepted it and dumped his current mgmt team, he seems to be loyal to them and to M-1. I was dissapointed but did not see it as a slap in the face, I am sorry that you did.


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## swedish_fighter (Jul 12, 2009)

leifdawg said:


> From all accounts the big stepping stone was co-promotion. Which would be well above the fair level. Fedor isn't God. Hell, he isn't even a big draw in America.


Fair would be if the contract would be beneficial to both parties. Fedor was totally getting exploited by Dana and the UFC if he had accepted that contract. Only an idiot would accept a bad contract when they don't have to. Brock is the one that need to prove himself, especially after the Mir loss.. Fedor care about his family and friends more than proving for like the twentieth time that he is #1, who can blame him? He got a small ego, a seems like a genuinely good guy IMO. If he believe strikeforce is better for him financially then thats probably where he belong.. You don't have to sell out just cus Dana is calling you a chicken.. UFC is already exploiting enough fighters as it is.. If there is some rival organizations then fighters will have the option to chose and the organizations will start fighting about the top names and offer our idols, the fighters better deals where they get the pay-checks they deserve.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Does anyone know if Fedor has an equity stake in M-1? Anyway, we are off topic. I think UFC is great, I do, good job of taking MMA mainstream but I love competition it only makes organizations/businesses that much better. Good for Strikeforce and good for Fedor. UFC still retains 90% of the big names so I am sure Dana is not losing any sleep.


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## name goes here (Aug 15, 2007)

If I partly owned m-1, and was an awesome fighter, I would stick with m-1 or which org would co- promote.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

name goes here said:


> If I partly owned m-1, and was an awesome fighter, I would stick with m-1 or which org would co- promote.


Thank you, agreed 100%

Plus Strikeforce does have a deal with Showtime/CBS its not like they are tiny.


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## leifdawg (Jan 1, 2008)

I'm just going to leave this thread before some of that Fedor ball sweat splashes on me.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Sweat: Splash Splash

Too late!


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

name goes here said:


> If I partly owned m-1, and was an awesome fighter, I would stick with m-1 or which org would co- promote.


True, but if I was supposed to be the #1 HW mma fighter on the planet I would also prove it. So far he hasn't.

Also, the amount of money dana and the ufc was going to pay him for a contract > "partly" owning m-1 LOL

Lets just say one fight in the ufc win or lose and fedor would be set for life money wise.


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

I think he proved it well enough in the past- IMHO it's hard to argue that he wasn't #1 prior to Pride's dissolution, and he beat Sylvia and Arlovski (who ran the UFC HW division during much of Fedor's Pride career) decisively which let him hang in at the top. But MMA is all about what you've done lately, and he's unfortunately not doing much now.

I'm excited for the Rogers fight but it certainly won't do much to shore up his #1 status, and if he loses, he's going to plummet in the rankings, so it's actually not a smart fight for him to take. Unfortunately there aren't a lot of top ranked HW's outside of the UFC right now. I'd like to see him fight Barnett, but it would probably have to be in Japan and I'm not sure Dream or Sengoku can afford that bout. 

I really wish Overeem would plan his cycle appropriately and take the damn drug test, I'd love to see him defend his title, and Fedor is the perfect choice.


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## MMA_Mastermind (Oct 7, 2009)

Fedor is too good for the UFC and Dana does not want to taint the organizations talent pool even more, all of the Title Holders are unstopable.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

HexRei said:


> I think he proved it well enough in the past- IMHO it's hard to argue that he wasn't #1 prior to Pride's dissolution, and he beat Sylvia and Arlovski (who ran the UFC HW division during much of Fedor's Pride career) decisively which let him hang in at the top. *But MMA is all about what you've done lately, and he's unfortunately not doing much now.*
> 
> I'm excited for the Rogers fight but it certainly won't do much to shore up his #1 status, and if he loses, he's going to plummet in the rankings, *so it's actually not a smart fight for him to take.* Unfortunately there aren't a lot of top ranked HW's outside of the UFC right now. I'd like to see him fight Barnett, but it would probably have to be in Japan and I'm not sure Dream or Sengoku can afford that bout.




Bolded sections. He hasn't done much lately? He quickly obliterated two UFC HW champions who were also Top 5 at the time. He wasn't even HIT in the Sylvia match once! This was a top 5 guy who dominated the UFC just before the match and he walked through him like he was a can. 

Now he's facing the #6 guy in the world, a higher ranked opponent than who Lesnar is facing. And to all the people saying he ducks good fighters to protect his "legacy," this is a good example that he is not. Rogers has major KO power who everyone is susceptible to, and a loss will seriously hurt his reputation. But that doesn't effect his decision to fight at all. In every interview and article about Fedor it's clear he doesn't consider his "legacy" and does not want to duck fighters.


You guys saying we're Fedor humpers... how dare we give our loyalty to the most proven well-rounded humble HW in our fair sport. I guess it's more stylish to like the 4-1 Lesnar who flips off cameras, spits in the face of his opponents and bashes sponsors?


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

Beating sylvia doesnt say much. Sylvia lost to RAY MERCER for god sakes.

And AA was out striking fedor until he went for a retarded flying knee and got tagged.

Im no lesnar lover but the facts are facts, he would lose to lesnar and maybe even cain.


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

khoveraki said:


> Bolded sections. He hasn't done much lately? He quickly obliterated two UFC HW champions who were also Top 5 at the time. He wasn't even HIT in the Sylvia match once! This was a top 5 guy who dominated the UFC just before the match and he walked through him like he was a can.


Yeah, I know he fought them. I mentioned it in my post. Sylvia was on the decline and had already lost to a much tinier man before getting pretty much kicked out of the UFC. Andrei was 8 months ago and had also not faced top competition in a long time, hell he was losing the groundfight to Nelson (a skilled fighter but certainly not the top of any heap) before that gift standup. 

Since then Fedor did a clearly worked "exhibition" match with Gegard and... nothing else. that's two fights in the last 16 months. And before that, he went seven months after beating... wait for it... HONG MAN CHOI. 



> Now he's facing the #6 guy in the world, a higher ranked opponent than who Lesnar is facing. And to all the people saying he ducks good fighters to protect his "legacy," this is a good example that he is not. Rogers has major KO power who everyone is susceptible to, and a loss will seriously hurt his reputation.


Rogers is a tenuous #6 and if he hadn't beaten the declining Arlovski (with a flash KO, too, we saw virtually nothing of his skillset outside hitting hard), he wouldn't even be ranked top ten. Does he even have a ground game? We don't know. Hell if he wasn't one of Strikeforce's only 2 or three notable HW's I seriously doubt people would even be paying attention to him.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Beating sylvia doesnt say much. Sylvia lost to RAY MERCER for god sakes.
> 
> And AA was out striking fedor until he went for a retarded flying knee and got tagged.
> 
> Im no lesnar lover but the facts are facts, he would lose to lesnar and maybe even cain.


Dude you don't know ANYTHING. You probably think Cain and Valesquez are different people. You just throw out random names because of internet highlight videos or something. I remember when you said Fedor hasn't faced anyone of "Gonzaga's skill level" before.

AA was getting frustrated not being able to tag Fedor, that's why he went for a flying knee. 



HexRei said:


> Yeah, I know he fought them. I mentioned it in my post. Sylvia was on the decline and had already lost to a much tinier man before getting pretty much kicked out of the UFC. Andrei was 8 months ago and had also not faced top competition in a long time, hell he was losing the groundfight to Nelson (a skilled fighter but certainly not the top of any heap) before that gift standup.
> 
> Since then Fedor did a clearly worked "exhibition" match with Gegard and... nothing else. that's two fights in the last 16 months. And before that, he went seven months after beating... wait for it... HONG MAN CHOI.
> 
> ...


Sylvia was on the decline? He had just barely lost to Nog and looked good in that fight, he beat Monson, he beat Vera (who beat Mir), and beat Arlovski twice before losing humiliatingly to Fedor without landing a single strike on him. And how was Sylvia "getting pretty much kicked out?" of the UFC? He had a very exciting competitive fight against Nog before he left, and I've never heard anything about DW kicking him out. If he was let me know but I haven't heard anything like that.

And how is Rogers any less impressive than Carwin? Carwin has looked wounded in a pretty decent amount of fights before coming back, Rogers hasn't seemed to be in too much trouble in any of his. 

And if Rogers wasn't going to be ranked top 10 then what would Carwin be ranked if he didn't beat Gonzaga? 


Granted people like Lindland and HMC have no business fighting Fedor, but would it be better if he fought them or declined the fight? It's not his fault he was in the wrong place at the wrong time. He was scheduled after that to fight Barnett, and Sylvia/Arlovski/Barnett would be inarguably a hard lineup of top 5 fighters.

Plus HMC is way scarier and more impressive than the Korean guy Lesnar fought. 


What are we arguing anyway HexRei? Do you not think Fedor is #1? If not who is? Do you not think he's impressive? Do you really think he's ducking Carwin, Lesnar, Mir etc? Why would he do that? I don't want to argue with you too much but I seriously don't get what you're defending. No one at HW is going to have more than a few serious fights in a row, no matter what organization. HW just simply isn't stacked enough.


edit: As to Fedor not fighting often recently, keep in mind he's also won the gold medal at the 06, 07, 08 and 09 ***** Championships. Some people train exclusively for that.


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## joshua7789 (Apr 25, 2009)

How is anyone really going to say that Arlovski was on the decline when he fought Fedor? He was on a five fight run against some good competition and he looked great in the fight right up until the knockout. Sylvia had gone six of eight prior to fighting Fedor with his two losses in that run coming to Couture and Nog, thats not to shabby. There is no arguing that Fedor is the number one heavyweight in the world, and he isnt ducking anyone. He stands to lose a hell of a lot more then he will gain from a fight with Rogers. Rogers is an extremely powerful striker who made Arlovski (who was still a top five heavyweight when he fought Rogers) look like an amateur. Rogers is dangerous and has a lot more then a punchers chance in this fight. It may seem like it, but im not even a Fedor fan, im just going off of the facts.


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## coldcall420 (Aug 2, 2007)

joshua7789 said:


> How is anyone really going to say that Arlovski was on the decline when he fought Fedor? He was on a five fight run against some good competition and he looked great in the fight right up until the knockout. Sylvia had gone six of eight prior to fighting Fedor with his two losses in that run coming to Couture and Nog, thats not to shabby. There is no arguing that Fedor is the number one heavyweight in the world, and he isnt ducking anyone. He stands to lose a hell of a lot more then he will gain from a fight with Rogers. Rogers is an extremely powerful striker who made Arlovski (who was still a top five heavyweight when he fought Rogers) look like an amateur. Rogers is dangerous and has a lot more then a punchers chance in this fight. It may seem like it, but im not even a Fedor fan, im just going off of the facts.


 
Arlovski has a fundamental flaw of moving forward with his hands down......he got caught by a huge powerful guy.....AA didnt look like an amateur he just got caught.....again....lol

CC420


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## joshua7789 (Apr 25, 2009)

coldcall420 said:


> Arlovski has a fundamental flaw of moving forward with his hands down......he got caught by a huge powerful guy.....AA didnt look like an amateur he just got caught.....again....lol
> 
> CC420


I havent watched that fight in awhile, but if i remember correctly, he backed straight up against the cage and threw a leg kick, then Rogers took his lunch money.


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## HexRei (Apr 27, 2007)

khoveraki said:


> Sylvia was on the decline? He had just barely lost to Nog and looked good in that fight, he beat Monson, he beat Vera (who beat Mir), and beat Arlovski twice before losing humiliatingly to Fedor without landing a single strike on him. And how was Sylvia "getting pretty much kicked out?" of the UFC? He had a very exciting competitive fight against Nog before he left, and I've never heard anything about DW kicking him out.


Dana said he was glad to have Sylvia gone and "no longer stinking up the place".  Dana was well aware of how difficult Sylvia was to market.
And yeah, I do think he was on the decline. He lost to Couture, Nog, beat Vera in a less than stellar performance against a(nother) guy who has proven he can easily fight at 60 lbs lower than Sylvia, and then lost to a washed up boxer. Yes he won his last fight but I don't see how you cant see that Sylvia was in decline. The Monson win was respectable but he mostly won that via his length, both on the feet and the ground. It's not like Monson is a good striker or ever has been, and Sylvia basically beat him up on the feet with his reach and Monson was like a midget in his guard, his fists could barely even reach Sylvia's face much less posture up to attack. Not all that impressive to me, although I do love Monson like a bro.



> And how is Rogers any less impressive than Carwin? Carwin has looked wounded in a pretty decent amount of fights before coming back, Rogers hasn't seemed to be in too much trouble in any of his.


Nowhere in my post did I mention Carwin but I guess we can talk about him



> And if Rogers wasn't going to be ranked top 10 then what would Carwin be ranked if he didn't beat Gonzaga?


 That's a good question, and quite possibly he wouldn't be. I think you have to take the nature of the fight into account and I don't think either Rogers OR Carwin proved a lot on those nights. But at least Carwin has a verifiable groundgame behind him in addition to his heavy hands.



> Granted people like Lindland and HMC have no business fighting Fedor, but would it be better if he fought them or declined the fight? It's not his fault he was in the wrong place at the wrong time. He was scheduled after that to fight Barnett, and Sylvia/Arlovski/Barnett would be inarguably a hard lineup of top 5 fighters.
> 
> Plus HMC is way scarier and more impressive than the Korean guy Lesnar fought.


 I agree with the last part, I think that was Min Soo Kim and that guy was a loser. But Fedor never did get to fight Barnett, and so you can't really count that as proof of anything.



> What are we arguing anyway HexRei? Do you not think Fedor is #1? If not who is? Do you not think he's impressive? Do you really think he's ducking Carwin, Lesnar, Mir etc? Why would he do that? I don't want to argue with you too much but I seriously don't get what you're defending. No one at HW is going to have more than a few serious fights in a row, no matter what organization. HW just simply isn't stacked enough.


It's hard to say who's #1 these days, since the commonly regarded #1 and #2 guys are in difference orgs. I think there is a good case for Fedor as #1, but I think if you look at recent times, there is also a good case for Brock, he has only gotten better and better and wrecked Couture who was previously supposed to be Fedor's big challenger. At this point I actually do think Brock would beat Fedor 7 out of 10 times. Mir is an incredible ground technician and he couldn't do anything at all to Brock and only barely pulled out the win the first time with a favorable standup and very little submission experience. I have a tough time seeing Fedor KOing or armbarring Brock at this point in their careers.


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

HexRei said:


> At this point I actually do think Brock would beat Fedor 7 out of 10 times.


If Fedor is going to take 3 of 10, he would have to take the _first_ three. Once Brock beats him, he'll never lose again. 

Personally, I don't think Fedor ever beats him, and this may well be the case with several other UFC HW's, just because of the size factor. I can't even see Fedor getting past a Valasquez or dos Santos. These guys are not only stronger, but much faster. Those would be two terrible matchups for Fedor. In fact I'm not even sure Lesnar beats Carwin. I still don't think people are grasping just how good these new HW's are. Whoever is on top in the UFC at the end of 2010 is indeed on top of the world. But whoever it is, it's definitely someone in the UFC right now.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

HexRei said:


> I agree with the last part, I think that was Min Soo Kim and that guy was a loser. *But Fedor never did get to fight Barnett, and so you can't really count that as proof of anything.*
> 
> 
> It's hard to say who's #1 these days, since the commonly regarded #1 and #2 guys are in difference orgs. I think there is a good case for Fedor as #1, but I think if you look at recent times, there is also a good case for Brock, he has only gotten better and better and wrecked Couture who was previously supposed to be Fedor's big challenger. At this point I actually do think Brock would beat Fedor 7 out of 10 times. Mir is an incredible ground technician and he couldn't do anything at all to Brock and only barely pulled out the win the first time with a favorable standup and very little submission experience. I have a tough time seeing Fedor KOing or armbarring Brock at this point in their careers.


Proof he isn't ducking top competition, Barnett was rated higher than anyone in the UFC.


And give me a break with Lesnar. He got submitted just last year by Mir. Do you think Mir has ANYWHERE near the submission, wrestling, or take down defense as Fedor? Seriously? Keep in mind Fedor's won the national gold in so many ***** competitions (at the highest weight possible, and it's essentially catch wrestling) in 05, 06, 07, 08, 09 etc etc etc etc etc.

And Mir is a lighter "jiu jitsu" guy with weak striking facing a stronger bigger "wrestler." Mir has lost to a lot of people before and has never been too impressive especially since his accident. Pretending Mir would be a threat to Fedor anywhere is almost dillusional. Would Mir outstrike Fedor? Take him down and smother him? Submit him? Come on man, you seriously just hate Fedor or something. Mir would have NOTHING on Fedor, neither would Couture (Fedor demolished Nog 2.5 times, Nog demolished Couture thoroughly). And besides, Lesnar couldn't outwrestle Couture so I'm positive he won't outwrestle Fedor.

Would Lesnar even place in a national competition right now? He won ONE NCAA championship like ten years ago. Fedor's been competing and winning ***** championships consistently every year for years and years and years.

It'd be like if Fedor had just won his national Judo championship in 1997, and people were now talking like he was the best Judo practitioner in MMA. It's just silly to think Lesnar would outwrestle Fedor. And is Lesnar improving like we think he is? He was basically doing the same thing to Mir the first time that he did the second time, but with a different ref.

There's so many holes in thinking Lesnar would win 7/10 times. You can't see Fedor KO'ing Lesnar? Lesnar has zero head movement, got intimidating by Mir standing, and hasn't stood with ANYONE but Couture - who wasn't getting owned despite the huge reach advantage and the fact that Couture isn't a striker. Fedor would win in a boxing match, a kickboxing match, a wrestling match. Fedor is currently competing at the highest level, highest weight class of basically "catch wrestling," Lesnar hasn't even competed in almost ten years and couldn't take down Couture.

And saying somehow that Couture couldn't beat Lesnar, and we thought Couture would be Fedor's biggest challenger years ago... I don't even know what to tell you. But in Fightsport or some magazine a year or so ago, Fedor and Couture both demonstrated a submission and throw on eachother. Afterwards in the article Couture said how overwhelmed he got with the speed and strength of Fedor. That's not too much to go on but no one in the world right now would say Couture would beat Fedor or even in the past. Plus there's a good list of people Fedor has beaten who's beaten Couture or who Couture beat way less impressively. Sylvia for example, lasted five hard rounds with Couture, but didn't last 30 seconds with Fedor without being rocked hard, thrown, and submitted.


But you can disagree, it's your right. But provide proof or step out of the discussion. Show me some fights where Lesnar demonstrated that he could avoid Fedor's striking. Or show me who he's outwrestled that has a wrestling background at all? Or show me who he's submitted... 

Lesnar has a good opportunity in the UFC right now, there's a lot of smaller strikers with weak TDD and no wrestling that I'm sure he matches up well with. But when we talk about Fedor vs Lesnar... Fedor wins this logically, statistically, credentially, consistently. 10/10.




calminian said:


> I still don't think people are grasping just how good these new HW's are. Whoever is on top in the UFC at the end of 2010 is indeed on top of the world. But whoever it is, it's definitely someone in the UFC right now.


Why don't you and YOURMOMWASHERE go talk about how awesome Gonzaga and JDS are somewhere really, really far away?


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## Nikkolai (Jan 7, 2008)

Calminian said:


> If Fedor is going to take 3 of 10, he would have to take the _first_ three. Once Brock beats him, he'll never lose again.
> 
> Personally, I don't think Fedor ever beats him, and this may well be the case with several other UFC HW's, just because of the size factor. I can't even see Fedor getting past a Valasquez or dos Santos. These guys are not only stronger, but much faster. Those would be two terrible matchups for Fedor. In fact I'm not even sure Lesnar beats Carwin. I still don't think people are grasping just how good these new HW's are. Whoever is on top in the UFC at the end of 2010 is indeed on top of the world. But whoever it is, it's definitely someone in the UFC right now.


Stronger, maybe. Fedor was throwing Nog around like a rag doll. Plus, he also has ***** for effective throws and leg sweeps. But I don't think either of those guys are faster. I think Fedor's one of (if not the) fastest heavyweight.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Why is Carwin better than Grim though? I mean Carwin has one impressive win on his resume right? Grim has 1.5? Yet Carwin is this great up and comer and Grim is a bum? Brock is 5-1 and Fedor is 30-1, yet Brock is the best ever and Fedor is overrated. Makes little sense to me. I actually think the best HW when HEALTHY in the UFC is Nog.


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

Nobody is saying lesnar would k.o fedor. What would happen is he would use his superior strength and wrestling to take fedor down and hammer fist his face into a pulp.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Nobody is saying lesnar would k.o fedor. What would happen is he would use his superior strength and wrestling to take fedor down and hammer fist his face into a pulp.


Really is that what Nog did and Coleman did to Fedor when they faced him? Fedor is the best ***** (one of the best) fighters in the world today. You really believe taking him down and pounding his face would be that easy? Do you know sir, what ***** is? Have you ever seen Fedor compete? Nog would beat Lesnar, he would.


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

Samborules said:


> Really is that what Nog did and Coleman did to Fedor when they faced him? Fedor is the best ***** (one of the best) fighters in the world today. You really believe taking him down and pounding his face would be that easy? Do you know sir, what ***** is? Have you ever seen Fedor compete? Nog would beat Lesnar, he would.


Nog and coleman do not have the size, strength, and wrestling skill as lesnar. Nog could not beat lesnar either, but I think he would hang on and take a beating all 5 rounds.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Both Coleman and Brock weight about the same, Brock is taller? Nog is about 250, not exactly a tiny human. You sir never answered my question, do you know what ***** is? Do you believe Fedor just stumbled on his 30 wins? 

:confused02:


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## UrbanBounca (Sep 13, 2009)

Samborules said:


> Really is that what Nog did and Coleman did to Fedor when they faced him? Fedor is the best ***** (one of the best) fighters in the world today. You really believe taking him down and pounding his face would be that easy? Do you know sir, what ***** is? Have you ever seen Fedor compete? Nog would beat Lesnar, he would.


I don't believe Lesnar would have very much difficulty taking Fedor down, but actually beating him on the ground is a different story.


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> ...Why don't you and YOURMOMWASHERE go talk about how awesome Gonzaga and JDS are somewhere really, really far away?


Well, why don't you pull a Fedor, and go argue with lesser competition somewhere.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

True, Coleman did take him down and then was submitted.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Calminian said:


> Well, why don't you pull a Fedor, and go argue with lesser competition somewhere.


Has anyone faced lesser competition than Carwin? Come on now.


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Samborules said:


> Has anyone faced lesser competition than Carwin? Come on now.


Carwin's still a bit unproven. But he did smash GG who in turn smashed Fedor's 2nd greatest accomplishment. So both his hands and ground game are there. I'm just saying, I won't be totally surprised if he gives Lesnar and run like no one else thus far. Would you?


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

All HWs have a punchers chance, yes. But Carwin has one decent win on his record and Coutoure crushed Gabe btw. Coutoure did not exactly crush Sylvia, Fedor did. The who beat who game is silly though. Brock is 5-1, Carwin is basically 1-0. Persons who undervalue Nog and Fedor are just silly. I hope you're not in that category. How is Carwin's record more impressive than Grim's? Explain that, please?


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Samborules said:


> ...Coutoure did not exactly crush Sylvia, Fedor did. The who beat who game is silly though. ...


Yet, you bring it up. So let's be consistent and look at all the who beat whos and hows. 

Let's see. Fedor couldn't finish Nog nor Cop. GG, Kongo and dos Santos crushed Cop, Mir crushed Nog. Let's go a little further. Fedor KO'd AA while AA was in mid air throwing a knee. Prior to that, AA was winning a technical standup match for a full 4.0 minutes. Grim completely destroyed AA in seconds. Fedor stopped Sylvia pretty quickly, via strikes and submission. Mercer KO'd Sylvia outright with one punch even faster. And as you know Kimbo made short work of Mercer, but I digress. And I should also point out, Sylvia dominated Nog until a 3rd rnd sub. He basically just blew it. He should have won. 

Fedor fans love to point out that he stopped Sylvia, while the LHW Couture didn't, but then hate when all the other MMAth is brought fourth. It's a double standard.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

My dear Calminian, MMA math is silly especially at the HW level. I believe you have never seen Fedor compete for you to make such statements. A lot of MMA as you know is match ups, Nog needed to take the taller Sylvia down and did, same for Coutoure but Fedor instead of that just punched him in the face. Fedor played a little cat and mouse with AA and caught him. Look obviously you are biased against him but he is 30-1, can we agree on that? Can we agree that he did not stumble on those 30 wins? Can we agree that Grim and Carwin are basically the same guy? If Lesnar can beat a HEALTHY not a 70% effective Nog then Lesnar is truly legit in my book but until then its bleh. Mir beat Lesnar too, how did he do in a rematch? Please answer my questions, at least one of them? 

:confused02:


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Samborules said:


> My dear Calminian, MMA math is silly especially at the HW level. ...


And yet you guys keep bringing it up. I'll make a deal. Stop bragging about how Fedor beat Sylvia more impressively than Couture (a light heavyweight) did, and I won't bring up the dozens of examples where Fedor was less impressive. 



Samborules said:


> Can we agree that he did not stumble on those 30 wins?


No, he didn't stumble upon them, but he got them in a weaker era in a weaker division. That simple fact cannot be ignored.


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## swedish_fighter (Jul 12, 2009)

Calminian said:


> Yet, you bring it up. So let's be consistent and look at all the who beat whos and hows.
> 
> Let's see. Fedor couldn't finish Nog nor Cop. GG, Kongo and dos Santos crushed Cop, Mir crushed Nog. Let's go a little further. Fedor KO'd AA while AA was in mid air throwing a knee. Prior to that, AA was winning a technical standup match for a full 4.0 minutes. Grim completely destroyed AA in seconds. Fedor stopped Sylvia pretty quickly, via strikes and submission. Mercer KO'd Sylvia outright with one punch even faster. And as you know Kimbo made short work of Mercer, but I digress. And I should also point out, Sylvia dominated Nog until a 3rd rnd sub. He basically just blew it. He should have won.
> 
> Fedor fans love to point out that he stopped Sylvia, while the LHW Couture didn't, but then hate when all the other MMAth is brought fourth. It's a double standard.


Diffrence is: Fedor fought Nog and Crocop in their prime.. 
They was big names back in the days.. most of Fedors opponents has been considered among the best when he fought them..

Personally I have a hard time seeing any of brocks fights that impressive.. 






That went to the second round, first one looking the same.. If brock is such a strong monster wrestler how come he is having a really hard time taking down a really old couture.. Couture is btw a bit lighter than Fedor..

Or his loss to Mir, impressive??





You can argue all you want, Brock will still have a dick tattooed on his chest.


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

swedish_fighter said:


> Diffrence is: Fedor fought Nog and Crocop in their prime.. ....


A notion I completely reject. They're still young and I believe better than they've ever been. Problem is, the competition has rocketed past them. It happens, especially in mma as the sport is evolving quickly.


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## Emericanaddict (Dec 31, 2006)

"You can argue all you want, Brock will still have a dick tattooed on his chest."

Best quote OF ALL TIME! IM JUST SAYIN.


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Emericanaddict said:


> "You can argue all you want, Brock will still have a dick tattooed on his chest."
> 
> Best quote OF ALL TIME! IM JUST SAYIN.


I'm really starting to wonder about guys that see that. My guess is you see em everywhere, in clouds, etc. Er, well, hey to each his own. :sarcastic09:


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Calminian, for the record you believe that all 30 of Fedor's wins came against weaker competition in a weaker era? Is this correct? please?

Please answer


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Samborules said:


> Calminian, for the record you believe that all 30 of Fedor's wins came against weaker competition in a weaker era? Is this correct? please?
> 
> Please answer


Dude, do you need it spelled out? What part are you not getting? YES! Fedor's greatest accomplishments, such as HH, Nog, Cop, Randleman, Coleman, etc. are WEAKER than today's competition. IS THAT CLEAR?

Oy! SR, you're starting to drive me nuts.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Nog is weaker competition? Really?

My goodness what do you consider strong competition then?


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

Samborules said:


> Nog is weaker competition? Really?
> 
> My goodness what do you consider strong competition then?


Come on man. Read some previous posts.


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

Carwin has one real fight/win; Brock has fought six times total; I think you need to give Fedor some credit and don't ask me to go and read your prior posts. Thats just silly. Nog is the #1 contender for Lesnar's belt and I bet Vegas would have him at 50/50 if he does not have a staff infection like he had against Mir, to win that match. Fedor dominated him 2x. If you insist on stating that his other 28 wins are meaningless at least acknowledge those two when Nog was in is PRIME. BTW I know you're down on Cro Cop but he was much faster when he was with Pride I think the ring miles took a toll on him he lost some quickness and that not power was his biggest advantage. That left leg high kick was a weapon because it was so fast, not anymore. 

Regardless you are entitled to your opinion although I believe it to be a bit well interesting at best.


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## UrbanBounca (Sep 13, 2009)

Calminian said:


> Dude, do you need it spelled out? What part are you not getting? YES! Fedor's greatest accomplishments, such as HH, Nog, Cop, Randleman, Coleman, etc. are WEAKER than today's competition. IS THAT CLEAR?
> 
> Oy! SR, you're starting to drive me nuts.





Calminian said:


> Come on man. Read some previous posts.


Why in the hell would anyone read your previous posts with a response such as the one I've quoted? Fedor hasn't faced good competition? Well, that's your credibility out the window.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

UrbanBounca said:


> I don't believe Lesnar would have very much difficulty taking Fedor down, but actually beating him on the ground is a different story.


Yeah, his wrestling is so great. He was total able to take down Couture at will. Oh wait, no he couldn't, and he hasn't won a single wrestling event in a decade. Fedor is still competing at the highest weight at the HIGHEST LEVEL of catch wrestling (*****), Fedor would put on a clinic against Brock. Maybe Brock should read Fedor's book.




Calminian said:


> Dude, do you need it spelled out? What part are you not getting? YES! Fedor's greatest accomplishments, such as HH, Nog, Cop, Randleman, Coleman, etc. are WEAKER than today's competition. IS THAT CLEAR?
> 
> Oy! SR, you're starting to drive me nuts.


I can't believe you're not banned yet Calminian as you've been a troll since you got here, but I'll address this post anyway. Your favorite guy ever JDS couldn't even put away a daydreaming, old, passive CroCop. Infact he got his nose broken and only managed to hit CroCop in the eye. 

And Heath Herring? He devasted Herring years ago, Lesnar today couldn't even finish him. It's funny you'd pick him especially since it's one of only four people Lesnar has ever faced.

Nog? Have you checked the rankings? Nog just destroyed Couture and is ranked what... #4? And DW thinks Coleman is still good enough to face Tito. Coleman was probably a better wrestler then than Lesnar is now. 


Plus it's clear you're an idiot, Pride's HW division was the most stacked a heavyweight division has ever been. Old timers from Pride's HW division are STILL dominating.

It's easy to establish you don't know what you're talking about at all. I'm not responding to YMWH because he's clearly just trying to start up drama. You on the other hand think you have actually solid opinions. So what do you know? What gym do you train at? How long have you been watching or competing in MMA? 

Explain me something that makes your opinion better than the other 50 top MMA fighters who think Fedor is the best HW and #1 P4P. GSP, BJ Penn, Bas Ruten, Gegard Mousasi, Wanderlei, Anderson Silva, Sylvia, etc that all think he's the best and has no holes in his game. And don't give me this "hasn't fought top competition" bullshit because he's always always fought top ranked competition, destroyed two top five guys in just minutes, and faces someone higher ranked than Carwin soon.


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## Tacx0911 (Aug 12, 2009)

There's no debate that Fedor's the best. Ask your favorite MMA fighter for more details...hahaha...


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> I can't believe you're not banned yet Calminian as you've been a troll since you got here, but I'll address this post anyway. Your favorite guy ever JDS couldn't even put away a daydreaming, old, passive CroCop. Infact he got his nose broken and only managed to hit CroCop in the eye.


:laugh: I'm sorry I can't stop laughing at this. I actually can't figure out who JDS is? Yet he's my favorite guy. 

Oh mercy! I'm sure it's obvious, I just can't seem to place it.

I gotta get outta here. For the record, I don't think Fedor stinks or hasn't fought good guys. My simple thesis is this. The fighters he's beaten are not of the calibre of the UFC HW fighters of today. 

I actually like Fedor. He deserves credit for what he's accomplished. But he's not the best HW _today_. There you have it. I have sinned. brand me with the T mark and let me wonder the earth.

_Oh and PS, notice yet another Fedor fan wanting to engage in MMAth._


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

Calminian said:


> :laugh: I'm sorry I can't stop laughing at this. I actually can't figure out who JDS is? Yet he's my favorite guy.
> 
> Oh mercy! I'm sure it's obvious, I just can't seem to place it.
> 
> ...


Even though people he's destroyed in their prime are still top HWs in the UFC? MMA Math is not "Fedor destroyed blank, and blank destroyed blank." That's how rankings are determined. 

And you don't know who Dos Santos is. :confused05:


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## jdun11 (Apr 23, 2006)

Nogueira schools Randy. And Fedor has manhandled Nog twice, yet he still doesnt think he is that good? That is just ignorant. Randy has what 10-11 losses, Chuck 7-8, same with Rampage, Hughes, Wandelerlei. All these guys Dana calls great fighters and legends of the sport and Fedor has that one phony blemish and Dana has the balls to call him overrated. What does the man have to do? Beat god himself? I kow what it is, sign with the UFC. Then Dana will be selling everyone on how he never lost and is a wrecking machine. Dana is so wrong when he talks about Fedor.

But Fedor not taking a 6 fight $30 million dollar deal is crazy on his part. Whats he gonna do after he beats Rogers nad Overeem?


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## Calminian (Feb 1, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> ...And you don't know who Dos Santos is. :confused05:


Ahhhhh, I shoulda got that. Alrighty then.



jdun11 said:


> Nogueira schools Randy. And Fedor has manhandled Nog twice, yet he still doesnt think he is that good? That is just ignorant. Randy has what 10-11 losses, Chuck 7-8, same with Rampage, Hughes, Wandelerlei. All these guys Dana calls great fighters and legends of the sport and Fedor has that one phony blemish and Dana has the balls to call him overrated. What does the man have to do? Beat god himself? I kow what it is, sign with the UFC. Then Dana will be selling everyone on how he never lost and is a wrecking machine. Dana is so wrong when he talks about Fedor....


I wonder if Fedor is good enough to finish Babalu yet? (sorry, low blow, I admit it)




> *edited by hexrei- please when you have two contiguous posts, just edit your original to include the other as well  it's not such a big deal for you since you don't have an avatar or a sig, but it's a rule.


Ooops. Sorry, forgot.


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## khoveraki (Jun 28, 2009)

jdun11 said:


> But Fedor not taking a 6 fight $30 million dollar deal is crazy on his part. Whats he gonna do after he beats Rogers nad Overeem?



Definitely agree with that first part. There's still Werdum to beat, but yeah the HW division everywhere is pretty weak now.

And that number was completely debunked, Fedor said in an interview that if it was anywhere near that much he would have taken it in a heartbeat, Co-Promotion or not. He also said after his 3 fight contract is over he's very interested in the UFC.


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

Samborules said:


> Nog is weaker competition? Really?
> 
> My goodness what do you consider strong competition then?


The likes of true underground fighters such as this...


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## YOURMOMWASHERE (Sep 20, 2009)

Funny how people are saying cro cop and nog are past their prime now. Come on, they are both still in their early 30's.

To me it seems UFC just proved they arent as elite as they thought they were.


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## GMK13 (Apr 20, 2009)

khoveraki said:


> Definitely agree with that first part. There's still Werdum to beat, but yeah the HW division everywhere is pretty weak now.
> 
> And that number was completely debunked, Fedor said in an interview that if it was anywhere near that much he would have taken it in a heartbeat, Co-Promotion or not. He also said after his 3 fight contract is over he's very interested in the UFC.


how long will it take for him to get to the ufc? he fights like once a year? by the time those 3 fights are up he will probably stop fighting.


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## VolcomX311 (Aug 18, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Funny how people are saying cro cop and nog are past their prime now. Come on, they are both still in their early 30's.
> 
> To me it seems UFC just proved they arent as elite as they thought they were.


As a fan of Cro Cop, I'll have to play devil's advocate because I'm pro reason. The speculations of CC being past his prime is based not only on his underwhelming performances, such as every single fight he's had since he's been in the UFC, with the exception of his debut tomato can fight and secondly, the speculations are based on Cro Cop saying that he was past his prime from his own lips. Hard to argue with the source. 

Nog.... he had one good performance against Couture, prior to that, I'll give him a pass with the whole staff infection thing with Mir, but his performance against Tim Silvia, even though he won, it was still a huge disappointment in terms of how he performed. 

Due to Nog's most recent performance, where he stands as far as the "past his prime" issue at least allows room for debate and speculation, but Cro Cop.... he sort of admitted it himself :confused05:


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## Samborules (Jun 16, 2009)

YOURMOMWASHERE said:


> Funny how people are saying cro cop and nog are past their prime now. Come on, they are both still in their early 30's.
> 
> To me it seems UFC just proved they arent as elite as they thought they were.


Have you ever seen Cro Cop fight in his prime in Pride and now? He lost quickness that was his primary strength. Its not age its ring miles. Dude, really, come on now. Step it up.


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